View source for Wikipedia talk:WikiProject TCR Series/Archive 1

==LP Winner Motorsport / Botka Rally Team==

So im already working on the Hungarian drivers articles and Unicorse Team, but im not sure what the article name should be created for LP Winner/Botka Rally Team? From what i have heard they are the same team, but what should the article name be? [[LP Winner Motorsport]] or [[Botka Rally Team]]? Whats your thoughts @{{U|Ivaneurope}} ? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 08:16, 19 June 2017 (UTC)
:As far as this is concerned on the TCR International Series website in the team's description the link is this - lpwinner.hu. This means that the team is named LP Winner Motorsport, but uses the Botka Rally Team banner in some series. My oppinion is to have the article to be named LP Winner Motorsport and to have redirecting link to this article for Botka Rally Team. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 08:57, 19 June 2017 (UTC)

== TCR Iberico/TCR Spain/TCR Portugal ==

So i finally found all the standings for the three separate standings, but i have encountered a little problem. In the TCR Portugal standings. The pair of Ricardo & Eduardo Leitão both drove a race each, but only Eduardo Leitão got the points scored towards the TCR Portugal championship in both races. For the second round Eduardo Leitão partnered with João Carvalho and they both scored points in TCR Portugal. So is the no points scored by Ricardo Leitão just an error in the points table? What do you think @{{U|Ivaneurope}} ? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 10:26, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
:I think drivers can choose for which standings they would be registered for points. TCR Iberico is one big mess as it not only is a standalone series, but has 2 series within it.[[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 15:26, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

== TCR Scandinavia team standings ==

The problems with updating the team standings for STCC are these

1. LMS has 5 cars, but which count?
2. KMS/Volkswagen Sweden are now 3 car team.
3. Brovallen Design is not listed in the standings

@{{U|CGM 20}} I need your oppinion.[[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 19:10, 28 June 2017 (UTC)

::Well with LMS i think only Laaksonen and Parhankangas score team points, because they are full season entries.<br> Im not sure with KMS, but i tried to calculate the points and from that it should be Blomstedt and Ekblom for Round 1 and Ekblom and Kristoffersson for Round 2 onwards.<br> I think there are only two possible reasons for Brovallan Design not being listed, 1. Its a simple error from STCC themselves. or 2. They entered the championship too late, they have a cut-off date in the regulations that says 15 March 2017. And with the entry first being announced on 19 April 2017, there is the chance that it could have been a very late deal.<br> The STCC 2017 Regulations can be found here: https://www.stcc.se/app/uploads/2014/05/Officiellt-T%C3%A4vlingsreglemente-STCC-2017-SVE.pdf <br>Note that they are in Swedish though. Does this help @{{U|Ivaneurope}}? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 08:07, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

::: For KMS the 3 entries are eligible, but only the best two cars score points. In the second Alastaro race Ekblom was 2nd, while Blomstedt was 2nd in races 1 and 3. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 08:49, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

:::: Im not sure that is the case, because the regulations clearly states that the team has to nominate two drivers for the entire weekend before the first session. So they cant just take the two best results i think. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 09:21, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

::::Well according to the teams standings in the STCC website in all three races the team scored 44 points in each one at Alastaro. Johan Kristoffersson took the wins in all three races leaving 18 points in each left. That could only be obtained through second place (done by Ekblom once and by Blomstedt). But what's weirder is that in Sovalla only the results of Kristoffersson and Ekblom are taken. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 16:11, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

::::Here's the Article 1.6 for Team standings from the STCC Regulations Translated from Swedish

"Points will be awarded to the two best-rated cars of the same team for the Championship, according to the same format as the Championship Championship (1.5.3 and 1.5.4). Team must report two cars in writing no later than at the race's performance meeting if the team contains more than two cars. All other cars of the same team are considered invisible in the calculation of points. Winning team at each competition event is the team that collected the most points at each competition's three competition hats. For equal points, section 1.8 applies"

[[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 16:23, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

:::::Did you take into account the points for pole postion and fastest lap? Otherwise i am out of ideas TBH. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 18:27, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

:::::: @{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Ivaneurope}} sorry guys, what I'm writing in the Archive, I do not know if I can do this, but I figured out this problem. It's hard to explain, but everything is correct in the table. I'll make a table in the next few days. If you are interested I can explain, but it is not easy in English :) [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 23:03, 19 December 2017 (UTC)

== Unicorse ==

I have just finished the Unicorse article draft, but im not sure if the name should be [[Team Unicorse]] or [[Unicorse Team]]? Or the third option of [[Unicorse]]? What do you think @{{U|Ivaneurope}}? What would be the common name? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 09:18, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

:The TCR team page has them listed as Unicorse Team and in the team's website the team is named Unicorse team. So the team's name is Unicorse Team. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 16:03, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

== M1RA's own page ==

I've made individual page for [[M1RA]] and I'd like some evaluation on it. @{{U|CGM 20}}, would you check it up.

