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Apparently being in America’s top 25 universities is low importance. Also many of the rankings place this school higher than many Ivy Leagues. So it being high importance is justified.
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[[Image:Vista-file-manager.png|50px|Archive]]
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* '''[[Talk:Washington University in St. Louis/Archive|Archived Talk Page 1]]'''<br>April 2005-July 2006<br>
* '''[[Talk:Washington University in St. Louis/Archive|Archived Talk Page 2]]'''<br>July 2006-December 2006<br>
[[Talk:Washington University in St. Louis/Archive|April 2005 - July 2006]]<br />
[[Talk:Washington University in St. Louis/Archive 2|July 2006 - December 2006]]<br />
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[[Talk:Washington University in St. Louis/Archive 3|December 2006 - May 2007]]<br />
== Centers and Institutes ==
[[/Deletion discussion]]}}


== Proposed merge of [[George Warren Brown School of Social Work]] into [[Washington University in St. Louis]] ==
{{Discussion top|result=To '''not''' merge, given sufficient independent reliable sources. [[User:Klbrain|Klbrain]] ([[User talk:Klbrain|talk]]) 09:11, 26 September 2024 (UTC)}}
I don't see sufficient notability for an independent article. Most of the content is referenced to a primary source, there is a large unsourced table of research centers that can simply go. There is some interesting information (e.g., first admission of Black students) that can be merged into the main article <small>'''''[[User:Polyamorph|Polyamorph]]''''' ([[User talk:Polyamorph#top|talk]])</small> 10:55, 1 April 2024 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' I think that there's sufficient material to justify an independent article. ~ [[User:HAL333|<span style="background:red; color:white; padding:2px; border:1px solid red;">'''HAL'''</span>]][[User talk:HAL333|<span style="background:black; color:white; padding:2px; border:1px solid red;">'''333'''</span>]] 15:08, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' There are ''barely'' sufficient sources to pass [[WP:GNG]] but they're there - the book dedicated entirely to the history of this organization that begins in the early 1900s is especially convincing. [[User:ElKevbo|ElKevbo]] ([[User talk:ElKevbo|talk]]) 21:29, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
{{Discussion bottom}}


== Rebrand ==
I made a few edits today, addding the heading "Centers and Institutes," as it would be beneficial to have a comprehensive listing of WUSTL academic organizations. Additionally, I added some information and liknks to a few centers/institutes, but the list is currently very small. Contributions would be appreciated, as well as any comments suggestions. <small>This [[Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages|unsigned]] comment was added by'' [[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] ([[User talk:Lmbstl|talk]]&nbsp;&bull;&nbsp;[[Special:Contributions/CLyerla|contribs]]) {{{2|}}}.</small><!--Inserted with Template:Unsigned-->


I've changed references from "Washington University" to "WashU" in accordance with today's announcement of a rebrand. More work on name references and logos will need to be done once there is more clarity on what can still be used and what is now considered defunct (particularly concerning university seals). [[User:WUSTLWikiWarrior|WUSTLWikiWarrior]] ([[User talk:WUSTLWikiWarrior|talk]]) 16:44, 16 August 2024 (UTC)
:Plenty of Universities have Centers and institutes, but why are the ones here so significant? why has so much space been devoted to them? I think we should dramatically revamp and perhaps even eliminate this section. But I want to hear other opinions.[[User:Astuishin|Astuishin]] 07:04, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


:Also, work will be needed on the pages of individual WashU schools, as well as other pages related to the school. [[User:WUSTLWikiWarrior|WUSTLWikiWarrior]] ([[User talk:WUSTLWikiWarrior|talk]]) 16:46, 16 August 2024 (UTC)
::Because of space concerns, Centers and Institutes have been moved to their own page: [[Centers_and_Institutes_of_Washington_University_in_St._Louis]]. Please feel free to expand the page-- these organizations can be very influentual and deserve mention.[[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] 07:40, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
:I’m going to undo this per [[WP:COMMONNAME]]. [[User:McYeee|McYeee]] ([[User talk:McYeee|talk]]) 17:15, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

