Jump to content

Talk:Amber Rudd: Difference between revisions

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Browse history interactively
← Previous edit
Content deleted Content added
VisualWikitext
→Windrush scandal: new section
Added talk header
 
(41 intermediate revisions by 18 users not shown)
Line 1: Line 1:
{{Talk page header}}
{{Controversial}}
{{Controversial}}
{{WikiProjectBannerShell|blp=yes|1=
{{WikiProject banner shell|class=B|blp=yes|listas=Rudd, Amber|1=
{{WikiProject Biography |living=yes |class=C |listas=Rudd, Amber |politician-work-group=yes |politician-priority=Low}}
{{WikiProject Biography |politician-work-group=yes |politician-priority=Low}}
{{WikiProject Journalism |class=C |importance=low}}
{{WikiProject Journalism|importance=Low}}
{{WP London|class=C}}
{{WikiProject London|importance=Low}}
{{WikiProject Politics of the United Kingdom |class=C |importance=Mid}}
{{WikiProject Politics of the United Kingdom|importance=Mid}}
{{WikiProject Sussex |class=C |importance=low}}
{{WikiProject Sussex|importance=Low}}
{{WikiProject Women |class=C |importance=Low}}
{{WikiProject Women}}
}}
}}
{{Press
{{Press
Line 16: Line 17:
| quote = "Who are these Wikipedia goblins changing history?"
| quote = "Who are these Wikipedia goblins changing history?"
}}
}}
{{User:MiszaBot/config
|archiveheader = {{talkarchivenav}}
|maxarchivesize = 75K
|counter = 1
|minthreadsleft = 3
|minthreadstoarchive = 1
|algo = old(28d)
|archive = Talk:Amber Rudd/Archive %(counter)d
}}
{{archives|search=yes}}


== Amber Rudd resigns as Work and Pensions Secretary ==
==BLP sources template==
Are these ok now? Time to remove the template? --[[Special:Contributions/217.155.32.221|217.155.32.221]] ([[User talk:217.155.32.221|talk]]) 08:57, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

== Rudd’s apparent conflict of interest ==

I see that the information I added on 9 July last year when I created the subsection 'Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change’ (and subsequently expanded) has been repeatedly deleted. I'll try and find some better sources (though ''[[Private Eye]]'' is pretty reliable when it reports on issues like this). In the meantime I see that it was good enough for ''[[Newsweek]]'', who have [http://europe.newsweek.com/amber-rudd-profile-who-britains-new-home-secretary-480338 used the WP article almost verbatim] in places! [[User:JezGrove|JezGrove]] ([[User talk:JezGrove|talk]]) 08:49, 15 July 2016 (UTC)
: If you have a read of [[WP:BLPSOURCES]] you will see that tabloids such as Private Eye are not appropriate for biographies of living persons. [[User:Absolutelypuremilk|Absolutelypuremilk]] ([[User talk:Absolutelypuremilk|talk]]) 10:05, 15 July 2016 (UTC)
:: I'm sorry, I followed your link but couldn't see any reference to ''Private Eye'' – and it certainly isn't a tabloid. I see that [[Wikipedia:Identifying reliable sources#News organizations]] actually cites ''Private Eye'' (note 3) to back up its arguments! Anyway, perhaps we could use [http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/decc-must-come-clean-over-decision-making-process-says-green-mp-caroline-lucas-10272267.html this source] if you find it more acceptable? [[User:JezGrove|JezGrove]] ([[User talk:JezGrove|talk]]) 10:33, 15 July 2016 (UTC)
::: Tabloid in the sense of their [[Tabloid journalism|journalism]], not their [[Tabloid (newspaper format)|format]]. The Independent source is acceptable and feel free to add it. However note that the Independent doesn't claim that Rudd is making the decision, unlike Private Eye (perhaps proving the point). [[User:Absolutelypuremilk|Absolutelypuremilk]] ([[User talk:Absolutelypuremilk|talk]]) 11:07, 15 July 2016 (UTC)
::::The Eye is many things, but on the investigative journalism side it certainly isn't tabloid in style. Incidentally, its report (July 2015) was about the separate potential COI concerning Hinkley Point C nuclear power station in Somerset, while ''The Independent'''s article is from May 2015 and concerns the Halite Energy Group's proposed gas storage facility in Lancashire. In both cases, Rudd's department was faced with major decisions directly affecting companies represented by the PR firm her brother was the founder and chairman of. [[User:JezGrove|JezGrove]] ([[User talk:JezGrove|talk]]) 12:40, 15 July 2016 (UTC)

