Talk:Dive Coaster

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Dive Coaster/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: John F. Lewis (talk · contribs) 19:39, 8 October 2012 (UTC)

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

1. Is it reasonably well written?

   A. Prose quality:

   B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:

2. Is it factually accurate and verifiable?

   A. References to sources:

   B. Citation of reliable sources where they are not always necessary:

   C. No original research:

3. Is it broad in its coverage?

   A. Major aspects:

   B. Focused:

4. Is it neutral?

   Fair representation without bias:

5. Is it stable?

   No edit wars, etc:

6. Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?

   A. Images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content:

   B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:

7. Overall:

   Pass or Fail:

To Fix

1. Reference 6 is a dead-link

    Done--Dom497 (talk) 20:14, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

2. Reference 7 does not specify the trains were 'Converted'. Re-find a reference or change the terminology.

    Done--Dom497 (talk) 20:23, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

3. Reference 8 lists all Dive coasters while its attached statement '90-degree vertical drop, a splashdown element, and floorless trains'

   That's because if you click each one you will see that it supports the statment. I just thought that it would be easier just to leave it as one ref then 7 different ones. If you want me to include a different ref for each dive coaster, I can do that.--Dom497 (talk) 19:56, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

   Considering a valid reason, You dont have to. If you want to, You can. John F. Lewis (talk) 20:02, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

4. Certain statements using Reference 10 may be better verified using Textual references.

   How are you supposed to show that a train stops at the top of the lift, the floors go down and up with just pictures (no news articles mention this other then fan sites?--Dom497 (talk) 19:56, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

   Is there anything (at all) that states the train stops for about 3-5 seconds? John F. Lewis (talk) 20:02, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

   Fan sites or articles written by random people. I will look around again just in case I missed something. But either way, isn't the video fine?--Dom497 (talk) 20:04, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

   The video is fine, But I was wondering if there are any textual versions that provide 3-5 seconds stop. If this is the only problem, I have no problems over looking this as the video does represent it reasonably. John F. Lewis (talk) 20:06, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

    Done Found a ref! :) --Dom497 (talk) 20:38, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

5. Wikify Image captions. It seems like an unusual request but if possible, Could you wikify captions when appropriate.

    Done--Dom497 (talk) 19:56, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

6. The article is now slightly outdated, as the Efteling dive coaster has opened already. It has floorless cars, a 4 second stop before the 37.5m drop, no splashdown and it's name is "Baron 1898". There's also a very brief section that is underground at the bottom of the drop. My source is having been on the coaster, but at least the name and the height can be found on the Efteling website (in dutch) . (I also fixed the markup of this list, it wasn't numbered right because of newlines for the lines starting with colons. To fix, I replaced the first of each of those colon sequences with a number sign. I apologise if this is bad etiquette.) 2A02:1810:4412:5B00:E15B:7E3E:2128:BEF1 (talk) 08:06, 23 July 2015 (UTC) (not a user) tacit

Eh?

I've read this four times and have literally no idea what it is trying to describe: Unlike other roller coasters where the chain lift takes the train directly to the first drop, a dive coaster has a second chain that moves the train just into the first drop and then pauses for three to five seconds before letting the train go. Other roller coasters take the train directly to the first drop. This one seems not to, but it does? Is the only difference the pause? What's the importance of there being two chains? Can someone please clarify? It's rather important that the essential definition of this type of ride is clearly explained. --Dweller (talk) 22:14, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

 Done.--Dom497 (talk) 22:49, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, I'm still none the wiser. They both have a chain that take it to the first drop. Only this type of ride has two chains that take it to the first drop? What difference does that make? --Dweller (talk) 12:46, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

Where does is say that two chains bring the train to the first drop? A typical roller coaster will have the lift hill, then the drop. A Dive Coaster has the lift hill, but not the drop (immediately). Instead, it navigates a section of track that is flat leading to the drop where a brake stops the train just as its about to go over. Watch these two videos and if you understand, then edit the article as you think it should say. "Normal" roller coaster POV Dive Coaster POV.--Dom497 (talk) 18:49, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

Is "Dive Coaster" a brand?

Is "Dive Coaster" a type of roller coaster, as the lede says? Or is it a brand of roller coaster? If it's a brand, the article should call it that, and not a type, shouldn't it? And if it isn't a brand, why is it capitalized? TypoBoy (talk) 00:50, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

To quote GoneIn60 from another discussion: "It is actually the name of a model manufactured by Bolliger & Mabillard. See their [1]."--Dom497 (talk) 20:35, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

I'll edit the article to reflect that. TypoBoy (talk) 01:47, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Dive Coaster at Efteling

Efteling has confirmed earlier that their new coaster for the 2015 season would be a B&M.

