Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Personal attacks: Difference between revisions

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This page is currently inactive and is retained for historical reference.
Either the page is no longer relevant or consensus on its purpose has become unclear. To revive discussion, seek broader input via a forum such as the village pump.

This process has been discontinued per this discussion.

The personal attack intervention noticeboard (PAIN), created on 7 October 2005, was intended as a counterpart to the request for intervention against vandalism page. A person with complaints over personal attacks could, after giving warnings, report a personal attacker on this page.

Unfortunately, the noticeboard generated a considerable amount of controversy. While vandalism is usually a clear cut case, and administrator intervention (i.e. blocking) is usually uncontroversial, determining whether a comment is a personal attack, incivil, or just simply blunt and frank, can be quite subjective. That led to a lot of arguments, flame wars, tit-for-tat disputes and wikilawyering on this page. Even after several warnings as well as changes to the header designed to instruct users on how to use this page, this noticeboard continued to deteriorate. Due to this deterioration as well as some particularly poor exchanges in December 2006, the entire page was nominated for deletion, with the result that the noticeboard was closed on 10 January 2007.

The closure of this noticeboard does not mean that personal attacks are tolerated; they should never be. It simply means that complaints over personal attacks are moved to different, and more appropriate venues such as the administrators' noticeboard, dispute resolution or, as a last resort, arbitration.

