View source for User talk:Megistias

[[/Archive 30 August 2009 up to 29 December 2009]]


== Maps == 

OK Megistias, I really don't understand why do you keep on pushing some ideas in your Illyrian related maps? We had discussion about it a long time ago and I can see some other people have criticized your work too in the meantime. Do you know that your map File:Illyrians.jpg is taken for a joke in some specialized history forums where many experts write. 

Why do you mark Liburni as Venetic people? There is no any evidence of that kind. There is only possibility that in the very northern Liburnia there was presence of Histri, who were close to Veneti (Veneti-like names). Why do you mark Iapodes as the Celts? Why do you spread wrong info about "Celticized Dalmatae"? Can you understand difference between: being a Celt/being Celtized/having material exchange with the Celts??? Are you aware that for this "Celtization" you use almost 90 years old theories about "Illyarian Hallstat", abandoned 60, 70 years ago?

Now I'm watching this map File:IllyrianWars.jpg. What is that? I'm shocked. What is that territory bordered by brown line (Demetrius of Pharos)? What is yellow territory (Teuta)? [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 12:29, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
::Do you have some difficulty reading this for example? 
*Wilkes, J. J. The Illyrians, 1992,ISBN 0631198075,page 183,"We may begin with the Venetic peoples, Veneti, Carni, Histri and Liburni, whose language set them apart from the rest of the Illyrians"[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 19:09, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
::I am shocked as well by your odd claiming [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:Maedi&diff=prev&oldid=339348168 talk] that the Iranian [[Medes]] had something to do with the Thracian [[Maedi]].And on a 3 years old discussion at that.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 19:26, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
::I ve made the maps simpler and more neutral regarding celt issues but i will work on them further when i can.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 08:52, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

I'll start discussion in Liburnian language, about this, Wilkes is certainly not top authority on the matter and using only his specualation (citation from his book often used by you is not a fact) produces imbalance in related articles. My idea is not edit warring or pushing one idea against the others. We should cooperate on this. [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 10:17, 25 January 2010 (UTC)
:About the Medes, well, actually there is possible connection. There's a large chance that the Medes contributted to ethnogenesis of the Illyrians, Thracians, Greeks in one episode of Indo-Europeanization in the Balkans. [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 11:00, 25 January 2010 (UTC)

== User talk:Daesitiates ==

I am not sure you're helping matters at [[User talk:Daesitiates]]. The user is clearly upset about some activities by other users; you are possibly among them. Let's focus on the content rather than what someone's agenda may be. I think the content issue needs to be resolved on the page where the disagreement exists. <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 15:18, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
::ok, but he has never used the talk page and his edits are seen as inappropriate by other users as well. [[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 15:27, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
:::I'm not making any judgment on his edits or whether or not others find them inappropriate. I told him that admin intervention is not appropriate and he needs to learn to find [[WP:CONSENSUS]] on the talk page of the article in question. That's a first step. If that is tried and it fails, there are other steps to follow in dispute resolution. <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 15:37, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Megistias, 

I am kindly inviting you to cooperate so we can find some compromise on the text entitled " Ardian", for none of my 16 friends could see what was wrong with my contributions ( enclosed below) to  "Ardian" and why you removed them.

I am inviting you ti once again read my additions that you have been continuously deleting and realise that they have no political connotations nor do they offend, assault or undermine anyone in any way. I am too old for this  son. I guess you could show some respect to  people who are  much older than you and people who have been dealing with these issues academically , doing their best to keep it at  the academic level, with as little as possible political interferences.

There are many people clled "Ardian" and when they want to show their parents, their children or their grandchildren the meaning of their name, the last thing they want to read is som epolitical background to that name, like" Thisi i sone of those imaginary Illyrian names imposed  to Albanians by communist regime in Albanian". Communism vanished from Albania decades ago my son, and most Albanians (me being one) themselves prefer Ilylrian and Albanian national names. Nobody imposes that on us.
 I guess Albanians DO  have a say about their own culture, right?

Why isn't there any Englishmen out there  deleting  contributions to some Celtic name? I'll tel you son, because he is civlized enough to understand that nationalism is a disease that needs to be cured.

