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<!-- {{Wikibreak|message=On vacation from October 15 to November 1. I'll be on-wiki much less than usual and possibly not at all. Certainly, don't expect a prompt response to any questions or requests.}} -->
<!-- {{Retired|date=June 22, 2020,|reason=due to ArbCom. I may edit once in a great while}} -->
<!--*After a protracted absence, I returned in the spring of this year, although I'm not sure exactly why. I'm still deeply disturbed by the governance at Wikipedia and the WMF, and I doubt that will ever change. I could say more but don't think it's appropriate. -->


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<table class="messagebox standard-talk">
<tr><td>[[Image:{{{image|Imbox content.png}}}|40px|Caution]]
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*Unless otherwise requested, I will respond on '''this page'''.
*Please include links to pertinent page(s).
*Click New section on the top right to start a new topic.
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== Thanks ==
== Advice on possible sockpuppet ==
I got my shoulder replaced this week and my one-handed typing needs improvement.
[[User:Activist|Activist]] ([[User talk:Activist|talk]]) 22:42, 21 December 2024 (UTC)
:I had trouble believing it was intentional. Sorry about your shoulder.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 23:38, 21 December 2024 (UTC)


== G11 ==
I'm not linking names as I don't want them to come and infest your page. At the end of the DR case he filed, Sarower Sigh Bhati stated he was leaving Wikipedia. [[Wikipedia:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard#Hridayeshwar_Singh_Bhati]] Yesterday, a new editor showed up at [[Talk:Hridayeshwar Singh Bhati]], Dr Meenakshi Kanwar, exhibiting the same sort of behavior.
# Rapid, consecutive posts saying the same thing over and over
# Same habit of using other editors' entire sig (including talk page link) when replying
# Same need to puff up subject (youngest patent holder, "deserves" child prodigy)
# Same habit of placing critical importance on what is basically a regurgitation of a primary source (announcement of patent publication)
I can provide diffs for all these. Bhati's contributions can be seen starting [[Talk:Hridayeshwar_Singh_Bhati/Archive_1#Is_it_fair.3F_::Latest_edit_by_http:.2F.2Fen.wikipedia.org.2Fwiki.2FUser:GiantSnowman|here]]. He has been involved in a SPI [[Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Sudeepgangal/Archive|here]]. Is this enough for a CU on Kanwar? If not, what do you recommend? BTW, Bhati is still editing. --[[User:NeilN|'''<font color="#003F87">Neil<font color="#CD0000">N</font></font>''']] <sup><font face="Calibri">''[[User talk:NeilN|<font color="#003F87">talk to me</font>]]''</font></sup> 15:37, 21 September 2013 (UTC)


Out of interest, why was the G11 declined (for The Misguided)?
:That new editor is frustratingly dense. The old one [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard&diff=prev&oldid=573653928 said he was leaving] but today he has logged in to [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk:TransporterMan&diff=prev&oldid=573882323 talk to TransporterMan], [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard&diff=prev&oldid=573883031 sign a DRN thread] entry by IP, and [https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Arbitration/Requests&diff=prev&oldid=573884126 make a plea to ArbCom]. So far, the two accounts have not both chimed in on the same thread. [[User:Binksternet|Binksternet]] ([[User talk:Binksternet|talk]]) 16:07, 21 September 2013 (UTC)


