View source for Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2019 November 4

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=== November 4 ===
<!-- Please do not add new nominations here.
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==== Category:Indian religions portals ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''dual upmerge'''. <small>[[Wikipedia:NACD|(non-admin closure)]]</small> [[User:DannyS712|DannyS712]] ([[User talk:DannyS712|talk]]) 09:16, 12 November 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose merging''' [[:Category:Indian religions portals]] to [[:Category:India portals]] and [[:Category:Religion portals]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' [[WP:SMALLCAT]].  After several deletions of related portals, this category now contains only one item: [[:Category:Hinduism portal]]. [[User:BrownHairedGirl|<span style="font-variant:small-caps"><span style="color:#663200;">Brown</span>HairedGirl</span>]] <small>[[User talk:BrownHairedGirl|(talk)]] • ([[Special:Contributions/BrownHairedGirl|contribs]])</small> 18:39, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
* Merge, delete, whatever; ports are useless! [[User:Joshua Jonathan|<span style="font-family:Forte;color:black">Joshua Jonathan</span>]] -[[User talk:Joshua Jonathan|<span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;color:black">Let's talk!</span>]] 19:56, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
* '''Support''' per nom. Note that it is irrelevant for this discussion whether portals are useful or not. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 21:52, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' - I tried to think what else might populate this - possibly Jainism or the Parsees' religion, but they would be much better simply under religion, quite apart from the question of whether these would need a portal.  [[User:Peterkingiron|Peterkingiron]] ([[User talk:Peterkingiron|talk]]) 15:28, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Horror rock ====
[[File:Symbol move vote.svg|16px|link=|alt=]] '''Relisted''', see [[Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2019 November 15%23Category:Horror rock]]<!-- Template:Cfd relisted -->

==== Category:Digital newspapers ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''merge'''. <small>[[Wikipedia:NACD|(non-admin closure)]]</small> [[User:DannyS712|DannyS712]] ([[User talk:DannyS712|talk]]) 09:17, 12 November 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose merging''' [[:Category:Digital newspapers]] to [[:Category:News websites]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' No meaningful distinction between the two.  The definition offered is: "Newspapers which are available digitally (either downloadable or browsable online), format similar to the print version." Quite a lot dont have a print version, if they ever had one, and even if they do there is nothing in the articles I've seen to suggest that the format is similar to the print version.   If this is agreed then there are subcategories to follow. [[User:Rathfelder|Rathfelder]] ([[User talk:Rathfelder|talk]]) 10:30, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
* '''Support''', I checked a number of articles in the subcategories and they were news websites indeed. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 21:57, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
* '''Support''', per nom. Plus the subcats, as mentioned, ''and also'' one of its containers: [[:Category:Newspapers by medium]]. Which currently contains only four pages that (as a container) it's not supposed to contain, this cat, and the admittedly-fascinating [[:Category:Telephone newspapers]]. Which is something I was totally unaware was ever a thing (around 120 years ago).
:* '''Comment''': Tangentially, [[:Category:Newspapers by medium]] has led me to the discovery that we  have entirely '''separate''' articles on: [[Digital newspaper]], [[Digital newspaper technology]], ''and'' [[Online newspaper]], so now I feel like I have some merges to propose. -- [[User:FeRDNYC|FeRDNYC]] ([[User talk:FeRDNYC|talk]]) 10:04, 5 November 2019 (UTC)
::Indeed.  I don't see how Online newspapers are different from News websites. And what about online magasines and periodicals? [[User:Rathfelder|Rathfelder]] ([[User talk:Rathfelder|talk]]) 17:43, 5 November 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Programmers who committed suicide ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''rename'''. <small>[[Wikipedia:NACD|(non-admin closure)]]</small> [[User:DannyS712|DannyS712]] ([[User talk:DannyS712|talk]]) 09:17, 12 November 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:Programmers who committed suicide]] to [[:Category:Computer programmers who committed suicide]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Per [[:Category:Computer programmers]]. This was an opposed speedy (see [[Category talk:Programmers who committed suicide#Suggested rename]]) because the main article is [[Programmer]]; however, while that may be appropriate for mainspace, it is too ambiguous (see [[Programmer (disambiguation)]]) for the category namespace. In any case, unless/until the parent is renamed to [[:Category:Programmers]] (currently a category-redirect), this title should not remain inconsistent. <small>(Courtesy pinging [[User:Armbrust]] and [[User:Fgnievinski]])</small> -- [[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]] <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|talk]])</sup> 03:54, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

