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m Archiving 4 discussions to Talk:Rape during the Kashmir conflict/Archive 1. (BOT)
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Assessment: banner shell, Human rights (High), Psychology (Rater)
 
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ये जरूरी नहीं है कि भारतीय सेना ने ही इसकी शुरुआत करी |पर यै बहुत जरूरी है आज के इस कल युग में इंसायनियत
खत्म हो गई है|मै रोहित कश्यप एक कश्यप परिवार का लडका हुं| कश्यप जाति के लोगों को ॠषि कश्यप का बशंज माना जाता है|इन्ही ऋषि के नाम से आज कश्मीर का नाम है|कश्मीर भारत की नहीं बल्कि पुरे विश्व कई खुबसूरत स्थानो मे से एक माना जाता है| परन्तु आज ऐसा बक्त आ गया है कि हिन्दुस्तान ओर पाकिस्तान के बीच का हिस्सा एक कश्मीर बन गया है|जो सिर्फ इन देशों के कारण ही इतने जूल्म सह रहा है| कश्मीर का इतिहास न दुनिया जानती है| ओर भारत ओर पाकिस्तान मै बैठे लोग| पर बहां के लोग उन सहे हुए जुल्मो को अच्छी तरह से जानते है| की बो जूल्म किसने किए | पर आज भी लोग शांत हैं| कुछ अपने बिते हुए कल से तो कुछ खोफ से| कई आतकंवादीयो ने बहा कि पडिंती महिलाओं के साथ बल्तकार किए| ओर कई लोगों को बेहरहमी से मार डाला| पर भारतीय सैनिकों को ये कार्य करना सोभा नहीं देता| सेना को लोगों कि रक्षा के लिए रखा जाता है,न कि उनके साथ बल्तकार करने के लिए या दुसरो की इज्जत के साथ खेलने के लिए| ये कभी भी इंसानियत का रूप नहीं दिखाती बल्कि हैबानियत का रूप दिखाती है|...


== Load of Nonsense (Horse.S) ==
== Problematic editing on history==


. Undiluted Bakwas (tr. 'Nonsense' in Hindi) ...
{{ping|NadirAli}} <s>[https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Rape_during_the_Kashmir_conflict&diff=784613485&oldid=784213163] [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Rape_during_the_Kashmir_conflict&diff=784615600&oldid=784614976] - I'm afraid that by edit-warring, you have violated the 1 RR restriction which is enforced on this page. You are well aware about the Arb Com Discretionary Sanctions situation related to IPA articles, and you also have been [[User_talk:NadirAli/Archive_5#ARBIPA_sanctions_alert|notified about the same]]. I sincerely suggest you to self-revert, or else you can be reported.</s>
. Even if a single conscientious Army officer, or soldier (Jawan) becomes aware of a subordinate, troop member or brother Officer who has indulged in what one considers very poor OLQ; and its is reported. All hell would break loose. Its a court martial offense, and unlike US and British Armies with their Code Reds and one eye closed, policies, theI dian Army is a professional Army with a stellar record both in territorial and extra territorial peace keeping efforts.
. Even if the paltan (Battallion or Army Unit) closes rank (again impossible to keep a lid on) to prevent leakage of what would be a smirch on their flag and code of izzat; its the end of that blokes days with the Army. Even the culprits Company Officer gets rebuked and his record scarred.
. I have always been amazed by Gang rapes and child rapes. How does one maintain an erection, let alone get excited to have one. But deviant psychopaths and screening to prevent, entry of such individuals into the ranks apart; the checks and balances in both war and peace efforts and areas are time tested and standardised to make such trangressing event, very difficult to execute.
. A stray incident of an improperly supervised platoon member, forcing himself on a woman may happen very rarely. However very difficult to imagine and only if that poor soldier has a role where he is constantly mingling with civilians.
. But reports of using Gun point and gang raping unwilling civilians, is just BS
. Mingling with civilians may result in affairs and some unsavoury military behaviour. But mostly from soldiers being seduced or in turn making false promises of marriage etc. Just like regular civilian behaviour but in much smaller percentages!! 🙂
. Do barbaric Sharia laws prevent adultery or cheating. I would believe not, but the percentage or proportion compared to more humanely governed (English Law?) is definitely less. The analogy is thattheArmy man is regukated by Arny Actwhich allows for exemary and timely punishment for infarctions.
. And the very few possible instances of rape would have resulted in summary dismissal and alllwing the law of the labd ro run its x
Course. J&K has been for long a political battleground for mercenary populists; and international pseudo-evangelists (looking to make a quick buck in the name of Human Rights) and joudnalists in search of their el dorado story, where any kite can fly. Akin to US protecting their Oil interests under the garb of Human emancipation in Turbanned Sheikhdoms.
. Complete Hogwash. [[User:Dinesh Samurai|Dinesh Samurai]] ([[User talk:Dinesh Samurai|talk]]) 09:15, 5 January 2020 (UTC)