So for the sake of those civilized values, as a person much older than you, I kindly ask you to read again my contributions that you ar so much upset about (for reasons known only to you) and reaize that  my contributions are in no way offending or undermining anyone, nor, most importantly, are they lacking reference.

Here are the contributions you deleted. Please, read them and tell me whcih parts you don't liek and why so we can find som ecompromise.

Again, please bear in mind that the text "Ardian" , the way you left it on Wikipedia, DOES look indirectly discriminatory to Albanians, for two reasons: 

1. It uses the undermining languge " the imaginary Illyrian names", 
and 
2. It only emphasizes negative aspects of the history of that name ( "Illyrian names being imposed by communists", which dopes not affect the fact that Albnainas themselves prefer Ilylrian and Albanian national names. After all, they do not need to ask for someone's permission in order to do that, right?).

"Original Illyrian names found in the literature, as well as names made up of Illyrian words and etymologies in general, are still among the most preferred personal names among modern Albanians today, along with names deriving from Albanian language, the Albanian national names like Bardh/Bardha, ('white', 'pure', 'fair'), Hyll ('star'), Bora ('snow'), Dita ('daylight'), Drita ('light', 'illumination'), Gonxhe ('rosebud'; first name of Mother Teresa), Lule ('flower'), Pellumb ('dove'), etc. Indeed, there are some obvious similarities between the supposed Illyrian words (names of persons, places and things) and Albanian ones, such as the name of Illyrian king Bardylis and Albanian word for white, 'bardh', the name of Illyrian king Hyllus and Albanian "(h)yll", for 'star', Illyrian deity Bindo and Albanian 'bind' ('convince', 'make believe')[3], and dozens more.
It also seems linguistically plausible to connect the name of Ardiaei with Latin "Ardea", meaning "Heron"[5]A small town located in the area adjacent to Neretva river (which was precisely the original homeland of ancient Illyrian community of Ardiaei)[6] is called Čapljina, deriving from "Čaplja", which in former Serbo-Croatian language (nowadays divided into Bosnian/Croatian/Montenegrin and Serbian) means precisely "Heron". This theory opens up many possibilities for the interpretation of the origin of this name, such as heron being present in significant numbers in that area since prehistory, and thus influencing the etymology, for example.However, this theory is challanged by the fact that the Ardiaei (although in a different form, Ardiaioi) were mentioned long before Romans conquered Illyrian lands, like, for example by Theopompus in the fourth century B.C., or in reference to their warfare agianst Phillip of Macedon, father of Alexander the Great. Vardiaei, one other variant of Ardiaei bears similarity with Greek word word ‘vardia’, meaning ‘watch/duty/shift’ (‘guard’ implicit), and if we allow for a possibility of Ardiaioi being some corrupt version (misspelling) of 'Vardaei', this may seem as a plausible explanation. [7] However, further research is undoubtedly necessary in order to reach any tangible conclusion.

There are some claims too, that in one of the ancient sources Ardiaioi was actually a mistaken emendation of Autariatae[8]. This is however most likely to mean that the author had mistaken Autariatae for Ardiaioi, rather than implying that they are one and the same people, for the fact that Ardiaioi were mentioned repeatedly and separately from Autariatae in several different ancient sources, as mentioned above. Whatever the case, the fact is that Ardiaioi (the Greek version of Ardiaiei or Vardaei) were mentioned before Romans came to exert any influence, including the lingusitic one among Illyrians. This so far rules out the Latin etymology of Ardiaiei, based on Latin 'ardea', for 'heron'."

All of them were well referenced, as you know. 

I frankly hope we will  manage to find a compromising solution, although, as I said, NONE OF US HERE  see what was wrong with  the above addition that I made.
([[User:Daesitiates|Daesitiates]] ([[User talk:Daesitiates|talk]]) 15:53, 5 February 2010 (UTC))

:How about creating a version of the article at [[User:Daesitiates/Ardian]], complete with references, so it can be discussed there? (Or a suitably named page; I'm not certain which article you are trying to make these edits to.) And remember, this isn't about you and your friends; it's about [[WP:RS|reliable sources]] <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 16:03, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough Frank, I will proceed with that instantly, although I might have to ask for your patientce if I am stuck somewhere in the process for, like I said, I am sure I am much older than many of you  guys here and I may not be as skillfull with Wikipedia. Ok. I will propose my version on that page. 
([[User:Daesitiates|Daesitiates]] ([[User talk:Daesitiates|talk]]) 16:23, 5 February 2010 (UTC)).  <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Daesitiates|Daesitiates]] ([[User talk:Daesitiates|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Daesitiates|contribs]]) 16:20, 5 February 2010 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
::You have never used the talk page for years.And your edits were unconstructive. You removed references among other things.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 16:43, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

megistias. I may have never used talk page, but like I said, I  am decades older than most of you. Trust me, you can al lbe my children.in other  words, i am not as skillful as you kids in wikipedia  and computer skills in general.