:Honestly think its a great start for now, but i might make a few changes here and there at some point in the future. I am btw also currently working on both [[Luca Engstler]] and [[Danny Kroes]] pages, so i expext them finished soon. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 18:38, 14 July 2017 (UTC)

== VLN ==

So i have been researching the TCR class in the VLN, but i couldn't find a championship standing for the class. Doesn't the VLN have individual standings for the each class? I also thought that unless someone wants to create the hole VLN season with every entry, we could put the TCR class in the [[2017 TCR Series seasons]]? What your opinion? @{{U|Ivaneurope}}, @{{U|Link7344}}? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 19:58, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
:In all honesty I don't see the need for an article that encompass all TCR related series. The [[2016 TCR Series seasons]] article was simply links of the series' standalone articles. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 15:21, 11 August 2017 (UTC)
::I agree with you that the [[2016 TCR Series seasons]] article wasn't really needed, but the [[2015 TCR Series seasons]] showed the true purpose for the article and thats why i think we need the [[2017 TCR Series seasons]] for the VLN TCR class and standings, because otherwise we would have to create the entire 2017 VLN series with several hundred drivers and that would be a bit over the top honestly, at least for me. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 16:38, 11 August 2017 (UTC)

== Nationally homologated TCR cars ==

There is a strange case with two cars built to the TCR regs - Lada Vesta TCR and the recently announced Senova D50 TCR. As it was acknowledged a while ago that for a car to be homologated to the TCR regs it needs to participate in at least one race in the TCR International Series otherwise no homologation or eligibility for pointscoring in any other TCR series. These two cars - Vesta and D50 - do not intend to compete in any other series. What is their staus within the TCR regs? I need your thoughts @{{U|CGM 20}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 08:09, 11 August 2017 (UTC)
: Of course, Senova is not a TCR car, it does not have international or national homologation now (like Hyundai i30). But at the same time Lada Vesta appears in the documents Balance of Performance ({{URL|docs.gestionaweb.cat/1462/bop-17-tcr-technical-bulletin-2017-17.pdf|Technical Bulletin No. 17}}) and scores points in the TCR Russia standings. {{Cquote|LADA Vesta TCR fully meets the technical requirements, but will be able to participate in the International TCR series only from next year. Due to the fact that we did not set a goal to go to international races, all certification and homologation documents were issued according to world standards, but with the admission only for the Russian championship.|source=From the interview of Maxim Ostudin, head of the commercial department of LADA Sport, for WTCCLive vk Russia.|width=85%}} {{right|[[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 10:27, 11 August 2017 (UTC)}}

::Honestly the Senova D50 project have not announced any intention to compete in the TCR International Series, at least not this year or in 2018 AFAIK, but this could of course change in the future. Or could a team buy a D50 and run it in the TCR International Series, or would they need permission? Currently the '''Eligible cars''' table has a section where it says ''Announced projects and cars having taken part in races while not complying to TCR requirement''. We could create a third section for the ''Cars complying with TCR requirements, running national homologation''? Because right now, the D50, Vesta and i30 etc should really be moved from the regular list. Thats my thoughts @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 10:39, 11 August 2017 (UTC)
:::But Senova now does not belong to any category (and did not participate in races). This is most likely an announced project, than a car with a national homologation like LADA. It is not known exactly whether Senova will be able to get any homologation. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 19:15, 11 August 2017 (UTC)
::::That is correct, my bad. It would probably fit into the projects section, which needs to be split from the "cars having taken part in races while not complying to TCR requirement" section. I was thinking that the ''Announced projects and cars having taken part in races while not complying to TCR requirement'' section could be split into two seperate sections. Named '''Announced projects''' and '''Cars having taken part in races while not complying to TCR regulations''', but then we would need to add the CTCC cars that took part in the [[2016 Guia Race of Macau]]. Whats your thoughts? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 08:56, 12 August 2017 (UTC)
:::::I think that CTCC cars are not needed in the list, they did not score points like Citoren in Italy or Audi TT and Opel Astra OPC in the International Series. Citroen and Audi from CTCC are not related to the TCR series. It is simpler to divide the table into two parts "Eligible TCR cars" and "other cars" adding a column with notes, where to describe the current status of the projects and where the non-compliant TCR cars were performing. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 11:32, 12 August 2017 (UTC)
::::::I like that idea, i think that is what we should do. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 12:43, 12 August 2017 (UTC)

