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== Source Repository ==

:We are tring to get as many sources in '''English''' as possible to make the article easy to read for all users. Please be nice and leave here the sources of Telexfree news that you have. [[User:Duda100|Duda100]] ([[User talk:Duda100|talk]]) 19:59, 5 December 2013 (UTC)


== Overlinking ==

I have, again, tagged this article with {{tl|overlinked}}. There are a huge number of duplicated wikilinks in this article. It needs them to be pruned down to linking only the first instance of each one. [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 22:28, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
:I have worked on that, and the article seems to be a little less "link polluted" to read. I keep my eyes on that issue and try to correct if new overlinking returns. Thanks for the notice! <small><span class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Frontiersanders|Frontiersanders]] ([[User talk:Frontiersanders|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Frontiersanders|contribs]]) 06:34, 11 December 2013 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

==[[WP:BLP]] issues==
{{BLP noticeboard}}
Where anything at all relating to a living person is stated in this article that may be even suspected to be defamatory, that must be shown to be accurate from a full reference in [[WP:RS]]. There is much in this article that potentially crosses that boundary. That '''must be referenced'' or it must be deleted. [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 16:21, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

==Removed text==
From ''Telexfree Brazillian Operations'': this article is not about Nehra per [[WP:COATRACK]]:
<blockquote>
Nehra is the former [[Amway]] Legal Director and today has its own law office, named MLM Law, specialized in Ponzi and Pyramid Schemes. He became famous after representing companies which were accused of operating Ponzi Schemes - [http://www.asdremission.com/ Ad Surf Daily],<ref>{{cite web|url=http://www.businessweek.com/the_thread/techbeat/archives/2008/08/ad_surf_daily.html|title=Ad Surf Daily - The Tech Beat (EN)|publisher=Bloomberg Businessweek|accessdate=Dec 7th, 2013}}</ref> and [[Universo FoneClub]]<ref>{{cite web|url=http://www.acheiusa.com/acheiusa/arquivo/0142/materias/achei-noticia2.asp|title=Universo Fhoneclub Owner, Sann Rodrigues, defends himself and says he is respecting the law (PT)|publisher=Achei USA Brazilian Newspaper|accessdate=Dec 7th, 2013}}{{Primary-source-inline|date=December 2013}}</ref> as well as representing the church minister [[Charles R. Groeschel]]<ref>{{cite web|url=http://www.sec.gov/litigation/litreleases/lr15805.txt|title=Securities and Exchange Commission vs. Association of Individual Ministries, Charles R. Groeschel and Sage Computer Services(EN) |publisher=SEC|accessdate=Dec 7th, 2013}}</ref><ref>{{cite web|url=http://www.nytimes.com/1998/08/22/business/pastor-chuck-s-bully-pulpit-sec-challenges-a-new-road-to-material-salvation.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm|title=Pastor Chuck's Bully Pulpit; SEC Challenges a New Road to Material Salvation (EN)|publisher=The New York Times|accessdate=Dec 7th, 2013}}</ref> accused by [[Securities and Exchange Commission|SEC]] to conduct a Pyramid Scheme in his temple.<ref>{{cite web|url=http://economia.ig.com.br/2013-03-21/nos-eua-telexfree-contrata-advogado-com-experiencia-em-casos-de-piramide.html|title=Telexfree hires in USA the best lawyer in Pyramid Schemes (PT)|publisher=IG News Portal Brazil|accessdate=March 28, 2013}}</ref></blockquote>
{{reflist-talk}}Cheers, [[User:Baffle gab1978|Baffle gab1978]] ([[User talk:Baffle gab1978|talk]]) 19:19, 11 December 2013 (UTC)

== A Couple Comments By Someone Who's Been Tracking This... ==

1) Gerald Nehra was also a consultant for the Zeek Rewards Ponzi scheme closed by SEC in August 2012.

This is easily verified via "creditor's list" on ZeekRewardsreceivership.com where the receiver in charge of cleanup had to pay the creditors, and among them is Nehra and Waak, Nehra's lawfirm.