Every army in the world claims to be professional, not just the Indian army. Moreover, almost every big army of the world has been accused of violating human rights (including war-time rapes) at least at some point of time in the history... The facts in this article can be varified form simple Google searches...Being good citizens of India, we should in fact acknowledge all those crimes (which are backed with sufficient evidences) and make sure that no such incidents happen again.
Regarding your edit, when the source uses the word "molest", what is your justification in interpreting as "mass rape" and writing it so in the article? Please see the OED meanings of the words '[https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/molestation molestation]' and '[https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/rape rape]'. I don't know what the heck you mean, when say there is some "Wikipedia consensus" which says molest = rape! First of all, you need to provide evidence for that. You have to keep in mind that this page is not on ''Sexual violence during Kashmir conflict'', its particularly on ''Rape''. Your addition doesn't fit this article. — '''[[User:Tyler Durden|<span style="color: red">Tyler Durden</span>]] [[User talk:Tyler Durden|<span style="color: maroon">(talk)</span>]]''' 07:13, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
[[User:Gaurav6523|Gaurav6523]] ([[User talk:Gaurav6523|talk]]) 15:52, 19 August 2021 (UTC)
:I've already had blocked NadirAli for 1RR violation. [[User:El_C|El_C]] 07:22, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
:: Scratched, I wasn't aware of that. Just noticed it on his talk page, thanks for informing. --- '''[[User:Tyler Durden|<span style="color: red">Tyler Durden</span>]] [[User talk:Tyler Durden|<span style="color: maroon">(talk)</span>]]''' 07:26, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
:::I have reverted this because source only talks about "looting and molesting", and since author mentions Maharaja number of times it seems that author is talking about something that we have already detailed (dogra troops, hindu, sikh mobs). [[User:Capitals00|Capitals00]] ([[User talk:Capitals00|talk]]) 08:22, 9 June 2017 (UTC)


== Semi-protected edit request on 23 April 2022 ==
This is false statement during the partion there are no proof that specifically indian army is accused. Writing anything without any proof and just by reading on wikipedia is nonsense. [[User:Shubham08642|Shubham08642]] ([[User talk:Shubham08642|talk]]) 10:14, 17 February 2019 (UTC)


{{edit semi-protected|Rape during the Kashmir conflict|answered=yes}}
== Please notice the discretionary sanctions on this article ==
Islamic militants used rape of non-muslim women specially Hindu women as tactics of war against India and to do jihad against majority community, because islamic militants whose ancestors were also got converted by Islamic tyrants thought kashmir originally belongs to Islamists and no kaffir Or kuffar can rule there.


