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{{Wikiproject Punk music|class=B|importance=top}}
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==New York hardcore and "influence on other genres"==
|action2date=17 October 2020
There should be a topic about New York Hardcore.
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I added a paragraph to the "Influence on other genres" section discussing post-hardcore. Please critique.
|action3date=15 July 2021
[[User:Ilikeartrock|Ilikeartrock]] 01:24, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
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New York is not mentioned enough. New York has been the center of hardcore since 1985. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/69.118.3.73|69.118.3.73]] ([[User talk:69.118.3.73|talk]]) 01:10, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
|topic=music }}

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I think Hardcore and Hardcore Punk are two different genres. New York helped develop the "Hardcore" scene, not the "Hardcore Punk" scene. We need to make a seperate article for '''Hardcore'''. It shouldn't redirect to "Hardcore Punk." You can reach me at my email: omairsd@gmail.com.
{{WikiProject Punk music|importance=top}}
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{{WikiProject Rock music|importance=top}}
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==Hip-hop?==
==Hip-hop?==
there needs to be a clearer distinction of how hip hop influenced hardcore, maybe the mentioning of bands like: fury of five, downset, biohazard, cold as life, boxcutter, skarhead, icepick and stout may possibly help
How are [[hip-hop]] elements common in [[metalcore]] (as said in the [[hardcore punk#1990s|1990s section]])? Remember, metalcore isnt [[nu metal]] here. [[Thrash metal]] and [[melodeath]] elements are in metalcore '''much''' more. So please dont add that hip-hop elements are in metalcore.
'''[[User:Mezmerizer|Prepare]] [[User:Mezmerizer/Talk|to]] [[User:Mezmerizer/Info|be]] [[Special:Contributions/Mezmerizer|Mezmerized]][[User:Mezmerizer/Contributions/Articles/Write|! :D]]''' 00:40, 24 November 2007 (UTC)


== External links modified ==
*Hip-hop and rap influences are ALL OVER the current metalcore scene. [[Emmure]], for instance, uses hip-hop rhythms in their breakdowns. Not to mention the fashion crossover in the scene, & deathcore bands wearing gold and platinum grills on tour.


Hello fellow Wikipedians,
:Then take it to the "[[deathcore]]" page. This article is about hardcore punk, not every single offshoot ever inspired by it in the history of modern music. And the only hip-hop influence in 'metalcore' is their appropriation of baggy pants and baseball caps fashion (maybe that's even moreso a 'nu metal' fashion). --[[User:Tim010987|Tim010987]] ([[User talk:Tim010987|talk]]) 20:45, 26 December 2008 (UTC)


I have just modified 6 external links on [[Hardcore punk]]. Please take a moment to review [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=807793122 my edit]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit [[User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot|this simple FaQ]] for additional information. I made the following changes:
Thses fashions have been with skater punks for years. I can remember dressing in these fashions back in the mid 80's. Trainer labels like Vans & Airwalk, baggies or cut offs for leg wear and baseball caps with bandanas on our heads. It was the modern hardcore punk fashion. Nothing to do with hip hop. It was just the fashions at the time. It was primarily an urban origination fashion style from LA & NY. Hip Hop likewise got it fashions from the same sources. If anything hiphop got some of it fashion tips from skater brands.
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20141108060937/http://www.thismagazine.ca/issues/2004/05/lords.php to http://www.thismagazine.ca/issues/2004/05/lords.php
In NY there was also Vision streetwear that was a big skater brand at the time. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/92.236.213.52|92.236.213.52]] ([[User talk:92.236.213.52|talk]]) 07:10, 6 February 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130921055829/http://www.deeplinking.net/media/NYMHC.pdf to http://www.deeplinking.net/media/NYMHC.pdf
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140720142753/http://www.thevaultmag.com/archives/tag/dayglo-abortions to http://www.thevaultmag.com/archives/tag/dayglo-abortions
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.montrealmirror.com/ARCHIVES/2000/070600/cover.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090622083840/http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/interviews/interviews/darryl_jenifer_of_bad_brains_i_want_to_be_the_soldier_of_my_music.html to http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/interviews/interviews/darryl_jenifer_of_bad_brains_i_want_to_be_the_soldier_of_my_music.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130225031458/http://riaa.com/goldandplatinumdata.php?table=SEARCH_RESULTS to http://riaa.com/goldandplatinumdata.php?table=SEARCH_RESULTS


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==Merge==
I merged the [[funkcore]] article into the [[funk rock]] article. '''[[User:Mezmerizer|Prepare]] [[User:Mezmerizer/Talk|to]] [[User:Mezmerizer/Info|be]] [[Special:Contributions/Mezmerizer|Mezmerized]][[User:Mezmerizer/Contributions/Articles/Write|! :D]]''' 01:27, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
==Sludge metal==
Shouldn't [[sludge metal]] be mentioned in this article ? [[User:Gothbag|Gothbag]] ([[User talk:Gothbag|talk]]) 02:18, 13 January 2008 (UTC)