Kind regards, [[User:Axad12|Axad12]] ([[User talk:Axad12|talk]]) 01:55, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
Finally looked at this. I'm including three accounts in this mess. It's not clear to me how much of this is sock puppetry and how much of it is meat puppetry, but both are sanctionable. I almost blocked all three, but after thinking about it some more, I'd prefer that one of you open a report at SPI. Make sure you explain that meat puppetry might be involved. Also, Sarower Sigh Bhati is the oldest account and therefore should be named as the master. I may yet block them on my own. If you file a report, please let me know that you've done so. Also, if there is continuing disruption, please give me a heads up. Thanks.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 23:48, 21 September 2013 (UTC)
:Also, be aware of [[Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Sudeepgangal/Archive]].--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 23:52, 21 September 2013 (UTC)
::Yes, I linked to it up above. But your advice is to open a new SPI with Sarower Sigh Bhati as the master and ask for CU, correct? --[[User:NeilN|'''<font color="#003F87">Neil<font color="#CD0000">N</font></font>''']] <sup><font face="Calibri">''[[User talk:NeilN|<font color="#003F87">talk to me</font>]]''</font></sup> 23:56, 21 September 2013 (UTC)
:::Oops, sorry, missed the link. Yes, that's my advice. I don't know whether the CU will be performed, though. I'm an SPI clerk (trainee), and I still haven't gotten the hang of when to endorse a CU and when not to. In this instance, my inexpert opinion is it's questionable whether a CU is warranted, but, hey, you're not a clerk, ask for it. If it's declined, so be it. Another option is ''not'' to request a CU and let a clerk request it or a CU make a decision to do it. Your choice. There are a lot of competing issues here, not the least of which is just the plain disruption caused by the editors, regardless of whether there's any sock or meat puppetry.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 00:05, 22 September 2013 (UTC)
::::See [[Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Sarower_Sigh_Bhati]]. I didn't ask for a CU as Kanwar self-declared she was the mother. --[[User:NeilN|'''<font color="#003F87">Neil<font color="#CD0000">N</font></font>''']] <sup><font face="Calibri">''[[User talk:NeilN|<font color="#003F87">talk to me</font>]]''</font></sup> 14:49, 22 September 2013 (UTC)


:{{tpw}} {{yo| Axad12}} It's not irredeemably " exclusively promotional and would need to be fundamentally rewritten". Some clean up is all it would need. [[User:Deepfriedokra|&#45;- Deepfriedokra]] ([[User talk:Deepfriedokra|talk]]) 02:00, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
Thanks for taking care of this. Kanwar is trying to appeal her block with the usual regard for directions. --[[User:NeilN|'''<font color="#003F87">Neil<font color="#CD0000">N</font></font>''']] <sup><font face="Calibri">''[[User talk:NeilN|<font color="#003F87">talk to me</font>]]''</font></sup> 02:34, 23 September 2013 (UTC)
::Okay, thank you.
:I see this is keeping you busy. Thanks for being on top of it. --[[User:NeilN|'''<font color="#003F87">Neil<font color="#CD0000">N</font></font>''']] <sup><font face="Calibri">''[[User talk:NeilN|<font color="#003F87">talk to me</font>]]''</font></sup> 18:19, 25 September 2013 (UTC)
::Can I request clarification on one point, albeit that it was not relevant to the decision here? In my admittedly limited experience of speedy deletion requests it seems that some users are prepared to authorise speedy deletion of material in draftspace and some users are not. Is this just a question of the luck of the draw (in terms of who deals with a request) or is there some underlying policy issue which I'm failing to grasp and which therefore looks like inconsistency due to a misunderstanding on my part?
::Any help on this point would be much appreciated. [[User:Axad12|Axad12]] ([[User talk:Axad12|talk]]) 02:08, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
:::{{yo|Axad12 }} I have stricter criteria for G11's that some (most?). Bbb23 is more insightfully incisive/decisive than I. There is a wide range of admin discretion at work, so sometimes it does depend on who sees it first, though I do not generally decline myself. [[User:Deepfriedokra|&#45;- Deepfriedokra]] ([[User talk:Deepfriedokra|talk]]) 02:15, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
::::I will say though that I don't care where the promotional content is. If it meets my criteria, I will delete it, though I only do one iteration. [[User:Deepfriedokra|&#45;- Deepfriedokra]] ([[User talk:Deepfriedokra|talk]]) 02:18, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