Those Islamic militants started to identify non-muslim women and kept harassing them at the start of complete Islamization of middle-east, because they believed that non-muslims from the kashmir would get hurt by these incidents and they immediately flee from the kashmir.
{{ping|Dilpa kaur}} Please do not make so many large edits to this article so fast, as per the discretionary sanctions on this article.
Let me also just double check the sanctions to check whether they are still in place. <br>
{{ping|Vanamonde93}} Are the sanctions still applicable to this page?
I have not been able to double check if the edits made by {{u|Dilpa kaur}} are good edits as yet, which I will be doing. I just wanted to verify the sanctions aspect first and if it is important for users to follow the ''one edit rule''. Regards. [[User:DiplomatTesterMan|DiplomatTesterMan]] ([[User talk:DiplomatTesterMan|talk]]) 18:35, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
: Yes, please see [[Wikipedia:Arbitration enforcement log/2016]] for the edit restrictions for all Kashmir conflict-related articles. -- [[User:Kautilya3|Kautilya3]] ([[User talk:Kautilya3|talk]]) 18:57, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
::No dear. The discretionary sanctions do not prohibit multiple large edits, they prohibit multiple reverts. Even that does not apply when one is pruning away copious quantities of copyright infringements. [[User:Dilpa kaur|Dilpa kaur]] ([[User talk:Dilpa kaur|talk]]) 11:10, 29 December 2018 (UTC)
:::{{re|Dilpa kaur}} The discretionary sanctions prohibit misrepresenting sources, and they also prohibit treating Wikipedia as a [[WP:BATTLE|battleground]]. You are free to remove copyright violations from the ''text of the article'', so long as you do not misrepresent the source in doing so: in edits such as [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Rape_during_the_Kashmir_conflict&diff=prev&oldid=875663646 this one], you are distorting what the source says. Furthermore, the guideline you are quoting relate to the use of quotations in the ''text'', not ''within citations''. The use of such quotations is ''not forbidden'', and what constitutes excessive use is not completely clear cut. I would encourage you to discuss this here first, and if no consensus is reached, take the issue to the copyvio noticeboard. [[User:Vanamonde93|Vanamonde]] ([[User talk:Vanamonde93|talk]]) 13:39, 29 December 2018 (UTC)


Islamic militants from the kashmir and Pakistan did rape of kashmiri Muslim and non-muslim women while wearing dress of Indian Army. Their supporter from communists parties twisted this fact and used as a propaganda against Indian Army and Indian [[Special:Contributions/2409:4042:4E94:CA62:0:0:FE08:A07|2409:4042:4E94:CA62:0:0:FE08:A07]] ([[User talk:2409:4042:4E94:CA62:0:0:FE08:A07|talk]]) 13:35, 23 April 2022 (UTC)
::::You are right Vanamonde93 that source misrepresentation and battleground behaviour is prohibited. But I am unsure why you think the latter is even a relevant issue here. We are debating, not fighting. As for your claim "so long as you do not misrepresent the source in doing so: in edits such as this one" you need to back that claim up by pinpointing to a sentence which did not remain faithful to its source after my copyedit. I will make a table later comparing each of my copyedited sentences with each corresponding source text to examine your claim. If we still can not solve our dispute here we will have to solve our dispute at [[WP:DRN]]. [[User:Dilpa kaur|Dilpa kaur]] ([[User talk:Dilpa kaur|talk]]) 15:47, 29 December 2018 (UTC)
:[[File:Red information icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done:''' please provide [[Wikipedia:Reliable sources|reliable sources]] that support the change you want to be made.<!-- Template:ESp --> [[User:ScottishFinnishRadish|ScottishFinnishRadish]] ([[User talk:ScottishFinnishRadish|talk]]) 13:40, 23 April 2022 (UTC)
