View source for User talk:Turnagra

== Article Review ==
Hello turnagra. I have simplified Pedro Piquero's article, replacing it, under your suggestions, with reliable sources and eliminating external links to wikipedia. I would like to know your opinion to help me. Thank you so much.  <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/212.73.34.202|212.73.34.202]] ([[User talk:212.73.34.202#top|talk]]) 11:03, 24 July 2023 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

==Reverted move==
I have reverted your move of [[Fox Glacier, New Zealand]], becuase it was contrary to [[Wikipedia:Naming conventions (New Zealand)]] and there was no discussion. If you believe this article should be an exception to the convention, please open a discussion on the talk page.-<span style="font-family:cursive; color:grey;">[[User talk:gadfium|gadfium]]</span> 01:43, 18 January 2020 (UTC)
:Hi {{user|gadfium}} - apologies for moving it without discussion. I'm trying to see how it runs contrary to the naming conventions, particularly number 5? Unless it's relating to the use of 'township' instead of 'town'? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 02:05, 18 January 2020 (UTC)

==Barnstar ==
{| style="border: 1px solid gray; background-color: #fdffe7; width:100%;"
|rowspan="3" style="vertical-align:top;width:5em"| [[Image:BoNM - New Zealand Hires.png|80px]]
|rowspan="3" |
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 0; vertical-align: bottom; height: 1.1em;" |'''The New Zealand Barnstar of National Merit'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: top; border-top: 1px solid gray; height:5em;"| [[Taiari / Chalky Inlet]] is an excellent piece of work by you. Thank you. Delightful to see such a well-developed article. With a longer lead, I'd upgrade it to B class.
|-
|style="vertical-align: top; border-top: 1px solid gray;" |<sub>''this WikiAward was given to Turnagra by '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' on 19:55, 4 August 2020 (UTC)''</sub>
|}
: Thank you! I'll go back and try to expand on the lead in the next couple of weeks sometime! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:27, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

== June 2021 ==
[[Image:Copyright-problem.svg|30px|link=|alt=Copyright problem icon]] Your edit to [[:How Great Thou Art]] has been removed in whole or in part, as it appears to have added [[Wikipedia:Copyrights|copyrighted]] material to Wikipedia without evidence of [[Wikipedia:Requesting copyright permission|permission]] from the copyright holder. If you are the copyright holder, please read [[Wikipedia:Donating copyrighted materials]] for more information on uploading your material to Wikipedia.  For legal reasons, Wikipedia cannot accept copyrighted material, including text or images from print publications or from other websites, without an appropriate and verifiable license. All such contributions will be deleted. You may use external websites or publications as a source of ''information'', but not as a source of ''content'', such as sentences or images&mdash;you must write using your own words. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously, and persistent violators of our copyright policy '''will be [[Wikipedia:Blocking policy|blocked from editing]]'''. See [[Wikipedia:Copying text from other sources]] for more information. '' Do not add copyrighted lyrics to articles about songs. This is unhelpful, not only because of copyright, but also because Wikipedia is [[WP:NOTINDISCRIMINATE|not a lyrics database]].''<!-- Template:uw-copyright --> [[User:RandomCanadian|RandomCanadian]] ([[User talk:RandomCanadian|talk]] / [[Special:Contributions/RandomCanadian|contribs]])  02:00, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
:{{reply to|RandomCanadian}} is there a reason why the entire edit was reverted and not just a subsequent edit to remove the lyrics? I'm also curious as to how the use of the lyrics in that instance to demonstrate its link to another hymn differs in use to the numerous other uses of lyrics in that article, especially since many of them are newer than the lyrics to Whakaaria Mai? I'd be keen to go back and add the section on Whakaaria Mai even without the lyrics if need be since the edit was much broader than that, but want to get a bit more context first to make sure I'm not missing something. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 02:11, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
::If there are more recent lyrics, and these are also under copyright, they also need to be removed. As for the presence of translations, that's a given for most major hymns. Unless this version is particularly significant and stands out amongst the translations for some reason, a short mention, such as "The song has been translated into other languages, including [...]" would be the logical way to give an encyclopedic summary of the topic (as opposed to giving [[WP:TMI|too much detail]]). [[User:RandomCanadian|RandomCanadian]] ([[User talk:RandomCanadian|talk]] / [[Special:Contributions/RandomCanadian|contribs]])  02:14, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
:::I think my point with the lyrics was that they're from a different hymn than How Great Thou Art, so it's more of a combination, but happy to do that via text instead of a lyrical comparison. As far as the significance of it, Whakaaria Mai is definitely significant as a version of the song and is probably the most famous hymn in New Zealand - in my view, absolutely worthy of a couple paragraphs at least. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 02:19, 19 June 2021 (UTC)

== Article Review ==

Hi there, I notice that you were the last person prior to myself to make an edit to the Christchurch suburb of [[Wigram]].  I have put a lot of effort over the last several weeks making it as complete as I can and I would really appreciate your input into the article, any edits/reviews etc, or if you could advise me of anything which you think should be changed?  I would love to get my edits reviewed by someone like yourself who is also familair with the area.

Thanks for all your contributions to Wikipedia!

[[User:StraightTalkNZ|StraightTalkNZ]] ([[User talk:StraightTalkNZ|talk]]) 13:05, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
:{{reply to|StraightTalkNZ}} Hi, welcome to Wikipedia and thanks for your work on the article! I see that [[User:Schwede66]] has already made a few changes and given you some feedback, so that's probably a good place to start. I think the key thing is trying to reword a lot of the content into text similar to other articles, instead of bulleted lists or incomplete sentences. I also think it's worth taking another check to see whether all of the categories are strictly necessary, or whether some of them could be combined. For instance, the article for [[Addington, New Zealand|Addington]] has a single "facilities" section - a similar section for Wigram could reasonably have paragraphs that cover the "National Institutions", "Parks, sport and recreation", "Elderly Housing and care" and potentially Education sections. This would make the article much easier to read. I also feel like the Governance section could be included within the infobox, and so I'm not sure if it's worth having a separate section on that. 

:At any rate, hopefully that's enough to get started on - happy to provide more feedback or be a sounding board for thoughts etc if that would be helpful! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 05:20, 21 June 2021 (UTC)
::By the way, the above comments would be better posted on the Wigram talk page, as other editors interested in the topic would also benefit from your good thoughts. You can always leave a note here that you've moved (or copied) your response to there. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 08:01, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

:::[[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] thanks for the tips, I merged those three under '''Landmarks and features''' as per the [[Saint Heliers]] article as I think that several items genuinely fit into regional landmarks e.g. Nga Puna Wai and the Museum rather than just "Features".  I also rewrote some of those sections to try to make it more text instead of just bulleted lists/incomplete sentences like you reccomended.  Hopefully it makes reads a bit better and thanks for your advice!
[[User:StraightTalkNZ|StraightTalkNZ]] ([[User talk:StraightTalkNZ|talk]]) 12:49, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

==Disambiguation link notification for October 10==

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. An automated process has detected that when you recently edited [[Glaciers of New Zealand]], you added links pointing to the disambiguation pages [[William Fox]] and [[Forbes Glacier]]<!-- ([//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dablinks.py/Glaciers_of_New_Zealand check to confirm]&nbsp;|&nbsp;[//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dab_solver.py/Glaciers_of_New_Zealand?client=notify fix with Dab solver])-->. Such links are [[WP:INTDABLINK|usually incorrect]], since a disambiguation page is merely a list of unrelated topics with similar titles. <small>(Read the [[User:DPL bot/Dablink notification FAQ|FAQ]]{{*}} Join us at the [[Wikipedia:Disambiguation pages with links|DPL WikiProject]].)</small>

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== NZ names and the meaning of life  ==

Hi, just some rambling thoughts to help explain myself on more meta topics. One of my little pet problems is AfD's where because the default is Keep, editors who want that have no insensitive to engage past posting a vote. That does not mean I am accusing anyone of anything. It is more that when the system incentivizes disengagement it does not aid discussion. No, I don't have a better system in mind.
On another point we have put so much ink into this RfD and I don't feel closer to understanding your point of view. Part of that is my own unwillingness to read and understand everything (I have been a bit slack, sorry), but also I feel the way threads work is floored. I would prefer I think lots of subheadings to keep us on narrow subtopics. For example in the Taranaki talk, I may have been guilty of [[moving the goalposts]] which happens often when you have so many points and feel you have to get them all out at once. As for my main problem of too few editors knowing the rules we make, I am musing on the idea of a NZ template on talk pages that links any specific NZ rule and spelling pages, like a FAQ but less aggressive. [[User:Dushan Jugum|Dushan Jugum]] ([[User talk:Dushan Jugum|talk]]) 20:17, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
:Kia ora {{ping|Dushan Jugum}}, cheers for reaching out. I totally agree with what you said on the dual name discussions, I think they very quickly get out of hand and become unwieldy - I feel sorry for anyone new trying to wade in now! I think what might help when it comes to the understanding of points of view is to separate the discussion from the specific guidelines and talk about the actual reasons behind the points of view - for instance, are you just opposed to dual names because they don't align with wider wikipedia policies or is there some other reason you're not a fan of dual place names behind used? I think a bit of kōrero around that first, which doesn't even touch on the specific guidelines, would be far more helpful in terms of understanding where people are coming from and then being able to come to a clearer picture on how we can move forward. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 05:08, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
Re Circumpolar peoples. Firstly I assure you we just follow the same pages and I am not following you. Secondly I wanted more subheadings and now I have four? different sub-threads on fundamentally the same question across two pages, be careful what you wish for. [[User:Dushan Jugum|Dushan Jugum]] ([[User talk:Dushan Jugum|talk]]) 09:56, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

Not that you need any validation from me, but I thought the vote would have gone the other way. If I was on the "other-side" I would have definitively seen it as an example of an administrator counting the votes. Then hours later I was unimpressed when I saw a few pages moved in my watch list, then gobsmacked when I found out how many others had been. Anyway just wanted to say that your comment that neutrality propagates the injustices of the majority was not lost on me. It is late, slavery has started to be mentioned, take some consolidation that what ever happens next I have to tell myself that it is what I wanted. [[User:Dushan Jugum|Dushan Jugum]] ([[User talk:Dushan Jugum|talk]]) 09:59, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

== Blanket move discussion NZ your vote ==

Hallo Turnagra, 

You have participated in a previous vote. There is a blanket move discussion initated by [[User:Spekkios]] to revert your vote on other pages which is here: [[Talk:Fox_Glacier_/_Te_Moeka_o_Tuawe#Requested_move_2_November_2021]] in case you are not aware of it yet. [[User:Gryffindor|Gryffindor]] ([[User talk:Gryffindor|talk]]) 17:52, 9 November 2021 (UTC)
:{{ping|Gryffindor}} thanks for that - hadn't got around to that one yet but have been well involved in the other move requests. Be sure to also check out the [[Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (New Zealand)]] page for an ongoing discussion around the much wider page moves that have happened and an attempt at forming a process going forward. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:08, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

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== Maps of New Zealand ==
[[File:Shakespeare Flat Track.jpg|thumb|Shakespeare Flat Track]]
Hi Turnagra! I can work on other maps of NZ. May be you can make a list of what is needed and give me the frames of these maps (in N,S, E, W coordinates). I will generate them. If you wish to work on them too I can generate the drafts and you can finish them. The maps are svg and I use Inkscape to finalise them. As a start I thought that I can create a detailed geographical map of New Zealand similar to [[:File:Corsica-geographic map-fr.svg|this]], [[:File:Colorado geographic map-en.svg|this]] or [[:File:Geographic map of Balkan Peninsula.svg|this]]. --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 13:46, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
:Thanks [[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]]! For maps like that, if you'd like to do one of New Zealand at a whole we could probably find a use for it, but it might be more useful to do one for each of the two main islands separately for their respective articles. I also think having some for some of the offshore island groups (such as the [[Manawatāwhi / Three Kings Islands]], [[Campbell Islands]] and [[Mercury Islands]]) could be useful, in the same way that we already have ones for [[Stewart Island / Rakiura]] and the [[Chatham Islands]] (though I note that both of these ideally need to be updated with dual names where relevant).
:The other main maps I've been thinking of at this stage have been one of the [[Marlborough Sounds]] (N,S,E,W borders probably 40°35' 41°35' 174°30' 173°25') and [[Banks Peninsula]] (N,S,E,W borders probably 43°32' 43°56' 173°10' 172°30') - these two would probably benefit from having location maps, so I'm not sure whether you'd prefer to just do the blank location map or do a detailed one too - up to you! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:40, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
:: I will start with the location maps. I made a try with [[:File:NZ Marlborough Sounds relief location map.svg|Marlborough Sounds]]. If OK I can make [[Banks Peninsula]]. I will do the islands after that. Let me know --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 22:58, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
:: I made also the [[:File:NZ Banks Peninsula relief location map.svg|map of the Banks Peninsula]].--[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 23:35, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
:::I think those both look great, thank you [[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]]! Do you mind if I go ahead and set them up as location maps now? Look forward to seeing how the detailed ones turn out, too! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 06:00, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
:::: Good that these fit your expectations. Just a little clarification: when you say "detailed ones" do you mean for these location maps or the island groups maps? I do not think that we need more details on these location maps but if you wish so, I can make them. I will focus on the islands now. This may take a bit more time. --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 08:13, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
:::::Apologies, I meant the island maps. There would definitely be cases where we could use labelled / detailed versions of the location maps, but I don't think that's a priority at the moment. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 09:25, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
::Hi Turnagra, here is the first map I made of [[:File:Three Kings Islands New Zealand geographic map en.svg|Three Kings Islands]]--[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 22:45, 10 February 2022 (UTC)
:::I like this, thank you! Is there any way to get the bathymetric data, or nothing high-res enough to use? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 08:08, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
:::: I tried with the ETOPO1 data but the resolution is too low to work well for such small maps. I can give a second try and optimise. May be bathymetry data from LINZ can work too but I have to dig a bit deeper on their site to find the correct data. If you have any idea for better data I will take it. --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 10:44, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
:::: I found [https://data.linz.govt.nz/layer/50448-depth-contour-polyline-hydro-190k-1350k/ Depth contour polyline] on LINZ site. I can try it and let you know. --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 10:48, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
:::: Added bathymetry --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 16:44, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
:::::That's come out well, thank you! Out of curiosity, how did you convert the depth contour lines into what you have on your image? That was where I ran into issues in my map, as I couldn't figure out how to properly change it over. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:46, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
::::::What do you use as tool for your maps? I use some scripts that I made to turn shape files into svg. I extract the contours for a given level from the shapefile and then apply the same logic as for costliness. --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 20:48, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
:::::::This was just trying to use QGIS, with varying levels of success... [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 20:52, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
:::::::: I agree that with QGIS it is not obvious. You can filter using the "valdco" filed. But the bathymetry data from LINZ is a bit tricky. No polygones but lines so it is difficult to fill with colour. I am working on the Campbell island now and the contours around are not ideal. The same was around Three Kings Islands. There were holes and some strange perfect circles of 20m in between 30 and 50m areas. --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 21:30, 11 February 2022 (UTC)

I'm following this with interest. Great work! Would it be possible to produce a map that shows the [[Heaphy Track]], with the track itself shown on it? The current issue with the track is that three bridges have just been washed away, including a suspension bridge of 147 m length! Would be nice to show on a map where that happened. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 21:10, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
: Hi [[User:Schwede66|Schwede66]]! That may be possible but I will be grateful if you are have an example of what you want. A topo map with the track? --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 21:30, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
::{{u|Ikonact}}, I actually quite like the relief maps that you've been producing. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 21:44, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
::Also, is it still the correct process that if I want to use one of your maps as a location map (e.g. in an infobox), I'd have to define it in [[Module:Location map]]? Given that you work a lot with maps, you'd probably more up to date with the happenings than I am. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 22:06, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
:::I created a map data in Commons for [[commons:Data:NZHeaphyTrack.map|Heaphy Track]]. This can be imported in the article. I will work on a topo map later on. Regarding the location maps, I think Turnagra is better placed than me to explain. --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 22:18, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
::::{{u|Ikonact}}, awesome work. Love it! The map shows two tracks, though. The Heaphy Track (the long one) and a shorter side-track, the Shakespeare Flat Track. See the clip. Could you keep the latter separate, please? How should these maps be categorised? I had not come across this type of data before. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 00:49, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