== small note ==
Just a note here to mention an old media mention. The ''[[London Evening Standard]]'' worked out how to view a revision history in 2015, for which I congratulate them of course, and also said "Unlike Shapps, the changes have been made by several users, some new. Who are these Wikipedia goblins changing history?"<ref>{{Cite news|url=|title=Changing face of Amber|last=Lo Dico|first=Joy|date=18 May 2015|work=[[London Evening Standard]]|page=17|access-date=|via=}}</ref> I think there might be a talk page template for this, but I could not find anything with documentation. [[User:MPS1992|MPS1992]] ([[User talk:MPS1992|talk]]) 20:23, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
: The template is {{press|collapsed=no|date= | url= |title= |org= }} but we need the url of the article. [[User:Absolutelypuremilk|Absolutelypuremilk]] ([[User talk:Absolutelypuremilk|talk]]) 21:30, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
::Thank you! It seems to work fine -- this is press coverage, just as the name of the template suggests, not social media or Web 2.0 or any such new-fangled thing. [[User:MPS1992|MPS1992]] ([[User talk:MPS1992|talk]]) 21:46, 19 July 2016 (UTC)

{{reflist}}

== Early life and education ==

Anonymous editor refers to father as a "descendant of King James 1st" and cites an Angelfire page for evidence. <ref>http://www.angelfire.com/realm/gotha/Part7.htm</ref> I have reverted these edits as this does not seem notable enough. The IP address appears to be from inside the Houses of Parliament, or at least in the IP range used by the twitter account Parliament WikiEdits <ref>https://twitter.com/parliamentedits</ref> [[User:SciHalo|SciHalo]] ([[User talk:SciHalo|talk]] 14:19, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
:Further the family tree seems to have Ethne Fitzgerald as being a descendant of James 1, not her father. It seems like her mother might be in the [[FitzGerald dynasty]].
:We really need better sources for this. I can believe her father full name might be Anthony. --[[User:Salix alba|Salix alba]] ([[User talk:Salix alba|talk]]): 16:24, 21 July 2016 (UTC)

{{reflist}}

== Your recent reverts ==

Greetings [[User talk:Absolutelypuremilk|APM]], re revision 743978989, the unnamed FT chief I wanted to avoid suggestions of [[wp:weasel]].
re revision 741003076, although you normally give excellent edit reasons, I can't see much wrong with this as [[Molly Scott Cato]] was operating -as many politicians do -under editorial control. The Telegraph owners live in a rage of tax havens. I will make sure the article is more clearly attributed & reinsert it. Regards [[User:JRPG|JRPG]] ([[User talk:JRPG|talk]])
: Thanks for replying here, the reason I removed the Molly Scott Cato comment was because her comment was not surprising given she is from an opposing party and didn't seem to add anything new. Similarly if Corbyn does something and a Tory MP complained about it, we wouldn't include it (unless it was notable in its own right). [[User:Absolutelypuremilk|Absolutelypuremilk]] ([[User talk:Absolutelypuremilk|talk]]) 13:58, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

