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m Maintain {{WPBS}}: 3 WikiProject templates. Keep majority rating "GA" in {{WPBS}}. Remove 2 same ratings as {{WPBS}} in {{WikiProject Biography}}, {{WikiProject United States}}.
 
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|dykentry= ... that '''[[William L. Uanna]]''' was responsible for security for the [[509th Composite Group]], which carried out the [[atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki|atomic bombing missions]], and for the state visit of [[Nikita Khrushchev]] in 1959?
|dykentry= ... that '''[[William L. Uanna]]''' was responsible for security for the [[509th Composite Group]], which carried out the [[atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki|atomic bombing missions]], and for the state visit of [[Nikita Khrushchev]] in 1959?
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{{Connected contributor|CIC7|editedhere=yes|declared=yes|otherlinks= COI declared [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=William_L._Uanna&diff=prev&oldid=621263902 here] and [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3ACIC7&type=revision&diff=615711094&oldid=578189816 here]}}
{{Connected contributor|CIC7|editedhere=yes|declared=yes|otherlinks= COI declared [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=William_L._Uanna&diff=prev&oldid=621263902 here] and [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3ACIC7&type=revision&diff=615711094&oldid=578189816 here]}}
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{{COI editnotice}}

==Untitled==
Thanks to DragonflySixtyseven for the redirect and additions.

== Contributing information to William L. Uanna ==

This evening I added a few images to Wikimedia. They are photographs and an FBI background investigation conducted for the Atomic Energy Commission. The FBI document verifies Uanna's service as head of investigations at First Service Command Boston and with Tenth Corps. In addition I included a picture of Uanna with the mission to Nagasaki to study bomb damage and a picture of him at a US Marine Security Guard Graduation. And there are some other pictures. I have hundreds of documents and pictures from his personal file and FOI requests. I have Uanna's Foreign Service Essay which is very informative. And employment applications that he filled out for the various jobs he held, each one giving more information on the other. Some of the people who are the recipients of the documents are David Lilienthal, Carroll Wilson, J. Edgar Hoover, Sheffield Edwards, Edward Lansdale, Mickey Ladd, V.P. Keay, Otto Otepka and others... I have over 50 newspaper clippings form his days as an athlete at Medford High School and Tufts University. And many newspaper and magazine articles about his career during the war and after. This is the first time I used Wikimedia, I did it under the name CIC777, category Bud Uanna. At this point I am unfamiliar with the process. I have a number of FBI Documents that I feel are very interesting. And the one from Ed Lansdale could have some significance. I appreciate the editing that has been done on this site and want to help clear up any questions about Uanna's bona fides. <small><span class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/CIC7|contribs]]) 02:17, 9 December 2013 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== William Uanna more information on Wikimedia Commons ==

I have uploaded some files and pictures to Wikimedia. I will add more soon. The Foreign Service Essay is an overview of Uanna's career. Background investigations memo's and employment applications fill in more details. The FBI files from the AEC and AFSWP 1946-1949 tell me that the FBI was on the outside looking in. Thanks for all the editing.[[User:CIC777|CIC777]] ([[User talk:CIC777|talk]]) 20:02, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

== Bud Uanna on Wikimedia Commons ==

I have uploaded some more files and pictures today to the Commons. I am still a novice at this. I would appreciate any help. I feel that some of these pictures and documents have historical significance. I am trying to keep any bias I have out of the descriptions, but still[[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 21:04, 21 December 2013 (UTC) give enough information to encourage but not lead researchers. It is a fine. Thank you for your edits.

== "Bud Uanna" images being deleted from Wikimedia==

Hello, earlier this morning I uploaded some more images to Wikimedia. They relate to Air Force One, John Foster Dulles, Bud Uanna's passport... images are being deleted from the Category:Bud Uanna. I would appreciate any help anyone can give me. I thought Wikimedia was the way to get images into Wikipedia. Most of the images relate to William Lewis "Bud" Uanna - now deceased. They are newspapers, photos he owned, books in which the author and date of publication is given ... I was very encouraged with the additions made to the William L. Uanna page. I am convinced it can be a page of interest to many readers.
--[[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 15:03, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

== Advice - Wikimedia upload removals. ==

Hello, I asking for help and or advice on the trouble I am having with Wikimedia and uploads that I put on Category:Bud Uanna. It seems that certain individuals are intent on removing uploads. One that I am especially concerned with is about a book called Above Top Secret by Timothy Good. This was removed almost immediately because I did not use "Copyright" although I gave the date of publication and all other information that I felt was necessary. This upload connected the 509th Composite Group to the Roswell - UFO incident. Other things were mentioned in that upload. It does not seem fair to me that someone can just delete something that is put up. There have been quite number of removals. I would appreciate any help or advice that anyone can give. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 21:34, 2 July 2014 (UTC)

