Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ncaabbs

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete. Resistance is futile! Mailer Diablo 13:42, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Ncaabbs

Non notable web forum. --Jeffrey O. Gustafson - Shazaam! - <*> 08:55, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

• Maybe non-noteable if you hate college sports or live outside the United States .... what an ignorant remark. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.119.207.153 (talk • contribs) 20:32, 9 March 2006.
• SPEEDY obviously violates WP:WEB and/or is clearly NN. Speedy tag removed by inclusionists. :) Crzrussian 12:34, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
• MemphisTigers.org is a part of NCAAbbs.... and it meets the criteria of WP:WEB as mentioned below. If you're using Alexa to justify site rank and use, please bah like a sheep because you are one. As webmaster at NCAAbbs, I could throw up an Alexa button on every page and inflate our rank in Alexa greatly. Shame on you for trusting Alexa for anything beyond the top few hundred. It's really this simple... MemphisTigers.org... which is a part of NCAAbbs that has been given the name "memphistigers.org" due to its high activity... MEETS THE CRITERIA SET FORTH HERE. If you're going to delete the page then do it, but while you're at it be fair and delete that policy since it's clearly not used as specified... and don't forget to delete a few hundred (thousand?) other wikipedia pages for similar communities. --georgia_tech_swagger
• I happen to disagree. NCAAbbs IS a notable forum. However it would be for someone not in the U.S. Over 13,000 fans..recently received an offer for xxx,xxx. The Memphis and UAB forums are recognized in the Memphis and Birmingham newspapers, and the UAB fans were even seen on ESPN(largest sports cable network in the U.S.) holding a sign that had NCAAbbs.com on it. Please specify more of what you want, and I am sure we can provide. The "speedy" tag said to be removed? --Techfan - <*> 07:38, 9 March 2006 (EST)\

Comment huh? (no, really, I didn't understand...) I am in the U.S. Crzrussian 19:19, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

• Delete as nn, fails to meet WP:WEB criteria. --Terence Ong 14:59, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. WP:VSCA. -- Krash (Talk) 15:03, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per nominator. Why do articles about web forums insist on listing their users' nicknames? Do they really believe anyone cares about them? JIP | Talk 15:16, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
• Advertisement and WP:WEB are not means for speedy deletion.WP:CSD —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 168.9.52.4 (talk • contribs) 16:10, 9 March 2006.
• I think it should stay. It meets the inclusion criteria as it has been in newspapers as well as syndicated radio talk shows frequently. If one thinks this should be removed, then by all means remove all similar Wikipedia articles such as the page for Something Awful, the page for LinuxQuestions.org, etc. I really could go on for hours listing similar long-standing Wikipedia pages of the exact same merit that relate to the exact same community type. WP:WEB gives a list of criteria... and if it meets ANY ONE it's deemed noteable. Well, here's an award NCAAbbs from an independent newspaper. That meets the WP criteria. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.119.207.153 (talk • contribs) 20:51, 9 March 2006.
  • Comment I was unable to find NCAAbbs.com in the very long list of winners, are you sure this is the right address. Eivind 23:01, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment. I believe User:68.119.207.153 was referring to the third-place award won by MemphisTigers.org, but the relationship between NCAAbbs.com and MemphisTigers.org is unclear to me. --Metropolitan90 00:23, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
      • Comment MemphisTigers.org falls under the umbrella of NCAAbbs.com. It is run on the same server, but because of the popularity of this particular portion of NCAAbbs.com it has it's own domain name.
• Keep it. Many other non-profit organizations have entries. NCAAbbs adds flavor and encourages people to participate in many online communities such as Wikipedia itself. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 170.20.11.116 (talk • contribs) 20:40, 9 March 2006.
• Keep it. Not-for-Profit venture that allows sports fans to express opinions and show school spirit. Has shown up on ESPN, Birmingham News, Atlanta JC, WMC-Memphis, etc. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.216.69.78 (talk • contribs) 20:47, 9 March 2006.
• Keep it. It is a valuable site for trading sports and non-sports information. MySpace has a Wikipedia listing and is not marked for deletion. I feel that NCAABBS has similar-type content for the 20-45 year old sports enthusiast. The site has also been mentioned in numerous sports radio broadcasts. I thought that Wikipedia was a place to share information and not a popularity contest. Removing this entry while keeping entries of "popular" sites would be a disservice to those who use Wikipedia. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 198.202.162.100 (talk • contribs) 20:59, 9 March 2006.
  • Delete. Myspace.com is the 8th most popular web site according to alexa.com. NCAAbbs.com is 35,477th. [1] --Metropolitan90 00:23, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
• Keep it. I particularly object to the reference to WP:VSCA, as it qualifies for none of those classifications. Many of the ideas posed on the site are discussed in the media and by NCAA Coaches and Athletic Directors. NCAA players and families frequently contribute as well. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Works2late (talk • contribs) 21:05, 9 March 2006.
• delete per nom Niffweed17, Destroyer of Chickens 21:20, 9 March 2006 (UTC).
• DELETE as per all the above. this is not a notable bbs. 150.108.61.240 21:21, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
• Keep it! NCAAbbs, and all of it's sites, are 100% non-profit non-commercial. They have been mentioned in the news, radio, and even tv. It meets the criteria set by this site. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 12.215.171.241 (talk • contribs) 21:25, 9 March 2006.
• KEEP IT What makes a site "notable" 150.108.61.240? You using it? Many of the above respondents have listed multiple media inclusions including newspaper, television and radio. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 198.202.162.100 (talk • contribs) 22:09, 9 March 2006.