Procedure

Wikipedia:Personal attack intervention noticeboard/Header

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+{{historical}}
-{{editabuselinks}}<br />
-<!-- Please remove/add HTML comments around {{adminbacklog}}. -->
-{{Wikipedia:Personal attack intervention noticeboard/Header}}
+:'''This process has been discontinued per [[Wikipedia:Miscellany_for_deletion/Wikipedia:Personal_attack_intervention_noticeboard|this discussion]].'''
-== New reports ==
-<!-- Place new reports here -->
+The personal attack intervention noticeboard (PAIN), created on [[7 October]] [[2005]], was intended as a counterpart to [[Wikipedia:administrator intervention against vandalism|the request for intervention against vandalism page]]. A person with complaints over [[wikipedia:no personal attacks|personal attacks]] could, after giving warnings, report a personal attacker on this page.
-=== Squeakbox and Hagiographer ===
-{{user|Squeakbox}} was blocked for a week per his personal attack parole (resulting from arbitration) for writing on his user page that one of his achievements was
-: ''restoring [[José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero]] from the [[NPOV|POV]] of another user who claims to write about saints but who is determined to slur him. '' [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User:SqueakBox&diff=prev&oldid=70752101]
-This is a veiled reference to {{user|Hagiographer}}, who acts exactly like {{user|Zapatancas}}, the other party in arbitration.  Squeakbox modified the reference so it now says,
-:''restoring José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero from the POV of another user who claims to write about saints. ''
-Hgiographer claims this is still a personal attack and changed the user page on his own several times before it was protected.  I would like some idea on whether the revised statement is acceptable or whether it sill constitutes a personal attack. No action is required at this time as Squeakbox is currently blocked for other reasons. [[User talk:Thatcher131|Thatcher131 (talk)]] 12:41, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
+Unfortunately, the noticeboard generated a considerable amount of controversy. While [[Wikipedia:vandalism|vandalism]] is usually a clear cut case, and administrator intervention (i.e. blocking) is usually uncontroversial, determining whether a comment is a personal attack, incivil, or just simply blunt and frank, can be quite [[subjectivity|subjective]]. That led to a lot of arguments, flame wars, tit-for-tat disputes and [[Wikipedia:WikiLawyering|wikilawyering]] on this page. Even after several warnings as well as changes to the header designed to instruct users on how to use this page, this noticeboard continued to deteriorate. Due to this deterioration as well as some particularly poor exchanges in December 2006, the entire page was [[wikipedia:miscellany for deletion|nominated for deletion]], with the result that the noticeboard was closed on {{#formatdate:10 January 2007}}.
-==Open reports==
-<!-- Place reports below this line only after there has been reply to the report -->
+The closure of this noticeboard does not mean that personal attacks are tolerated; they should never be. It simply means that complaints over personal attacks are moved to different, and more appropriate venues such as the [[Wikipedia:administrators' noticeboard|administrators' noticeboard]], [[wikipedia:dispute resolution|dispute resolution]] or, as a last resort, [[Wikipedia:requests for arbitration|arbitration]].
-=== {{user|El Gringo}} ===
+===Procedure===
-NB - this user has immediately removed both my NPA warnings on his talk page: [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3AEl_Gringo&diff=74009903&oldid=73841054] [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3AEl_Gringo&diff=74034644&oldid=74032729].
+[[Wikipedia:Personal attack intervention noticeboard/Header]]
+[[Category:Wikipedia failed proposals|Personal attack intervention noticeboard]]
-The personal attacks in question are here: [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:United_Kingdom&diff=prev&oldid=73840428] and [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:British_Isles_%28terminology%29&diff=prev&oldid=74030292].
+[[Category:Wikipedia archives|Personal attack intervention noticeboard]]
-As you will see, the user in question is acting very belligerently towards those he considers "British", in what I consider to be a racialist manner.  [[User:Gsd2000|Gsd2000]] 23:28, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
-:I have restored the NPA3 template with a message on his talk page explaining why. If he removes the template again and then persists in attacking, he will require either NPA4 or admin attention. [[User:Crimsone|Crimsone]] 23:38, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
-::He's now just removed your addition, citing it as vandalism, again.  [[User:Gsd2000|Gsd2000]] 00:02, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-:::It doesn't matter. The diffs you provided show obvious personal attack, and my message and NPA3 can be seen here at this [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk:El_Gringo&diff=prev&oldid=74042541 diff]. If there is another attack, post a diff of it here, and somebody else will deal with the report taking account of this. :) [[User:Crimsone|Crimsone]] 00:07, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-:::: The User has persisted in making personal attacks [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:United_Kingdom&diff=prev&oldid=74048431]. This now needs, I feel, admin attention for resolution. [[User:Crimsone|Crimsone]] 05:43, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-:::::In the post directly above, El Gringo was called a racist - I can understand a bit of incivility when responding to such an accusation.  