:::{{Ping|Schwede66}} the maps should all be already loaded as location maps (see for [[Module:Location map/data/New Zealand Fiordland|Fiordland]], [[Module:Location map/data/New Zealand Banks Peninsula|Banks Peninsula]], and [[Module:Location map/data/New Zealand Marlborough Sounds|Marlborough Sounds]]) so all you'd need to do is specify them on the relevant infobox. I've done this for the first two already on some articles (eg. [[Taiari / Chalky Inlet]] for Fiordland and [[Ōtamahua / Quail Island]] for Banks Peninsula) but haven't got to the Marlborough Sounds yet. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 23:08, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
::::Yes, I see that it does things the way it should be in other infoboxes, but <code>Infobox settlement</code> seems to be set up differently. Going by the documentation, it seems that you do need to set it up via [[Module:Location map]] for coordinates to be shown as a pin. See [[Takapūneke]] for an example. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 23:54, 11 February 2022 (UTC)
:::::{{Ping|Schwede66}} Weird, I have no idea why that one is working differently to the others. How did you manage to get it working, so that I can do it for the other two maps? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 23:45, 12 February 2022 (UTC)
::::::I does work once a map is set up via [[Module:Location map]] (which you've done; or was it Ikonact?) and by using it via the parameter <code>pushpin_map</code> '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 00:49, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

I made the [[:File:Campbell Island New Zealand geographic map en.svg|Campbell Island map]] too --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 22:33, 12 February 2022 (UTC)
:Thanks again, love your work! I'll set to updating that article with it. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 23:45, 12 February 2022 (UTC)
+ [[:File:Auckland Islands New Zealand geographic map en.svg|Map of Auckland Islands]] --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 16:42, 14 February 2022 (UTC)
:Looks great as usual! I'm not sure what's still on your list, but just in case you were planning to do the Antipodes Islands it seems there's [[:File:Topographical map of the Antipodes Islands in English.svg|already a map]] of the same style for them so probably don't need to bother there. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:15, 14 February 2022 (UTC)
:: I made a list [[User:Ikonact/Work NZ Outlying Islands|here]] of those islands that have a map already. I will start with the Snares Islands now --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 19:59, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

+ [[:File:Snares Islands New Zealand geographic map en.svg|Map of Snares Islands]]--[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 22:50, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

+ [[:File:Bounty Islands New Zealand geographic map en.svg|Map of Bounty Islands]] --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 09:55, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
:These both look great, thanks! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:31, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Hi Turnagra! I reduced my activities on Wikipedia those last weeks and therefore did not finish with the NZ islands maps. I see from my list that I still need to make the map of the Kermadec Islands. Could you please let me know if there is any other map that you would like to have? Thanks --[[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 10:51, 8 March 2022 (UTC)

:All good, hope everything's okay! The only other island group which could potentially benefit from a map would be maybe the [[Mercury Islands]], since the current one has great detail of the bathymetry but nothing on the surface. If possible, I've wondered whether maps for the [[North Island|North]] and [[South Island|South Islands]] could be worthwhile as well, though I know that would be a lot more work so that's absolutely fine if you'd rather not do that!
:With the recent changes to the sub-antarctic islands and my other planned projects, I've also been wondering about whether a blank location map for [[Zealandia]] could be feasible - though this is quite a bit area, so there might be too much distortion for an easy one of those? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 08:26, 9 March 2022 (UTC)
::Hi Turnagra! I am working on the maps but in the current political context I do miss some creative inspiration. Meanwhile I would like to draw your attention to [[:File:Marlborough Sounds topographic map-en.svg|this excellent map of Marlborough Sounds]] created by @[[User:Sting|Sting]] on a request at the fr.wiki. I hope you will enjoy it. [[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]] ([[User talk:Ikonact|talk]]) 15:26, 25 March 2022 (UTC)
:::Don't worry [[User:Ikonact|Ikonact]], I completely understand and just hope you look after yourself! Thank you for the heads up on that other map as well, it looks fantastic! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:23, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

Regarding your request, {{u|Marshelec}}, here's the discussion about the Heaphy Track map. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 07:35, 3 August 2022 (UTC)

== DYK ==

Have you ever considered giving your quality articles exposure on the main page (i.e. homepage) of Wikipedia? [[Puhi Kai Iti / Cook Landing Site]] qualifies for [[Wikipedia:Did you know|DYK]] (Did you know ...) and it's guaranteed that it will be shown. If you are lucky, it even gets a photo spot. I can show you the ropes if you are interested. It has to happen within seven days of the article having been created. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 07:56, 13 March 2022 (UTC)

:Thanks for the idea! I think I'd looked into it briefly in the past but either couldn't quite get my head around the process or couldn't figure out a good hook. Happy to give it a shot if you reckon the articles are up to it, and of course any pointers would be much appreciated! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 09:07, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
:[[User:Schwede66|Schwede66]] - I just gave the nomination a shot, I think I did it properly? (on looking back, I forgot to change the date that I made the article, so it's showing up as having been made today...) [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:50, 16 March 2022 (UTC)
::That's looking good. With regards to the date, I've simply shifted the template to the correct header and that fixes that part. I've watchlisted the nomination page so can assist if needed. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 20:34, 16 March 2022 (UTC)

== Reverting / undo ==

{{ping|Turnagra}} you can’t just undo a good faith move because it was undiscussed. You need to include a reason for why you believe the move was wrong. <span style="font-family:Avenir, Tenorite, Verdana, sans-serif">—&nbsp;<span style="border-radius:0.25em;padding:1px 4px 0;background:#faeded">[[User:HTGS|HTGS]]</span>&nbsp;([[User talk:HTGS|talk]])</span> 01:08, 23 March 2022 (UTC)

:Kia ora [[User:HTGS|HTGS]] - I was pressed for time this morning when I made the reversion, which is why I didn't fully explain it as I probably should have per [[WP:BRD]].  Fundamentally, it's the exact same argument that forms the basis of the current move request: Your new title required more disambiguation, was longer, and overall not an improvement to the article. I note your reference to the Cave Creek Disaster, which happened three years before the dual name was adopted. Recent usage when not talking of the disaster uses the dual name, and so that's a better and more accurate fit for the article per the guidelines for geographic names.
:I also note the wording in your original message, and would like to remind you about [[WP:AGF]]. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 04:55, 23 March 2022 (UTC)

== Which is 'Removed from request'? ==

Your list of moves at [[Wikipedia:Requested_moves#March_23,_2022]] lists a different move as "* Removed from request 23/3 as dual name does not apply to town" than [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Cam_River_(Canterbury)#Requested_move_22_March_2022] which has "Diamond Harbour, New Zealand" struck out instead of "Cam River (Canterbury)".  I presume one of these two should be altered to match the other. - [[User:R. S. Shaw|R. S. Shaw]] ([[User talk:R. S. Shaw|talk]]) 19:00, 23 March 2022 (UTC)

:Thanks for the heads up [[User:R. S. Shaw|R. S. Shaw]]! It should be Te Waipapa / Diamond Harbour which was removed from the request. I've properly deleted it now, and will check in later today at the requested moves page to see whether the change has properly been reflected. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:06, 23 March 2022 (UTC)

== [[Alšėniškiai]] ==
{{atop
| status = 
| result = Not the right venue; take it to move review. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 18:46, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
}}



Hi, why did you close the discussion without moving, if the arguments were clearly in favor of that? [[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] ([[User talk:Marcelus|talk]]) 20:10, 2 April 2022 (UTC)

:Kia ora [[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] - I closed it as there seemed to be consensus amongst other editors not to move the article. The request had already been relisted once and there have not been any new comments in over three weeks. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 20:13, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
:: Notice that on 9 march the page was moved by [[User:Cukrakalnis]] without any discussion, I didn't want to start an edit war, so that's why I started the move discussion. And there was no consensus, Cukrakalnis was proposing moving the page to the Latin name, also you need to weigh arguments, the name proposed by me was clearly the most popular in Google Scholar. The page should be moved at least to the old name.[[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] ([[User talk:Marcelus|talk]]) 21:33, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
:No answer??? [[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] ([[User talk:Marcelus|talk]]) 19:28, 3 April 2022 (UTC)
::I'll admit that I hadn't seen the various moves in the page's history - though I think [[User:Cukrakalnis|Cukrakalnis]] had every right to move the article initially per [[WP:BEBOLD]]. I'm a bit confused as to the subsequent order of things, which looks like you moved the page to your desired title ''and then'' took out a move request? The subsequent reversion of your move would've been to make the move request work properly. All of this, however, doesn't escape the fact that there was consensus in that move request against moving the page to Holszański. At most, it may be worth reverting the article to its original stable title of Olshanski for a move request, as probably would've been a better approach than what took place, but I don't think that's necessary either. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 20:48, 3 April 2022 (UTC)
::: Once again there was no consensus, because only two users were against moving (one of them was a user who originally moved it to Alšėniškiai), and they had no substantial arguments. My argument was that Holszański is the most popular in English literature, the other proposal was that the page should be moved to one of the Slavic forms of the name because most authors prefer the Slavic form of the name (which btw is historically accurate, Alšėniškiai is modern Lithuanisation). So I guess I should [[WP:BEBOLD]] and move the page back to [[Olshanski]]?[[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] ([[User talk:Marcelus|talk]]) 21:01, 3 April 2022 (UTC)
::::I think a better course of action if you disagree with the closure is to open a [[WP:MOVEREVIEW]]. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 21:08, 3 April 2022 (UTC)
::::: But don't you see the problem here? The user is moving the article under an incorrect name. You end the discussion prematurely without checking what the actual situation of the article was. A week is really not much time for such a fairly niche topic. Now I, in turn, have to start another discussion on the same topic, which will probably end similarly.[[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] ([[User talk:Marcelus|talk]]) 12:02, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
::::::[[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] is incorrect when he says {{tq|name proposed by me was clearly the most popular in Google Scholar}} and {{tq|they had no substantial arguments}}, because, as I said [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Al%C5%A1%C4%97ni%C5%A1kiai#Requested_move_9_March_2022 on the talk page]: {{tq|Most of the "Holszański" mentions are of separate individuals and not the family itself. The accurate rendition for the family would be "Holszańscy" (plural instead of singular) [12] - this gives only 3 results. Alšėniškiai is undoubtedly preferred to Holszańscy.'}} We are talking about the whole family, not individuals, who would have likely called themselves different names, like in the case of another family, the [[Giedraičiai]] (examples: Gedroits ([[Vera Gedroits]]), Guedroitz ([[Wladimir Guedroitz]], [[Alexis Guedroitz]]), Giedroyc ([[Jerzy Giedroyc]]) or Guédroïtz ([[Ania Guédroïtz]])). This is not the first time that Marcelus made ungrounded overgeneralizations and claims.
::::::{{tq|Cukrakalnis was proposing moving the page to the Latin name}} that was only a minor suggestion when I said {{tq|Could Latin-language names be a neutral compromise to these discussions about which language names to use?}} I asked this, because there is a continuous never-ending and unconstructive back-and-forth between me and Marcelus for a long time (already close to half-a-year). Marcelus also moved the page [[Romualdas Giedraitis]] to [[Romuald Giedroyć]] on [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Romuald_Giedroy%C4%87&type=revision&diff=1066465453&oldid=1053686973 January 18], when the closure was clear '''No Consensus''' [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Romuald_Giedroy%C4%87#Requested_move_9_October_2021 on 5 November 2021]. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]], does this constitute a violation of wiki guidelines? If so, which ones? I am unsure where to report it, that's why I am asking, and this is not an isolated case as there is a disquieting trend of [[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] breaking Wikipedia rules. [[User:Cukrakalnis|Cukrakalnis]] ([[User talk:Cukrakalnis|talk]]) 15:21, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
::::::: You are comparing incomparable things. You give examples of different Giedroycs whose common origin cannot be proven. This family was extremely extended. Already at the very beginning in the 14th century, we find many "Giedroycs knyazs" without specific kinship. Besides, you give the example of a Russian-speaking Giedroyc family whose name was transliterated in its own way in English. There were the Polish-speaking Giedroycs, who spelled themselves "Giedroyć", and the 14th/15th-century Giedroycs, who were undoubtedly Lithuanian and should be referred to by their Lithuanian-sounding surname. With the Holszanskis, the situation is different. This is a family with undoubtedly Lithuanian roots, but which became Ruthenised already in the first generation. From the second generation we can only find Russian and later Polish names. Besides, we can count the members of this family, they died out in the 16th century. It would be against the historical truth to use the Lithuanised form of their surname, because they never used it. And google hits prove that researchers agree that we should use Slavic family name in reference to the. You can accuse me of many things, but I just need to know you are understanding my point. [[User:Marcelus|Marcelus]] ([[User talk:Marcelus|talk]]) 17:23, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
::::::The discussion had been going for nearly a month (including a relist) and had not had any new comments in over three weeks - that's not a discussion which has been ended prematurely. I'm not convinced by the argument that we should be using a plural for the name instead of a singular (for example, we have articles at [[Rockefeller]] and [[Roosevelt]], not "Rockefellers" and "Roosevelts"), but the discussion had still gone on long enough in my view. 
::::::As I said before, I'm more than happy for you to take out a move review if you're not happy with my closure. I don't think that my talk page is the best venue to continue this discussion outside the context of the original closure. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:27, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
{{abot}}

== DYK nomination of Article ==

[[File:Symbol_question.svg|26x26px]] Hello! Your submission of [[Article]] at the [[Template talk:DYK|Did You Know nominations page]] has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) at '''[[Template:Did_you_know_nominations/Puhi_Kai_Iti_/_Cook_Landing_Site|your nomination's entry]]''' and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! <!--Template:DYKproblem--> [[User:Cielquiparle|Cielquiparle]] ([[User talk:Cielquiparle|talk]]) 08:10, 3 April 2022 (UTC).