== Improving the main page ==

Allright, even though we're small community we need to take care of the main [[TCR International Series]] article. This article has some issues that need to be resolved.

*This article reads like a news release, or is otherwise written in a promotional tone. (November 2014)
*This article needs additional citations for verification. (November 2014)
*This article's tone or style may not reflect the encyclopedic tone used on Wikipedia. (November 2014)

The aim of this WikiProject is to maintain every TCR related page and up until this moment no one has managed to improve the entire article. The sections Announcements in 2014 and Announcements in 2015 are more like announcement citations during the creation of the series proper. Also in the Technical regulations section @{{U|CGM 20}} had conveniently placed cars that have competed in TCR series without complying fully to the regs. In the last section we've discussed about putting Lada Vesta TCR, Senova D50 TCR and Hyundai i30 N TCR in their own bubble as "Nationally homologated or pending homologation cars". I also think to put Balance of Performance collumn, but there's a catch - some cars have different variation (mainly the gearbox).

@{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Link7344}} - I need your thoughts and ideas how to improve the main page and do the other TCR series need their own sub-pages or not. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 16:05, 11 August 2017 (UTC)

:Im glad we finally get to address these issues with the main page. To rewrite the lead section of the article could be the "easy" solution to fix the otherwise promotional tone. TBH i never understood the need for the two '''Announcements in 2014 and 2015''' sections, i can sort of understands them in the beginning, but now we don't really need them. <br>The '''Eligible cars''' table needs work, and you can read my suggestions in the section above. <br>Im not sure how a BoP column would really be needed, this is a encyclopedia, do people really care about the BoP? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 16:31, 11 August 2017 (UTC)

== Individual pages ==

With the TCR family constantly increasing and more series and new cars are comming into the fray. With that perhaps comes the need to create individual pages for the TCR related series (there are some notable exceptions) and perhaps even the cars could have their own articles like it was done with most S2000 and R5 rally cars. Your thoughts @{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Link7344}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 10:19, 17 August 2017 (UTC)

:I don't think we need pages for the cars, we could just make a section for them in the road car articles. Im not sure what other pages would need creation? Could you clarify @{{U|Ivaneurope}}?? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 12:08, 17 August 2017 (UTC)

:: I've put some lines about the Civic TCR in the JAS Motorsport page. Check it out. @{{U|CGM 20}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 09:10, 18 August 2017 (UTC)

::: I've also put some lines about Hyundai i30 N TCR in the [[Hyundai Motorsport]] page. Trouble is where we should redirect the car info - on the road car article or in the car developer article if it has section for the designated car. I remember when [[Skoda Fabia R5]] didn't had its own article, it was redirected to [[Skoda Motorsport]] - the developer of Fabia R5. @{{U|CGM 20}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 09:49, 2 September 2017 (UTC)

::::I can see what you mean, but wouldn't people expect it to be written in the article about the road car? My only reason to be against making articles for the cars, is that GT3 cars does not have their own articles either. @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 16:33, 2 September 2017 (UTC)

== TCR Baltic Trophy ==

Ok, I've stumbled across one TCR series that is a stub - the [[2017 TCR Baltic Trophy]]. The trophy is part of a much bigger series - [[Baltic Touring Car Championship]]. Now with TCR Baltic having a single entry (Ernesta Globyte) and being part of the BaTCC I sugest to move the TCR article into new article - [[2017 Baltic Touring Car Championship]]

@{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Link7344}} - your thoughts [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 09:45, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

:If we move it to the [[2017 Baltic Touring Car Championship]], then we need to add all the other additional entries, like in the [[2017 Russian Circuit Racing Series]] article. Otherwise we could just delete the whole article and add it to the [[2017 TCR Series seasons]]? @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 10:31, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

