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== Jesus' brothers. Jose.was NOT the father of Jesus, but yet he is mentioned as his father, meaning that they didn't have to be his "flesh" brothers.. ==
==Older==


Jesus' brothers. Joseph was not Jesus' father, but he is mentioned as such, meaning his "brothers" didn't have to be his "flesh" brothers. [[Special:Contributions/2605:BA00:3208:924:6CF5:9C85:F216:7D88|2605:BA00:3208:924:6CF5:9C85:F216:7D88]] ([[User talk:2605:BA00:3208:924:6CF5:9C85:F216:7D88|talk]]) 01:09, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
''the "see" of Israel:'' A [[Episcopal see|See]] is the seat of a bishop. There was a (Pauline Christian) see of Jerusalem, but the idea of a see of "Israel" which no longer exised, or even of Palestine or Judea, which did exist, is the product of a modern imagination. [[User:Wetman|Wetman]] 01:12, 16 Feb 2004 (UTC)


:Wrong. "Jesus son of Joseph" - John 1:45. The 'virgin birth' is a myth and a mistranslation of Isaiah 7:14. However, Y'shua bar Yosef was the Reincarnated God. [[Special:Contributions/2600:1700:3DC4:8220:809E:FBC2:479:C5A8|2600:1700:3DC4:8220:809E:FBC2:479:C5A8]] ([[User talk:2600:1700:3DC4:8220:809E:FBC2:479:C5A8|talk]]) 21:30, 1 January 2025 (UTC)
* Wetman is correct therefore I have edited the article to reflect his comment. [[User:Loremaster|Loremaster]] 04:23, 10 Apr 2004 (UTC)
-----
I feel that an entry '''Desposyni''' needs to disambiguate all the "cover names" in the Pauline New Testament (like "Mary mother of James" after the Crucifixion) and the equivocations that cover genuine family relationships. And the relations of Jesus and Mary Magdalene need to be carefully addressed. After all "who" the Desposyni were is a basic point. (I'm not competent to do this. Or I'm chicken...) [[User:Wetman|Wetman]] 06:24, 10 Apr 2004 (UTC)


* As always, I agree with Wetman. The Desposyni article was a quick creation of mine that I intended to come back to one day and make over but never did. I will try to do so as soon as I get some free time and find more sources. [[User:Loremaster|Loremaster]] 14:43, 10 Apr 2004 (UTC)


== Source? ==


Relative to Jesus' brothers, which some say were his "blood" brothers; in the New Testament, Joseph is called "Jesus' father" even though he wasn't which could mean they weren't his "blood brothers. [[Special:Contributions/2605:BA00:3208:924:6CF5:9C85:F216:7D88|2605:BA00:3208:924:6CF5:9C85:F216:7D88]] ([[User talk:2605:BA00:3208:924:6CF5:9C85:F216:7D88|talk]]) 01:19, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
Hello, what's the source for this statement: "Every early community of Judean followers of Jesus, whether it was Nazarene or Ebionite, was governed by a desposynos as a patriarch, and each of them carried one of the names traditional in Jesus' family but no one was ever named after him."


== "No Biblical Evidence" ==
Also, what's the source for Jesus being a descendent of Zadok, David's High Priest? The Zadok given in Jesus' genalogy in the New Testament belongs to the time after the Babylonian Exile, at least five hundred years afte David's Zadok, doesnt' he?


The page states more than once that there is "no Biblical evidence" for Joseph being an older man and the Adelphoi being step siblings and/or cousins, but the most common scriptural evidence given by Catholics seems to be twofold. Firstly, Joseph died before the crucifixion, and secondly Jesus has to give Mary away to be taken care of by John, an Apostle who was not a blood relative. These two pieces are the most common given by Catholics, so in the interest of fairness the page should reflect this instead of the biased statement of "there is no Biblical evidence" [[User:Ptinkle99|Ptinkle99]] ([[User talk:Ptinkle99|talk]]) 03:37, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
Thanks. -- [[User:84.57.14.9|84.57.14.9]] 17:50, 16 Sep 2004 (UTC)


:But the apostle Paul met Jesus's own brother. That throws a monkey wrench in that reasoning. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]]) 14:37, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
:The source for the first claim is '''Martin, Malachi. ''The Decline and Fall of the Roman Church''. New York: Bantam, 1983. 30-31.'''