== Advice re RM Discussions ==
 
I’ve observed that you have made a number of non-admin closures of RMs (some not without some blowback from other editors).  When I started closing RMs over a decade ago, I made many mistakes as well.  The learning curve was challenging.  One of the things I did in 2015 was to capture a summary of commonly used arguments in RMs that in my view should be avoided.  I share it with you as you may find it useful.  [[User:Mike Cline/Arguments to avoid in Requested Move discussions|Arguments to Avoid in Requested Move Discussions]] [[User:Mike Cline|Mike Cline]] ([[User talk:Mike Cline|talk]]) 12:17, 8 April 2022 (UTC)

:Kia ora [[User:Mike Cline|Mike]], cheers for this. I've been trying to stick to the fairly straightforward ones for the time being (especially since a lot of the move requests I don't actually have the ability to do because I don't have the required perms yet) but this will definitely be useful going forward. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:34, 8 April 2022 (UTC)

==DYK for Puhi Kai Iti / Cook Landing Site==
{{ivmbox
|image = Updated DYK query.svg
|imagesize=40px
|text = On [[Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2022/April#11 April 2022|11 April 2022]], '''[[:Template:Did you know|Did you know]]''' was updated with a fact from the article '''''[[Puhi Kai Iti / Cook Landing Site]]''''', which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ''... that the '''[[Puhi Kai Iti / Cook Landing Site|Cook Landing Site]]''' also commemorates the Māori who landed in New Zealand four centuries or more before Cook did?'' The nomination discussion and review may be seen at [[Template:Did you know nominations/Puhi Kai Iti / Cook Landing Site]]. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>([[User:Rjanag/Pageview stats|here's how]], [//pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2022-04-01&end=2022-04-21&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=Puhi_Kai_Iti_/_Cook_Landing_Site Puhi Kai Iti / Cook Landing Site])</small>, and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics|the statistics page]]. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the [[:Template talk:Did you know|Did you know talk page]].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK -->  [[User:Maile66|— Maile ]] ([[User talk:Maile66|talk]]) 00:03, 11 April 2022 (UTC)

==DYK for Hector Mountains==
{{ivmbox
|image = Updated DYK query.svg
|imagesize=40px
|text = On [[Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2022/June#4 June 2022|4 June 2022]], '''[[:Template:Did you know|Did you know]]''' was updated with a fact from the article '''''[[Hector Mountains]]''''', which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ''... that the '''[[Hector Mountains|Tapuae-o-Uenuku&nbsp;/ Hector Mountains]]''' have been an important ''mahinga kai'' (food-gathering site) for the [[Māori people|Māori]] for more than 600 years?'' The nomination discussion and review may be seen at [[Template:Did you know nominations/Tapuae-o-Uenuku / Hector Mountains]]. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>([[User:Rjanag/Pageview stats|here's how]], [//pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2022-05-25&end=2022-06-14&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=Hector_Mountains Hector Mountains])</small>, and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics|the statistics page]]. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the [[:Template talk:Did you know|Did you know talk page]].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK -->  &nbsp;&mdash;&nbsp;[[User:Amakuru|Amakuru]] ([[User talk:Amakuru|talk]]) 00:03, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

== [[Talk:10th Rifle Division (Soviet Union)#Requested move 29 April 2022]] ==

Hi; could you explain how you determined there was a consensus against this proposal? [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 03:24, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

:As I said in the closing notes, the move has been active for over a month and in that time the prevailing view of the discussion is that the disambiguation of that page (as well as the two other divisions raised as part of the discussion) is fine as it is. There was no consensus on any other potential title, nor grounds for a [[WP:NOGOODOPTIONS]] close, while the discussion seemed sufficient to close against a move. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 03:36, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

::What I am asking is how you weighted the arguments that allowed you to decide that there was a consensus against the move. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 03:43, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
:::I'm not sure what you're getting at with this. You argued that the disambiguation wasn't sufficient, other editors said it was {{endash}} you both cited [[WP:MILMOS#UNITNAME]] with different interpretations, and I found the argument from the other editor more compelling. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 03:59, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
::::What I am getting at with this is that I believe you assessed consensus incorrectly, so I am asking you to explain why you found the "oppose" arguments more compelling than the "support" arguments. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 05:58, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
:::::And I have done so. I'm curious as to what other outcome you think would be possible in this instance, as a close in favour of a move with no proposed title would bean incredibly poor choice of outcome. I'm happy to reverse my close and relist if you'd prefer, as you clearly won't accept any answer I give and frankly I can't be bothered continuing the discussion, but I suspect this will just delay the same outcome. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 06:08, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
::::::I don't think you have; you've explained that you found the argument from one of the other editors more compelling, but you haven't explained why, in the context of Wikipedia policy, you found it more compelling. And the two results that I believe would have been appropriate would have been no consensus, or a relist. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 06:10, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
:::::::I'd assumed that it would be clear from their respective points. Now do you want me to relist or not? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 06:16, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
::::::::No, it wasn't. I'm not certain why you are unwilling to explain why, in the context of Wikipedia policy, you found their respective points more compelling. If you are not willing to explain why, then either changing the result to "no consensus", or a relist, would be appropriate. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 06:19, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
:::::::::I'm not unwilling, I'm just confused as to how you're not understanding it. Peacemaker's explanation of how the current titles fit the guidelines in [[WP:MILMOS#UNITNAME]] makes for a stronger argument than your vague assertion that it doesn't fit the same guideline, especially when that guideline states {{tq|the disambiguating term should be the common name of the country whose armed forces the unit belongs to}} {{endash}} the following section about further disambiguation is not necessary as per Peacemaker's argument that the other units are sufficiently distinct by virtue of being NKVD and Guards Motor divisions respectively. If that's still not good enough for you, I'm happy to go and change it to no consensus. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 07:05, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
:::::::::::Thank you for explaining. However, I believe you assessed consensus incorrectly; Peacemaker did argue that they are sufficiently disambiguated, but two editors, myself and Necrothesp, argued that usage is still ambiguous as 10th Rifle Division (Soviet Union) can reasonable refer to both of these articles, and since [[WP:MILMOS#UNITNAME]] doesn't give guidance on whether usage is ambiguous there is no basis to provide additional weight to Peacemakers argument. As such, I still believe that changing the result to no consensus would be appropriate. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 07:17, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

== Tracking my edits ==

Apologies for opening a second discussion; I have an extensive backlog on my watchlist to go through.

Eight hours after I moved [[Eyre Mountains/Taka Ra Haka Conservation Park]] you reverted the move, despite having never edited the article before. Similarly, eight hours after I created [[Scott Point (North Auckland)|Scott Point]] you moved it to Tiriparepa / Scott Point, despite the article having no links to it at the time. I cannot think of any explanation for either of these examples, particularly the Scott Point example, aside from [[WP:HOUNDING]], and so while I have raised this before with you I need to raise it again; please stop tracking my edits. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 03:38, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

:I regularly track a number of pages {{endash}} particularly around dual names {{endash}} as well as the new page list for WPNZ. I can assure you I'm not personally tracking your edits {{endash}} I have far better things to do with my time. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 03:46, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

::{{diff2|1084815825|This is the new page list for WPNZ from the time you moved the article}}. As you can see, Scott Point was not listed on it. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 03:53, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
:::Well then I'm not sure where I saw it {{endash}} perhaps on the WPNZ unassessed list? What I can assure you of though is that it wasn't by stalking your history. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 04:02, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
::::At the time you moved the article, it wasn't in the scope of any wikiproject, so it can't have been in WPNZ's unassessed list. In addition, it had no categories, was an orphan, and wasn't on the WPNZ new page list. At this point, I am unable to assume good faith, as there appears to be no way that you could have identified that article without tracking my edits. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 05:54, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
:::::I've explained that other move already {{endash}} watchlists are a thing as you've said so yourself {{endash}} and while I can't recall how I found Tiriparepa / Scott Point as that one took place so long ago, I can assure you that you're nowhere near important enough to warrant me paying that much attention to you. Now please stop lobbing false accusations and go find someone else's door to darken. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 06:16, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
::::::By itself, that other move would not be suspicious. Surprising, but in the context of [[WP:AGF]] I would believe you, as I did the first time you reverted a number of my edits despite never having edited any of those pages. However, with this history, and with the example of Scott Point where neither of us can determine how you could have found the article other than tracking my edits, I cannot believe you, and would ask that you commit to not tracking my edits. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 06:26, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
:::::::I may not have edited a specific page, but it's an area (New Zealand places, especially those with dual names) where I've got an extensive edit history, so I'm not sure why you're surprised that I have a bunch of them on my watchlist even if I haven't edited them specifically. I'm not sure what the point of committing to not do something I already don't do is, but if it'll help you sleep better at night then sure, whatever. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 06:48, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
::::::::Thank you. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 07:18, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
Kia ora anō [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] {{endash}} I received a notification about your recent message and reversion (just to be clear about how I found it). As I've mentioned several times previously, I have a range of articles on my watchlist, even if I may not have edited them in the past. I would have done the exact same move had another editor reverted the page, as indeed [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Requested_moves/Technical_requests&oldid=1094342344 I have]. I was not tracking your edits, as I have also mentioned several times previously. For instance, having looked at your contributions for the purpose of this reply, I had no idea that you were trying to downgrade WP:POINT. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 06:38, 29 June 2022 (UTC)

:Hope you guys don't mind me butting in (cc {{u|BilledMammal}}). Turnagra, I'm pretty certain that I know how you would have seen [[Scott Point (North Auckland)|Scott Point]]. When the article was first created, it contained a link to [[Ninety Mile Beach, New Zealand]]. As that beach has a dual name, my guess is that it's on your watchlist, Turnagra. If so, creating the article with that link would have triggered your [[Help:Notifications#Toolbar_icons|notice badge]] to show up in blue. You can check whether that's true by clicking on your notice badge and that should show you all past notices. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 00:30, 1 July 2022 (UTC)
::I don't mind; if you can provide an innocent explanation it would make me considerably more comfortable. However, that isn't it; you don't receive notifications for articles being linked to articles that are on your watchlist, you only receive them for articles you have created. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 22:30, 16 July 2022 (UTC)

== June 2022 ==

[[File:Information orange.svg|25px|alt=Information icon]] Please do not [[Wikipedia:No personal attacks|attack]] other editors, as you did  at [[:Talk:Stephens Island (New_Zealand)]]. Comment on ''content'', not on contributors. Personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Please [[Wikipedia:Staying cool when the editing gets hot|stay cool]] and keep this in mind while editing. ''Specifically, the statement {{tq|vexatious move requests you and others have carried out}} is casting [[WP:ASPERSIONS]]. This is also not an isolated incident; for example, a few days before you accused me of being {{tq|fundamentally opposed to indigenous names}}. 

Please be careful to avoid personal attacks in the future.''<!-- Template:uw-npa2 --> [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 07:29, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

:[[WP:ASPERSIONS]] is not a get out of jail free card. My comments have been based entirely on our history of interactions and your proposed moves on places where even the most stringent opponents of dual names agree that the dual name is the common name {{endash}} see, for example, on [[Talk:Aoraki_/_Mount_Cook#Requested_move_3_November_2021|Aoraki / Mount Cook]]. I would also point out your similar opposition to South African moves (which, for the record, I saw by virtue of engaging with them through the [[WP:RM]] page). Until your actions demonstrate otherwise, I can only act based on the evidence which I have seen. 
:On the subject of casting aspersions, I would also like to point you to the discussion directly above this, in which you accused me of hounding with no proof {{endash}} a complete failure of [[WP:AGF]], and in the process committing the very thing you're now trying to give me an (unfounded) warning for. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 08:50, 12 June 2022 (UTC)
::Look at the data; Google News shows 35 articles using only Mount Cook in the past month, compared to 14 using both Aoraki and Mount Cook. Google Scholar shows 434 results using only Mount Cook since 2018, compared to 240 results using both Aoraki and Mount Cook. This is in addition to the ngrams and specific examples I presented in the nomination - there is clearly a strong argument that the [[WP:COMMONNAME]] is Mount Cook, and that means that it was - and is - appropriate to open a discussion on the topic. 
::However, that isn't relevant. Aspersions is a requirement to support your accusations with evidence, and at the appropriate location - {{tq|Legitimate concerns of fellow editors' conduct should be raised either directly with the editor in question, in a civil fashion, or if necessary on an appropriate noticeboard or dispute-resolution page.}} You made yours without evidence, and on an article talk page.
::Regarding the hounding, evidence was presented, including evidence that you edited an article that you could only have found through my contributions page. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 09:35, 12 June 2022 (UTC)
:::And now you say {{tq|This is bordering on [[WP:WIKILAWYERING]]}}. If you believe my conduct is inappropriate, please raise it directly with me, rather than throwing out aspersions on article talk pages - I would also suggest reading [[Wikipedia:Wikilawyering#Use and misuse of the term]]. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 09:48, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

== Postcard #1 (2022) ==
{|-style="height: 120px;"
|<big>'''Postcard from the West Coast'''</big>
<big>''Monday 20 June, 2022''</big>
|[[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|right|120x120px]]
|-
|'''Kia ora koutou''' and thanks for joining the West Coast Wikipedian at Large project! I hope you enjoy helping improve coverage of the beautiful country of [[Te Tai Poutini]] over the next ten weeks • First, bookmark the [[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022|'''2022 project page''']] to keep up with which topics we're working on • For '''questions and suggestions''', use the [[Wikipedia talk:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022|project Talk page]] (and watchlist it) • There's a '''Useful tools''' section on the project page that's worth checking out • We're doing something different this year: instead of the daily reporting of 2020, we're compiling a '''weekly report''': just edit the [[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/Weekly Progress|Weekly Progress page]] with what you did when you did it, no pressure to do something every day! • There are '''prizes''' for both quantity and quality • '''Online training''' for newbie editors (Mon 27 Jun) and Commons contributors (Mon 4 Jul)—see the [[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL#Events|About page]] and feel free to recruit friends • The focus for the next couple of weeks is '''[[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022#Punakaiki|Punakaiki]]''': the [[pancake rocks]] (which need their own article?), [[Paparoa Track]] (a stub with no photos!), [[Cave Creek disaster|Cave Creek]] (much work needed, and photos of the track, creek, and memorial), and [[Barrytown]], subject of a [[Wikipedia:Meetup/Barrytown/1|Wikiblitz]] but still with plenty to do • I'll be '''visiting the Punakaiki area''' and hopefully presenting on Wikipedia to the DOC team around the 29–30 June (depending on weather), and will take photos of tracks, river, points, islands, and caves–requests taken • Note: there's a [[Wikipedia:Meetup/Hokitika/7|West Coast Reptiles Wikiblitz]] on '''Sunday 3 July''' if you want to help improve articles about native lizards • Right, that's plenty! Maybe people would be interested in an '''online team chat'''? I could post a Doodle poll… • '''So''' looking forward to working with you all on this! • Mānawatia a [[Matariki]], — [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]]
|[[File:CVNZ Punakaiki MRD 12.jpg|alt=|thumb|''[[Selliera radicans]]'' is a coastal turf plant that lives on the exposed clifftops near the [[Pancake rocks|Pancake Rocks]].]]
|}

== Postcard #2 (2022) ==
{|-style="height: 120px;"
|<big>'''Postcard from the West Coast'''</big>
<big>''Tuesday 5 July, 2022''</big>
|[[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|right|120x120px]]
|-
|'''Kia ora koutou''' and thank you all for your hard work over the last couple of weeks! We've had a cold snap here on the Coast, but at least the rain's slackened off and I've been able to get out on the blue sunny days and take snapshots • Schwede66 has been sorting out the [[Paparoa Range]], cleaning up mountain wikidata, and expanding the [[Pororari River|'''Pororari River''']] • We have a new article about the [[Truman Track|'''Truman Track''']], and a great photo selection for [[c:category:Cave Creek|Cave Creek]] • Our hardest worker has been Marshalc, creating new articles on the [[Pancake Rocks and Blowholes|Pancake Rocks]], [[Bullock Creek (New Zealand)|Bullock Creek]], and the [[Inland Pack Track|'''Inland Pack Track''']] amongst others • I took a field trip to Punakaiki and sorted out the Wikidata and photos for every scenic spot between the {{Q|Q112859334}} and {{Q|Q32217346}} • If you're still thinking about helping, we could do with expanding the '''[[Punakaiki]]''' article, and sorting the best [[c:category:Pancake Rocks photos|Pancake Rocks photos]] into a [[c:Commons:Galleries|Commons gallery]] • Greymouth photographer Jase Blair [[c:Category:Photos by Jase Blair|donated some '''beautiful photos''']] of Paparoa National Park which need using • The [[Avatar moth|'''Avatar moth''']] from [[Denniston Plateau]] (with its newly-improved article) will be RNZ's [[Critter of the Week|''Critter of the Week'']] on Friday • New resource: Mark Pickering's book '''{{Q|Q112841717}}''' is free to download and a great reference • This coming weekend I'm off to [[Moana, New Zealand|Moana]] {{Icon|Start}} on [[Lake Brunner]] {{Icon|Start}} (to photograph the bays, walks, and especially the [[Kotuku Model Bungalow]] {{Icon|Start}} (those are all Start-quality icons, hint hint) • Check out the [[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022|Project page]] to see jobs there are to do, and how you can help out! Ka kite ano. — [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]]
|[[File:Strongman Mine Disaster memorial MRD 03.jpg|alt=|thumb|Memorial to the [[Strongman Mine]] disaster of 1967. The stones are in memory of [[Pike River Mine disaster|Pike River]].]]
|}

== Autopatrolled  ==

[[File:Wikipedia Autopatrolled.svg|right|80px]]
Hi Turnagra, I just wanted to let you know that I have <span class="plainlinks">[//en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Special%3ALog&type=rights&page=User%3ATurnagra added]</span> the [[Wikipedia:Autopatrolled|autopatrolled user right]] to your account. This means that pages you create will automatically be marked as 'reviewed' and no longer appear in the [[Special:NewPagesFeed|new pages feed]]. Autopatrolled is assigned prolific creators of articles where those articles do not require further review, and may have been [[Wikipedia:Requests for permissions/Autopatrolled|requested]] on your behalf by someone else. It doesn't affect how you edit; it is used only to manage the workload of [[Wikipedia:New pages patrol|new page patrollers]].

