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{{Talk header|search=yes}}
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{{WikiProject Dogs|class=Start|importance=mid|breeds=yes}}
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{{WikiProject Italy|class=Start|importance=Low}}
{{WikiProject Dogs|importance=mid}}
{{WikiProject Italy|importance=Low}}
==Possible copyvio==
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I have sent email to thewestlord@yahoo.com, which is the email address on the page from which this came, asking whether they're the ones who posted it and release their copyright, or whether we need to remove it. So I'm letting this sit for a moment... [[User:Elf|Elf]] | [[User talk:Elf|Talk]] 03:48, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)
{{merged-from|Abruzzese Mastiff|14 May 20}}


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:OK, when I asked about whether OK to use under GFDL or PD, got this response:
:: Wikipedia .. you the best site ever.
:: feel free to use the text anyway you like it .
::
:: Linda ,


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==Rmoving copyvio notice AGAIN==
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see above. [[User:Elf|Elf]] | [[User talk:Elf|Talk]] 00:47, 20 August 2005 (UTC)
| archive = Talk:Maremmano-Abruzzese Sheepdog/Archive %(counter)d
:It is ridiculous to think that an editor's statement that they recieved an e-mail from the purported author is valid proof that copyright violations do not exist!
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== Merge discussion: Abruzzese mastiff ==
==Photo Request==
{{Discussion top|result=The result of this discussion was '''merge'''. [[User:Cavalryman|Cavalryman]] ([[User talk:Cavalryman|talk]]) 01:56, 14 May 2020 (UTC)}}
{{reqbreedphoto|request=A photo that shows the whole dog, standing}}
I've suggested merging [[Abruzzese Mastiff]] here. While I respect and indeed partially agree with the arguments of the separatists who resent the fusion of the Maremmano and Abruzzese strains, the fact remains that they have been a single breed since 1958, the Cane da pastore Maremmano-Abruzzese. The "Mastino Abruzzese" is now just another name for the same dog. There is no breed of that name, and no dog can be registered as such. The article already has considerable discussion of these matters, but that could possibly still be further expanded. [[User:Justlettersandnumbers|Justlettersandnumbers]] ([[User talk:Justlettersandnumbers|talk]]) 20:30, 29 October 2011 (UTC)
:'''Support'''. I wonder if we could generate some conversation on this proposal before it rots too much more.--'''[[User:Tikuko|<span style="color:black;">T</span><span style="color:orange;">K</span><span style="color:gray;">K</span>]]''' [[User talk:Tikuko|<sup><small>bark</small> <i><big>!</big></i></sup>]] 12:56, 20 January 2013 (UTC)
* '''Post bold merger support'''. {{u|Justlettersandnumbers}} & {{u|Tikuko}}, have just boldly merged these articles I have stumbled upon this old merger discussion, the merge has been completed. Kind regards, [[User:Cavalryman|Cavalryman]] ([[User talk:Cavalryman|talk]]) 01:56, 14 May 2020 (UTC).
{{Discussion bottom}}


== External links modified ==
[[Special:Contributions/130.195.86.36|130.195.86.36]] ([[User talk:130.195.86.36|talk]]) 02:38, 7 January 2008 (UTC) question re: photo request
I have (original) photos of my Maremmas - can I send them to someone to review and post to this article? Regards, brian.a.lyall@gmail.com, 7 January 2008


Hello fellow Wikipedians,
==Weight==


I have just modified 4 external links on [[Maremma Sheepdog]]. Please take a moment to review [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=783415520 my edit]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit [[User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot|this simple FaQ]] for additional information. I made the following changes:
How much do they weigh? Weight is mentioned indirectly but there is no actual weight range or average listed.
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070630071430/http://www.canids.org/occasionalpapers/livestockguardingdog.pdf to http://www.canids.org/occasionalpapers/livestockguardingdog.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110708012515/http://site.blackmooseranch.com/Dogs_Puppies.html to http://site.blackmooseranch.com/Dogs_Puppies.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110516121926/http://www.warrnambool.vic.gov.au/page/page.asp?page_Id=527 to http://www.warrnambool.vic.gov.au/page/page.asp?page_Id=527
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120327143041/http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/companimals/guarddogs/guarddogs.htm to http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/companimals/guarddogs/guarddogs.htm