:Can you provide links to any relevant discussions? [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 16:11, 3 July 2014 (UTC)
I'm sorry I don't know exactly what you mean.[[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 01:41, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

:What I mean is that you're saying that you've had a problem with uploads, and I don't know if you mean uploads to Wikipedia or to Commons, and where to find them. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 16:28, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

==Tags==
I've tagged this article for COI and OR, as a person claiming to be the subject's son has been introducing original research, edit warring over it for inclusion. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 21:43, 17 August 2014 (UTC)

Both tags removed, as the OR has been cured and the COI seems manageable at this time. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 16:09, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

=="Murder"==
The article contains the following under the subject header "film portrayals":
<blockquote>At the end of the movie Enola Gay, an update of the post World War II careers of the movie's main characters was shown. In a short clip showing Macht in his role as Bud Uanna it said "Stephen Macht as Major William "Bud" Uanna - Uanna became a member of the CIA and was murdered in Africa, any records of his death have subsequently disappeared."</blockquote>
Some movie, not a documentary but a fictionalized account, says something. So what? It is unsubstantiated and a rather wild allegation, totally at variance with the New York Times obituary which stated that he died of a heart attack. Such a serious and troubling statement, in effect indicating skullduggery of some kind as well as a cover story propagated to the public, requires multiple reliable sources if it is to be included in the article. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 14:01, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
:All it is doing is reporting what the movie says, and that is not in dispute. On what basis are multiple sources required? [[User:Hawkeye7|Hawkeye7]] ([[User talk:Hawkeye7|talk]]) 21:30, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
::[[WP:FRINGE]]. It's a fringe theory. Being mentioned at the end of a movie of unknown reliability is insufficient for inclusion. For all we know, it could have been made up out of whole cloth. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 22:06, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
:::But is the mention of it [[WP:UNDUE]]? [[User:Hawkeye7|Hawkeye7]] ([[User talk:Hawkeye7|talk]]) 22:50, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
::::We're not even at that point in the analysis because we are utilizing a fictional film as a source for an allegation about the subject's death. If it was a documentary by a credible person I would feel differently. But this is some words on the screen at the end of an obscure 1980 fiction film that mixes fact and fiction. The most we should say is that Uanna was portrayed by Macht in the film. We shouldn't use the "film portrayals" section to repeat factual claims like this, even innocent ones, much less fringe theories, in fictional works. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 02:44, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
::::I found this film on YouTube. I won't link to it as it is a copyright violation. It was a TV movie. No, we don't care what TV movies say about real people, except in the article about the TV movie. This might he worth an article as it stars [[Billy Crystal]]. The statement about his death is UNDUE there; here, to answer your query above, yes it is UNDUE here too, for this "murder" accusation would inappropriately dominate the "film portrayals" section. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 03:12, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
* I am pleased that the article is up for GA, and there appears to be few barriers to its promotion. Uanna is an important and interesting historical figure. As long as we rely on the very good sourcing available it certainly should qualify. Ancestry, as noted below, is problematic. But otherwise it seems to be in good shape. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 15:53, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

==Murdered in Africa==
I would like to request that some editor put the inclusion of the statement that was make at the end of the movie ENOLA GAY that William Uanna was murdered in Africa on the Request for comment on articles page. I am his son and I have given my opinion on this a number of times. To me, my father was a part of history, although he was written out of it by some authors like Leslie Groves, Kenneth Nichols... William Uanna was portrayed in 3 movies. He was also featured in many newspaper articles and included in books. The fact that the movie ENOLA GAY said he was murdered is a fact. Was the movie up to snuff. Watch it yourself. All the way to the end where it says he was murdered. Whoever watches it can make up their own mind up. That is all I ask. Would the producers of the movie put something like that in just to spice up a movie that was already one of the most controversial subjects of the century? That's a starting question for someone who watches the movie. Food for thought and research. I wish the issue were put before some editors for comment. Then it can go to Mediation if necessary. Thank you, Steven Uanna <small><span class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/CIC7|contribs]]) 20:02, 3 November 2015 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:William Uanna ''is'' a part of history. His fame ("notability" in Wikipedia jargon) is clearly established. Nothing will diminish now. Part of the pleasure of working on the Manhattan Project articles has been ensuring that Uanna, and others like him receive due acknowledgment, and will not be written out. [[User:Hawkeye7|Hawkeye7]] ([[User talk:Hawkeye7|talk]]) 01:26, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
::"Their seed shall remain for ever, and their glory shall not be blotted out. Their bodies are buried in peace; but their name liveth for evermore." Ecclesiasticus 44:14-15
Thank you Hawkeye7. I really appreciate your input. Ecclesiastes 9:13-18 [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 20:21, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

==FOI disclosures==
The material [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=William_L._Uanna&diff=722213420&oldid=722190654 here] is not verifiable and of questionable utility in the article. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 18:00, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

