Talk:Parri government: Difference between revisions

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Requested move 17 December 2022

The request to rename this article to Parri government has been carried out.

If the page title has consensus, be sure to close this discussion using {{subst:RM top|'''page moved'''.}} and {{subst:RM bottom}} and remove the {{Requested move/dated|…}} tag, or replace it with the {{subst:Requested move/end|…}} tag.

– In line with what was already established in Talk:Meloni government, all Italian governments should have the same title format. Scia Della Cometa (talk) 22:21, 17 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Support as the correct term in Italian is governo, not gabinetto and for obvious reasons of consistency, per nominator. --Checco (talk) 07:48, 18 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose the replacement of Cabinet with government but support the numbering part of the proposal. All these articles are specifically about the cabinets as that term is used in English, one aspect of government as that term is used in English. Government is a broader topic in English. What the correct term is in Italian is irrelevant as this English WP. DeCausa (talk) 11:39, 18 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- @User:DeCausa: You are probably unaware of the fact that all governments of Italy since 1945 have already been moved to the "Xxxx format" and that several similar articles include "government", not "cabinet" (see Template:EU governments). "Government" is perfectly OK for "cabinet" in English, otherwise we would not have Template:Governments of Ireland and several other examples. However, it is true that we should have a naming convention on governments (it is not OK to have some articles on governments named with the "Xxxx government" and others with the "Xxxx cabinet" format). --Checco (talk) 13:53, 18 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  - WP:OTHERCONTENT. None of that changes my view. In English, "X Government" for a list of cabinet members, which all of these articles are, is misleading and I oppose it. DeCausa (talk) 14:06, 18 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    - @DeCausa I understand your reasoning, but there is an evident problem of consistency between articles of the same type. This is my main concern, consistency is too important in my view. You are right that these articles only list cabinet members (i.e. only ministers), but this issue affects articles concerning all governments up to the 1990s. Changing the title of each page depending on which government members are listed in the article it would become too complex, am I wrong? --Scia Della Cometa (talk) 22:34, 18 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support. I would also accept "X ministry". "Cabinet" is a peculiar technical term of Anglo-American politics, not language. It is weird to talk about Italian "cabinets" but British "ministries", where the term 'cabinet' only exists in the latter, while the former uses "council of ministers". Moreover, the current title is poor language usage - as we don't refer to "X cabinet", but the possessive "X's cabinet". ("Lincoln's cabinet", not "Lincoln cabinet"). I would support the extrication of the "cabinet" term not only from he titles all the Italian government articles, but also wherever else they appear here (e.g. there are a few French ones). I am a bit ambivalent between "X government" and "X ministry", but both are undoubted improvements over "x cabinet". But given the consensus on Talk:Meloni government for post-war Italian governments, I would support the same "X government" format for pre-war governments for consistency. Walrasiad (talk) 23:54, 18 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support per nom.--Ortizesp (talk) 00:59, 19 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@@ Line 82: / Line 82: @@
 ****@[[User:DeCausa|DeCausa]] I understand your reasoning, but there is an evident problem of consistency between articles of the same type. This is my main concern, consistency is too important in my view. You are right that these articles only list cabinet members (i.e. only ministers), but this issue affects articles concerning all governments up to the 1990s. Changing the title of each page depending on which government members are listed in the article it would become too complex, am I wrong? --[[User:Scia Della Cometa|Scia Della Cometa]] ([[User talk:Scia Della Cometa|talk]]) 22:34, 18 December 2022 (UTC)
 * '''Support'''.  I would also accept "X ministry". "Cabinet" is a peculiar technical term of Anglo-American politics, not language.  It is weird to talk about Italian "cabinets" but British "ministries", where the term 'cabinet' only exists in the latter, while the former uses "council of ministers".  Moreover, the current title is poor language usage - as we don't refer to "X cabinet", but the possessive "X's cabinet". ("Lincoln's cabinet", not "Lincoln cabinet").  I would support the extrication of the "cabinet" term not only from he titles all the Italian government articles, but also wherever else they appear here (e.g. there are a few French ones).  I am a bit ambivalent between "X government" and "X ministry", but both are undoubted improvements over "x cabinet".  But given the consensus on [[Talk:Meloni government]] for post-war Italian governments, I would support the same "X government" format for pre-war governments for consistency. [[User:Walrasiad|Walrasiad]] ([[User talk:Walrasiad|talk]]) 23:54, 18 December 2022 (UTC)
+*'''Support''' per nom.--[[User:Ortizesp|Ortizesp]] ([[User talk:Ortizesp|talk]]) 00:59, 19 December 2022 (UTC)