:::There is a fair amount of discretion on G11s, but mostly on the gray ones. I don't think this particular one was gray at all; indeed, I thought it was relatively well written.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 02:17, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
::::Indeed. [[User:Deepfriedokra|&#45;- Deepfriedokra]] ([[User talk:Deepfriedokra|talk]]) 02:19, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
::::[[User:Axad12|Axad12]], that's a G11 that will most likely be declined by every admin, including me. Please keep that in mind when you put things up for speedy deletion. [[User:Drmies|Drmies]] ([[User talk:Drmies|talk]]) 02:21, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
:::::To clarify...
:::::I nominated the article under G11 as "Unambiguous advertising or promotion", which it seemed to me was in accordance with the recent result of the declined AfC which described the draft as "reading like an advertisement".
:::::While accepting that the text might have been amended, the fact that the SPA creator had recently been blocked made that prospect rather unlikely.
:::::For the sake of my future understanding, where have I erred here? Is it the fact that the likelihood of clean-up is irrelevant and even if I was correct (and there were no future edits to the draft) it would have been deleted after 6 months anyway with no harm done? [[User:Axad12|Axad12]] ([[User talk:Axad12|talk]]) 02:31, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
::::::It doesn't particularly read like an advertisement either. Even assuming that [[User:Bonadea]]'s comment that "The quotations from reviews are decidedly cherry-picked" is correct (I haven't checked), while that's still a neutrality issue, it's not one that calls for deletion of the draft - it would still be coherent if the Reception section were just removed. —[[User:Cryptic|Cryptic]] 03:27, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
:::::::I'd still be grateful for clarification on my post above (assuming, for the sake of argument, that a draft ''did'' read like an advertisement). [[User:Axad12|Axad12]] ([[User talk:Axad12|talk]]) 05:18, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
:::For anyone trying to follow this thread, the page in question is [[Draft:The Misguided]], and a block of the creator was [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents#user_Stan1900_and_the_films_of_Shannon_Alexander decided at ANI]. The article may continue to languish at AfC due to its issues but I agree with others that the page is not an obvious G11 candidate. [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 06:15, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
::::{{yo|Axad12 }} Perplexingly, blocking does not always mean the content met [[WP:G11]]. I weigh each candidate on its merits. Creator in this instance, "is indef blocked for [[WP:IDHT]] and [[WP:BATTLEGROUND]] among many other issues," so that's apart from the quality of the draft in question. I infer the creator has a serious [[WP:COI]] with more at stake than, "don't delete my babies!' Having ones "babies" deleted is traumatic enough on its own. Hope that helps. [[User:Deepfriedokra|&#45;- Deepfriedokra]] ([[User talk:Deepfriedokra|talk]]) 09:15, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
:::::Agreed that the block was unrelated to the quality of the article - although the user could as easily have been blocked as a promo only account if he hadn't made a complete fool of himself at ANI.
:::::The reason I mentioned the user being blocked was because that meant that the draft was unlikely to be improved - but as I said above, presumably that is irrelevant if it means that the draft would then just remain unpublished for 6 months and then get deleted. [[User:Axad12|Axad12]] ([[User talk:Axad12|talk]]) 09:49, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
::::::Speaking as an administrator who had a lot of frustrating interactions in the last week with the blocked editor, I too agree that the draft does not qualify for G11 deletion. We should not let the fact that the primary author behaved like a monumental pain in the ass cloud our assessment of the draft. [[User:Cullen328|Cullen328]] ([[User talk:Cullen328|talk]]) 10:18, 22 December 2024 (UTC)
:::::::As I mentioned above, the G11 nomination wasn't due to the pedigree of the creator but was rather to do with the comments left by the AfC reviewer - albeit that I now see that that was not grounds for a G11 nomination in any event.
:::::::Thanks all for clarifying my understanding of the process, very much appreciated. [[User:Axad12|Axad12]] ([[User talk:Axad12|talk]]) 10:42, 22 December 2024 (UTC)


