Talk:Nguyễn Ngọc Loan

No photos of VC victims?

I have always wondered why Eddie Adams, the American photog on the spot, was not curious or thorough enough to take a photo of the family that this Viet Cong partisan (he seems not to be in uniform) had murdered earlier. Does anyone know of a photo? It would make a valuable addition to this story about Nguyen Ngoc Loan, which seems almost always to be presented out of context.

There is none. Either Eddie Adams never investigated, or he was prevented from investigating or he did investigate but found there was in fact no bodies. The simple fact is there is no clear evidence Nguyen murdered anyone and I suspect there is a good chance he didn't. No one is denying that atrocities were committed by both sides but there is no reason to assume an atrocity was commited by this particular man when there is no evidence to suggest he did other then a claim by a partisan source after he had been executed Nil Einne 07:00, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Other famous photo?

"would become two of the most famous images in journalism" wheres this other photo?

The other "image" is a film, you knob!--Mofomojo 04:55, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

I'm thinking that the other image is the raising of the flag at Iwo Jima

Where did Loan die?

I have a question too: did Loan die in Washington or in Washington, DC? Meelar 04:30, 28 May 2004 (UTC)

He died in Fairfax County, Virginia (specifically, the community of Burke), where he lived. Fairfax County is in the Washington, DC metropolitan area. —Ryanaxp June 28, 2005 17:49 (UTC)

Possible copyvio

I came across this site here earlier today. Which text predates which? Kouros 13:11, 4 Sep 2004 (UTC)

see Wikipedia:Copies of Wikipedia content (undetermined or disputed compliance). regards, High on a tree 01:02, 7 Sep 2004 (UTC)

That site—thefreedictionary.com—is one of many sites that copies articles from Wikipedia and frames them with various ads. This is permitted under the license used on Wikipedia, but you can be sure that any text presented on that site was originally copied verbatim from the main Wikipedia. —Ryanaxp June 28, 2005 17:49 (UTC)

This execution was in violation of the Geneva convention.

This assertion was added in an edit today, and I removed it as unsupported and POV. It appears the viet cong executed by Loan was conducting armed hostilities dressed as a civilian (in fact most accounts claim he was an infiltrator). Therefore, at most, the viet cong would most likely have been an unlawful combatant who would not have qualified for protection under the Geneva convention. —Ryanaxp June 28, 2005 17:49 (UTC)

BS. The unlawful combatant term was largely non existant until Bush found it and decided to use it. I warn you that if you accept the unlawful combatant term then you except that snipers and many other type of covert soldiers can be considered unlawful combatants. There is also no conclusive evidence for your claim of Nguyen's activities. I have copied the text from the Nguyen Van Lem article. Although I dislike such an extensive copying of text from one article to another, in this case it is needed. Nil Einne 06:44, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Regardless of the date of the term, the concept has been around since before the Geneva Conventions. Spies have been executed in previous rules of war. Furthermore, I find this assertion of yours interesting: "I warn you that if you accept the unlawful combatant term then you except that snipers and many other type of covert soldiers can be considered unlawful combatants."

There's a major difference between snipers in uniform targetting an enemy, and terrorists in civilian clothes who target civilians. And if a U.S. military sniper ever does fight while wearing civilian clothes, there is no doubt he would not be granted rights as a legitimate combatant under the Geneva Conventions. Nor would I expect any third parties to be arguing strenuously on his behalf. So your warning is meaningless.

And what difference would it make anyway? The U.S. and its coalition allies are the only ones who do recognize the Geneva Conventions nowadays. With all the protests going on now, there are very few who even give a damn about Iraqi civilians being killed by terrrorists. And if they're not going to demand that little bit of decency, I see the odds that any of them will demand Geneva Conventions for uniformed soldiers is laughable.

In any case, I request that you revise your edits.

-- Randy2063 15:36, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Please provide references to substantiate the circumstances of his capture, and his status under the Geneva Conventions. Thanks. Edison 22:41, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

ARVN generals

ARVN generals seems more like something that belongs as a category than in the article. Since this category does not yet exist, I won't yet erase the section. Ruy Lopez 28 June 2005 18:04 (UTC)

Timeframe of the photo?

I've always wondered, in the famous single frame, has the execution shot been fired, or is it about to be fired? If anyone has this information, it should probably go in the article. Suntiger 15:28, 22 July 2005 (UTC)

It is before the shot is fired. The most famous photo is actually one in a sequence of several photos shot directly before and following the execution—I learned this and saw the relevant photos in an excellent photographic book by two journalists who covered the war (I'll try to get the title, authors' names and ISBN if I remember to do so when I go home after work). —Ryanaxp 18:09, July 22, 2005 (UTC)

I don't think this is true. I've read that analysis of this photo shows splinters exiting the man's head. Certainly, the man is being affected by some force, and his head already looks misshapen, and the trigger finger is already back. One could assert that the photo shows is a shockwave prior to impact but it is highly unlikely that the picture could have been taken after the shot had been 'started' and before impact. Simply, the shutter speed would not be fast enough to contain that moment alone. Macgruder

I believe that its after he pulled the trigger, but before the bullet impacted or even left the barrel. His face is proabbly a consequence of the the blast's shockwave.

Article needs clean-up

As it presently stands the article appears to be an incomplete merge of a biography of Loan and an article on the photo itself. There is some repetition and the like that I think needs to be straightened out. I don't think it's bad enough to justify a cleanup tag on the article page. 23skidoo 22:37, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

I think it's just fine. Look at the David Pearl article. Genjix 17:26, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

Then where's the blood?

Here is the Video of the execution

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqAWoIFoYcY —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.6.206.16 (talk) 05:36, 13 January 2007 (UTC).