View source for Talk:Examples of feudalism

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==France in examples==

Why isn't France in the examples of feudalism? France was one of the core areas where feudalism originated and developed. Strange, I think. [[User:Cun|cun]] 20:11, 19 September 2005 (UTC)

:The article is not a country by country "list-of", Feudal arrangements existed in France (and many other places in Europe) -- the article is examples of how feudalism was practiced in certain places at certain times (11th c france was different from 13th c france). If you have information concerning France, at particular places and times, please do add for illustrative purposes. [[User:Stbalbach|Stbalbach]] 00:21, 20 September 2005 (UTC)

==Tibet==

The section on Tibet is clearly biased. Never has it been confirmed from a non-Chinese documented source that the majority of Tibetans were serfs. In fact, it makes claims that these serfs lived in harsh conditions without backing it up. The way I understand it, the majority of serfs were criminals or owed a debt. I wouldn't be surprised if whoever wrote this was a supporter of the PRC.
:In any case serfs and peasants are common in feudal societies - and may be indentured citizens of another country, so it would be unsurprising considering chinese dominence of that region in the medieval period that they inslaved tibetians. So that doesn't mean that all tibetians were serfs but that their social circumstances may have forced them into becoming so. Hard to find primary evidence on this, but until contrary evidence is provided the article should be left as is.

== American South ==

To quote the article [[Feudalism]]: "However, some have taken the feudalism analogy further, seeing it in places as diverse as Ancient Egypt, Parthian empire, India, to the American South of the nineteenth century."
I don't think this article really refers to Egypt of the American South, does anyone have information on that?--[[Special:Contributions/69.234.177.129|69.234.177.129]] ([[User talk:69.234.177.129|talk]]) 15:27, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

== Copied from [[Feudalism]] ==

Below text copied from [[Feudalism]] for the moment, and will incorporate it here or at [[Feudalism in England]]. [[User:Green Cardamom|Green Cardamom]] ([[User talk:Green Cardamom|talk]]) 00:46, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

:It it important to understand that there was only one absolute "owner" of land in the feudal system, in the person of the king asserting his [[allodial right]]. All nobles, knights and other tenants merely "held" land from the king, who was thus at the top of the "feudal pyramid", under conditional feudal contract of tenure, generally with the option to make such holding hereditable on payment by an heir of a suitable [[feudal relief]]. Thus a [[tenant-in-chief]](generally in the form of a [[English feudal barony|baron]] or knight)   was a vassal of the king, and a [[mesne|mesne tenant]] (generally a knight, sometimes a baron, including tenants-in-chief in their capacity as holders of other fiefs) held when [[subinfeudation|sub-enfeoffed]] by the tenant-in-chief.

 ==Varieties of feudal tenure in England in about the 12th century==
Under the feudal system several different forms of [[land tenure]] existed, each effectively a contract with differing rights and duties attached thereto. The main varieties are as follows:

 ===Military tenure===
*'''by [[English feudal barony|barony]]''' (''per baroniam''). Such tenure constituted the holder a [[English feudal barony|feudal baron]], and was the highest degree of tenure. It imposed duties of military service and allowed, indeed required,  attendance at [[parliament]]. All such holders were necessarily [[tenants-in-chief]].
*'''by [[knight-service]]'''. This was a tenure ranking below barony, and was likewise for military service, of a lesser extent. It could be held ''[[tenant-in-chief|in capite]]'' from the king or as a ''[[mesne]]'' tenancy from a tenant-in-chief.
*'''by [[castle-guard]]'''. This was a form of military service which involved guarding a nearby castle for a specified number of days per year.

 ===Non-military tenure===
*'''by [[serjeanty]]'''. Such tenure was in return for acting as a servant to the king, in a non-military capacity. Service in a ceremonial form is termed “grand serjeanty” whilst that of a more functional or menial nature is termed “petty sergeanty”.
*'''by [[Frankalmoin|frankalmoinage]]''', generally a tenure restricted to clerics.
*'''by [[scutage]]''' where the military service obligations had been commuted, or replaced, by money payments. Common during the decline of the feudal era and symbolic of the change from tenure by personal service to tenure for money rent.
*'''by [[copyhold]]''', where the duties and rights were tailored to the requirements of the [[lord of the manor]] and a copy of the terms agreed was entered on the  roll of the manorial court as a record of such non-standard terms.
*'''by [[socage]]'''. This was the lowest form of tenure, involving payment in produce or in money.

Feudalism developed in 9th C. France, flourished (in England) up to about the first quarter of the 14th.c.<ref>Writs of Summons for the last general feudal levy of the English kingdom were issued in 1385, per Sanders, I.J., English Baronies, A Study of their Origin & Descent, 1086-1327, Oxford, 1960, preface, p. vii </ref> and declined until their legal abolition in England at least in 1660, with the [[Tenures Abolition Act 1660|Tenures Abolition Act]].

The term is  derived from the mediaeval Latin word ''feodum'', meaning simply an [[Estate (law)|Estate in land]] , but deriving from a more ancient Gothic source ''faihu'' signifying simply "property" which in its most basic sense was "cattle". <ref>Encyclopaedia Brittannica, 9th.ed. vol. 9, p.119, Feudalism. c.f. the Latin word ''pecunia'', money which also means cattle.</ref>

{{reflist-talk}}

==Idea for definition of feudalism==

"Feudalism is any system of granting land in exchange for services, in a manner that binds people to socially stratified real property and work for a lengthy period of time." How does that sound?  &mdash;  [[User:Rickyrab|Rickyrab]]. <sup>[[User talk:Rickyrab|Yada yada yada]]</sup> 16:52, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

:You'll need reliable sourcing for that. But otherwise it sounds not unreasonable. --[[User:OpenFuture|OpenFuture]] ([[User talk:OpenFuture|talk]]) 05:44, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

== Unclear sentence ==

"As separate lords did not command their own troops to protect their own lands."  This sentence seems incomplete grammatically.  I am not sure what the intended meaning is. [[User:Septimus.stevens|Septimus.stevens]] ([[User talk:Septimus.stevens|talk]]) 18:15, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

== Manga under "See also" ==
I wonder why under the "See also" heading, there are links to Manga pages? [[User:Dbrukman|Dbrukman]] ([[User talk:Dbrukman|talk]]) 20:02, 30 October 2021 (UTC)