"your edits were unconstructive". Excuse me young man, but  isn't this statemen slightly overambitious?  I would be truly grateful if aou enlgihtened me on how my edits were unconstructive.
After all, how constructive is it to  change the text on a national name making it look like a mere political criticism? 

is there any positive word you said about that name in that particular text or anythin positive you said about Albanian culture. Out of so many references to Albanian names (and culture in generaly) you only imposed  the negative one, the one obviously undermining  Albanian culture by calling its names repertoire some communist construct imposed on people. Now, how constructive ( let alone unbiased) is that?

Image me going to some Greek name page and doing what you did on "Ardian"? Now, how fair would you consider that to be? I am sorry to say this, but you more than obviously have some serious unresolved issue in your  attitude towards Albanian culture.

Finaly, I would be grateful if you remind me when  and how I remeove references.  <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Daesitiates|Daesitiates]] ([[User talk:Daesitiates|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Daesitiates|contribs]]) 17:14, 5 February 2010 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
::Please, sign your comments and take some time to read wikipedia rules.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 17:16, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

This discussion is pointless. Let's focus on content moving forward. No need to look at the past; let's just get it right in the present. <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 17:21, 5 February 2010 (UTC)


You're right Frank. I 'm sorry. I just flet I needed to tell the truth, but yes,  let's move ahead now and see what we can do.
I proposed my version on  [[User:Daesitiates/Ardian]] as you advised. I had a little problem though for I couldn't use the references in a normal way so I copied them at the bottom. i hope that's not the problem.  I think what matters is the content.
([[User:Daesitiates|Daesitiates]] ([[User talk:Daesitiates|talk]]) 17:28, 5 February 2010 (UTC)).

:Further comment belongs at [[User talk:Daesitiates/Ardian]]. And remember: [[WP:V|Wikipedia is about verifiability, not truth.]] <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 17:37, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

== Discussion ==

Your comments [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3ADaesitiates%2FArdian&action=historysubmit&diff=342143847&oldid=342129523 here] are '''not helpful''', and I've removed them. The purpose of that page is '''not''' to discuss the main article and whether or not the content is appropriate for the main article. The first things to be worked on are formatting, references, citation, removing original research, and all the basics. If we can't get past all of that, nothing can go into the main article space. 

If you read what I've written thus far, I've been saying let's work in a safe, [[WP:SANDBOX|sandbox]]-type area and get the content up to Wikipedia standards ''first''. After we get there, ''then'' we can talk about achieving some kind of consensus to put it in the article. If you (or anyone) start attacking the talk page of a sandbox work with reasons why the material can't get into a main space article, conflict will surely arise. Let's focus on proper writing, sourcing, and other policies first. Better yet - let ''me'' work on that with him. Thanks! <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 19:52, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
::i wont do anything to the sandbox but i redirected ardian to adrian name page that includes all such names.Clear and cut.Thats where the name derives from. [[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 20:05, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
:::And I have undone that redirect from [[Ardian]]. The article contains content specific to the name ''Ardian''. There may be sourcing issues with the article itself, but that's not a reason to redirect it elsewhere. <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 20:19, 5 February 2010 (UTC)


I hope I am following it up properly. I just  want to say that I finally managed to resolve my referencing problem and I hope  my proposed text at my user page:Daesitiates/Ardiaei is now ready for negotiations.

If I may just kindly ask, are the three of us supposed to negotiate the issue on this page (this one here belonging to megistias), my talk page (Daesitiates) or somewhere else? Please forgive my ignorance. I am ensuring you I am  doing my best  to learn on the go. Thanx for the patience. 