== Business career reverts ==

I'm disappointed to see that edits sourced to ''[[Private Eye]]'' have yet again been reverted on the basis of 'tabloid' journalism. As I have previously pointed out on this page (in the section 'Rudd’s apparent conflict of interest' above) Wikipedia's very own article [[Wikipedia:Identifying reliable sources#News organizations]] cites ''Private Eye'' to back up its arguments. Yes, the 'Eye' can be scurrilous when it is being satirical, but it also conducts and publishes serious investigative journalism, too; although since the best results are usually piggy-backed without acknowledgment by other less courageous media organisations when the facts have safely been established it perhaps doesn't get the credit it deserves. For what it's worth, I certainly haven't noticed Rudd or any of her family challenging its recent very detailed ''In the City'' revelations about their business transactions as being factually correct. [[User:JezGrove|JezGrove]] ([[User talk:JezGrove|talk]]) 23:40, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
:Irrespective of whether Private Eye is or isn't a tabloid, it's really quite bizarre that some editors apparently seem to believe that a detailed audit of the annual P&L of each company she was a director of is essential to include an encyclopedia entry about a Cabinet Minister. [[User:Dtellett|Dtellett]] ([[User talk:Dtellett|talk]]) 20:57, 1 November 2016 (UTC)
::Agreed, we don't do this sort of thing for other Cabinet ministers. Let's not set a precedent here. [[User:This is Paul|This is Paul]] ([[User talk:This is Paul|talk]]) 21:14, 1 November 2016 (UTC)

The ''Business Career'' section is now a redacted mess and it makes very little sense, is incorrect chronologically and is very lacking in actual detail.
This article<ref>[https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/sep/21/amber-rudd-monticello-ill-fated-step-complicated-career-bahamas-leaks The Guardian 21/9/2016]</ref> is a well-researched source from a major UK national newspaper. It isn't necessary to use this much detail, or to copy it directly, but it does show that Rudd's business career was far from that described in the current Wiki entry. The article and many other press column inches shows that her career was fairly controversial and not just as simple as an investment banker then a venture capitalist as her own website states<ref>[https://www.amberrudd.co.uk/about-amber-rudd Amber Rudd (MP)]</ref> [[User:Andrew ranfurly|Andrew ranfurly]] ([[User talk:Andrew ranfurly|talk]]) 00:56, 13 December 2016 (UTC)

{{reflist}}

== Unrelated links below ==

Unrelated links below <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/86.140.9.23|86.140.9.23]] ([[User talk:86.140.9.23#top|talk]]) 19:08, 12 December 2016 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Edit warring ==

[[User:86.140.9.23|86.140.9.23]] please stop edit warring and discuss here on the talk page. Have a look at [[WP:OR]] before you add this content again. [[User:Absolutelypuremilk|Absolutelypuremilk]] ([[User talk:Absolutelypuremilk|talk]]) 22:33, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
: [[User:Absolutelypuremilk|Absolutelypuremilk]], for someone who claims to be a "PhD student" you appear to be a complete f*cktard when it comes to reading the cited references.
- The BBC
- The Guardian
- Companies House.

[[User:This is Paul|This is Paul]]
Similarly re: cited refs.

Both of you,
cease & desist from reverting Rudd's business dealings. [[User:86.140.9.23|86.140.9.23]] 19:17, 12 December 2016

: [[User:86.140.9.23|86.140.9.23]], can you show us your BBC/Guardian source for the content you are adding? [[User:Absolutelypuremilk|Absolutelypuremilk]] ([[User talk:Absolutelypuremilk|talk]]) 13:45, 13 December 2016 (UTC)

==Ancestry and connections==
I removed the claim that Rudd is a descendant of King Charles II of England and a distant relation of [[Samantha Cameron]]. It was sourced to a ''Daily Mail'' article, a publication which, of course, Wikipedia does not consider reliable. Even if there are any usable source, it is hardly important enough for the summary, in which it was until a few minutes ago. A ''Telegraph'' article adds the Queen to Charles II (but does not mention Mrs Cameron), but draws only on the ''Mail'' article as a source.<ref>{{cite news|url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/politics/four-weddings-safe-sex-poetry-7-things-need-know-amber-rudd/|title=Four Weddings to safe sex poetry: 7 things you need to know about Amber Rudd|work=The Telegraph|date=1 June 2017|accessdate=2 June 2017}}</ref> So that is probably best not used too. [[User:Philip Cross|Philip Cross]] ([[User talk:Philip Cross|talk]]) 19:09, 2 June 2017 (UTC)

: Googling, I have found no really good sources to make these details about Rudd's supposed distant living relations or ancestor at all worth including. [[User:Philip Cross|Philip Cross]] ([[User talk:Philip Cross|talk]]) 19:17, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
::When you consider just how many of us are probably descended from Charles II about ten times over, it really cannot be classed as notable or even interesting. [[User:Valetude|Valetude]] ([[User talk:Valetude|talk]]) 19:29, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

