Talk:OpenDocument: Difference between revisions
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{{afd-merged-from|OpenDocument Foundation|OpenDocument Foundation|12 October 2019}} |
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==Untitled== |
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Death link: http://std.dkuug.dk/keld/iso26000-odf |
Death link: http://std.dkuug.dk/keld/iso26000-odf |
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linked text: The OASIS Committee Specification OpenDocument 1.0 (second edition) <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/84.252.55.240|84.252.55.240]] ([[User talk:84.252.55.240|talk]]) 10:16, 10 February 2011 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
linked text: The OASIS Committee Specification OpenDocument 1.0 (second edition) <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/84.252.55.240|84.252.55.240]] ([[User talk:84.252.55.240|talk]]) 10:16, 10 February 2011 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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{{Technical|date=September 2010}} |
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== Simplification == |
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It makes a lot of sense to me to remove unnecessary details and redundancy because the article does not target a technical audience. |
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For instance: "After responding to all written ballot comments, and a 30-day default ballot, the OpenDocument International standard went to publication in ISO, officially published November 30, 2006.", what is actually relevant here? Maybe the official date of publication. Many sentences of the article could be simplified and de-obfuscated --[[User:Arebenti|Arebenti]] ([[User talk:Arebenti|talk]]) 16:14, 6 December 2011 (UTC)--[[Special:Contributions/79.204.190.26|79.204.190.26]] ([[User talk:79.204.190.26|talk]]) 16:13, 6 December 2011 (UTC) |
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: I recommend moving almost all of the material on standardization to the web page [[OpenDocument_standardization]]. I would keep only a version of the final two paragraphs: 1) that the current version is 1.3 and 2) that there is continuing work. The rest was topical 17 years ago but not now. I will not make any changes myself.[[User:Rick Jelliffe|Rick Jelliffe]] ([[User talk:Rick Jelliffe|talk]]) 10:37, 18 June 2023 (UTC) |
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== OpenOffice.org Calc to MediaWiki == |
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How do I import an [[OpenOffice.org Calc]] spreadsheet to Wikipedia? I want to keep as much formatting as possible. [[User:Morriswa|Allen]] ([[User talk:Morriswa|talk]]) 13:07, 17 March 2012 (UTC) |
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*Reference 8 "ISO and IEC approve OpenDocument OASIS standard for data interoperability of office applications" now points to a non-existing page. <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Ckhung|Ckhung]] ([[User talk:Ckhung|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Ckhung|contribs]]) 11:45, 11 April 2010 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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*"OpenDocument 1.0 (second edition)" now points to a non-existing page. |
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* Under '''Critisism''' all the bullets but one are formulated as being verified facts. But "Microsoft believes that it is not possible to implement..." is a pessimistic, subjective statement. If it was a fact, "It is not possible to implement [ever]...", it would belong here. If we were listing bugs or feature requests this list would be VERY long. Why not remove the statement, or at least move it to a new "Microsoft's opinions" section? [[User:Gigahz|Gigahz]] ([[User talk:Gigahz|talk]]) 05:38, 22 May 2010 (UTC) |
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** Updated. --[[User:Belg4mit|Belg4mit]] ([[User talk:Belg4mit|talk]]) 04:09, 21 June 2011 (UTC) |
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:Short answer: You can't. Wikipedia has its own wiki table format. See [[Help:Wikitable]] and [[Help:Table]]. However, it can also support, within limits, simple HTML, but don't expect to spit out an HTML file with OpenOffice.org Calc and simply drag it into Wikipedia, as the MediaWiki engine won't understand 80% of the code and you'll have to do significant re-coding of the HTML anyway. — [[User:Hydrargyrum|Quicksilver]]<sup>[[User_talk:Hydrargyrum|T]] [[Special:Emailuser/Hydrargyrum|@]]</sup> 18:50, 4 April 2012 (UTC) |
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== Abusive messages & anonymous edits == |
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== Copyright Restrictions == |
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An anonymous user (at IP 82.131.94.40) has now twice removed a referenced statement from the OpenDocument Foundation without justification (and I have now reverted this twice). The same user has left a message on my talk page: "Alexbrn is a Microsoft payed [sic] piece of shit. Go lick your balls, asshole." Wikipedia at its finest? (and what do other editors think?) [[User:Alexbrn|Alexbrn]] ([[User talk:Alexbrn|talk]]) 17:47, 11 May 2010 (UTC) |
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I don't know if this were better suited to another article but I've just been trying to wrap my head around Sun's patent statement recarding OpenDocument format, specifically: |
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:a) I think that any rudeness towards other editors is against the principles of Wikipedia; perhaps you could report this person on the adminstrators notice board. |
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'' |