--[[User:Daesitiates|Daesitiates]] ([[User talk:Daesitiates|talk]]) 20:45, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
::Other than Frank gracioucly having the good will to guide you through article editing, and you following... i have to repeat that many of the things you suggest in the sandbox have been proposed by albanian editors over the years on many articles, and they did not go in.They are not encyclopedic, to put it politely.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 20:49, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

::Daesitiates - please stick to [[User:Daesitiates/Ardian|the sandbox]] we are working in. That content is nowhere near ready to be reviewed by anyone for inclusion anywhere else. <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 21:16, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

:Megistias - perhaps you can take a look at [[User talk:Daesitiates/Ardian]] to READ only, please without commenting. I think you'll find we're peeling back the layers a bit and we will eventually be able to get to the content. I don't want to predict how things will turn out, but I hope you will watch as things progress.

:If I may say, your approach doesn't look to be so inspiring either; if you're going to call into question another editor's actions, especially when it's clear you already don't agree...it's usually not going to wind up in a good result. To be specific, it really doesn't help when you tell someone that "many of the things you suggest...have been proposed...and did not go in." This is going to inspire someone to argue, not to work with you to achieve consensus. And I would point out that if there is to be any peaceful editing and avoidance of edit warring, page protection, topic bans, and maybe even blocks, ''both'' sides are going to have to learn to find something to agree on. Consensus isn't about getting someone else blocked or banned. It's about finding something acceptable enough to both sides that they'll both leave it in even if neither thinks it is the 100% "right" way to word it. We certainly still need verifiable citations from reliable sources. That's not in question. But there comes a point where we have to understand that the best result possible may be based on consensus rather than full agreement from every party.

:Hopefully we can start achieving good results all around. <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 03:41, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
::I am not going to comment on the sandbox, but i have yet to find a single reference on which to base a reason to consider Ardian anything else other than a variant of Adrian.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 11:28, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

:::That is not the purpose of that sandbox exercise. The purpose is to understand how to edit, how to find sources, how to write an article, and how to discuss issues. Whether or not Ardian is anything more or less than a variant of Adrian is really quite beside the point. Eventually we will get to that. <small><span style="padding:2px;border:1px solid #000000">[[User:Frank|<span style="color:cyan;background:blue">&nbsp;Frank&nbsp;</span>]]&nbsp;{{!}}&nbsp;[[user_talk:Frank|<span style="color:blue;background:cyan">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span></small> 11:41, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

==Beograd Atlas of 1970==
Since you have been involved in Ilyrian related topics I have recently found these pictures, you might be interested to check: [[http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Albania_kosovo_macedonia_6_8_century.png]] [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Slav-7-8-obrez.png]].[[User:Alexikoua|Alexikoua]] ([[User talk:Alexikoua|talk]]) 20:57, 7 February 2010 (UTC)
::Wow, suddenly albanians appeared 500+ years before they actually did, Byzantine Greeks are gone and non-Greek populations somehow have "absolute homogeny", and have have over all the region.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 22:38, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

==Albanian name==

:Your edits in Albanian (name) are ridiculuous, Arba and Olbonenses have nothing to do with Albanian name. Position of Olbonenses is unkown, some scientists think that Olbonenses were Aluatae - citizens of Alvona, so Olbona would be error in writing or distorted toponym. And both Alvona and Arba were in the north of Liburnia, where Histri, Iapodes and Liburnians were mixing - a region historically and geographically not linked to Albania and Albanians. It is like to say that name of Bangkok came from "bannana". Or from sound produced by John Wayne's gun: "bang". ;P [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 13:43, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
::I know they dont, since you are certain please remove it. [[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 13:46, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
::Olbonenses are not even mentiond in that article. What are you talking about?[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 13:53, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

ha? you're right, sorry. [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 14:06, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Maps... I will, I've already signed myself in Commons, one of these days I'll remove them there and upload a few new ones. At the moment I'm working some other maps too, Dalmatae, Dalmatae Tariotes, Iapodes, Roman Dalmatia, Iron Age burial tradition in the Western Balkans,... [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 14:25, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

== Reverted you in Shkoder ==

[http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Shkod%C3%ABr&action=historysubmit&diff=343389349&oldid=343373916] Please see this revert I made to your contribution to [[Shkoder]]. Hope that's ok. [[user:sulmues]]--Sulmues 18:38, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
::The very next sentence says the same thing, only better.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 19:43, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