It's worth noting that in both Ad Surf Daily and Zeek Rewards, Nehra chose to see his client as "not a Ponzi scheme", even though both are closed for being such.

2) There are actually TWO TelexFree in the US... a Corp, and a LLC. Both are registered by the same people at virtual addresses.

This is my personal research, obviously NOT up to Wiki standards, but I hope it serves as a starting point for somebody.

http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com/2013/07/telexfree-location-lie-its-tvi-express.html

3) According to latest news, TelexFree has been outlawed in Peru

http://www.andina.com.pe/Espanol/noticia-empresas-wcm777-y-telexfree-no-estan-autorizados-para-captar-dinero-del-publico-486768.aspx#.Uq0tNPRDt8E (Link in Spanish)

[[User:Kschang77|Kschang77]] ([[User talk:Kschang77|talk]]) 05:02, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

:Thanks [[User:Kschang77|Kschang77]], we will use those information in the article for sure. Many many thanks for your research. [[User:Duda100|'''<span style="color:green;">Brazilian</span><span style="color:gold;">Tale</span>''']] ([[User talk:Duda100#top|<big>✉</big>]]) 11:22, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

:Peru news have been added to the article. Now we just need to quote all Pyramid Schemes that Nehra defended in court. [[User:Duda100|'''<span style="color:green;">Brazilian</span><span style="color:gold;">Tale</span>''']] ([[User talk:Duda100#top|<big>✉</big>]]) 22:31, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

== Reference is redirected ==

This reference: http://www.telexfree.com/home/mudaIdioma/br/ redirects to http://www.telexfree.com/ and reveals the following (machine translated) text:

"By judicial decision issued on June 13, 2013 , the Judge in Thais Queiroz B. de Oliveira Abou Khalil , in the records of the Preparatory Action No. 0005669-76.2013.8.01.0001 Injunction , filed by the Prosecutor of the State of Acre , pending in the 2nd Civil Court of Rio Branco -AC , are prohibited new accessions to Telexfree network on condition partner or adviser ; receipts are sealed by Telexfree , Returnable Deposit Funds and Costs of Reserve Position ; are prohibited sales kits 99Telexfree VOIP accounts in ADCentral and ADCentral Family modalities ; payments are prohibited , to partners and advisers , commissions , bonuses and any benefits derived from the Telexfree network ( from sales of VOIP 99 Telexfree accounts of new registrations , ad postings , training of direct or indirect binary , royalty , Team Builder , perhaps due among others ), that the breach of any of the above determinations motivate the payment of a fine of U.S. $ 100,000.00 (one hundred thousand dollars) for each new registration or reregistration and each overpayment ."

May I suggest that the reference be edited to reflect this and also that the text might be adjusted accordingly if necessary? [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 11:35, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

:Sure. Telexfree website it is suppose to be in 3 languages, but I think the message it is only in Portuguese. Let´s put it instead of the link. [[User:Duda100|'''<span style="color:green;">Brazilian</span><span style="color:gold;">Tale</span>''']] ([[User talk:Duda100#top|<big>✉</big>]]) 11:45, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

::It appears to be a banner that, once closed, allows access to the site. [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 11:50, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

:::I have done a little tidying. I used {{Tl|Quote}}, something you will not yet have been aware of. [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 13:11, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

::::Perfect. I´m always learning new things around here. [[User:Duda100|'''<span style="color:green;">Brazilian</span><span style="color:gold;">Tale</span>''']] ([[User talk:Duda100#top|<big>✉</big>]]) 22:29, 15 December 2013 (UTC)
::::: I have worked on this part to better the translation and I also added "secondary" references.--[[User:Frontiersanders|Frontiersanders]] ([[User talk:Frontiersanders|talk]]) 10:50, 16 December 2013 (UTC)

== Unsourced statement about logo ==

In December 2013, the new company logo was presented during a convention promoted by the company aboard a cruise ship.{{cn|date=December 2013}} It depicts only the right half of the old logo, with stripes colors replaced by white, over a blue sphere. However, the stripes in the new logo still have the same shape as the old logo and, subsequently, the same shape as the BWF logo.{{or|date=December 2013}}