*'''Support'''; better explained than in my original proposition. [[User:Fgnievinski|fgnievinski]] ([[User talk:Fgnievinski|talk]]) 14:50, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' to better explain contents. [[User:Dimadick|Dimadick]] ([[User talk:Dimadick|talk]]) 20:53, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
* '''Comment''' I felt like I supported this as a no-brainer, until I looked at that speedy objection. It's true that [[Programmer]] is the article in question, and in fact there is no [[Programmer (disambiguation)]] — '''that''' redirects to [[Program (disambiguation)]], which in fact lists basically no real ambiguities for "Programmer". The only alternatives to [[Programmer]] are [[Synthesizer programmer]] which is just a redirect to [[Synthesizer]], and [[Programmer (hardware)]] which is obviously not a person. So now I feel like maybe [[:Category:Computer programmers]] '''should''' be renamed to [[:Category:Programmers]]. -- [[User:FeRDNYC|FeRDNYC]] ([[User talk:FeRDNYC|talk]]) 01:48, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
**From the plain-language perspective that "programmer" means "one who programs" or "one who performs programming", there could be quite a few potential ambiguities based on the entries on the disambiguation page: e.g., programmer (music), radio programmer, broadcast programmer. I appreciate your perspective, and to be honest I, too, was initially torn between nominating this category versus the parent. I would not necessarily oppose a nomination to rename the parent, but unless/until that happens I would argue that we should not pre-judge the outcome of a future, hypothetical discussion and this category should be renamed to align with its current parent. -- [[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]] <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|talk]])</sup> 06:28, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
*** {{ping|Black Falcon}} {{tqi|q=y|From the plain-language perspective that "programmer" means "one who programs" or "one who performs programming", there could be quite a few potential ambiguities based on the entries on the disambiguation page: e.g., programmer (music), radio programmer, broadcast programmer.}} I don't dispute that, ''technically'', but it just doesn't strike me as true '''practically'''. The fact is, if you were to meet someone on the street and they told you "I'm a programmer", you'd know they meant a computer programmer. Any of us would. A profession '''''other''''' than computer programmer, you'd expect them to specify what "alternate" type of programmer. But in our current society, "programmer" == "computer programmer". [[WP:COMMONNAME]] and all that.<br />That being said, I ''don't'' really dispute that, ''unless'' [[:Category:Computer programmers]] is renamed/redirected, it makes sense to rename this one.  -- [[User:FeRDNYC|FeRDNYC]] ([[User talk:FeRDNYC|talk]]) 22:31, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
****That's fair. The fact is, I don't have any strong feelings about this either, except that this category should match whatever naming convention its parent uses. Thanks, -- [[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]] <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|talk]])</sup> 04:33, 11 November 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:SGI people ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''rename'''. <small>[[Wikipedia:NACD|(non-admin closure)]]</small> [[User:DannyS712|DannyS712]] ([[User talk:DannyS712|talk]]) 09:17, 12 November 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:SGI people]] to [[:Category:Silicon Graphics people]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Per [[:Category:Silicon Graphics]], and because [[SGI]] is ambiguous. I did not propose to speedy because all applicable subcategories of [[:Category:Silicon Graphics]] use the acronym. I will defer to others who are more knowledgeable on this topic to nominate the other subcategories, if appropriate. -- [[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]] <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|talk]])</sup> 03:52, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' More descriptive title. [[User:Dimadick|Dimadick]] ([[User talk:Dimadick|talk]]) 20:54, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' -- We try to avoid abbreviations in category names.  It may be that some of the sibling subcats also need renaming, but I woulkd defer to those more knowledgeable of the subject.  [[User:Peterkingiron|Peterkingiron]] ([[User talk:Peterkingiron|talk]]) 15:22, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:UK MPs 2017– ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''Renamed''' following clear precedent, 2010-2015, 2015-2017. The only hesitations were in regard to the dissolution of parliament which has now happened. [[User:Cabayi|Cabayi]] ([[User talk:Cabayi|talk]]) 10:29, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:UK MPs 2017–]] to [[:Category:UK MPs 2017–2019]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' The current UK Parliament, elected in 2017, is due to be [[Dissolution of the Parliament of the United Kingdom|dissolved]] on Wednesday 6 November 2019[https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/parliament-and-elections/elections-elections/what-does-the-early-parliamentary-general-election-bill-do/], in preparation for the [[2019 United Kingdom general election]].
