Talk:Purple Haze/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Viriditas (talk · contribs) 04:32, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

Recent edits

Resolved

• An editor has recently introduced several unintentional errors into the article. This includes changing "We" to "e" in the "Background and recording" section and introducing a period after a comma and citation in the lead.[1] Viriditas (talk) 01:10, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Corrected. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

@Ojorojo:, you missed the "We" to "e" error in the quote. It still says, "e got it on the third take as I recall" instead of "We got it on the third take..." Viriditas (talk) 21:17, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

e got it this time. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:58, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation

Resolved

• Dab header looks good. Viriditas (talk) 23:23, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
• Looking at links...Note, this list does not imply that the links are wrong, just that it isn't clear why they are linked to these particular articles:
  • Psychedelic drug songs links to psychedelic rock instead of psychedelic music (see discussion below in lead section)

I thought the psychedelic rock article describes it better (more in Lead discussion). —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

• • Eight track recording links to history of multitrack recording instead of multitrack recording (see for example, eight track recording)

Again, I thought the history article did a better job describing analog (tape) 8-track and includes a mention of its introduction to the UK in 1968. However, I added a bit with a link to multitrack to make it clearer, which makes a second link unneeded. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

• • effects unit describes an effects pedal in the context of the Octavia effects unit. Considering the wide usage of the redirect[2] wouldn't a redirect work better in this context?

Since Octavia already links to effects pedal, I left out the additional link. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

• • Distortion unit links to Guitar effects#Distortion which is currently a redirect to effects unit

Again, Fuzz Face links to effects unit and distortion, so I left out the extra link. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

• • Inches per second links to Magnetic tape sound recording#Tapedeck speeds, currently a redirect to Tape recorder#Tapedeck speeds

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Infobox

Resolved

• OK. Viriditas (talk) 03:35, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Images

Resolved

• Everything checks out. Viriditas (talk) 23:23, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

I have been thinking about adding an image of Hendrix's handwritten early draft lyrics,[3] but can't tell if they are copyrighted (since they are completely different, the song's copyright wouldn't apply). The R&R Hall of Fame credits "Design Photography Inc."[4], along with many of the other "Spotlight Artifacts" images. Janie Hendrix's lyric book has a photography credit for "Jan Blom/Authentic Hendrix LLC" (the sellers of the postcards). It's not essential, but may break up some text in "Lyrics and interpretation". —Ojorojo (talk) 21:08, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

It's copyrighted. You could upload it as fair use to illustrate the critical commentary. Viriditas (talk) 20:37, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Lead

Resolved

• Because of ambiguities in the lyrics, it has been often interpreted as referring to a psychedelic experience, although Hendrix described it as a love song.
  • Try: "Because of ambiguities in the lyrics, listeners often interpret the song as referring to a psychedelic experience..." Viriditas (talk) 03:22, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

Done, more direct. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• It was also a regular concert feature and live recordings by each of Hendrix's group configurations have been issued
  • Try: "The song featured regularly in concerts and each of Hendrix's group configurations issued live recordings" Viriditas (talk) 03:15, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

As above. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• The song has been inducted into the Grammy and the Rock and Roll Halls of Fame. It is also included on lists of the greatest guitar songs, including at number two by Rolling Stone and number one by Q magazine.
  • Are songs actually inducted or just listed? I thought only performers and groups were inducted. The source goes to a museum exhibit that lists "500 Songs That Shaped Rock and Roll By Song". Viriditas (talk) 03:26, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

Right, but I didn't want to add the "500 Songs..." to the lead. I think the Grammy is the more significant. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• Hendrix described it as a love song, but it has acquired a reputation as "one of the archetypical psychedelic drug songs of the sixties"
  • Links within quotes are generally not recommended, but can be acceptable. I'm curious why you linked to psychedelic rock instead of psychedelic music. I haven't yet checked the quote, so perhaps I'm asking a question I'll be able answer shortly. Keep in mind, if you can link outside of the quote, that's encouraged. Viriditas (talk) 23:56, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

Practice noted, but I left the link in because it handles the drug-music connection without overemphasizing it and places it in context. Drmies changed the order, but I think it works. I expanded it in the Lyrics section. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Rewrote lead. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:58, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

• including those by Rolling Stone magazine and Q magazine.
  • Is it necessary to repeat the word magazine twice here? Why not "Rolling Stone and Q magazine"? Viriditas (talk) 01:05, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Background and recording

