Talk:Say Say Say: Difference between revisions

Content deleted Content added

Inline

Latest revision as of 05:38, 5 October 2024

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Say Say Say article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1

Say Say Say is a featured article; it (or a previous version of it) has been identified as one of the best articles produced by the Wikipedia community. Even so, if you can update or improve it, please do so.

This article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page as Today's featured article on October 3, 2012.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
March 22, 2009	Good article nominee	Listed
February 27, 2010	Featured article candidate	Not promoted
March 30, 2010	Featured article candidate	Promoted

Current status: Featured article

This article is rated FA-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:

The Beatles Low‑importance

This Paul McCartney-related article is within the scope of WikiProject The Beatles, which focuses on improving coverage of English rock band The Beatles and related topics on Wikipedia. Users who are willing to participate in the project should visit the project page, where they can join and see a list of open tasks.The BeatlesWikipedia:WikiProject The BeatlesTemplate:WikiProject The BeatlesThe Beatles

Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Songs, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to songs on Wikipedia.

To-do list:

For WikiProject The Beatles

A list of articles needing cleanup associated with this project is available. See also the tool's wiki page and the index of WikiProjects.

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Article requests : Articles on each Beatle tour (Category:The Beatles concert tours). See: Missing articles.
Expand : The Lost Lennon Tapes, notable radio series which has spawned many bootlegs. Apple Records See also: Adopt an article
Stubs : See: Category:The Beatles song stubs
Update : Pics/Graphics wanted: Kenwood.
Verify : Beatle wives
Other : Project: Add {{WikiProject The Beatles}} to the talk pages of all Beatles-related articles. Send a newsletter to members, canvas for new members and coordinate tasks. Enter articles assessed as stubs onto this list, also list articles needing cleanup and other work here.

This article does not yet have a related to do list. If you can think of any ways to improve the article, why not create one?

Michael Jackson Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Michael Jackson, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Michael Jackson on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Michael JacksonWikipedia:WikiProject Michael JacksonTemplate:WikiProject Michael JacksonMichael Jackson
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Pop music Low‑importance

	Pop music portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Pop music, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of articles related to pop music on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Pop musicWikipedia:WikiProject Pop musicTemplate:WikiProject Pop musicPop music
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

R&B and Soul Music Low‑importance

	R&B and Soul Music portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject R&B and Soul Music, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of R&B and Soul Music articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.R&B and Soul MusicWikipedia:WikiProject R&B and Soul MusicTemplate:WikiProject R&B and Soul MusicR&B and Soul Music
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Mr. T?

Mr. T wasn't the carriage driver, and may not even have been in the music video at all. Since this article is starred as a quality article, I'll leave that part alone, but just know that that tidbit is not evident. 72.174.131.123 (talk) 22:56, 30 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Need more clarity on the chronology of their collaborations

In this passage:

"Produced by George Martin, it was recorded during production of McCartney's 1982 Tug of War album, about a year before the release of "The Girl Is Mine", the pair's first duet from Jackson's album Thriller (1982)."