<small>(below moved from Figureofnine talk page [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 16:36, 27 May 2016 (UTC))</small>

Hello. Can you tell me what information prompted you to undo. As I think you know William "Bud" Uanna was my father. I have a wealth of information about him. I think he was a part of history. Can we discuss this on my User talk:CIC7 page? Thank you, Steven Uanna [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 20:25, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

:See above. See previous discussions re [[WP:OR]]. Also the material in question, and the other text you reverted yesterday, is trivia and puffery in additional to being original research. Not going to repeat myself, even if I had the time to deal with your refusal to "get" Wiki policies, so that is all I have to say on this. (Note: user blocked 24 hours but presumably will be free to contribute to this page upon lifting of block) [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 16:36, 27 May 2016 (UTC)

==To CIC7==
Steven will you please respond to the note I left at your talk page [[User_talk:CIC7#Conflict_of_interest_in_Wikipedia|here]]? Thanks. [[User:Jytdog|Jytdog]] ([[User talk:Jytdog|talk]]) 21:04, 27 May 2016 (UTC)
{{Talk:William L. Uanna/GA3}}

:Hello. Jytdog has informed me about the Wikipedia policies, we discussed them on my CIC7 Talk page and I will do my best to follow the guidelines. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 23:25, 31 May 2016 (UTC)

==Undue weight==
Am tagging per my comment in the reassessment. There is insufficient text on Uanna's role in the Manhattan Project. I think that is self-evident. We don't even have an enough for a separate section. Absurd. Will address this personally upon my return to regular editing but am tagging in the interim. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 20:18, 3 June 2016 (UTC)

:Have removed tag, as noted, because the amount of text on the project has been greatly expanded. I hope to contribute to this section myself but at this time am contributing only sporadically. I would implore my brethren to concentrate on this and not on the postwar career, which at this time is overemphasized and excessive in detail. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 11:49, 12 June 2016 (UTC)

==Community reassessment==
{{Wikipedia:Good article reassessment/William L. Uanna/1}}

==William L. Uanna Marine Security Guards==
I would like to open a discussion about Uanna's career at the U.S. Department of State where he was the Chief of the Division of Physical Security and his relation to the Marine Security Guards. Uanna appears to have had a varied career after the Manhattan Project and the Marine Security Guards - MSG's appear to be one of his accomplishments at the State Department. I refer to the line "Over time, the Marine Security Guards have become the "custodians"...My issue is the term "over time" as if it just evolved. In fact they are "custodians" by law - Title 10 USC 5983. This can be viewed at www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/5983. The web site Marine Corps Embassy Security Guard Group at www.msg-history.com/detachments/MCESC/MCESC_V.1.html gives a timeline of events leading up to the law. "Over time" is an oversimplification of the difficulty encountered by the Department of State and Marine Corps to bring the Marines into the Department of State. It almost did not happen. This is explained at the Security of the Department of State web site at www.state.gov/documents/organization/176702.pdf. Start at p.137 for the Marine Security Guard Story. Uanna is pictured some pages down and some of his duties described. I invite other editors to review these documents and consider revising the "over time" statement. It diminishes the efforts put into the Marine Guard program, like diplomatic immunity and Top Secret Clearances for the Guards. Uanna may have played the leading role at the Department of State. He is the only civilian on the stage in the picture showing the Marine Guard graduation that is featured on the William L. Uanna page and a photo on Category:Bud Uanna on Wikimedia - Bud Uanna State Department Marine Security Guards p.2.jpg shows him shaking hands with a Marine officer. The picture is signed "To Wm. L. Uanna with sincere appreciation, R.E. Roach. A Lt. Col. R.E. Roach is listed as the Commanding Officer of the Marine Security Guards on the Marine Corps Embassy Security Guard Group web site timeline referred to above. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 02:51, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

:Hi CIC7 - what would be most useful, would be to write here what language you would like to see. Like: Can we please change ""Over time, the Marine Security Guards have become the "custodians"" to "blah blah blah" cited to these sources:
:* [https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/5983 Title 10 USC 5983]
:* [https://www.state.gov/documents/organization/176702.pdf Chapter 4, McCarthyism and the Cold War: Diplomatic Security in the 1950s] p. 137 in [https://www.state.gov/documents/organization/176589.pdf History of the Bureau of Diplomatic Security of the United States Department of State United States Department of State], Bureau of Diplomatic Security, Printed October 2011

:Please note that www.msg-history.com/detachments/MCESC/MCESC_V.1.html is a dead link.