Resolved

• The group had recorded several demos of original material
  • Get rid of "had". Viriditas (talk)

Done. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• However, producer Chas Chandler was pushing for Hendrix to write a song based on a guitar riff that he was toying with around the middle of December: "I heard him playing it at the flat and was knocked out. I told him to keep working on that, saying, 'That's the next single!'"
  • This would work much better as a paraphrase and partial quote, setting the context and narrative. The use of passive voice slows the reader down. "In the middle of December, Chandler heard Hendrix toying around with a new guitar riff. "I heard him playing it at the flat and was knocked out. I told him to keep working on that, saying, 'That's the next single!'" You see how the quote adequately explains it? You don't have to say all that "however...pushing for Hendrix" bit. The quotes says it. Viriditas (talk) 22:05, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

Yes, much cleaner. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• Since this was accomplished using multitrack recording, the technology allowed for additional parts to be recorded and added to complete the final master.
  • "Multitrack recording technology allowed engineers to record and complete additional parts on the final master." Viriditas (talk) 22:11, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• After the basic track was finished, Chandler explained that he and Hendrix continued to develop the song
  • "After they finished the basic track, Chandler and Hendrix developed the song".. No need for "was" or "continued to", that just slows the reader down. The subsequent quote explains how they continued to work on it. Viriditas (talk) 22:13, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed,. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• Redding and Mitchell were not included in the process, because Chandler felt that it was more efficient for him and Hendrix to do it alone.
  • Is that comma needed or necessary? Viriditas (talk) 08:43, 30 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• Recording for the previous songs by the Experience had used conventional techniques, but Chandler decided to try out some new effects and sounds for "Purple Haze".
  • Get rid of "had": "Unlike the conventional techniques used by the Experience to record previous songs, Chandler decided to try out new effects and sounds for "Purple Haze"." Viriditas (talk) 08:43, 30 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• The unit doubles the frequency of the sound it is fed, essentially adding an upper octave, and was developed by Roger Mayer, an acoustical and electronics engineer, with Hendrix's input.
  • This version of the current text lacks readability. Please consider rewriting it. Something like this might work: "The unit, which was developed with Hendrix's input by acoustical and electronics engineer Roger Mayer, doubles the frequency of the sound it is fed, essentially adding an upper octave." Viriditas (talk) 01:28, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

I liked it better as two sentences, without the "it is fed": "The unit doubles an audio frequency, thereby essentially adding an upper octave.[ref] It was developed by Roger Mayer, an acoustical and electronics engineer, with Hendrix's input."[ref][5] —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

• Purple Haze" also saw the introduction of the Octavia guitar effects unit, which was used on the guitar solo. The unit, which was developed with Hendrix's input by acoustical and electronics engineer Roger Mayer, doubles the frequency of the sound it is fed, essentially adding an upper octave.
  • "The guitar solo features the first use of the Octavia guitar effects unit. Acoustical and electronics engineer Roger Mayer developed the unit with input from Hendrix. The Octavia doubles the frequency of the sound it is fed, essentially adding an upper octave." Viriditas (talk) 08:53, 30 October 2014 (UTC)

Better still. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Lyrics and interpretation

Resolved

• Lyrically, "Purple Haze" draws on several sources and Hendrix often gave different accounts of its composition.
  • I'm having trouble getting past this introduction. Trying to discuss lyricism, sourcing, and compositional accounts in one sentence is tough, especially when it isn't specific. How do you feel about splitting this into two sentences, mentioning exactly what the "several sources" are in the first sentence, and then summarizing the different accounts in the second sentence? Viriditas (talk) 02:04, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

This was an attempt to paraphrase "Biographer Harry Shapiro commented that "Every time he [Hendrix] was asked..." I gave it another try. —Ojorojo (talk) 18:29, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• Hendrix had read Night of Light, a 1966 novel by Philip Jose Farmer, that expanded on a short story published in 1957.
  • Get rid of "had". Simply, "Hendrix read..." Viriditas (talk) 02:17, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

Gone. —Ojorojo (talk) 18:29, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• You've got a lot of quotes in this section. Think about the mechanics of paraphrasing. Viriditas (talk) 03:45, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Rewrote. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• In an April 7, 1967, interview Hendrix offered another explanation
  • Is the date important here? "In a later interview, Hendrix offered another explanation for the song"... Viriditas (talk) 02:17, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

No, but I thought that placing it after the single release was noteworthy. —Ojorojo (talk) 18:29, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