::BaTCC is one awkward series as it shares some races with the BEC - Baltic Endurance Championship. IMO we can arrange the entry lists like in [[2017 24H Series]] and [[2017 Touring Car Endurance Series]].@{{U|CGM 20}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 11:55, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

:::Yeah exactly, so that is likely the only solution. But can we properly source it? @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 12:10, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

::::[http://batcc.eu/drivers/?type=batcc] - Here're the drivers competing in the BaTCC. @{{U|CGM 20}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 12:24, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

:::::It looks possible, but i think its a little funny that it says '''Drivers and Teams''' on their website, yet the lack of team names are a bit of a problem. @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 12:29, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

::::::Privateers usually don't have a team - sometimes the car preparator is listed. We can make the list sorta like the WRC season reports where private entries in the team collumn are having the driver's name. That's my solution. @{{U|CGM 20}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 12:37, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

:::::: What about looking at the 1006km Palanga race? Some entries from BaTCC and BEC entered. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 12:43, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

:::::::It sounds like a good way to do it. That is properly what should be done. @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 13:28, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

::::::::The BaTCC page requires a lot of work. The problem is that the names of teams are not written in the BaTCC list, and vice versa, the names of the racers are not listed in the BEC. And, oh, yes, for RCRS 2017 and 2016 it would be necessary to make the same tables as in the WRC. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 18:58, 23 August 2017 (UTC)
:::::::::TCR Baltic Trophy tables should be moved to the article "2017 TCR Series Seasons" as a class of TCR in VLN 2017. At least this season there are no participants yet. @{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 17:17, 4 September 2017 (UTC)

::::::::::I will have a look at it, but i think we should move the entire article from the [[2017 TCR Baltic Trophy]] to [[2017 Baltic Touring Car Championship]] and then slowly add all the other classes and entries. @{{U|Ivaneurope}}, @{{U|Link7344}}. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 18:27, 5 September 2017 (UTC)

:::::::::::I have created a draft of the [[User:CGM 20/2017 BaTCC|2017 Baltic Touring Car Championship season]], please check it out. So we can discuss what will happen to the [[2017 TCR Baltic Trophy]] page. @{{U|Ivaneurope}}, @{{U|Link7344}}. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 09:56, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

::::::::::::It looks good in my oppinion. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 14:47, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
:::::::::::::I think that the first place in the table should be put the pilots instead of the teams, because they do not have a team championship. And actually I do not see the need for such an article, it will be unclaimed. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 19:41, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

::::::::::::::So should we move the 2017 TCR Baltic Trophy page to the 2017 TCR Series seasons? Or create the 2017 Baltic Touring Car Championship? Can we all three agree on something here? @{{U|Ivaneurope}}, @{{U|Link7344}}. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 17:06, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
::::::::::::::: I am for moving this article to the 2017 TCR Series seasons as TCR Italia 2015 and TCR Russia 2015. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 20:30, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

::::::::::::::::Last chance @{{U|Ivaneurope}}? Otherwise we will just have to move/merge the [[2017 TCR Baltic Trophy]] into the [[2017 TCR Series seasons]]. (This is not meant to be a rude post, so dont read it that way. Thank you) [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 12:53, 14 October 2017 (UTC)

:::::::::::::::::I say to move/merge [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 10:45, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

== Vukovic Motorsport or Milenko Vukovic ==

As you may have heard - Vukovic Motorsport has made TCR-spec Megane Mk4. The problem is that Vukovic Motorsport doesn't have Wiki article and it will be really good to create one. However there is practice with some family owned teams to be redirected to a said driver who owns the team - in this case Milenko Vukovic is the owner of the team. He doesn't have an article as well. Now should we create separate page for the team or make it a redirection to Milenko Vukovic's driver profile. @{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Link7344}}.

PS: I think the engine that Mégane TCR would use is the F4RT engine, used by Lada in their Vesta RCRS. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 17:42, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

:I think we should wait a little with creating an article for either, as they will have to run the car in the International Series before it gets homologated. Because currently they are not notably AFAIK, but this could change in 2018, when the car is set for its debut.<br>About the engine. I think you might be right about the F4RT engine, but we dont have confirmation for that yet and that is why i listed it as TBA. @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 19:53, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

:::Now we know which engine would use the new Mégane TCR - 1.8L engine probobly from the new Mégane RS and Alpine A110 sportscar. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 14:31, 14 September 2017 (UTC)

::::Could you add the engine to the table? because im not familiar with the different engine articles. @{{U|Ivaneurope}}. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 10:14, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

:::::Unfortunately I don't have the engine code name :( [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 18:37, 26 September 2017 (UTC)

== Champions table ==

The current table is TBH a little messy to lot at and i have created a different layout but wanted to hear your opinions. 