The above statement was written by me on the article page. Although this statement is very easy to check visually as true, I understand pretty well that it should not be stated by me, but instead, by a third party source. As the release of the new logo occurred few days ago, there are still no written sources for that. So, I moved the statement to the talk page. [[User:Maurício Gomes MMN|Maurício Gomes MMN]] ([[User talk:Maurício Gomes MMN|talk]]) 18:30, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

:Leave the text in the article. It is a original research and there are some youtube videos about this Extravaganza 2013. [[Special:Contributions/62.203.45.148|62.203.45.148]] ([[User talk:62.203.45.148|talk]]) 20:23, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

::We can not use youtube videos as sources except in very restricted circumstances. [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 21:35, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

::: I also agree one should wait for secondary sources to come up (it shouldn't take too long). By the way, talking about videos, Faddle: could you share with me some of your "expertise"? What if one wants to put some major TV News as references (let's say CNN, Globo, CBS, etc), and that news is available on youtube? Would that be an appropriate case to add an youtube video as a reference? Thanks! --[[User:Frontiersanders|Frontiersanders]] ([[User talk:Frontiersanders|talk]]) 04:31, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

::::If I could recall from where I got it myself it would be a pleasure. In general the issues with Youtube are reliability of the video itself and whether it has been posted in breach of copyright. If a respected new org posts a video in its own channel that tends to be reliable. If I post that same video in mine I have broken copyright laws. One we can probably cite, the other definitely not. Waitimg for secondary sources is always valid. There is no rush to be [[WP:NOTNEWS|first with the news]]. [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 09:14, 18 December 2013 (UTC)
:::::I have found [[Wikipedia:Video links]] which is helpful. [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 09:18, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

:Let´s wait for other sources than Youtube amateur videos or Facebook posting of Telexfree promoters. This logo controversy calls all Brazilian media attention and some of the sources may update their article with this new logo which by the way it is AT&T logo mixed with BWF logo. [[User:Duda100|'''<span style="color:green;">Brazilian</span><span style="color:gold;">Tale</span>''']] ([[User talk:Duda100#top|<big>✉</big>]]) 08:45, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

== Mothering this article ==

From observation the core of editors who created the article appears to be mothering it. Of course it can be improved. All articles can be improved. But please may I make a plea to allow it go go out to play on its own, at least for a good while. It no longer needs to be wrapped in warm towels, nor have its grazed knees bandaged with such care. Instead, consider that you have all fathered it, not mothered it, and act as a dad, not a mum. Be proud of it, and send it out into the world, and watch it grow and develop.

You have all done, are all doing, a great job, but the satisfaction from standing back and watching someone else improve it is immense. [[User:Timtrent|<span style="color:#800">Fiddle</span>]] [[User talk:Timtrent|<span style="color:#070">Faddle</span>]] 18:22, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

ស្សមានថអវ្្រ្ក <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/27.109.112.113|27.109.112.113]] ([[User talk:27.109.112.113|talk]]) 17:59, 9 January 2014 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Semi-protected edit request on 27 January 2014 ==

{{edit semi-protected|<!-- Page to be edited -->|answered=yes}}
<!-- Begin request -->
Please remove under industry type: ponzi scheme

There is no proof that this business is a ponzi scheme.

<!-- End request -->
[[User:Ammondx|Ammondx]] ([[User talk:Ammondx|talk]]) 02:45, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
:{{notdone}} There seems to be ample sources describing it as such. --[[User:NeilN|'''<font color="navy">Neil<font color="red">N</font></font>''']] <sup>''[[User talk:NeilN|<font color="blue">talk to me</font>]]''</sup> 03:14, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