{{sourcecheck|checked=false|needhelp=}}
*No <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/68.211.217.229|68.211.217.229]] ([[User talk:68.211.217.229|talk]]) 06:57, 25 February 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->


Cheers.—[[User:InternetArchiveBot|'''<span style="color:darkgrey;font-family:monospace">InternetArchiveBot</span>''']] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">([[User talk:InternetArchiveBot|Report bug]])</span> 04:11, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
==Question==
Why does this article have almost nothing to do with what Hardcore Punk is? Ive read through it and i gleamed plenty about its history, but nothing about what Hardcore Punk is musicially.


== External links modified ==
I came to Wikipedia looking for that information. IM dissapointed to find that, once again, Wikipedia has let me down.


Hello fellow Wikipedians,
Can someone please add some information usefull to the article such as ''what it is'' rather than splitting hairs over who did what? <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/79.68.234.255|79.68.234.255]] ([[User talk:79.68.234.255|talk]]) 05:04, 20 January 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->


I have just modified one external link on [[Hardcore punk]]. Please take a moment to review [[special:diff/813885483|my edit]]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit [[User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot|this simple FaQ]] for additional information. I made the following changes:
This article is helpful if your familiar with a majority of the bands and genres rediscussed through the explanation of hardcore's history. I'm surprised something as big as hardcore punk wouldn't have gotten a "this article includes jargon" by now, a more thorough explanation of all the aspects of this article is needed. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/75.51.140.214|75.51.140.214]] ([[User talk:75.51.140.214|talk]]) 05:23, 17 April 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071206015225/http://www.saveyourscene.com/web/view.php?table=interviews&show=39 to http://www.saveyourscene.com/web/view.php?table=interviews&show=39


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There is much more here about non-hardcore bands (Melvins, Extreme Noise Terror) than actual hardcore bands. Music made after 1984 is almost non-existent. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/69.118.3.73|69.118.3.73]] ([[User talk:69.118.3.73|talk]]) 01:11, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->


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==Question 2==
What about Warzone, Cro-mags, and maybe Madball?


Cheers.—[[User:InternetArchiveBot|'''<span style="color:darkgrey;font-family:monospace">InternetArchiveBot</span>''']] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">([[User talk:InternetArchiveBot|Report bug]])</span> 19:38, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
==hXc==
Someone needs to fix the article so that when someone searches "hXc", "Hardcore Punk" doesn't come up. hXc does NOT mean Hardcore Punk. It just means "Hardcore", and is often accosiated metalcore bands, like As I Lay Dying, Suicide Silence, etc.


== Cringe kid Erik ==
If you don't change it, we at least need to add something about how it's changed over the years. And how the term "hXc" is no longer associated with Hardcore punk much anymore.


"The cringe kid Erik" became famous, when he made his first appearance on "Mate are you sleeping naked?". Since then has he made hes appearance on his new born YouTube channel "Erik Kjær". His first video is titled "Lil Pump- Gucci Gang ft. Prince". In about 15 minutes within he uploaded the video on the world famous social media YouTube, 78 users watched the music video. He has since announced that he is going to make another music video, but he claimed that he had no idea which song yet.
:I would agree that there is a definite difference between "hardcore" and "hardcore punk." [[Dead Kennedys]] do NOT sound much like, say, [[Bane]]. However I don't think "Hardcore" is the same thing as Metalcore, hence the "metal" prefix. This article hardly even mentions New York Hardcore.

:I think the term "Hardcore Punk" definitely merits its own article, but the distinction should me made between it and "hardcore." I would prefer to see the term "hardcore" have its own article as well. [[User:Emceelane|Emceelane]] ([[User talk:Emceelane|talk]]) 04:22, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

Hardcore is short for Hadcore punk. Bands like I Lay Dying are Metalcore. By the way Hardcore is a more straightforward form of punk. In this way, it was much more purist punk and it didn't include "a wide range of sounds" (as the article states) in comparison to the first wave of punk and new wave.

Someone needs to fix the article so that when someone searches "hXc", "Hardcore Punk" doesn't come up. hXc does NOT mean Hardcore Punk. It just means "Hardcore", and is often accosiated metalcore bands, like As I Lay Dying, Suicide Silence, etc.

If you don't change it, we at least need to add something about how it's changed over the years. And how the term "hXc" is no longer associated with Hardcore punk much anymore.

:I would agree that there is a definite difference between "hardcore" and "hardcore punk." [[Dead Kennedys]] do NOT sound much like, say, [[Bane]]. However I don't think "Hardcore" is the same thing as Metalcore, hence the "metal" prefix. This article hardly even mentions New York Hardcore.

