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== The Wii U should be classed as a 7th gen console. ==
== Cool it on the Switch Generation specifics right now ==


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The Wii U released one year prior to the PS4 and Xbox One, but was evidently made to compete with Sony and Microsoft's prior HD consoles. Not only is there little in the way of meaningful processor, resolution and memory upgrades, the Wii U still retained characteristics not present in any 8th generation console, such as legacy support for 4:3 standard definition television displays. If you track the hardware and software support from Nintendo and third parties, you can observe that there's far more overlap with Xbox 360/PS3's defining titles, and almost no overlap from PS4 and Xbox One (e.g: Black Ops 2, Splinter Cell, Batman Arkham Origins, Need for Speed Most Wanted, Mass Effect 3, Assassin's Creed III and IV). Major franchises (e.g: Minecraft, Terraria, LEGO) stopped releasing new titles or software updates simultaneously on all three HD consoles, and the hardware was discontinued entirely in 2017 - aligning closely with the discontinuation of the Xbox 360/PS3 hardware in 2016. [[User:Memoryman3|Memoryman3]] ([[User talk:Memoryman3|talk]]) 23:00, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
I think most of us are on the same page that the Switch is 8th-gen because it was released to compete with the Xbox One and PS5 and they spent the most time competing with each other so far, and I want to point out that this happened multiple times in previous generations, i.e. the Atari 2600 released in 77, the 5200 released in 83, and the next generation started in 83, the 5200 was targeted to compete with other 2nd gen consoles not the new 3rd gen ones. Generations span a long time with a lot of overlap, the last 4th gen console was discontinued after the first 6th gen consoles had started production. The PS2 lived from 2000-2013, living until the Wii was discontinued, that doesn't make it a 7th gen console, it didn't compete with the Wii, the PS3 did. Nobody marketed them against each other.
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:We go by how sources define the market and competition of the consoles, not the tech specs directly. Wii U was commonly talked alongside the PS4 and Xbox One, so its an eighth gen console. [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 23:05, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
::Could you cite any reliable sources that define the Wii U as competing with the PS4 and Xbox One? Many publishers and developers didn't seem to think so as evidenced by the system's lifecycle and support. [https://www.theverge.com/2013/1/31/3939092/john-riccitiello-on-wii-u-ps4-xbox-steam-box-game-violence EA even refused to categorise Wii U as a "Gen 4" console.] [[User:Memoryman3|Memoryman3]] ([[User talk:Memoryman3|talk]]) 00:49, 14 May 2024 (UTC)
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:::There's multiple in the article already, not to mention, simple Google searches [https://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/the-8-generations-of-video-game-consoles/zvcjkty find more pretty easily too]. [[User:Sergecross73|<span style="color:green">Sergecross73</span>]] [[User talk:Sergecross73|<span style="color:teal">msg me</span>]] 01:16, 14 May 2024 (UTC)
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:No, reliable sources don't commonly state this. [[User:Sergecross73|<span style="color:green">Sergecross73</span>]] [[User talk:Sergecross73|<span style="color:teal">msg me</span>]] 23:15, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
::Then the Wii should stay in 6th or 7th gen, it's literally an overclocked GameCube. [[User:VitAlv13|VitAlv13]] ([[User talk:VitAlv13|talk]]) 12:53, 10 October 2024 (UTC)
:::We go by what reliable sources say, per [[WP:V]], not personal observations on horsepower of the hardware. [[User:Sergecross73|<span style="color:green">Sergecross73</span>]] [[User talk:Sergecross73|<span style="color:teal">msg me</span>]] 12:55, 10 October 2024 (UTC)
::::Then the Game & Watch Super Mario Bros. (2020) would be the successor to the Switch, because it released later? [[User:VitAlv13|VitAlv13]] ([[User talk:VitAlv13|talk]]) 13:41, 10 October 2024 (UTC)
:::::That's not how that works, particularly with a product line as complex as Nintendo's.<span id="Masem:1728567883305:TalkFTTCLNEighth_generation_of_video_game_consoles" class="FTTCmt"> —&nbsp;[[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 13:44, 10 October 2024 (UTC)</span>
:::::I don't understand how you could have come to that conclusion from what I said. [[User:Sergecross73|<span style="color:green">Sergecross73</span>]] [[User talk:Sergecross73|<span style="color:teal">msg me</span>]] 13:57, 10 October 2024 (UTC)


