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== "it is uncertain if humans can in fact convert linoleic acid to arachidonic acid.[*]" ==
== Arachidonic Acid Supplementation ==


The study<ref>{{cite journal |last1=Rett |first1=BS |last2=Whelan |first2=Jay |title=Increasing dietary linoleic acid does not increase tissue arachidonic acid content in adults consuming Western-type diets: a systematic review |journal=Nutrition & Metabolism |date=10 June 2011 |volume=8 |issue=36 |pages=1, 13 |doi=10.1186/1743-7075-8-36 |pmid=21663641 |pmc=3132704 |ref=Rett}}</ref> linked for this assertion just says, that varying the linoleic acid precursor in a Western-type diet typically abundant in LA (and even lots of AA !), does not further increase AA blood levels and with extreme LA reduction AA may starts trending (sub-significantly) a little lower. This just indicates a tightly regulated control / feedback loop, besides possibly the effect of adipose fat tissue buffering over a long time, and potential chronic overload by excess preformed AA in the diet.
Arachidonic Acid has recently (over the past 2 years) become a popular supplement in the body building community. It's contained in two products (X-Factor and Halodrol Liquigels). I can understand not wanting to write a section that promotes these products, but would it be worth having something noting it's use in this area?
This review study also is concerned with the opposite: "''Elevated tissue AA levels are believed to be positively associated with eicosanoid formation and risk for a variety of chronic diseases, including cardiovascular disease, cancer and inflammation. The literature expresses concern over the fact that increasing dietary LA can potentially enrich tissues with AA due to their metabolic link.''"


That LA to AA conversion takes places in humans is well established (many studies even show the detailed mechanisms) and there are many vegans from birth meanwhile not consuming AA.
Here's a link to a study that was done at a university on this particular use:


So this assertion seems absurd, and super absurd to be drawn from that study, and should probably removed.? [[User:Kxroberto|Kxroberto]] ([[User talk:Kxroberto|talk]]) 15:43, 24 August 2023 (UTC)
https://beardocs.baylor.edu/bitstream/2104/4890/1/Mike_Roberts_masters.pdf


:It never hurts to have a keen eye review how other editors have characterized studies. It certainly suggests revision for further clarity would be salutary. cheers. [[User:Anastrophe|anastrophe]], [[User talk:Anastrophe|an editor he is.]] 21:26, 24 August 2023 (UTC)
[[User:PAT or JK|PAT or JK]] 15:39, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
:Yes, a section on the commercial trade in AA would be welcome. Citations from the muscle press would be appropriate. Go for it; be bold.
[[User:David.Throop|David.Throop]] 22:21, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


{{talkref}}
== Eicasanoids and Arachidonate Acid ==
i want you to discuss the eicasanoids which are the origin of arachidonate acid
:There's already a link to the [[Eicosanoid]]s in the article. What else were you wanting?[[User:David.Throop|David.Throop]] 13:07, 22 February 2006 (UTC)


== Since little or no arachidonic acid is found in common plants, such animals are obligate carnivores??? ==
==Arachidonic Acid in Dairy==
There are many referencesx on the net to dairy products as a rich source of 20:4 fats but according to the USDA nutrition database, dairy products are free of arachidonic acid. What is the truth?


That is illogical, If a creature required arachidonic acid and could not create it internally, yes they would need to eat SOME meat but they would not need to be obligate carnivores which are designed only to eat meat. They could be omnivores as well. Considering the explanation also says that humans are in this category (which the other talk point disputes), we are obviously omnivores and not obligate carnivores. So the explanation makes no sense as written, the author does not seem to understand the actual definition of 'obligate carnivore.' [[Special:Contributions/70.166.33.7|70.166.33.7]] ([[User talk:70.166.33.7|talk]]) 02:04, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
--[[User:Rjms|RJMS]] 17:38, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
:Good question. The IUPAC Lipid Handbook [http://www.iupac.org/publications/pac/2001/pdf/7304x0685.pdf] (Table 5, p 740) agrees - human milk contains AA, but cow's milk doesn't.[[User:David.Throop|David.Throop]] 03:30, 24 May 2006 (UTC)


:"Obligate carnivore" means the organism requires ''some'' meat; it does not mean it eats ''only'' meat. Omnivores ''may'' be obligate carnivores, if they ''require'' the meat component of their diet. Organisms that only consume meat can also be obligate carnivores, or could simply be (for lack of knowledge of a proper term) "situational carnivores": that is, they are only eating meat, but they could survive just as well eating no meat. "Obligate carnivore" and "omnivore" are not mutually exclusive; "obligate carnivore" and "vegetarian" are mutually exclusive.

:[[User:Kimen8|Kimen8]] ([[User talk:Kimen8|talk]]) 11:06, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
What are the major food sources of this fatty acids. I've tried to find some, but a comprehensive overview is hard to find [[User:Health23|Health23]] 20:53, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
::There's a listing of several online sources for food sources of nutrients, esp essential fatty acids, at [[Essential fatty acid#Food sources]] &ndash; [[User:David.Throop|David.Throop]] 00:40, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

== Origin of name? ==

Does anyone know why this compound is named so? Does it have to do with Arachnids? [[User:Joeylawn|Joeylawn]] 02:31, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

== Is it misleading to call it an essential fatty acid? ==

This part doesn't seem to me to add up:
:''Arachidonic acid is one of the [[essential fatty acid]]s required by most [[mammal]]s. Some mammals lack the ability to&mdash;or have a very limited capacity to&mdash;convert [[linoleic acid]] into arachidonic acid, making it an essential part of their diet. Since little or no arachidonic acid is found in [[plant]]s, such animals are obligatory [[carnivore]]s; the [[cat]] is a common example.''