"The pair's first duet" is too confusing. If the rest of the article is correct, "Say Say Say"was the pair's first duet, and since they only had one duet on "Thriller" it's also confusing in that part of the context. I came here to research so I don't want to edit it since I don't know all the facts, but the way it is is at best misleading. Kevintimba (talk) 05:37, 5 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@@ Line 23: / Line 23: @@
 |maindate=October 3, 2012
 }}
+{{WikiProject banner shell|class=FA|1=
-{{WikiProjectBannerShell|1=
-{{WikiProject The Beatles|class=FA|importance=Low|paul=yes|martin=yes|display=Paul McCartney|song=yes|attention=no|needs-infobox=no}}
+{{WikiProject The Beatles|importance=Low|paul=yes|martin=yes|display=Paul McCartney|song=yes|attention=no|needs-infobox=no}}
-{{WikiProject Michael Jackson|class=FA|importance=Low}}
+{{WikiProject Michael Jackson|importance=Low}}
-{{WikiProject Pop music|class=FA|importance=low}}
+{{WikiProject Pop music|importance=low}}
-{{WikiProject R&B and Soul Music|class=FA|importance=low}}}}
+{{WikiProject R&B and Soul Music|importance=low}}
+}}
-== Credits ==
+== Mr. T? ==
+Mr. T wasn't the carriage driver, and may not even have been in the music video at all. Since this article is starred as a quality article, I'll leave that part alone, but just know that that tidbit is not evident. [[Special:Contributions/72.174.131.123|72.174.131.123]] ([[User talk:72.174.131.123|talk]]) 22:56, 30 October 2022 (UTC)
-I was wondering if anyone had any input on the credits on this song.  I was mainly wondering if Ringo Starr played drums.
+== Need more clarity on the chronology of their collaborations ==
-== Info ==
+In this passage:
-*http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=fzzwW8913G0C&pg=PA92&lpg=PA92&dq=%22Say+Say+Say%22&source=bl&ots=q5UXFhR3gP&sig=1gwAQwSSdRj2YGx7jmrhzbgDhKo&hl=en&ei=GZe-SZCvJtWHsAaGkeSkCQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=3&ct=result
-*http://www.boston.com/ae/music/gallery/2008mtv_music_videos?pg=6
+"Produced by George Martin, it was recorded during production of McCartney's 1982 Tug of War album, about a year before the release of "The Girl Is Mine", the pair's first duet from Jackson's album Thriller (1982)."
-Update, I searched Google books and couldn't find anything else. Next I'll do Google news. — [[User:Realist2|<span style="color:#4173E4">'''''R'''''</span>]][[User_talk:Realist2|<span style="color:#D80B0B"><sup>'''''2'''''</sup></span>]] 14:31, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
-:Ok, cheers. '''[[User:Pyrrhus16|<font color="black">Pyrrhus</font>]]'''[[User talk:Pyrrhus16|<font color="#FF0000">16</font>]]''' 14:38, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
+"The pair's first duet" is too confusing. If the rest of the article is correct, "Say Say Say"was the pair's first duet, and since they only had one duet on "Thriller" it's also confusing in that part of the context. I came here to research so I don't want to edit it since I don't know all the facts, but the way it is is at best misleading. [[User:Kevintimba|Kevintimba]] ([[User talk:Kevintimba|talk]]) 05:37, 5 October 2024 (UTC)
-*Worse lyrics in a song, for the year 1983. Source = Anthony Violanti. "Schlock: An Unusually Confused and Nasal Dylan". (August 18, 1996). ''The Buffalo News''.
-*http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20037860_2,00.html
-*"Aside from 'Say Say Say' and 'The Man', both co-written and performed with Michael Jackson, McCartney wastes the rest of the album on bathos and whimsy". Source = "Paul McCartney's New Album Is Just 'Embarrassing Fluff'". (January 15, 1983). ''Lexington Herald-Leader''.
-*"[McCartney] redeemed himself somewhat with the 1983 success of the spunky 'Say Say Say'-another duet with Jackson-but plunged back into wimpdom with '[[No More Lonely Nights]]'". Source = Paul Grein. (January 3, 1988). "Hits That Hurt In Some Cases, That Top 10 Smash Can Smash an Artist's Image". ''Los Angeles Times''.
-**OK, add these in, if they aren't already, then we are [[WP:GAN|ready to go]]. :) — [[User:Realist2|<span style="color:#4173E4">'''''R'''''</span>]][[User_talk:Realist2|<span style="color:#D80B0B"><sup>'''''2'''''</sup></span>]] 11:41, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
-== Conflicting information in The Girl Is Mine article ==
-The year before [recording The Girl is Mine], the duo had '''recorded''' "Say Say Say" and "The Man" for McCartney's fifth solo album, Pipes of Peace (1983).
-From [[The Girl Is Mine]] article with added emphasis. But this article says:
-Prior to '''recording''' "Say Say Say", McCartney had collaborated with Jackson on "The Girl Is Mine", for Jackson's Thriller album. In return, Jackson agreed to record "Say Say Say" for McCartney's Pipes of Peace.
-So both articles claim to be the second duet in terms of when they were recorded. I have no idea which is right. If The Girl is Mine article is right than the Girl Is Mine was recorded second but released first. [[User:Gripdamage|Gripdamage]] ([[User talk:Gripdamage|talk]]) 15:36, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
-:Thanks, I've reworded the section of this article. '''[[User:Pyrrhus16|<font color="black">Pyrrhus</font>]]'''[[User talk:Pyrrhus16|<font color="#FF0000">16</font>]]''' 16:34, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