== The separation of Original and Slim ==
If Nintendo releases an upgraded Switch and markets it as a competitor to the Xbox Series/PS5 then *that* can be gen 9. [[User:Wintergreen0354|Wintergreen0354]] ([[User talk:Wintergreen0354|talk]]) 22:46, 27 February 2023 (UTC)


The Eighth generation of video game consoles is the first page to distinctly separate ps4 slim and Xbox one s from there original models. Every other page lists them together or under each-other.
:The Switch is ''already'' marked as a competitor to the PS5 and the XBX|S. Every industry outlet and even NPD is already pitting it with Sony and Microsoft's current gen systems. [[Special:Contributions/61.9.108.144|61.9.108.144]] ([[User talk:61.9.108.144|talk]]) 02:34, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
:The argument over how things should be classified here strikes me as entirely [[WP:OR|original research]]. Console generations are arbitrary groupings defined by reliable sources, and sources don't seem to agree on where the Switch belongs, e.g.:
:* Wired ([https://www.wired.com/story/evolution-of-game-console-design-america/]): {{tq|Nintendo hasn't made its ninth-generation intentions known yet. A souped-up Switch is likely on the horizon, but will it still retain the form factor?}}
:* BBC ([https://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/the-8-generations-of-video-game-consoles/zvcjkty]): {{tq|Is Switch eighth gen or ninth gen? We don't know. Let's say it's ninth because we're running out of space.}}
:That is unsurprising. If generations are defined simply by how companies market them, then the Switch and WiiU wouldn't be in the same generation, as the Switch was marketed as a direct successor and WiiU production was discontinued prior to the Switch's launch ([https://www.polygon.com/2017/1/31/14452066/wii-u-discontinued]). When the Switch launched it was sometimes referred to with terms like {{tq|Nintendo's next-generation game console}}, but there wasn't otherwise a "new generation" of consoles it was being contrasted against (e.g. [https://www.engadget.com/2016-10-20-nintendo-switch-first-thoughts.html]). Most early reporting on the "ninth generation" platforms focuses on the Xbox Series X and PS5, likely because of launch timing and marketing (e.g. [https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/15/technology/xbox-series-x-playstation-5.html]). Reporting on console sales at the time the Switch launched compared its sales against the PS4 and Xbox One (e.g [https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/03/dont-read-too-much-into-the-switchs-successful-launch-numbers/], [https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2017/10/19/the-nintendo-switch-outsold-both-xbox-one-and-ps4-last-month/?sh=1201d66e6bf7]), while current reporting on console sales compares the Switch to the PS5 and Xbox Series X/S (e.g. [https://www.vgchartz.com/article/457247/ps5-vs-switch-sales-comparison-april-2023/], [https://gamingbolt.com/nintendo-switch-outsold-the-ps5-in-may-in-the-uk-for-the-first-time-this-year]).
:Most reporting seems to use terms like "current generation" to describe what is actively competing at the time of reporting (i.e. the distinction isn't about whether a company has released a successor console, but just that the "current generation" is current major consoles, so in 2018 that'd have been the Switch, PS4, and Xbox One, and in 2022 it was the Switch, PS5, and Xbox Series X/S). Explicitly numbered terms like "eighth generation" and "ninth generation" are somewhat rare in reporting. Plenty of sources argue that they don't exist at all, and plenty of those which do use these terms ''cite them back to Wikipedia'', as noted in this Gamesradar article ([https://www.gamesradar.com/ea-quickly-learns-it-has-no-idea-what-console-generation-were-in/]): {{tq|The issue is that there's no real accepted numbering of generations. If people have an idea of how the generations should be numbered, it's probably based on a Wikipedia article}}.
:The Switch likely should be '''mentioned on both pages'''. I think the honest problem is the continued insistence on categorizing consoles neatly into numbered generations regardless of whether it is supported by sources. [[User:Dylnuge|<span style="color: #1e79a1;font-weight:700;">Dylnuge</span>]] <sup>([[User talk:Dylnuge|''Talk'']] • [[Special:Contributions/Dylnuge|''Edits'']])</sup> 21:57, 2 June 2023 (UTC)