== Verifiability ==
:The second claim is inaccurate and has been corrected to state that Jesus was a descendant of Aaron rather than Zadok. The source is '''Luke 1:5''' and '''Luke 1:36'''. Do you need me to elaborate more?


{{re|Anotherperson123}} I can see the [[WP:RS]] (Segal) on Google Books. It confirms ([[WP:V]]) "of the same womb". Don't pretend it doesn't, we're not schoolchildren.
:[[User:Loremaster|Loremaster]] 20:37, 16 Sep 2004 (UTC)


Pretending it does not say "of the same womb" only tarnishes your reputation as a Wikipedia editor. We take a dim view of such shenanigans.
----


Before you object: it does mean "brothers", but the literal translation is "of the same womb". The field "lit." is not meant for the meaning, but for the literal translation. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]]) 14:53, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
I have edited somewhat the statement of their dynastic legitimacy as fact. They may of course be true heirs, I don't know, but there just isn't enough documentation or other evidence to establish such claims irrefutably. [[User:Fire Star|Fire Star]] 15:30, 24 Sep 2004 (UTC)
----
What sources did Malachi Martin cite for his statement that "Every early community of Judean followers of Jesus, whether it was Nazarene or Ebionite, was governed by a desposynos as a patriarch, and each of them carried one of the names traditional in Jesus' family but no one was ever named after him?" Martin's account of the desposyni meeting with Pope Sylvester is equally suspicious. Where did he get it?
[[User:Jbull|Jbull]] 13:59, 18 October 2005 (UTC)


:Nowhere have I said that it doesn't say the words "of the same womb". I simply stated, as the source says, that this is the etymology of the word, rather than the strict literal definition. Here is a quote (emphasis mine):
== Blood relative? ==
:“As her defiance of Creon continues into the stichomythy, her word homospanchmos some fifty lines late ''etymologically defines'' ‘brother’ as ‘of the same womb’ (511). Homospanchmos calls attention to the ''root meaning'' of the familiar word for ‘brother,’ adelphos, from a- (“same” equivalent to homo-) and delphys (“womb,” equivalent to splanchma).”
:This clearly states that this is the etymological definition of the word, rather than its literal translation. [[User:Anotherperson123|Anotherperson123]] ([[User talk:Anotherperson123|talk]]) 16:56, 28 September 2024 (UTC)


::{{re|Anotherperson123}} True, but inessential. This is getting tedious, so please read the whole page. Your argument does not fly. Let me state it again: such behavior is not appreciated.
I thought that most Christians believed that Joseph ''wasn't'' a blood relative of Jesus. Is this an inaccuracy in the article, or an inconsistency within the belief being explained? [[User:Mel Etitis|Mel Etitis (<font color="green">&Mu;&epsilon;&lambda; &Epsilon;&tau;&eta;&tau;&eta;&sigmaf;</font>)]] 18:19, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC)
::I.e. combating Segal's manifest view with a quote from the same page is not done. [[WP:NOTDUMB]].
::In case you still cannot figure out what I mean, see the quote provided for [[WP:V]] purposes at {{diff2|1248301387}}. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]]) 19:20, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
:::I think you may be confused about what a [[literal translation]] is, as it is nothing other than the meaning of a word apart from its context in a phrase or sentence. As such, literal translations translate word for word. It does not mean translating part-of-a-word for part-of-a-word. [[User:Anotherperson123|Anotherperson123]] ([[User talk:Anotherperson123|talk]]) 17:22, 30 September 2024 (UTC)


::::{{re|Anotherperson123}} Now there are three [[WP:RS]], including one which literally says "literally". Your POV does not trump three [[WP:RS]], and more sources could be [[WP:CITED]], since this is not a dubious matter, instead it is broadly accepted.
:As "Son of God", logically Jesus could be no more than a '''half-brother''' of any human being. Thus the ''desposyni,'' as Jesus' human relatives, are "half-brothers" and "half-cousins" and "half-second cousins twice removed" if you like. But, and much more to the point, '''no such distinctions''' are made in Scripture, unless "brothers" does not really mean ''brothers'' &mdash;a strained reading that Roman Catholic tradition since Jerome has come ever more strongly to assert, because the developing mythology of the [[Perpetual Virginity]] of Mary trumped the plain-spoken statements in Scripture concerning family relationships. If the entry is insufficiently clear, it is because we need to be very careful on these points, or "disputed" banners will be applied and "controversial" text suppressed. --[[User:Wetman|Wetman]] 18:52, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC)
::::At Wikipedia there is some room for editorial discretion, but that room ceases to exist when the sources have spoken.
::::To end this dispute, I [[WP:CITED]] [[WP:RS]] which endorse both "of the same womb" and "brothers" as literal meanings of ''adelphoi''.
::::So: which is true? Both are true! [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]]) 08:20, 1 October 2024 (UTC)