== Django unchained edit ==
== Happy Holidays! ==


<div style="border: 3px solid #01902a; background-color:#fff; text-align:left; padding:2px;"><div style="border: 2px solid red; background-color:#fff; text-align:left; padding:6px;" class="plainlinks">[[File:Xmas colors, 2013 (photo by David J).jpg|x80px|left]]
You said you needed more sources for the Cosplay sections for Django Unchained. http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Django_Unchained&action=history


[[User:Ekdalian|Ekdalian]] ([[User talk:Ekdalian|talk]]) is wishing you a [[Mary Poppins (character)|Merry]] [[Christmas]]! This greeting (and season) promotes [[Wikipedia:WikiLove|WikiLove]] and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a [[Christmas|Merry Christmas]], whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year!
What would you consider 'reliable' secondary sources? There wont be many articles about it, but there are plenty of pictures available. Would links to some taken from comic con work? <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/70.89.60.29|70.89.60.29]] ([[User talk:70.89.60.29|talk]]) 15:04, 25 September 2013 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:Look at [[WP:RS]]. Pictures are almost never reliable sources. You'd need something from a major newspaper or magazine that comments on the issue.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 15:09, 25 September 2013 (UTC)


''Spread the cheer by adding {{tls|Xmas5}} to their talk page with a friendly message.''
== IP sock ==
</div></div> [[User:Ekdalian|Ekdalian]] ([[User talk:Ekdalian|talk]]) 08:44, 23 December 2024 (UTC)


== Happy holidays! ==
Hi, I just noticed that [[Special:Contributions/132.194.210.73|this user]] who you blocked the other day is now evading his block and making contentious edits [[Special:Contributions/132.194.219.175|with a new IP]]. Both IPs can be traced to Denver, Colorado, and in both cases the IP user is edit warring on the NRA and Gun politics articles. [[User:ROG5728|ROG5728]] ([[User talk:ROG5728|talk]]) 19:21, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:golden; background-color:#fff; border-width:2px; text-align:left; padding:8px;" class="plainlinks">[[File:Happy new year old.svg|180px|left]]

'''Hello there, 'tis the season again, believe it or not, the years pass so quickly now! A big thank you for all of your contributions to Wikipedia in 2024! Wishing you a Very happy and productive 2025! ♦ [[User:Maliner|Maliner]] ([[User talk:Maliner|talk]]) 17:16, 23 December 2024 (UTC)
== SPI advice needed ==

Hi Bbb23. I hope everything is well with you and yours. Sorry for the trouble, but since you are an SPI clerk I would like to ask your opinion about IP sock tagging. Please see: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Drmies#Mass_reverting_of_IP_sock_tags_of_K-pop_articles Mass reverting of IP sock tags of K-pop articles] and associated discussion at [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:GregJackP#Please_do_not_mass-revert_IP_sock_tags Please do not mass-revert IP sock tags]. Whenever you have the time, please let me know your opinion regarding the best way forward in this case. Thank you. [[User:Dr.K.|Δρ.Κ.]]&nbsp;<small><sup style="position:relative">[[User talk:Dr.K.|λόγος]]<span style="position:relative;bottom:-2.0ex;left:-5.2ex;*left:-5.5ex">[[Special:Contributions/Dr.K.|πράξις]]</span></sup></small> 01:58, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
:Hi, Dr.K., I'm kind of worn out from Wikipedia today, and, thankfully, I'm going to get off in a moment. I'll try to take a look tomorrow. Regards.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 02:08, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
::Of course, Bbb23. No obligation or rush at all. Thank you very much for considering this. Take care. [[User:Dr.K.|Δρ.Κ.]]&nbsp;<small><sup style="position:relative">[[User talk:Dr.K.|λόγος]]<span style="position:relative;bottom:-2.0ex;left:-5.2ex;*left:-5.5ex">[[Special:Contributions/Dr.K.|πράξις]]</span></sup></small> 02:14, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
:::In my short time as an SPI trainee clerk, I've learned that the issue of tagging is a contentious one. Policies and templates contradict each other, not to mention the practices of individual administrators and editors in this area. If I had my way, I'd make it simple. Only administrators would be able to add tags or remove them, and there'd be a thorough discussion to make the tagging consistent. In terms of this individual crusade by Greg, I'd bring up the issue at the talk page of [[WP:SOCK]] and see if you get any reactions there. My guess is no one will be bothered that much by the removal of tags from unblocked IPs. I sampled a few of Greg's edits, and given that the tags were added by non-admins, it doesn't bother me all that much for them to be removed. Just as an aside, some administrators believe that IPs should ''never'' be tagged. One more thing. [[WP:HSOCK]] doesn't apply to IPs but to all users.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 14:31, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
::::IMHO, tagging of IPs should be restricted ''only'' to cases where a ''significant number'' of "sock edits" are traceable to the specific IP, and where there is ''no'' possibility of having an "innocent bystander" be faced with that tag -- especially for such cases as IP addresses linked to schools where it is likely that new students will be faced with the detritus from previous students, etc. Indeed, I would suggest this is an extension of how we deal with "living persons" - that is, ''contentious claims'' about a person who was quite likely ''not'' involved in socking as a "sock" should be removed. There are, indeed, some IPs which are tagged, and properly so, but cases where single edits are found should generally not be so tagged. All IMHO, of course. [[User:Collect|Collect]] ([[User talk:Collect|talk]]) 14:45, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
:::::Thank you very much Bbb23 for the information. I agree also with Collect's points. The problem is, according to my experience with K-pop articles, there are certain geolocations which chronically edit-war unsourced BLP information about birthdays and positions into these articles. Many of these IP addresses strongly indicate they are from a rather narrow IP range. This information could be useful in case a range-block was ever necessary. I remember one instance where one IP was blocked as a sock through checkuser. But as Drmies mentioned we could go the other way and semi the articles involved. In any case thank you both for your feedback. Best regards. [[User:Dr.K.|Δρ.Κ.]]&nbsp;<small><sup style="position:relative">[[User talk:Dr.K.|λόγος]]<span style="position:relative;bottom:-2.0ex;left:-5.2ex;*left:-5.5ex">[[Special:Contributions/Dr.K.|πράξις]]</span></sup></small> 01:28, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