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One precondition of any such license granted to a party ("licensee") shall be the licensee's agreement to grant reciprocal Royalty-Free Licenses under its Essential Claims to Sun and other implementers of such specification. Sun expressly reserves all other rights it may have.'' |
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Does this mean that a book (or at least a copy of a book's text) written/made available in .odf format falls under a "reciprocal Roaylty-Free License" as well? Or does the liscence only apply to other computer programs implimenting the markup language and not documents created/saved in .odf format? |
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:b) But examination of the history and limited size of the Open Document Foundation suggests that this is hardly a reliable source to quote from, so I have removed this statement. [[User:Murray Langton|Murray Langton]] ([[User talk:Murray Langton|talk]]) 21:19, 11 May 2010 (UTC) |
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I'm currently writing a novel in open office so this means something to me. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/209.89.94.250|209.89.94.250]] ([[User talk:209.89.94.250|talk]]) 01:19, 7 June 2012 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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:: I'm not sure reliability comes into it - the central principle of Wikipedia is "verifiability, not truth" [[WP:VER]] and this organization existed, has its own Wikipedia entry, played a documented role in the development of the format under discussion, and is cited elsewhere in this entry. Removing this one mention of them has the unfortunate effect of giving this article a certain point of view [[User:Alexbrn|Alexbrn]] ([[User talk:Alexbrn|talk]]) 06:04, 12 May 2010 (UTC) |
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== Primary Sources Template == |
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:: Reliability is a consideration, see [[Wikipedia:Identifying reliable sources]]. Also, have you formally reported the abuse (if not I think you should do so)? [[User:Murray Langton|Murray Langton]] ([[User talk:Murray Langton|talk]]) 08:16, 12 May 2010 (UTC) |
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The preamble to this article invokes the Primary Sources Template which states, "This article relies on references to primary sources or sources affiliated with the subject, rather than references from independent authors and third-party publications.", as if that were a bad thing. However, in the case of an openly developed international standard, I do not think it is a bad thing. It seems to me that the Primary Sources Template is appropriate only when the source in question has some proprietary interest. In standards development, there is plenty of introspection in the process. The output of that process is precisely what _should_ be relied upon. I recommend removing the template. [[User:DrHow|DrHow]] ([[User talk:DrHow|talk]]) 21:36, 12 June 2012 (UTC) |
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:: On looking at [[WP:VER]] I see that there is a strong emphsis on reliable sources as well. [[User:Murray Langton|Murray Langton]] ([[User talk:Murray Langton|talk]]) 13:00, 12 May 2010 (UTC) |
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:On what basis? Nobody is saying that this is a bad thing - that's the reason why these templates are also called ''maintain boxes''. The template only says that the article relies on primary sources (and not on third party). Either fix the problem or let it as it is. [[User talk:Mabdul|<span style="font-family:Courier New; display:inline; border:#009 1px dashed; padding:1px 6px 2px 7px; white-space:nowrap; font-size:smaller; color:#000000;">mabdul</span>]] 11:29, 13 June 2012 (UTC) |
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::: No I haven't reported it. How do I? I suppose my question about this deletion is why is this statement from the OpenDocument Foundation removed, while another one is maintained (currently reference #27)? And there are many references in this article which fall below any quality/track-record/reliability bars this reference apparently fails. I can't see how this is consistent (and has the side-effect of airbrushing 'criticism' out of the article) Or is it time for a mass purge on this article? [[User:Alexbrn|Alexbrn]] ([[User talk:Alexbrn|talk]]) 13:40, 12 May 2010 (UTC) |
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:It is a formal issue. Means that you have to use an appropriate template, and add the ref information.--[[User:Arebenti|Arebenti]] ([[User talk:Arebenti|talk]]) 17:32, 16 July 2012 (UTC) |
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== External links modified == |
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:::: One place to report uncivil language is at [[Wikipedia:Wikiquette alerts]]. I observe that you have been editing Wikipedia for over 3 years now; perhaps you should consider looking around the site a bit more instead of focusing on only a few articles. [[User:Murray Langton|Murray Langton]] ([[User talk:Murray Langton|talk]]) 22:01, 12 May 2010 (UTC) |
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Hello fellow Wikipedians, |
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:::: I've had a look at ref #27 (a GrokLaw page). In view of the numerous comments posted it would seem that this has at least had some public scrutiny by a range of people - whether or not they actually released the software in question is another matter; perhaps you know one way or the other? [[User:Murray Langton|Murray Langton]] ([[User talk:Murray Langton|talk]]) 22:08, 12 May 2010 (UTC) |
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I have just added archive links to {{plural:2|one external link|2 external links}} on [[OpenDocument]]. Please take a moment to review [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=698642005 my edit]. If necessary, add {{tlx|cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{tlx|nobots|deny{{=}}InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes: |