Looks like both sides need to cool down. Shell <sup>[[User_talk:Shell_Kinney|babelfish]]</sup> 12:06, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-::::::Agreed - my apologies for missing that. [[User:Crimsone|Crimsone]] 16:37, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-:::::::We should not lose sight of the fact that this user's abuse of British contributors is completely inexcusable, and began long before I used the "r" word.  [[User:Gsd2000|Gsd2000]] 00:59, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-I absolutely agree Gsd2000. All that's been said here to the best of my knowledge is that the diff I gave was not a wonderful example due to the provocation made (as cited above). Never the less, if the user is continues along with unprovoked and obvious personal attacks, the diffs of these will undoubtedly be considered. If not, the warnings can be considered to be heeded as per policy. This doesn't discount the recent [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_comment/El_Gringo RfC] opened about the dispute itself though, which you are more than entitled to add your perspective to if you feel it prudent or worthwhile to do so. :) [[User:Crimsone|Crimsone]] 01:11, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-==={{User|Blake911}}===
-[[User:Blake911]] has repeatedly and fasely accused myself and Jestix of harassing him on his wikipedia talk page. He consistantly edits my warnings on his page, either deleting them[[http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3ABlake911&diff=74073611&oldid=74073575]] or changing them[[http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3ABlake911&diff=74074744&oldid=74073858]] to deface what I have said. He has also outright attacked me using the name [[http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3ABlake911&diff=73889842&oldid=73867517|"super geek"]] to describe me. While this is minor, I let it slide initially, assuming good faith and that my warnings would be heeded. That was not the case however. I hope I made the case easy to read, I've never posted something in this manner before. Regards, <font color="DarkGreen">[[User:Shazbot85|Shazbot85]]</font><sup>[[User talk:Shazbot85|Talk]]</sup> 04:53, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-:Editor given a final warning for personal attacks and removing warnings.  Please let us know if he persists. Shell <sup>[[User_talk:Shell_Kinney|babelfish]]</sup> 04:59, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-::Thanks for such a speedy reply. I'll keep my eyes peeled. <font color="DarkGreen">[[User:Shazbot85|Shazbot85]]</font><sup>[[User talk:Shazbot85|Talk]]</sup> 05:08, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-It appears [[User:Blake911]] is not going to dissist from personal attack, as can be seen here [[http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3ABlake911&diff=74086711&oldid=74086295]] where he further accusses me of harassing action, baselessly and completly falsely. One would be led to believe he is not going to play nice with others and won't stop throwing his fit until people leave his NN articles alone. something that just won't do. Any help is appreciated. Regards, <font color="DarkGreen">[[User:Shazbot85|Shazbot85]]</font><sup>[[User talk:Shazbot85|Talk]]</sup> 06:41, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-'''Addition''' I came accross more of User:Blake911's baseless acusations here [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Jestix]], on  Jestix's talkpage. <font color="DarkGreen">[[User:Shazbot85|Shazbot85]]</font><sup>[[User talk:Shazbot85|Talk]]</sup> 06:47, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-'''See also''' Here [[http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3AArticles_for_deletion%2FBlake_Van_Leer&diff=74088225&oldid=74087960]] for more name calling. <font color="DarkGreen">[[User:Shazbot85|Shazbot85]]</font><sup>[[User talk:Shazbot85|Talk]]</sup> 06:52, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-*Blocked for 24 hours. Shell <sup>[[User_talk:Shell_Kinney|babelfish]]</sup> 12:03, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-==={{user|Indrancroos}}===
-[[User:Indrancroos|Indrancroos]] has turned the indian martial arts discussion page from a discussion about the merits of the article to a discussion about me... he has accused me of racism on multiple occasions, and yet has yet to substantiate anything about any statements that i have said that are racist... he has also supposedly brought in other discussion too... but has yet been able to bring in any statements of racism that i have made... i have attempted to tell him to stop doing this and yet he continues... two whole pages of the discussion panel consist of his ramblings...[[User:Kennethtennyson|Kennethtennyson]] 03:03, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
-:Please supply some [[WP:DIFF|diffs]] for these incidents. [[User:Crimsone|Crimsone]] 03:20, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
-::[[User:Kennethtennyson|Kennethtennyson]] seems to be missing in action, so I will provide the diffs, seeing as how Indrancroos has come after me now that his block for stalking Kennethtennyson has expired: [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:Indian_martial_arts&diff=next&oldid=73325122], [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:Indian_martial_arts&diff=73808729&oldid=73801548], [http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:Indian_martial_arts&diff=73819367&oldid=73817287].
-::[[User:JFD|JFD]] 09:36, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-*Blocked for 48 hours. Editor continued to re-post attacks and harassment (including attempts to track WP editors to other websites) after last block. [[User:Shell_Kinney|Shell]] <sup>[[User_talk:Shell_Kinney|babelfish]]</sup> 12:17, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-=== [[user:fluence|fluence]] ===
-[[user:fluence|fluence]] has requested people attack my talk page here http://217.154.142.24/keane/forum/viewtopic.php?t=35462 and revert edits to [[keane]] that I have made [[User:Richyard|Richyard]] 17:11, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