== Nom nom nom ==

<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:brown; background-color:gold; border-width:1px; text-align:left; padding:8px;" class="plainlinks">[[Image:Cheeseburger.png|100px|left]]

[[User:Ponyo|<b><font color="Navy">''Jezebel's''</font></b><font color="Navy">Ponyo</font>]]<sup>[[User_talk:Ponyo|<font color="Navy">''bons mots''</font>]]</sup> has given you a [[Cheeseburger]]! Cheeseburgers promote [[Wikipedia:WikiLove|WikiLove]] and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by giving someone else a Cheeseburger, whether it be someone you've had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy eating! <br />

We can't have you starving now can we?

Spread the goodness of Cheeseburgers by adding {{tls|Cheeseburger}} to their talk page with a friendly message, or eat this cheeseburger on the giver's talk page with {{tls|burger-munch}}!
{{clear}}
</div>
</div>
<!-- Template:Cheeseburger -->
:Oh, I dunno, I kinda liked playing Camille. Thanks, Ponyo. Best.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 18:36, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

== Edit issue ==

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Farolif] User Farolif on the [[Hun Sen]] article is reverting me. I am thinking it is o.k. to use what I have used on the article page and he is saying no, that it is not neutral. Its a legit news source and they ''say it'', and it updates the situation of that particular person in that particular place [http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/09/18/us-cambodia-hunsen-analysis-idUSBRE98H04K20130918] so I paraphrased it and used it. I noticed a previous action you made with that person and am wondering if what he is doing now constitutes a kind of creeping edit war. I asked him to ''talk page'' the issue but no luck on that. [[User:Earl King Jr.|Earl King Jr.]] ([[User talk:Earl King Jr.|talk]]) 06:18, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
:It doesn't look like an edit war to me at this point. Don't let it become one. As for your edit, you may think you paraphrased it, but if I saw it, I'd remove it as a copyright violation without regard to any other problems it may have.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 14:21, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
::Thanks. Good information. [[User:Earl King Jr.|Earl King Jr.]] ([[User talk:Earl King Jr.|talk]]) 22:17, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