When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
==Original Use Section Cleanup==
The Original Use section is not encyclopedia quality, referring specifically to the last line of "don't get me wrong-they bark". It also is packed full of sexist language. I will change these two without changing any of the actual content.
Upon reading over the passage, I decided it would be best to remove the last line completely. I will paste it here so nobody has to bother with history if they think it should stay.
"these dogs are great to have as a family pet but don't get me wrong-they bark." [[User:Sparkleiya|Sparkleiya]] 04:41, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
==Breed name==
Maremmano-Abruzzese
Lorna Coppinger and Raymond Coppinger, the biologists who are the preeminent experts on Livestock Guarding Dogs describe the "breed" (a term the Coppingers question) as the Italian "Maremmano-Abruzzese " in their book "Dogs: A New Understanding of Canine Origin, Behavior and Evolution (2002), University of Chicago Press, ISBN 0226115631. The Maremmano-Abruzzese being one of five or six dogs types involved in annual sheep migrations from highlands to lowlands common in many parts of the world. Should this article be titled "Maremmano-Abruzzese"? The Coppingers find that there is no valid distinction between dogs from the Tuscan Marremma and those from Abruzzo. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:MGerety|MGerety]] ([[User talk:MGerety|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/MGerety|contribs]]) 01:42, 22 October 2007 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->


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Unless I this is a similar cousin this beautiful dog is also called a Pastore Abruzzese (Abruzzese Shepherd) at least in Avezzano, Italy (which is in Abruzzo). I had asked the locals what they call this stunning dog which I had never seen before.[[Special:Contributions/192.88.165.35|192.88.165.35]] ([[User talk:192.88.165.35|talk]]) 17:06, 24 January 2008 (UTC)


Cheers.—[[User:InternetArchiveBot|'''<span style="color:darkgrey;font-family:monospace">InternetArchiveBot</span>''']] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">([[User talk:InternetArchiveBot|Report bug]])</span> 04:10, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
==So-called copyright violation==
A user who failed to login, and thus identify him or herself leaving only IP addresses, first claimed a lack of references and then labelled the previous version of this article a possible copyright violation. Before realizing that the user's objections were nonsense and that a user on that IP address had been cited for bogus edits, I rewrote the article so as to avoid any possible appearance of such a violation, relying on a number of academic articles including Drs. Coppinger at Hampshire College, the preeminent experts on livestock guarding dogs, as well as articles in Italian about this fabulous dog. i am personally quite familiar with this breed seeing them quite often in Abruzzo guarding their flocks of sheep. MGerety 03:33, 24 October 2007 (UTC)


== Requested move 14 May 2020 ==
:The user's claims were not bogus. Several parts of the previous version were copied almost word from word from the article on this breed at Dog Breed Info. [[User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] 05:10, 24 October 2007 (UTC)


<div class="boilerplate" style="background-color: #efe; margin: 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px dotted #aaa;"><!-- Template:RM top -->
Right. The florid description of the "standard" Maremma did take language from the that site, though very similar language is repeated in many kennel Club descriptions. Since biologists dispute breeding working dogs simply for appearance rather than behavioral characteristics that portion was not suitable at any rate. However, the remainder of the article especially that written about the dog's origins seemed original, in fact, the same IP user criticized it as possibly being "original research". I think it is not appropriate to delete photographs and then label ones restoration "vandalism" though the point on article length. Added headers as suggested [[User:MGerety|MGerety]] 11:54, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
:''The following is a closed discussion of a [[Wikipedia:Requested moves|requested move]]. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a [[Wikipedia:move review|move review]] after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. ''