So here is the original table:
{|class="wikitable" style="font-size:80%"
!Season
!Asia
!Italy
!Portugal
!Russia
!Benelux
!Germany
!Thailand
!Spain
!Europe
!24H Series
!{{Tooltip|TCES|Touring Car Endurance Series}}
!Middle East
|-
| [[2015 TCR Series seasons|2015]]
| {{flagicon|HKG}} [[Michael Choi (racing driver)|Michael Choi]]
| {{flagicon|ITA}} Valentina Albanese
| {{flagicon|PRT}} [[Francisco Mora (racing driver)|Francisco Mora]]
| {{flagicon|RUS}} [[Aleksey Dudukalo]]
|colspan=7 align=center| Not held
|rowspan=2 align=center| Not held
|-
| [[2016 TCR Series seasons|2016]]
| {{flagicon|HKG}} [[Andy Yan]]
| {{flagicon|ITA}} [[Roberto Colciago]]
| {{flagicon|PRT}} [[Francisco Mora (racing driver)|Francisco Mora]]
| {{flagicon|RUS}} Dmitry Bragin
| {{flagicon|BEL}} Stéphane Lémeret
| {{flagicon|GBR}} [[Josh Files]]
| {{flagicon|NED}} [[Carlo van Dam]]
| {{flagicon|ESP}} Jaime Font<br>{{flagicon|ESP}} Faust Salom
| {{flagicon|BEL}} [[Pierre-Yves Corthals]]
| {{flagicon|GBR}} Nabil Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} Ramzi Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} Sami Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} [[Phil Quaife]]
| {{flagicon|NLD}} Ivo Breukers<br>{{flagicon|NLD}} Rik Breukers
|-
|[[2017_TCR_International_Series|2017]]
|colspan=9 align=center| TBD
| {{flagicon|FRA}} Thierry Blaise<br>{{flagicon|DEN}} Kim Holmgaard
|align=center| TBD
|{{flagicon|GBR}} [[Josh Files]]
|}

And here is my proposed layout:
{|class="wikitable" style="font-size:80%"
!Series
![[2015 TCR Series seasons|2015]]
![[2016 TCR Series seasons|2016]]
![[2017 TCR Series seasons|2017]]
|-
! Asia
| {{flagicon|HKG}} [[Michael Choi (racing driver)|Michael Choi]]
| {{flagicon|HKG}} [[Andy Yan]]
|rowspan=9 align=center| TBD
|-
! Italy
| {{flagicon|ITA}} Valentina Albanese
| {{flagicon|ITA}} [[Roberto Colciago]]
|-
! Portugal
|align=center colspan=2| {{flagicon|PRT}} [[Francisco Mora (racing driver)|Francisco Mora]]
|-
! Russia
| {{flagicon|RUS}} [[Aleksey Dudukalo]]
| {{flagicon|RUS}} Dmitry Bragin
|-
! BeNeLux
|rowspan=8 align=center| Not held
| {{flagicon|BEL}} Stéphane Lémeret
|-
! Germany
| {{flagicon|GBR}} [[Josh Files]]
|-
! Thailand
| {{flagicon|NED}} [[Carlo van Dam]]
|-
! Spain
| {{flagicon|ESP}} Jaime Font<br>{{flagicon|ESP}} Faust Salom
|-
! Europe
| {{flagicon|BEL}} [[Pierre-Yves Corthals]]
|-
! 24H Series
| {{flagicon|GBR}} Nabil Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} Ramzi Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} Sami Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} [[Phil Quaife]]
| {{flagicon|FRA}} Thierry Blaise<br>{{flagicon|DEN}} Kim Holmgaard
|-
! {{Tooltip|TCES|Touring Car Endurance Series}}
| {{flagicon|NLD}} Ivo Breukers<br>{{flagicon|NLD}} Rik Breukers
|align=center| TBD
|-
! Middle East
|align=center| Not held
|{{flagicon|GBR}} [[Josh Files]]
|}