== Abusive IP socks ==

Hi, Bbb23. You blocked the dynamic {{IP|201.215.187.159}} for three months on 13 August; mainly, as you said, because of their sock puppetry threat. Yeah... I think {{IP|200.73.232.97}} is the same person, per [[WP:DUCK]]: same ISP, same city, same charm. See their talkpage. Unfortunately, those two can't be blocked as a "range", it would be massive. How are you on range blocks? Is there anything we can do, other than blocking 200.73.232.97 as well? (I'm holding off on that until they respond to me, but considering their reception of [[User:Thomas.W]], I'm not expecting a very warm welcome.) What annoys me is that 201.215.187.159 stopped editing on 13 August (obviously) and 200.73.232.97 didn't start until 26 September. I just bet there were some little duckies in between, and will be more. [[User:Bishonen|Bishonen]] &#124; [[User talk:Bishonen|talk]] 20:30, 28 September 2013 (UTC).
:I'm just slightly better on range blocks than I used to be, which isn't saying much. I ususally go to [[User:Kww]] when I have these kinds of questions. I believe [[User:Diannaa]] is knowledgeable as well. If there's a pattern to the edits, sometimes a filter can eliminate the disruption, but there has to be enough evidence to justify the filter. Sorry I can't be of more help.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 20:39, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
::Range block looks out of the question: too wide, and no convenient subnets are apparent, either.&mdash;[[User:Kww|Kww]]([[User talk:Kww|talk]]) 20:56, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
::Everything I know about range blocks I learned from [[User:Bishonen/Archive 14#One syllable|Bish's talk page]] {{smiley}} -- [[User:Diannaa|Diannaa]] ([[User talk:Diannaa|talk]]) 22:44, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
:::And here I thought you knew what you were doing. I'm still working on "convenient subnets".--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 22:51, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
::I've blocked {{IP|200.73.232.97}} per self-confessed block evasion, and I guess they fully intend to return with another IP.[https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk:200.73.232.97&diff=574926342&oldid=574918163] I'm actually a little torn on this: they have a bad temper, but make useful edits. I've offered them a deal, to which I hope you don't object, Bbb. But as for NuclearWarfare's famous words-of-one-syllable range block instructions in my archive, they don't work no more, because the link is dead. :-( [[User:Bishonen|Bishonen]] &#124; [[User talk:Bishonen|talk]] 10:02, 29 September 2013 (UTC).
::::As long as you're willing to keep an eye on the new account (assuming the deal is accepted) ''and'' the IPs, I have no problem with trying to assist someone who shows promise. I just hope we don't end up with a long-term user with a bad attitude.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 13:47, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
:::::I had a nice polite conversation, on both hands, with the ip, but they declined my offer, as I rather expected. They've been around for years, and if they'd wanted an account, I guess they'd have had one by now. [[User:Bishonen|Bishonen]] &#124; [[User talk:Bishonen|talk]] 22:48, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
::::::Yes, I was watching. As you say, at least they were polite.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 22:57, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
::: Here's a replacement tool: http://toolserver.org/~tparis/rangecontribs/. I hope [[User:Kww]] can give us all a hand in cases are not clear-cut. -- [[User:Diannaa|Diannaa]] ([[User talk:Diannaa|talk]]) 13:34, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

== "Mysogynist" and WP::Label ==

As you have effectively forbidden discussion of this on the Men's Rights Movement talk page, I believe it is entirely appropriate to take the issue up on your talk page.
As I'm sure you are aware, [[WP::Label]] states that a label should not be used unless it is "widely" so used by RS. In practice, the label "terrorist" is applied when one or more governments apply the label -- e.g. [[Al Qaeda]], [[Tamil Tigers]], [[Hamas]], etc. I would ask you to apply the same standard to the [[Men's Rights Movement]] article. That is, if one or more governments have stated that the MRM is "mysogynist", it would be appropriate to use the label in the lede of the article. Otherwise, it would not. I request that you apply the policy the same way it is applied elsewhere on Wikipedia. Thank you.[[User:William Jockusch|William Jockusch]] ([[User talk:William Jockusch|talk]]) 04:03, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
:Hello? It would be polite to explain yourself.[[User:William Jockusch|William Jockusch]] ([[User talk:William Jockusch|talk]]) 01:12, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

== WikiProject Boxing - Notability discussion ==

Changes to [[WP:NBOX]]/[[WP:NBOXING]] have been discussed at length at [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Boxing#Notability discussion]], and I believe a consensus has been reached. Best Regards. [[User:DynamoDegsy|DynamoDegsy]] ([[User talk:DynamoDegsy|talk]]) 15:48, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
:I suggest you go to the guideline talk page and start a topic linking to the project discussion and invite comments. It's not clear to me that a consensus was reached in the project discussion. Nor is it clear that should be the end of the matter considering the extent of the changes. Procedurally, for someone who has edited as much as you have, you should (1) stop marking your edits as minor when they clearly aren't and (2) use edit summaries.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 15:55, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
::DynamoDegsy - these kind of changes need wider input than just one WikiProject, same goes for every sport. [[User:GiantSnowman|Giant]][[User talk:GiantSnowman|Snowman]] 16:55, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

== The Woven Thread deletion. ==

Hi, thanks for your message letting me know about the speedy deletion of The Woven Thread production company page I created. I understand your reasons for doing so, but I'd like to ask a couple of questions.
I checked to see that there were other similar pages for independent television production companies in Scotland and found several: [[The Comedy Unit]], [[Effingee Productions]] are two examples, both of which make comedy in Scotland, as does The Woven Thread. In fact effingee hasn't made any television for 5 years, but The Woven Thread is a new company and will make programmes for the forseeable future. My question is this: At what point is a company big enough to warrant a page?
Thanks for your help--<small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:MrMHines|MrMHines]] ([[User talk:MrMHines|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/MrMHines|contribs]]) 09:36, 30 September 2013‎ (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned -->