Since the articles you create will no longer be systematically reviewed by other editors, it is important that you maintain the high standard you have achieved so far in all your future creations. Please also try to remember to add relevant [[Wikipedia:WikiProject|WikiProject]] templates, [[Wikipedia:Stub|stub tags]], [[Wikipedia:Categorization|categories]], and [[Wikipedia:Orphan|incoming links]] to them, if you aren't already in the habit; user scripts such as [[User:Evad37/rater|Rater]] and [[User:SD0001/StubSorter|StubSorter]] can help with this. As you have already shown that you have a strong grasp of Wikipedia's [[Wikipedia:Core content policies|core content policies]], you might also consider volunteering to become a [[Wikipedia:New pages patrol|new page patroller]] yourself, helping to uphold the project's standards and encourage other good faith article writers.

Feel free to leave me a message if you have any questions. Happy editing! '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 20:13, 16 July 2022 (UTC)

== Postcard #3 (2022) ==
{|-style="height: 120px;"
|<big>'''Postcard from the West Coast'''</big>
<big>''Tuesday 19 July, 2022''</big>
|[[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|right|120x120px]]
|-
|'''Kia ora koutou''' and once again thank you for all your mahi over the last fortnight • We've been working on articles on the '''[[Lake Brunner]]''' area; the lake's article is looking heaps better, and it's [[Template:Did you know nominations/Lake Brunner|in the queue for DYK]] • Marshelec, Swede66, and Turnagra have been the putting in lots of effort, with new articles on the [[Croesus Track]], [[Mount Te Kinga]], and the [[Pike29 Memorial Track|Pike19 Memorial Track]] amongst others • We've rescued lots of great photos from Flickr and other public collections • But these weren't enough: I did two field trips to photograph up and down the '''Punakaiki coast''', and halfway around the Arnold Valley and Lake Brunner; numerous new Commons categories and Wikidata images resulted • Progress at the lake was derailed by having to be [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gV0UIe3X7pQ filmed for the '''evening news'''], editing Wikipedia in the open air while being attacked by [[Austrosimulium|sandflies]] (our project mascot is well chosen) • Over the next two weeks the focus shifts to [[Karamea]], all the caves and walks of the [[Ōpārara Basin|'''Ōpārara Basin''']], and the [[Heaphy Track]] • There is '''plenty to do''': the [[Wangapeka Track]], [[Honeycomb Hill Cave]], and [[Kahurangi National Park]] need massive work, so I'm stoked that Marshall and Lyn are joining me for a few days this weekend at Karamea to help • This is an area that critically relies on tourism, and it's embarassing the coverage is so bad in Wikipedia • Check out the [[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022|Project page]] to see jobs there are to do, and how you can help out! Ka kite ano. — [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]]
|[[File:Kotuku Model Bungalow MRD 06.jpg|alt=small square modernist weatherboard house|thumb|The [[Kotuku Model Bungalow]] at Jack's Mill School; designed, built, and completely furnished ''at 3/4 scale'' by ''primary school children'' in 1938—the project of a visionary headmaster, now Heritage NZ listed.]]
|}

==DYK for Copland Track==
{{ivmbox
|image = Updated DYK query.svg
|imagesize=40px
|text = On [[Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2022/July#26 July 2022|26 July 2022]], '''[[:Template:Did you know|Did you know]]''' was updated with a fact from the article '''''[[Copland Track]]''''', which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ''... that a hut on New Zealand's '''[[Copland Track]]''' had to be moved after being hit by a mudslide just 13 weeks after opening?'' The nomination discussion and review may be seen at [[Template:Did you know nominations/Copland Track]]. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>([[User:Rjanag/Pageview stats|here's how]], [//pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2022-07-16&end=2022-08-05&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=Copland_Track Copland Track])</small>, and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics|the statistics page]]. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the [[:Template talk:Did you know|Did you know talk page]].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK -->  [[User:Gatoclass|Gatoclass]] ([[User talk:Gatoclass|talk]]) 12:02, 26 July 2022 (UTC)

== Postcard #4 (2022) ==

{|-style="height: 120px;"
|<big>'''Postcard from the West Coast'''</big>
<big>''Monday 1 Aug, 2022''</big>
|[[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|right|120x120px]]
|-
|'''Kia ora koutou''' and thanks for helping with this project • It's been a busy fortnight: I visited [[Karamea]] with Marshall and Lyn, and we spent the day on the '''[[Fenian Track]]''', which now has its own article and over '''100 photos''' of the valley, the local flora and fauna, and the three caves we explored • Yes, there were cave wētā and [[Spelungula|'''spiders''']] •  I also got to meet with local historians, photographers, and nature buffs who are keen to share photos and deluged me with print materials • The double hook featuring the [[Paparoa Track]] and the [[Pororari River]] articles appeared in [[Wikipedia:Recent additions/2022/July#25 July 2022|DYK on 25 July]] and they got 3000 readers between them, but the [[c:File:Paparoa_Track,_New_Zealand.webm|accompanying DOC video clip]] got over '''400,000 views'''! • The newly-created [[Copland Track|'''Copland Track''']] article was in DYK the next day, and [[Lake Brunner]] will feature soon • Great work, everyone • Coming up: [[Te Wahipounamu|'''Te Wahipounamu''']] and the [[Haast Pass|'''Haast Pass''']]—I'll be spending three days exploring and photographing the area, and could definitely do with help fleshing out the skeletal coverage of the lakes, localities, rivers, and wetlands of that beautiful part of the world • Check out the [[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022|Project page]] to see the north-to-south list for '''South Westland''', and pick something to work on; ask me for a job if you don't have one! Ka kite ano. — [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]]
|[[File:South Island Robin on Fenian Track 01.jpg|alt=small curious bird dark above, light below, with red legs and beady eyes|thumb|Marshall took this photo of a very curious South Island robin (''[[South Island robin|Petroica australis australis]]'') on the Fenian Track.]]
|} [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]] ([[User talk:Giantflightlessbirds|talk]]) 10:56, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

== Postcard #5 (2022) ==
{|-style="height: 120px;"
|<big>'''Postcard from the West Coast'''</big>
<big>''Monday 15 Aug, 2022''</big>
|[[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|right|120x120px]]
|-
|'''Kia ora koutou;''' we're coming up to the home stretch! • I got back from South Westland with about '''400 photos''' to upload and categorise into Commons • The DOC team down there are very excited about our project; they're busy reopening the '''[[Haast-Paringa Cattle Track]]''' with a new swingbridge, and I promised we would create an article with photos of all the huts • Archives New Zealand have a wonderful collection of [https://digitalnz.org/records?text=National%20Publicity%20Studios&i%5Bcontent_partner%5D=Archives%20New%20Zealand%20Te%20Rua%20Mahara%20o%20te%20K%C4%81wanatanga# '''tourist publicity photos''' on DigitalNZ]; you could search them for pics of West Coast places for articles (see the ones I used in [[Pleasant Flat]]) • There's still '''plenty to do''' over the last fortnight of the project—if you could find some time to pick one of the biggest gaps and have a go at filling it, that would be great • in Haast, we '''need articles''' on [[Okuru]] (currently a redirect), [[Hannahs Clearing]], the [[Roaring Billy Falls|Roaring Billy]] and [[Thunder Creek Falls]], and [[Ship Creek (New Zealand)|Ship Creek]]; I have photos of all of them • You could also check back through the '''[[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022#Punakaiki|Punakaiki]]''', '''[[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022#Lake Brunner|Lake Brunner]]''', and '''[[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022#North Westland|North Westland]]''' lists for anything that needs expanding • In other news, I'm running an online workshop 7 pm August 23rd on '''Adding Photos to Commons'''; [https://event-10944-9919.lilregie.com/booking/attendees/new enrolment's free], share with any keen photographers you know • We're also having a [[Wikipedia:Meetup/Hokitika/7|Wikiblitz this coming Sunday]] to try to improve the articles about '''West Coast reptiles''', and could use help •  Thank you for all your hard work; I'd like to organise an '''online meetup on Zoom''' at the end of the project to look back at what we've done and have a think about next steps; will send some possible times • Ka kite ano. — [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]]
|[[File:Pleasant Flat FL24658467.jpg|alt=a couple having a picnic on a grassy slope overlooking river flats and snowy mountains;the woman has sunglasses, the man a striped shirt and a fishing rod. A transistor radio sits between them.|thumb|A couple having a lovely picnic at [[Pleasant Flat]] in 1965, from the National Publicity Studios collection]]
|}

== Postcard #6 (2022) ==
{|-style="height: 120px;"
|<big>'''Postcard from the West Coast'''</big>
<big>''Monday 29 Aug, 2022''</big>
|[[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|right|120x120px]]
|-
|'''Kia ora koutou;''' well, it's time to wrap up this project • What a wonderful and short '''ten weeks''' it's been; I've really appreciated all the mahi people have put into improving articles about the West Coast • There's a summary of what we've managed to achieve [[Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2022 Final Report|in the '''final report''']] • Briefly: '''24''' '''new''' articles, '''5''' of them in DYK, '''974 edits''' to '''193''' articles, adding '''73,800''' words and '''653''' citations • We uploaded '''1126 photos''' into numerous new Commons categories • Standouts for me were [[User:Schwede66|'''Schwede66''']]'s sorting out all the [[Paparoa Range|Paparoa mountains]] named after famous scientists, [[User:Marshelec|'''Marshelec''']]'s work on [[Karamea]] and [[Bullock Creek (New Zealand)|Bullock Creek]], and [[User:Turnagra|'''Turnagra''']] creating the [[Copland Track]] article • There are small '''prizes''' going out to those three, but I also want to acknowledge all the effort of [[User:Paora|Paora]], [[User:Chocmilk03|Chocmilk03]], and [[User:Gertrude206|Gertrude206]]—great stuff • I'm about to head off to Europe for a month, to attend the Wikimedia Summit and learn what European Wikipedians are up to, but despite time zones would like to have '''an online catchup''' with participants soon • '''Thank you''' again for all your hard work; ka kite ano and I hope we'll have another bash at the West Coast again soon. Don't be strangers. — [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]]
|[[File:Home Guard - Punakaiki - Pascoe.webp|alt=A soldier in uniform with a rifle looking out to see standing atop the Pancake Rocks at Punakaiki|thumb|[[John Pascoe]]'s photo of a Home Guard solder at the [[Pancake Rocks]]]]
|}

{| style="background-color: #FFF; border: 2px solid #fceb92;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 10px 5px 10px 5px;" | [[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|120x120px]]
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 5px 5px 0 5px; height: 1.5em;" | ''The West Coast Stamp of Approval''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 0 20px 10px 10px;" | Thank you so much for all your work for the West Coast Wikipedian at Large (The Sequel) project, and I've a small thank-you prize for you which I'll pop into the post—will message you for a mailing address. Your help sorting out macrons and creating nicely-illustrated articles was much appreciated. —[[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]] ([[User talk:Giantflightlessbirds|talk]]) 18:21, 29 August 2022 (UTC)
|}

==Dispute resolution==
Do you see this as a content dispute, or an issue with editor behaviour? For the former, see [[WP:Dispute resolution]], and perhaps [[WP:Mediation]]. for the latter, there's [[WP:ANI]] and if you get no satisfaction there, [[WP:ARBCOM]]. However, there are several parties on each side of this discussion (so [[WP:Third opinion]] is not suitable) and by taking it to the "drama boards" you will be seeking comment from people who may not understand the New Zealand perspectives on use of Māori and macrons and there is a chance it will backfire onto you.

One suggestion at the dispute resolution link is to disengage, and I have at least partially followed this strategy myself.-<span style="font-family:cursive; color:grey;">[[User talk:gadfium|gadfium]]</span> 04:53, 7 October 2022 (UTC)
==[[Whakatāne seamount]]==
Thanks for the move as observed but should it not be Whakatāne Seamount ?[[User:ChaseKiwi|ChaseKiwi]] ([[User talk:ChaseKiwi|talk]]) 22:14, 17 October 2022 (UTC)

:Kia ora [[User:ChaseKiwi|ChaseKiwi]] - I thought about that, but it seems that it's usually just referred to as "Whakatāne" as the name from what I can gather (which is consistent with other seamounts in the area). As such, "seamount" is filling more of the role of disambiguation in the title, with the current title seeming more natural than parenthetical. Keen to get your take on it if you reckon it works better as a proper noun though. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 22:17, 17 October 2022 (UTC)
::Its its official name [https://gazetteer.linz.govt.nz/place/14228 New Zealand Gazetteer entry] [[User:ChaseKiwi|ChaseKiwi]] ([[User talk:ChaseKiwi|talk]]) 23:16, 17 October 2022 (UTC)
:::My bad - feel free to change it! I feel a bit guilty having already had to correct one typo in it... [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 23:35, 17 October 2022 (UTC)
== Renaming discussion was shallow to coin a pun ==
Good on you for detecting island issue in recent discussion on category renaming. Missed the fact that up to 100m or so under present sea level a [[maar]] could occur rather than a seamount. Please see [[Category talk:Seamounts of New Zealand]] [[User:ChaseKiwi|ChaseKiwi]] ([[User talk:ChaseKiwi|talk]]) 21:40, 1 November 2022 (UTC)

== ArbCom 2022 Elections voter message ==

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The [[WP:ARBCOM|Arbitration Committee]] is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the [[Wikipedia:Arbitration|Wikipedia arbitration process]]. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose [[WP:BAN|site bans]], [[WP:TBAN|topic bans]], editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The [[Wikipedia:Arbitration/Policy|arbitration policy]] describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.

If you wish to participate in the 2022 election, please review [[Wikipedia:Arbitration Committee Elections December 2022/Candidates|the candidates]] and submit your choices on the '''[[Special:SecurePoll/vote/{{Arbitration Committee candidate/data|2022|poll}}|voting page]]'''.  If you no longer wish to receive these messages, you may add {{tlx|NoACEMM}} to your user talk page. <small>[[User:MediaWiki message delivery|MediaWiki message delivery]] ([[User talk:MediaWiki message delivery|talk]]) 01:08, 29 November 2022 (UTC)</small>

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== Invitation ==

<div style="border: 2px solid #484898; background: #FFF; background-color:#98FB98; padding: 1ex 1ex 1ex 1.5ex; margin: 0px 0px 1em 1em; font-size: 99%">
[[Image:AFC-Logo.svg|75px|right]]
Hello Turnagra: 

'''[[Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation|WikiProject Articles for creation]]''' is holding a ''' two week long [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/January 2023 Backlog Drive|Backlog Drive]]'''!<br />
The goal of this drive is to '''eliminate''' the backlog of unreviewed articles. The drive is running until 14 January 2023.