:Please provide the exact change you would like to see and please make sure that the sources you give provide support for the content. Thx [[User:Jytdog|Jytdog]] ([[User talk:Jytdog|talk]]) 03:33, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

::I will write a suggested change. The link I provided to the Marine Corps Embassy Security Group website does work on the search engine "mywebsearch" it takes you to their search engine page and that takes you to the timeline section within the MCESG website to view the timeline of events concerning the Marines and the State Department. Also I wanted to mention that notes 42, 48 and 57 of Chapter 4 of the Department of State website mentioned above show more of Uanna's involvement bringing the Marines into the Department of State. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 22:00, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

:::Great editing. Can we please change: "He them published the Protection of Dignitaries Manual and developed the handbook used at the training school for Marine Security Guards who would be employed as "custodians" of U. S. Embassies, legations and consulates overseas." to "He then published the Protection of Dignitaries Manual and developed the handbook used at the training school for Marine Security Guards who would be posted to U. S. Embassies, legations and consulates overseas as "custodians". This seems like a small change but I suggest this because my reading of the Wikipedia [[Marine Security Guard]] page linked to William L. Uanna seems to describes the Marines position not as employees but unique and elite members of the diplomatic community. I had thought of using the term "deployed" but that seems like a term that should be used for larger military groups. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 00:01, 8 June 2016 (UTC)
::::{{done}} [[User:Hawkeye7|Hawkeye7]] ([[User talk:Hawkeye7|talk]]) 00:51, 8 June 2016 (UTC)
:::::Thank you. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 00:00, 9 June 2016 (UTC)
::::::This strikes me as excessive and unnecessary detail in a section of the article that needs to be cut back, not expanded. If there is going to be bloat in the non-Manhattan Project areas of this article then it is a backwards step. This strikes me as routine biographical material and not especially notable. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 21:34, 11 June 2016 (UTC)

==509th Composite Group Security==

I would like to open a discussion about making additions to the paragraph next to and below the picture of Uanna in his military uniform on Tinian Island in 1945. After the line that ends with "...the combat element of the 509th Composite Group." I would like to suggest adding "The dossiers represented the most thorough investigation to date secretly carried out in the name of the United States Government."

And after the line that ends "...back to prison for any dereliction of duty or security breaches." I would like to suggest adding "Tibbets liked Uanna's style, he was coolly pleasant and uninterested in anything but his work." This information is from pp. 23-24 of the book RUIN FROM THE AIR by Gordon Thomas and Max Morgan Witts, the same book that is noted and referenced in the existing paragraph although it is noted on pp. 45-46 in the existing paragraph's notes. My copy is the First Scarborough House Paperback Edition 1990. The paperback edition states that the book ENOLA Gay was first published in the United States by Stein and Day and that RUIN FROM THE AIR is an expanded version and was published in hardcover in Great Britain by Hamish Hamilton, Ltd. Copyright 1977. Near the bottom of the page it states - Reprint. Originally published: London: Hamilton, 1977. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 23:27, 10 June 2016 (UTC)
:What is the source for the change in the first paragraph? Please remember that for every change you propose you also need to suggest a reliable source. And if you format that source so it can be copy/pasted folks here will have less effort to implement your suggestions - it is in your interest to make this easy for them. :) [[User:Jytdog|Jytdog]] ([[User talk:Jytdog|talk]]) 04:06, 11 June 2016 (UTC)
:::Sorry. The source is the same: RUIN FROM THE AIR pp. 23-24 1990 paperback, but I think it is the same reading as the hardback pp.46-46 which I do not have. This section was edited recently by another editor. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 11:57, 11 June 2016 (UTC)
::::Thank you. Any suggestions on expanding the Manhattan Project section would be welcome. Ihave split off as a separate section. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 21:22, 11 June 2016 (UTC)