• Biographer Harry Shapiro commented that "Every time he [Hendrix] was asked about this song, he gave a different answer. The likelihood was even he couldn't be positive about the initial inspiration ... 'Purple Haze' was almost certainly a pot-pourri of ideas neatly parcelled up into one song
  • This is the kind of quote that can easily be paraphrased and briefly quoted. if you're going to keep what you have, the rule of thumb is to use the blockquote when it approaches three lines. I think what you've got is fine for now, but it's something to keep in mind. When I read this, I think, "this is probably better off as a paraphrase". YMMV. Viriditas (talk) 03:39, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Paraphrased. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• On January 28, 1967, before the song was completed, Hendrix responded to a question about his songwriting...
  • What was the question? Why not put it in that narrative context? Viriditas (talk) 03:40, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Added. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• In an April 7, 1967, interview he offered an another explanation
  • An another? Delete "an". "Another" is already "an other". Viriditas (talk) 03:45, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Fixed typo. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• Because of the ambiguities in the lyrics, "'Purple Haze' has become known as one of the archetypal psychedelic drug songs of the sixties"
  • I'm not sure I really understand why the ambiguities led to it becoming known. Is this a poor paraphrase? Look at the source again, please. Viriditas (talk) 03:48, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Rewrote. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• With lines such as "purple haze all in my brain" and "'scuse me while I kiss the sky", many fans and the press have interpreted the song as referring to a psychedelic experience
  • "Many fans and the press interpret the song as referring to a psychedelic experience due to lines such as "purple haze all in my brain" and "'scuse me while I kiss the sky". Viriditas (talk) 02:23, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 18:29, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Composition

Resolved

• Diabolus in musica
  • The convention is lowercase: diabolus in musica. Viriditas (talk) 09:14, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• and some believe that its use was proscribed by papal bull
  • Who believed? Music historians? Avoid weasel words... Viriditas (talk) 09:18, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• "to play it was like ringing Satan's doorbell"
  • Best quote ever! Come on, who doesn't want to doorbell ditch mean ole Satan? Loads of fun! Seriously, Ojorojo, you must use that as the DYK! Viriditas (talk) 09:25, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I do His bidding. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• Hendrix chord is linked twice in this section, three times if you count the link to the dominant seventh sharp ninth chord in the same section. Since you link to the E7♯9 article three times, is it necessary to link in the caption? If so, then no need to link Hendrix chord in the body. Viriditas (talk) 02:13, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Just linked Hendrix chord in the body. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Linked in lead and Composition infographic. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• "almost sound[ing] likes he's playing a blues raga. He starts out playing in the Mixolydian mode and then he goes right into the blues side. The Octavia has the effect of a sitar, kind of like Ravi Shankar meets B.B. King."
  • Six links in that quote. Is that standard for music articles? That's pretty much unheard of in other topic areas at the GA/FA level, I believe. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Viriditas (talk) 02:14, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Certain words I link out of habit – genres, artists, musical terms, etc. The key word is Mixolydian, which I think is OK to link, but dropped the rest. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:25, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Releases and charts

Resolved

• Live recordings of "Purple Haze" as performed by each of the different Hendrix lineups have been released[57] – the Experience: Live at Monterey; Gypsy Sun and Rainbows: Live at Woodstock; the Band of Gypsys: Live at the Fillmore East; and the Cry of Love touring group: Live at Berkeley.
  • The placement of the citation and the use of the dash here hamper readability. Why doesn't the reference go at the end, and why did you use a dash here instead of a colon? Viriditas (talk) 20:16, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. The first reference doesn't include the newer albums, so I split it into two sentences for readability. —Ojorojo (talk) 23:42, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• As one of Hendrix's most popular songs, "Purple Haze" has appeared on numerous compilation albums over the years.
  • Get rid of "as", "has", and "over the years": "One of Hendrix's most popular songs, "Purple Haze" appears on numerous compilation albums". Viriditas (talk) 02:38, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

Changed. —Ojorojo (talk) 18:29, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Recognition and influence

Resolved

• Looks good. Viriditas (talk) 02:26, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

• I have an issue with citation 61, but I'll bring it up in the final comments at the end of the review. Viriditas (talk) 04:23, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I brought it up in the review criteria section first. The point is, you shouldn't add content based on a search result, but on reliable secondary sources picking the content. So instead of listing the bands in the search, it is preferable to have a list of the most notable versions highlighted by a respected authority. Viriditas (talk) 04:29, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Despite earlier reservations, I trimmed it to charting singles/songs and those mentioned as "popular" (instead of a mere inclusion). We'll see how others respond to it. —Ojorojo (talk) 19:36, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Notes

Resolved

Footnotes

• The Track single release date is listed as March 17, 1967 by Shapiro[1] and the Jimi Hendrix Encyclopedia;[2] McDermott[3] uses March 1, 1967.
• The Reprise single release date is listed as June 19, 1967 by Shapiro[50] and Shadwick;[51] McDermott[52] uses August 16, 1967, one week before the American release of Are You Experienced.