== Hyllus ==

Maybe you can help. Except [[Hyllus]] in Greek mythology and [[Hyllus (river)]], there was also '''Hyllus Peninsula''' at the eastern Adriatic coast. See [[Tariotes]]. This toponym was recorded in the ancient Greek sources. Can you find some data, like citations,... [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 09:11, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
::
*Well, i found Pliny,Naturalis Historia,'' Liburniae finis et initium Delmatiae Scardona in amne eo XII passuum a mari. dein Tariotarum antiqua regio et castellum Tariona, promunturium Dio-medis vel, ut alii, '''paeninsula Hyllis''' circuitu C, Tragurium civium Romanorum, marmore notum, Siculi, in quem locum Divus Claudius veteranos misit, Salona colonia ab Iader CXII. petunt in eam iura viribus discriptis in de...'' 
*Nothing yet on ancient greek texts.Will keep on looking.Could it be that an greek mentions this in a latin language text? 
[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 11:37, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

I doubt, I have some sources which mention ancient Greek sources exclusively, in my understanding those from Hellenistic era. Pliny the Elder and other Latin writers knew about this name. However, it seems that in the Greek scholarship there were some unsuccesful attempts to attach this toponym to Pelloponesus or some other peninsula in Greece. I'm thinking about new article: [[Hyllus Peninsula]], so any data would be nice. BTW this is probably from where originally Hylleis arrived to Greece during the Dorian invasion. [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 12:17, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
::Which Hellenistic writers? Maybe they write the name in a slightly different manner, a variance, thats why its no popping up so prominentely.But then there are some writers from that era that are obscure and hard to find. Got any names?[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 12:39, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

What I have is this: [http://hrcak.srce.hr/index.php?show=clanak&id_clanak_jezik=58198], text is in both Croatian and English, check ref note no. 2. [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 12:47, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
::[[Stephanus of Byzantium]] 6th century AD, writes of the myth but adds in the bottom, though part of the text is not saved, "''Υπερ δε τους Υλλους Λιβυρνοι και τινες Ιστροι λεγομενοι Θρακες. Και το θυληκον '''Υλλις προκειτα χερρονησος''' ηλικη. Μαλιστα Πελοποννησος, ως φασι'' …."
*Something like they are above the Liburni, and then of Istri that are called Thracians. And then '''Yllis chersonese''', like a female. In the end he says that it looks like Pelloponesus but then the text is gone no more elaborating. Then he goes on on blah blah.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 12:54, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
::Ok from your link, it says ''"through the middle of the peninsula which Roman sources called Hyllus''" so we know that Latin texts will most likely be using this term for it.And the reference inside it goes "''According to an ancient Greek legend or, more precisely, propaganda, the Hyllus Peninsula was slightly smaller than the Peloponnese and there were 15 cities on it inhabited by barbarized Greek Hyllini, the descendents of Herakles’ son Hyllus (Suić 1955: 132-133; Katičić 1995: 91-98, 387-398; Mastrocinque 1996: 359-361; Čače 1995-96: 21-45).''"
*This is most likely from [[Stephanus of Byzantium]]. The Herakles myth and some non-mythic data that a place with a similar sounding name existed.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 13:01, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
::Ok, the data from your link is Pliny + Stephanus as after the missing text he writes what the pdf-reference writes.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 13:06, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
::Also, the only parallel data from Stephanus seems to come from ''De prosodia catholica'', by Pseudo-[[Aelius Herodianus]] 180-250,. It seems as if Stephanus had copied the exact data that Pseudo-[[Aelius Herodianus]] provided. 
*But i want to verify this more to be certain.[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 13:14, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
::Its the same, Stephanus copied from Herodianus.See also [http://books.google.com/books?id=RtSV5M3BUwIC&pg=PA106&dq=De+prosodia+catholica+stephanus&hl=el&cd=1#v=onepage&q=De%20prosodia%20catholica%20stephanus&f=false From political architecture to Stephanus Byzantius][[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 13:19, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
Tnx :) [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 13:22, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

