User talk:Baristarim/Archive 7

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Comments

Alanya

Thanks for the encouragement! One section I would like to add to complete the package would be Politics. Except for my meetings with the mayor and once with the state appointed governor, I know little about local politics. Do you know of any sites that have election data or maps for the region? Preferably in English? Otherwise my only concern with the article is citation, since many observations are not verifiable. --Patrickneil 17:44, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

The Phrygian issues

Look up http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mushku To find more about Phrygians and Mushku or Mushki(Mushkitsi) These are Georgian tribes, they have nothing to do with our history. We are never remembered by the name Phrygians, but yet we are rememberd by Nairi etc etc. Greeks say there is no link with Assyrians referring to Phyrgians as Mushki, yet Moshchoi which Greeks use is Georgian tribes. We have always called ourselves with the name Armen. The most common Armenian name. A nationality just doesnt forget its name, or change names sometime in their history, it doesnt work that way. Ararat arev 18:28, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

I put in the Talk:Armenia page, the discussion. Ararat arev 18:49, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

VP

Nope, VandalProof looks up your username not your IP address, and DHCP wouldn't renew your IP during a login so it's not a dropped connection. Every once in awhile someone has your problem, try contacting User:AmiDaniel about it, he's the one who wrote the program --froth^{T C} 19:34, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

User:Greatmuslim blocked

Hi. Since you were the first to welcome Greatmuslim I thought I'd let you know as a matter of courtesy that I've blocked him for 24 hours for repeatedly posting attack (and possibly libellous) stuff on Adnan Oktar despite several warnings on his talkpage by yourself and others not to do so. I hope he'll take the time to read the useful links in the welcome message you posted and come back as a more productive editor! Regards, Tonywalton  | Talk 21:43, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Hey

I've been doing pretty good. Congrats on Turkey becomming an FA!! :-) Khoikhoi 06:08, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Terrorism

Sure, I'll look into it when I have the time. Right now I'm starting to get more and more busy in real life... Khoikhoi 06:14, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Tebrikler, Teşekkürler

Merhabalar. kusura bakma daha önce cevap veremedim. iki haftadır internete erişimim çok rahat değildi.

Turkey article'ının FA'sı için tebrikler! Gerçi çok takip edemedim gelişimini ama anladığım kadarıyla buna en büyük pay sana ait.

Armenian Genocide'ın talk'u da o gün bir anda alevlendi hakikaten. hala da sönmemiş anladığım kadarıyla :) Umarım kıvılcımı çakan ben olmamışımdır, zira tam aksiydi amacım. Ortamı biraz yumuşatabilirim sanmıştım ama sanırım kabul etmem lazım ki her iki tarafta da bu konu hakkında sabit fikirli olan çok. yine de bana yardımcı olduğun için (özellikle hukuk bilginle) çok teşekkür ediyorum.

Wikipedia'ya da yeni başladım evet ama henüz biraz pasif kalıp gözlemlemeyi tercih edeceğim. Sanırım işler ekşi sözlük'te alışık olduğum şekilde yürümüyor ;) Bir de belki sonra Türkçesine katkı yapmayı da tercih edebilirim. zira galiba orada daha çok yardıma ihtiyaç var.

Sana da Türkiye hakkında yaptığın katkılar için gönüllerin barnstar'ını veriyorum :)O da şimdilik benim gibi bir çömez için gerçeğini vermek ne kadar doğru olurdu bilmediğimden :)

Görüşmek üzere;Ombudsee 09:32, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Rica Ediyorum, Atatürk High School of Science, Istanbul DEGIL dogrusu Ataturk High School of Science, Istanbul

Tekrar ediyorum. Bu sekilde davranmaya devam ederseniz sikayet yoluna gidecegim. Onganer 14:06, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