::Note https://marcomm.washu.edu/our-name/. Specifically says that "Washington University" should no longer be used in reference to WashU. [[User:WUSTLWikiWarrior|WUSTLWikiWarrior]] ([[User talk:WUSTLWikiWarrior|talk]]) 17:28, 16 August 2024 (UTC)
:::I'll research the influence of these organizations and add anything I can find.[[User:Astuishin|Astuishin]] 08:13, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
:::@[[User:McYeee|McYeee]], you are right that we should keep that as the name for now throughout the article–however, certain official names have changed, which should be reflected in the article. [[User:WUSTLWikiWarrior|WUSTLWikiWarrior]] ([[User talk:WUSTLWikiWarrior|talk]]) 17:35, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

:::There are three issues here. First, this is an internal guideline for marketing, and Wikipedia goes by what a consensus of reliable sources use, not by internal guidelines. Second, the guideline doesn't even say that "Washington University" is incorrect, just that it should not be used, which in this context means should not be used by university PR people. Finally, do you have any sources that say that certain official names have actually changed? [[User:McYeee|McYeee]] ([[User talk:McYeee|talk]]) 17:36, 16 August 2024 (UTC)
== Changed "Campus" to "Campuses" ==
::::Fair points–however, I would expect colloquial name usage to change (including in news articles) to WashU in the coming months as a result of this, at which point we can make the necessary updates.

::::As for your third point, official school websites have made the switches to their new informal (not formal) names; this includes "WUSM" to "WashU Medicine."

::::One thing that ''will'' have to be changed on Wiki sooner rather than later is the logo. I am not sure about the official seal, but the logo at the bottom of the infobox is now outdated. [[User:WUSTLWikiWarrior|WUSTLWikiWarrior]] ([[User talk:WUSTLWikiWarrior|talk]]) 18:00, 16 August 2024 (UTC)
Information on the Danforth campus is pretty thorough, although a lot of information is missing about the Med Campus, Tyson Research Center, and West Campus. I will work to flesh it out and would appreciate any suggestions and contributions. <small>This [[Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages|unsigned]] comment was added by'' [[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] ([[User talk:Lmbstl|talk]]&nbsp;&bull;&nbsp;[[Special:Contributions/CLyerla|contribs]]) {{{2|}}}.</small><!--Inserted with Template:Unsigned-->
:::::I've asked WikiData to change the Official URL. The page is Semi-protected there. I agree that the logo has to be changed. I don't know about the seal either. [[User:McYeee|McYeee]] ([[User talk:McYeee|talk]]) 18:36, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

::::::Yes, I was looking into doing that earlier but did not want to change it manually from the official URL as is used in the template. Thank you. [[User:WUSTLWikiWarrior|WUSTLWikiWarrior]] ([[User talk:WUSTLWikiWarrior|talk]]) 18:53, 16 August 2024 (UTC)
== Created "Libraries and Museums" section ==

Created "Libraries and Museums" heading along with a listing of the 14 WUSTL libraries. Any suggestions and/or refinements woiuld be appreciated. <small>This [[Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages|unsigned]] comment was added by'' [[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] ([[User talk:Lmbstl|talk]]&nbsp;&bull;&nbsp;[[Special:Contributions/CLyerla|contribs]]) {{{2|}}}.</small><!--Inserted with Template:Unsigned-->
:created [[Washington University Library System]] page --[[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] 05:43, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

::I combine this and some of the other sections to try and make them more condensed [[User:Bancham|Bancham]] 11:46, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

:::It would be very nice if people could actually ''add'' content instead of deleting it. I don't know why [[User:Bancham|Bancham]] deleted references, further reading, and external links. I am not going to reverse any edits until they are discussed here. However, I believe that the deleted material was useful and should be reverted. Additionally, I will make suggestions for expansion of the WUSTL page, since the page needs content more than it needs rearranging. --[[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] 15:20, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

::::Okay i'm sorry if I offended [[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]], but if you compare the WUSTL page with other schools you'd quickly find that the external links section is getting out of hand, I mean you don't have to provide a link to every single website for the school. and of course intend to add more content, if one examine the talk page and the article history they will find that I have been contributing to this page for quite a while. [[User:Bancham|Bancham]] 22:26, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

I am not offended at all; just perplexed. I am not insisting that external links be present. However, I don't know why you deleted references and further reading suggestions. Anyway, I look forward to content being added to the WUSTL page. If we are going to use other institutions of equivilent reputation as a guide, which you have suggested, the WUSTL series is sorely lacking. We can rearrange the articles all we want, but it won't disguise the fact that they are quite thin in spots. [[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] 06:22, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

:I still think the st. louis colleges nav box is to large, and I also agree that the futher reading section needs to be restored. As for the external links I think they were I little bit much though some of the links could be restored. [[User:Astuishin|Astuishin]] 09:18, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

::I haven't yet seen any objections to a partial restoration . . . [[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] 04:50, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

==WUSTL logos and images==

I left a request on [[User:CLyerla|CLyerla]]'s talk page for some specific guidelines so we can discuss these edits.