:I think the term "Hardcore Punk" definitely merits its own article, but the distinction should me made between it and "hardcore." I would prefer to see the term "hardcore" have its own article as well. [[User:Emceelane|Emceelane]] ([[User talk:Emceelane|talk]]) 04:22, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

Hardcore is short for Hadcore punk. Bands like I Lay Dying are Metalcore. By the way Hardcore is a more straightforward form of punk. In this way, it was much more purist punk and it didn't include "a wide range of sounds" (as the article states) in comparison to the first wave of punk and new wave.

I totally agree. Distinguishing between "Hardcore Punk" and "Hardcore" is just perpetuating a semantic confusion that has no basis in the evolution of these genres. Hardcore is short for Hardcore Punk, and the current confusion seems to stem from groups incorporating metal influences in the late eighties wanting to retain some credibility as a punk band (Coverge routinely refers to their shows as punk rock shows), along with the second wave of hardcore (youth crew etc), becoming increasingly formulaic and aggressive. I think a case could also be made for hardcore merging with metal as a result of the simultaneous consolidation of "emotional" strains of hardcore during the nineties. The problem in ordering the articles is that there is such widespread confusion regarding these genres. People insert arbitrary distinctions between "punk" and "punk rock" as well as "hardcore" and "hardcore punk" without regard to the development of genres. My suggestion would be along the lines of the second poster, that we do not create a seperate "hardcore" article, but clarify the development of the term and the confusion surrounding it in a new section.

==Seminal Brazilian Hardcore punk==
I feel the lack of mention to the seminal Brazilian scene. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/189.56.30.10|189.56.30.10]] ([[User talk:189.56.30.10|talk]]) 21:16, 28 April 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:The only band I know of from Brazil is Sepultura. If you think that this page is lacking specific information on the scene, then you might be the best one to add it, but don't forget to add references. [[User:Hellboy1975|hellboy]] ([[User talk:Hellboy1975|talk]]) 23:29, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

Ratos de Porão (Portuguese for "Basement Rats") but they are more crossover thrash. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/92.236.213.52|92.236.213.52]] ([[User talk:92.236.213.52|talk]]) 07:19, 4 February 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

==Emo==
Er, why does it say SDRE is the first emo band? I'd say that Moss Icon is; SDRE was the first one to have the indie emo style. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:67.169.189.82|67.169.189.82]] ([[User talk:67.169.189.82|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/67.169.189.82|contribs]]) 6:34, 11 May 2008</small><!-- Template:Unsigned -->
*Hm. That statement is given a source, but I personally think that the statement is BS. SDRE started out years after bands like Rites of Spring and Moss Icon did. At the very least, SDRE was the first emo band to gain recognition outside underground music circles. [[User:TheLetterM|TheLetterM]] ([[User talk:TheLetterM|talk]]) 16:53, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

==This page==

Has some serious problems. Its soley focused on 'the little things'. New York Hardcore barely gets a mention here. Instead it seems to be obsessed with tiny influences of the genre, near unknown bands and the offshoots that don't really link much. I mean, CBGBs was the cradle of hardcore punk, along with bands touring from washington and NewYork, and the only real mentions there are Black Flag, Bad Brains and Minor Threat. I'd view Agnostic Front as having much prominance (Black Flag can't be considered 'Hardcore' until 81 when Rollins started lead vocals.). Also, this is just about all based on the sources of one journalist. Try excanding that. [[Special:Contributions/86.145.189.29|86.145.189.29]] ([[User talk:86.145.189.29|talk]]) 15:55, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

I agree, this page needs a revamp badly. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/78.143.209.21|78.143.209.21]] ([[User talk:78.143.209.21|talk]]) 09:44, 27 May 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

==Hatebreed and Sick Of It All==

arguably the most successful hardcore punk bands. nothing much about them in this article. sort it out --[[User:Murkle|Murkle]] ([[User talk:Murkle|talk]]) 19:35, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
:If you feel this way then feel free to make a contribution, but I think there are plenty who would argue that Hatebreed are not really a hardcore punk band. [[User:Hellboy1975|hellboy]] ([[User talk:Hellboy1975|talk]]) 23:08, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
That's right Hatebreed is not Hardcore and Sick Of It All only played Hardcore on their first album.

Bullshit - they are two of the biggest hardcore bands ever.

Hatebreed should be at least included in the mainstream section. With Jamey Jasta doing headbangers ball, he attracted much attention to his band. I can't imagine another band that has sold more records worldwide than those guys, especially since they could reach more places than your average hardcore band. I'll see what I can do about this. [[User:Christmasjones25|Christmasjones25]] ([[User talk:Christmasjones25|talk]]) 16:02, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

==NEW SCHOOL HARDCORE?==
bands like comeback kid, have heart, verse, bane, american nightmare, etc. aren't mentioned on this page? surely bands that play this music has played a part it making what hardcore is today? <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Himynameisnick|Himynameisnick]] ([[User talk:Himynameisnick|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Himynameisnick|contribs]]) 02:26, 14 October 2008 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== What about John Peel's Peel Sessions? ==

What about Radio One DJ John Peel's Peel Sessions?