== Liburnians == 

Megistias what are you doing? After you have completely destroyed almost every Illyrian related article, now you keep on doing your special mission here too? You stupid arrogant little shit!!! Please report me!!!!! [[User:Zenanarh|Zenanarh]] ([[User talk:Zenanarh|talk]]) 07:19, 15 February 2010 (UTC)
:There is no need to report this editor, they have now reported themselves and I have blocked them for a week for disruption. I have no idea what this conflict is all about, but please don't rise to the bait. Thanks. - [[User:Tbsdy lives|Tbsdy]] (formerly [[User:Ta bu shi da yu|Ta bu shi da yu]]) <sup>[[User talk:Tbsdy lives|talk]]</sup> 10:47, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

I will check them the following days. Nice job by the way[[User:Alexikoua|Alexikoua]] ([[User talk:Alexikoua|talk]]) 08:38, 18 February 2010 (UTC)

== Names on 1854 map ==

No problem:  The wanting names on that map are Zidon, Zoar, Arpad, Aram, Arphachsad, Mash, Carchemish, Calneh in the first area. There's one name in Canaan I can't make out, possibly Cheth. The word (Armenians) in parentheses is under Togharma. (Medians) should also be in parentheses. In the Sinai, you've got Ludim, Amalek, Edom, Midian and Sinim. Note that most of these are now thought to have been located outside of the Sinai peninsula. Cheers, [[User:Til Eulenspiegel|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[User talk:Til Eulenspiegel|talk]]) 18:14, 19 February 2010 (UTC)
:Oh yeah, there's another area near the Caspian with the names: Kaspian, Kur R., Araxes R. [[User:Til Eulenspiegel|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[User talk:Til Eulenspiegel|talk]]) 18:23, 19 February 2010 (UTC)


Great job on the map!  I do like the green version, though. Cheers,  [[User:Til Eulenspiegel|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[User talk:Til Eulenspiegel|talk]]) 16:54, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

==Origin of Albanians==

I have continued this debates you began on the Origin of ROmanians talk page with Pannonia. Please feel free to comment [[User:Hxseek|Hxseek]] ([[User talk:Hxseek|talk]]) 22:46, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

:Yep. Its a shame the way Pannonian is carrying on. He accuses me being biased by my personal beliefs on Kosovo, which is rediculous. I think he has taken a personal offence because I agreed with you that his maps are anachronistic, and that his source Atlas of World History is hardly awe-inspiring. I am currently reading ''Epirus Vetus. Archaeology of a Late Antique Province'' by Bowden. I think its a very good piece of work [[User:Hxseek|Hxseek]] ([[User talk:Hxseek|talk]]) 04:52, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

== The purpose of [[WP:AN/I]] ==

Hi. I noticed that you have made a few hasty reports to [[WP:AN/I]] today. Please remember, frivolous complaints and unsubstantiated requests for administrator intervention '''do not belong there'''. Please do not clutter that page with accusations or side-discussions within a discussion. '''Before posting a grievance about a user there, please discuss the issue with them on their user talk page.''' The reports you filed today belonged on a different page, to which the following is a guide:
* To report persistent '''vandalism''' or '''spamming''', see [[Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism|administrator intervention against vandalism]].
* To report '''[[WP:CIVIL|impolite or uncivil communications]]''' with other editors, see [[Wikipedia:Wikiquette alerts|wikiquette alerts]].
* To report improper '''deletion''' or request '''undeletion''', see [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]].
* To report improper '''usernames''', see [[Wikipedia:Usernames for administrator attention|usernames for administrator attention]].
* To request '''page [[WP:PROT|protection]]''', see [[WP:RFP|requests for page protection]].
* To report '''edit warring''', see [[Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring|the administrators' edit warring noticeboard]].
* To report '''long time edit warring/abuse''', see [[Wikipedia:Long term abuse|Long term abuse]].
* To report '''suspected sockpuppetry''', see [[Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations|Sockpuppet investigations]].
* To start a '''[[Wikipedia:Banning policy|ban discussion]]''', see the [[Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard|administrators' noticeboard]].
* For evasion of '''[[Wikipedia:Blocking policy|blocks]]''', abuse of '''[[Wikipedia:Administrators|admin tools]]''', or other '''incidents''', see [[Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents]] ('''[[WP:ANI]]''')
* To request permanent '''[[Wikipedia:Revision hiding|deletion]] of dangerous personal information''', see [[Wikipedia:Requests for oversight|requests for oversight]]. '''<span style="color:red">DO NOT</span> make such requests at [[WP:AN/I]]; reports there are visible to everyone.'''
* To get assistance in resolving disputes, please see '''[[Wikipedia:Dispute resolution|dispute resolution]]'''.
Please ensure that if you file a report at any of those pages that you both '''read and follow all instructions''' listed in the respective header, as different noticeboards can have different requirements. Also, please observe that you '''must notify''' any user(s) about which you initiate a discussion [[WP:AN/I]]. You may use place {{tlsx|ANI-notice}} on their user talk page to do so. Thank you. [[User:Ioeth|Ioeth]] <small>([[User_talk:Ioeth|talk]] [[Special:Contributions/Ioeth|contribs]] [[WP:TW|twinkle]] [[WP:FRIEND|friendly]])</small> 22:46, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