Whats your thoughts @{{U|Ivaneurope}}, @{{U|Link7344}} ? Of course if you have a different idea, then please share it. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 15:32, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
:I think the current layout is fine, but 24H Series, TCES and VLN are unnecessary IMO as they don't use TCR-regs as their main ruleset. @{{U|GCM 20}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 16:13, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

::I see your point @{{U|Ivaneurope}}, but i guess they are in the table because they have a official TCR class with standalone standings. So in my opinion it makes sense that they are there. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 16:31, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
:::In a new form, the table is much better. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 22:19, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
::::Thanks for your inputs, the only problem i have found with my proposed layout is, with time, it will become just as messy as the other one....But that could be fixed with making them from fx. 2015–2020 and 2020–2025 etc. But should we vote about which solution we should use? Or can we all three agree on something here? @{{U|Ivaneurope}}, @{{U|Link7344}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 16:37, 2 September 2017 (UTC)
:::::This problem will arise very soon, it can be solved as it appears. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 17:06, 4 September 2017 (UTC)
::::::Okay i will work a little more with the new table style and then replace the old one, in due time. Thanks for the input. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 18:20, 5 September 2017 (UTC)

== Secondary TCR categories ==

Within some TCR series the entries are either split or participate in additional secondary categories like Junior class. One fine example is Thailand Super Series's TCR Thailand championship - the drivers are split into Pro-Am and Am categories. Each category scores points separetly one from another and sometimes Am drivers have more points than even the Pro-Am champion.

The question is should we put secondary class champions in the champions table like I did in my last edit? Your thoughts @{{U|CGM 20}} @{{U|Link7344}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 08:42, 13 September 2017 (UTC)

:I have thought about this problem for some time already, but if we add the Am champion from TCR Thailand. Then we would also need to add the Junior champions from TCR BeNeLux and TCR Germany, plus the Am/Cup champions from TCR Asia. 

:I think it would look something like this if we use my proposed new layout.
:{|class="wikitable" style="font-size:80%"
!Series
![[2015 TCR Series seasons|2015]]
![[2016 TCR Series seasons|2016]]
![[2017 TCR Series seasons|2017]]
|-
! Asia
| {{flagicon|HKG}} [[Michael Choi (racing driver)|Michael Choi]]
| {{flagicon|HKG}} [[Andy Yan]]<br>{{flagicon|MAC}} [[Kevin Tse]] <small>(Am)</small>
|rowspan=6 align=center| TBD
|-
! Italy
| {{flagicon|ITA}} Valentina Albanese
| {{flagicon|ITA}} [[Roberto Colciago]]
|-
! Portugal
|align=center colspan=2| {{flagicon|PRT}} [[Francisco Mora (racing driver)|Francisco Mora]]
|-
! Russia
| {{flagicon|RUS}} [[Aleksey Dudukalo]]
| {{flagicon|RUS}} Dmitry Bragin
|-
! BeNeLux
|rowspan=8 align=center| Not held
| {{flagicon|BEL}} Stéphane Lémeret<br>{{flagicon|BEL}} Romain de Leval <small>(Junior)</small>
|-
! Germany
| {{flagicon|GBR}} [[Josh Files]]<br>{{flagicon|DEU}} Tom Lautenschlager <small>(Junior)</small>
|-
! Thailand
| {{flagicon|NED}} [[Carlo van Dam]] <small>(Pro-Am)</small><br>{{flagicon|TWN}} [[Chen Jian Hong]] <small>(Am)</small>
| {{flagicon|THA}} [[Pasarit Promsombat]] <small>(Pro-Am)</small>
|-
! Spain
| {{flagicon|ESP}} Jaime Font<br>{{flagicon|ESP}} Faust Salom
|rowspan=2 align=center| TBD
|-
! Europe
| {{flagicon|BEL}} [[Pierre-Yves Corthals]]
|-
! 24H Series
| {{flagicon|GBR}} Nabil Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} Ramzi Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} Sami Moutran<br>{{flagicon|GBR}} [[Phil Quaife]]
| {{flagicon|FRA}} Thierry Blaise<br>{{flagicon|DEN}} Kim Holmgaard
|-
! {{Tooltip|TCES|Touring Car Endurance Series}}
| {{flagicon|NLD}} Ivo Breukers<br>{{flagicon|NLD}} Rik Breukers
|align=center| TBD
|-
! Middle East
|align=center| Not held
| {{flagicon|GBR}} [[Josh Files]]
|}
:Your thoughts @{{U|Ivaneurope}}? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 09:24, 13 September 2017 (UTC)

