View source for User talk:Michael D. Turnbull/Archives/2023

{{Talk archive}}

== Question from [[User:KamleshArora|KamleshArora]] on [[Help:User contributions]] (05:57, 5 January 2023) ==

Hi,

I have published a page on Wikipedia and it's still under review.
Please provide your guidance so that the page can be approved.

Regards
Kamlesh --[[User:KamleshArora|KamleshArora]] ([[User talk:KamleshArora|talk]]) 05:57, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:KamleshArora|KamleshArora]] Is this about [[Draft:Junglee Games]]? That was declined on 21 December and again on 24 December. I am not a reviewer of new articles but I know what reviewers are looking for. That is evidence that the company is [[WP:NCORP|notable in the specific meaning of that word used by Wikipedia]]. Evidence is needed in the form of citations which are all three of: [[WP:RS|from reliable sources]], [[WP:INDEPENDENT|independent of the company]] and with [[WP:SIGCOV|significant coverage, not just a mention]]. That rules out anything mostly based on an interview (current refs #1, #2) or a press release (#5): I didn't check the other refs. Your draft says "{{tq|recognized as one of India's great mid-size workplaces 2022 by Great Place to Work}}". That sounds very promising, since I assume that Great Place to Work is some sort of organisation independent of Junglee games. However, you don't cite your source for that statement, so readers can't [[WP:V|verify]] it, a core principle here on Wikipedia. You need much more on what third-parties are saying about Junglee Games (for good or bad) and much less about what they are saying about themselves. The world is full of people and companies going about routine business. Wikipedia only wants articles on those clearly [[WP:GNG|making an impact that others are writing about]]. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:36, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Vipul.sushiljain|Vipul.sushiljain]] (17:51, 6 January 2023) ==

Hi I have started writing blogs, on Jainism, All the knowledge which I have to the best I am articulating it and writing it so people know and read about it. This is by blog URL - https://jainidologythirth.blogspot.com
Kindly visit it, and help me in adding a backlink of my blog to wikipedia so people visit and read. Thank you. --[[User:Vipul.sushiljain|Vipul.sushiljain]] ([[User talk:Vipul.sushiljain|talk]]) 17:51, 6 January 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Vipul.sushiljain|Vipul.sushiljain]] No! Wikipedia must not be used for [[WP:PROMOTION|promotion]] of any sort and spam links to external websites will be deleted on sight, as one you added already has been. In addition, blogs are not considered reliable sources (see [[WP:BLOGS]]) and have very limited use within Wikipedia. Please restrict your contributions to material that will improve the encyclopaedia. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 17:59, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
::I am not using wikipedia, for promotion, the content which I have written is logical and valid, which will help people to know more on thirthankar god. [[User:Vipul.sushiljain|Vipul.sushiljain]] ([[User talk:Vipul.sushiljain|talk]]) 06:21, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Vipul.sushiljain|Vipul.sushiljain]] Adding links to your blogs is promotion, irrespective of how accurate the material is. If you have published in a peer-reviewed journal then you could cite the information. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:24, 7 January 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Void if removed|Void if removed]] (11:14, 5 February 2023) ==

Hi, you've been assigned as my experienced mentor and I have a question about sources, verifiability and original research.

I've found myself mostly trying to engage constructively in a highly contentious topic area so I'm trying to approach edits with caution and build consensus, and work towards a neutral POV as much as possible.

When it comes to preferring secondary sources over primary ones, what should we do when there is clear disagreement? A primary source says x, a supposedly reliable source says y, yet anyone can read the primary source and verify that it is indeed x - should we still defer to the secondary source? That is, does a reliable secondary source override a primary one, or does verifiable disagreement put the reliability of the secondary source in question?

Thank you for your time! --[[User:Void if removed|Void if removed]] ([[User talk:Void if removed|talk]]) 11:14, 5 February 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Void if removed|Void if removed]] That's a tough question! I mainly edit in areas of science, so there tend to be multiple sources for most facts and a decent primary source will usually have been peer-reviewed, which gives it extra weight. I gather that your "highly contentious" topic area is for example the [[LGB Alliance]]. For these sorts of topics, much of the heat is generated because people express their strong opinions surrounding a limited number of objective facts and get into tangles over definitions. The role of a Wikipedia editor, I think, is to disregard all that and recast the information in a strictly [[WP:NPOV]] way for our readers. So it is quite reasonable that an article here should point out that primary source x and secondary source y differ and that yet another source z exists. Maybe we shouldn't comment at all until the dust settles: how will tertiary sources in 10 years' time view the issue?
:I could perhaps give a better answer for a specific case but meanwhile my advice is that you [[WP:AGF]] with those who disagree with you. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 13:23, 5 February 2023 (UTC)
::Yes, I tried to be vague because I don't want to bother you with specifics, especially as it is so contentious and I'm well aware I'm in the minority here, but perhaps vagueness isn't terribly helpful!
::If you really want to go down the rabbit hole (though I very much advise you don't), [[Talk:LGB Alliance#Founders|I think this discussion about "founders"]] is probably the area where I first really ran off the rails trying to pick apart how to reconcile primary and secondary sources. I'm in the minority in caring about it so I don't expect to make any headway with it and have dropped the whole issue - I only picked it in the first place because I thought it would be simple!
::Here is a problem where an organisation says one straightforwardly factual thing about themselves, very clearly, in multiple primary sources, something backed up by *some* secondary sources and *some other* secondary sources disagree, *some of which* have been corrected or disputed directly by the individuals in question (on eg. Twitter). It isn't a subject that's easily deferred to "some people say x, others say y", nor is it a subject where summing together all possible options produces a useful result either. 
::It may seem a minor point, but from digging through the page history I believe that a specific list of names has been synthesised from multiple sources and then subsequently started to appear in secondary sources, which then has been used as citations to reinforce that original list, in a circular fashion. Obviously I can't prove that someone copy+pasted the list from wikipedia (or google) into an article, but I'm personally convinced that's happened.
::So yes, anyway, I guess I'm a bit lost as to where the maxim of preferring secondary sources turns into a disregard for when they contradict primary ones, and how to navigate policy in this area. [[User:Void if removed|Void if removed]] ([[User talk:Void if removed|talk]]) 15:01, 5 February 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Void if removed|Void if removed]] If I had been engaged in that discussion (and I'm glad I wasn't) I would simply have quoted [https://lgballiance.org.uk/about/ this webpage] as being fully in compliance with a Wikipedia policy, namely [[WP:ABOUTSELF]]. Other editors might have been able to find earlier versions of that page on the [[Wayback machine]] that said something different but by [[WP:ONUS]] (another policy) it is for those who wish to include potentially controversial material to come to a [[WP:CONSENSUS]] to do so. All that said, I think you were right to [[WP:DROPTHESTICK]]. Life is too short to fight [[How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?|these sorts of debate]]. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 15:51, 5 February 2023 (UTC)
::::Thank you very much for your guidance, it is appreciated. Hopefully I'll manage to branch out into less heated areas before I ask another question! [[User:Void if removed|Void if removed]] ([[User talk:Void if removed|talk]]) 16:05, 5 February 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:CinemaScholar|CinemaScholar]] on [[Docufiction]] (15:16, 7 February 2023) ==

I need help adding a citation to an entry. --[[User:CinemaScholar|CinemaScholar]] ([[User talk:CinemaScholar|talk]]) 15:16, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:CinemaScholar|CinemaScholar]] I'm guessing here but I think you need something like this:
:The [[neologism]] docufiction was introduced by Rhodes and Singer.<ref>{{cite book |isbn=9780786421848 |title=Docufictions: Essays on the Intersection of Documentary and Fictional Filmmaking |last1=Rhodes |first1=Gary D. |last2=Springer |first2=John Parris |date=8 November 2005 }}</ref>{{rp|5}}
{{talkref}}
:The page number can be specified using the {{tl|rp}} template (I've checked on Google books and that's the correct page). You could include the Google books URL but that's unnecessary. If I've got the wrong end of the stick, please give more details.... and incidentally that article displays examples of [[WP:OVERCITE]]. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 15:32, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:CinemaScholar|CinemaScholar]] (22:15, 7 February 2023) ==