The result of the move request was: Moved {{rmnac}} <span style="background:Black;padding:1px 5px">[[User:Buidhe|<b style="color: White">b</b>]][[User talk:Buidhe|<b style="color: White">uidh</b>]][[Special:Contributions/Buidhe|<b style="color: White">e</b>]]</span> 03:59, 22 May 2020 (UTC)
:Restoring photos that had been removed as a legitimate edit almost immediately after their removal with no justification or commentary and by passing the revert system does constitute a form a vandalism. If someone objected, they should have broached it on the talk page as the removal was properly justified to bring the article into proper compliance with Wikipedia policies. Also, OR can be applied if the article lacked citations, conclusions were drawn by combining multiple sources to make a new line of thought, etc. [[User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] 22:49, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
----


==Bravo==
This article is now greatly improved, with new headers much better than mine. [[User:MGerety|MGerety]] 22:03, 24 October 2007 (UTC)


[[:Maremma Sheepdog]] → {{no redirect|Maremmano-Abruzzese Sheepdog}} – Nearly every source used in the article uses this or the Italian ''Cane da pastore Maremmano-Abruzzese'' as the breed’s name, some then list the current name as an alternate name. [[User:Cavalryman|Cavalryman]] ([[User talk:Cavalryman|talk]]) 01:42, 14 May 2020 (UTC)
:Agreed. Thanks for stepping in to giving it a good rewrite :) [[User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] 22:32, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
==Pastore Abruzzese==


* '''Support'''. This is going to be a difficult one. There are many WP:RELIABLE WP:SECONDARY references to both the "Maremma sheepdog" and to the "Maremmano-Abruzzese Sheepdog", so arguing WP:COMMONAME will get us nowhere. However, we are dealing with a dog that is found in TWO provinces of Italy, in the [[Maremma]] region of [[Tuscany]], and in [[Abruzzo]]. The FCI name is the "Maremma and the Abruzzes Sheepdog". Therefore, I am going with WP:PRECISION. '''[[User:William Harris|<span style="color: dimgray">William Harris</span>]][[File:Canis lupis track.svg|17px]][[User talk:William Harris|<span style="color: dimgray">talk</span>]][[File:Canis lupis track.svg|17px]]''' 10:08, 14 May 2020 (UTC)
I think this web site displays banner adds but itself is non-commercial.
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: ''The discussion above is closed. <b style="color: #FF0000;">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.''<!-- from [[Template:Archive bottom]] --></div><div style="clear:both;"></div>
[[User:MGerety|MGerety]] 03:51, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

:From the rough translation of the pages, it appears that they also sell puppies, which makes it commercial and non-neutral, unfortunately [[User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] 04:30, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 15:15, 13 March 2024


Merge discussion: Abruzzese mastiff

[edit]
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
The result of this discussion was merge. Cavalryman (talk) 01:56, 14 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I've suggested merging Abruzzese Mastiff here. While I respect and indeed partially agree with the arguments of the separatists who resent the fusion of the Maremmano and Abruzzese strains, the fact remains that they have been a single breed since 1958, the Cane da pastore Maremmano-Abruzzese. The "Mastino Abruzzese" is now just another name for the same dog. There is no breed of that name, and no dog can be registered as such. The article already has considerable discussion of these matters, but that could possibly still be further expanded. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 20:30, 29 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Support. I wonder if we could generate some conversation on this proposal before it rots too much more.--TKK bark ! 12:56, 20 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
[edit]

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Requested move 14 May 2020

[edit]
The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved (non-admin closure) buidhe 03:59, 22 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]


Maremma Sheepdog → Maremmano-Abruzzese Sheepdog – Nearly every source used in the article uses this or the Italian Cane da pastore Maremmano-Abruzzese as the breed’s name, some then list the current name as an alternate name. Cavalryman (talk) 01:42, 14 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support. This is going to be a difficult one. There are many WP:RELIABLE WP:SECONDARY references to both the "Maremma sheepdog" and to the "Maremmano-Abruzzese Sheepdog", so arguing WP:COMMONAME will get us nowhere. However, we are dealing with a dog that is found in TWO provinces of Italy, in the Maremma region of Tuscany, and in Abruzzo. The FCI name is the "Maremma and the Abruzzes Sheepdog". Therefore, I am going with WP:PRECISION. William Harristalk 10:08, 14 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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