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== Change to new ODF Icons? == |
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*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090615185541/http://www.ua.es:80/en/rua/formatos.html to http://www.ua.es/en/rua/formatos.html |
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*Attempted to fix sourcing for http://www.odfalliance.org/resources/fact-sheet-Microsoft-ODF-support.pdf |
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the ''checked'' parameter below to '''true''' to let others know. |
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Hi, I'd like to propose changing the file type icons. |
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{{sourcecheck|checked=true}} |
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Currently the article uses rather generic text document, spreadsheet and presentation icons from the [http://tango.freedesktop.org/Tango_Icon_Library Tango icon library]. |
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Cheers.—[[User:Cyberbot II|<sup style="color:green;font-family:Courier">cyberbot II</sup>]]<small><sub style="margin-left:-14.9ex;color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS">[[User talk:Cyberbot II|<span style="color:green">Talk to my owner</span>]]:Online</sub></small> 10:39, 7 January 2016 (UTC) |
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I propose to use the ODF icons from the [http://odftoolkit.org/ODF-Icons ODF toolkit]. |
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== odf 1.3 == |
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The ODF icons from the toolkit are neutral towards vendor, platform and application. And they express the actual format ODF. |
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odf 1.3 is out. the article is outdated--[[Special:Contributions/2A02:587:4409:2F7F:540A:1598:C962:479E|2A02:587:4409:2F7F:540A:1598:C962:479E]] ([[User talk:2A02:587:4409:2F7F:540A:1598:C962:479E|talk]]) 23:26, 14 September 2020 (UTC) |
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Any objections? How shall I proceed? |
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See |
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Thanks! Lutz. |
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--[[User:Laushh|Laushh]] ([[User talk:Laushh|talk]]) 12:09, 8 June 2010 (UTC) |
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:Just one more piece of information. The ODF icons are available under the Apache License Version 2.0. Is this "free enough" for Wikipedia? --[[User:Laushh|Laushh]] ([[User talk:Laushh|talk]]) 15:59, 8 June 2010 (UTC) |
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::Update: Done. --[[User:Laushh|Laushh]] ([[User talk:Laushh|talk]]) 14:43, 10 June 2010 (UTC) |
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https://blog.documentfoundation.org/blog/2020/01/21/odf-1-3-approved-as-oasis-committee-specification/ <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/2A02:6D40:3491:A701:51F2:1EAA:35AC:AAF2|2A02:6D40:3491:A701:51F2:1EAA:35AC:AAF2]] ([[User talk:2A02:6D40:3491:A701:51F2:1EAA:35AC:AAF2#top|talk]]) 15:10, 3 December 2020 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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== ODF database support == |
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:I agree. I have removed the 'Future' heading so that the part about 1.3 is now simply an item under 'Further standardization'. The same goes for the change-tracking part, and I do not know the status of that. But the 'further' in 'further standardization' is not entirely clear to me anyway. I guess it is just vague enough to allow for any versions to be put under this section... --[[User:MichielN|MichielN]] ([[User talk:MichielN|talk]]) 22:04, 16 September 2022 (UTC) |
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== Off-topic Link == |
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Someone has again added an infobox stating that the ODF spec supports databases. There is an archived discussion at [[Talk:OpenDocument/Archive 7#Does ODF really support databases?]] where I'm pretty sure that we decided that it didn't. Shouldn't someone do a good faith revert? [[User:Feedmecereal|Danny]] ([[User talk:Feedmecereal|talk]]) 22:46, 25 August 2010 (UTC) |
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The link at the end ''Reactions to Microsoft lobbying at ISO'' is not related to ODF (and has severe problems) and should be removed. I will not remove it. [[User:Rick Jelliffe|Rick Jelliffe]] ([[User talk:Rick Jelliffe|talk]]) 10:31, 18 June 2023 (UTC) |
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== |
== .odb ? == |
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The disambiguation page [[ODB]] claims that ".odb" is a "file extension for OpenDocument format databases", and the [[.odb]] lemma currently links to OpenDocument, however "odb" is not mentioned in the article at all. --[[User:BjKa|BjKa]] ([[User talk:BjKa|talk]]) 15:15, 30 January 2024 (UTC) |
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As currently noted in the article, several of the criticisms mentioned in this section have been addressed in the newly-adopted ODF 1.2 specification. With that in mind, is there any reason not to remove these (obsolete) criticisms? We don't need any more FUD fodder than we already have, after all. --[[User:Foolishgrunt|Foolishgrunt]] ([[User talk:Foolishgrunt|talk]]) 20:51, 21 November 2011 (UTC) |
Latest revision as of 15:15, 30 January 2024
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Untitled
[edit]Death link: http://std.dkuug.dk/keld/iso26000-odf linked text: The OASIS Committee Specification OpenDocument 1.0 (second edition) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.252.55.240 (talk) 10:16, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
This article may be too technical for most readers to understand.(September 2010) |