== Adelphopoiesis ==
::Sorry, I wasn't talking about brothers or half-brothers, but about ''Joseph'' (described as Jesus' father in the article). [[User:Mel Etitis|Mel Etitis (<font color="green">&Mu;&epsilon;&lambda; &Epsilon;&tau;&eta;&tau;&eta;&sigmaf;</font>)]] 19:01, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC)


Is there not also the simple possibility of brother-making ceremonies (adelphopoiesis, much like adoption) being responsible for these adelphoi? Under which they would be Jesus's siblings but wouldn't have been actual relatives. [[User:GlobalPeas|GlobalPeas]] ([[User talk:GlobalPeas|talk]]) 06:28, 21 December 2024 (UTC)
:::I added a short caveat to address this but this has to be developed. [[User:Loremaster|Loremaster]] 20:47, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC)


:According to [[Adelphopoiesis|our article]], that's a kind of medieval Christian thing, probably not known in 1st century AD Galilee and Judea. [[User:AnonMoos|AnonMoos]] ([[User talk:AnonMoos|talk]]) 04:08, 23 December 2024 (UTC)
::::OK &mdash; though now I have another problem. ''Who'' used this term in this way if not Christians? Following the various links I managed to work it out (though I'm still a little hazy), but shouldn't this be stated clearly right at the beginning?<br>Incidentally, in Cypriot Greek ''Desposyni'' means ''Miss'', ''Mademoiselle'', etc. [[User:Mel Etitis|Mel Etitis (<font color="green">&Mu;&epsilon;&lambda; &Epsilon;&tau;&eta;&tau;&eta;&sigmaf;</font>)]] 22:01, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC)


== Rabbi Jesus son of Joseph had 7 Siblings: 4 Brothers - GOD=GOOD=7_4 ==
:::::I've edited the article again for clarification. ''Desposyni'' was a term used by Christians, Nazarenes and Ebionites. However, only the Ebionites used it to refer to Joseph due to their belief that he was the biological father of Jesus. Have you taken the time to learn more about the differences between these three sects within the Jesus movement? [[User:Loremaster|Loremaster]] 20:18, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)


'''GOD=GOOD=7_4 Theory''' (''Seal #2'') appeared in the ''7 Siblings of Y'shua: 4 brothers - James (Yakov), Jose (Joseph), Simon, Judas (Jude)''. The Reincarnating God also had three sisters. ''"Jesus son of Joseph." - John 1:45''. The 'virgin birth' is a myth. [[Special:Contributions/2600:1700:3DC4:8220:809E:FBC2:479:C5A8|2600:1700:3DC4:8220:809E:FBC2:479:C5A8]] ([[User talk:2600:1700:3DC4:8220:809E:FBC2:479:C5A8|talk]]) 21:43, 1 January 2025 (UTC)
== Church fathers ==

I'm crossposting a recent post on [[Talk:Jesus]] [[User:Archola|Arch O. La]] ''<small><sup><font color="green">[[User:Archola/S|Grigory]]</font> <font color="#404040">[[User:Archola/T|Deepdelver]]</font></sup></small>'' 22:34, 4 May 2006 (UTC):

<blockquote>Hey - I would have just added this myself but the page is frozen. But I think we should add a section on the Fathers' view of Jesus' genealogy (specifically the view in [[Augustine of Hippo|Augustine]]'s Retractions 2:7; [[St. Jerome]]'s Commentary on Matthew 1:16; [[Eusebius of Caesarea]]'s view in the Ecclesiastical History 1:7; and [[John Damascene]]'s view in his Exact Exposition of the Orthodox Faith 4:14. That tradition says:

Heli son of Matthat was descended from [[David]]'s son [[Solomon]]; Jacob son of Matthan from David's son [[Nathan (son of David)|Nathan]]. The Fathers claim that Heli and Jacob were in fact half-brothers. According to tradition, their mother Estha first married Matthat and had Heli; then after Matthat died, she married Matthan and had Jacob.