Barnstars will be given out as awards at the end of the drive.<br />
There is a backlog of over {{Rounddown|{{formatnum:{{PAGESINCATEGORY:Pending AfC submissions}}|R}}|-2}} articles, so start reviewing articles. We're looking forward to your help! <b><span style="background:#444;padding:2px 12px;font-size:12px"><span style="color:#FC0">❯❯❯</span>[[User:Raydann|<span style="color:#fff"> Raydann</span>]][[User talk:Raydann|<sup><i><span style="color:#D3D3D3">(Talk)</span></i></sup>]]</span></b> 10:11, 3 January 2023 (UTC)</div> <b><span style="background:#444;padding:2px 12px;font-size:12px"><span style="color:#FC0">❯❯❯</span>[[User:Raydann|<span style="color:#fff"> Raydann</span>]][[User talk:Raydann|<sup><i><span style="color:#D3D3D3">(Talk)</span></i></sup>]]</span></b> 10:11, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

== WikiProject New Zealand law task force ==

(You may have noticed) The task force has been created per our discussion the other week, I invite you to join it if you are still interested :)
{{User WikiProject New Zealand/Law task force|This user wants you to join '''[[Wikipedia:WikiProject New Zealand/Law task force|WikiProject NZ Law]]'''.}}<br/><br/><br/> [[User:Carolina2k22|<b style="text-shadow: 0px 0px 10px #8e24aa; color: #8e24aa;">Carolina2k22</b>]] • [[User talk:Carolina2k22|<span style="color: #8e24aa;">(talk)</span>]] • [[Special:Contribs/Carolina2k22|<span style="color: #8e24aa;">(edits)</span>]] 07:10, 6 January 2023 (UTC)

:Thanks [[User:Carolina2k22|Carolina]] - definitely keen to help out, I just need to figure out how to rearrange the userboxes so not to lose how well they line up with the Piopio picture on my userpage currently! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 17:35, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
::Fair enough! It does look quite lovely; I'm glad you're still interested! [[User:Carolina2k22|<b style="text-shadow: 0px 0px 10px #8e24aa; color: #8e24aa;">Carolina2k22</b>]] • [[User talk:Carolina2k22|<span style="color: #8e24aa;">(talk)</span>]] • [[Special:Contribs/Carolina2k22|<span style="color: #8e24aa;">(edits)</span>]] 23:31, 6 January 2023 (UTC)

== Please don't remove sections ==

Don't remove questions from the various Help desks, or from other people's talk pages, even when a question has been answered, or if something is no longer relevant.  It looks like you did that here https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:WikiProject_Articles_for_creation/Help_desk&diff=prev&oldid=1131660908.

You can, however,  always remove things from ''your own'' Talk page.  Other people may find the information useful and informative.   Thanks! [[User:David10244|David10244]] ([[User talk:David10244|talk]]) 07:02, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

:Sorry [[User:David10244|David]] - I figured it'd be okay as it was my own question and wasn't long after posting. Will make sure not to next time! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 07:04, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

== dual name debate ==

Kia ora, I know it's exhausting but thought you might like to know the [[Clutha River|Clutha/Mata-Au]] RFM has opened up again. [[User:TreeReader|TreeReader]] ([[User talk:TreeReader|talk]]) 07:34, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

:Thanks [[User:TreeReader|TreeReader]] - I was already aware and had been trying to figure out how best to formulate my argument. As a word of caution, I'd suggest not paging people like this as it may be seen as [[WP:CANVASSING]] and could cause votes to be discounted. The better approach is to alert relevant wikiprojects, such as [[WP:WPNZ]]. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 07:36, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
::Ah ok thanks for letting me know. I thought it felt a bit sneaky but it's so frustrating going round in circles every 6 months! [[User:TreeReader|TreeReader]] ([[User talk:TreeReader|talk]]) 07:38, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
:::Absolutely, it can be a pain. I'd suggest keeping an eye on the requested moves section of the [[Wikipedia:WikiProject New Zealand/Article alerts|WPNZ article alerts]] so that you can see when move requests you may be interested in crop up, it's always an ongoing issue! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 07:40, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
::::Thank you! I wasn't aware of the alerts section on WPNZ, that's good to know. [[User:TreeReader|TreeReader]] ([[User talk:TreeReader|talk]]) 06:35, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

== A barnstar for you! ==

{| class="barnstar" style="border:1px solid gray; background:#fdffe7;"
|-
|rowspan="2" style="padding-right:5px;" | [[File:Working Man's Barnstar.png|100px]]

|style="font-size:1.65em; padding:0; height: 1.1em;" | '''The Working Wikipedian's Barnstar'''
|-
|style="border-top: 1px solid gray;" | Thank you for participating in Articles for Creation's [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/January 2023 Backlog Drive|January 2023 Backlog Drive]]! You reviewed 50 drafts, for a total of 63.5 points. &mdash;&nbsp;[[User:Ingenuity|Ingenuity]]&nbsp;([[User talk:Ingenuity|talk]]&nbsp;&bull;&nbsp;[[Special:Contributions/Ingenuity|contribs]]) 00:43, 15 January 2023 (UTC)
|}
:Thank you! Was a pleasure to be able to help out where I could. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 01:15, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

==DYK for Garden of Eden Ice Plateau==
{{ivmbox
|image = Updated DYK query.svg
|imagesize=40px
|text = On [[Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2023/January#18 January 2023|18 January 2023]], '''[[:Template:Did you know|Did you know]]''' was updated with a fact from the article '''''[[Garden of Eden Ice Plateau]]''''', which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ''... that the [[New Zealand Geographic Board]] initially rejected the name of the '''[[Garden of Eden Ice Plateau]]''' for being biblical in origin?'' The nomination discussion and review may be seen at [[Template:Did you know nominations/Garden of Eden Ice Plateau]]. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>([[User:Rjanag/Pageview stats|here's how]], [//pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2023-01-08&end=2023-01-28&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=Garden_of_Eden_Ice_Plateau Garden of Eden Ice Plateau])</small>, and the hook may be added to [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics/Monthly DYK pageview leaders|the statistics page]] after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the [[:Template talk:Did you know|Did you know talk page]].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK -->  [[User:BorgQueen|BorgQueen]] ([[User talk:BorgQueen|talk]]) 12:03, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

== ITN recognition for [[Cyclone Gabrielle]] ==

{{ivmbox
  |1=On 15 February 2023, '''''[[:Template:In the news|In the news]]''''' was updated with an item that involved the article '''''[[Cyclone Gabrielle]]''''', which you nominated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the [[Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates|candidates page]]. [[User:Stephen|Step]][[User talk:Stephen|hen]] 00:40, 15 February 2023 (UTC)
  |2={{Ambox globe current red}}
  |imagesize=50px
 }}
:Well done nominating this! Now we just need the community to upload some images and videos. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 01:12, 15 February 2023 (UTC)
::Thank you! And yeah, I'm a bit surprised that there's such a relative lack of images so far given how widespread the damage is. I assume that people in those areas probably have more pressing things on their mind at the moment though. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 04:48, 15 February 2023 (UTC)
== Your [[WP:Good articles|GA]] nomination of [[Taiari / Chalky Inlet]] ==
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've [[Talk:Taiari / Chalky Inlet/GA1{{!}}begun reviewing]] the article [[Taiari / Chalky Inlet]] you nominated for [[WP:GA|GA]]-status according to the [[WP:WIAGA|criteria]]. [[File:Time2wait.svg|20px|link=]] This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. <!-- Template:GANotice --> <!-- Template:GANotice --> <small>Message delivered by [[User:ChristieBot|ChristieBot]], on behalf of [[User:Mike Christie|Mike Christie]]</small> -- [[User:Mike Christie|Mike Christie]] ([[User talk:Mike Christie|talk]]) 18:40, 24 March 2023 (UTC)
== Your [[WP:Good articles|GA]] nomination of [[Taiari / Chalky Inlet]] ==
The article [[Taiari / Chalky Inlet]] you nominated as a [[Wikipedia:Good article nominations|good article]] has passed [[File:Symbol support vote.svg|20px|link=]]; see [[Talk:Taiari / Chalky Inlet]] for comments about the article, and [[Talk:Taiari / Chalky Inlet/GA1]] for the nomination. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a '''bold link''' under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can [[Template_talk:Did_you_know#To_nominate_an_article|nominate it]] within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility.<!-- Template:GANotice result=pass --> <!-- Template:GANotice --> <small>Message delivered by [[User:ChristieBot|ChristieBot]], on behalf of [[User:Mike Christie|Mike Christie]]</small> -- [[User:Mike Christie|Mike Christie]] ([[User talk:Mike Christie|talk]]) 22:40, 28 March 2023 (UTC)

== Burwood Plantation vs. Bottle Lake Forest Park ==

Kia ora, I have a Christchurch locality quandary. There's a Wikidata item for the Burwood Plantation, which some sources online equate with the Burwood Resource Recovery Park, but the location seems to be the same as [[Bottle Lake Forest]]. Do you know if these are names for the same place? --[[User:Prosperosity|Prosperosity]] ([[User talk:Prosperosity|talk]]) 21:38, 18 April 2023 (UTC)

:[[User:Prosperosity|@Prosperosity]] I'm not 100% sure, but my gut is that they're the same thing - or at least are now. There seems to be a topomap result which points to the plantation being where there's a subdivision now, so maybe they used to be distinct but have since combined? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 22:25, 18 April 2023 (UTC)
::Hmm....in that case, I'll merge the items for now, and if it turns out that they're different, we can always recreate them. --[[User:Prosperosity|Prosperosity]] ([[User talk:Prosperosity|talk]]) 01:41, 19 April 2023 (UTC)
:::I think "Burwood Plantation" and "Bottle Lake Forest Park" are used interchangeably. The recovery park is a small area within the plantation / park. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 04:23, 24 April 2023 (UTC)

==DYK for Taiari / Chalky Inlet==
{{ivmbox
|image = Updated DYK query.svg
|imagesize=40px
|text = On [[Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2023/April#29 April 2023|29 April 2023]], '''[[:Template:Did you know|Did you know]]''' was updated with a fact from the article '''''[[Taiari / Chalky Inlet]]''''', which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ''... that more than 100 traps were set to catch a single stoat on an otherwise predator-free island in '''[[Taiari / Chalky Inlet|Taiari&nbsp;/ Chalky Inlet]]''' in 2022?'' The nomination discussion and review may be seen at [[Template:Did you know nominations/Taiari / Chalky Inlet]]. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>([[User:Rjanag/Pageview stats|here's how]], [//pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2023-04-19&end=2023-05-09&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=Taiari_/_Chalky_Inlet Taiari / Chalky Inlet])</small>, and the hook may be added to [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics/Monthly DYK pageview leaders|the statistics page]] after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the [[:Template talk:Did you know|Did you know talk page]].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK -->  -- [[User:RoySmith|RoySmith]] [[User Talk:RoySmith|(talk)]] 00:03, 29 April 2023 (UTC)

== A barnstar for you! ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | [[File:Tireless Contributor Barnstar Hires.gif|100px]]
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Tireless Contributor Barnstar'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Thanks for your hard work in AfC over the last few weeks, usually a thankless task...! Your work is not going unnoticed. [[User:Mattdaviesfsic|Mattdaviesfsic]] ([[User talk:Mattdaviesfsic|talk]]) 07:24, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
|}

:Thank you! Just wanting to try and do my bit to get the backlog down! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 10:01, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

== OSH literacy:  ==

The International Literacy Summit, the Institute of Occupational Safety & Health ( IOSH) have all stated that OSH literacy is a literacy comparable to computer literacy, health literacy, financial literacy etc. It meets all standards to be classified as a key skill literacy. [[User:Davidmagee9|Davidmagee9]] ([[User talk:Davidmagee9|talk]]) 05:34, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Davidmagee9|Davidmagee9]] Thanks for the context, I don't have any issues about it being its own article in that case! It might be worth editing the article to mention that stuff as well if it's not in there already. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 06:01, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
::Many thanks Turnagra. I appreciate your time and will follow your kind advice. David Magee [[User:Davidmagee9|Davidmagee9]] ([[User talk:Davidmagee9|talk]]) 14:16, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

== Page Review - Mike Boateng ==

Hello,

I wish to express my concern over the recent submission decline of a [[Draft:Mike Boateng|page]] that I've patiently waited four months for approval, due to the presence of a single citation that could have been effortlessly excised. I feel it's critical to secure approval for this page at the earliest because a search for 'Mike Boateng' on Google only displays search results for the [[Draft:Mike Boateng|Michael Boateng]] whose page I created. Nevertheless, the accompanying knowledge panel is linked to a different [[Michael Boateng]] of lesser notability, and this confusion is negatively impacting the search results of the intended Mike Boateng, especially since the other individual has a criminal record.

In alignment with the notability guidelines stipulated by Wikipedia, I'd like to present the following arguments to emphasize Mike Boateng's worthiness of a Wikipedia page.

# ''Extensive Exposure'': Mike Boateng, a prominent Black TV personality in the UK, has been featured extensively in credible and independent media outlets.
# ''Public Impact'': His active role in popular reality TV shows such as Love Island and Celebrity Ex on the Beach has notably shaped public views and dialogues.
# ''Accolades'': Mike's double nomination for the National Reality TV Award for categories like "Best Male Personality of the Year" and "Reality Personality of the Year" attests to his industry-wide recognition and further validates his notability.
# ''Comparison'': In juxtaposition with other notable figures such as Jon Clark and Josh Ritchie, Mike's significance and contributions seem just as noteworthy, if not superior.

In light of these arguments, I kindly request that this page be approved. I appreciate your understanding. Thank you. [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 11:09, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