==Trivia==
The material reverted [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=William_L._Uanna&curid=28061808&diff=724976739&oldid=724942390 here] meets the definition in my opinion, compounded by its [[WP:PRIMARY]] sourcing and its [[WP:COI]] origin. My optimism on the ability to improve this article is fading considering the [[WP:OWN]] character of the editing of this article, which has kept this article overly detailed to an extreme extent and containing much extraneous and insignifcant information. The fact that the subject of the article claimed in a primary source document that he read certain material related to a secondary aspect of his career is non-encyclopedic. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 22:25, 12 June 2016 (UTC)
:Uanna thought it was worth mentioning in his Foreign Service Essay on p.2 which can be viewed through the Wikimedia Commons Bud Uanna link on William L. Uanna. I can only guess but I think having City Manager information helped him at Oak Ridge where according to his autobiography at the Atomic Heritage Foundation "www.atomicheritage.org/profile/william-l-bud-uanna" he managed the police, detectives and welfare bureau. Also, he appears to have been a City Manager of sorts on Tinian Island. Page 5 of his Foreign Service Essay states that he was working on his doctorate degree in Public Administration. And knowing how a city runs probably helped him in his coordination of security for visiting diplomats during the Cold War. Knowing the ins and outs of city life may have helped him manage security at Oak Ridge where any number of issues could arise. The United States did not have the luxury that Germany and Japan did - slave labor. And he was the Administrative Officer in Addis Ababa at the time of his death, I think that means he managed the Embassy. I suggest we keep it in - I think it was a tool he used. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 22:59, 12 June 2016 (UTC)
::But it's just reading he did to prepare for this position. We're getting in the weeds here. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 23:25, 12 June 2016 (UTC)
:::I don't agree. Qualifications are relevant to a biographical article, and his self-study tells us about his character. [[User:Hawkeye7|Hawkeye7]] ([[User talk:Hawkeye7|talk]]) 23:28, 12 June 2016 (UTC)
::One way to solve this is whether any independent source mentions this. If so that is a good argument against TRIVIA. [[User:Jytdog|Jytdog]] ([[User talk:Jytdog|talk]]) 23:37, 12 June 2016 (UTC)
:::City Manager is mentioned again at Wikimedia Bud Uanna, the link from William L. Uanna. It is the image 3/4 of the way down the page, right above the image of his passport. But, this is listed as background information for his Foreign Service Essay prepared by Uanna. Also - It is listed on p.3188 of Volume 32 of WHO'S WHO IN AMERICA 1962 - 1963, his listing finishes with: Served with AUS 1941-1947. Registered profl. civil engr., Mo. Mem. Mass., Fed. bar assns., ''Internat. City Mgrs. Assn.'' Address: American Embassy APO 319, N.Y.C. I don't know how WHO'S WHO collects it's information. Perhaps it is supplied by the individual listed. If so, for what it's worth, Uanna thought the International City Managers Association worth mentioning along with his engineering registration and bar membership. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 00:58, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
::::The question is not about his City Manager <u>Association affilation</u> <s>job</s> but this bit about his reading that book many times. And I asked if there are '''independent''' sources and you have not brought any. [[User:Jytdog|Jytdog]] ([[User talk:Jytdog|talk]]) 01:04, 13 June 2016 (UTC) (redact [[User:Jytdog|Jytdog]] ([[User talk:Jytdog|talk]]) 04:19, 13 June 2016 (UTC))
:::::OK, I am in the weeds. What are we talking about? It appears Uanna read the seven volumes several times then became a cooperating member of the City Managers Association in 1940. Trivia would seem to me to be "he liked to refinish furniture in his spare time." Apparently he listed this among his accomplishments. Can we mention that he read the books? Can we mention that he was a City Managers Association member? The Wikipedia's listing for [[City Manager]] shows that it is a very interesting position, the Profile shows that in the early years they were usually engineers ''Uanna was an engineer'' today they usually require a Masters in Public Administration, ''Uanna was working on his Doctorate.'' [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 01:40, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
::::::He never was a city manager and his reading a book is only tangentially related to his notability. Apart from the subject and a document you obtained via the FOI Act, where is the independent sourcing of this or for that matter any of the primary sourced material you have obtained for this article on your father? For some months now I have been perplexed by first the extent to which this article has been salted with trivial details, and now by the fierce defense of every single bit of trivia in the article, and the kneejerk defense of its GA status by coordinators of the Milhist project in the GAR even when it had virtually nothing on why he is notable. It is strange. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 03:21, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
:::::::Please try and keep things civil. Labelling editors' actions/opinion as kneejerk and "strange" is not conducive to collaboration. It is easy to find pejorative ways of describing someone's actions. Perhaps you could apply the same good faith to others here that you expect them to show you. Please remember that others are allowed to hold contrary opinions and that sometimes consensus is about compromise (on both sides). Beyond that, on many of your points I happen to agree with you (to an extent), which is why I have tried to tighten the article as best I can. That being said, overall, I'd say it is close to being what I would expect to find in a biography on a person (I've reviewed quite a few for GA, ACR and FAC, and I have written a few which have been published professionally offline). That being said, I wouldn't personally include some of the information that is currently in the article (the anecdote about the conversation with Russ on the plane and the missing shirt for instance), but equally I disagree with the characterization that it focuses unduly on intricate details. Indeed, I think it still needs a little bit more about his personal life if it could be reliably sourced (not a lot more, but some information on when and where he he met his wife, when were they married etc) and also some explanation about why he was commissioned into the engineers but assigned to the CIC as Director of Operations. Where possible, primary sources should be replaced by secondary ones also, but remember [[WP:PRIMARY]] does not totally preclude use of such sources. Regards, [[User:AustralianRupert|AustralianRupert]] ([[User talk:AustralianRupert|talk]]) 05:07, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
::::::::It is what it is, which is strange, and I am not the only editor to notice about project coordinators rallying around another project coordinator to defend an article at a time when it clearly and obviously gave insufficient attention to the most notable aspect of this man's career (if we determine notability on the basis of secondary sources and not FOI documents obtained by the son of the subject). The article was approved for GA status '''with almost nothing on what makes this man notable, which is that he was in charge of security for the first atomic bomb!''' That is why he is the subject of so many film portrayals. Not because he was on the football team or was in the CIC corps or the State Department. I'm not blameless in this; this article simply was not on my radar. I suggest that you not flaunt all the reviews you've done if you think it is OK for an article to be so ridiculous imbalanced and packed with trivia like "he sold his home." WTF? "He sold his home"?????? That's not trivia? Why in [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=William_L._Uanna&diff=725037522&oldid=725036863 this edit] did you remove about him submitting names to the FBI while retaining that he "sold his home"? Please explain your rationale. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 12:15, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
::::::::Just to be very clear as to what I am referring to when I say "strange," I am referring to [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=William_L._Uanna&oldid=722670865#Counter_Intelligence_Corps this version] of the article, which made it seem as if the Manhattan Project was just a secondary aspect of his life. Its unjustified GA status (in that version) is then defended as perfectly fine. The reader knows more about what's important about this man by watching the James Whitmore movie than reading this article. I would say "strange" is an understatement.[[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 12:33, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
::::::::::I wasn't flaunting anything, merely pointing out that this compares with what I've seen elsewhere at high levels of assessment and offline (not really sure how else I can say that). Equally, there is no need to shout in your edit statements or call things ridiculous or say "WTF" about other people's edits or opinions. My rationale for my edit was that I was making an effort to reduce some of the detail of the article, which is, I believe what you have been asking for. I removed a large part of the sentence because it seemed like a run of the mill part of his job as security officer (I filed 20 of those applications last week in fact at my work where security officer is only a secondary appointment i.e. I'm expected to do it in my own time). If I got it wrong, apologies. That said, you will find people more amenable to your position if you use a less disparaging approach. As I said, I happen to agree with you on a number of your points. Please read the comments at the GAR again. I said "keep (with tweaks)" and then I listed several significant issues. Anotherclown also acknowledged that there were issues, but pointed out that this is only a GA, which means it doesn't have to be perfect. So, no it wasn't defended as "perfectly fine". There has been considerable editorial effort put into improving the article by a number of people. If you wish for people to continue to make an effort, encouraging them would be a better way to achieve that. Regards, [[User:AustralianRupert|AustralianRupert]] ([[User talk:AustralianRupert|talk]]) 13:04, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
:::::::::::No we don't allow grossly unbalanced articles as Good Articles. That's a totally incorrect statement; it is cotnrary to the GA criteria. We don't let basket cases like this limp along until they are FA. And no, I think we have quite enough on Mr. Uanna's personal life, and your comment about adding material on how he met his wife, and your edit cited above, indicate that we have different views of what constitutes trivia. And with that, I have pretty much exhausted the spare time that I can devote to Wikipedia. Thanks for taking up my time with this useless discussion. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 13:54, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
:::::::::::On further consideration I agree that submitting names to the FBI is as trivial as his selling his house. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 02:48, 18 June 2016 (UTC)