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Persian Gulf

Please be cautious of your edits at Persian Gulf as I see you have made several reverts to the article recently. If you persist with excessive reversions and disruptive editing, you may be blocked either for WP:3RR or simply disruption. Discuss matters on Talk:Persian Gulf rather than reverting the work of others on sight. -- tariqabjotu 16:11, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Re:Selam

Hi, thanks for your offer about Portal:Turkey. It would be great if you could help me with the "Anniversaries" section. Its link will be like Portal:Turkey/Anniversaries/January for this month. Also "Did you know" and "News" sections need to be updated. I presume you already know the test page Portal:Turkey/Test as you worked on it two days ago.So, size de mutlu yıllar ve kolay gelsin. By the way, congratulations about the Turkey article, another FA for our project --Bugtrio | Talk 16:42, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Persian/Arabian Gulf

Thank you for your input regarding that article. We really need neutral users there. Please have a look here :[1] Jidan 19:57, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Sezer says relax

Here is something to relax to then... [[2]] [[3]] Politis 21:25, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Adnan Oktar article

I'm thinking about going to make a review about that other guy contribution. To filter it, unbias it and seek reliable sources (like that source wich confirm the blackmailing [4]) so we can get rid of that guy and perhaps rid of the npov assessment. But I must admit that Islam scholar are not my favorite field of interest ^_^, so could you help me for that task ? Oh btw, don't forget the 3RR. This is not vandalism, this is npov, and so you are subject of this rule ;) . -- Esurnir 22:31, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Recent edit wars and a request

I dont know what the edit war is all about, but I hope you two can find a compremist. I was wondering if you could translate this Turkish page please - tr:Coşkun Sabah. Thank you. Chaldean 03:34, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Kebab

Hi, shall we write "Kebabs in Turkey" or "Kebabs of Turkey", which one would be suitable? Görüşürüz, Chapultepec 10:59, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

This is called Dispute Resolution NOT Vandalism

Baris, you are changing an article without the originator's consent. You have started the vandalism. I shall be taking action against your acts. Please next time take consent of the originator of an article before doing changes. It is you who isn't reading the discussions. Onganer 13:45, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Please write you argument on the talk page of "Ataturk High School of Science, Istanbul" Onganer 14:07, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Go ahead and take action - see WP:OWN by the way, nobody has to ask your permission. Maybe you should consider creating your own website if you want to be in full control. Cheers! Baristarim 14:18, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Response to question

Basically, I should indicate that I am less interested in actually trying to collect trophies as I am in the possibility of seeing as many articles as possible assessed (which can pretty much be only done through projects) and in trying to help editors who might share similar interests to be able to work together in what is maybe a slightly broader number of articles than they might work on otherwise. Honestly, this could be done just as easily through work groups or tasks forces of other existing projects, as through separate groups. Also, having groups dedicated to given topics also at least potentially allows for greater opportunties for other functions, like peer review, collaboration, and even portals. Granted, the OO project could work just as well as a group within the existing Christianity project, and I personally would be more than amenable in seeing a work group/task force for Oriental Orthodoxy created within that project. Also, as the person who probably did the most to assemble the existing Project Directory, I am probably aware of more areas which are not covered by any existing project than others, and I would ultimately like to see every article we have have at least one project interested in it. I'm not sure if this answers your question, but it is the best answer I have. Thank you for your attention and your polite inquiry. Badbilltucker 14:48, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Fatih at night

Hallo, my Source is nothing less than the commander of the police station of Fatih, located in Fevzi Pascia Caddesi. I have been robbed in the quarter - near Isa Feneri Camii - last week, on the second day of Bayram. The officer told me that they received me only because I am a foreigner. According to him, in the quarter live about 12,000 criminals (The process of recognizing someone by means of pictures of known criminals living in Fatih and archived on the police intranet lasted almost two hours...) . According to him the day before my aggression a couple (she was a foreign tourist, he was a turkish friend) has been attacked and robbed in the evening near Zeyrek Camii. The police officer concluded that he would never walk alone in the streets of the quarter at night. I wrote this remark just because I think that could be useful for other tourists that go to Fatih. Kind regards,