Thanks very much. I made the change exactly as you suggested, with the wording and ISBN number. Someone called Mr.Ollie not only deleted the change, but keeps posting rude stuff about me. Why is this happening? Why would Wikipedia do this to a volunteer attempting to help, someone who reached out for help (to you) and then followed the suggestion precisely? --[[User:CinemaScholar|CinemaScholar]] ([[User talk:CinemaScholar|talk]]) 22:15, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

:This change is blatantly incorrect, and badly sourced. See [[Talk:Docufiction#First_use_of_the_term]]. -[[User:MrOllie|MrOllie]] ([[User talk:MrOllie|talk]]) 22:33, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:CinemaScholar|CinemaScholar]] (22:44, 7 February 2023) ==

I've now added a secondary source, peer-reviewed, and this person is still "warring" against me. Is there anything that can be done? --[[User:CinemaScholar|CinemaScholar]] ([[User talk:CinemaScholar|talk]]) 22:44, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:CinemaScholar|CinemaScholar]] Having discussions in multiple places makes it difficult for editors to follow them. Please now restrict comments about the article content to [[Talk:Docufiction]] and behavioural conduct to [[WP:ANI]], if you decide to go down that route, which I note you have not yet done and I would not recommend. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:09, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

== Barnstar from Clovermoss ==
{| style="color: #88888; background-color: #ffffff; border: 1px solid #3fb6ff; border-radius:10px;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | [[File:Teahouse Barnstar Hires.png|150px|link=WP:Teahouse|File:Teahouse Barnstar Hires.png CC BY-SA 3.0 Heather Walls]]
|style="font-size: large; padding: 3px 12px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''Teahouse Barnstar'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 15px; border-top: 1px solid gray;" | Hi Michael! I don't think we've ever directly interacted before but I just wanted to say that your efforts to help newcomers don't go unnoticed and are appreciated. I've had the Teahouse on my watchlist for quite some time and while I don't pitch in there as much as maybe I want to, I do notice the great work that you and other editors do on a regular basis. So here's a barnstar to show that. [[User:Clovermoss|<span style="color:darkorchid">Clovermoss</span><span style="color:green">🍀</span>]] [[User talk:Clovermoss|(talk)]] 00:06, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
|}

== A barnstar for you! ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | [[File:Kindness Barnstar Hires.png|100px]]
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Awarded for your exceptionally helpful response for [[WP:Teahouse#A question on DYK|my inquiry at the Teahouse]]. Thank you! '''[[User:The Bestagon|The&nbsp;⬡&nbsp;Bestagon]]'''&nbsp;'''<sup>[[User talk:The Bestagon|''T'']]</sup>'''<span style="color:blue">/</span>'''<sub>[[Special:Contributions/The_Bestagon|''C'']]</sub>''' 14:28, 11 February 2023 (UTC) <small> And for your kind advice on my talk page regarding that matter too! '''[[User:The Bestagon|The&nbsp;⬡&nbsp;Bestagon]]'''&nbsp;'''<sup>[[User talk:The Bestagon|''T'']]</sup>'''<span style="color:blue">/</span>'''<sub>[[Special:Contributions/The_Bestagon|''C'']]</sub>''' 14:49, 11 February 2023 (UTC) </small>
|}

== Question from [[User:Johnsagent]] ==
I queried the Wikipedia Help Desk about a Deprecated Sources notice I got when I tried to submit an article on my sandbox because on my edit page, none of the deprecated references were marked.  You were nice enough to locate two of them for me which I removed.  However, I just tried to resubmit and got the same notice though I have no red marks on my draft. Could you help again?[[User:Johnsagent|Johnsagent]] ([[User talk:Johnsagent|talk]]) 08:19, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Johnsagent|Johnsagent]] I still see a deprecated source at #1233, which is the website nndb.com. Ideally, your draft could do with a lot of other tidying-up of sources. For example (using this one as its easy to locate in the text): you have #1787<ref>[http://www.codyenterprise.com] | June 4, 2018 | Supreme Court disbars Krone | [http://www.codyenterprise.com/news/local/article_f9156c8c-682d-11e8-a9ea-cb2bb456a622.html]</ref> That's got a direct link to a URL that's the top level of a website, which should really be the |website= parameter of a {{tl|cite web}} AND a URL for the actual material you are citing. The whole thing would be much better if transformed to this.<ref>{{cite web |url=http://www.codyenterprise.com/news/local/article_f9156c8c-682d-11e8-a9ea-cb2bb456a622.html |title=Supreme Court disbars Krone |date=June 4, 2018 |website=codyenterprise.com |access-date=2023-02-20 }}</ref> There may be additional parameters to add, such as the author information but I can't actually reach the website from my European location, so I can't check.
:Some of your bare URL's can probably be improved just by running the "Expand citations" menu option at the side of the sandbox page but I'm hesitant to let that bot loose on such a huge number of citations in one go as it will be near-impossible to compare the before and after versions! Nevertheless I would encourage you to try these sort of fixes as you have clearly already put immense amounts of time into the draft and it would be a pity not to finish the job. Let me know if I can help with parts of what needs to be done.
::I've been working hard.  So, do you see any other deprecated sources that need attention?  Any way to get them all?[[User:Johnsagent|Johnsagent]] ([[User talk:Johnsagent|talk]]) 18:21, 23 February 2023 (UTC)
::@[[User:Johnsagent|Johnsagent]] I don't see any more deprecated sources now. Why not install the gadget at [[User:Headbomb/unreliable]] into your own account and then you'll be able to see them yourself in future? That gadget also highlights less reliable (but usable) sources, so you might look for alternatives for marginal sources or remove them if you have multiple sources already. I noticed a couple of places where you have DAB-page links rather than links to the correct article. These appear in orange and are [[Robert Bentley]], [[Shawn Harrison]], [[William Scarborough]], [[Nelson Castro]], [[Sandra Williams]], [[Peter Beck (politician)]], [[Dan Kirby]], [[Harold Mitchell]] and [[Chittenden County]]. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:59, 24 February 2023 (UTC)
{{talkref}}

== [[Hessische Staatskanzlei]] ==

Dear Michael D. Turnbull, the whole thing started when i came across the English article on the Staatskanzlei, which had only one sentence in it and an info above on the site that one should add additional info by translating the German article and that is, what i have done. I added the external link to the Duties of the Staatskanzlei as i myself thought it was a bit thin on this. I guess, the info on the former Hotel Rose has been given to show its huge history - i could leave out the stuff about JÜrgen Schneider - then it would perhaps be clearer? Or do you think one should erase the history of the Hotel completely? Kind regards, [[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] ([[User talk:Naomi Hennig|talk]]) 21:35, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] I think that the building itself is interesting and that its history as the hotel is relevant. There should be enough sources to expand the current English article based on what you have already added in your sandbox. My assumption is that the role of State Chancellery for each German state will be somewhat similar across them all, although I'm not familiar with where there are articles for these (or a summary article) in English. My suggestion would be that you move material from your sandbox, leaving out most of the "Tasks" and all of the "Head of..." section but keeping the bit on Schneider as that's certainly relevant to the history of the building. Meanwhile, I'll add an infobox for the building. Then we can review where we've got to and think about where to put the material on the Hesse Chancellery as a political institution. Is that OK? [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:56, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
::I just found a German wikipedia-article on the subject of "Staatskanzlei" in general:

*  In most of the German states, the State Chancellery (also known as the Senate Chancellery or State Ministry) is the official residence of the Minister President. The officials and employees of the State Chancellery assist the Prime Minister in the performance of his official duties. The State Chancellery has the status of a supreme state authority.[1][2] The Head of Office of the State Chancellery is usually called the Chief of the State Chancellery (CdS). Central tasks are the comprehensive information, the preparation of problems, the preparation of decisions for the respective head of government, the enforcement of the guideline competence of the head of government as well as planning, coordination, management and control of the government work. The authority's responsibilities also include preparing decisions on the awarding of decorations and state prizes, organizing protocol matters, and press and public relations work. 