:::::Actually, that's easily done; don't bother with the tables. You replaced "intimidation" in the original with "subjugation"; the two words are not equivalent. You replaced "rape in Kashmir was a systematic attempt to humiliate the local population" with "rape is conducted systematically during counter-offensives against militants to shame local Kashmiri communities." Again, similar, but not identical in meaning. This was just in one edit, and does not even go into the grammatical problems you have introduced ("the motivations causing rape", for instance, is ungrammatical). Also, plastering a copyright violation template on the talk page of a user you know to be aware of copyright is evidence of a battleground attitude. So, I'm uninterested in going to DRN. Please take Dianaa's advice, and discuss any further issues with quotations here on the talk page. If you find copyright violations in the text, you should either remove the text completely, or rewrite it thoroughly. This approach of trying to switch individual words to ones similar in meaning simply does not work. [[User:Vanamonde93|Vanamonde]] ([[User talk:Vanamonde93|talk]]) 18:35, 29 December 2018 (UTC)
While I agree that Islamic militants have a history of raping Hindu women and Jihad against Hindus, there is no evidence that those were Islamic militants dressed in Indian army.[[User:Thelordofsword|Thelordofsword]] ([[User talk:Thelordofsword|talk]]) 12:37, 11 October 2022 (UTC)
::::::That is a bit better. I have copyedited 2 sentences you are right about. However, your statement that "This was just in one edit" is not useful. You have to give clear examples rather than leaving ambiguous statements. You are also incorrect on my copyedit of the Amnesty International statement. The original source text goes like this "rape is practised as part of a systematic attempt to humiliate and intimidate the local population during counter-insurgency operations." It is obvious that the former text ("rape in Kashmir was a systematic attempt to humiliate the local population") was too close a paraphrase of the original text. It is also quite obvious that my copyedit ("rape is conducted systematically during counter-offensives against militants to shame local Kashmiri communities") is identical in meaning to the source text. If you still disagree with such an obvious fact this then going to [[WP:DRN]] will become a good faith pathway to solve your dispute with me. I will add the comparative table there. [[User:Dilpa kaur|Dilpa kaur]] ([[User talk:Dilpa kaur|talk]]) 06:15, 30 December 2018 (UTC)
:::::::"systematic attempt to humiliate" is ''not'' the same as "rape is conducted systematically". If you're unable to understand that, you shouldn't be editing such a contentious topic. More importantly, you are dodging the main point I made. Dianaa explicitly told you that the quotations in citations were not a problem. You have refused to acknowledge this, and have done nothing about restoring the quotations, which greatly aid verifiability. Please do so now. [[User:Vanamonde93|Vanamonde]] ([[User talk:Vanamonde93|talk]]) 14:18, 30 December 2018 (UTC)
::::::::There is no difference in the meaning of those two texts if you actually read their original sentences in full without narrowing down to 4 words. Nevertheless, I have copyedited that sentence for you.
:::::::::While Diannaa did say that attributed quotes are okay, she also cautioned that excessive quotes violate [[WP:NFCC]].[https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Dilpa_kaur&diff=875863445&oldid=875848659] I have reinstated a trimmed version of those quotes. I won't be restoring large (excessive) paragraphs.[[User:Dilpa kaur|Dilpa kaur]] ([[User talk:Dilpa kaur|talk]]) 08:00, 1 January 2019 (UTC)