:FYI: Justtheeditor1 has resubmitted [[Draft:Mike Boateng]] and it is awaiting a reviewer. Your call on whether you want to revisit that or leave it to someone else. You should be aware that at a Teahouse entry about this draft, Justtheeditor1 wrote "Under different usernames, I work on developing Wikipedia pages for UK reality TV stars and their related ventures." I am researching and considering starting a Sockpuppet investigation.  [[User:David notMD|David notMD]] ([[User talk:David notMD|talk]]) 21:29, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
::Thanks [[User:David notMD|David]] - I'm happy to leave this for someone else to get a second opinion on the article. I'd also note their [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Teahouse&diff=prev&oldid=1161896915 other comment] in the tea house that they work with a group of people. I'm happy to leave that side of things with you as I'm not overly familiar with it. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 21:39, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
::Hi David, 
::You seem to be more concerned about this comment than any of my previous speaking about a concerning trend of unconscious bias when accessing submissions on people of colour. This fact is quite revealing. As also mentioned in the comments (which you conveniently seem to have missed), I’ve said to provide more context, my comment about "different usernames" doesn't mean I control these accounts. Instead, I assist in creating content within a community of fellow celebrity enthusiasts who then create the pages. This approach ensures that we don't violate the rules against sockpuppetry.  [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 06:47, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
:Kia ora [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] - as I mentioned in [[Wikipedia:Teahouse#Rejected_Page|the Teahouse]], me declining your article wasn't due solely to that single source, but rather issues around the reliability of the sources you chose more generally and questions about whether Boateng meets the notability criteria for articles (per [[WP:NPEOPLE]]). My view was that the sources you provided weren't reliable enough, nor did they demonstrate that Boateng had notability outside of the context of Love Island, and as a result brought [[WP:BLP1E]] into consideration.
:I'd also like to vehemently deny your [[WP:ASPERSION|aspersion]] that my decline was in part based on racism - nothing could be further from the truth. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 21:34, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
::I fully acknowledge and respect your viewpoints. My remarks weren't targeted at you, and I concurred with your initial reasons for rejecting the submission. Instead, my comments stemmed from a troubling pattern that my group has detected during the submission process. We don't usually face these approval challenges when dealing with lesser-known white celebrities. However, our initial submissions for celebrities of color never get accepted, unlike our other submissions.
::As you can observe, substantial efforts have been undertaken by me and others in the wiki community to elevate this page to the requisite standards for approval. Would you be so kind as to reassess the page and determine if it now meets the criteria? [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 06:56, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
:::Can we also take a brief pause to empathize and objectively evaluate the strong evidence present in what I've penned? It's hard to fathom the degree of frustration experienced by individuals like Mike who are seemingly at a loss to resolve such issues. This is precisely why groups like ours come into being. If you Google "Mike Boateng," EVERY result points to him. Various articles, images, the works. Yet, the knowledge panel that emerges is associated with a different, lesser-known Michael Boateng, whose Wikipedia page appears alongside all of Mike's search results. As a long-time follower of Mike, I've witnessed him express his struggles on social media about how this mix-up has hindered his job prospects and potential brand partnerships because it's the first thing that comes up in searches. The wrong person appearing on his search results due to Wikipedia. This is precisely the kind of situation Wikipedia was designed to address: to serve as an impartial repository of verifiable, well-established facts. Mike Boateng's truth is being obscured online by another individual's identity, and as a collective community, we should aspire to ensure that the facts remain untainted and truthful for both lesser-known and more prominent individuals. [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 07:17, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
::::I can completely understand that frustration and have experienced something similar myself in the past (incidentally also relating to some borderline racist approaches taken by others). I'd make a few general points first:
::::* I can't speak to your other submissions as I haven't seen them, but if you think there's genuinely some underlying bias there it could be worth teasing that out a bit. I'd suggest starting a subpage within your userspace (see [[WP:SUBPAGE]]) and having a table to review your group's draft articles with links to the versions at the time of their review so that you're able to build a stronger case and see whether there's any other differences which might cause it (or which can be pre-emptively discounted before someone uses it to explain the declines)
::::* With regards to the google results, it's worth bearing in mind that these are often tailored based on google's understanding of you and aren't always representative of society as a whole. For instance, if I search for "Hamilton" I almost exclusively get results for the city here in New Zealand, rather than the musical, historical figure, or cities elsewhere. If I search Mike Boateng as someone who has never seen a single episode of Love Island or watched English club football, my results are about 50/50 between the two of them. This is why wikipedia doesn't generally rely on things like search results when determining primary topics for page moves, for instance.
::::* Were this page to be accepted, the current [[Michael Boateng]] would likely remain at that title, per [[WP:SMALLDETAILS]] - so there's still a risk that search results would be confused. 
::::With all this said, if you would like me to I am happy to take another look at the article - or else wait for another reviewer to give a second opinion. One thing I would suggest before this, though, is to have a look at some of the pages around reliable sources ([[WP:RS]], [[WP:DEPS]], and [[WP:RSP]]) and check the lists in the latter against the sources you've got. My concern is that some of the sources you've got, even if they're not explicitly mentioned on this list, feel as though they're at an equivalent level of reliability to sources which ''are'' listed. This means that the article could be at greater risk of deletion down the line, and making sure your sources are at a good level (see [[WP:42]]) helps to make the article much stronger and able to withstand any challenges that come up in the future. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 07:53, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::Thank you so much for your thoughtful and detailed response. Your insight is valuable and has given me much to consider. I truly respect and appreciate the time and effort you've put into your analysis, and it's genuinely refreshing to find someone like you in the Wikipedia community offering such unbiased reviews.
:::::I fully understand your perspective and find your suggestions to be quite helpful. I'll start by discussing with my group the idea of starting a subpage within our userspace, as per your suggestion, and work on developing a table to review our group's draft articles. This way, we can build a more robust case while also identifying any potential differences that could influence our submissions.
:::::In regards to the search results, your point makes perfect sense. Google's algorithms can indeed personalize search results based on user behavior, which may not be representative of a broader societal view. This aspect hadn't occurred to me previously, so thank you for pointing it out.
:::::Concerning the article, based on the changes that have been made, I kindly request that you take another look at the page. I believe it now meets the criteria for notability, but of course, I respect your expert judgment and will accept your final decision. We've also taken into consideration the advice you've provided regarding the reliability of sources (WP:RS, WP:DEPS, and WP:RSP). We're making continued efforts to ensure our sources meet the required level of reliability so as to strengthen the article and protect it from potential challenges in the future.
:::::Once again, thank you for your guidance, and I look forward to any further feedback you may have. [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 09:22, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::Okay, I'll try and find time but it might not be til this weekend. Before I do, though, I'd suggest taking another look through your sources in light of the links I sent (particularly the last two) and double check that you think these meet the relevant threshold for reliability on wikipedia. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:40, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::::Thank you for your response and for your willingness to take the time to review the article. I appreciate your guidance and the links you've shared, particularly the last two, which offer insightful perspectives on the standards of source reliability on Wikipedia.
:::::::In light of your advice, I will revisit my sources and double-check their alignment with Wikipedia's standards for reliability. I understand the importance of ensuring that any information added to Wikipedia is well-sourced, accurate, and adheres to the principles of verifiability and neutrality.
:::::::Thank you once again for your time and effort. I look forward to hearing your thoughts and feedback once you've had a chance to review the article.  [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 20:57, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::::Hello Turnagra,
::::::::I understand you may not have had time this weekend. However, when you do manage to find some time, could you kindly review the article? All the necessary updates have been made to ensure the article meets the relevant threshold for reliability on Wikipedia. Thank you once again for your assistance. [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 15:57, 3 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::Sorry, I got caught up by other things and haven't had much time for Wikipedia. At a quick look, I'd see whether there are alternate sources for the material you've currently used the mirror and IMDb for if possible, as these seem to have borderline reliability. This isn't necessarily to say that those sources would be a barrier to it being accepted, as I haven't had time for a proper look yet. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 10:09, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::Hello Turnagra,
::::::::::It's been a while since your last message and I was wondering if you might have a chance to give the article a more thorough review now? Your insights would be invaluable. [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 11:37, 23 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::Sorry [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]], this completely slipped my mind. I'll try to take a look this afternoon sometime. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:27, 23 July 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::::No worries, thank you.  [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 17:50, 24 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::::Dear [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]],
:::::::::::::Firstly, I want to again express my gratitude for your role in ensuring the accuracy and quality of Wikipedia's content. Your hard work is truly invaluable.
:::::::::::::However, I wanted to bring up a concern regarding the review process of the [[Mike Boateng]] page. I completely understand that you may be dealing with a multitude of tasks and I appreciate your commitment towards maintaining the integrity of Wikipedia. But it's been quite disheartening to see the delay in the review of our page, especially given how prompt you were to issue the initial decline.
:::::::::::::Since your initial review, the page has undergone substantial edits, both from myself and other Wikipedia users. We've taken into account your feedback regarding notability and have made concerted efforts to meet the standards outlined in the notability guidelines (WP:ORGCRIT). I firmly believe that the page now stands in compliance with Wikipedia's stringent criteria.
:::::::::::::I understand your initial reservations, but I feel the initial decline might have been a tad harsh considering the significant improvements made since then. I would greatly appreciate it if you could expedite the review process and re-evaluate  the [[Mike Boateng]] page at your earliest convenience.
:::::::::::::Thank you again for your time and efforts. Your assistance in this matter is greatly appreciated. [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 09:01, 26 July 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::::::I appreciate your frustration, and please know that it's not intentional - I just genuinely keep forgetting, I've got a bunch of other stuff on and I end up spending my limited wikipedia time on other things. I've taken a look, and while I still have some questions about notability I'm happy to take your word for it as someone more familiar with the topic and get the ball rolling on approval. I'm still a bit iffy about the reliability of some of the sources too - the one source which is probably untenable more than the others is IMDb, you'll definitely need a more reliable source for the date of birth (see [[WP:IMDb]]). [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 09:25, 26 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::::::It's completely understandable that managing multiple tasks can be demanding, and I value the time you dedicated to this process amidst your other commitments.
:::::::::::::::Your willingness to start the approval process truly shows your commitment to collaboration and fairness.
:::::::::::::::Once again, thank you for your understanding, consideration, and your continued efforts to uphold the quality of Wikipedia's content. [[User:Justtheeditor1|Justtheeditor1]] ([[User talk:Justtheeditor1|talk]]) 19:35, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

== Request for Assistance in Revising Article Submission ==

Hello Turnagra,

I hope this message finds you well. I recently received a decline on my article submission, and I appreciate your feedback regarding the sources I included. After carefully considering your suggestions, I am seeking guidance regarding the references in question.

It came to my attention that a few of the articles I referenced, although sourced from reputable magazines, are exclusively available in printed press and are not accessible online. In light of this, I would greatly appreciate your advice on how to handle these references appropriately.

Given the stricter requirements for citing sources in biographies of living people, as outlined in WP:BLP, I understand the importance of ensuring the accuracy and availability of all sources before resubmitting the article for approval.

Thank you for your time and assistance in this matter. I look forward to your guidance on how to proceed with the references.

Best regards, [[User:Cestgeorge|Cestgeorge]] ([[User talk:Cestgeorge|talk]]) 05:20, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

:Mōrena [[User:Cestgeorge|Cestgeorge]], thanks for reaching out. I'm more than happy to help where I can (though acknowledging that a lot of the references are in French and so I won't be able to comment on whether they're reliable or back up what you've used them for). Citing paper sources is fine and happens all the time, the key thing is making sure they're reliable and independent (see [[WP:42]]). Having a look over [[WP:Citing sources]] is a good place to start too, and I'll provide more feedback on the article when I get a chance. The key thing with BLP is that everything is backed up by reliable sources. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:57, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
::Thank you for your response and willingness to assist. I appreciate your guidance on ensuring reliable and independent sources for citations. I have taken note of your suggestions and will review WP:Citing sources for further information. I look forward to receiving your feedback on the article. Maintaining accuracy and adhering to BLP guidelines is important to me. If you have any additional recommendations or specific areas to focus on, please let me know. Thank you again for your support. [[User:Cestgeorge|Cestgeorge]] ([[User talk:Cestgeorge|talk]]) 13:08, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
:::Sure thing, perhaps I'll hold off on the more proper review until you've had a go with the guidance from that link? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 10:10, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
::::I hope this message finds you well. I'm writing to inform you that I've taken the time to thoroughly review the guidance provided in the Wikipedia:Citing sources article. In accordance with the guidelines outlined there, I have made several improvements to the article in question.
::::Specifically, I have addressed dead links by replacing them with proper citations and have made efforts to locate notable references, with a preference for English sources. It is worth noting that while I have focused on English citations, some of the most notable references are in French.
::::Given the recent updates and improvements I've made to the article, I believe it is now an appropriate time for a more comprehensive review. I kindly request your assistance in conducting a thorough evaluation of the article and providing any necessary feedback or further guidance for refinement.
::::Thank you in advance for your time and consideration. [[User:Cestgeorge|Cestgeorge]] ([[User talk:Cestgeorge|talk]]) 14:19, 13 September 2023 (UTC)
::::I hope this message finds you well. I am writing to remind you of my previous message sent over a month ago regarding the article in question. I kindly request your attention to the detailed improvements I made, as outlined in my previous communication. Your review and feedback on those changes would be greatly appreciated.
::::Thank you for your time and consideration.
::::Warm regards, [[User:Cestgeorge|Cestgeorge]] ([[User talk:Cestgeorge|talk]]) 12:43, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
:::::Apologies for the delay [[User:Cestgeorge|Cestgeorge]], things got away from me. I'll try and look at it soon! Though if you haven't already, please resubmit it in case someone else gets to it ahead of me. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 17:19, 31 October 2023 (UTC)

== Suggestions on rewriting [[Draft:Oleg Rogynskyy]]? ==

Hi @[[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]], you recently declined this page with a suggestion to do a heavy rewrite for a more neutral and encyclopedic tone. I made several changes and would appreciate further suggestions when you have time to look at the revised draft. Thank you. [[User:Igor Markov|Igor Markov]] 10:53, 2 July 2023 (UTC)

:I think the changes you've made are a good start, but parts of it still feel very promotional. I think the best idea is to have a look over articles for similar people (particularly those with higher [[WP:ASSESS|quality classes]]) and see how they're written. It should feel neutral, not as though it was written by a promoter of the person in question. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 10:12, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
::@[[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]], thank you for the encouragement. I made another round of changes, hopefully in the right direction. I am hesitant about the quote in the last sentence. For one, it explains why the Order of Merit 3rd degree was awarded, but the text is so general that it fits the descriptions of "reads like advertisement" that we so want to avoid. Keep it or ditch it? - What do you think?
::- [[User:Igor Markov|Igor Markov]] 02:20, 11 July 2023 (UTC)

== https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Algorithmic_Contract_Types_Unified_Standards ==

Your comments: "I suspect this will be notable, but the referencing in the history section needs to improve before it can be accepted"

I have added more references. I should also point out that ACTUS is the second of 3 sources for the [[Office of Financial Research|OFR]]'s work. Both the first ([[ISO 20022]]) and [[Financial Information eXchange|FIX]], which was added a year after ACTUS, already have Wikipedia pages. If there is something specific you feel has not been referenced, please say so. Thank you. [[User:Yankinthebank|Yankinthebank]] ([[User talk:Yankinthebank|talk]]) 10:59, 5 July 2023 (UTC)

:Thanks - I think the sources you've added are sufficient, and I see that someone else has already accepted the draft - congrats! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:23, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

== Miguel Ablóniz ==

Thanks for recent review of my draft article [[Draft:Miguel Ablóniz]]. Having created many dozens of articles here in the last twenty years, it's rather frustrating that it was declined on the basis of insufficient citation, considering that this simple three paragraph article contained no less than five in-line citations, which seems like it should be more than sufficient. However, we move on. You noted in particular that none of the items listed in the "selected publications" section were cited. But, indeed, they are themselves perfectly valid citations in the meaning set forth for [[Wikipedia:Citing sources|general citations]] as defined in [[Wikipedia:Citing sources]]. After all, they give the author, the name of the work, and the publishing house. But perhaps you can help me figure out how to provide a better citation format for these, and what template is most appropriately used? The issue, essentially, is that these scores are (or were - several are out-of-print) published by well-known but specialty publishing houses (''e.g.'', Berben or Ricordi) that do not generally use ISBN identifiers, or even necessarily state the year of publication. Nevertheless, their existence is easily established from online sheet music resellers ([[https://www.prestomusic.com/sheet-music/search?search_query=abloniz&size=10&view=large%7C for example]]). For some, at least, the publishers catalogue number is also available, but that is about it. What do you advise? [[User:Fawcett5|Fawcett5]] ([[User talk:Fawcett5|talk]]) 18:49, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

:Kia ora [[User:Fawcett5|Fawcett5]] - I can understand that it would have been frustrating given the range of articles you've created. I had that the publications mentioned could be the sources themselves for that section, so I'm happy with that, but I think my concern with the body above is still there. The entire second half of the main paragraph is uncited (everything from Milan onwards), with that section containing a few claims that I think would benefit from being backed up. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:22, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

::[[User:Turnagra|Tunagra]] - OK, I have added some additional references, and also made sure an existing reference was in the right spots.  While not perfect, the spirit of Wikipedia is that other users can take a small article and grow and improve it. Having this one sit on ice any longer serves no-one. Please, let's move this out of draft so that others may contribute. [[User:Fawcett5|Fawcett5]] ([[User talk:Fawcett5|talk]]) 17:33, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Fawcett5|Fawcett5]] I'll try and have a look when I get a chance, but I've been pretty busy lately unfortunately. If you haven't already, I'd suggest resubmitting the draft if you think it's up to scratch, then another reviewer might have a chance to get to it before I do. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:57, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
::::Well, it took multiple months for anyone to even take a look last time.  So, I'll wait for you, thanks.  You know, as a long-time contributor and admin here, I really do think that this review process is totally contrary to the spirit of Wikipedia. Articles are best improved and expanded by having a lot of eyes on them.  In my opinion, if there isn't a question about the fundamental notability of the article subject, and a stub article is evidently created in good faith and isn't basically just junk, we are all much better served by moving things to the main space earlier than later. A good article results from the efforts of many contributors.  [[User:Fawcett5|Fawcett5]] ([[User talk:Fawcett5|talk]]) 14:59, 17 October 2023 (UTC)
:::::@[[User:Fawcett5|Fawcett5]] apologies for the delay - I think it's fine to accept, but the script I use can't actually do all the required things unless it's submitted as a draft (and I can't both submit and accept the same draft). If you're able to submit it I'll go in and accept it. 
:::::I'd also say that I didn't realise your history or the history of the draft at first, before reviewing the first time. I agree that the AfC process has some issues, particularly the length of time it takes to get to articles. I'm actually surprised you're not autopatrolled, given your role and your history of articles. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 05:18, 21 October 2023 (UTC)
::::::OK thank you! I've gone ahead and resubmitted. [[User:Fawcett5|Fawcett5]] ([[User talk:Fawcett5|talk]]) 19:06, 21 October 2023 (UTC)

== [[Draft:Dinmukhamet Idrisov]] ==

Hi @[[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]], thank you for patrolling articles in drafts! I would like you to review the article, I have added links to reliable sources. [[User:Agneta 92|Agneta 92]] ([[User talk:Agneta 92|talk]]) 09:07, 10 July 2023 (UTC)

== Request for applications for position of Wikipedian-at-Large, Aotearoa New Zealand ==

Kia ora! The [https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Aotearoa_New_Zealand| Wikimedia Aotearoa New Zealand User Group] invites you to read about the call for applications for a [https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Aotearoa_New_Zealand#Wikipedian-at-Large_(WPAL)_project| Wikipedian-at-Large] for Aotearoa New Zealand in 2024. Group members are happy to explain the process and discuss ideas with interested editors.