Perhaps we could use this to fill up the article on the "Hessische Staatskanzlei" and put all the text on the former hotel Rose in an extra article, like a stub? Kind regards, --[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] ([[User talk:Naomi Hennig|talk]]) 11:14, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] Wouldn't it make more sense to do it the other way round? The existing [[Hessische Staatskanzlei]] is about the building: I've just added it to [[Wiesbaden-Mitte]] as a building of interest. It is very relevant that the [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1615909 wikidata item for the article] calls it a national heritage site, nothing to do with government as such. "State Chancellery" is Wikidata [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1415691 Q1415691] and it would probably be as [[State Chancellery]] that you would create a new article on the more general topic, with text including what you have translated above. Then the historic list of heads of the individual states would be sub-sections of that article and of course there would be a wikilink to the Hesse building as an example. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:36, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
::This sounds very reasonable... now we would call the article ²Former Hotel Rose"? And then this article would only be on the building... and the other thing with the state chancellery would have some time for me to collect info? Kind regards and thank you very much that you help me on this subject, i really appreaciate this! Kind regards, [[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] ([[User talk:Naomi Hennig|talk]]) 14:34, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] I don't think that there is any need to alter the name of the article, as that corresponds to the current name of the building and Wikipedia typically renames articles to their current form or the [[WP:COMMONNAME]]. Obviously, the enhanced article should include material already in your sandbox about the former hotel. I've already added the infobox.
:::As to the wider issue, I'm on a steep learning curve! Just looking at en:Wikipedia, we have [[States of Germany]] and [[Composition of the German state parliaments]], which cover the whole country. Then for each Landtag there are articles like [[Landtag of Hesse]] and [[List of presidents of the Landtag of Hesse]], with another article explaining what a [[Minister president (Germany)]] is. As far as I can tell so far, there is no article on [[State Chancellery]] or any [[List of State Chancellors]] but if there were to be such articles, I'd expect them to cover all the German states, with tables as at [[States of Germany]]. Whether there should then be individual article for each state (e.g. [[State Chancellery of Hess]] etc) I'm not sure: is there such a thing comprehensively on the German Wikipedia?  We do have [[German Chancellery]] for the federal level. So, the main issue for you is how much new writing you want to do and at what level: the whole in one article and/or each Chancellery at State level. You could be very busy for a long time but [[WP:NOHURRY]]! What do you think? [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 16:37, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
::::First of all, this is a learning curve for me too... I never knew our political system is so complicated. When i started with the translation i really had to look up the tasks they are performing at the [[Hessische Staatskanzlei]]... :-) - i would never pass an immigration-test for Germany, i fear. As i'm pretty busy at the moment preparing a weekend in Hesse (haha, yes, my sister lives there and our whole family is spread over Hesse), i would prefer to leave this tangled wool of all the Chancelleries to someone more enthusiastic about this than me... do you go accord? :-) - Kind regards and thank you so much for your insight and help. It means a lot to not be left completely alone with such complicated matters, --[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] ([[User talk:Naomi Hennig|talk]]) 16:52, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
:::::@[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] That's absolutely fine. No-one here has to do anything they don't want to do. You have already completed most of the difficult bits that will help expand Hessische Staatskanzlei and I hope you'll complete that by moving the relevant parts to the live article, as we have discussed. Enjoy your time in Hesse! [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 16:59, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
::::::Dear Michael, would you be so kind to have a look on what i added to the site? I also added the template "translated page" and the info-box looks great. Gives the whole article more power, i find! --[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] ([[User talk:Naomi Hennig|talk]]) 17:08, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
:::::::@[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] OK, I'll do a light bit of copy-editing later this evening. For example, the way you did used {{tl|ill}} wasn't quite right. Incidentally, you have expanded the text more than fivefold, so in its current state the article would be a candidate for a [[WP:DYK]] on the Mainpage. That would be another milestone in your life as a WP editor: let me know if you need help in making a nomination (see the link for the basics). [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 17:47, 17 March 2023 (UTC)
::::::::Wow, Michael, you did a lot of editing, finding this wonderful old picture of the building and finding good reference-links for the text. The article really looks great now! I never did nominate an English article on the ''Did you know'', for the German "Schon gewusst" i already had 7 articles there. But do you believe that really many people are interested to know more about the Hessische Staatskanzlei? Kind regards, --[[User:Naomi Hennig|Naomi Hennig]] ([[User talk:Naomi Hennig|talk]]) 11:06, 18 March 2023 (UTC)

== Nomination an article for DYK? ==

Hi, yesterday you mentioned I could nominate the [[Lydian-Milesian War|article]] for a DYK? I would like to do so, but I'm not sure I can phrase it perfectly on my own. Personally I was thinking something along the lines of "Did you know Thrasybulus of Miletus tricked the Lydian king Alyattes into believing his city was thriving with a party, and so ended the siege of Miletus and a twelve year war?" Alternatively, a less detailed version: "Did you know tyrant Thrasybulus ended the twelve-year Lydian-Milesian War with a fake party?" My phrasing isn't fantastic, but I believe this anecdote is the most interesting from the article. How can I improve the DYK? Many thanks [[User:GeneralCraft65|GeneralCraft65]] ([[User talk:GeneralCraft65|talk]]) 09:01, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:GeneralCraft65|GeneralCraft65]] Your second, shorter, version is the sort of "hook" that's perfect for DYK, as it is likely to make readers want to know more. There is a nomination wizard at [[Template:DYK nomination header#Instructions for nominators]]. Read the instructions on that page and try it out. Post back into this thread if you need any assistance. The text for the hook will be (with links) ...that [[tyrant]] [[Thrasybulus of Miletus|Thrasybulus]] ended the twelve-year '''[[Lydian-Milesian War]]''' with a fake party? You can copy/paste that bit out of here in the source editor. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:09, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

==DYK for Hessische Staatskanzlei==
{{ivmbox
|image = Updated DYK query.svg
|imagesize=40px
|text = On [[Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2023/April#6 April 2023|6 April 2023]], '''[[:Template:Did you know|Did you know]]''' was updated with a fact from the article '''''[[Hessische Staatskanzlei]]''''', which you recently nominated. The fact was ''... that in 1945 the [[United States Army|US Army]] confiscated the Hotel Rose in [[Wiesbaden]], which is now the '''[[Hessische Staatskanzlei|Hessian State Chancellery]]'''?'' The nomination discussion and review may be seen at [[Template:Did you know nominations/Hessische Staatskanzlei]]. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>([[User:Rjanag/Pageview stats|here's how]], [//pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2023-03-27&end=2023-04-16&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=Hessische_Staatskanzlei Hessische Staatskanzlei])</small>, and the hook may be added to [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics/Monthly DYK pageview leaders|the statistics page]] after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the [[:Template talk:Did you know|Did you know talk page]].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK -->  [[User:BorgQueen|BorgQueen]] ([[User talk:BorgQueen|talk]]) 00:02, 6 April 2023 (UTC)
=== Precious ===
{{user precious|header=organic chemistry and its people|thanks=for quality articles around organic chemistry, based on scietific expertise, beginning in 2018 with expanding and referencing [[Ralph Raphael]], then [[Alan R. Battersby]] and [[Fluazifop]], for gnomish cleanup of IMDb, for nominating the work of others, for offering help at the Teahouse and help desk, - Mike,}}
You are recipient no. [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Quality Article Improvement/Precious#Michael D. Turnbull|2840]] of Precious, a prize of [[WP:QAI|QAI]]. --[[User:Gerda Arendt|Gerda Arendt]] ([[User talk:Gerda Arendt|talk]]) 14:46, 6 April 2023 (UTC)

