Talk:Aum Shinrikyo

Note about 'cult-bashers'

It also seems important to note that there are groups usually called 'cult-bashers' that collect and later distribute the smear material on religious groups they call 'cults'. Example of such group: Cult Awareness Network. Besides smearing the 'cults' these entities label the scholars suspected in 'sympathising the cults' in being 'cult sympathisers' and smear them as well (usually so-called 'character assassination' is involved, when scholar is accused being a bad citized, drug addict etc.). I would very much like these people to keep their research to themselves and not produce it here, but given the nature of open source this is not always feasible. 'Cult-bashers' is a separate problem for scholars in itself, as they tend to provide information that look legitimate and to attack sholars focused more on research than activism.

Comments on the "During its most successful period" passage

Another difficulty is how to classify the doctrine. There always are a lot of PhDs that offer their expert opinion on what Aum's doctrine is (i.e. 'a mixture of..'), usually not bothering to read even the several books that were translated into English (the full collection is several bookshelves in Japanese). Let me comment the following passage:

During its most successful period, Aum Shinrikyo was a new religious group (did it ceased to be new or religios since then?), often described as a cult (true, but a repetition), centered on the charismatic leader Shoko Asahara (debatable and not very informative). Asahara's teachings (incorrect label, Asahara did not write the Pali Canon, so we cannot say the Canon is his teachings) combined elements of Buddhism and Hinduism (simplistic and not accurate) as well as millenarian Christianity (wrong), including yoga (yoga was already mentioned - Hinduism, why repeat), meditation (meditation is a technique, not a religion), and Qi Gong breathing exercises (Qi Gong is not 'breathing excercise', it's static postures, there are also moves, there are some breathing rules, similar to 'kata' in Karate. Qi Gong is part of Taoism, which was mentioned in my edition of the article) Central to the group's teachings was that the apocalypse is near (popular belief, but wrong. Central to the teachings are original buddhist sutras, the Pali Canon). The name "Aum Shinrikyo" derived from the Hindu mantra "Aum", followed by a Japanese word meaning "supreme truth" (true). /// Note: not much factual data, many lame passages, a lot seems to be said just to make the group seem weirder.

I am writing this comment to outline problems that are hard to avoid when dealing with the subject and to find consensus on how to improve the article. In other worlds, I think that stuff like doctrine is better discuss here and then make amendments.

Description of crimes

Same to crimes. Does it makes any sense to describe the sufferings of victims at such lenghth (almost a half of the text)? Will we post the detailed report on how exactly Mr Clinton had sex with that Ms Levinsky on Clinton's article (half of the text)? I suggest just to state who was killed.

'On October 31, 1989, a lawyer working against Aum Shinrikyo, Tsutsumi Sakamoto, successfully persuaded Shoko Asahara to submit to a blood test to test for the "special power" that the leader claimed was present throughout his body. He found no sign of anything unusual. To prevent the disclosure of this outcome' /// The blood test and 'special power' is simplistic and untrue. Tsutsumi Sakamoto, to my knowledge was a lawyer who tried something like mega-lawsuit Japanese-style against Aum and was very active in that. Monks in Aum severe ties with families, so their relatives (such as fathers, mothers etc.), with help of Sakamoto, sought 'compensation' (money) for the fact that they cannot live with them as they used to (moral damage) and funds they were receiving when relatives supported them financially (financial damage). Sakamoto was their lawyer, who received percentage of the sums. Of course, Sakamoto probably also tried to 'expose Aum' as lawyers do, but Aum was 'exposed' many thousand times before by almost every major newspaper or TV station in Japan. Compensations could make Aum bankrupt. So this is the facts, but I suggest deleting everything except the fact that Sakamoto was murdered and what Sakamoto did shortly before the murder. Otherwise, we could safely try not only describe Mr Clinton's affair in naturalistic details, but also write on reasons Ms Levinsky was so attractive to him in length.

External links

Removed the Apologetics Index Weblog again (previously it was removed by Gary D). Reason: it is almost identical (examples of exceptions below) to CESNUR's collection of newspaper articles, a link to which we already have.

Also removed the Apologetics Index link as well. This is an "online Christian ministry" aiming to "provide Christians with information on cults and sects", i.e. a Christian anti-cult website (it also has a specific section on "Aum apologists", as well as on "cult sympathysers" in general). Since there is no evidence that any staff member of this group has ever met Aum members alive and since all the links listed by the AI are available elsewhere, I suggest inserting direct links.

The following two articles are present at CESNUR, but not AI:

• [[1]]
• [[2]]

Religious News Blog and compensations fund

As regards the recent changes (which involved links to Religious News Blog, previously removed 3 times from "see also" section), I will try to incorporate additions, but not incorrect info. Let me comment on the following passage:

"[v]ictims of the March 1995 sarin gas attacks on the Tokyo subway and other crimes committed by the AUM Shinrikyo cult urged the government Wednesday to act swiftly and comprehensively on the issue of compensation, which remains unresolved after nine years." The report pointed out that AUM had been "ordered to pay compensation to its victims. However, the cult is apparently short of funds, while those directly involved in the crimes do not have the capacity to pay." (Kyodo News Service)

In fact, Aum Shinrikyo paid everything it could and was declared bankrupt as a result (that is why "the cult" is "short of funds", because it does not exist anymore). A new successor organization has been established, under name Aleph and it can not be "ordered" to pay any debts of Aum Shinrikyo, obviously. However, Aleph *voluntarily* established a compensations fund to pay compensations to victims. There were reports in the media pointing to insufficient *government* support to victims, including medical and financial, but this has nothing to do with "acting swiftly" with "the cult", because it has already being paid fully and the new organization is not responsible for any outstanding debts(see above). Therefore, as this passage is misleading, I will remove it.