Alex2006 16:58, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

OK, thanks! Anyway, also with these problems, Istanbul remains a beautiful city ;-)

Ciao, Alex2006 14:44, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Congratulations

Congratulations for Turkey's FA! I know this is almost entirely your achievement. Therefore,

		The Barnstar of National Merit
		I, Yannismarou award you the Barnstar of National Merit for your efforts to bring Turkey to FA status, your contributions to articles about Turkish history and your launching of the Wikipedia:Greek and Turkish wikipedians cooperation board.--Yannismarou 10:44, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Minority Report

I had told you Von Ryan:) [5]. O konu wikipedia'da bir ansiklopedi maddesi haline gelemez. Sıkar! Gel de küfret! :) Cretanforever 00:32, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Turkish bow

Would you be able to have a look at the Turkish bow article and update a few pictures? also possibly add more information if it is in your interest? Thanks :)

Thanks For The Revert

Thank you for the quick revert on my talk page....In actuallity I chuckled when I saw the tag. Shoessss 15:42, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Again

You don't use revert scripts in editing disputes (such as this), it's rude. Normally I revert such edits whoever makes them, but I wont this time because because you'll probably start yelling "POINT ... POINT ... WIKISTALKING ... WIKISTALKING" :) //Dirak 15:19, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Can you keep an eye out?

Hi, sorry to bug you about this, but Hagop Kazazian Pasha will be on the next DYK -- hence be on the main page. Can you keep an eye out for vandalism, etc that may occur? Thx! --Free smyrnan 16:04, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Baristarim

This is very true, but this wrestlying bears many similarities to greek wrestling practiced throughout byzantine times. Turks like to claim the cultural similarities between greeks and turks are due to turkish cultural assimalation of the greeks, however for the most part it is largely because of turkish appropriation of byzantine culture. i mean this in no offensive way, it is simply a statement of fact that the cultural similarities began not after 1453, but in 1071 after turks became more 'byzantinized' after capturing major anatolian seats of grecobyzantine culture.

There is certainly a synthesis of cultures, this is something that i have propounded, not ridiculed any nation for. The Romans made an art out of copying other cultures and it got them the greatest empire in world history. However, there seems to be a tendency among many nationalist turks to attribute anything that seems byzantine to a conjectural 'turkic' culture. The tanbur is clearly a mix of greek and persian stringed instruments for example, yet many turks claim that it existed prior to their invasions of persia and byzantium. <small>(Personal attack removed)</small> regards. nikos.

Are you enjoying your conversation with GreekWarrior? :-) Khoikhoi 19:11, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Just trying to be nice :) Baristarim 19:14, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

IMO, it's hard to be nice to people that say things like this... Khoikhoi 19:20, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Sources