{{reflist}}

== First Secretary of State ==

What is the source that Rudd has been appointed FSoS? She is not listed as such in the announcement from No. 10, on the official list of the Cabinet or on the Home Office web page of her. Did someone make up an alternate fact somewhere along the way? [[Special:Contributions/98.10.165.90|98.10.165.90]] ([[User talk:98.10.165.90|talk]]) 21:16, 9 June 2017 (UTC)

Have amended both pages to reflect this. Same user keeps changing it. Have mentioned need for source to confirm, can't find anything myself. [[User:Loobeloo|Loobeloo]] ([[User talk:Loobeloo|talk]]) 13:57, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

:Well, that's settled - [[Damian Green]] has been appointed First Secretary of State now. [[User:JezGrove|JezGrove]] ([[User talk:JezGrove|talk]]) 17:27, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

== External links modified ==

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 4 external links on [[Amber Rudd]]. Please take a moment to review [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=788769053 my edit]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit [[User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot|this simple FaQ]] for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150518072720/http://www.hastings.gov.uk/decisions_democracy/voting_petitioning_having_your_say/elections_voting/electionresults/?elecdate=07052015&electype=general to http://www.hastings.gov.uk/decisions_democracy/voting_petitioning_having_your_say/elections_voting/electionresults/?elecdate=07052015&electype=general
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130103080238/http://amberrudd.co.uk/news/better-transport-a-fairer-deal-for-fishermen-in-maiden-speech/ to http://amberrudd.co.uk/news/better-transport-a-fairer-deal-for-fishermen-in-maiden-speech/
*Added {{tlx|dead link}} tag to http://amberrudd.co.uk/news/complete-the-link/
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20170324174008/http://failover-www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/newsreview/features/article1406580.html to http://failover-www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/newsreview/features/article1406580.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20131207153551/http://www.thestleonardsacademy.org/governors.php to http://www.thestleonardsacademy.org/governors.php

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

{{sourcecheck|checked=false|needhelp=}}

Cheers.—[[User:InternetArchiveBot|'''<span style="color:darkgrey;font-family:monospace">InternetArchiveBot</span>''']] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">([[User talk:InternetArchiveBot|Report bug]])</span> 11:22, 3 July 2017 (UTC)

== Email ==

{{replyto|Absolutelypuremilk}} Firstly greetings, and apologies for the delay in responding -I'm trying to get an acceptable meaningful compromise here. It is essential to show enough information to allow the reader to judge the naivety displayed by Rudd. Anyone of the millions who has worked for HMG will have had a security briefing, will have been told of the risk of imposters and the consequences to their career of a security breach. FWIW even the medical charity I now work with doesn't allow Microsoft Outlook if patient details are involved. You may find it of general interest to look at [[ECHELON]]. Regards [[User:JRPG|JRPG]] ([[User talk:JRPG|talk]]) 11:16, 28 August 2017 (UTC)

==Windrush scandal==

Another significant 'controversy' with which Rudd is key protagonist: felt a note should be made here, at the least, if changes to page are withheld til dust settles (though at time of writing, this issue ''is'' that a statement has been released: it's just contradicted by earlier evidence). For a user better practiced in toeing the line with living political figures. [[User:Tosk Albanian|Tosk Albanian]] ([[User talk:Tosk Albanian|talk]]) 15:15, 20 April 2018 (UTC)

== Breaking: Amber Rudd resigns ==


Resignation letter: https://twitter.com/AmberRuddHR/status/1170429481879842817?s=20
I think 10 Downing Street confirms this minute that Amber Rudd has resigned as Home Secretary. -- [[Special:Contributions/87.102.116.36|87.102.116.36]] ([[User talk:87.102.116.36|talk]]) 21:06, 29 April 2018 (UTC)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49623737


Amber has resigned, saying she cannot "stand by" while "loyal moderate Conservatives are expelled".
== Is she still Minister for Women & Equalities? ==


