Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bowral High School

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. (non-admin closure) power~enwiki (π, ν) 00:53, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

Bowral High School

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Bowral High School (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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This article does not cite sources and heavily relies on (what appears to be) original research. Therefore, I believe it does not meet the Wikipedia standards. ❂stringDTD❂ 10:52, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

• Keep per WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES, tag with {{unreferenced}}, and work on improving it. It does indeed meet WP:V per DuckDuckGo. PCHS-NJROTC ^{(Messages)Have a blessed day.} 13:01, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES now specifically states that secondary schools "are not presumed to be notable simply because they exist" and "WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES should be added to the Arguments to avoid in deletion discussions" following a RfC. Nick-D (talk) 23:53, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
    • WP:NOTPAPER This article has been around since 2008. To be swift and to the point, what is the point of even contributing to Wikipedia if essentially a no-consensus vote (the RFC in question) puts hours worth of work on the chopping block? I wouldn't. PCHS-NJROTC ^{(Messages)Have a blessed day.} 02:24, 15 July 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. Hhkohh (talk) 14:58, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Schools-related deletion discussions. Hhkohh (talk) 14:58, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions. Hhkohh (talk) 14:58, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

• Keep notable school in Bowral. There are two major schools: Bowral Public School (K-6) and Bowral High School (7-12). Here's a listing from Highland NSW official website [1] AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 17:22, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
  • No one is suggesting that the school doesn't exist, and that is not an official website. Nick-D (talk) 23:54, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
    • D'oh, community website. Anyway there should be news articles about the schools. Here's some about their art students showing in Art Express [2] There's also a famous cricketer Don Bradman who went to Bowral High back when it was just a secondary school and before they established the new location in 1929/1930; he scored his first century at age 12 while at the school; sourced by multiple books and news articles [3]. [4] Also MP Jai Rowell is an alum there. [5] AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 03:23, 15 July 2018 (UTC)
• Keep as a high school. No reason to think that with local and hard copy searches sources cannot be found to meet WP:ORG. We keep high schools for very good reasons; not only do they influence the lives of thousands of people but they also play a significant part in their communities. Expansion not deletion is the way to go with such articles. Just Chilling (talk) 18:58, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
• Delete Run of the mill small town high school. The above editors seem unaware that secondary schools are no longer considered automatically notable following a large scale RFC: I'd encourage them to re-read WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES. Nick-D (talk) 23:53, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment Thank you, that's the point I was trying to make. The school does not seem notable at all. It seems like it it just a school at a very small town and not notable (basing off that the article is unreferenced at all. ❂stringDTD❂ 02:15, 15 July 2018 (UTC)
    • If it's just a concern about very small town, then you can redirect to Bowral until more details are written up beyond the paragraphs or so that describe the school systems back then. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 03:25, 15 July 2018 (UTC)
    • Details are now added. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 16:34, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

Trove news archive about new high school:

• Dated 1928 back when it was still Bowral Intermediate High School [6]
• Visit by Lord Chelmsford in 1921 to the Bowral District School [7]
• 1925 plans to erect new high school [8]
• 1927 construction plans [9]
• 1928 enlargement of high school site [10]
• 1929 foundation stone scheduled [11] laid [12] picture [13]
• 1929 building in progress [14]
• 1929 cost of high school $25,000 and description of building [15]
• 1930 announcement that school has been classified raised to second class [16]
• 1930 Official opening news article [17] [18] [19]
• 1930 Speech Day and progress report by headmaster on class enrollment figures, erection of tennis courts, successes on the leaving exams - this is fairly significant coverage near the founding date of the facility [20]
• 1930 Captains and Prefects named [21], Sports records created for school [22], 1931 scholarships for graduates [23]
• 1935 PCA meeting for more courses (lists some courses that were present back in the days) [24]
• 1935 death of headmaster Cowie [25]
• 1937 Headmaster AD Watson (2nd headmaster of school) leaves [26]

The list goes on through other years but the stuff around 1930 is most pertinent as significant coverage by news sources. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 03:56, 15 July 2018 (UTC)

Some nim-come-poop (not directed at anyone in particular) is probably going to come along and say but, but, but, that's all local coverage and there's nothing special about this place! and to that I challenge them to take a random sample of 50 articles from each of these categories: Category:Public high schools in California, Category:Cities in Florida, and Category:Prisons in Texas. How many of them are run-of-the-mill subjects that just barely meet WP:GNG (or, perhaps in you opinion, don't meet WP:GNG at all)? WP:OTHERSTUFF? Read over that argument closely before you cite it. The argument here isn't that one, two, ten, or even one hundred articles exist, the point is three quarters or more of Wikipedia content exists. If we nuke all of it, it won't just be Wikipedians noticing and talking about the mass removal of pages about little towns, moderately sized cities, schools, hospitals, etc. I point back to WP:NOTPAPER, and also to WP:IAR. PCHS-NJROTC ^{(Messages)Have a blessed day.} 11:16, 15 July 2018 (UTC)

• Keep - there are more than enough sources cited here to show notability. The last RfC on school notability said virtually nothing...even its proposer disavowed it in his RfA. All it said was you couldn't claim OUTCOMES alone as a reason to keep. However, that too has been completely ignored. Guidelines here are dictated by the community, not some bureaucratic action like an RfC. Forever, the notability of secondary schools has been weighed against a standard much closer to WP:PLACE than WP:ORG. We have an RfC roughly every two years on this subject, and no matter the outcome, the standard at AfD remains most accurately reflected by WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES. In short, actions speak much louder than words. John from Idegon (talk) 18:58, 16 July 2018 (UTC)
• Keep - it meets all 10 of my standards for high schools. Bearian (talk) 20:07, 16 July 2018 (UTC)
• Keep obviously. —Doncram (talk) 12:39, 17 July 2018 (UTC)
• Keep not per SCHOOLOUTCOMES which is now considered an invalid reason, But Keep per the sources in the article which to me confirms the schools notability, IMHO meets GNG. –Davey2010^Talk 13:32, 17 July 2018 (UTC)
• Comment, not sure why some editors above are referring to Bowral as "very small town", this is subjective and irrelevant to afd discussions, anyway, at 12,949 it is in the top 100 towns/cities by population in Australia, so it is not (Yoo Hoo, Go Bowral!:)). Coolabahapple (talk) 08:44, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

For a "small town high school", it sure has significant coverage in multiple newspapers: Sydney Morning Herald, The Southern Mail (Bowral), The Robertson Advocate, The Scrutineer and Berrima District Press, The Labor Daily AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 16:38, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

• Keep per above passes WP:GNG.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 08:17, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.