He was famous for promoting an underground hardcore punk music on the leading respectable national radio. Groups like Napalm Death, Extreme Noise Terror, Intense Degree, Doom, Dr and the Crippens etc were all featured on his peel sessions [[User:Metalosaurus|Metalosaurus]] ([[User talk:Metalosaurus|talk]]) 19:56, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Those are all metal bands. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/69.118.3.73|69.118.3.73]] ([[User talk:69.118.3.73|talk]]) 01:13, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

All those bands are now considered metal in some sense however at the time they came out there were no such easy distinctions. An early incarnation of Napalm Death featured on Crass records Bullshit Detector for example and their sound was definitely not metal. Napalm Death at least were very much Punk in their attitude and their audiences reflected this. Personally I think Metalosaurus is definitely right in that there was a strong relationship between the UK hardcore (UK82 for you Americans?) and the thrash/crust scenes. To ignore this would be to omit a member of the hardcore
family ! <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/59.134.163.83|59.134.163.83]] ([[User talk:59.134.163.83|talk]]) 12:55, 22 June 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== -core genres are forms of hardcore punk like genres ending in metal are forms of heavy metal. ==


Any musics ending in -core are all types or evolutions of hardcore punk the same way musics ending in metal are types or evolutions of Heavy Metal. When punk rock rose to fame and died into post-punk new-wave / dark-wave rock etc it was the hardcore punk movement that was born and revived punk into new realms. It seems that there is a new fad of naive metal fans who think they have stumbled on a new word and are inventing uses of -core genres wrongly into metal. It like calling horror punk as horror metal. Everyone knows that musics ending in metal are forms of heavy metal and get the metal ending from Heavy Metal the same way musics ending in -core get the core ending from Hardcore.

It is simple to tell metal and punk apart as metal is played technically challenging with lead breaks and timing etc of a proffessional high quality manner (or an attempt at least) where as punk is deliberately played to an un-proffessional manner (based mostly on three-cords).
There is a good interview from 1989 made by the BBC titled "thrashed to death" where Tom Araya from the thrash metal group Slayer rightfully says - "anything much faster or more overboard than reign in blood makes no sense and crosses the line between metal & punk".
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=WcjD9n4pafs&feature=related (starts about 2.45 into clip and finishes statement about 3.45)
This is not meant disrespectfully as Tom loves and was influenced by punk but what he is referring to is that punk is not supposed to be structured like metal. Punk was started by amateur garage bands.

The original true meaning of the word Punk is 'dead wood (as was used to start fires)'. In other words it means no good or of poor quality. It was how the first punk rock bands got this name. When thrash metal (which although greatly influenced by the energy and sound of punk, it remained complex and structured metal) met hardcore punk it used to be called "crossover" and not thrashcore, metalcore, sludgecore etc etc. The slightest little tweek in sound and hey some young five minute fan is trying to call it a new genre. I guess to impress thes other silly little mates with great knowledge of music styles. I'm sorry but knowing thousands of silly genre names doesn't make you a bigger fan or show greater appreciation of the music

*No, though what you say has merit its not all that simple. Punk did start as sloppier wile medal started more technically challenging but that was thirty years ago. Since then the lines have been blurred, there are crossovers and technically challenging punk bands as well as sloppier metal musicians. Its also to be noted that hardcore was an adjective before it was a form of music and its still used as an adjective today, so lots of genres were named from that. Genres like Slowcore and Sadcore have essentially no connection to hardcore even with the suffix. Metalcore is a form of metal, not hardcore though it incorporates aspects of the later. Also I'm almost sure that the early punks did not know the original meaning of the word. They just knew it was an insult and took the name from there. I'm sure the people who coined the geek squad don't know the original meaning of geek either. Stuart [[Special:Contributions/68.161.121.165|68.161.121.165]] ([[User talk:68.161.121.165|talk]]) 21:01, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Thats my point. Like Heavy Metal spanned into Speed "Metal", Power "Metal", "Symphonic "Metal", Thrash "Metal", Death "Metal" etc etc Hardcore spanned into "-core" genres (speed metal etc are all styles / sub genres of heavy metal). NWOBHM was influenced greatly by the energy of Punk at the time and thrash metal was greatly influenced from Hardcore at the time. Neither were a crossover / fusion genre as both NWOBHM & thrash remained metal structurly. When Napalm Death first surfaced they were alongside groups like Extreme Noise Terror, Dr & the Crippens & Intense Degree and often got cover together on Radio DJ John Peel's "Peel sessions". It was all genred as Hardcore back then. They were all Hardcore bands who admitted to having Heavy Metal influences the same way thrash bands admitted to having punk influences. I remember as I used to have the records and listen to the shows etc. Back then I can remember many unbrella terms such as Skatecore (Intense Degree). Crustcore - later giving rise to Grindcore via Napalm Death, rapcore (a few early hardcore acts such as Suicidal Tendencies who used raps as vocal over hardcore punk music. I remember well as I was massively into the skate scene and these terms were majorly connected. Thrasher magazine who often give a way free records of such artists.
I was also greatly into the metal scene so I saw both sides of the fan base.
Many metal fans throught groups such as Napalm Death were metal and when Napalm Death used the term "grindcore" in interviews and groups like Biohazard and Pantera spoke about having massive hardcore influences the metal fans started using the term -core as a metal ending. Its like punks who know nothing about metal who hear some metal groups and mistake them as punk and start calling punk genres as - metal. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/92.236.213.52|92.236.213.52]] ([[User talk:92.236.213.52|talk]]) 09:13, 11 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