Now, when Heli grows up, he marries a woman (tradition doesn't assign her a name as far as I can tell) but dies before they have any children. Then, in accordance with the [[levirate]] law in [[Deuteronomy]] 25:5, Jacob married Heli's widow, and "raised up seed for his brother." Thus, Jacob was physically Joseph's father, but Heli was accounted his father in accordance with the Law. {{unsigned|Adam sk}}</blockquote>

== Jesus Descendants down to today ==
The 2003-06 best seller, Da Vinci Code claimed the holy grail was Jesus
bloodline down to today and was just following that same subject from
earlier (1983-4) best seller, Holy Blood Holy Grail.
Many off point disagreements over this assume immediately, that this meant
Jesus didnt die on the cross and never went to heaven and so later had
children. And so that would undermine all Christianity.

In fact, no one in these discussions ever meant that; they meant Jesus had
children before he died on the cross and then still went to heaven.
And the Bible clearly prophecied that Jesus would have children.

See -
*He shall see his Seed - Isaiah 53: 10
*He shall sprinkle his Seed across many nations - Isaiah 52:15
*Thus saith the Lord, the Holy One of Israel, and His Maker, ask me of things to concerning My Sons ... Isaiah 45: 11

The only source settling this all out for On Point consideration is the new
book : The Jesus Presidents,

[http://www.booksamillion.com/ncom/books?id=3634927356792&isbn=0595333001Jesus Descendants to Today to You?]

{{unsigned|152.163.100.196}}

:Spam? [[User:Archola|Arch O. La]] ''<small><sup><font color="green">[[User:Archola/S|Grigory]]</font> <font color="#404040">[[User:Archola/T|Deepdelver]]</font></sup></small>'' 21:19, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

==Jesus Descendants==
Descendants of Jesus himself are "direct" Desposyni versus descendants of related lines descended from his brothers and sisters or from his cousin John the Baptist.
These are the related lines of Jesus direct family including a postulated twin of his named Thomas who died in Mylapore, India where the evidence exists, it is claimed, for his having living there.

In addition, in Northwest India, are records of Jesus himself having visited and remained a time. And some claim, he is buried there. (see below)

Other's claim, Joseph of Arithathea was Jesus brother and so his bloodline in UK down to today also was a Desposyni line.

Jesus = Mary Magdeline Jesus twin Thomas
_____________________________________________ ___________________
| | | died Mylapore India
Rama Theo Joseph Jesus II Tamar/ 40-70 AD
Joseph Justus Alain/Galain Demaris Dau no known children
down to down to + ? Paul
Merovingian Kings FitzAlan no known
AND to Brit, & descendants
Scot, Wales kings Stewart
and all European lines
Kings all Europe

* for more info see: The Jesus Presidents showing Jesus lines to today
** Jesus also reportedly had a 2nd wife Lydia

==Jesus Life in India==
Expert Holgar Kersten sets out the details of Jesus life and death in India in his book
[Jesus lived in India] (Element, Rocport, Mass, 1994 ISBN 1-85230-550-9).

He also discusses Jesus reverred tomb in Srinagar, Kashmir, India.

[[User:207.69.137.26|207.69.137.26]]lil desposyni sr~

==Personal surmise==
This article is marred by self-indulgent personal surmise. Can it be re-edited as a ''report'' of what's been said, to give the reader a sense of the historical development of these ideas? --[[User:Wetman|Wetman]] 08:01, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

==Basic argument==
While this article mentions different opinions within the scriptures, it makes no mention of one of the most basic arguments - that a married man and woman, of that time period, would produce no issue, ever. In a time and place when women were expected to spend their lives bearing and raising sire for their husbands, and children were the only way for a person to ensure a future for themselves once they were past working prime. Its almost impossible to believe. [[User:BethEnd|BethEnd]] 02:38, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