I think most mammals live off plants. If plants contain little or no arachdonic acid, then this substance can hardly be an essential component of the diet for most mammals. According to Udo Erasmus, only two fatty acids are essential for humans (linolenic acid and linoleic acid, listed at [[essential nutrient]]); ones such as arachidonic acid can be made in the body from the others. He argues that since there are large numbers of vegetarian humans and they don't tend to get the diseases that would indicate shortage of the longer-chain fatty acids, that they must not be having difficulty making these substances within the body. Cats may be more of an exeption than an example of "most mammals". --[[User:Coppertwig|Coppertwig]] 20:47, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
===Which fatty acids are 'essential'?===
:Here's a snippet of text that I'm working on as a clarification to the definition at [[Essential fatty acid]]:
The essential fatty acids were described by Burr and Burr in 1930 as those fatty acids which cured the deficiency disease brought on by a lack of fat in the diet. Arachidonic acid was one of the fatty acids which they tested and found to be effective. Further work has shown that any of the common ω-3 or-6 fatty acids will work. And the common usage in the field is that the term ''essential fatty acid'' comprises all the ω-3 or-6 fatty acids (or at least the polyunsaturated, straight-chain methylene-interrupted ones; there are some conjugated oddities like [[calendic acid]] that aren't.) Authorative sources include the whole families, without qualification.<ref name=Hutchins>
{{cite web|url=http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/514322_1|title=Symposium Highlights -- Omega-3 Fatty Acids: Recommendations for Therapeutics and Prevention |year= 10/19/2005|author=Heather Hutchins, MS, RD }}
*&quot;Omega-3 fatty acids and their counterparts, n-6 fatty acids, are essential polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFA) because they cannot be synthesized de novo in the body.&quot;</ref>
<ref name=Nugent>{{cite journal |author=Nugent K, Spigelman A, Phillips R |title=Tissue prostaglandin levels in familial adenomatous polyposis patients treated with sulindac |journal=Dis Colon Rectum |volume=39 |issue=6 |pages=659-62 |year=1996 |id=PMID 8646953}}
*"Arachidonic acid is an essential fatty acid..."</ref>
<ref name=Carlstedt>{{cite journal |author=Carlstedt-Duke J, Brönnegård M, Strandvik B |title=Pathological regulation of arachidonic acid release in cystic fibrosis: the putative basic defect |journal=Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A |volume=83 |issue=23 |pages=9202-6 |year=1986 |id=PMID 3097647}}
*"[T]he turnover of essential fatty acids is increased (7). Arachidonic acid is one of the essential fatty acids affected."</ref>
The human body can make some long-chain PUFA (arachidonic acid, EPA and DHA) from lineolate or lineolinate.
Some writers therefore hold that the LC-PUFA are not essential. But is not how the field has generally used the term.
<references /> [[User:David.Throop|David.Throop]] 00:01, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 02:27, 19 May 2024

"it is uncertain if humans can in fact convert linoleic acid to arachidonic acid.[*]"

[edit]

The study[1] linked for this assertion just says, that varying the linoleic acid precursor in a Western-type diet typically abundant in LA (and even lots of AA !), does not further increase AA blood levels and with extreme LA reduction AA may starts trending (sub-significantly) a little lower. This just indicates a tightly regulated control / feedback loop, besides possibly the effect of adipose fat tissue buffering over a long time, and potential chronic overload by excess preformed AA in the diet. This review study also is concerned with the opposite: "Elevated tissue AA levels are believed to be positively associated with eicosanoid formation and risk for a variety of chronic diseases, including cardiovascular disease, cancer and inflammation. The literature expresses concern over the fact that increasing dietary LA can potentially enrich tissues with AA due to their metabolic link."

That LA to AA conversion takes places in humans is well established (many studies even show the detailed mechanisms) and there are many vegans from birth meanwhile not consuming AA.

So this assertion seems absurd, and super absurd to be drawn from that study, and should probably removed.? Kxroberto (talk) 15:43, 24 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

It never hurts to have a keen eye review how other editors have characterized studies. It certainly suggests revision for further clarity would be salutary. cheers. anastrophe, an editor he is. 21:26, 24 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ Rett, BS; Whelan, Jay (10 June 2011). "Increasing dietary linoleic acid does not increase tissue arachidonic acid content in adults consuming Western-type diets: a systematic review". Nutrition & Metabolism. 8 (36): 1, 13. doi:10.1186/1743-7075-8-36. PMC 3132704. PMID 21663641.{{cite journal}}: CS1 maint: unflagged free DOI (link)

Since little or no arachidonic acid is found in common plants, such animals are obligate carnivores???

[edit]

That is illogical, If a creature required arachidonic acid and could not create it internally, yes they would need to eat SOME meat but they would not need to be obligate carnivores which are designed only to eat meat. They could be omnivores as well. Considering the explanation also says that humans are in this category (which the other talk point disputes), we are obviously omnivores and not obligate carnivores. So the explanation makes no sense as written, the author does not seem to understand the actual definition of 'obligate carnivore.' 70.166.33.7 (talk) 02:04, 16 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Obligate carnivore" means the organism requires some meat; it does not mean it eats only meat. Omnivores may be obligate carnivores, if they require the meat component of their diet. Organisms that only consume meat can also be obligate carnivores, or could simply be (for lack of knowledge of a proper term) "situational carnivores": that is, they are only eating meat, but they could survive just as well eating no meat. "Obligate carnivore" and "omnivore" are not mutually exclusive; "obligate carnivore" and "vegetarian" are mutually exclusive.
Kimen8 (talk) 11:06, 16 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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