To add to this all -core genres were not seperate genres but just variants of Hardcore. i.e. skatecore was still hardcore it just appealled to skaters and sang lyrics about skating i.e. the song 'Skate bored'. Rapcore was still hardcore it just chanted in a rap style street lyric. i.e. Suicidal Tendencies song 'Join the Army'. Suicidal Tendencies were Hardcore / Crossover but also skatecore & rapcore (who later went thrash metal for a few albums). crustcore was hardcore that appealled to crusties - dreadlocked scruffy squatter anarcho-punks. Emocore were originally hardcore groups and Grindcore was started by Napalm Death who were originally from a hardcore scene inspired by metal (like crustcore) and not a metal scene inspired by punk.

==Links==
All of the links on this page seem to fit under the [[WP:LINKSTOAVOID]] category. Unless there's any major objections, I will remove them all in a few days time. [[User:Hellboy1975|hellboy]] ([[User talk:Hellboy1975|talk]]) 22:23, 15 February 2009 (UTC)
:As there were no objections, links were removed [[User:Hellboy1975|hellboy]] ([[User talk:Hellboy1975|talk]]) 22:45, 3 April 2009 (UTC)


Dude I hope you werent born in 1975 and Really are from Australia. Thats OBVIOUSLY why You Have no CLUE. If your From The US you still have no clue. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/68.196.165.107|68.196.165.107]] ([[User talk:68.196.165.107|talk]]) 16:26, 16 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

The only thing I don't have a clue about is what you think I don't have a clue about? [[User:Hellboy1975|hellboy]] ([[User talk:Hellboy1975|talk]]) 09:48, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

==Reverting to "The Original"==
C'mon guys, all this is going to result in is the article being locked or something. To the person reverting back to the original, can you please justify why you are doing this, so we can move forward. [[User:Hellboy1975|hellboy]] ([[User talk:Hellboy1975|talk]]) 22:16, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

==Hogan's Heroes==
ALSO ......HOGAN'S HEROES HAD REAL METAL IN IT Way Before Many mentioned acts, SORRY GUYS that is a FACT. WHAT IS IT THE HH WIKI HAS TO BE WRITTEN TO GET CREDIT, THATS FUNNY BEING OUT 5 YEARS BEFORE , WITH REAL METAL, LEADS, WHAMMY BAR, CRY-BABY PEDAL, METAL SOUND AS FAR BACK AS 1985, History Is HISTORY not His-Story Go To The myspace ect. or If anyone "editing" Is an ADULT YOU Dont need to be reminded, Heres the myspace, www.myspace.com/officialhogansheroes by summer the wiki will be done , I already have a Wiki edit page set up nicely by an Editor. I hate to break it to you, nothing against anyone but this is BULLSHIT. Too bad you cant "wiki" the few Hundred thousand discs and LP and cassettes were on from 1985-2004. 14 Worldwide comp.s Too Bad you cant change history HH has a a whole Plethera of entries in BillBoards phonolog under Pop Artist and Rock H. GO SEE IT ITS IN THE BLOG.s Nice and Scanned for all the crybabies. Also About 400 Pieces of Press. in the "pics" 1984-2009.

Not Just some crunch guitar who according to this Bullshit would think didnt happen till 1990, In Fact It Happened by 1985.
Good thing wiki cant rewrite all those comp.s HH is on on 6 labels three in japan, and on the same comp.s (14) with reagan youth g.b.h. UK Subs antiflag ECT.ECT.ECT.