::Thats alot of stuff :)[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 00:46, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
:::Yup! But super handy. It's always good to know where you can go to get the quickest, most effective resolution. Cheers! [[User:Ioeth|Ioeth]] <small>([[User_talk:Ioeth|talk]] [[Special:Contributions/Ioeth|contribs]] [[WP:TW|twinkle]] [[WP:FRIEND|friendly]])</small> 02:29, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

== [[Pashalik of Yanina]] ==

Please do not continue reverting back and forth; rather, discuss this civilly on the talk page of that article.  Thank you. [[User talk:Fox|<font style="color:#000000;">&nbsp;'''''f&nbsp;o&nbsp;x'''''&nbsp;</font>]] <small>''<font style="color:#AAAAAA">(formerly garden)''</font></small> 12:00, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

::I have, [[Talk:Pashalik_of_Yanina]] , [[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 12:11, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

== You have a response in my talk page. ==

Regards. --[[user:sulmues|sulmues]] ([[user talk:sulmues|talk]])  20:07, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

== Your request at RPP ==

Hi there! Just to let yuo know, I've declined your protection request for now, you can find my reasons at [[WP:RPP]]. 

Just to let you know, for future reference, that you should put new requests at the top of the list, as that's where admins will look for it. When the list is short like it is today, it doesn't make much difference, but it can sometimes get to 20 or more requests waiting action, and ones at the bottom may well get missed. Cheers! [[User:Ged UK|<font color="green">Ged</font>]][[User talk:Ged UK|<font color="orange">'''''UK'''''</font>&nbsp;]] 12:31, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

::Thankou[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 13:46, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

== Albania TF ==

Could you please respond [[Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Albania/Members#New_member|here]]? --[[user:sulmues|sulmues]] ([[user talk:sulmues|talk]])  23:43, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

::No, after this insult of yours [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3AReliable_sources%2FNoticeboard&action=historysubmit&diff=344698953&oldid=344697715 diff], of course not :) [[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 23:52, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

:::It's not about me! You deserve to stand there, because you have written all the Albanian related articles. --[[user:sulmues|sulmues]] ([[user talk:sulmues|talk]])  01:33, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

::::And please display this {{Veteran Editor II Userbox}} as you are a Grand Tutnum now. You deserve it! --[[user:sulmues|sulmues]] ([[user talk:sulmues|talk]])  06:00, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