Both of those are from book summaries, which means they are in the book. Do not remove sourced information. See Wikipedia NPOV.Azerbaijani 19:19, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Please read the articles closely and do not do blind reverts :) I put a lot of effort into finding sources and writing that article's intro. The ones that you called sourced information are not so actually. The other refs in the intro are actual books on architecture with visible pages. The ones provided by anon are one of them from a web forum, the other one from a book description - I read very carefully every source provided and write them carefully. If you have any other concerns about the specifics of the article, you can leave me a note. Ottoman architecture was influenced primarily by Byzantine architecture, and Mimar Sinan, originally a Orthodox convert to Islam made a great synthesis of the Islamic Mamluk and Byzantine styles. Seljuk styles was never predominant after the 14th century. In any case, the influence of Persian styles can be extensively talked about in the article of Seljuk architecture. If you ever come to Istanbul, you would see what I mean :) Cheers! Baristarim 18:45, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Your argument makes no sense. Those are sources from BOOKS. See Wikipedia NPOV. You cannot decide what is and what is not a source. Those are from books too, I do not have to buy the book just so I can use it as a source. Both of those sources come from books. Would you like me to talk to admins about your POV push? Obviously, you cannot possible believe you can get away with dictating what a source is and what is as source is not, especially when you yourself say that books are sources. I dont want to have to deal with an edit war, so I will not hesitate to report our POV push and disruptive reverting.Azerbaijani 19:29, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Listen, did you even read what I just wrote above? Why are you insisting that Persian is placed in front of Byzantine? Do you have any idea what Ottoman architecture was? Have you ever seen Sinan's works? One of the source is from a forum, the other one is a book summary. This has nothing to do with NPOV, it has to do with academic correctness. Seljuk styles were influenced by Persian architecture, and Seljuk architecture was the basis for Ottoman architecture until 1453. What about 1453-1922? It was Byzantine and Mamluk influence (after the transfer of the Caliphate to Ottoman dynasty). Baristarim 19:29, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Have you checked the other refs? They clearly state that the Byzantine influence was the greatest, the whole pages from the books are visible directly. Other sources I cited are precise, those ones are a) one from a web forum, b) a book summary not written by an academic. Please see the other refs. You can talk to any admin you would like. I provided seven serious refs for that intro, there is no POV push. Please be civil and don't accuse anyone in that manner. I am simply trying to make the article more academic in good faith. Please see the difference between Persian influence on Seljuk architecture and the extent of Seljuk influence on Ottoman architecture. Have you seen Ottoman buildings at all? Please be reasonable. Baristarim 19:34, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

What "POV push"? I spent a lot of time looking for those refs and rewriting the intro. Please be civil. Baristarim 19:36, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

POV push because you are taking out sourced info which clearly by your tone, is apparent that you do not like.Azerbaijani 19:37, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Why? Other books clearly specify that the main influence was Byzantine with Islamic Mamluk influences that was built on Seljuk traditions after 1453, and those books are visible for all to see with their specific pages visible via Google Books. I am only reverting because one of them is from a forum the other a book description, and contradict the content of the six other references listed. That's all. Believe me, there is no POV pushing, WP:AGF. Baristarim 19:45, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Influences are influences, it doesnt matter how small or book. Book sources are book sources.

It matter because for academic precision. If the main influence was Byzantine and to a lesser degree Islamic Mamluk, then that means there is no logic to putting something else before those two. Those are not book sources: one of them is from a post in a forum, the other one a book summary - the other sources listed are the words of actual academics who have written on the specific subject, and there are six of them. Playing with the order is the real POV pushing since it goes against established academic concensus. That's all. Please show me one major Ottoman artefact that wasn't primarily influenced by Byzantine or Mamluk elements, see Blue Mosque and Dolmabahce Palace and Ciragan Palace, the masterpieces of Ottomans, for example. Keep in mind that this is not the article about the Seljuk architecture, it is about Ottoman architecture. They had different styles. Baristarim 20:11, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

What are you talking about? Islamic architecture was Iranian architecture. The Islamic Armies adopted old Sassanid architecture, and that later became known as Islamic architecture. Iranian architecture was used in Anatolia and the Caucasus alongside Byzantine architecture before the area even became Turkified. Not only did the Ottoman's used Islamic Persian architecture, but they also used Byzantine architecture, which itself had some Persian influences.Azerbaijani 20:16, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Another request

Barış, can you please keep an eye on Lapithos? Thanks, Khoikhoi 23:00, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

embargo

I think that we should include the reason why Turkey is not opening its ports to the RoC: because it refuses to lift the embargo against TRNC / Northern Cyprus. Any ideas? I can do it, or you, or we can leave it out. No problem. The longer reason is that after the 2004 referendum the EU had given assurances to the TC people that their isolation would end; the TC voted for, but the EU failed to keep its commitment. Politis 23:43, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Aegean Sea

Duh, I wanted to do that before you did. Who will take the honours to TfD it as well? NikoSilver 00:09, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Lol.. I can do it if you want, however I will wait a bit if you would like to go ahead :) Baristarim 00:16, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

By the way. Can you take a look at Greeks? An anon deleted some stuff, I reverted once but I wasn't sure what was going on since I don't know the subject well, I left a note to Politis too. I didn't want to revert legitimate edits, but the anon wasn't leaving any edit summaries. Cheers! Baristarim 00:19, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Go ahead and TfD it yourself, I guess we need a joint Greko-Turkish template vote flunking anyway.