== Your change on Societat Civil Catalana ==

You removed a sentence in agreement with Crystallizedcarbon on this page. I think that, por exactly the same reasons as explained by the latter in the Talk page, and because the same wrong source is quoted, the following sentence appearing at the end of the chapter 'Activism' should also be deleted: 'This belief is aligned with the rhetoric used by Spanish nationalism'. Thanks for your attention [[User:Mariano211|Mariano211]] ([[User talk:Mariano211|talk]]) 17:09, 24 March 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Mariano211|Mariano211]] For the sake of openness and to keep all discussion in one place, please make your comments on [[Talk:Societat Civil Catalana]] rather than here. It would be sensible to start a new section for each edit request, even though your current suggestion will be similar to the one already actioned. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 17:20, 24 March 2023 (UTC)
::I have got this message again. Do you suggest that I start a new section with my proposal? In order to avoid another lengthy discussion, perhaps it would be sensible to just delete the sentence I point at, because consistent with your previous deletion of 24 March. I wait for your comments before going ahead. [[User:Mariano211|Mariano211]] ([[User talk:Mariano211|talk]]) 19:33, 5 April 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Mariano211|Mariano211]] The discussion on the article seems to have calmed down, with the latest comment on the Talk Page being yours of March 31. Now might be the time to proceed cautiously to make a small change to the article itself and see what comment that gets. If you are reverted, don't edit war but immediately engage in a discussion in a new section. Remember [[WP:ONUS]] says that people adding article content have to justify doing so and gain consensus, whereas removing content is less controversial. If you do delete the sentence, consider leaving the citation if it is relevant elsewhere: I'm thinking of the Alia Wong article, which is in English and makes some reasonable points. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:34, 6 April 2023 (UTC)
::::Thanks for your sensible advice, I will proceed as suggested [[User:Mariano211|Mariano211]] ([[User talk:Mariano211|talk]]) 16:19, 6 April 2023 (UTC)
::::Following 95.17.250.138's reaction I created i new section under 'Talk'. Thanks for your attention [[User:Mariano211|Mariano211]] ([[User talk:Mariano211|talk]]) 14:51, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

== A barnstar for you! ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | [[File:Editors Barnstar Hires.png|100px]]
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Editor's Barnstar'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Dear Mike,
To a newbie stumbling through a maze, to adhere to Wikipedia protocols, you have been a tremendous guide, helper in copy-editing on Lee Youn Chin, article.
Your time, efforts, patience and editorial help is very much appreciated!  You and other editors like you are the best! [[User:Setwikirec0|Setwikirec0]] ([[User talk:Setwikirec0|talk]]) 14:38, 23 April 2023 (UTC)
|}

== Lee Youn Chin - translation to Chinese draft done  ==

Dear Mike,I

Hope you are doing great! Its good here too.

If I may trouble you again, the article of Lee Youn Chin, was successfully translated to Chinese.  I submitted it, and I can see that it is now a draft in Chinese, as confirmed by Wiki-Chinese message to me.  However, when I go to my translation-> it displays Lee's draft in Chinese under Published. When I click on the draft, I now cannot see my translation any more. ?? Instead, it says "Wikipedia does not have a draft: Lee Youn Chin.  ???  

This msg comes up- 

* '''[https://zh.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Draft:%E6%9D%8E%E9%9B%B2%E7%8F%8D_Lee_Youn_Chin&action=edit 开始编辑Draft“Draft:李雲珍 Lee Youn Chin”]'''。

But the below link I saved does display it in Chinese.

Sorry, I'm all muddy again and not sure as to why - Now I see, Now I don't syndrome! :((

Please help and advice me to whom should I contact.  The Chinese wiki translation group, I did open a talk page when I moved it to publish.  But I'm not sure of things.  Maybe, its a phrase to wait till the wiki patrol, wiki editors and others see and approved and move it?  


[https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Draft:%E6%9D%8E%E9%9B%B2%E7%8F%8D_Lee_Youn_Chin&oldid=1151097826 https://en.wiki%E9%9B%B2%E7%8F%8D_Lee_Youn_Chin&oldid=1151097826pedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Draft:%E6%9D%8E]


Thank you very much, Mike!


[[User:Setwikirec0|Setwikirec0]] ([[User talk:Setwikirec0|talk]]) 00:04, 23 April 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Setwikirec0|Setwikirec0]] As far as I can tell, the problem is that you drafted the Chinese version of the article here on the English Wikipedia, so its URL currently is <nowiki>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:%E6%9D%8E%E9%9B%B2%E7%8F%8D_Lee_Youn_Chin</nowiki>. Note the "//en." at the beginning. Each language on Wikipedia has its own rules and submission procedures. No-one here within the English Project can accept an article into Chinese Wikipedia. Instead, you need to find out what their submission process is and follow it. You can copy/paste out your Chinese draft as wikitext into that language's equivalent of the [[WP:AFC|articles for creation]] page, which I think is at [https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:%E5%BB%BA%E7%AB%8B%E6%A2%9D%E7%9B%AE this URL] and read any instructions there for submitting it. Later, you can get an administrator here on English Wikipedia to delete the redundant draft by adding the template {{tl|db-author}} to the very top: that is how to request what we call "speedy deletion", leaving no trace here. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:29, 23 April 2023 (UTC)
::Just one more thing. For copyright reasons, you need to say where you got the original (English) version of the article you translated when you copy/paste it into the Chinese area. Do that by an edit summary. There is more information at [[WP:TRANSLATEUS]]. Incidentally, you can see your global contributions at [https://guc.toolforge.org/?by=date&user=Setwikirec0 this URL, which currently has no relevant Chinese entries]. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:35, 23 April 2023 (UTC)
:::Always so thankful for your promptness! You are very helpful and the best, Mike! [[User:Setwikirec0|Setwikirec0]] ([[User talk:Setwikirec0|talk]]) 16:52, 23 April 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Definitelynotlane|Definitelynotlane]] (03:21, 26 April 2023) ==

How can I start a new historical page about a person of the American society that's unheard of --[[User:Definitelynotlane|Definitelynotlane]] ([[User talk:Definitelynotlane|talk]]) 03:21, 26 April 2023 (UTC)

:That's a tough question, @[[User:Definitelynotlane|Definitelynotlane]]! If you mean that there is no reliably-published information about the person, then the answer is simple: you can't, because wikipedia only covers topics that are [[WP:NBIO|notable in a specific sense]]. If you mean that there is information about them that exists only in obscure historical records and books that few people have access to but you do have access, then it might be possible but I warn that it is tricky for new editors like yourself to draft an article (we prefer that word to "page", since we are not social media). You have a steep learning curve and should start by reading [[WP:NTK|this basic overview of what we need]]. The process of creating a draft for review by experienced editors is [[H:YFA|explained here]]. Good luck.... if you have addiitional questions, just add them here in this section of my Userpage and I'll try to assist. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:55, 26 April 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Diana Agron00|Diana Agron00]] (15:12, 14 May 2023) ==

Hi... How do I verify my account in Wikipedia. --[[User:Diana Agron00|Diana Agron00]] ([[User talk:Diana Agron00|talk]]) 15:12, 14 May 2023 (UTC)

:Hi @[[User:Diana Agron00|Diana Agron00]]. I don't really understand your question. Accounts here are not required to use real-life names and most editors use a pseudonym. I happen to use my full name but have never "verified" it to anyone on Wikipedia. It is actually against policy to impersonate some well-known living person by using their name as your account name (see [[WP:UN]]). Are you claiming to be [[Dianna Agron]]? It is also against policy to reveal the real-life identity of anyone using a pseudonym (see [[WP:OUTING]]). 
:By the way, I note from your Userpage that you work at IMDb. Please note that Wikipedia does not consider that it is a reliable source and you will get into trouble if you add information based only on IMDb citations. See [[WP:IMDB]] for the details. It is, however, standard practice to link to that website in the [[WP:EL|external links]] sections of articles on films, TV shows and actors and there are templates to do just that at {{tl|IMDb name}} and {{tl|IMDb title}}. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 15:42, 14 May 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann|Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann]] on [[User:Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann]] (20:59, 20 May 2023) ==