If you delete NCAABBS how can you justify keeping something like the Dem Underground in respect to Neutral Point Of View) is a fundamental Wikipedia principle which states that all articles must be written from a neutral point of view, representing views fairly and without bias. This includes reader-facing templates, categories and portals. According to Wikipedia founder Jimbo Wales, NPOV is "absolute and non-negotiable". [1]??? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rickheel (talk • contribs) 22:46, 9 March 2006.

• Delete nn, poor alexa rating Eivind 23:01, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
  • Comment this is not a vote! newbies adding comments regarding deletion are often ignored by admins, and espesially when you don't sign your post with ~~~~. Eivind 23:01, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment Can you bah like a sheep for me? Alexa rankings mean NOTHING beyond the top few hundred... I can EASILY inflate the Alexa rank for any site that has even modest traffic. Read up and free your mind of that Alexa load of bull. And here is some more reading material for you. --georgia_tech_swagger
• Delete as non-notable website / forumcruft. — Adrian~enwiki (talk) 01:21, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. "UAB fans were even seen on ESPN(largest sports cable network in the U.S.) holding a sign that had NCAAbbs.com on it." That's amazing. My cousin once got on TV with a sign at a WWE event that read "Vince You Silly Bastard" on one side and "It Burns When I Pee" on the other. I encourage people to check out the "independent award from a local newspaper" that has got 68.119.207.153 so excited. So excited they forgot to actually check if the website won an award. It's hard to be objective with this level of guff on the AfD but let's try... WP:WEB? Nope... Deizio 01:58, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
  • Comment MemphisTigers.org == NCAAbbs. Read more carefully before throwing in your $0.02. --georgia_tech_swagger

• "MemphisTigers.org is a part of NCAAbbs" or "MemphisTigers.org == NCAAbbs", which is it? In any case, you failed to note that the "award" criteria reads: "The website or content has won a well known and independent award". Deizio 02:51, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

• Delete. While there is some independent verifiability, I think that having one of the component sites selected as third best Memphis related sites is quite enough to meet the bar. I would reconsider if the site had even minor influence on college sports or if more verifiable material was found. Capitalistroadster 02:27, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

• Did you mean "...not quite enough..."? Deizio 02:51, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