The pro models make sense to separate, the slim models should be merged in and added to details to the original model. [[User:Doremon764|Doremon764]] ([[User talk:Doremon764|talk]]) 03:18, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
== Nintendo switch is a 9th gen not an 8th gen console ==


:The slim models were only a casing redesign but did not significantly change the CPU or GPU. the Pro models did improve these systems and others. That's why they are treated differently [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 03:50, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
End of story [[User:Gahex220|Gahex220]] ([[User talk:Gahex220|talk]]) 13:51, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
::Seconded, Masem is correct. [[User:Sergecross73|<span style="color:green">Sergecross73</span>]] [[User talk:Sergecross73|<span style="color:teal">msg me</span>]] 13:18, 20 July 2024 (UTC)

:::I meant on other lists slim models are not displayed separately from the original model.
:Just show us reliable sources that classify it as a 9th generation console and we'll update it. Hint: this has been discussed to death and no one has been able to show any reliable sourcing for this. [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 13:54, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
:::* [[Seventh generation of video game consoles]] (with Wii, Xbox 360, and PS3)
::What source is used for the basis of the numbered generations in the first place? Did Nintendo ever call either the Wii U or Switch an 8th generation console? On their website they refer to the Switch (and not the Wii U or 3DS) as "current generation". I don't think they factor competitors into their concept of a generation. [[Special:Contributions/222.118.236.159|222.118.236.159]] ([[User talk:222.118.236.159|talk]]) 16:15, 20 February 2024 (UTC)
:::* [[Sixth generation of video game consoles]] (with PS2)
:::Third party reporting has been sorting consoles into generations for many years, and those are the sources we use. First party categorization can be mentioned, but has the inherit risk of those first-parties confusing marketing with reality (eg Xfinity's "10G" internet service). [[User:Darkage7|<span style="font-style:italic">Darkage7</span>]][[User talk:Darkage7|<sub>[Talk]</sub>]] 18:19, 20 February 2024 (UTC)
:::* Even with [[Third generation of video game consoles]], as well as [[Second generation of video game consoles]](with SG-1000, NES/Famicom, Master System/Mark III, Atari 7800, and for second generation Atari 2600 and Intellivision)
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:This has been debated to death, you're certainly not going to move the needle with a non-argument like that... [[User:Sergecross73|<span style="color:green">Sergecross73</span>]] [[User talk:Sergecross73|<span style="color:teal">msg me</span>]] 14:46, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
:::The chart on this page separate into columns Xbox one from its s model, the PS4 from its slim model, and Nintendo Switch oled model from the original column. [[User:Doremon764|Doremon764]] ([[User talk:Doremon764|talk]]) 22:05, 22 July 2024 (UTC)

::::When it comes to the handhelds on this page PSVita and 3DS are pact in the same box when it comes to how the chart is displayed. Just to bring up the inconsistency of the charts. [[User:Doremon764|Doremon764]] ([[User talk:Doremon764|talk]]) 22:09, 22 July 2024 (UTC)
⚫
== The Wii U should be classed as a 7th gen console. ==

⚫
The Wii U released one year prior to the PS4 and Xbox One, but was evidently made to compete with Sony and Microsoft's prior HD consoles. Not only is there little in the way of meaningful processor, resolution and memory upgrades, the Wii U still retained characteristics not present in any 8th generation console, such as legacy support for 4:3 standard definition television displays. If you track the hardware and software support from Nintendo and third parties, you can observe that there's far more overlap with Xbox 360/PS3's defining titles, and almost no overlap from PS4 and Xbox One (e.g: Black Ops 2, Splinter Cell, Batman Arkham Origins, Need for Speed Most Wanted, Mass Effect 3, Assassin's Creed III and IV). Major franchises (e.g: Minecraft, Terraria, LEGO) stopped releasing new titles or software updates simultaneously on all three HD consoles, and the hardware was discontinued entirely in 2017 - aligning closely with the discontinuation of the Xbox 360/PS3 hardware in 2016. [[User:Memoryman3|Memoryman3]] ([[User talk:Memoryman3|talk]]) 23:00, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