In her resignation letter, she said she no longer believed leaving the EU with a deal was the government's "main objective".
Has she resigned from that position simultaneously? I'd assume so. [[User:LordYarnspinner|LordYarnspinner]] ([[User talk:LordYarnspinner|talk]]) 21:20, 29 April 2018 (UTC) [[User:LordYarnspinner|LordYarnspinner]] ([[User talk:LordYarnspinner|talk]]) 21:20, 29 April 2018 (UTC)


She described the sacking of 21 Tory MPs on Tuesday as an "assault on decency and democracy".
== Copyright on signature ? ==


In her resignation letter to the prime minister she said: "I joined your cabinet in good faith: accepting that 'No Deal' had to be on the table, because it was the means by which we would have the best chance of achieving a new deal to leave on 31 October.
I wondered about the law related to the copyright of signatures. Here's what WP says:


"However I no longer believe leaving with a deal is the government's main objective."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signature#Copyright


== Is she still the fastest-rising politician to a Great Office of State since the Second World War? ==
So I wonder a bit about the statement connected to the signature image on this page as
the author decided that there cannot be any copyright as the whole information in the
image is public knowledge. Personally I understand how this statement may be true but
I also have my reservations. Maybe somebody knows for sure ... JB. --[[Special:Contributions/92.195.51.183|92.195.51.183]] ([[User talk:92.195.51.183|talk]]) 00:50, 30 April 2018 (UTC)


This article cites a 2016 source, which states that Rudd was (presumably, at the time of publication of the linked source) the fastest-rising politician to a Great Office of State (i.e. Prime Minister, Chancellor of the Exchequer, Foreign Secretary, Home Secretary) since the Second World War - she became an MP in 2010, and was promoted to Home Secretary in 2016, which means her rise to a Great Office of State took slightly over 6 years. However, [[Rishi Sunak]] was elected as an MP in 2015, and became Chancellor of the Exchequer in 2020 - less than 5 years after becoming an MP. Is it worth updating this article to reflect this, or should we try to find a source to update Sunak's article? Or does no one care? Just wondering if this now-inaccurate piece of information was worth correcting.
== [[Windrush scandal]] ==


== wrong website ==
{{editprotected}}
Please remove the "''Main article''" link as it redirects straight back to the same section. -- BobTheIP editing as [[Special:Contributions/88.111.202.102|88.111.202.102]] ([[User talk:88.111.202.102|talk]]) 12:15, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
Sorra, but this website is no longer working: amberrudd.co.uk. Have a look please.--[[User:Cabanero|Cabanero]] ([[User talk:Cabanero|talk]]) 11:37, 3 December 2023 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 14:26, 13 February 2024

Amber Rudd resigns as Work and Pensions Secretary

[edit]

Resignation letter: https://twitter.com/AmberRuddHR/status/1170429481879842817?s=20 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49623737

Amber has resigned, saying she cannot "stand by" while "loyal moderate Conservatives are expelled".

In her resignation letter, she said she no longer believed leaving the EU with a deal was the government's "main objective".

She described the sacking of 21 Tory MPs on Tuesday as an "assault on decency and democracy".

In her resignation letter to the prime minister she said: "I joined your cabinet in good faith: accepting that 'No Deal' had to be on the table, because it was the means by which we would have the best chance of achieving a new deal to leave on 31 October.

"However I no longer believe leaving with a deal is the government's main objective."

Is she still the fastest-rising politician to a Great Office of State since the Second World War?

[edit]

This article cites a 2016 source, which states that Rudd was (presumably, at the time of publication of the linked source) the fastest-rising politician to a Great Office of State (i.e. Prime Minister, Chancellor of the Exchequer, Foreign Secretary, Home Secretary) since the Second World War - she became an MP in 2010, and was promoted to Home Secretary in 2016, which means her rise to a Great Office of State took slightly over 6 years. However, Rishi Sunak was elected as an MP in 2015, and became Chancellor of the Exchequer in 2020 - less than 5 years after becoming an MP. Is it worth updating this article to reflect this, or should we try to find a source to update Sunak's article? Or does no one care? Just wondering if this now-inaccurate piece of information was worth correcting.

wrong website

[edit]

Sorra, but this website is no longer working: amberrudd.co.uk. Have a look please.--Cabanero (talk) 11:37, 3 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:Amber_Rudd&oldid=1206932807"