::Fine by me [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 14:49, 13 September 2017 (UTC)

== 2017 TCR Asia Series pilots ==
I think that in [[2017 TCR Asia Series]] article it is necessary to remove the pilots from the Thailand and Chinese series, despite the fact that they performed in the combined races. In the table of participants and in the table of results, too. @{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 14:40, 18 September 2017 (UTC)

:I agree, i was never a fan of adding them in the first place. But after it was added to the [[2016 TCR Asia Series|2016 season article]], i just accepted it. But they should be removed from both the 2016 and 2017 articles. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 16:44, 18 September 2017 (UTC)
:: But in 2016, the participants in the Thailand series scored points for TCR Asia. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 06:35, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

:::We need to make some distinction of pointscoring entries - there are cases in other series that drivers are listed in the Teams and Drivers list despite lacking eligibility to score points. Like in TCR Germany Bas Koeten Racing was ineligible for points.[[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 18:15, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

::::@{{U|Link7344}} my bad, i had somehow forgot that. They should of course stay in the 2016 article. I agree with @{{U|Ivaneurope}} that we should change the entry list to the same layout as in TCR Germany. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 10:18, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

== European Touring Car Cup ==

Now, since the ETCC use TCR cars as their main class (well the entire field is now TCR exclusive) I think it'd be good to put the ETCC in the TCR seasons template. Your oppinion @{{U|CGM 20}} @{{U|Link7344}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 09:49, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

:I agree, but i would only add this season and future seasons, since the previous seasons ran to TCN2 (or whatever they were called) regulations. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 10:15, 22 September 2017 (UTC)
::The article ETCC 2017 does not state that the TCR rules are used. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 20:34, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
:::The articles from TouringCarTimes do state that ETCC use the TCR technical rules for 2017, which includes BoP. Last season even though the cars were clearly TCR they've competed under the TCN-2 umbrella in ETCC - using the TCR cars, but had to conform to FIA technical regulations including FIA homologated fuel-tank and rollcage.

Here're the articles:
*[https://www.touringcartimes.com/2017/04/24/etcc-set-to-officially-adopt-tcr-regulations-ahead-of-season-launch-at-monza/]
*[https://www.touringcartimes.com/2017/04/27/11-car-entry-for-the-etcc-season-opener-at-monza/]
*[https://www.touringcartimes.com/2017/05/23/rikli-hondas-switch-to-tcr-specification-from-this-weekend/]

I think that this subject is closed and ETCC would appear in the TCR Series template as well as the Champions list. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 22:00, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

== Chineese names convention ==

This is a tricky topic as it ivolves the order of Chineese names. Generally the surname is first amd then the first name in Chineese like for example Tengyi Jiang. However many websites such as TouringCarTimes and my Wikipedia edits of the [[2017 China Touring Car Championship]] use the traditional naming convention - name-surname like in Jiang Tengyi. We need a solution for the naming convention of Chineese drivers. @{{U|CGM 20}} U{{U|Link7344}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 14:53, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

:With Tengyi Jiang as an example i think you should know the following: First name: Teng Yi (simplified Tengyi) and last name: Jiang. Therefore when we write Tengyi Jiang we are writing his surname last and when we write Jiang Tengyi we write his surname first. But i think the main problem can be solved quite easy, because Tengyi Jiang's article has multiple redirects such as Jiang Tengyi, Jiang Teng Yi and Teng Yi Jiang and when other Chinese drivers articles with Traditional Chinese names are created, then the same could be done. @{{U|Ivaneurope}} [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 16:07, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

== Honda Civic Type-R TCR 2nd Generation ==

As you may've been aware, [[JAS Motorsport]] announced earlier in the year that they would build new TCR car which is based on the 5th Generation [[Honda Civic Type-R]] (FK8 chassis). Now since this is a brand new car I've added the FK8 Civic in the list of Eligible Cars as Civic Type-R TCR (FK8) and the 2017 one is added the FK2 label (the Mk4 Type-R designation). This is done so the two models to be distinguishable one from another since both are two different cars.