Oh, and I wouldn't worry so much about Greece... The WIKIPEDIAN CHAUVINIST JUNTA is constantly monitoring that article! NikoSilver 00:35, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Turkey FA summary

Hi, I was just about to sleep actually. And please let me apologize if it was a bit rude to just point out the issue and do nothing with the paragraph, like I was expecting you to do everything. I really think you would be more comfortable doing that, after all, you know every piece and corner of the article. I don't mind at all if you start modifying it because I trust your writing skills and I will try to help along. Iyi geceler, Atilim Gunes Baydin 04:59, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to find and read the main page summaries of all previous FA country articles. As a reminder, I have a problem with the mention of Middle East, note that it's not even referred to in the actual article save the relations with Israel, and I'm not sure if the country's being populous should be something to focus on (be it at the very beginning, or any place at all), when I read that, it's a bit like there is nothing much interesting about the country. I mean, putting more emphasis on Turkey's unique characteristics could be more "catchy" to get people to read the rest of the article. And I really believe mentioning the process of EU membership negotiations is a must for this summary. Just sharing my thoughts. :) I'll try to help. Atilim Gunes Baydin 05:30, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Football AID 14 Jan - 21 Jan

Thank you for participating in the Football AID vote this week.

Turkcell Super League has been selected as this week's collaboration. Please do help in working to improve it.

WikiProject France

Hello! We are a group of editors working to improve the quality of France related articles. You look like someone who might be interested in joining us in the France WikiProject and so I thought I'd drop you a line and invite you! We'd love to have you in our project :-) STTW (talk) 16:24, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Turkification

Hi Baris. To be honest, i did not read the whole discussion, but i have been following some parts of it the past days, and at that time, i checked only the diff link; u quoted a PA for the revert, but i did not see any. Not that the language Tajik uses is the best possible to reach agreements and solutions, but i do believe that he does have a point. what he said about the former Turkish Minister of Culture shocked me, and if true, it surely has a place somewhere in Wikipedia. Maybe not in that article, though... Khoikhoi had proposed a different term to be used for assimilation by Turkic peoples, as a whole, different than the term "Turkification". I will post a comment in that article's talk, explaining further. PS: i have that article in my watchlist since long ago (when the articles about -ication began to appear like mushrooms) and i tried not to get involved in the past. Hope i will help to settle disputes down now:) Regards Hectorian 16:54, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Turkification 2

Ugh. It looks like I'd be jumping into a snake pit if I got involved; maybe you can just explain to me on my talk page what the problem is? Is there any way it can be resolved? You might try contacting Francis Tyers about it—he's the one who created the article, and he's also an excellent mediator. Khoikhoi 05:14, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Sorry to butt in. Allow me to disagree about Francis Tyers being a good mediator. In my experience, his involvement generates constant and unecessary compliations that lead to antagonisms. His abscence seems like a blessing: things are sorted out. For instance, Greek-Turkish points of contention tend to find common ground or people can agree to disagree. No offence intended to anyone holding an opposite imperssion. Politis 12:59, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Edit warring

You have been blocked for edit warring at Turkification. You are clearly aware of 3RR and our policies against edit warring, based on your recent comments, so you know that repeatedly reverting 3 times in a day is the same. You have 6-7 reverts in the one article on just Jan. 12 and 14. Please use only civil discussion to resolve any editing conflicts. Dmcdevit·t 05:51, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Fair enough.. It is true that the tag-war got out of hand. I apologize if it caused any disruption. Baristarim 08:30, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

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