"oh but if this didnt happen until I write it and reference it on the wiki" How Much BULLSHIT is that. You Cant rewrite the Truth. Not Only that but watch Video of the groups its no accident that after playing with many of them in 1988 they were influenced further by HH as was a Million sXe NJ hardcore bands. EVER WONDER WHY SO MANY "whammy-bar shit" in HC after 1988. Oh the answer is HH. esp. NJHC.

The whole discography is up www.myspace.com/officialhogansheroes all the references are up and will be written out on HH wiki. However This is why Im so Glad HH is a real band Outside of Clicks and "hardcore" most of this shit doesnt hold any water outside the "scene" . Go to Youtube HH was Streets ahead of that shit LIVE....theres the proof. I realize this has a certain criteria to follow But Fucking-A This is BULLSHIT. Not Only that but some fake-ass jealous losers are in a tiffy about this F-OFF You Cant Change the TRUTH.

:Holy.. leave those rants to [[talk:metalcore]]. --[[User:Kmaster|Kmaster]] ([[User talk:Kmaster|talk]]) 20:23, 16 April 2009 (UTC)


I wrote it better and excluded any names that arent really needed to make a point. Ill be back to try and figure out how its going to fit in. Metalcore had double kick drumming and metal bass and guitar. HH only had the metal in the guitar and maybe drum fills. its not metalcore its hardcore with inflected metal in it.
Thanks Kmaster for trying to point this in the right direction.
:The thing is, the [[metalcore]] article was made for all metal-hardcore crossover genres, not only modern "melo-death" metalcore.--[[User:Kmaster|Kmaster]] ([[User talk:Kmaster|talk]]) 16:13, 17 April 2009 (UTC)


who is editing us off this page what are you Blind we started in 1984 out live by 1985 on Nuclear Assault thanks List by 1986 so Its not like we werent in the "scene". Oh and at LEAST as much "metal" than those mentioned. Are we waiting for a "wiki" because its coming I dont play Hardcore anymore but if some Groups are getting credit when we influenced them with our metal sound then We Desrve Credit. We ALREADY Get It because on video and audio we have stuff PREDATING THE STUFF LISTED and ISNT THAT WHAT IT SAYS..."The EARLIEST". go watch live video of all those bands and see who is earliest (of those mentioned)in REAL LIFE . <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/68.196.165.107|68.196.165.107]] ([[User talk:68.196.165.107|talk]]) 22:56, 27 August 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== The Middle Class ==

No mention of the Middle Class? Ludicrous. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/76.117.7.237|76.117.7.237]] ([[User talk:76.117.7.237|talk]]) 07:18, 29 May 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:Agreed. [[User:Druff|Druff]] ([[User talk:Druff|talk]]) 23:32, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

==Lets start the long list of bands==
I am a rare Wikipedia editor.
When I feel it particularly necessary, I do.
This is my second time.

1) I added the following descriptive linked constructs:
"self-determination, class conflict and injustice."

So the list now reads:
"The songs are usually short, fast, and loud, covering topics such as: politics, personal freedom, self-determination, fascism, class conflict, authority, violence, injustice, social alienation, straight edge, vegetarianism, veganism, war, religion, drugs and the hardcore subculture itself.[2][3][4]"

2) Additionally, I added a short list of groups, that is the most overlooked part of the whole thing.

"Among them were: Bold, Gorilla Biscuits, Side By Side, Breakdown, Trip 6, Warzone and Youth of Today."

Even before the issue of who was the most influential, who was real hardcore or the difference between hardcore and hardcore punk. How derivative hardcore is from punk in lyrics and music. So how about we make a long list of bands and then debate each ones merits to the genre. My edit was summarily over posted with the extra and around the vegetarian part.

I WANTED TO SEE A LIST OF BANDS WHEN I GOT TO THE PAGE! <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/96.224.5.134|96.224.5.134]] ([[User talk:96.224.5.134|talk]]) 20:44, 25 July 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:*See [[List of hardcore punk bands]].[[User:Spylab|Spylab]] ([[User talk:Spylab|talk]]) 05:12, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

::Hey Spylab, nice links list... One band I am looking for music from (I had it on cassette tape) is "Life's Blood" (east coast), they were really great. Any thoughts? <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/96.224.5.134|96.224.5.134]] ([[User talk:96.224.5.134|talk]]) 23:57, 27 July 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:::This is not a forum for general discussion of hardcore music. Please limit your comments or questions to improving the article. Thank you. ---<font face="Georgia">'''[[User:RepublicanJacobite|<span style="color:#009900">RepublicanJacobite</span>]]'''<sub>''[[User talk:RepublicanJacobite|<span style="color:#006600">The'FortyFive'</span>]]''</sub></font> 01:21, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

==Heavy Metal and Its importance==
Musially, hardcore punk was a response to the speed and aggression imposed by the groups of metal influenced by the energy of punk rock. The sound of these groups is known as the [[speed metal]] of the mid-1970s, starting to the NWOBHM movement in the 1980s ... These groups are Motorhead and Judas Priest. ([[User:Mago266|Mago266]] ([[User talk:Mago266|talk]]) 05:47, 10 November 2009 (UTC))