Which are the correct dates? Do you know? If you do, indicate them in the footnotes. Viriditas (talk) 04:16, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Clarified (hopefully). —Ojorojo (talk) 17:01, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

• Monterey Purple
  • I have never once heard that story before. Glad to know I learned something today. Viriditas (talk) 02:32, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

There was a lot of speculation in previous revisions and I think this helps address it without overemphasizing it. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Citations

• Harvard cites aren't working on my end. Please test them and see for yourself. Did you forget to use ref=harv in your cite templates? Viriditas (talk) 02:32, 31 October 2014 (UTC)
  • I think I fixed them all.[6] Viriditas (talk) 03:47, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

That's why ref=harv didn't work before (multiple authors not included in cites). Found a couple more. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:03, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Categories

Resolved

• Why no Category:Psychedelic rock songs? Viriditas (talk) 20:29, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

As per WP:SONGS#Categories #5: Category:Songs by artist should go in Category:Songs by genre (and apparently not individual songs). —Ojorojo (talk) 23:42, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

That's the most convoluted project guideline I've ever seen. I have to say, I don't agree with it. Categorizing an entire band by song genre makes no sense. Only individual songs should be categorized. According to that ridiculous scheme, all Red Hot Chili Peppers songs‎ are "rap" songs and all Jane's Addiction songs are "funk". That makes no sense. However, that is for another discussion page. Viriditas (talk) 01:27, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

Agree 100%. All Led Zeppelin songs are categorized as heavy metal and folk rock, plus a couple others. Looking through Category:British folk songs, you find Category:Led Zeppelin songs, but that category includes all LZ songs without further qualification/categorization. Since it is not apparent which really are British folk songs, each must be checked individually to find out (a brief search didn't show any, so although LZ's songs are categorized as British folk, none of their actual songs are). —Ojorojo (talk) 13:58, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

Criteria

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

1. Is it reasonably well written?

   A. Prose is "clear and concise", without copyvios, or spelling and grammar errors:

   B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:

2. Is it factually accurate and verifiable?

   A. Has an appropriate reference section:

   B. Citation to reliable sources where necessary:

   Citation 61 is a search result pointing to random recordings of the song. While this is OK for the moment, this kind of citation can be easily abused. In the future, please only link to reliable secondary sources that pick and choose the notable versions of the song.

Changed (see Recognition and influence comment). —Ojorojo (talk) 19:36, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

1. C. No original research:

2. Is it broad in its coverage?

   A. Major aspects:

   I wanted to know more about the unique riff. I can't think of anything else like it in the history of psychedelic rock.

I went through all the sources again and couldn't find any good material. From the sheet music/tab (and listening), it uses the simplest blues scale. Although the syncopation is different, comparable riffs with different orders have been used in blues and R&B for a long time. Hendrix's guitar tone really sets it apart. The combination with the Fuzz Face emphasizes certain harmonics, which gives it a unique sound, that some describe as "Eastern". Of course, this (as it applies to PH) is OR or SYN. I'll look for psychedelic rock riff/song comparisons. Also I added a request for an audio sample; 30 sec would cover the tritone, the riff, and the chord progression. —Ojorojo (talk) 19:36, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

@Ojorojo: Could you add some of that to the lead? I realize you've already touched upon some of it. No worries if you can't. Viriditas (talk) 19:58, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

1. B. Focused:

2. Is it neutral?

   Fair representation without bias:

3. Is it stable?

   No edit wars, etc:

   Stable.

4. Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?

   A. Images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content:

   Valid fair use rationales.

   B. Images are provided if possible and are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions:

   Relevant; captions OK

5. Overall:

   Pass or Fail:

   Minor issues. Viriditas (talk) 03:47, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

   Suggestions for improvement listed above in criteria section. Thanks for your good work. Viriditas (talk) 20:08, 3 November 2014 (UTC)