==Further personal details==
I found an article that sheds some light on where Uanna met his wife. It is a front page story in the MEDFORD MERCURY from Tuesday, February 28, 1956 entitled "Top Security Post.... Ex-Medford Athlete Now Guards World Diplomats" by Al Frezza. It also has a picture of Uanna - the same picture on his passport. It continues on p.7 with "Now living in Washington, Uanna is married to the former Bonnie Leonard of Knoxville, Tenn., who was his secretary while he was assigned to the Atomic Energy Commission. The position of Chief of Physical Security is somewhat opposite to playing football, teaching, legal work or engineering but Uanna say's "it's interesting." The story I heard is that 27 year of Bonnie Leonard was working out of the secretarial pool at the Pentagon in Washington and living in the women's dormitory which was nearby called Arlington Hall in 1947. Every day she would be given her assignment and would get on the back of an electric cart and be driven to "who knows where" in the labyrinth halls of the Pentagon to type, take shorthand or file. One day her assignment was: Major Uanna. At the end of the day she got on a cart and went back to the pool. The next day the dispatcher said that Major Uanna had called the pool and said "Send that girl back." She became his personal secretary. Some of the first work she did was making corrections on a report that Uanna had typed about the Manhattan Project. After corrections and editing it was to be re-typed as a permanent record. She recounted how she had to white out the word "Punkin" and re type "Pumpkin" and she said that this was in reference to the practice bombs the 509th Composite Group used to practice for the Atomic Strike. They were married on August 29, 1947 in Washington. Shortly after that they moved to Kansas City, Missouri where Uanna oversaw the construction of the Atomic Bomb storage bases. They had not been there long when they sold their home "at a loss" which irritated her because they had put a lot of work into it but did not bother Uanna, and this irritated her. According to her Uanna did not care about money and was "generous to a fault." They moved back to Washington where Uanna went to work for the CIA. History, nostalgia, trivia...I know it is difficult to sift. Sometimes truth bursts upon the scene, other times it evolves and you have to beat the bushes to find it. Obviously the information above would only be interesting to a small audience. But it does show some of the back story and the human side. I'll do what I can to help. I am trying to understand where William l. Uanna is headed. Granted, his Manhattan Project work was part of history but his career in the Cold War was notable too. The Manhattan Project was the beginning of the Arms Race and the proverbial Military Industrial Complex. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 14:19, 16 June 2016 (UTC)