I did find this information:

"The official logotype must be reproduced exactly as supplied by LRG or the University. It must not be separated into its various sections,such as use of the heraldic device (shield,crest) by itself.The official logotype is a federally registered trademark."

from: http://productgraphics.wustl.edu/pdf-forms/guidelines.pdf

It can be argued that photos from the WUSTL campus fall under fair use-- however, I think we should respect the WUSTL guidelines that the shield not be used on its own; to do so violates the logotype design.

Thoughts?

I hope that we can work together to agree on guidelines/permission for image use instead of getting into a tug-of-war that benefits no one. [[User:Lmbstl|Lmbstl]] 04:48, 29 December 2006 (UTC)


User Lmbstl - Thank you for your post - I was not able to reply until this morning. The information you located on the Product Graphics Web site is correct. The University logo is a trademarked symbol and as such cannot be altered or revised. Use of the shield alone, without the accompanying school name, is strictly prohibited. In addition, the version of the shield currently being used alone is incorrect - the shield does not contain the latin verse "Per Veritatem Vis" except when used within the University Seal (also a protected trademarked symbol). The University appreciates its accurate inclusion in Wikipedia, but must protect its identifying marks both within the University and in the public arena. Our Director of Product Licensing is in the process of contacting Wikipedia management to request the removal of the shield artwork, and hopes to achieve the same satisfactory response as was received with the use of the University Seal. - CLyerla

::I have a couple of problems with this document, CLyerla. First I'm wondering how far this document extends, if for instance one took a picture of the campus that did not come from the office of the DPL could it be removed (Like the seal embossed over Brookings hall, or pictures of the seal at commencement). Does this policy extend to any text rewritten about the university, for instance criticism about the admissions policy, or freedom of speech concerns on campus?(understand that in the past you removed some of this information) Could a member of the board of trustees sanitation the use of the seal. Do you believe Washington University has veto power over any content in the encyclopedia that concerns it? (because the universities name is a tm we might not be able to use it) Does this policy count under old seals or university artwork whose copyright as long since passed? Would the current logo be removed if the university did grant the encyclopedia the permission to use it? Is it trademarked?
The shield happens to be carbon copy of an old alumni information packet and was not altered in any means, how is this handled? What if the TM has expired on it?

::Until you have answered these question I will not revert your edits however I will remove all logos concerning the university until this matter is cleared. I am also glad of the fact, CLyerla, that you have finally realized this encyclopedia is not an extension brochure for your university. Thank you [[User:Astuishin|Astuishin]] 16:11, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

:::I've got no problems I just want if you're really a member of the university administration, CLyerla can you please identify yourself clearly to the community on this talk page that you are a member of the university staff? Thanks [[User:Bancham|Bancham]] 16:14, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

The University has no issue with use of its logo in this manner as an identifying mark - however, the logo must be used correctly at all times or is deemed a misrepresentation of the University and a misuse of its trademarked identity. The University Seal, whether in picture form or as digital artwork, is not the identifying symbol of the University. Similarly, older versions of the logo do not represent the University anymore than a homemade or newly created original logo would. The University does not object to the absence of artwork but any artwork that is used must be accurate and correct. -CLyerla

:I would like to repeat my question CLyerla can you please identify yourself clearly to the community on this talk page that you are a member of the university staff? I can of think this a bad joke. [[User:Bancham|Bancham]] 16:48, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

My apologies Bancham - I am the University Web Editor. - CLyerla

Thanks [[User:Bancham|Bancham]] 16:59, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