-*You've warned him about calling for meat puppets and attacking other users; if the editor persists, you may want to use some of the [[WP:DR|dispute resolution]] processes unless its nothing more than blatent personal attacks. [[User:Shell_Kinney|Shell]] <sup>[[User_talk:Shell_Kinney|babelfish]]</sup> 00:09, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-=== [[user:3bulletproof16|3bulletproof16]] ===
-User Shell Kinney removed the original posting of this saying "rm 3bulletproof16 report, JB196 asked to stop harassing this editor," in reference to my reverts of Bullet's talk page. One moderator is telling me one thing and another moderator is telling me another. I have every right to file this report and not have it be deleted until it is addressed accordingly. The explanation given by Shell Kinney is clearly not an example of harassment as moderator Extraordinary Machine has stated to me that "Please do not remove legitimate warnings from your talk page or replace them with offensive content. Removing or maliciously altering warnings from your talk page will not remove them from the page history. You're welcome to archive your talk page, but be sure to provide a link to any deleted legitimate comments. If you continue to remove or vandalize legitimate warnings from your talk page, you will lose your privilege of editing your talk page." That text can be seen on my talk page. You tell me I cannot revert talk pages, yet another mod tells me I can and not only that I can, but I should. That is an invalid reason for dismissal of my report and for that reason I am reposting it.
-I apologize if reports are not allowed to be reposted once they are dismissed, but it is impossible to know the answer to that question when different moderators enforce different policies.
-As far as Bulletproof, this user violated [[WP:AGF]] on numerous occasions by writing nasty edit summaries directed towards my integrity on the [[Vic Grimes]] page. Just some comments he made include his accusation that I am “[violating] the integrity of Wikipedia” (2:30), that I am “vandalizing” the page (written multiple times as “rv vandalism”), “deliberately attempting to compromise the quality of articles” (2:45), among other slanderous comments which violate [[WP:AGF]]. My edit history on Wikipedia shows that I have made not some but NUMEROUS constructive edits to a wide range of pages, including not only wrestling-related pages but also [[List of trade unions]] (which I helped tremendously by adding category templates for years of establishment). I am clearly out to help Wikipedia and whether or not I am taking his comments too sensitively is irrelevant; this user has cast me out to be a “troll” (http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=User_talk:3bulletproof16&oldid=73889398) among other remarks that clearly lack good faith, yet have not been addressed.
-Thank you very much for your consideration.
-Regards,
-A faithful Wikipedian (contrary to how I was portrayed)
-JB196[[User:JB196|JB196]] 00:32, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-:You've already got threads at AN, ANI, AN3, various article and user talk pages, and even a WikiProject; is this extra report really necessary? [[User:Luna Santin|Luna Santin]] 00:38, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-::Absolutely it is necessary....I am on more than a few occasions being told that I am reporting incidents on the wrong page and being told that they can't help me and I have to go elsewhere (such as reporting 3RR on the main Adminstirators Notification board and being told that theres a subboard for 3RR, among other examples). I am reporting a Personal Attack in the Personal Attack section.[[User:JB196|JB196]] 00:41, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-:::Fair enough; my apologies, I haven't yet taken a deeper look through those threads. [[User:Luna Santin|Luna Santin]] 00:47, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-::::::No problem.[[User:JB196|JB196]] 00:51, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-*Please see [[User talk:JB196|his talk page]] which should quickly clear up what's going on. [[User:Shell_Kinney|Shell]] <sup>[[User_talk:Shell_Kinney|babelfish]]</sup> 00:57, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-**Additionally, please see my response [[User_talk:Shell_Kinney#re:JB196|here]].  JB196 has been counselled by numerous admins and is venue shopping.  This report has no merit. [[User:Shell_Kinney|Shell]] <sup>[[User_talk:Shell_Kinney|babelfish]]</sup> 01:12, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
-:::::::"Note that no legit warnings were removed or reverted from my talk page, only his harassment."
-When you have to make up stories that you know never happened, you know you don't have much of a case. This is a blatant lie. Never did I harass you. Every comment was constructive. Readding constructive comments was the extent of this supposed harassment. If the constructive comments had stayed, there would be no need to remove them, and as Wikipedia administrators have communicated to me, it is not allowed for a person to remove notices from their talk page unless they are blatant vandalism/spamming/trolling, which this was not. The only part of this statement that holds any ground is the "no legit warnings" part, and of course "no legit warnings were removed," being that I never posted any time of formal warning and you can't remove something that was never there in the first place.
-It is 3bulletproof16 who personally attacked and harassed me for upholding Wikipedia Policy. I continue to be greatly offended that this users repeated personal attacks to my integrity are going unachknowledged (let alone dealt with, but it'd be nice to at least have somebody achknowledge them).[[User:JB196|JB196]] 01:33, 7 September 2006 (UTC)