Talk:Sandwich

"Samwidge" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Samwidge. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. TheAwesomeHwyh 02:08, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

This Is The Most Valid Definition Of A Sandwich

sandwiches - two separate pieces of what is typically bread with some sort of food that is not the same as the outer pieces separating the two.

Therefore: Hotdogs are not sandwiches. Open bread sandwiches are NOT sandwiches. (Including Toast, PB & J without the other piece, etc.) Burritos are NOT sandwiches. Pizza is NOT a sandwich. Anything that conforms to these expectations are sandwiches. Anything that differs is NOT a sandwich.

I did not cite a source, because I am the one who wrote this. Does this mean that this definition is incorrect? No. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Caillou.guac (talk • contribs) 21:14, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

I care less about correctness than I do about accuracy. This definition doesn't account for hoagies, submarines or pocket sandwiches, and it willfully excludes open sandwiches, all of which are described as sandwiches by reliable sources. That's the problem with original research: something one person made up just isn't going to be as accurate a representation of the facts as would be an aggregation of reliable, independent sources. Ibadibam (talk) 02:51, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

@Caillou.guac: I agree with Ibadibam, we don't do OR here and we go by sources. You will need to convince the wider world to accept your definition before it will appear here. I'd note that as always any definition falls apart at the edges. "Hot dogs are not sandwiches" except by that definition, if you cut the bun completely through it is, and despite what our article suggests, I'm fairly sure this is done in some places (tried a quick search but it's difficult due to debates over cutting the bread sideways or topways as well as questions over how commercial hot dog buns are cut) yet the item may otherwise have limited differences between something else called a hot dog which is evidently not a sandwich. Similarly submarine sandwich and rolls, the bread can be cut through completely, but it can also be not cut through completely in some cases. Likewise if you fold over a single piece of sliced bread, say with ham and cheese or peanut butter or marmite, it's not a sandwich. If you eat or cut the fold, cut it before you fold it (at least I assume so since a definition which excludes cutting a presliced bread in half as 2 separate pieces of bread seems to get into even more complexities) or use two slices of bread, this is a sandwich. Yet the difference between these 2 is remarkably small. And notably the first case, raises the point that if you're eating such a non-sandwich, all you have to do is eat the fold and suddenly the non sandwich you're eating becomes a sandwich, whoops. If for some reason you include folding over the bread without cutting as 2 separate pieces, this raises the question even more why a hot dog bun or bread roll or whatever not cut completely through is not counted but your folded bread is. The sausage sizzle of course also generally uses folded bread. Then of course you have to consider wraps etc. Nil Einne (talk) 08:21, 16 September 2020 (UTC)

Why does the definition in the article include "wrapper" when the first two references [1][2] specifically are counter two that?

Re reference 1, the court case concerning White City in Massachusetts, that concluded that a sandwich is made with two slices of bread. Therefore an item such as a burrito is not a sandwich. Re reference 2, the dictionary definition cited also mentions two slices of bread.

Why include "wrapper" and then cite two references that are counter to that? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.203.79.134 (talk) 16:19, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Earliest date for pre-packaged sandwiches

The debunk of Marks and Spencer's being the first to market pre-packed sandwiches is sourced to two subsequent editions of the Radio Times, which I assume could only be the letters page. Readers writing to a magazine to say how they remember something differently would not be a reliable enough source to downgrade the weight of a researched Guardian story. Pinging Bkesselman (talk · contribs) to ask if they can clarify, but I'll remove the Radio Times sourced content for now. --Lord Belbury (talk) 09:16, 14 September 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for this Lord Belbury (talk · contribs) I can't find the references I looked at before to check if they were indeed on the RT letter pages or not - they may have been. However, a quick search of the British Newspaper Archive shows that the Cheshire Observer - Friday 06 December 1974 reported that a woman from Chester pleaded guilty at Chester Magistrate's Court to stealing "a pack of sandwiches" (value 12p) from British Home Stores. She had been seen taking "the sandwich pack from a display". I think that the 1980 M&S date is not safe. But I'm happy that you should make any adjustment to the article you choose.Bkesselman (talk) 11:18, 14 September 2020 (UTC)

Agreed, that does seem enough to question it. It's possible the Guardian article is drawing a deliberate distinction by referring to the invention of the "chilled packaged sandwich", and looking for other sources Bee Wilson's Sandwich: A Global History goes further by referring to purpose-built boxes being an M&S innovation. I'll see what I can do. --Lord Belbury (talk) 11:41, 14 September 2020 (UTC)

Infobox image

Perhaps this is a bet western-centric of me, but the headline image for this article doesn't seem to be particularly appetizing. While I know that this isn't any kind of requirement for a food article, I feel like we could just do better.

At some point in 2013 the image in question for the infobox image was a lovely image of a salmon and cream cheese sandwich. At some point, this image was relegated to the gallery and the image was in the infobox was changed to a picture of a woman holding a salami sandwich. This image wasn't great, so it was later changed to a BLT after a mention on the talk page a few years ago. In late 2020, it was changed to the not very tasty looking egg sandwich we have today. The reasoning for this change was valid, however, I think it lowered the overall quality of the page.

I'm not entirely certain what image would work best, so I thought it would be ideal to reach out to the maintainers of this page and food wiki in general and solicit some thoughts. Let's do sandwiches the justice they deserve. :) --allthefoxes ^(Talk) 07:57, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

That 2020 edit was from me, replacing File:BLT sandwich on toast.jpg because I felt that photo was too tightly cropped to one corner of the sandwich, and was depicting a sandwich made with toast when the article lead defines it as "slices of bread" and the wider article barely mentions toasting at all. I agree that the egg sandwich isn't a very appealing one, but it was the best one I could find on commons that fairly illustrated the text of the lead. I'd say it still beats the earlier image of File:Salmon Cream Cheese Sandwiches.jpg for being plain "slices of bread" rather than a baguette, but would be happier to see a more appetising photo that met the article's definition of "typically consisting of vegetables, sliced cheese or meat, placed on or between slices of bread". --Lord Belbury (talk) 19:17, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 March 2021

The picture of a sandwich is actually a roll. The article gives a clear definition of the distinction between the two, yet fails to apply this. The picture should be changed to a sandwich made of TWO SLICES OF BREAD 89.168.225.2 (talk) 21:37, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Twassman | Talk | Contribs 21:44, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

"Turkey and cheese" listed at Redirects for discussion

A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Turkey and cheese. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 July 9#Turkey and cheese until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. _signed, Rosguill ^talk 15:39, 9 July 2021 (UTC)