Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dominick Pezzulo

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. (non-admin closure) Coolperson177 (talk) 01:16, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

Dominick Pezzulo

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Dominick Pezzulo (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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Wikipedia is not a memorial and there is absolutely nothing notable about this individual besides the fact he was featured in World Trade Center (film), which already mentions him in its article. He is no different from the nearly 3,000 other people who died on 9/11. I am also nominating the following related pages because there is nothing notable about these individuals besides being featured in the same movie, which its article also mentions:

Dave Karnes (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Will Jimeno (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

John McLoughlin (police officer) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Jason Thomas (Marine) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) The Legendary Ranger (talk) 01:11, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

• Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2021 September 9. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 01:32, 9 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep. This seems like a mean-spirited nomination. Each person is well documented and there is enough information to demonstrate notability. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 02:42, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 08:20, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of New York-related deletion discussions. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 08:20, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Terrorism-related deletion discussions. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 08:20, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

• Keep It seems to me there is a difference between someone entering a doomed building to rescue people and someone trying to get out. Maybe it is my view rather than the nominator's that is idiosyncratic. Never mind, journalists have written about these people partly to remark on mistakes in the film but also to provide more background information. For notability purposes it does not matter why journalists wrote about their subjects but whether what they wrote meets our criteria. I think the articles meet our criteria. Thincat (talk) 14:46, 9 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep This man is a hero who died while trying to save his fellow officers. Ask Will Jimeno if he thinks this page should be deleted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:7000:AE40:A5B3:89C1:4A13:48F5:2940 (talk) 21:18, 9 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep: All are very clearly notable via WP:GNG; a search shows that a number of sources that provide WP:SIGCOV exist on the Internet. While you are correct that we are not a memorial, that alone does not disqualify them from having an article if they pass WP:GNG. Curbon7 (talk) 22:12, 10 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep:In my humble opinion, there may be a distinction between a heroic rescuer and a lucky rescued. IF deletion must go ahead, delete the rescued as they were (happily) simply lucky - though their retention adds context to the (worth preserving) stories of the rescuers.ShropshirePilgrim (talk) 12:24, 11 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep: William Jimero should be kept since he is also now an author with two titles. All of them should be kept due to their notoriety. IMHO. OnePercent (talk) 12:37, 11 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep: A quick Google reveals all individuals above are notable in their own right for their roles in the timeline. Just an aside, which isn't relevant to the AfD or the final decision, but you could have picked a more respectful time to nominate these pages for deletion. Even if you had waited a week... --Jkaharper (talk) 13:16, 11 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep: I'd like to address John McLoughlin in particular - I came across his name in an article which in no way mentioned or addressed the aforementioned movie, and googled the name to read more about him, which led me to his Wikipedia page. Wikipedia is not a memorial, it is however a repository for information, including about people of note, and the experiences McLoughlin had make him a person of note for whom a Wikipedia page is appropriate. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.77.200.79 (talk) 21:27, 11 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep and note that MORE information available is preferable to LESS information, especially regarding the events surrounding 9/11 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.243.152.172 (talk) 22:33, 11 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep They are heroes and deserve their own page, what they did was remarkable and interesting. Nobody is stopping you from making a Wiki-page for the other 3000 people that died. 130.208.204.26 (talk) 08:48, 12 September 2021 (UTC)

Keep: Considering their roles in a significantly historical event, I'd say the four articles should remain in line with WP:N. Deleting three of the articles, based exclusively on their inclusion in a film that is in turn based on extraordinary significant events, seems like a shoddy excuse to remove them. Also, the repeated use of "absolutely nothing notable" about the subjects seems a little, perhaps unintentionally, distasteful. Evilgidgit (talk) 16:24, 12 September 2021 (UTC)

• Keep I find it disgusting that you would attempt to delete this page, you should be ashamed of yourselves. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:582:4901:1EB0:0:0:0:B90E (talk) 21:00, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep It is extraordinarily significant for someone to survive having not just one, but two 1,000+ foot skyscrapers fall on top of them. If anything, this provides context to the ~3,000 dead who may lack an article; survival was just that difficult. Wikipedia is about notability and this is pretty notable, considering the many articles being written about these men even two decades later. My response applies to all four proposed deletions. You could make your same (weak, in my opinion) argument for any number of 9/11 figures, and then all we'd be left with are 19 redundant articles about the same Middle Eastern loser. The event was as much an attack as it was a response, and what were essentially miracles of survival and/or people fighting back are as much a feature of the event as the attacks themselves and their inclusion is warranted here. Separately from my response to your proposal, considering the time, this was an extremely insensitive thing to do and you ought to be ashamed of yourself. Mary Samsonite (talk) 01:11, 13 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep At least for Will Jimeno I can't see a justification to deletion. There was a large article on his life events after 9/11 that came out in a national publication (Politico) for the 20th Anniversary, and it noted he has a published book, has done motivational speaking around the country etc. It would seem he is more notable than simply a random individual who died in the collapse of the towers and has a specific fame beyond just the fact he survived the collapse. Eth19508029 (talk) 02:01, 13 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep - this whole nomination feels like it was done in bad faith, and the disregard for BLP (there's a rather large difference between "fails to meet Wikipedia's notability guidelines" and "there is nothing notable about [person]") or WP:BEFORE. Jimeno clearly meets the GNG, having been profiled in Politico. As for the others, you could probably make the case that being portrayed in an Oliver Stone movie is evidence that person meets our notability guideline. Similarly, having received a significant national award like the 9/11 Heroes Medal of Valor also suggests notability (regardless of what one might think about some of the post-9/11 awards). Guettarda (talk) 03:29, 13 September 2021 (UTC)
  • I think this nomination is a good example of when a potentially valid nomination turns into a trainwreck due to the bundling of an obviously notable article. Curbon7 (talk) 03:47, 13 September 2021 (UTC)
• Comment. Note that we have deleted articles on many equally brave individuals who have been decorated for their courage in action or otherwise. I'd be interested in an explanation as to why these people are notable and the others are not. Because reading this AfD, it does seem that some sort of special case is being made for them because they were involved in the events of 9/11 and were portrayed in a film about it. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:50, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
• Keep, these people have clearly received plenty of significant coverage in reliable sources.Jackattack1597 (talk) 00:49, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.