Apologetics Index: Under Surveiilance Passage

Replaced links to Apologetincs Index (a countercult website maintained by an "online Christian ministry") - over 6 total, some repeating - with direct links to sources.

Miscellaneous minor edits

Removed the sentence on nuclear weapons development and attempts to acquite uranium (lack of credible evidence). To the best of my knowledge, suspicions and theories regarding attempts to buy uranium in Africa and extract in Australia were not confirmed.

Changed around some wording. Under Activities, "It had been founded by" becomes "Founded by". "young elite universities graduates" becomes "young graduates from elite universities". Gaius Octavius Atellus

Added: info on Aleph'2005

Information on reformers and fundamentalists, although scarce, has appeared at least several times in Japanese press starting the summer of 2005, so I condider it worth mentioning. The extent of disagreements is unclear, so I chose not to speculate this time.

Unexplained addition

Shogo Amakusa, leader of the renegade Christians in the Christian Arc of the anime Rurouni Kenshin, is likely based on Shoko Asahara.

Author of this, please elaborate on the meaning of this passage, what exactly in Mr Amagusa was based on Asahara? the character in that anime movie resembles him or something else? I will try to investigate and if found relevant enough, rephrase. Otherwise will remove. This perhaps makes sense to leave as Aum affair influenced the popular culture... but frankly religious theme is recent animes are so closely attached to Japanese version of reality that I remember a few more movies where I could find similarities... It would be great if you could provide some more examples or materials on this 'cultura;' aspects, especially J-Pop and anime mass cultureExitControl

March 21 edits

Removed various additions such as this one:

"Although Aum/Aleph often use terminology appropriated from Sanskrit and Tibetan Buddhist doctrine, they attribute meanings to these terms which are shorn of their original contexts and often bear little resemblance to the original doctrines"

I believe we may say that "some critics say or believe" this. Didn't rephrase because most similar additions attempt to picture the group worse it already was while the information itself is of doubtful quality or isn't an information at all (rather author's opinion). Another good example is expanding the 'doctrine' part with sentences sayings that 'Asahara' is an assumed name and he is currently in prison (it is already stated where it should). Lastly, if someone has so much time and determination as to replace 'argued' to 'unfoundently claimed', please think about others (namely me) who has to go thru each sentence and clean it up not to destroy the valuable imput of others who made contributions later :-) If I spoiled your term paper this way, what would you say to me? :-) Couldn't you find a less destructive way to express your POV?

Contacted North Korea? No proof

Replaced the following:

"Right-wing groups also are reported to dislike Aleph due to Aum's previous attempt to contact North Korea to acquire the weapons they eventually acquired from Russia". [3]

There are many allegations and ideas regarding many things, but as in many of such cases there is absolutely no proof that any Aum member contacted North Korea with anything, there is also no proof that any weapons were acquired from whatever source, including Russia the country. Besides, the page linked does not deal with any weapons matters at all.

As to Japan's right wing protesters, they dislike many things that they consider foreign to Japan's traditional values - America for defeating Japan in WWII and U.S. bases in Okinawa, Russian embassy for not giving back Kuril islands, Koreans for taking low-profile Jobs etc, Chinese for this and that etcetera. Their standard technique of 'peaceful protest' incudes a sort of audio-terrorism, when high-decibel noise is produced from powerful loudspeakers (this is considered legal in Japan). As regards to Aum, these protestations are understandably very unpleasant to Aum's neighbors and obviously the landlords.

As to North Korea. Couple of years ago, a lay Aum follower fled to North Korea where she sought political asylum. This way she tried to get rid of harassment by PSIA, the security service whose main duty is 'to monitor Aum Shinrikyo' which it believes 'remain a serious threat' (before Aum-related incidents there were plans to disband the Agency). The agency tried to convince the woman to spy on Aum from within and threatened with some consequences in case she refuses. The woman has lived in Pyongyang's hotel and finally decided to return back. In her words, secret service agents, now North Korean, were constantly keeping eye on her and basic necessities to which she got used in Japan (such as lipstick) were impossible to obtain. All this story came up in quite idiotic manner when she returned, but initially it was reported by the papers that her trip to North Korea was somehow a grim plot by Aum to establish contact with 'evil regime'. Conclusion: read carefully and double cross-check. ExitControl

Meaningless passage removed

"An American woman, Bridget Melbane, who many believed to be affiliated with the group, was extradited back to Japan after committing several crimes in the US involving stalking and harassment. Her affiliation as of December 19, 2006 could not be verified."

Since the affiliation of that woman 'could not be verified' I suppose we shouldn't put this information into the article? Actually in Japan there was a larger-scale incident where Aum affiliation was suggested by the media: the Boeing 747 hijacking in Hakodate. It later became apparent that the hijacker had no connection whatsoever with Aum and never had, but at the time usual headline read like this: 'member of the outlawed Aum sect (never outlawed) hijacks a Japanese Boeing 747 with 365 passengers on board at the airport in northern Hakodate (correct), demanding the release of the sect's jailed leader (again, never demanded)'.

ALL OF YOU - SIGN YOUR POSTS!!!! 50.111.6.31 (talk) 05:59, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

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