==new hardcore==
correct me if i'm wrong, but this article seems to hardly make any mention of hardcore from the late 90's on.
surely bands like bane, maybe have heart, ceremony, or even the new wave of nyhc influenced bands like trapped under ice, naysayer, etc should be mentioned. the current state of hardcore is widespread and diverse, and i think it deserves representation.'''-unsigned'''
:Agreed this needs a 2000's section [[User:Jonjonjohny|Jonjonjohny]] ([[User talk:Jonjonjohny|talk]]) 21:50, 26 March 2010 (UTC)


== Orphaned references in [[:Hardcore punk]] ==
== Orphaned references in [[:Hardcore punk]] ==
Line 203: Line 73:
I check pages listed in [[:Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting]] to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for [[User:AnomieBOT/docs/OrphanReferenceFixer|orphaned references]] in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of [[:Hardcore punk]]'s orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for ''this'' article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.
I check pages listed in [[:Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting]] to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for [[User:AnomieBOT/docs/OrphanReferenceFixer|orphaned references]] in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of [[:Hardcore punk]]'s orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for ''this'' article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.


<b>Reference named "terrorizer":</b><ul>
<b>Reference named "Radio":</b><ul>
<li>From [[Heavy hardcore]]: {{cite web |url=http://news.radio.com/2013/10/21/5-under-the-radar-metal-bands-that-are-pushing-boundaries/ |title=5 Under the Radar Metal Bands That Are Pushing Boundaries |website=Radio.com |date=October 21, 2013 |accessdate=November 11, 2017}}</li>
<li>From [[Crust punk]]: "Powerviolence: The Dysfunctional Family of Bllleeeeaaauuurrrgghhh!!." ''Terrorizer'' no. 172. July 2008. p. 36-37.</li>
<li>From [[The Exploited]]: {{cite web |url=http://radio.com/2013/04/08/top-5-songs-hating-on-margaret-thatcher/ |title=Top 5 Songs Hating On Margaret Thatcher |publisher=[[Radio.com]]}}</li>
<li>From [[Thrashcore]]: "Powerviolence: The Dysfunctional Family of Bllleeeeaaauuurrrgghhh!!". ''Terrorizer'' no. 172. July 2008. p. 36-37.</li>
</ul>
</ul>


I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. [[User:AnomieBOT|AnomieBOT]][[User talk:AnomieBOT|<font color="#888800">⚡</font>]] 21:18, 4 April 2010 (UTC)
I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. [[User:AnomieBOT|AnomieBOT]][[User talk:AnomieBOT|<span style="color:#880">⚡</span>]] 12:52, 2 February 2019 (UTC)

==Thrash Metal==

Why is it a derivative genre rather than a fusion one? [[User:Theburning25|Theburning25]] ([[User talk:Theburning25|talk]]) 02:36, 29 July 2010 (UTC)<br />
I would not consider Thrash Metal as a derivative genre of Hardcore, that belongs to Heavy Metal, and the fusion between the two, Crossover Thrash, is already mentioned in the Infobox. If it's true Hardcore has influenced Thrash metal, it would be incorrect to consider it a sub-genre. As stated in the main article: "Metallica and Slayer, pioneers of the heavy metal subgenre thrash metal, were influenced by a number of hardcore bands". [[User:Raxhonp|Raxhonp]] ([[User talk:Raxhonp|talk]]) 21:12, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
:Bearing that in mind I'd like to move it from the "derivative genres" section - any objections? If there are any objections, cites would be good. [[Special:Contributions/82.44.14.26|82.44.14.26]] ([[User talk:82.44.14.26|talk]]) <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|undated]] comment added 15:53, 2 September 2010 (UTC).</span><!--Template:Undated--> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== STYLE change ==

I revamped the style/sound since I believe the emphasis on musical style is a major feature of the hardcore scene. In order to do this, I listened to the back catalogs of many of the bands and presented an unbiased factual representation of the sound in academic language.

I took the earliest possible bands identified with the hardcore movement and analyzed their styles and presented the best description of THOSE bands, while recognizing that the sound has changed over the years. being that no two hardcore bands back then sounded the same, I compared each and found similar elements.


{{Talk:Hardcore punk/GA3}}
As for references I really wasn't sure how to reference what something sounds like, perhaps an audio recording??? <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Christmasjones25|Christmasjones25]] ([[User talk:Christmasjones25|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Christmasjones25|contribs]]) 05:38, 15 August 2010 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
oh this was me the whole time, forgot to sign [[User:Christmasjones25|Christmasjones25]] ([[User talk:Christmasjones25|talk]]) 05:41, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 19:34, 23 December 2024

Former good article nomineeHardcore punk was a Music good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
April 2, 2020Good article nomineeNot listed
October 17, 2020Good article nomineeNot listed
July 15, 2021Good article nomineeNot listed
Current status: Former good article nominee

Hip-hop?