I totally agree. The company has being accused of operating a Ponzi scheme, which is yet to be proven by any court of law, therefore 'Ponzi Scheme' should not appear as industry type on the right hand side of the page. Telexfree is legally registered and operating as Multilevel Marketing company. <small><span class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:007Star|007Star]] ([[User talk:007Star|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/007Star|contribs]]) 14:04, 1 February 2014 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== telexfree is not a ponzi scheme ==

telexfree is a multinivel enterprise , the article is bad. please correct <small><span class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Segago|Segago]] ([[User talk:Segago|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Segago|contribs]]) 02:59, 28 January 2014 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:"Ponzi scheme" sources: [http://g1.globo.com/fantastico/noticia/2013/06/justica-ve-indicios-de-piramide-na-telexfree-e-determina-investigacao.html], [http://www.caldeiraopolitico.com.br/arqs/materia/8661_a.pdf], [http://economia.uol.com.br/noticias/redacao/2013/03/14/ministerio-pede-investigacao-sobre-suposto-esquema-de-piramide.htm], [http://veja.abril.com.br/blog/radar-on-line/internet/telexfree-depois-da-piramide-financeira-agora-esta-as-voltas-com-plagio/]. --[[User:NeilN|'''<font color="navy">Neil<font color="red">N</font></font>''']] <sup>''[[User talk:NeilN|<font color="blue">talk to me</font>]]''</sup> 03:49, 28 January 2014 (UTC)

== all your sources said : "indícios,investigation,possible,speculation,maybe. telexfree is working with ponzi scheme" but never said that is true confirmed with evidence, is just popular poor news... ==

all your sources said : "indícios,investigation,possible,speculation,maybe. telexfree is working with ponzi scheme" but never said that is true confirmed with evidence, is just popular poor news... <small><span class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Segago|Segago]] ([[User talk:Segago|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Segago|contribs]]) 18:12, 6 February 2014 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:This is not the "news" opinion, the Ponzi Scheme statment is the opinion of the Finance Ministry, which didn't "suspect", but rather "accused" it of being Ponzi Scheme, as shown in the sources. The article clearly states the current status of the investigation, and the description box list BOTH "Ponzi" and "MMN", which reflects the Neutral view that both alternatives are being considered at the current date.--[[User:Frontiersanders|Frontiersanders]] ([[User talk:Frontiersanders|talk]]) 18:31, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

== Two Minor Quibbles ==

1) I agree with the complainers... it should say ALLEGED ponzi scheme, operation frozen by emergency order from Brazilian court.
:'''Comment:''' The same argument may be used for stating it as Multilevel Martketing. It is not "proven" to be MLM, so it would have to be "ALLEGED" MLM. So the box with BOTH "Ponzi scheme" AND "Multilevel Marketing" is the best way of describing it.--[[User:Frontiersanders|Frontiersanders]] ([[User talk:Frontiersanders|talk]]) 18:27, 18 February 2014 (UTC)



=== Tv Show American Greed Clarification/ Correction? ===
2) There's no proven link between FoneClub and TelexFree except they both involve Sann Rodrigues. To say TelexFree is derived from FoneClub is beyond what's supportable by evidence. You can say though, that TelexFree bears an uncanny resemblance to FoneClub, which was started by the TelexFree top promoter Sann Rodrigues.
Hello there everyone! Big-time fan of con movies and Ponzi scheme documentaries here. I'm watching a repeat episode right now of the CNBC television series known as, [[American Greed | American Greed: Scams, Scoundrels, And Suckers]]. At the intro/onset to their episode about Telexfree, they mentioned it wasn't multi-level marketing [[Multi-level marketing | MLM]], because those are backed by a real and very successful product nearly always (example, [[Amway]]). The television show said that Telexfree was most definitely a [[pyramid scheme]]. As such, isn't it a little surprising that the opening paragraph for this Wikipedia article calls this company a Ponzi scheme ... And doesn't mention "[[pyramid scheme]]" until the opening paragraph's last sentence?! [[User:Vid2vid|Vid2vid]] ([[User talk:Vid2vid|talk]]) 07:19, 30 May 2019 (UTC)


>TelexFree is a multi-faceted scam and it's difficult to put a single label on it. TelexFree is generally considered a Ponzi scheme because of its AdCentral scheme. The participants pay a membership fee $299 for "AdCentral" which allows them to act as advertising agent for TelexFree: by spamming a link with a referral code SOMEWHERE on the Internet each day. And if you do this 7 days in a row, you get $20 back. So potentially, you pay $299, spam one link for 365 days, you get $1040 per year back.
3) Is there any link between Sann Rodrigues and DiskAvontade, the predecessor of TelexFree / Common Cents? I mean, the phone cards sold by FoneClub had to come from somewhere, right?