*Perhaps the article is not plain and clear enough, if someone has inserted John the Baptist here, as a "a relative of Jesus" (Yes, I do know the tradition, even its sources.) --[[User:Wetman|Wetman]] 20:22, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
==Peer review Javascript==
===[[Desposyni]]===
The following suggestions were generated by a semi-automatic [[User:AndyZ/peerreviewer.js|javascript program]], and <font color="red">may or may not be accurate</font> for the article in question.
*Consider adding more [[WP:LINK|links]] to the article; per [[WP:MOS-L]] and [[WP:BTW]], create links to relevant articles.
*This article has no [[WP:IMAGE|images]]. Please see if there are any [[WP:IT|free use]] images that fall under [[WP:IUP]] and [[WP:IT]] that can be uploaded. To upload images on Wikipedia, go to [[Special:Upload]]; to upload non-[[WP:FU|fair use]] images on the [[Wikimedia Commons]], go to [[commons:special:upload]].<ref name="noimg">See footnote</ref>
*See if possible if there is a [[WP:IT|free use]] image that can go on the top right corner of this article.<ref name="leadimg">See footnote</ref> <!--Note that if something is in front of a lead image, it will not render by this javascript suggestion peer reviewer (like a disambig link or a lead comment-->
*Per [[WP:MOS#Headings]], headings generally do not start with the word "The". For example, ''<nowiki>==The Biography==</nowiki>'' would be changed to ''<nowiki>==Biography==</nowiki>''.
*Per [[WP:MOS#Headings]], headings generally should not repeat the title of the article. For example, if the article was [[Ferdinand Magellan]], instead of using the heading ''<nowiki>==Magellan's journey==</nowiki>'', use ''<nowiki>==Journey==</nowiki>''.
*Please reorder/rename the last few sections to follow guidelines at [[WP:GTL]]. {{{1|}}}
*Watch for [[User:Tony1/How_to_satisfy_Criterion_2a#Redundancy|redundancies]] that make the article too wordy instead of being crisp and concise. (You may wish to try Tony1's [[User:Tony1/How to satisfy Criterion 2a: redundancy exercises|redundancy exercises]].)
**Vague terms of size often are unnecessary and redundant - “some”, “a variety/number/majority of”, “several”, “a few”, “many”, “any”, and “all”. For example, “<font color='red'><s>All</s></font> pigs are pink, so we thought of <font color='red'><s>a number of</s></font> ways to turn them green.”
{{#if:{{{1|}}}|*The article has a few or too many inline external links, which hamper the readibility of the article. Please convert them to [[WP:FOOTNOTE|footnotes]], preferably in the [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Cite/Cite.php cite.php] format recommended by [[WP:WIAFA]].|*This article needs [[WP:FOOTNOTE|footnotes]], preferably in the [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Cite/Cite.php cite.php] format recommended by [[WP:WIAFA]]. Simply, enclose inline citations, with [[WP:CITE]] or [[WP:CITE/ES]] information, with <nowiki><ref>THE FOOTNOTE</ref></nowiki>. At the bottom of the article, in a section named “References” or “Footnotes”, add <code><nowiki><div class="references-small"><references/></div></nowiki></code>.}}<ref name="foot">See footnote</ref>
*Please ensure that the article has gone through a thorough copyediting so that the it exemplifies some of [[WP:WIAFA|Wikipedia's best work]]. See also [[User:Tony1/How to satisfy Criterion 2a]]. {{#if:{{{1|}}}|For example,
**{{{1}}}}}{{#if:{{{2|}}}|**{{{2}}}}}{{#if:{{{3|}}}|**{{{3}}}}}{{#if:{{{4|}}}|**{{{4}}}}}{{#if:{{{5|}}}|**{{{5}}}}}{{#if:{{{6|}}}|**{{{6}}}}}{{#if:{{{1|}}}|**and perhaps other copyediting fixes for grammar/spelling are needed.}}<ref name="copyedit">See footnote</ref>
You may wish to browse through [[User:AndyZ/Suggestions]] for further ideas. Thanks, [[User:Archola|Arch O. La]] ''<small><sup><font color="green">[[User:Archola/S|Grigory]]</font> <font color="#404040">[[User:Archola/T|Deepdelver]]</font></sup></small>'' 21:22, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

==Catholic interpretation about Jesus'brothers ==
The article did not give details. I made some additions. Please, correct me if my English is not right.

==General vomit==
UUuurrk! [[User:Rursus|Rursus]] 00:03, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

== Holy Spirit ==

Why does this article not also include the popular belief that the Holy Spirit encompassed Mary and she bore Jesus? --[[User:KCMODevin|KCMODevin]] 05:21, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 13:20, 2 January 2025

Jesus' brothers. Jose.was NOT the father of Jesus, but yet he is mentioned as his father, meaning that they didn't have to be his "flesh" brothers..