Correction: Bonnie Leonard was not staying at "Arlington Hall" when she met Major Uanna but at [[Arlington Farms]]. The dormitories were called "halls." [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 16:14, 16 June 2016 (UTC)

:I've separated this into a different section, if you don't mind. [[WP:NOTEVERYTHING]] discusses why we do not include all facts about a subject, even if sourced, and that would seem to cover what you are suggesting here. Have you considered creating a personal family website into which you can deposit documentation and also personal details that don't make the cut for Wikipedia? This article probably could link to it in the "external links" section. [[User:Figureofnine|Figureofnine]] <small>([[User talk:Figureofnine|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Figureofnine|contribs]])</small> 22:50, 17 June 2016 (UTC)
::{{ping|CIC7}} Do you have a source for the wedding date? [[User:Hawkeye7|Hawkeye7]] ([[User talk:Hawkeye7|talk]]) 01:07, 18 June 2016 (UTC)
:::Yes. 2 sources so far. Among her personal employment papers she states that she was married in Washington, D.C. on August 29, 1947. And, same document, I see that she lived in Rm.H-121, ''Kansas Hall'' - Arlington, Va. Aug. 1946 - Aug. 1947. WHO'S WHO gives the date as Aug. 27, 1947. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 02:17, 18 June 2016 (UTC)
::::G'day, I think it would be ok to mention the marriage date and place, but only very briefly (i.e a single sentence). I wouldn't suggest using the personal employment papers as references. The ''Who's Who'' reference should be ok, though. Regards, [[User:AustralianRupert|AustralianRupert]] ([[User talk:AustralianRupert|talk]]) 02:24, 18 June 2016 (UTC)
:::::I was looking through some of Uanna's newspaper clippings compiled by his mother. There are quite a number with Uanna mentioned and or pictured from his days at MEDFORD HIGH SCHOOL and TUFTS COLLEGE. Some from the Boston Globe and others no doubt from local papers around Boston. I'll mention 2 articles for now. Neither has the newspaper or the date but 1928 is penciled in under this: MEDFORD RUNNERS START FOR PHILADELPHIA TODAY - State Relay Champions After National High School Mile Championship at Penn - Sprint Team Also to Compete - Six Athletes Make Trip. Medford, April 25 - Six Medford High School Relay Men, accompanied by Edwin F. Pigeon will leave tomorrow at 9am for the University of Pennsylvania Relay Carnival. Uanna is pictured and the article says that he will compete in the 440 yard sprint. It looks like the Medford track team were the State Champs, now going to the Penn State Relays. Another article pictures Uanna in a suit and tie and says: Buddy Uanna was a half back on the 1928 undefeated (Medford High) club. He graduated from Tufts last year, but this year will graduate with his Master's degree. Buddy will be recalled as one of the All-Scholastic halfbacks in schoolboy days and he carried on in the same fashion on the Jumbo (Tufts) eleven. Small in stature, along the Henry Hormel type, a real speedster, Buddy was a terror on an end run or if he ever got loose through the secondary. Aggressive, he gave grid fans many a thrill on the football field. In track he was the mainstay in the dashes and the running broad jump, both at Medford High and at Tufts. He was also a star on the Jumbo wrestling team. (He was the New England 145 lb. Champion and went to the quarter finals in the National Wrestling Championship) He has been practicing teaching at Medford High for the past few months and plans to enter the teaching profession in the fall. So: Went to the Penn State Relays. According to the articles was a key player on the 1928 undefeated Medford High Football team. Was a three letter man at Tufts - track, football, wrestling - excelled in each. Plus, put himself through college on a football scholarship. If anyone wants me too I can dig deeper into these clippings. There is a lot of information, many pictures, even a cartoon of him running in football. Lots of background, especially the rivalry between Medford High School and arch rival Malden High School. Uanna's height (5'5") next to other players in the photographs is very obvious. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 22:29, 20 June 2016 (UTC)
==1st Technical Service Detachment==
Can a link be put on 1st Technical Service Detachment? And can we restore the references to Uanna's security responsibilities when he first entered the Counter Intelligence Corps. I don't know when they were taken out but they were there on 04:51 13 June 2016. And links can be added to "top secret" - keep the link to radar. I think this is important. Here is why: Bomb sights are mentioned - this must have been the Norden Bomb sight - the Wikipedia page shows Thomas Ferebee with a Norden in front to the Enola Gay. Firing mechanisms - this probably means Proximity Fuses. These were the most secret weapons leading up to the Atomic Bomb. In one of Uanna's background documents he said that he handled all the security for the tests done on Radar by the Army Air Corps. These weapons were major technological advances and were crucial to keeping the Axis from having an early victory and they bought time for the Allies. Radar defeated the Nazi Wolf Packs in the Atlantic. The Norden Bomb Sight and the Proximity