*[[WP:CORP]] has some guidelines. And there's [[WP:GNG]]. It's not just about size. [[User:Drmies|Drmies]] ([[User talk:Drmies|talk]]) 14:44, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

== inre [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Boss 2(2013 Bengali film) ]] ==

While this fails [[WP:NFF]], the topic of a planned sequel '''IS''' beginning to be spoken about in reliable sources.[http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/entertainment/regional/bengali/news-interviews/Jeet-and-Subhashree-pair-up-for-Boss-sequel/movie-review/22544220.cms] Yes, the article is [[WP:NYF|TOO SOON]], but being sourcable is not a speedy-able film topic. Best, '''[[User:MichaelQSchmidt|<font color="blue">Schmidt,</font>]]''' ''[[User talk:MichaelQSchmidt|<sup><small>Michael Q.</small></sup>]]'' 10:28, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

== TOO Copyright images India ==

I truest you as an admin and {{Reply to|Drmies}} too and know you always post your own views. I also try to do so. In Commons, my arguments are being rejected thrice. No one, not a single admin, is supporting my points there and someone has told, I am wasting their time. Still, I can not understand where I am wrong.

The point I am trying to say them— when we don't know copyright status of an image/content in a country, our attempt should be to find it. "We don't know", "Commons does not have any information" — these should not be reason to keep content here. Please help me to understand where I am wrong here. '''Commons thread: [[:Commons:Commons:Administrators'_noticeboard#My_disappointment:_TOO_and_India]]''' <span style="background:orange;border:orange ridge">[[User:Titodutta|Tito]]</span><span style="color:blue;background:white;otit;border-bottom-style:ridge;">☸</span><span style="background:#57C738;border:green ridge">[[User talk:Titodutta|Dutta]]</span> 12:14, 30 September 2013 (UTC)
*Thanks, but that's outside of my scope of experience. I don't know who Fry1989 is, but they provided an argument that, at least to my inexperienced eyes, makes sense. If you're asking for more participation in a particular discussion, well, you can but it probably won't help much. On en-wiki such discussions remind me of MfD discussions; they don't attract a lot of attention. [[User:Drmies|Drmies]] ([[User talk:Drmies|talk]]) 14:43, 30 September 2013 (UTC)
:*Tito, I can barely follow the discussion on Commons. Commons has its own set of policies and ways of doing things, and I've never really participated in any significant discussions. The only thing I go to Commons to do is to nominate an image used on Wikipedia for deletion or in rare instances to tag it for speedy deletion. What you say above I understand, I think. You're saying that although normally a no consensus to delete something defaults to keep, it should be the opposite for copyright issues (the burden should be shifted to use legalese), but that's as much as I understand. To the extent it matters, I ''do'' know Fry1989.--[[User:Bbb23|Bbb23]] ([[User talk:Bbb23#top|talk]]) 23:25, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

== [[User:Lindodawki]]'s 3RR report ==

*{{userlinks|Lindodawki}}
Hello Bbb. see [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Edit_warring&diff=575365003&oldid=575351476 this 3RR closure], where you wrote 36 hours as the result. Did you forget to issue the block? I had previously done a 48 hour block (though not per the 3RR board) because the [[Latin America]] article is on my watchlist and I noticed the revert war. It does not seem that the user is paying any attention. Thanks, [[User:EdJohnston|EdJohnston]] ([[User talk:EdJohnston|talk]]) 05:03, 2 October 2013 (UTC)

== ANI ==

[[Image:Ambox notice.svg|link=|25px|alt=Information icon]] Hello. There is currently a discussion at [[Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents]] regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. <!--Template:ANI-notice--> Thank you.

Latest revision as of 17:16, 23 December 2024


Thanks

I got my shoulder replaced this week and my one-handed typing needs improvement. Activist (talk) 22:42, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I had trouble believing it was intentional. Sorry about your shoulder.--Bbb23 (talk) 23:38, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

G11

Out of interest, why was the G11 declined (for The Misguided)?