Please could you tell me how can I established in this page? --[[User:Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann|Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann]] ([[User talk:Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann|talk]]) 20:59, 20 May 2023 (UTC)
:{{tps|br}} {{replyto|Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann}} Wikipedia is [[WP:NOTFACEBOOK|not Facebook]]: you don't get to have a page. Please read [[WP:AUTO]] and [[WP:FIRST]] as those should answer all your questions. <span class="nowrap" style="font-family:copperplate gothic light;">[[User:Chris troutman|<span style="color:#345">Chris Troutman</span>]] ([[User talk:Chris troutman|<span style="color:#345">talk</span>]])</span> 22:39, 20 May 2023 (UTC)
:@[[User:Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann|Md. Atiq- Ur- Rahmann]] Editors on Wikipedia are given a personal area, not part of the main encyclopaedia where we have articles. To create it, click on your username here (currently in red) and then type what you wish to tell other editors about what you will contribute. Before doing that, read the advice at [[WP:UPYES]], which describes what may be placed there. In a moment, I will add some relevant further information on your Talk Page. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 23:02, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

== Minor thing ==

The [[User_talk:Michael_D._Turnbull/Archives/2022]] is partly messed up, see last named thread and downward. I'm guessing a stray symbol or half-tag somewhere. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 09:44, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

:Thanks, {{U|Gråbergs Gråa Sång}}. Somehow a nowiki end-tag had become "nowiki/" instead of "/nowiki". [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:59, 24 May 2023 (UTC)
::For the benefit of future WP-archeologists. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 11:00, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

{{You've got mail}} [[User:JcwDenno|JcwDenno]] ([[User talk:JcwDenno|talk]]) 04:31, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] (14:05, 12 June 2023) ==

There is a welcome or "home page" for me, and it says "Most viewed (since your edit)", will my user page or talk page ever appear on there if I happen to spend more time on those than on some other random pages? Or are those pages excluded from the algorithm?? --[[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 14:05, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

:No, as it says on the page I linked in my original reply, the new-user homepage view count only refers to views of articles in mainspace that you have edited. You can see how many pageviews there are on any general page by clicking on the "Page information" link which on my PC using the default Vector 22 skin is located to the right of the page content. You can get a ''very'' full summary of your editing by navigating to [https://xtools.wmcloud.org/ec/en.wikipedia.org/Michael_D._Turnbull a URL like this]: I've used my own edit history in that link since there's more to see than currently would be in yours. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:16, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] (02:28, 12 June 2023) ==

It says you are my mentor, what does that entail? --[[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 02:28, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

:Hi @[[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] and welcome to Wikipedia as a editor. The basic objectives of the mentoring program [[WP:GTF|are discussed at this link]]. The idea is that by putting new editors in touch with a named individual, they are more likely to manage what can be a steep learning curve here. You are under no obligation to use me as your mentor: you could for example just ask questions at the [[WP:TEAHOUSE|Teahouse]], as I see you have already done. I regularly contribute to the Teahouse and Help Desk, as well as making article edits on topics I'm interested in (see my UserPage). If there is anything you want me to help with, just continue to place requests in this thread. (P.S. I am in the UK time zone, so mainly active 10-18 hours GMT) [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:22, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
::thanks for your time. i am in virginia, so eastern time zone. So we are a bit off. I can continue to ask questions in the tea house if that is better?  [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 13:59, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] You'll get broader and faster answers at the Teahouse but the whole point of the mentoring system is to encourage  questions that new editors might worry may make them look stupid if posted in that rather public forum. Also, Teahouse threads get archived after just a few days, making it harder to find your old question again if you need to remind yourself of the answer/links. Talk Pages tend to be archived much more slowly and to have less content in the first place. For asking me questions that you want to keep close at hand, just {{tl|ping}} me to a new thread on your own Talk Page, where everything will be under your full control. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:06, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
::::ping you? [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 14:08, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::can i only "ping" you on my own talk page??
:::::Also, I want to update my signature, do you know how i do that too? 
:::::Cheers Mike [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 14:09, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::@[[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] The ping mechanism works to alert people to any Talk Page, provided you make sure you sign your posts (as you have been doing). See [[WP:PING]] for the full details. You don't, for example, need to ping me when you reply within '''my''' Talk Page, as the system already alerts me to new content here. It is good practice to ping people in other threads, however, since they may otherwise not notice you have replied, even if the person you are replying to has the Talk Page on their watchlist. That's particularly important in threads within the Teahouse, and similar, where content comes so quickly that it is easy to forget you were in the midst of a conversation! The "reply" mechanism (as distinct from the "edit source" mechanism) for editing Talk pages is very helpful since it gives an edit window with an icon on the right which can be used to add the names of people you wish to alert who have already contributed to that thread. 
::::::You'll often find that you can get self-help by searching within the main search bar with a likely search term prefixed by '''WP:''' Hence "WP:SIGNATURE" finds [[WP:SIGNATURE]], where you'll find the instructions, including how to customise your own. The so-called "WP" namespace (see [[WP:NAMESPACE]]) is where loads of help exists. There is also a specific Help namespace but I find that less comprehensive. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:30, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::::sign my posts? [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 14:32, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::::i just click on "reply", is that "signing"? [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 14:32, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::The reply tool adds signatures automatically and seems to be what you have used consistently so far. See [[WP:SIGNATURE]] for the alternative method that involves adding four tilde characters ~ ~ ~ ~ (without gaps) which the Wiki software converts to a signature + timestamp. You need to use that method if you are editing directly not usng the reply tool. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:37, 12 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::thanks mike, im going to click the wp:signature thing next and look into that. [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 14:38, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

== Imdb-links, again ==

Did you ever find out where on WP the use of these (the sneaky ones) are recommended/taught? Is it perhaps even done automatically with visual editor? Perhaps whatever it is can be sought out and de... ''changed.'' [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 13:34, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

:The only place I ever found was in a Help page: we both commented on [[Help_talk:Interwiki_linking#Interwiki_links_to_IMDB]] but nothing happened! Actually, I don't think that's the answer. I ''suspect'' it is something to do with new editors who are familiar with IMDb where, maybe, they use that sort of link. I've asked on such editor's Talk Pages to tell me where they got the idea but no-one has said anything useful. I warned a couple of editors recently [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3AUWJSISA414TWA%26C&diff=1159949327&oldid=1158237312 here] and [[User talk:Archie Arcane|here]] but got no responses. If they do reply, I'll try to get them to open up.... and I suggest you take the same approach when you next run into the issue (I don't bother trying to reach out to IP editors, who are the main culprits). [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:05, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
::[https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Help%3AInterwiki_linking&diff=1160116396&oldid=1153446530]. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 14:16, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
:::Yes, we should probably have made that edit last year! It will be interesting to see if it makes a scrap of difference. My bet is "no". (P.S. I removed all the latest baddies yesterday and just now, so currently we have a clean slate). [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:22, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
::::It's not likely to be a place the newbies read, is it? I actually got an edit conflict with you on that yesterday. I just tried to insert imdb as EL with VE, but it seemed to use the template correctly. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 14:26, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::I'll go back and ask the specific question of the two people from yesterday, in the hope they can throw some light on this. I'm glad you've shown it ain't a problem in the VE, as that would have been a b..... to get someone to fix. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:30, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::Quite a bother, yes. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 14:32, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::::@[[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] Ah! Maybe some progress: see [[User talk:UWJSISA414TWA%26C#IMDb links]]. Perhaps you could add some advice there about the correct use of VE, as I'm not familiar with it? [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 16:00, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::::And you think I am!? I've concluded it doesn't actually give you std:s, though. I wrote something. I keep thinking I ''should'' get better at it, for Teahouse understanding if nothing else. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 17:33, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::::Come to think of it, that makes an amount of sense, many of the "afflicted" articles seems to have non-eng origin, so to speak. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 17:37, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::::Hm, VE may be our enemy after all:[https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Nic%C3%B4le_Lecky&diff=prev&oldid=1160149950]. Don't ask me ''how'' they did it. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 18:22, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::That diff's been redacted for copyvio, so I can't see what you meant. I'll start to play with VE today and see what I come up with. Meanwhile, I thought we could add a "Technical considerations" section to [[WP:CITEIMDB]] explaining how to use the {{tl|imdb name}} and {{tl|imdb title}} templates (or {{tl|cite web}}) and not the interwiki links: that might assist anyone who actually went to look for help to do things correctly. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:22, 15 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::I've tried the VE editor, where I find there's a pretty steep learning curve for adding templates: and you have to know they exist! I've made some tweaks to the wording at [[WP:CITEIMDB]] and [[WP:IMDBTEMPLATE]] which I hope may help. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 12:08, 15 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::What happened was that the editor changed my EL-section imdb (template) to the kind we don't like, with a VE (tagged) edit. In other news, [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Help:Interwiki_linking&oldid=prev&diff=1160238044]. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 13:51, 15 June 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::::Yes, I saw that revert. I think from their edit summary Mathglot was objecting to the text being in the "Disadvantages" section, not that it shouldn't be somewhere more relevant. They also seemed to be worried that if there was specific advice against the IMDb link in articles then the Help page arguably needs other advice about when/where to use interwiki links that would make the page unwieldy. Maybe needs to be discussed with them either on that Talk Page or on their UserTalk page. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 15:01, 15 June 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Cookie dough dingus|Cookie dough dingus]] (03:50, 21 June 2023) ==