But Telexfree ALSO pays referral commission for each member who buys AdCentral package.
[[User:Kschang77|Kschang77]] ([[User talk:Kschang77|talk]]) 08:33, 9 February 2014 (UTC)


There is a separate commission structure for selling the phone plan itself, in a multilevel manner as well.
== the Brazilian court order frozen operation by emergency of Ympactus and not telexfree==
the Brazilian court order frozen operation by emergency of Ympactus and not telexfree. and neither can proof nothing about ponzi scheme.[[User:Segago|Segago]] ([[User talk:Segago|talk]]) 06:37, 18 February 2014 (UTC)sega
:"Telexfree has its worldwide operations, excluding Brazil, operated by Telexfree LLC[1][2] Brazilian operations are held by Ympactus Comercial Ltda.[5]" --[[User:NeilN|'''<font color="navy">Neil<font color="red">N</font></font>''']] <sup>''[[User talk:NeilN|<font color="blue">talk to me</font>]]''</sup> 06:48, 18 February 2014 (UTC)


So it's BOTH a Ponzi scheme and a Pyramid scheme.
:NeilN is right. Ympactus was the OFICIAL representation for Telexfree in Brazil at the time of Court suspension (as you can check in ANY of the sources in the article) and "TELEXFREE" is STILL the CURRENT brand name for Ympactus: If you check Brazilian's CNPJ Oficial website (http://www.receita.fazenda.gov.br/pessoajuridica/cnpj/cnpjreva/cnpjreva_solicitacao.asp), type Ympactus CNPJ: 11669325000188, and one can see that "TELEXFREE INC" is STILL the brand name for Ympactus. The article is accurate.--[[User:Frontiersanders|Frontiersanders]] ([[User talk:Frontiersanders|talk]]) 18:23, 18 February 2014 (UTC)


the case in brazil still open [[User:Segago|Segago]] ([[User talk:Segago|talk]]) 19:23, 20 February 2014 (UTC)sega
[[User:Kschang77|Kschang77]] ([[User talk:Kschang77|talk]]) 11:47, 2 March 2022 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 13:47, 19 February 2024


Archives (Index)

This page is archived by ClueBot III.

Tv Show American Greed Clarification/ Correction?

[edit]

Hello there everyone! Big-time fan of con movies and Ponzi scheme documentaries here. I'm watching a repeat episode right now of the CNBC television series known as, American Greed: Scams, Scoundrels, And Suckers. At the intro/onset to their episode about Telexfree, they mentioned it wasn't multi-level marketing MLM, because those are backed by a real and very successful product nearly always (example, Amway). The television show said that Telexfree was most definitely a pyramid scheme. As such, isn't it a little surprising that the opening paragraph for this Wikipedia article calls this company a Ponzi scheme ... And doesn't mention "pyramid scheme" until the opening paragraph's last sentence?! Vid2vid (talk) 07:19, 30 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

>TelexFree is a multi-faceted scam and it's difficult to put a single label on it. TelexFree is generally considered a Ponzi scheme because of its AdCentral scheme. The participants pay a membership fee $299 for "AdCentral" which allows them to act as advertising agent for TelexFree: by spamming a link with a referral code SOMEWHERE on the Internet each day. And if you do this 7 days in a row, you get $20 back. So potentially, you pay $299, spam one link for 365 days, you get $1040 per year back.

But Telexfree ALSO pays referral commission for each member who buys AdCentral package.

There is a separate commission structure for selling the phone plan itself, in a multilevel manner as well.

So it's BOTH a Ponzi scheme and a Pyramid scheme.

Kschang77 (talk) 11:47, 2 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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