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This page has archives. Sections older than 60 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 4 sections are present. |
Simplification
[edit]It makes a lot of sense to me to remove unnecessary details and redundancy because the article does not target a technical audience. For instance: "After responding to all written ballot comments, and a 30-day default ballot, the OpenDocument International standard went to publication in ISO, officially published November 30, 2006.", what is actually relevant here? Maybe the official date of publication. Many sentences of the article could be simplified and de-obfuscated --Arebenti (talk) 16:14, 6 December 2011 (UTC)--79.204.190.26 (talk) 16:13, 6 December 2011 (UTC)
- I recommend moving almost all of the material on standardization to the web page OpenDocument_standardization. I would keep only a version of the final two paragraphs: 1) that the current version is 1.3 and 2) that there is continuing work. The rest was topical 17 years ago but not now. I will not make any changes myself.Rick Jelliffe (talk) 10:37, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
OpenOffice.org Calc to MediaWiki
[edit]How do I import an OpenOffice.org Calc spreadsheet to Wikipedia? I want to keep as much formatting as possible. Allen (talk) 13:07, 17 March 2012 (UTC)
- Short answer: You can't. Wikipedia has its own wiki table format. See Help:Wikitable and Help:Table. However, it can also support, within limits, simple HTML, but don't expect to spit out an HTML file with OpenOffice.org Calc and simply drag it into Wikipedia, as the MediaWiki engine won't understand 80% of the code and you'll have to do significant re-coding of the HTML anyway. — QuicksilverT @ 18:50, 4 April 2012 (UTC)
Copyright Restrictions
[edit]I don't know if this were better suited to another article but I've just been trying to wrap my head around Sun's patent statement recarding OpenDocument format, specifically: One precondition of any such license granted to a party ("licensee") shall be the licensee's agreement to grant reciprocal Royalty-Free Licenses under its Essential Claims to Sun and other implementers of such specification. Sun expressly reserves all other rights it may have.
Does this mean that a book (or at least a copy of a book's text) written/made available in .odf format falls under a "reciprocal Roaylty-Free License" as well? Or does the liscence only apply to other computer programs implimenting the markup language and not documents created/saved in .odf format?
I'm currently writing a novel in open office so this means something to me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.89.94.250 (talk) 01:19, 7 June 2012 (UTC)
Primary Sources Template
[edit]The preamble to this article invokes the Primary Sources Template which states, "This article relies on references to primary sources or sources affiliated with the subject, rather than references from independent authors and third-party publications.", as if that were a bad thing. However, in the case of an openly developed international standard, I do not think it is a bad thing. It seems to me that the Primary Sources Template is appropriate only when the source in question has some proprietary interest. In standards development, there is plenty of introspection in the process. The output of that process is precisely what _should_ be relied upon. I recommend removing the template. DrHow (talk) 21:36, 12 June 2012 (UTC)
- On what basis? Nobody is saying that this is a bad thing - that's the reason why these templates are also called maintain boxes. The template only says that the article relies on primary sources (and not on third party). Either fix the problem or let it as it is. mabdul 11:29, 13 June 2012 (UTC)
- It is a formal issue. Means that you have to use an appropriate template, and add the ref information.--Arebenti (talk) 17:32, 16 July 2012 (UTC)
External links modified
[edit]Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to 2 external links on OpenDocument. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}}
after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}}
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- Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090615185541/http://www.ua.es:80/en/rua/formatos.html to http://www.ua.es/en/rua/formatos.html
- Attempted to fix sourcing for http://www.odfalliance.org/resources/fact-sheet-Microsoft-ODF-support.pdf
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odf 1.3
[edit]odf 1.3 is out. the article is outdated--2A02:587:4409:2F7F:540A:1598:C962:479E (talk) 23:26, 14 September 2020 (UTC)
See
https://blog.documentfoundation.org/blog/2020/01/21/odf-1-3-approved-as-oasis-committee-specification/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:6D40:3491:A701:51F2:1EAA:35AC:AAF2 (talk) 15:10, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
- I agree. I have removed the 'Future' heading so that the part about 1.3 is now simply an item under 'Further standardization'. The same goes for the change-tracking part, and I do not know the status of that. But the 'further' in 'further standardization' is not entirely clear to me anyway. I guess it is just vague enough to allow for any versions to be put under this section... --MichielN (talk) 22:04, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
Off-topic Link
[edit]The link at the end Reactions to Microsoft lobbying at ISO is not related to ODF (and has severe problems) and should be removed. I will not remove it. Rick Jelliffe (talk) 10:31, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
.odb ?
[edit]The disambiguation page ODB claims that ".odb" is a "file extension for OpenDocument format databases", and the .odb lemma currently links to OpenDocument, however "odb" is not mentioned in the article at all. --BjKa (talk) 15:15, 30 January 2024 (UTC)
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