Fuse were also very important. Uanna's involvement in these projects early in the war is noteworthy and was probably the reason he was given command of the 1st Technical Service Detachment. In a conversation I had with Jacob Beser I asked him if Uanna was just a security man or did he have a technical understanding of the Atomic Bomb. He said that he "absolutely" understood the most technical aspects. I have stated this before and it can be surmised from Uanna's educational accomplishments that he was a genius. Most likely a high genius. His wife stated that he had taken 3 different IQ type tests. He scored 160 - 180 - and topped out on the third. The information about radar, bomb sights and firing mechanisms can be seen at the Category:Bud Uanna Wikimedia page under State Department Bona Fides Foreign Service Background 1956 p.2.jpg. My understanding is that Uanna had these responsibilities as a Sergeant, before he went to Officer Candidate School. The CIC was made up of mostly enlisted men - all with IQ's over 120. They were not required to give their rank to anyone under the rank of General and if necessary they could say - "my rank is classified, in this investigation, I outrank you." I think Uanna kept on the cutting edge of technology in his post war career. He hired the anti bugging technicians at the Department of State and Otto Otepka told me that he gave an "amazing" demonstration to high ranking State and Defense Officials in 1955 demonstrating a laser beam directed against a pane of glass from a distance that could listen to a conversation on the other side of the glass. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 11:58, 25 June 2016 (UTC)
:"{{tq|I have stated this before and it can be surmised from Uanna's educational accomplishments that he was a genius. Most likely a high genius.}}" -- WP:not a forum? [[User:K.e.coffman|K.e.coffman]] ([[User talk:K.e.coffman|talk]]) 16:25, 25 June 2016 (UTC)
::WP:not a forum? Did I do something wrong? Because I did not mean to break any rules. I am more familiar with the background documents than most. See what Dennis Flinn had to say about Uanna's mental abilities in the 1954 Performance Rating he gave him when Uanna became a physical security officer before he officially became Chief of the Division of Physical Security at the Department of State. It is the yellow colored document near the bottom of Category:Bud Uanna. "...profound knowledge of systems of procedures..." "...keen mind..." "...highly skilled in the preparation of directives, instruction manuals, lecture courses and procedures..." "He gets along well with people..." The 1955 Performance Review states "He is a forthright individual who commands the respect of his subordinates and fellow workers." Did I do something wrong? It seems that some do not want a human side to Uanna. If he was human then the idea that he was murdered...well then. Paul Tibetts liked Uanna's style, he was cooly pleasant and uninterested in anything but his work. Should that be included? Claude Eatherly's story is interesting. It is worth mentioning, but could we follow up on what Uanna's wife said. Because Uanna's advice to remove Eatherly from the 509th Composite Group was not followed he had to be watched for years, through the 1950's. The U.S. was afraid that he would defect to the Soviet Union and be used by them as a propaganda tool during the Cold War. Everything I read about Uanna indicates that he was almost always one step ahead. Like he was on the football field or on the track. The last thing I want to do is argue, use acronyms for curse word or say I have wasted quite enough of my time here - adios. No, I will stay as long as I am allowed, I just want a fair shake for the guy. [[User:CIC7|CIC7]] ([[User talk:CIC7|talk]]) 20:44, 25 June 2016 (UTC)
::::CIC7 please restrain yourself. Writing walls of text like this is not appropriate. This is exactly what happens when people with a close personal connection are active at an article, and it is disruptive. Please limit yourself to proposing specific content that is supported by specific sources. If there is a discussion about X having too much or too little [[WP:WEIGHT]], that discussion is mostly simply resolved by showing what weight ''''independent secondary sources''' give X. You have all the independent secondary sources at your fingertips; please deploy that knowledge simply and concisely. Thanks. [[User:Jytdog|Jytdog]] ([[User talk:Jytdog|talk]]) 22:12, 25 June 2016 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 09:21, 28 February 2024

Good articleWilliam L. Uanna has been listed as one of the Warfare good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Did You Know Article milestones
DateProcessResult
December 5, 2013Good article nomineeNot listed
September 2, 2015Good article nomineeListed
May 30, 2016Good article reassessmentKept
Did You Know A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "Did you know?" column on October 3, 2015.
The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that William L. Uanna was responsible for security for the 509th Composite Group, which carried out the atomic bombing missions, and for the state visit of Nikita Khrushchev in 1959?
Current status: Good article
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:William_L._Uanna&oldid=1210784971"