== March 2010 ==
<div class="user-block"> [[File:Stop x nuvola with clock.svg|40px|left]] You have been '''[[Wikipedia:Blocking policy|blocked]]''' from editing for a period of '''24 hours''' for '''[[WP:EDITWAR|edit warring]] on [[Vjosë]], [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Vjos%C3%AB&diff=347924252&oldid=347923101], [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Vjos%C3%AB&diff=347954960&oldid=347954584], [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Vjos%C3%AB&diff=348074422&oldid=348056426], [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Vjos%C3%AB&diff=348075813&oldid=348074422]'''. Please stop. You are welcome to [[Wikipedia:Five pillars|make ''useful'' contributions]] after the block expires. If you believe this block is unjustified you may [[Wikipedia:Appealing a block|contest this block]] by adding the text <!-- Copy the text as it appears on your page, not as it appears in this edit area. Do not include the "tlx" argument. -->{{tlx|unblock|Your reason here}} below, but you should read our [[Wikipedia:Guide to appealing blocks|guide to appealing blocks]] first. [[User:Tiptoety|<span style="color:#4E562C;font-weight:bold">Tiptoety</span>]] <sup>[[User talk:Tiptoety|<span style="color:#FFDB58">talk</span>]]</sup> 10:55, 6 March 2010 (UTC)</div><!-- Template:uw-block2 -->
{{unblock reviewed|1=See the article talk page|decline="See talk page" does not address the reason for your block.  This incident was originally raised at [[WP:ANI]] and then moved to [[WP:3RR]] for action.  [[WP:EW]] is clear in this regard, and protection of thr article for only 24 hrs is a minimum requirement at this time ([[User talk:Bwilkins|<font style="font-variant:small-caps">talk→</font>]]<span style="border:1px solid black;">'''&nbsp;[[User:Bwilkins|BWilkins]]&nbsp;'''</span>[[Special:Contributions/Bwilkins|<font style="font-variant:small-caps">←track</font>]]) 12:12, 6 March 2010 (UTC)}}
{{unblock reviewed|1=That was raised at originally raised at WP:ANI by me and then to be moved to WP:3RR for action for '''User Sulmues''', by me, not for me.|decline=I am declining your request for unblock because it does not address the reason for your block, or because it is inadequate for other reasons. To be unblocked, you must convince the reviewing administrator(s) that 
*the block is not necessary to prevent damage or disruption to Wikipedia, <u>or</u>
*the block is no longer necessary because you
**understand what you have been blocked for,
**will not continue to cause damage or disruption, and
**will make useful contributions instead.

Please read our [[Wikipedia:Guide to appealing blocks|guide to appealing blocks]] for more information. You were blocked for edit warring, it doesn't matter who reported who, you were edit warring. [[User:Kingpin13|Kingpin]]<sup>[[Special:Contributions/Kingpin13|13]]</sup> ([[User talk:Kingpin13|talk]]) 12:41, 6 March 2010 (UTC)}}

{{unblock reviewed|1=Sorry i forgot myself and changed the article within too little time. But the talk page was used and still is on the issue.|decline=It's good that you've acknowledged your edit warring; please sit out the rest of your block and contribute constructively when you return. [[User:GlassCobra|<font color="002bb8">Glass</font>]]'''[[User talk:GlassCobra|<font color="002bb8">Cobra</font>]]''' 14:28, 6 March 2010 (UTC)}}

== Himara and Vasil Bollano== 

I am going to ask for a neutral person to settle this. You must work for the Greek government to have all the time in the world to revert to nonsense. '''I posted their names from the 16th century and you remove them? Why?''' How are they not relevant?
[[User:Keep it Fake|Keep it Fake]] ([[User talk:Keep it Fake|talk]]) 17:34, 7 March 2010 (UTC)


::Yes ask a neutral person, thats a good solution. Just dont remove sources. The rest of your accusation or claim against me is .....[[User:Megistias|Megistias]] ([[User talk:Megistias#top|talk]]) 17:36, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

== Vjosa common female name in Albanian: source is edit-warred ==

Hi there! You might want to be interested in seeing [[Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard#Vjosa_common_female_name_in_Albanian:_source_is_edit-warred|this]], because you are involved. --[[user:sulmues|sulmues]] ([[user talk:sulmues|talk]])  11:00, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

== Result of the 3RR case ==

Please see the result of [[WP:AN3#User:PANONIAN reported by User:Megistias (Result: Both warned)]], a 3RR case which you filed about the [[Dardani]] article. Both you and PANONIAN are edit warring. Try to get an outside view before you revert again. Sanctions are possible otherwise. [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 01:36, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

== Rv you ==

I reverted you on [[Zana e malit]]. You claim too much there without any sources. --[[user:sulmues|sulmues]] ([[user talk:sulmues|talk]])  11:54, 16 March 2010 (UTC)


== Albanian nationalism ==
Did you revert me as IP on that article?--<span style="background-color: maroon; color: white">[[User:ZjarriRrethues|<font color="white">'''—&nbsp;''ZjarriRrethues''&nbsp;—'''</font>]]</span>&nbsp;<sup>[[User_talk:ZjarriRrethues|talk]]</sup> 11:15, 18 March 2010 (UTC)