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there needs to be a clearer distinction of how hip hop influenced hardcore, maybe the mentioning of bands like: fury of five, downset, biohazard, cold as life, boxcutter, skarhead, icepick and stout may possibly help

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Cringe kid Erik

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"The cringe kid Erik" became famous, when he made his first appearance on "Mate are you sleeping naked?". Since then has he made hes appearance on his new born YouTube channel "Erik Kjær". His first video is titled "Lil Pump- Gucci Gang ft. Prince". In about 15 minutes within he uploaded the video on the world famous social media YouTube, 78 users watched the music video. He has since announced that he is going to make another music video, but he claimed that he had no idea which song yet.

Orphaned references in Hardcore punk

[edit]

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Hardcore punk's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "Radio":

  • From Heavy hardcore: "5 Under the Radar Metal Bands That Are Pushing Boundaries". Radio.com. October 21, 2013. Retrieved November 11, 2017.
  • From The Exploited: "Top 5 Songs Hating On Margaret Thatcher". Radio.com.

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT 12:52, 2 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

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GA toolbox
Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:Hardcore punk/GA3. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Vaticidalprophet (talk · contribs) 15:10, 2 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Picking this up. Am aware of the two prior quickfails, but they're a while ago now. This is a long article, and it may take some time to return with a review. Vaticidalprophet 15:10, 2 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hey, Hoponpop69, I'm actually going to be taking over this review from Vaticidalprophet. Fear not, I'm a certified Hardcore Kid and I should get to this review by the end of the week, grad school nonsense willing. — GhostRiver 14:37, 14 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Good Article review progress box
Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV ()
3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant ()
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Infobox and lede

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Characteristics

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Musical elements

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Dancing

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Fashion

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Politics

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Demographics

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Record labels

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Etymology

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History

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Late 1970s and early 1980s

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United States
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Canada
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United Kingdom
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Other countries
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Mid-to-late 1980s

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1990s and 2000s

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Digital influence
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Straight edge and hardline
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Mainstream success
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2010s

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2020s

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  • None of the references in this section are formatted properly
  • I think "difficult" is an understatement -- maybe specify the closing of venues and other restrictions that prevent physical shows from occurring
  • Band and record label presence on Instagram, along with hardcore podcasts like Axe To Grind, zines, and video content from videographers like hardcore archivist Sunny Singh of Hate5Six have helped the hardcore community stay connected during an unprecedented era of social distancing. This reads a bit promotional at the moment. Maybe try something like "With social distancing limiting the availability of physical interactions, the hardcore community has relied on social media activity, podcasting, zines, and video content to stay connected virtually."
  • Why did these hardcore groups gain mainstream attention during the pandemic era?

Influence

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Fusion and subgenres

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References

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General comments

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  • Very few of the references are formatted properly. Please use the cite tags provided in the editing space rather than applying your own style.

Ok, I'm going to level with you. This article, as it stands, is written like a research paper moreso than an encyclopedia. The reason that most of the sections aren't filled out is because I noticed a lot of broad, overarching problems that I'd just repeat every time:

  • References: very few, if any, are properly formatted, with some bare links.
  • Reliable sources: WP:ALLMUSIC prefers that, whenever possible, you use a non-AllMusic source. Beyond that, there are several blog posts and other non-reliable sources like IMDb.
  • Prose, broadness, and focus: This is the biggest problem I see. Very few sections are developed beyond a list of bands. It's more useful to have a history of how a scene developed in a particular time and place than to list out all of the examples. I think the strongest showing of this is in the "other American regions" subhead: okay, we have a list of Minneapolis bands, but what makes Minneapolis hardcore special/different? How did it develop? There's also an overreliance on direct quotes that, again, I feel would be better served in a research paper than in the context of a Wikipedia article.

Regrettably, I'm going to have to fail this article, as the issues are overarching enough that they go beyond what a GA reviewer is asked to fix. I would recommend looking at some music GAs and FAs to get a better sense of what this prose looks like. — GhostRiver 22:24, 15 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Agree. And the whole entry is skewed to being 90% about the US as though it was the only originator and home of hardcore. It does not acknowledge the massive influence of the crucial hardcore bands crass and discharge; it takes no interest in the European hardcore scene and only a nod to the Asian and South American scenes. And yes, it looks like a civilian wrote this. Mswestbrom (talk) 14:34, 21 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I suspect getting this article to GA status will be quite difficult. Every time I look at it, something new raises an eyebrow. (Today it was “Knoxville.) Morganfitzp (talk) 21:17, 13 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]