[edit]

Jesus' brothers. Joseph was not Jesus' father, but he is mentioned as such, meaning his "brothers" didn't have to be his "flesh" brothers. 2605:BA00:3208:924:6CF5:9C85:F216:7D88 (talk) 01:09, 7 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Wrong. "Jesus son of Joseph" - John 1:45. The 'virgin birth' is a myth and a mistranslation of Isaiah 7:14. However, Y'shua bar Yosef was the Reincarnated God. 2600:1700:3DC4:8220:809E:FBC2:479:C5A8 (talk) 21:30, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]


Relative to Jesus' brothers, which some say were his "blood" brothers; in the New Testament, Joseph is called "Jesus' father" even though he wasn't which could mean they weren't his "blood brothers. 2605:BA00:3208:924:6CF5:9C85:F216:7D88 (talk) 01:19, 7 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"No Biblical Evidence"

[edit]

The page states more than once that there is "no Biblical evidence" for Joseph being an older man and the Adelphoi being step siblings and/or cousins, but the most common scriptural evidence given by Catholics seems to be twofold. Firstly, Joseph died before the crucifixion, and secondly Jesus has to give Mary away to be taken care of by John, an Apostle who was not a blood relative. These two pieces are the most common given by Catholics, so in the interest of fairness the page should reflect this instead of the biased statement of "there is no Biblical evidence" Ptinkle99 (talk) 03:37, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

But the apostle Paul met Jesus's own brother. That throws a monkey wrench in that reasoning. tgeorgescu (talk) 14:37, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Verifiability

[edit]

@Anotherperson123: I can see the WP:RS (Segal) on Google Books. It confirms (WP:V) "of the same womb". Don't pretend it doesn't, we're not schoolchildren.

Pretending it does not say "of the same womb" only tarnishes your reputation as a Wikipedia editor. We take a dim view of such shenanigans.

Before you object: it does mean "brothers", but the literal translation is "of the same womb". The field "lit." is not meant for the meaning, but for the literal translation. tgeorgescu (talk) 14:53, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nowhere have I said that it doesn't say the words "of the same womb". I simply stated, as the source says, that this is the etymology of the word, rather than the strict literal definition. Here is a quote (emphasis mine):
“As her defiance of Creon continues into the stichomythy, her word homospanchmos some fifty lines late etymologically defines ‘brother’ as ‘of the same womb’ (511). Homospanchmos calls attention to the root meaning of the familiar word for ‘brother,’ adelphos, from a- (“same” equivalent to homo-) and delphys (“womb,” equivalent to splanchma).”
This clearly states that this is the etymological definition of the word, rather than its literal translation. Anotherperson123 (talk) 16:56, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Anotherperson123: True, but inessential. This is getting tedious, so please read the whole page. Your argument does not fly. Let me state it again: such behavior is not appreciated.
I.e. combating Segal's manifest view with a quote from the same page is not done. WP:NOTDUMB.
In case you still cannot figure out what I mean, see the quote provided for WP:V purposes at [1]. tgeorgescu (talk) 19:20, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think you may be confused about what a literal translation is, as it is nothing other than the meaning of a word apart from its context in a phrase or sentence. As such, literal translations translate word for word. It does not mean translating part-of-a-word for part-of-a-word. Anotherperson123 (talk) 17:22, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Anotherperson123: Now there are three WP:RS, including one which literally says "literally". Your POV does not trump three WP:RS, and more sources could be WP:CITED, since this is not a dubious matter, instead it is broadly accepted.
At Wikipedia there is some room for editorial discretion, but that room ceases to exist when the sources have spoken.
To end this dispute, I WP:CITED WP:RS which endorse both "of the same womb" and "brothers" as literal meanings of adelphoi.
So: which is true? Both are true! tgeorgescu (talk) 08:20, 1 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Adelphopoiesis

[edit]

Is there not also the simple possibility of brother-making ceremonies (adelphopoiesis, much like adoption) being responsible for these adelphoi? Under which they would be Jesus's siblings but wouldn't have been actual relatives. GlobalPeas (talk) 06:28, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

According to our article, that's a kind of medieval Christian thing, probably not known in 1st century AD Galilee and Judea. AnonMoos (talk) 04:08, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Rabbi Jesus son of Joseph had 7 Siblings: 4 Brothers - GOD=GOOD=7_4

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GOD=GOOD=7_4 Theory (Seal #2) appeared in the 7 Siblings of Y'shua: 4 brothers - James (Yakov), Jose (Joseph), Simon, Judas (Jude). The Reincarnating God also had three sisters. "Jesus son of Joseph." - John 1:45. The 'virgin birth' is a myth. 2600:1700:3DC4:8220:809E:FBC2:479:C5A8 (talk) 21:43, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

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