• Deizio - I'm not sure what kind of problem you have with NCAAbbs, but to say that MemphisTigers.org, BlazerTalk.com, and NCAAbbs.com have not had an impact on the college sports world, especially in Memphis and Birmingham, then you do not need to be judging it. The point on UAB fans is that they were not only seen, but mentioned and also on the UAB radio station. Was your cousin mentioned? --Techfan

• I have made no comment about the "impact" of anything, the only problem I have is that this topic does not meet any part of WP:WEB or any other notability criteria and is invalid for inclusion in this particular encyclopedia. The appearance of people holding signs in crowds or unsolicited mentions on radio shows is not noteworthy. If you are going to argue that your site has received sufficient "media coverage" to make it noteworthy you should be thinking about verifiable and in-depth coverage in major national newspapers, nationally syndicated radio and / or popular national publications such as Time Magazine. I'm unfamiliar with "the UAB radio station", can you clarify what it's sphere of influence might be? By all means keep up the banter here but without an understanding of what makes a topic suitable for inclusion on WP, and the procedure by which pages get deleted, you aren't getting anywhere. If I do have a slight problem with anything it's the unsightly deluge of unsigned opinions from newcomers which are endemic to AfD debates on web forums. The encouragement of forum participants who have not previously edited on Wikipedia to make submissions here has the opposite of the desired effect - there is no surer way to ensure your site sticks in the minds of many WP editors for all the wrong reasons. Please check the links for new editors I've placed on your user talk page. Deizio 03:30, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

• I was referring to you saying "Did you mean '...not quite enough...'?" in reference to the influence on college sports and communities of fans. Think of it this way: Musicianforums is ONE OF MANY homes for musicians. NCAAbbs is THE home for fans of Memphis, UAB, Cinncinnati, NIU, etc. Now why is Musicianforums fine, and NCAAbbs not? I think that there are many problems other than our page to be worried about. The result of many "unsigned" users are here because they saw the big notice on the NCAAbbs page when viewing the page. It HAS made an impact. It HAS been mentioned in newspapers, radio, and TV. What do you want more of? What will get it "passed through"? If you could be more specific, I am sure we can provide what you want. Techfan 03:48, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

• "...not quite enough..." related to the point "I think that having one of the component sites selected as third best Memphis related sites is quite enough to meet the bar" by Capitalistroadster, as I believe he may have accidentally omitted the word "not". To answer your other points, each AfD is judged on its own merits and one should resist the equation: "If topic A is ok, why not topic B?" Let WP:AFD and WP:WEB be your guides in this matter. I'll be happy to answer further questions on my talk page. Deizio 04:05, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

• Fair enough, but you still have not answered my questions. What do you want more of? What will get it "passed through"? However, I think that it would be unfair to delete the NCAAbbs page, but let another that serves its purpose just as we do, but I would argue that NCAAbbs has made a bigger impact. Ediquette or not, I think you SHOULD compare situations to what others have considered o.k., rather than your own assumptions. Also..it DOES meet WP:WEB, even if you do not consider the Memphis award enough. See "The content itself has been the subject of multiple non-trivial published works whose source is independent of the site itself." Techfan 04:12, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

Techfan

• Delete per nom. --kingboyk 22:36, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
• The point is: the users would like to see this on here, and questions have NOT been answered or responded to. If you are going to say "delete", then answer our questions as to what more we would need on our page, because I am sure we can provide. NCAAbbs has never had an advertisement, only word of mouth, and since 2002 we have grown to 13,000+ users and have MADE AN IMPACT on the college sports world. The users that have posted here are not new to Wikipedia, they just do not contribute or monitor pages. We don't expect to get 1,000 new users from this, but we do want it to serve as a page for newcomers and others interested in the history of NCAAbbs. Our page is fine on the terms of WP:WEB. See related links for reference. Techfan 05:39, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

• Check your talk page Deizio 11:05, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.