::Okay, still I have some problems. You are say that pictures of the seal cannot be used because they are not '''identifying''', on what legal grounds can the university block that inclusion on a non-profit web base encyclopedia? And also how does this apply if the copyright has expired? Thank you [[User:Astuishin|Astuishin]] 17:00, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

The University Seal in any form is not the identifying symbol of the University. It is artwork created for special use by the Board of Trustees only, and Wikipedia's legal counsel Brad Patrick confirmed the University's position on that matter in August 2006. - CLyerla

:But what is the legal argument behind that philosophy? I understand the internal university policy, but is there a law or section in the US copyright law that you can point to back up your claims, because so far I do not see any laws that supersede the right to take a picture and use it for non commercial purposes or the right to use a photo or object whose copyrights have expired and are in public domain. Thank you. [[User:Astuishin|Astuishin]] 17:19, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

I can only suggest you discuss it with Mr. Patrick, who handled the matter with the University's legal counsel office. I do not know the extent of their conversation. - CLyerla

:I would actually like to get in touch with University's legal office, because I've already emailed Dan and he saw no legal problems with the posting of the shield. Is there anyway you could direct me to them? Preferably by email, I would greatly appreciate it. Thank You [[User:Astuishin|Astuishin]] 17:35, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

::Also I have another question, earlier you stated any artwork used must be ''accurate and correct'', what does this mean? No dated pictures or designs of the University? Thank You [[User:Astuishin|Astuishin]] 17:42, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 21:38, 9 November 2024

If you are a part of the WUSTL WikiProject, you can add this template to your userpage:
{{User WUSTLproject}}
to display the following userbox on your userpage:

This user is a member of the Washington University in St. Louis WikiProject.

This will also add you to: Category:WikiProject Washington University in St. Louis participants

If you attend or have attended Washington University, you can add this template to your userpage:
{{User WUSTL}}
to display the following userbox on your userpage:

This user attends or attended
Washington University in St. Louis

This will also add your page to: Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Washington University in St. Louis


Proposed merge of George Warren Brown School of Social Work into Washington University in St. Louis

[edit]
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
To not merge, given sufficient independent reliable sources. Klbrain (talk) 09:11, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see sufficient notability for an independent article. Most of the content is referenced to a primary source, there is a large unsourced table of research centers that can simply go. There is some interesting information (e.g., first admission of Black students) that can be merged into the main article Polyamorph (talk) 10:55, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Rebrand

[edit]

I've changed references from "Washington University" to "WashU" in accordance with today's announcement of a rebrand. More work on name references and logos will need to be done once there is more clarity on what can still be used and what is now considered defunct (particularly concerning university seals). WUSTLWikiWarrior (talk) 16:44, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Also, work will be needed on the pages of individual WashU schools, as well as other pages related to the school. WUSTLWikiWarrior (talk) 16:46, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I’m going to undo this per WP:COMMONNAME. McYeee (talk) 17:15, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note https://marcomm.washu.edu/our-name/. Specifically says that "Washington University" should no longer be used in reference to WashU. WUSTLWikiWarrior (talk) 17:28, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@McYeee, you are right that we should keep that as the name for now throughout the article–however, certain official names have changed, which should be reflected in the article. WUSTLWikiWarrior (talk) 17:35, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There are three issues here. First, this is an internal guideline for marketing, and Wikipedia goes by what a consensus of reliable sources use, not by internal guidelines. Second, the guideline doesn't even say that "Washington University" is incorrect, just that it should not be used, which in this context means should not be used by university PR people. Finally, do you have any sources that say that certain official names have actually changed? McYeee (talk) 17:36, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Fair points–however, I would expect colloquial name usage to change (including in news articles) to WashU in the coming months as a result of this, at which point we can make the necessary updates.
As for your third point, official school websites have made the switches to their new informal (not formal) names; this includes "WUSM" to "WashU Medicine."
One thing that will have to be changed on Wiki sooner rather than later is the logo. I am not sure about the official seal, but the logo at the bottom of the infobox is now outdated. WUSTLWikiWarrior (talk) 18:00, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've asked WikiData to change the Official URL. The page is Semi-protected there. I agree that the logo has to be changed. I don't know about the seal either. McYeee (talk) 18:36, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I was looking into doing that earlier but did not want to change it manually from the official URL as is used in the template. Thank you. WUSTLWikiWarrior (talk) 18:53, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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