Sent by {{noping|Zippybonzo}} on behalf of {{noping|MurielMary}} using [[User:MediaWiki message delivery|MediaWiki message delivery]] ([[User talk:MediaWiki message delivery|talk]]) at 06:37, 24 July 2023 (UTC)
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== LEN Euro Cup 2022–23  ==

Hi. I have finished editing the rest of the 2022–23 LEN Euro Cup. I have also put in more third party sources. Can it finally be approved? Or is the review already going on? [[User:ILoveSport2006|ILoveSport2006]] ([[User talk:ILoveSport2006|talk]]) 22:52, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

== Super Rugby Americas ==

Also, the Super Rugby Americas 2023 article has more third party sources than before. Can it be approved yet? [[User:ILoveSport2006|ILoveSport2006]] ([[User talk:ILoveSport2006|talk]]) 00:19, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

== August 2023 Good Article Nominations backlog drive ==

{| style="border: 5px solid #ABCDEF ; background-color: #FFF; padding:10px 15px 0"
|style="padding: 0; vertical-align: middle; height: 1.1em; font-size:130%" |'''[[Wikipedia:Good article nominations|Good article nominations]] |'''  <span style="font-size:85%">August 2023 Backlog Drive</span>
|rowspan=3|[[File:Multiple GA Barnstar.png|right|75px]]
|-
|'''August 2023 Backlog Drive:'''
* On 1 August, a one-month backlog drive for good article nominations will begin.
* Barnstars will be awarded.
* Interested in taking part? You can '''[[WP:WikiProject Good articles/GAN Backlog Drives/August 2023|sign up here]]'''.
|-
|colspan=2|'''Other ways to participate:'''
* [[Wikipedia talk:Good article nominations|Join the conversations on our talkpage]]
|-
|colspan=2 style="font-size:85%; padding-top:15px;"|You're receiving this message because you have reviewed or nominated a good article in the last year.
([[User talk:Buidhe|t]] &#183; [[Special:Contributions/Buidhe|c]]) '''[[User:buidhe|<span style="color: black">buidhe</span>]]''' 05:15, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
|}
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== Your [[WP:Good articles|GA]] nomination of [[1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera]] ==
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've [[Talk:1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera/GA1{{!}}begun reviewing]] the article [[1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera]] you nominated for [[WP:GA|GA]]-status according to the [[WP:WIAGA|criteria]]. [[File:Time2wait.svg|20px|link=]] This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. <!-- Template:GANotice --> <!-- Template:GANotice --> <small>Message delivered by [[User:ChristieBot|ChristieBot]], on behalf of [[User:Zawed|Zawed]]</small> -- [[User:Zawed|Zawed]] ([[User talk:Zawed|talk]]) 09:40, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

== Thanks for reaching out ==

URL to a relevant and verifiable article for the comparison in eruptive volume is  Table 1 in [https://repository.geologyscience.ru/bitstream/handle/123456789/1185/compar.pdf?sequence=2 Directed blasts and blast-generated pyroclastic density currents: a comparison of the Bezymianny 1956, Mount St Helens 1980, and Soufrière Hills, Montserrat 1997 eruptions and deposits].  There may be something in [http://www.sedimentaryores.net/Cascades/MtStHelens/Gliken_1996_debris%20avalanche.pdf Glikens monograph] . Over to you to decide if comparison still relevant as for readers under 40 the comparison has little meaning  [[User:ChaseKiwi|ChaseKiwi]] ([[User talk:ChaseKiwi|talk]]) 22:03, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

:[[User:ChaseKiwi|@ChaseKiwi]] thanks- I suspect based on the comments from the reviewer that it'd need to be a source directly comparing Mt Tarawera to something for it to be usable, but you're right in that it's probably a less relevant comparison these days anyway.
:Also, having said that I would be happy to handle the bulk of the work it seems the comments are a bit more substantial- if you felt like lending a hand at some point to help get it up to scratch that could be useful, but obviously no obligation! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 23:15, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
::Will certainly look at article when time. Noted the reviewers comments which I found informative as to general style, especially as I have got into the habit of putting references into the introduction of articles. I find it very difficult myself to agree with the reviewers opinion that original sources could be usefully amalgamated or removed to reduce number of sources...while often useful...the opinions of difference academic groups need to also be fact based and I noted a glaring example of justified challenge in my view from a geologist recently who had actually done field work in New Britain/New Ireland to an academic groups view from afar in a recent attempt to tidy up some articles [[User:ChaseKiwi|ChaseKiwi]] ([[User talk:ChaseKiwi|talk]]) 07:28, 16 August 2023 (UTC)
:::I don't think you can use GNS copyright images on wikipedia. Certainly you need their explicate permission to do so for each image that contains even a little bit of image that is copyright. No expert in copyright law but best to revert Rotomahana page for moment. While NZ copyright law at 50 years is better than what one jurisdiction I work in would have 95 years it still seems clear enough [[User:ChaseKiwi|ChaseKiwi]] ([[User talk:ChaseKiwi|talk]]) 21:00, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
== Your [[WP:Good articles|GA]] nomination of [[1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera]] ==
The article [[1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera]] you nominated as a [[Wikipedia:Good article nominations|good article]] has passed [[File:Symbol support vote.svg|20px|link=]]; see [[Talk:1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera]] for comments about the article, and [[Talk:1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera/GA1]] for the nomination. Well done! If the article has never appeared on the Main Page as a "Did you know" item, and has not appeared within the last year either as "Today's featured article", or as a bold link under "In the news" or in the "On this day" prose section, you can [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Create new nomination|nominate it]] within the next seven days to appear at DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On this day" column do not affect DYK eligibility.<!-- Template:GANotice result=pass --> <!-- Template:GANotice --> <small>Message delivered by [[User:ChristieBot|ChristieBot]], on behalf of [[User:Zawed|Zawed]]</small> -- [[User:Zawed|Zawed]] ([[User talk:Zawed|talk]]) 10:01, 14 September 2023 (UTC)
:[[User:Turnagra]] thanks for your work on bringing this!up to scratch - great article on a significant topic! [[User:ITBF|ITBF]] ([[User talk:ITBF|talk]]) 07:57, 9 October 2023 (UTC)
::Thank you! I remember finding the article in its old state and being shocked at how sparse it was, so glad I was able to help bring it to where it should be! Just need to do the Pink & White Terraces now... [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 09:26, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

== Postcard from the Coast ==

{|-style="height: 120px;"
|<big>'''Postcard from the West Coast'''</big>
<big>''Wednesday 20 Sep, 2023''</big>
|[[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|right|120x120px]]
|-
|'''Kia ora koutou;''' so good to be a Wikipedian at Large on the West Coast again. • I've been setting up visits and field photography trips to '''Karamea''' (Oct 15), '''Fox Glacier''' (Oct 2), and '''Whataroa''' (Oct 9), and working through the typewritten ''Whataroa South Westland: Centennial Report 1879–1979'' • Great work from Panamitsu creating the [[Waitangiroto Nature Reserve]] article, and Paora with [[c:Category:Gerhard_Mueller_(surveyor)|Gerhard Mueller]] and {{Q|Q122695369}}. [[User:Prosperosity|Prosperosity]] created Wikidata items and Commons categories for most of '''Hokitika's public sculpture''', and I added over 100 photos and more items • Hoping to tag along on a '''kōtuku''' tour, but I'm also approaching photographers who've taken [https://tikitouringnz.blogspot.com/2016/12/white-herons-of-waitangiroto.html good pics of the colony] about releasing their work for Commons • We should improve the [[kōtuku]] and [[Waitangiroto River]] articles with journal articles—and the [[Whataroa River]] and [[Waitangitāhuna River]] articles could do with a tidy up (there's a [http://www.thebookshelf.auckland.ac.nz/docs/Tane/Tane-17/23%20Results%20of%20the%20Waitangitaona.pdf great article] in ''Tane'' about how the former split in two, and the implications for the Waitangiroto) • Coming up are the '''Glacier Country''' tourism articles: can I recommend Lynley Hargreaves' [https://www.pottonandburton.co.nz/product/vanishing-ice/ new book] ''Vanishing Ice'' as a reference? • '''''[https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Gillespies_Beach_Beginnings Gillespies Beach Beginnings]''''' is recently transcribed and available in Wikisource as well • Keep at it folks, and I'll drop you a line in a week and a bit.  — [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]]
|[[File:Whites Aviation Whataroa 32057195.jpg|alt=Black and white aerial photo of small West Coast crossroads settlement surrounded by forested mountains|thumb|Whites Aviation 1958 aerial photo of [[Whataroa]]]]
|} [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]] ([[User talk:Giantflightlessbirds|talk]]) 03:32, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

==DYK for 1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera==
{{ivmbox
|image = Updated DYK query.svg
|imagesize=40px
|text = On [[Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2023/October#9 October 2023|9 October 2023]], '''[[:Template:Did you know|Did you know]]''' was updated with a fact from the article '''''[[1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera]]''''', which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ''... that ash fall from the '''[[1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera]]''' ''(pictured)'' was reported on ships nearly 1,000 kilometres (620&nbsp;mi) out to sea?'' The nomination discussion and review may be seen at [[Template:Did you know nominations/1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera]]. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>([[User:Rjanag/Pageview stats|here's how]], [https://pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2023-09-29&end=2023-10-19&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=1886_eruption_of_Mount_Tarawera 1886 eruption of Mount Tarawera])</small>, and the hook may be added to [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics/Monthly DYK pageview leaders|the statistics page]] after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the [[:Template talk:Did you know|Did you know talk page]].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK -->  [[user:theleekycauldron|theleekycauldron]] ([[User talk:Theleekycauldron|talk]] • she/her) 00:02, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

==Disambiguation link notification for October 9==

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited [[Douglas River]], you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page [[Douglas Glacier]]<!-- ([//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dablinks.py/Douglas_River check to confirm]&nbsp;|&nbsp;[//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dab_solver.py/Douglas_River?client=notify fix with Dab solver])-->. 

([[User:DPL bot|Opt-out instructions]].) --[[User:DPL bot|DPL bot]] ([[User talk:DPL bot|talk]]) 06:10, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

== November Articles for creation backlog drive ==

<div style="border: 2px solid #484898; background: #FFF; background-color:#98FB98; padding: 1ex 1ex 1ex 1.5ex; margin: 0px 0px 1em 1em; font-size: 99%">
[[Image:AFC-Logo.svg|75px|right]]
Hello Turnagra: 

'''[[Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation|WikiProject Articles for creation]]''' is holding a '''month long [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/November 2023 Backlog Drive|Backlog Drive]]!'''<br />
The goal of this drive is to '''reduce''' the backlog of unreviewed drafts to less than 2 months outstanding reviews from the current 4+ months. Bonus points will be given for reviewing drafts that have been waiting more than 30 days. The drive is running from 1 November 2023 through 30 November 2023.

You may find [[:Category:AfC pending submissions by age]] or [[:Category:Pending AfC submissions|other categories and sorting]] helpful.

Barnstars will be given out as awards at the end of the drive.<br />
There is a backlog of over {{Rounddown|{{formatnum:{{PAGESINCATEGORY:Pending AfC submissions}}|R}}|-2}} pages, so start reviewing drafts. We're looking forward to your help! [[User:MediaWiki message delivery|MediaWiki message delivery]] ([[User talk:MediaWiki message delivery|talk]]) 13:25, 31 October 2023 (UTC)</div>
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== [[Draft:Alex Kuch]] ==

Kia ora Turangra! Thank you for looking over the draft for [[Draft:Alex Kuch]]. I have gone ahead and removed all the School and University sources. Now containing independent sources and one about the awards but about Alex and not a list. Note I found Romanian sources too which are about his talks in Parliament which are independent. Thank you for checking and reviewing!  [[User:DanNZ17|DanNZ17]] ([[User talk:DanNZ17|talk]]) 19:34, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

== Postcard from the Coast ==

{|-style="height: 120px;"
|<big>'''Postcard from the West Coast'''</big>
<big>''Wednesday 8 Nov, 2023''</big>
|[[File:Sandfly Stamp.jpg|right|120x120px]]
|-
|A bit of a gap since the last postcard, but what a great time we've had with the Wikipedian at Large project in the interim • The highlight has been having Marshall and Lyn join me on the West Coast for a few days, visiting [[Fox Glacier (town)|Fox Glacier]] and '''[[Whataroa]]''' • We now have '''good photo collections''' for the newly-created [[Waitangiroto Nature Reserve]], and a a much improved article with galler • The '''Whataroa''' article has been improved with local history and links to the White Herons • We also have much better coverage of Fox Glacier, including new Ngāi Tahu '''viewing place''' [[Te Kopikopiko o te Waka]], and photos of [[c:Category:Te_Weheka_Walkway|Te Weheka Walkway/Cycleway]] and the [[c:Category:Fox_Glacier_South_Side_Walkway|South Side Walkway/Cycleway]] • Could I get you all to '''check back through your contributions''' and add anything extra you've done to the [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:GLAM/WestCoastWPAL/2023_Weekly_Progress|Weekly Progress] page as we wrap up • Also—I'm hosting a '''catch-up meeting''' on Sunday '''November 12, 2:30 pm''', online at [https://whereby.com/rove.wiki my Whereby chat room]. This is a chance to go over anything you'd still like to see improved, talk about how the project went and possibilities for future ones, and announce '''winners''' of prizes for most or best contributions. '''Drop me a line''' at {{NoSpam|mike|rove.wiki}} if you can make it (or can't but have ideas about the project) • '''Thank you all''' for your contributions, however small, and chat soon.  — [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]]
|[[File:Waitangiroto MRD 19.jpg|alt=White heron viewed against river and bush|thumb|[[Kōtuku]] at [[Waitangiroto Nature Reserve]]]]
|} [[User:Giantflightlessbirds|Giantflightlessbirds]] ([[User talk:Giantflightlessbirds|talk]]) 19:25, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

== Request on 04:17:54, 8 November 2023 for assistance on [[Wikipedia:Articles for creation|AfC]] submission by Lightoil ==
{{anchor|04:17:54, 8 November 2023 review of submission by Lightoil}}
{{Lafc|username=Lightoil|ts=04:17:54, 8 November 2023|declinedtalk=Draft:KQ_Entertainment}}

<!-- Start of message -->
I believe I have added a better source compared to the previous review. So I would prefer a better explanation. 