Kind regards, Axad12 (talk) 01:55, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(talk page watcher) @Axad12: It's not irredeemably " exclusively promotional and would need to be fundamentally rewritten". Some clean up is all it would need. -- Deepfriedokra (talk) 02:00, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, thank you.
Can I request clarification on one point, albeit that it was not relevant to the decision here? In my admittedly limited experience of speedy deletion requests it seems that some users are prepared to authorise speedy deletion of material in draftspace and some users are not. Is this just a question of the luck of the draw (in terms of who deals with a request) or is there some underlying policy issue which I'm failing to grasp and which therefore looks like inconsistency due to a misunderstanding on my part?
Any help on this point would be much appreciated. Axad12 (talk) 02:08, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Axad12: I have stricter criteria for G11's that some (most?). Bbb23 is more insightfully incisive/decisive than I. There is a wide range of admin discretion at work, so sometimes it does depend on who sees it first, though I do not generally decline myself. -- Deepfriedokra (talk) 02:15, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I will say though that I don't care where the promotional content is. If it meets my criteria, I will delete it, though I only do one iteration. -- Deepfriedokra (talk) 02:18, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There is a fair amount of discretion on G11s, but mostly on the gray ones. I don't think this particular one was gray at all; indeed, I thought it was relatively well written.--Bbb23 (talk) 02:17, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed. -- Deepfriedokra (talk) 02:19, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Axad12, that's a G11 that will most likely be declined by every admin, including me. Please keep that in mind when you put things up for speedy deletion. Drmies (talk) 02:21, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
To clarify...
I nominated the article under G11 as "Unambiguous advertising or promotion", which it seemed to me was in accordance with the recent result of the declined AfC which described the draft as "reading like an advertisement".
While accepting that the text might have been amended, the fact that the SPA creator had recently been blocked made that prospect rather unlikely.
For the sake of my future understanding, where have I erred here? Is it the fact that the likelihood of clean-up is irrelevant and even if I was correct (and there were no future edits to the draft) it would have been deleted after 6 months anyway with no harm done? Axad12 (talk) 02:31, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It doesn't particularly read like an advertisement either. Even assuming that User:Bonadea's comment that "The quotations from reviews are decidedly cherry-picked" is correct (I haven't checked), while that's still a neutrality issue, it's not one that calls for deletion of the draft - it would still be coherent if the Reception section were just removed. —Cryptic 03:27, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'd still be grateful for clarification on my post above (assuming, for the sake of argument, that a draft did read like an advertisement). Axad12 (talk) 05:18, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For anyone trying to follow this thread, the page in question is Draft:The Misguided, and a block of the creator was decided at ANI. The article may continue to languish at AfC due to its issues but I agree with others that the page is not an obvious G11 candidate. EdJohnston (talk) 06:15, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Axad12: Perplexingly, blocking does not always mean the content met WP:G11. I weigh each candidate on its merits. Creator in this instance, "is indef blocked for WP:IDHT and WP:BATTLEGROUND among many other issues," so that's apart from the quality of the draft in question. I infer the creator has a serious WP:COI with more at stake than, "don't delete my babies!' Having ones "babies" deleted is traumatic enough on its own. Hope that helps. -- Deepfriedokra (talk) 09:15, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed that the block was unrelated to the quality of the article - although the user could as easily have been blocked as a promo only account if he hadn't made a complete fool of himself at ANI.
The reason I mentioned the user being blocked was because that meant that the draft was unlikely to be improved - but as I said above, presumably that is irrelevant if it means that the draft would then just remain unpublished for 6 months and then get deleted. Axad12 (talk) 09:49, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Speaking as an administrator who had a lot of frustrating interactions in the last week with the blocked editor, I too agree that the draft does not qualify for G11 deletion. We should not let the fact that the primary author behaved like a monumental pain in the ass cloud our assessment of the draft. Cullen328 (talk) 10:18, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
As I mentioned above, the G11 nomination wasn't due to the pedigree of the creator but was rather to do with the comments left by the AfC reviewer - albeit that I now see that that was not grounds for a G11 nomination in any event.
Thanks all for clarifying my understanding of the process, very much appreciated. Axad12 (talk) 10:42, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Happy Holidays!

Ekdalian (talk) is wishing you a Merry Christmas! This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year!

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Ekdalian (talk) 08:44, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Happy holidays!

Hello there, 'tis the season again, believe it or not, the years pass so quickly now! A big thank you for all of your contributions to Wikipedia in 2024! Wishing you a Very happy and productive 2025!  ♦ Maliner (talk) 17:16, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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