:This category will then need renaming to fit the ''YYYY–YYYY'' convention of [[:Category:MPs of the United Kingdom House of Commons, by Parliament]]
:Recent British politics hasn't been entirely predictable, and plans relating to dates have not always been implemented.  So I think it's best to await confirmation in reliable sources that dissolution has actually taken place.
:Once that confirmation is available, then the category will be eligible for speedy renaming per [[WP:C2D]](ii).
:Unless there are objections, that makes the category eligible for speedy renaming 48 hours after details are posted here of the reliable sources confirming that dissolution has happened. [[User:BrownHairedGirl|<span style="font-variant:small-caps"><span style="color:#663200;">Brown</span>HairedGirl</span>]] <small>[[User talk:BrownHairedGirl|(talk)]] • ([[Special:Contributions/BrownHairedGirl|contribs]])</small> 01:12, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' once dissolution is confirmed. I'd also like to nominate "Recent British politics hasn't been entirely predictable" for the title of Understatement of the Year. [[User:Grutness|Grutness]]...''<small>[[User_talk:Grutness|<span style="color: #008822;">wha?</span>]]</small>'' 02:56, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
**@[[User:Grutness|Grutness]], given the subject matter, I did try to adopt the English technique of understatement. <grin> More colourful terminology is available ... --[[User:BrownHairedGirl|<span style="font-variant:small-caps"><span style="color:#663200;">Brown</span>HairedGirl</span>]] <small>[[User talk:BrownHairedGirl|(talk)]] • ([[Special:Contributions/BrownHairedGirl|contribs]])</small> 04:02, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
** {{ping|Grutness}} I suppose the only response that feels appropriate is, to quote the great, just-departed John Bercow: '''''ORDAAAAAAH!''''' -- [[User:FeRDNYC|FeRDNYC]] ([[User talk:FeRDNYC|talk]]) 10:34, 5 November 2019 (UTC)
***<nowiki>:)</nowiki> [[User:Grutness|Grutness]]...''<small>[[User_talk:Grutness|<span style="color: #008822;">wha?</span>]]</small>'' 15:42, 5 November 2019 (UTC)
:: (P.S: For the record, Bercow is newly-retired, not dead. I realized when I read it back that my original comment sounded ominous.) -- [[User:FeRDNYC|FeRDNYC]] ([[User talk:FeRDNYC|talk]]) 00:53, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' [[User:Bondegezou|Bondegezou]] ([[User talk:Bondegezou|talk]]) 06:59, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' per nom. '''[[User:Lugnuts|<span style="color:#002bb8;">Lugnuts</span>]]''' <sup>[[User talk:Lugnuts|Fire Walk with Me]]</sup> 12:23, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' -- I would normally say this was premature until this dissolution had happened, but it would require another Act of Parliament to prevent it.  [[User:Peterkingiron|Peterkingiron]] ([[User talk:Peterkingiron|talk]]) 17:53, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
**@[[User:Peterkingiron|Peterkingiron]], in normal circumstances the chances of another Act are non-existent, but the current Westminster Parliament seems to have a taste for instant legislation.  So I wouldn't entirely rule it out, which is why I recommend waiting until dissolution has actually happened.  Of course, with a [[prorogation]] having been recently annulled by the courts, we can't entirely rule out a dissolution being voided by the courts ... but I think best cross that bridge if and when we come to it. --[[User:BrownHairedGirl|<span style="font-variant:small-caps"><span style="color:#663200;">Brown</span>HairedGirl</span>]] <small>[[User talk:BrownHairedGirl|(talk)]] • ([[Special:Contributions/BrownHairedGirl|contribs]])</small> 18:46, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' per nomination. As I write this, the current parliament will be dissolved in less than 10 hours. --[[User:Philip Stevens|Philip Stevens]] ([[User talk:Philip Stevens|talk]]) 14:39, 5 November 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' (of course). Straightforward housekeeping. [[User:Andrew Gray|Andrew Gray]] ([[User talk:Andrew Gray|talk]]) 19:21, 5 November 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>