== Semi-protected edit request on 29 August 2023 ==
== Follow-up from the above section ==


{{edit semi-protected|Rape during the Kashmir conflict|answered=yes}}
{{ping|Dilpa kaur}} Sasri kaal Ji! Please do make the table you were talking about above. Maybe you could try to make it in this way. (Since the table is hard to make on the talk page due to the lack of visual editor, I also made one in my userspace, located at [[User:DiplomatTesterMan/Rape during the Kashmir Conflict]], which you are welcome to fill in.) (Also since I am not sure whether this kind of discussion can go on this talk page or not, hence in userspace if need be.)
ACCUSING THE INDIAN ARMY OF ORCHESTRATING MASS RAPES IS AN UTTER TRAVESTY. CORRECT THIS CONTENT RIGHT AWAY. [[Special:Contributions/103.57.236.55|103.57.236.55]] ([[User talk:103.57.236.55|talk]]) 18:21, 29 August 2023 (UTC)

:[[File:Red information icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done:'''<!-- Template:ESp --> seems pretty well sourced. feel free to check out some of the citations linked in the article [[User:Cannolis|Cannolis]] ([[User talk:Cannolis|talk]]) 18:44, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
{| class="wikitable"
|+Edits on "Rape during the Kashmir conflict" - Dilpa Kaur
! rowspan="2" |Sr No
! rowspan="2" |Edit Date and Time
! rowspan="2" |Edit Summary
! colspan="2" |Changes made to text
! rowspan="2" |Comments
|-
!Previous
!After
|-
|1
|04:38, 28 December 2018
|''(copyediting closely pararphrasd text and removing excessive quotations per'' [[WP:COPYVIO]]'')''
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|2
|04:39, 28 December 2018‎
|''([[Rape during the Kashmir conflict#Background|→‎Background]]: copyediting close paraphrases and removing excessive quotations per [[WP:COPYVIO]])''
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|-
|3
|04:41, 28 December 2018
|''([[Rape during the Kashmir conflict#Rape%20as%20a%20weapon%20of%20war|→‎Rape as a weapon of war]]: copyediting close paraphrases and removing excessive quotations per [[WP:COPYVIO]])''
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|-
|4
|04:43, 28 December 2018‎
|([[Rape during the Kashmir conflict#Extent|→‎Extent]]: ditto, removing large quantities of copyrighted material (quotes) and copediting any closely paraphrased texts)
|
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|-
|5
|04:46, 28 December 2018
|([[Rape during the Kashmir conflict#Aftermath|→‎Aftermath]]: copyediting close paraphrases and removing excessive quotations per [[WP:COPYVIO]])
|
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|-
|6
|04:50, 28 December 2018‎
|''(ditto, copyediting closely paraphrased texts and removing excessive quotations per'' [[WP:COPYVIO]]'')''
|
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|}
Regards. [[User:DiplomatTesterMan|DiplomatTesterMan]] ([[User talk:DiplomatTesterMan|talk]]) 13:20, 30 December 2018 (UTC)
:Thank you DTM but the table I am working on in my folder is structured differently. It has a column for the original source's text, another column for the old article text and the third column is for my copyedit. Each row contains an individual sentence to compare between the three.
:The above table which goes by each edit doesn't leave room to compare each sentence individually and besides won't be of much help because in each edit of mine most of the bytes were actually removal of large white gaps inside the ref templates. I made the reference templates more compact.[[User:Dilpa kaur|Dilpa kaur]] ([[User talk:Dilpa kaur|talk]]) 08:01, 1 January 2019 (UTC)
:: {{re|Dilpa kaur}} Umm ok. So we don't get to see your table? :( [[User:DiplomatTesterMan|DiplomatTesterMan]] ([[User talk:DiplomatTesterMan|talk]]) 16:25, 1 January 2019 (UTC)
:: <small>{{ping|Dilpa kaur}} re-ping, some problem with the last one. [[User:DiplomatTesterMan|DiplomatTesterMan]] ([[User talk:DiplomatTesterMan|talk]]) 16:26, 1 January 2019 (UTC)</small>
<s>== Rape by militants (post-1988) ==
After reading the content and the sources thereof, I wonder how is this section standing. This whole section looks blatant POV, OR and irrelevant. I couldn't find incidents like in its following section with sources, if anyone can he/she is welcome. ''[[User:Mehrajmir13|<span style="background:white"><font color="green">&nbsp;Mehra<font color="red">j</font>Mir&nbsp;</font></span>]]''[[User talk:Mehrajmir13|(talk)]] 12:28, 19 February 2019 (UTC)</s>
:The whole article was manipulated due to possible vandalism. I reverted those edits now. ''[[User:Mehrajmir13|<span style="background:white"><font color="green">&nbsp;Mehra<font color="red">j</font>Mir&nbsp;</font></span>]]''[[User talk:Mehrajmir13|(talk)]] 13:13, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

== Semi-protected edit request on 22 February 2019 ==

{{edit semi-protected|Rape during the Katua Mohammed|answered=yes}}
Pakistan Murdabad [[User:PAPAPakistanKa123|PAPAPakistanKa123]] ([[User talk:PAPAPakistanKa123|talk]]) 07:36, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
:[[File:Red question icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done:''' it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a [[Wikipedia:Identifying reliable sources|reliable source]] if appropriate.<!-- Template:ESp --> &#8209;&#8209;'''[[User talk:ElHef|<font color="red">El</font><font color="orange">Hef</font>]]'''&nbsp;<small>([[Special:Contributions/ElHef|<font color="black">Meep?</font>]])</small> 13:48, 22 February 2019 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 18:04, 17 December 2024

ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 13:40, 23 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

While I agree that Islamic militants have a history of raping Hindu women and Jihad against Hindus, there is no evidence that those were Islamic militants dressed in Indian army.Thelordofsword (talk) 12:37, 11 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 29 August 2023

[edit]

ACCUSING THE INDIAN ARMY OF ORCHESTRATING MASS RAPES IS AN UTTER TRAVESTY. CORRECT THIS CONTENT RIGHT AWAY. 103.57.236.55 (talk) 18:21, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: seems pretty well sourced. feel free to check out some of the citations linked in the article Cannolis (talk) 18:44, 29 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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