-::No, it's still wrong - it's saying that they'd already worked on The Girl is Mine. It seems however that Say Say Say was recorded Summer 1981 and The Girl is Mine around April 1982. So despite it being released a year afterwards, Say Say Say was recorded first. I can't change the info as it stands however since there are two refs next to it.--[[User:Tuzapicabit|Tuzapicabit]] ([[User talk:Tuzapicabit|talk]]) 00:06, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
-Surely there must be some way to address obvious conflicts such as this.  If it's wrong, it's wrong.  Shouldn't some weight be given to citations?  You have multiple biographies of both artists saying one thing (which is then even supported by the artists themselves), and the conflicting information is supported by a Rolling Stone rock-n-roll encyclopedia and an online bio of Paul McCartney, written by music critics?  Just because someone made the understandable (and obvious) mistake of using the release date to determine which came first, does not mean that we should accept their mistake as being factual information.--[[User:HomeNot|HomeNot]]  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|undated]] comment added 03:34, 20 October 2013 (UTC)</span><!--Template:Undated--> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
-== Too violent ==
-"Upon its release, the National Coalition of Television Violence classified the music video as too violent to be aired." Really? --[[User:Andreasegde|andreasegde]] ([[User talk:Andreasegde|talk]]) 15:17, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
-:Yes, it might have been to do with the arm wrestle. :) '''[[User:Pyrrhus16|<font color="black">Pyrrhus</font>]]'''[[User talk:Pyrrhus16|<font color="#FF0000">16</font>]]''' 15:22, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
-::There's no violence in the video. I guess they don't know that arm wrestling is a sport, not a crime. [[User:Grundle2600|Grundle2600]] ([[User talk:Grundle2600|talk]]) 14:31, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
-:Thats real weird, Say Say Say has no violence, just a comical energy drink scene.
-[[User:Nikhil121|Nikhil121]] ([[User talk:Nikhil121|talk]]) 9:28, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
-== cameo by some big black dude? ==
-I'm new to (editing) Wikipedia, but that certainly doesnt look right. I can get rid of that, right? [[User:Stevenferdin|Stevenferdin]] ([[User talk:Stevenferdin|talk]]) 08:29, 4 July 2009 (UTC)
-== Location of music video filming ==
-I changed the music video filming location from Los Olivos, California to Los Alamos, California.  I lived in Los Alamos at the time and have first-hand knowledge that it was filmed there.  Los Olivos is a nearby town but was not the primary filming location.  Filming locations in Los Alamos included the Union Hotel and the former train depot (see, for example, the Union Hotel's official website, www.unionhotelvictorianmansion.com, as well as numerous tourism sites which come up in a Google search).
-[[User:Teddy foucault|Teddy foucault]] ([[User talk:Teddy foucault|talk]]) 01:25, 8 August 2011 (UTC)Teddy_foucault
-== cameo in say say say video ==
-Who is the big guy micheal arm wrestles in the say say say video???  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/74.44.147.109|74.44.147.109]] ([[User talk:74.44.147.109|talk]]) 07:07, 10 November 2011 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
-== 7th top ten hit - recheck facts ==
-Jackson was one shy of the Beatles, who charted 9 top 10 hits in 1964.  Six number ones, plus Please Please Me, Do you wanna know a Secret, and Twist and Shout.  dnsla23 22:19, 8 August 2013 (UTC)  <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Dnsla|Dnsla]] ([[User talk:Dnsla|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Dnsla|contribs]]) </span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->dnsla23 18:36, 27 July 2014 (UTC)
-== Stanton vs. Giraldi ==
-Can we discuss this disagreement about whether it's Harry Dean Stanton or Bob Giraldi appearing in the video? The first person to make this change added a primary source (the YouTube video) to back up their claim. I removed it and added two secondary sources (AV Club article and a book by a respected Beatles author) that state it is Stanton in the video. My changes were reverted and a DVD was added as the source for Giraldi. Is this another primary source (just watching the video) or is there something on the DVD actually stating that it is Giraldi? My position is that reliable secondary sources should trump our ability to visually identify who is in the video, which amounts to [[WP:OR]]. You say it is "obviously" Giraldi, but I think it is Stanton. In the end, secondary sources should trump our personal opinions. --[[User:Laser_brain|<font color="purple">'''Laser brain'''</font >]] [[User_talk:Laser_brain|<font color="purple">(talk)</font >]] 14:24, 5 May 2015 (UTC)
-:In the commentary for the "Say Say Say" music video on ''[[The McCartney Years]]'' DVD, at the 3:04 mark McCartney says "that's Bob Giraldi making a little Hitchcock-like cameo performance." Unfortunately, I didn't see anything in the cite AV media template that references the specific content in the DVD being cited. And for comparison's sake, here's a link to a photo of Bob Giraldi circa 1983.[http://davidmcgough.com/photos/thumbs/Bob%20Giraldi,%20Barry%20Manilow%201983,%20NY.jpg] [[User:Piriczki|Piriczki]] ([[User talk:Piriczki|talk]]) 16:29, 5 May 2015 (UTC)
-:: OK, thanks. In that case, it's likely that the sources I presented were repeating misinformation. --[[User:Laser_brain|<font color="purple">'''Laser brain'''</font >]] [[User_talk:Laser_brain|<font color="purple">(talk)</font >]] 16:33, 5 May 2015 (UTC)