Hi, I was wondering how to write about a rural high school in Kentucky (Rockcastle County High School, it's a draft into resubmission at the moment) without it being declined? I've marked the school's district and did US Dept. of Education research and cited sources, supplied a well-organized infobox template and supplied the location and coordinates! What am I doing wrong? --[[User:Cookie dough dingus|J.A.]] ([[User talk:Cookie dough dingus|talk]]) 03:50, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Cookie dough dingus|Cookie dough dingus]] The issue is not what you are doing "wrong" but the fact that the draft does not show that the school is [[WP:NSCHOOL|notable]] in the sense that Wikipedia defines this. The world has hundreds of thousands of schools so Wikipedia wants to focus on those which have already been commented on in sources meeting [[WP:42|these criteria]]. Your draft merely shows that the school exists but does nothing to show that it stands out from the crowd. In the early days of the encyclopaedia, [[WP:STUB|stub]] articles like that often got published but now with over 6 million articles in English, the standards have, correctly in my opinion, been raised (see [[WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES]]). Incidentally, the reviewers won't be impressed by the fact that you have re-submitted it, after Sungodtemple moved it to draft, without making any substantive change to address the lack of notability. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:21, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] (15:14, 17 June 2023) ==

How am i doing? anything you might change? --[[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 15:14, 17 June 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] Your contributions seem mostly fine. [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Special%3AContributions&target=Iljhgtn&namespace=all&tagfilter=mw-reverted&start=&end=&limit=50 The ones reverted] by other editors all relate to over-use of Wikilinks, I guess because of [[MOS:OVERLINK]]. Now may be the time to try to make more substantial contributions by researching topics you are interested in (using [[WP:42|these types of sources]]) and update articles accordingly. As your UserPage doesn't tell me anything about your interests/knowledge, I can't really give more specific advice. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 12:22, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
::ok thnkas [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 17:44, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
:::i like writing about ships, both USA naval warships and UK warships mostly, but ships of other nations would interest me as well. Anything naval ship themed. [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 21:03, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
::::@[[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] It sounds as though you should explore the Projects related to that at [[WP:WikiProject Transport/Maritime transport task force]] and maybe join [[WP:WikiProject Transport/Maritime transport task force/Participants| its membership list]]. I don't know exactly how active they are but you could certainly ask on their Talk page or via an existing member. There is also an active Project on [[WP:WikiProject Military history/Maritime warfare task force| maritime warfare]]. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:08, 29 June 2023 (UTC)
:::::cool i will do that [[User:Iljhgtn|Iljhgtn]] ([[User talk:Iljhgtn|talk]]) 18:29, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

== DYK Patricia Davies ==

Thanks for your help Michael and sincere apologies for causing extra work. I went to Template:Did you know nominations/Patricia Davies... but cannot see how to change /edit things there. For example how to add a better source if the current one is not good.  There is no edit button. I've tried clicking here or there but to no avail? Someone else has already improved things luckily but I have no idea how they did it.  [[User:Balance person|Balance person]] ([[User talk:Balance person|talk]]) 11:56, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Balance person|Balance person]] The page is [[Template:Did you know nominations/Patricia Davies (cryptographer)]] as already mentioned. You can't use the visual editor there, only the source editor works and there is an "Edit source" tab as usual. Someone has already commented and seems to think the hook is fine with minor update to the correct Act (1911, 1920 or 1939?). I was the one who tweaked the hook to include both sisters: see the "View history" tab as on all Wikipedia pages. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 12:05, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
::Thanks for the explanation. I don't actually know which date of the act they signed but will endeavour to find out. [[User:Balance person|Balance person]] ([[User talk:Balance person|talk]]) 14:14, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
::OK I think it is done. Many thanks.[[User:Balance person|Balance person]] ([[User talk:Balance person|talk]]) 14:45, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
::Hello Mike. You kindly suggested that I keep in touch as the DYK for Patricia Davies progresses. And I notice that the person  reviewing it for DYK has asked for help as it is the first one they have done. I don't know if they have done enough for the DYK to progress or if the DYK is now in limbo? I am sure I cannot do anything about it myself. But is this something you would be able to help with? I am not sure if there is a time limit on these things or not? There will be some protocol about it I am sure!  [[User:Balance person|Balance person]] ([[User talk:Balance person|talk]]) 10:07, 1 July 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Balance person|Balance person]] No need to worry. The DYK has passed its review and progressed to a queue from which I guess it will be about 2 weeks to reach the Mainpage. The reviewer was a relative newcomer to approving DYK, so mentioned that when OKaying it. There will be plenty of other eyes on it (including an admin) who will intervene if they think there is a problem but the chances of that are very low in my opinion. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:10, 1 July 2023 (UTC)
::::Thanks, Mike. I knew you would know! [[User:Balance person|Balance person]] ([[User talk:Balance person|talk]]) 13:55, 1 July 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:SaeedBama|SaeedBama]] (09:03, 6 July 2023) ==

Hello, How can I protect a page from editing? What is the documents or requirements for doing that?

Thank you 
SAEED --[[User:SaeedBama|SaeedBama]] ([[User talk:SaeedBama|talk]]) 09:03, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:SaeedBama|SaeedBama]] Please read [[WP:PROTECT]] carefully and come back with further questions in this thread if necessary. It is difficult for me to give better advice unless you mention the article where you think page protection may be needed. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:41, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Iamshield|Iamshield]] on [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/Help desk]] (11:53, 17 July 2023) ==

How can I submit my draft --[[User:Iamshield|Iamshield]] ([[User talk:Iamshield|talk]]) 11:53, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

:Hi @[[User:Iamshield|Iamshield]]. I don't see any draft in [[Special:Contributions/Iamshield|your contributions]], only a couple of minor edits prior to this question. Where did you save/publish it? There are very full instructions for writing articles at [[WP:YFA|this link]] but beware: writing a complete article is quite difficult for a newcomer. See also [[WP:BACKWARD|this essay]]. If you have further questions, just add them here in this thread. Best wishes. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 12:28, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

==DYK for Viriditoxin==
{{ivmbox
|image = Updated DYK query.svg
|imagesize=40px
|text = On [[Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2023/July#26 July 2023|26 July 2023]], '''[[:Template:Did you know|Did you know]]''' was updated with a fact from the article '''''[[Viriditoxin]]''''', which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ''... that '''[[viriditoxin]]''' may be able to inhibit cancer growth?'' The nomination discussion and review may be seen at [[Template:Did you know nominations/Viriditoxin]]. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>([[User:Rjanag/Pageview stats|here's how]], [https://pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2023-07-16&end=2023-08-05&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=Viriditoxin Viriditoxin])</small>, and the hook may be added to [[Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics/Monthly DYK pageview leaders|the statistics page]] after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the [[:Template talk:Did you know|Did you know talk page]].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK -->  [[User:Aoidh|Aoidh]] ([[User talk:Aoidh|talk]]) 00:02, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:Principaltill2014|Principaltill2014]] (19:07, 29 July 2023) ==

Hello Michael,

How can we go about correcting misinformation on the West Ranch High School Page?