If you don't like this give some other ideas @{{U|CGM 20}} @{{U|Link7344}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 12:54, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

:I would have done the same, but perhaps we should move the FK8 to the Announced projects section. Since the car hasn't been homologated yet. @{{U|Ivaneurope}}. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 17:21, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

== TCR Iberico ==

I propose that the TCR Cup Iberia to be moved to [[2017 TCR Series seasons]] and the Portuguese and Spanish series to be split into two separate season reports since the two had completely different entry lists, rules and calendars. @{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Link7344}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 16:44, 20 October 2017 (UTC)

:I see your point, it could help make the championship rounds more clear. But at present im not sure if the need is there for it to be more clear. @{{U|Ivaneurope}}, do you have any further thoughts? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 08:14, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

::On the subject, TouringCarTimes states that Francisco Abreu is also TCR Portugal champion [https://www.touringcartimes.com/2017/10/22/edgar-florindo-wins-portimao-francisco-abreu-champion/]

:::I am aware of the TCT article, but surely the TCR website article should know who is champion? [http://tcr-series.com/index.php/news/item/tcr-iberico-abreu-wins-title-as-mora-crashes] [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 10:50, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

::::I've read the article wrong. My bad [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 11:20, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

:::::You didn't read it wrong, TCT got it wrong and have now corrected their mistake in their article. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 14:14, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

:::::: I agree that the article should be divided. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 14:46, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

:::::::Okay since you two vote for this change, i will change my vote and agree that we should move TCR Ibérico, TCR Portugal & TCR Spain to TCR Series seasons and split them up further. [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 19:04, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

== TCR Trophy Europe 2017 ==

I suggest adding in the [[2017_TCR_Trophy_Europe|table]] a column with the main series where the pilots competed. What do you think @{{U|CGM 20}}, @{{U|Ivaneurope}}. [[User:Link7344|Link7344]] ([[User talk:Link7344|talk]]) 20:25, 26 October 2017 (UTC)
:Don't know if this is needed. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 20:30, 26 October 2017 (UTC)
::I can conclude that adding such collumn is simply trvial and unnecessary. Some drivers had participated in two or more series, or none at all. Take for instance Luigi Ferrara, who took part in both TCR Germany and TCR Italy while entered a round in the TCR International Series (abeit with Top Run Motorsport) as well. Therefore it's unknown how did he qualifies. Adding a collumn would only make the table more confusing.

::Thus I reject the proposal. @{{U|Link7344}} @{{U|CGM 20}}[[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 19:19, 27 October 2017 (UTC)

:::On the subject of TCR Europe, i think they have changed the name for this year. Last year it was '''TCR Trophy Europe''' and this year they have only referred to it as the '''TCR Europe Trophy'''. So should we move the page from [[2017 TCR Trophy Europe]] to [[2017 TCR Europe Trophy]], your thoughts @{{U|Link7344}} @{{U|Ivaneurope}}?? [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 08:36, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

::::For the sake of consistency I say let's keep it as it is. @{{U|Link7344}} @{{U|CGM 20}} [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 09:24, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

== Peugeot 308 Racing Cup ==


Hi all,
Question: is the pre-2018 Peugeot 308 Racing Cup car full TCR spec? I read that Peugeot was developing a full TCR spec 308 for 2018 ([https://www.touringcartimes.com/2017/10/29/aurelien-comte-celebrates-2017-tcr-europe-trophy-title-adria/ link]). This would indicate that the pre-2018 used Peugeots are not full TCR spec cars. The sources on the [[TCR International Series]] page do not give a definitive answer. Does anyone know and have a good source?

[[User:Poppo154|Poppo154]] ([[User talk:Poppo154|talk]]) 10:00, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

:Well if you look at the official TCR website, they have the pre-2018 car listed as an eligible car. So i would assume it was fully homologated. The only thing on their website that could question that, is the fact that the Hyundai is also listed there and they have been very vocal about the Hyundai not being homologated yet... [[User:CGM 20|CGM 20]] ([[User talk:CGM 20|talk]]) 13:38, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

::The 308 Racing Cup is indeed eligible to score points in TCR sanctioned series. But I think this homologation would expire once the 308 TCR gets full homologation. [[User:Ivaneurope|Ivaneurope]] ([[User talk:Ivaneurope|talk]]) 15:51, 10 November 2017 (UTC)