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:We go by how sources define the market and competition of the consoles, not the tech specs directly. Wii U was commonly talked alongside the PS4 and Xbox One, so its an eighth gen console. [[User:Masem|M<span style="font-variant: small-caps">asem</span>]] ([[User Talk:Masem|t]]) 23:05, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
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:No, reliable sources don't commonly state this. [[User:Sergecross73|<span style="color:green">Sergecross73</span>]] [[User talk:Sergecross73|<span style="color:teal">msg me</span>]] 23:15, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 13:57, 10 October 2024


The Wii U should be classed as a 7th gen console.

[edit]

The Wii U released one year prior to the PS4 and Xbox One, but was evidently made to compete with Sony and Microsoft's prior HD consoles. Not only is there little in the way of meaningful processor, resolution and memory upgrades, the Wii U still retained characteristics not present in any 8th generation console, such as legacy support for 4:3 standard definition television displays. If you track the hardware and software support from Nintendo and third parties, you can observe that there's far more overlap with Xbox 360/PS3's defining titles, and almost no overlap from PS4 and Xbox One (e.g: Black Ops 2, Splinter Cell, Batman Arkham Origins, Need for Speed Most Wanted, Mass Effect 3, Assassin's Creed III and IV). Major franchises (e.g: Minecraft, Terraria, LEGO) stopped releasing new titles or software updates simultaneously on all three HD consoles, and the hardware was discontinued entirely in 2017 - aligning closely with the discontinuation of the Xbox 360/PS3 hardware in 2016. Memoryman3 (talk) 23:00, 12 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

We go by how sources define the market and competition of the consoles, not the tech specs directly. Wii U was commonly talked alongside the PS4 and Xbox One, so its an eighth gen console. Masem (t) 23:05, 12 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Could you cite any reliable sources that define the Wii U as competing with the PS4 and Xbox One? Many publishers and developers didn't seem to think so as evidenced by the system's lifecycle and support. EA even refused to categorise Wii U as a "Gen 4" console. Memoryman3 (talk) 00:49, 14 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There's multiple in the article already, not to mention, simple Google searches find more pretty easily too. Sergecross73 msg me 01:16, 14 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, reliable sources don't commonly state this. Sergecross73 msg me 23:15, 12 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Then the Wii should stay in 6th or 7th gen, it's literally an overclocked GameCube. VitAlv13 (talk) 12:53, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We go by what reliable sources say, per WP:V, not personal observations on horsepower of the hardware. Sergecross73 msg me 12:55, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Then the Game & Watch Super Mario Bros. (2020) would be the successor to the Switch, because it released later? VitAlv13 (talk) 13:41, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's not how that works, particularly with a product line as complex as Nintendo's. — Masem (t) 13:44, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't understand how you could have come to that conclusion from what I said. Sergecross73 msg me 13:57, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The separation of Original and Slim

[edit]

The Eighth generation of video game consoles is the first page to distinctly separate ps4 slim and Xbox one s from there original models. Every other page lists them together or under each-other.

The pro models make sense to separate, the slim models should be merged in and added to details to the original model. Doremon764 (talk) 03:18, 20 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The slim models were only a casing redesign but did not significantly change the CPU or GPU. the Pro models did improve these systems and others. That's why they are treated differently Masem (t) 03:50, 20 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Seconded, Masem is correct. Sergecross73 msg me 13:18, 20 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I meant on other lists slim models are not displayed separately from the original model.
The chart on this page separate into columns Xbox one from its s model, the PS4 from its slim model, and Nintendo Switch oled model from the original column. Doremon764 (talk) 22:05, 22 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
When it comes to the handhelds on this page PSVita and 3DS are pact in the same box when it comes to how the chart is displayed. Just to bring up the inconsistency of the charts. Doremon764 (talk) 22:09, 22 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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