I tried to correct it myself and did not do it correctly. I now understand why I was banned from editing on Wikipedia and I apologize. Can you make this change, or direct my how to request that it be made?

West Ranch High School
Stevenson Ranch California

This information is incorrect:
Since the high school did not have a mascot at the time, the class of 2008 chose the wildcat to represent the school and because the movie High School Musical, which had come out 2 years prior to West Ranch’s first graduating class.

How can we change it to this?
The school mascot and colors were selected by a steering committee of student leaders in the spring of 2004, prior to the opening of the school.

Thank you so much,

Robert Vincent --[[User:Principaltill2014|Principaltill2014]] ([[User talk:Principaltill2014|talk]]) 19:07, 29 July 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Principaltill2014|Robert]] Most of the relevant details are now on your own Talk Page. Let me try to explain, as an uninvolved editor here. First, it would help you to change your mindset from "West Ranch High School's Page" (implying [[WP:OWN|ownership, as if a school's website]]) to ''"a Wikipedia article about the school, written entirely based on sources [[WP:42|like these]]".'': please read the linked items. Once you've read those, you should understand why your edits to [[ West Ranch High School]] were reverted by experienced editors: they came across too much like [[WP:PROMOTION|promoting the school]] rather than [[WP:NPOV|neutrally stating some facts, with references]]. To many people's surprise, Wikipedia isn't interested just in [[WP:TRUTH|truth]] but gives more weight to its core policy of [[WP:V|verifiability]]. Hence what you "know", or I "know" is irrelevant - articles here are based on what's been published in [[WP:RS|reliable sources]]. 
:So, what can you do to add to the article? As someone with a [[WP:COI|conflict of interest]], you should not edit it directly but instead make any suggestions you have at [[Talk:West Ranch High School]], stating in a simple way what you think should be added/removed or reworded. To draw attention to your suggestion(s) there is a template you can use to be found at the link {{tl|edit COI}}. If you click on that link, you'll see how exactly to structure the request. Make sure you provide references for any new material: the school's own website is fine for some types of information (see [[WP:ABOUTSELF|this guidance]]). You should find that your request is handled within a few days. By all means come back to me in this thread if you have more questions. I would also advise that you place a COI template on your own User Page - currently the redlink [[User:Principaltill2014]], which you create by clicking on that redlink and adding something. I suggest, at minimum, placing <code><nowiki>{{UserboxCOI|1=West Ranch High School}}</nowiki></code> there. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 12:09, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

== I have sent you a note about a page you started ==

Hello, Michael D. Turnbull. Thank you for your work on [[3-(Difluoromethyl)-1-methyl-1H-pyrazole-4-carboxylic acid]]. [[User:SunDawn]], while examining this page as a part of our [[WP:NPP|page curation process]], had the following comments:

{{Bq|1=Hey there! Hope you're having a great day. Thank you for contributing to Wikipedia with your article. I'm happy to inform you that your article has adhered to Wikipedia's policies, so I've marked it as reviewed. Have a fantastic day for you and your family!}}

To reply, leave a comment here and begin it with {{code|<nowiki>{{Re|</nowiki>SunDawn<nowiki>}}</nowiki>}}. Please remember to sign your reply with {{code|<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>}}. <small>(Message delivered via the [[Wikipedia:Page Curation/Help|Page Curation]] tool, on behalf of the reviewer.)</small><!-- Template:Sentnote-NPF -->

[[User:SunDawn|<span style="background-color:black; color:orange;">&maltese; SunDawn &maltese;</span>]] [[User talk:SunDawn|<span style="color:blue;"><span style="font-size:85%;">(contact)</span></span>]] 21:26, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

:Thanks, @[[User:SunDawn|SunDawn]]. DYK is the next step, along the lines of "DYK ....that six agricultural [[Fungicide|fungicides]] are [[Amide|amides]] of '''[[3-(Difluoromethyl)-1-methyl-1H-pyrazole-4-carboxylic acid|a specific pyrazole carboxylic acid]]''' (''shown'')? [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:02, 31 July 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:KeshiaYarvell|KeshiaYarvell]] (17:27, 5 August 2023) ==

Hi Yarvell Acquanetta Cheatum I 'm star artist actor with my voice my mic on both side of my face area and stomach one on my upper tigth on right side of the leg; I need to add my information to my page Companies is looking for my information with my net worth
KESHIA is my nickname and it's spelled all kind of ways need help  with finishing  my page Yarvell is my real name. My marriage show up on some of my information Yarvell Scott I'm DIVORCED 12/09/2014 Kimberly Michelle Pate is on my information need to looking this one ASAP --[[User:KeshiaYarvell|KeshiaYarvell]] ([[User talk:KeshiaYarvell|talk]]) 17:27, 5 August 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:KeshiaYarvell|KeshiaYarvell]] If you are [https://www.instagram.com/yarvella/ this person] you can forget about having an article about you in Wikipedia. There simply are not enough sources meeting [[WP:42|these criteria]] that are published about you. Wikipedia is not to be used for [[WP:PROMOTION|promotion]]. Stick to social media for that. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 17:36, 5 August 2023 (UTC)

== Tea House - Show me the way ==

send you the talk :
@Theroadislong Thanks. As Turnbull commented, really speaking, actually I want to update my Article:Ramakrishna Mission Brahmananda College of Education. But I have some doubts and so I ask him few questions at the Teahouse Platform. [[User:Supriyomj16022008|Supriyomj16022008]] ([[User talk:Supriyomj16022008|talk]]) 17:00, 31 August 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Supriyomj16022008|Supriyomj16022008]] Please don't continue in this section of my Talk Page. I've made another comment in the Teahouse thread and you can ask more questions there if necessary. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 17:18, 31 August 2023 (UTC)

== Question from [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] (10:31, 30 August 2023) ==

Dear mentor,

I just translated a page from English to Chinese. When I tried to link my translated page

https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%80%8C%E6%A6%AE%E8%80%80%E8%97%9D%E8%A1%93%E3%80%8D%E6%96%87%E5%8C%96%E5%8B%B3%E7%AB%A0%E7%8D%8E%E7%AB%A0

to its original page

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medal_for_Merit_to_Culture_%E2%80%93_Gloria_Artis

, the page says I have no authority to do so, or the page has limit edit. I am looking for help or advice. Thank you so much.