Link: http://www.eftelist.nl/mail/7579

At one point, the spokesman of Efteling confirmed the manufacturer.

Text: Koen: "We kiezen er op dit moment niet voor om naar buiten te komen met zulke specifieke informatie, maar een goed verstaander weet op basis van dit nieuws natuurlijk direct dat het inderdaad om deze fabrikant gaat. Dat kan onmogelijk een groot geheim blijven."

Translation: Koen: "We don't want to give specific information yet, but everyone who has some knowledge of roller coasters knows that, based on this information (that Efteling is planning a dive coaster for next season), this is a roller coaster from this manufacturer. It is impossible to keep that a secret."

So, actually he is saying that the manufacturer HAS to be B&M, because that is, as good as, the only possible manufacturer right now. So, according to Efteling's spokesman, Efteling's dive coaster is obviously a B&M. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.104.161.70 (talk) 11:34, 30 April 2014 (UTC)

Hi, first of all, that doesn't look like a reliable source. Secondly, he never actually said "B&M" so though it may be obvious to enthusiasts, it won't be towards the general public/readers of the article. For these reasons we can not use that ref.--Dom497 (talk) 19:44, 30 April 2014 (UTC)

Other Dive Coasters

HangTime (roller coaster) by Gerstlauer is described as a Dive Coaster on the Knott's Berry Farm website and advertisements. According to this article, Dive Coasters are made only by B&M. Even if that's trademarked, HangTime seems to fit the description of a Dive Coaster. Shouldn't it be mentioned in this article, maybe in a section "Similar Roller Coasters"? And if HangTime is a non-B&N divelike coaster, presumably there could be others. ShawnVW (talk) 13:31, 2 June 2018 (UTC)— Preceding unsigned comment added by ShawnVW (talk • contribs) 05:58, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

As it is currently written, this article is about the model of coaster that is named Dive Coaster by Bolliger & Mabillard. While there may be similar models from other manufacturers, that's not currently what this page is about. However, we do have examples of other pages that likely started out as a particular model from one manufacturer that have been expanded to include others ─ Inverted roller coaster is probably a good example. I would support the addition of other "dive-style" coasters to this page. If this page is expanded to include other manufacturer's products, then perhaps the name should be modified. At the very least I would change "coaster" to lower case so it is no longer a proper name.—JlACEer (talk) 16:20, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

Yes, if there's adequate sourcing that shows other manufacturers making similar rides, then it may be time to expand this article beyond the B&M model. The name could be changed to either Dive coaster or Diving coaster, depending on what the sources prefer. That would be a "type" addition to {{infobox roller coaster}}. --GoneIn60 (talk) 04:41, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

"Dive coaster" should not be capitalized

The many instances of "Dive Coaster" on this page are incorrectly capitalized. A dive coaster is a type of coaster, just as a red wagon is a type of wagon. It would be jarring to find a page referring repeatedly to Red Wagons, Fighter Planes, or Breakfast Cereals, and it is no less jarring here. You can't simply declare that dive coaster "is a proper noun". I know that capitalizing makes the topic feel exciting and notable, but the MOS is quite clear. Please see MOS:CAPS for a detailed discussion of the policy. Regulov (talk) 18:52, 25 February 2020 (UTC)

I see now that the argument will be that this page is not about a type of roller coaster, but a trademarked property of B&M. This is nonsense, but I'm sure very gratifying to B&M. The page is not an advertisement. Regulov (talk) 19:04, 25 February 2020 (UTC)

Feel free to show us examples of where "dive coaster" is used as a generic term. Otherwise, I would not object to renaming this page B&M Dive Coaster as was done with Gerstlauer Euro-Fighter—JlACEer (talk) 22:54, 25 February 2020 (UTC)

The wing coaster article was recently renamed from Wing Coaster, because sources have been using the term in a generic sense, referring to a type or class of roller coaster. It also covers examples from other manufacturers. The same cannot be said about Dive Coaster, at least not yet. If you have sources that state otherwise, bring 'em to the table. Until then, we should treat Dive Coaster as a proper name like we'd treat EliteBook or Xbox One. --GoneIn60 (talk) 06:13, 26 February 2020 (UTC)

"This is nonsense, but I'm sure very gratifying to B&M. The page is not an advertisement."

B&M wouldn't give two shits about some Wikipedia article, and if you're going to lob a claim about advertising, you ought to follow through and explain your position. This article covers the technology, design and concept developed by B&M, and the intention isn't any different than other articles covering products from other companies. --GoneIn60 (talk) 09:13, 26 February 2020 (UTC)