<!-- End of message -->[[User:Lightoil|Lightoil]] ([[User talk:Lightoil|talk]]) 04:17, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

:Kia ora [[User:Lightoil|Lightoil]] - that source seems helpful, but KQ Entertainment is only discussed in a portion of the article and it doesn't do enough to move the company over the notability threshold in my view. Please see [[WP:NCORP]] and try to find some solid reliable sources that discuss the company in detail before re-submitting. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 04:24, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

== Bias against Atharis ==

The article [[Draft:List of Atharis]] is literally written in a similar form to [[List of Ash'aris]] and [[List of Maturidis]]. It even has sufficient citations, and the two articles I mentioned don't even have sufficient information and may be confusing for the reader to read. You should remove those two articles as well, since they are of the same content length and matter.  [[User:Boredom889|Boredom889]] ([[User talk:Boredom889|talk]]) 02:53, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

== Invitation to an in-person meetup in Mohua / Golden Bay ==

[[File:Wikimedia-Meetup-GoldenBay-Mohua-v2 05.jpg|thumb|400px|[[Golden Bay Air]] are holding some seats for us until 21 November]]
Thinking about your summer break? Think about joining other Wikipedians and Wikimedians in [[Golden Bay / Mohua]]! Details are on the [[Wikipedia:Meetup/Mohua_/_Golden_Bay|meetup page]]. There's heaps of interesting stuff to work on e.g. the oldest extant waka or New Zealand's oldest ongoing legal case. Or you may spend your time taking photos and then upload them.

Golden Bay is hard to get to and [[Golden Bay Air|the airline]] flying into [[Tākaka Aerodrome|Tākaka]] uses small planes, so we are holding some seats from and to [[Wellington Airport|Wellington]] '''and''' we are offering attendees a $200 travel subsidy to help with costs. 

Be in touch with [[User talk:Schwede66|Schwede66]] if this event interests you and you'd like to discuss logistics. '''[[User:Schwede66|<span style="color: #000000;">Schwede</span>]][[User talk:Schwede66|<span style="color: #FF4500;">66</span>]]''' 09:14, 13 November 2023 (UTC)
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== Request for feedback on two drafts ==

I have two drafts that I would like your feedback on 

* [[Draft:Owari clan]]
* [[Draft:Yamato no Kuni no Miyatsuko]]

I feel both are currently in a good state but might need some improvement. I am planning on taking a break rather soon and hope I can get them through quickly before it[[User:Immanuelle|'''Immanuel'''le]] ❤️💚💙 [[User_talk:Immanuelle|(talk to the cutest Wikipedian)]] 20:39, 13 November 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Immanuelle|Immanuelle]] sorry for the delay, but it looks like both of those have now been approved - good job! Just one question, are these drafts translated from the Japanese articles or do you write them yourself? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:20, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
::@[[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] I write them myself.  I used to translate articles from Japanese but they didn’t turn out very well. 
::If you look at the Japanese articles they are actually quite different in structure, and imo quite inferior with very few sources.  [[User:Immanuelle|'''Immanuel'''le]] ❤️💚💙 [[User_talk:Immanuelle|(talk to the cutest Wikipedian)]] 19:19, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Immanuelle|Immanuelle]] That's good to know, thank you! Do you have any further drafts in the work before your break which you think might be near the level for acceptance? [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 19:35, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
::::@[[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] I have this one [[Draft:History of religion in China]] but it is a split proposal rather than a proper new article, and [[Draft:Amabe clan]] which I tried to fix the tone of. I will look over a couple more, but I think I am mostly done. I will tag you with other ones [[User:Immanuelle|'''Immanuel'''le]] ❤️💚💙 [[User_talk:Immanuelle|(talk to the cutest Wikipedian)]] 20:30, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
:::::@[[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] Yes [[Draft:Nunasokonakatsu-hime]] but otherwise it seems every other draft will require a lot of work. So pretty close to good for a break. [[User:Immanuelle|'''Immanuel'''le]] ❤️💚💙 [[User_talk:Immanuelle|(talk to the cutest Wikipedian)]] 02:23, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
::::::Thanks [[User:Immanuelle|Immanuelle]] - I'll take a look at Amabe in more detail, but I feel like the one on the Empress could do with a fair bit more prose rather than a couple sentence description and the family tree. I'm also not sure whether a draft is the best approach for the split as it could usurp those other discussions so I might leave that one for a more experienced editor. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 02:26, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
:::::::@[[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] I found one more that I think is good for submission [[Draft:Tagata Shrine]] [[User:Immanuelle|'''Immanuel'''le]] ❤️💚💙 [[User_talk:Immanuelle|(talk to the cutest Wikipedian)]] 03:26, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

== Your recent review ==

Hello Turnagra, just letting you know that I left you a note at [[Draft talk:Faria Abdullah]], after having transferred the templates and message from my TP to that pages, so that the main contributors can understand what's happening. Thank you again for your time. -[[User talk:Mushy Yank|<span style="font-family:American Typewriter;color:#DC134C">My, oh my! </span>]][[User:Mushy Yank|<span style="color:Crimson;font-family:American Typewriter;font-size:13px;">(Mushy Yank)</span>]] 21:28, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

== Herzberger Quader ==

Hello Turnagra,
even though it was negative, thank you for your review. I understand that it is difficult when all the sources are in German. But the main change I made was not the source 5, but the source 2!

I would like to give you some more explanations. Schulze collected a lot of (and invented some) mathematical games in 1982-1984. He created an exhibition that moved from place to place in 10 years (1984-1994). In this time almost all publications that one can find where about the exhibition and some notes about the content including the Herzberger Quader. I have found a note that there was a complete book about the whole exhibition in preparation. After Schulze's death the book was abandoned, but finally a real article about the Herzberger Quader was published. I found it a few weeks ago, and now this is source 2.

And this is my problem: I have no doubt that the Herzberger Quader is notable. In Germany today, almost all publications on recreational mathematics that mention the Soma Cube also mention the Herzberger Quader. But that is the situation in Germany. It's very hard to find anything about the Herzberger Quader in English, and even the best site about it (fam-bundgaard.dk) is a private site and therefore not a reliable source for my article.
How can an article about the Herzberger Quader be published in the English encyclopedia? --[[User:Rainer Gutsche|Rainer Gutsche]] ([[User talk:Rainer Gutsche|talk]]) 12:32, 21 November 2023 (UTC)

== November 2023 ==

[[File:Information orange.svg|25px|alt=Information icon]] Please do not [[Wikipedia:No personal attacks|attack]] other editors, as you did  at [[:Talk:Hinemoatū / Howard River]]. Comment on ''content'', not on contributors. Personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Please [[Wikipedia:Staying cool when the editing gets hot|stay cool]] and keep this in mind while editing. ''Comments like "this ridiculous crusade against dual names has gone on long enough. As pointed out in multiple past move requests whenever you rail against dual place names"; you've made similar comments many times in the past, and I've even had to raise this before at [[#June 2022]] and [[#Tracking my edits]].

I understand you disagree with my preference for the [[WP:COMMONNAME]], but that doesn't make my preference a behavioral issue - and even if it did, the appropriate place to raise that is not article talk pages but my talk page.

As a general rule, comment in content, not contributors - please strike or remove the aspects of the comments you have made against that general rule.''<!-- Template:uw-npa2 --> [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 02:10, 26 November 2023 (UTC)
:Describing a pattern of behaviour is not a personal attack, nor is calling such move requests ridiculous. I have been remarkably restrained in my comments on your move requests, as I have not once brought in my views on you as an individual, nor have I highlighted your repeat [[WP:BADGER]] or [[WP:SEALION]]ing, or my views that you are fundamentally [[WP:NOTHERE]] for the betterment of Wikipedia. I'm well aware of how to behave on Wikipedia, and I don't believe my comment broke any of the guidelines. So, with respect, I will not be editing my comment. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 04:14, 26 November 2023 (UTC)
::Regardless of whether you see it as a personal attack it isn't appropriate to raise on the talk page; as [[WP:PA]] says, {{tq|Comment on content, not on the contributor}}. If you want to comment on the contributor's {{tq|pattern of behaviour}} bring it to their talk page. [[User:BilledMammal|BilledMammal]] ([[User talk:BilledMammal|talk]]) 04:42, 26 November 2023 (UTC)

==Draft Tech Herfrica==
Hello and Thank You for your insight {{ping|Turnagra}} as regards your recent review on [[Draft: Tech Herfrica]] they were very helpful. I have made adjustment to the writing style and made corrections to the context of the article where necessary backed by reliable independent references. Do give it a look to see that it now meets the criteria for the article to be moved to main space. I would also appreciate your advice accordingly in more ways of making it better. [[User:Samlodias|Samlodias]] ([[User talk:Samlodias|talk]]) 11:49, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

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== [[Draft:Faria Abdullah]] ==

An article being deleted so many times doesn't make an article not notable. She was not notable in 2021 and 2022, fine. In 2023 and now, she passes [[WP:NACTOR]] without a doubt. Three lead roles: ''[[Jathi Ratnalu]]'' ([https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvCbZxYdLuU a song] dedicated to her character reached 100 million views), ''[[Like, Share & Subscribe]]'', and ''[[The Jengaburu Curse]]'' (first billing). Given these 3 roles, why can't she have an article? [[User:DareshMohan|DareshMohan]] ([[User talk:DareshMohan|talk]]) 17:56, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

== [[Draft:Total Commitment (Del Shannon album)]] ==

where's the feedback, please highlight thanks [[User:Samchristie05|Samchristie05]] ([[User talk:Samchristie05|talk]]) 23:45, 5 December 2023 (UTC)

:Kia ora [[User:Samchristie05|Samchristie05]] - have another look at the reasons why other users have declined the draft, and the comments which they have left. This should be at the top of the draft and hopefully gives you a place to start. Sing out if you're having difficulty and I'll try to make it clearer. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 06:49, 6 December 2023 (UTC)

== Request on 22:50:25, 6 December 2023 for assistance on [[Wikipedia:Articles for creation|AfC]] submission by SunCamper ==
{{anchor|22:50:25, 6 December 2023 review of submission by SunCamper}}
{{Lafc|username=SunCamper|ts=22:50:25, 6 December 2023|declinedtalk=Draft:Cliff_Tait}}

<!-- Start of message -->

Hi there

I'm just a newby and really need some help with this new entry for Cliff Tait.  He's featured in a big Museum in New Zealand and I've referenced information from there.  Some of what I've put in has come from Cliff Tait's books, two books, now also held in the Museum, and oral history at the Museum.  The books are out of print, I'm not sure how I can reference those books? I've mentioned the books and the oral history at the Museum. There are articles. It's all really old so I'm not sure how to do this.

I'm not much of an editor and just trying to do the best I can, so any help or tidying up would really be appreciated.  This man is in museums, articles, books, I'm not sure how else I can prove this.  He's about the only adventurer of his standard that I can't see on Wikipedia so he must deserve an entry!

I can let you know the names of the books and they are easily found on google, and on entries in the Museum, but they are too old have text online.


<!-- End of message -->[[User:SunCamper|SunCamper]] ([[User talk:SunCamper|talk]]) 22:50, 6 December 2023 (UTC)

:Mōrena [[User:SunCamper|SunCamper]] (and welcome)! More than happy to help out with this where I can. To answer a few of your questions:
:* It's absolutely fine to cite a book that's out of print and not available online, so long as you've got the information for it. The article editing bit has tools which can help make citing easy, and there's also [[WP:Referencing for beginners]] which might be useful.
:* Oral history is a bit trickier, as we generally prefer independent secondary sources. Have a look at [[WP:42]] for some info on what sort of stuff we'd need in the sources.
:The other thing I'd say is that [[WP:BLP|biographies of living people]] have stricter requirements for referencing than most articles, and generally need each statement needs to be cited to a reliable source. I'll take a proper look over the weekend and chuck in some notes on where citations would be useful, but hopefully this gives you enough to go off for now! [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:03, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

== [[Draft:Faria Abdullah]] ==

Hello,
You had mentioned last month that you would talk to another user to have a second look at that draft. Any chance you received a reply from them? Thank you very much. -[[User talk:Mushy Yank|<span style="font-family:American Typewriter;color:#DC134C">My, oh my! </span>]][[User:Mushy Yank|<span style="color:Crimson;font-family:American Typewriter;font-size:13px;">(Mushy Yank)</span>]] 08:07, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

:Apologies, I got sidetracked and forgot to raise it. I'd suggest that you either ask for input at the [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/Help desk|AfC help desk]] or submit the draft again if you think that it's demonstrating that [[WP:NACTOR]] is met. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 09:05, 17 December 2023 (UTC)
==Thank you for participating in AfC November 2023 Backlog Drive==
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== Cameron's Crossing railway station ==

Hi there. Leaving a message here so it doesn't disappear when the article gets deleted - I did a quick Papers Past search for potential references to it and found absolutely nothing in the Kaikohe area... but the exact same name was in use for a few months in 1875 as the name for a station somewhere near the later Makarewa Junction station (the site of which in 1875 was not yet a junction...) at the opposite end of the country. Go figure. [[User:Daveosaurus|Daveosaurus]] ([[User talk:Daveosaurus|talk]]) 12:12, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

== Fraser Island (K'gari) Name Change. ==

Hey buddy, the name change for Fraser Island/K'gari only happened last year. It is local knowledge around Australia that the island is still referred to it as Fraser Island regardless of whether it is its official name or not. This will happen for the better part of several years (at minimum). You'd be hard-pressed to find legitimate sources that have local knowledge. That's why I have none, which does not make my statement any less true. Additionally, you might want to look up [[Wikipedia:Edit warring]], because right now you're engaging in it, which can lead to sanctions. Please do not delete my comment; it just makes you look intellectually dishonest. [[User:Ash.david|Ash.david]] ([[User talk:Ash.david|talk]]) 14:46, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

:Kia ora [[User:Ash.david|Ash.david]] - I would encourage you to read the comments of the other editor whom you sent a similar message to about the same topic. I also note that other editors have warned you about the content you have added to the article in the past for said content pushing a particular point of view. Wikipedia relies on having references to back up content, particularly when it's a comment that could be seen as pushing a point of view, and a lack of reliable sources to back up a comment such as that generally means it shouldn't be in an article. 
:Generally, Wikipedia follows a process called [[WP:BRD|Bold, revert, discuss]]. You made a bold edit, which is totally fine and encouraged. However, other editors have disagreed with the edit and have reverted it. Rather than adding it back, as you have done, you should follow [[User:Twotwos|Twotwos]]' helpful recommendation and discuss the edit you would like to see on [[Talk:Fraser Island|the article's talk page]] to come to a consensus on whether or not it should be added. Continuing to add content in without a discussion after multiple editors have reverted it can be seen as disruptive behaviour, and can lead to action being taken. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:05, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
::Or, you could instead of being disruptive yourself, help find sources for my comment. Otherwise, deleting it is edit warring, and is dishonest.  [[User:Ash.david|Ash.david]] ([[User talk:Ash.david|talk]]) 18:10, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
:::If you feel it merits inclusion, the burden of proof is on you to find justification for its inclusion. There is nothing dishonest about it. I would note that the other user you messaged did try to find sources, and came up empty. [[User:Turnagra|Turnagra]] ([[User talk:Turnagra#top|talk]]) 18:12, 6 January 2024 (UTC)
::::Mate, the burden of proof is on people who disagree with the statement. Ask a local from Queensland, ask any local, it's Fraser Island. You don't need an academic source for that.  [[User:Ash.david|Ash.david]] ([[User talk:Ash.david|talk]]) 18:21, 6 January 2024 (UTC)