Yours sincerely,
Eleni --[[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 10:31, 30 August 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] Nice to have a question at the limits of my competence! I'm not sure how much of this stuff you know already, so I'll work through it slowly. Links between the multiple language versions of Wikipedia are handled in Wikidata, so the page you need to edit is [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1702885 this one for Q1702885]. That page is [[WP:SEMI|protected to prevent vandalism]] and can only be edited by accounts with >10 edits and over 4 days old. You may not have passed that threshold when you tried to do the edit but as far as I can tell, you should be fine now. ''But there is an oddity in Wikidata I don't understand''. When I navigate to a Wikidata page such as [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q122059408 this one for a list article I created recently] I see "edit" icons all over the place, including top right where I could add another language link if a foreign-language version of my list was available. On Q1702885 I can see no such "edit" options, despite the fact I can readily edit other standard semi-protected pages and I already have 31 edits to Wikidata! My conclusion is that semi-protection in Wikidata limits editing much more than it does elsewhere. I think that your best bet is to contact Wikidata editors at [[:Wikidata:Wikidata:Project_chat]], summarising what we've said here. I'll be interested to know what they say.... [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:12, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
::Dear Mike,
::   Thank you so much for your detailed explanation and advice XD. I have concluded the scenario and submitted it as a bug in the Project_chat. Hopefully, there will be a solution to the problem, and I will update you on that. Have a nice day! 
::Regards, 
::Eleni [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 15:07, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
:::Wow, they have replied and edited the source for me. The reply is as follows, "That item was is protected and you are not autoconfirmed at wikidata. I've done that for you." I have double checked the criteria for autoconfirmed users ---  at least 4 days of age and at least 50 edits (90 days and 100 edits if editing through a Tor node) [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 15:14, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
::::@[[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] That's interesting. Semi-protected locks here on Wikipedia (see my link above) allow people with 10+ edits and 4+ day-old accounts to edit. Wikidata seems not only to require 50+ edits but these must be edits at Wikidata itself: which even I don't have and I've been editing Wikipedia for 5+ years! [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 15:21, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
:::::I have further added a comment, asking for the edit requirement for that specific page. Looking forward to the reply. I am also curious about the exact requirement as well. I will update you when they reply me XD [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 15:40, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
::::::The reply is as follows "Wikidata has a 50 edits requirement to be autoconfirmed, not 10. Each site calculate edit counts and account age separately, not added. You can check your account age and edit count on each site at here" 
::::::I guess they mean the requirement is 50 edit, which I didn't meet. [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 03:09, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
:::::::50 edits in wikidata*
:::::::https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:CentralAuth?target
:::::::This is the website they gave me to check all my edits in each site. [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 06:20, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
::::::::You can also check this one:[https://xtools.wmcloud.org/ec/en.wikipedia.org/EleniXDD] [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 14:12, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::@[[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] The bit that's still mystifying me is where Eleni actually asked and was answered at Wikidata: their contribution history shows nothing and I can't find any relevant stuff on the chat page.... [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:27, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::...logged out edits? [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 14:31, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::You might suppose so but I still can't see any relevant discussion at [[:Wikidata:Wikidata:Project chat]] nor in the edit history of the editor there who made the link to zh wikipedia on Q1702885, assuming that they were the same person. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 14:37, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::hahahaha, actually I asked in the bug report page of the project_chat. Here it goes. 
::::::::::https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T345264
::::::::::It is just now I realised in the link you sent me earlier, down below there is a discussion section. I kind of ignored it at first, and went to the bug report. [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 03:25, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::@[[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] Interesting! Phabricator edits are not shown in the global contributions at the xtools link. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:37, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
:::::<small>Hah! I have 70, but then again, I'm at 10+ years, so my account is older than, for example, Wikidata. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 14:07, 31 August 2023 (UTC)</small>

== Question from [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] (07:57, 1 September 2023) ==

Dear Mike, 
 
    There is another problem that I want to seek advice from you. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liu_Duan_Duan
This is an article page I created yesterday, usually when article has been created, if you search key word + wiki in google, it can be shown. 
  
      However, when I try to search this article in google or other browser, it never shows up. It can only be shown if I search it internally in Wiki. I wonder if it is because I accidentally made it as "Draft" in the beginning. 

     I am looking forward to your advice. Thanks

Regards,
Eleni --[[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 07:57, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] This is entirely normal on the English Wikipedia. Editors like you (or me) can directly create articles in the main encyclopaedia without going through the review that drafts get if the [[WP:AfC]] process is used. However, such articles are marked as "[[WP:NOINDEX|no-index]]" to search engines until they have been reviewed and approved by a group of experienced editors called the [[WP:NPP|new pages patrol]]. Articles will by default be indexed 6 months after their creation in the unlikely event the NPP miss them. Some editors (not me or you yet) ask to have the "autopatrolled" right: if granted, that means the articles they create get indexed immediately. Looking at [[Liu Duan Duan]], I'm afraid that you may find that the NPP have a harsh opinion and may [[WP:DRAFTIFY]] it. As it stands currently, it is poorly sourced: normally articles need at least three separate citations that meet [[WP:42|these criteria]]. So I suggest you quickly try to improved it to that standard. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 09:49, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
::Dear Mike,
::Thank you for your insightful feedback, I will definitely go and modify the page. 
::There leads to another problem --- I rename the page, so now there's two. Although before the action, it is stated that when pressed the old one, it will be redirected to the new one, unfortunately this doesn't work all the time. Sometimes article involve the name Liu Duan Duan directs to the old page, Do you think I should work on both pages or I just leave the old one alone.  Or should  I propose to delete the old page? Thanks a lot XD
::old one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liu_Duanduan
::new one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liu_Duan_Duan [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 11:14, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] I see that you have tagged [[Liu Duanduan]] for speedy deletion, which is fine. The alternative would have been to convert that page to a [[WP:Redirect]], which would have been reasonable if this was a likely search term that readers might accidentally or deliberately type. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 11:31, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
::::Thank you for all the constructive advice XDD I have really learnt a lot. I am so lucky to have a mentor like you :)) [[User:EleniXDD|EleniXDD]] ([[User talk:EleniXDD|talk]]) 14:39, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

== You've got mail! ==

{{You've got mail}} [[User:TheLonelyPather|TheLonelyPather]] ([[User talk:TheLonelyPather|talk]]) 14:45, 6 September 2023 (UTC)

== Possibly helpful information about IPv6 addresses ==

Hi! I came across [[Special:Diff/1174508830|your reply at the Teahouse]] where you mention that the contribution history of the IP editor has no draft associated with it - you can often find contributions that appear missing for an editor contributing from an IPv6 address by adding {{code|/64}} to the end of the URL to their contributions page. For this particular editor, that would be [[Special:Contributions/2601:5C0:C380:4980:BD25:9843:27D3:B53C/64]], which does list a draft. The /64 IP range is the typical size assigned to a single network, and because ISPs typically assign IP addresses dynamically, a single user is likely to contribute from many IPs in the range over time. [[User:Tollens|Tollens]] ([[User talk:Tollens|talk]]) 01:06, 9 September 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Tollens|Tollens]] Thanks, I was vaguely aware of that but I'll now put a reminder on my UserPage. The draft in question [[Draft:Carol A. Mullen]] has a rather chequered history and I've commented on it several times before. It is currently being made worse, not better! [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 10:13, 9 September 2023 (UTC)

== Waxworker Said I Haven't Bring Any Reliable Sources ==

[[User:Waxworker|Waxworker]] said I haven't bring any reliable sources when I "Dollface" in "The Tom and Jerry Show (2014 TV series)" page and probably won't allows me to undo her removal. Dollface is actual character in "The Tom and Jerry Show (2014)" voiced by Julie Wittner. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:The_Tom_and_Jerry_Show_(2014_TV_series)#c-Waxworker-20230908222200-ElectricStormFire86-20230908221800 Can you talk to her? Because Dollface is an actual character in the Tom and Jerry franchise, not some kind of a fan made character. [[User:ElectricStormFire86|ElectricStormFire86]] ([[User talk:ElectricStormFire86|talk]]) 22:34, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:ElectricStormFire86|ElectricStormFire86]] It is pointless going to the Talk Pages of editors at the Teahouse who have been trying to help you. We are generalists, giving advice based on our knowledge of Wikipedia's procedures, not the specifics. As Colin has said, we advised you how to take this forward. We have no knowledge or interest in Tom and Jerry characters. If you can't achieve consensus with Waxworker, then [[WP:dispute resolution|dispute resolution]] tells you how to pursue this. The relevant Wikipedia policy is [[WP:V|this one]]: you cannot add information you personally know to be true unless you can back that up with a '''published''', reliable source you cite. If you can't find such a source, then regrettably the information cannot be included. It may surprise you to know that Wikipedia [[WP:TRUTH|focuses on verifiability, not truth]]. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 12:09, 10 September 2023 (UTC)

== Did you got my message last night? ==

Did you got my message last night about [[User:Waxworker|Waxworker]]'s unruly and seemingly unfair behavior saying that I had provided unreliable sources? [[User:ElectricStormFire86|ElectricStormFire86]] ([[User talk:ElectricStormFire86|talk]]) 23:05, 9 September 2023 (UTC)

:Yes. However, no editor here is obliged to reply within a given time period, or even at all. We are in the main volunteers with lives outside of Wikipedia. On Talk Pages, reply times of up to a week are common, even for active editors like myself. That's why the best venues for seeking assistance are those like the Teahouse, which many experienced editors watch, so that general and accurate advice can be given quickly in almost all cases. [[User:Michael D. Turnbull|Mike Turnbull]] ([[User talk:Michael D. Turnbull#top|talk]]) 12:13, 10 September 2023 (UTC)