Talk:Alicia Keys

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Cite sources

"Critical reviews were mostly positive, though many found Keys derivative, with a sound reminiscent of 1970s soul singers like Curtis Mayfield and Marvin Gaye with hip hop influences that were less original than similar blends from nu soul artists like Lauryn Hill, Erykah Badu and D'Angelo."

Who are these "many"? Please avoid "weasel words" and cite sources. It's probably true that someone said this, but we should say who said what. --Sketchee 03:16, Dec 19, 2004 (UTC)

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Original version:

Alicia Keys is a singer-songwriter born January 25, 1981 in Harlem, New York, New York.

Keys plays multiple instruments and is a classically trained pianist; she is noted for her emotive voice, which set her apart from other popular American singers after she achieved fame in the late 1990s. Keys attended the Professional Performance Arts School, and Columbia University (at the age of 16).

Having signed a contract with Arista Records, she followed Arista president Clive Davis to J Records, where her multi-platinum album "Songs in A Minor", was released. The single "Fallin" was a large hit, and she was nominated for several Grammy Awards.

Links

• CNN bio
• Alicia Keys Fan.Com

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I spent 10 minutes searching, and there is no "Professional Performance Arts School" listed anywhere, except in hundreds of Alicia Keys biographies, all almost word-for-word the same. I don't know what else is made up about this pop singer.

Let's start over with the FACTS we know. Anything that just appears in a PR release, cite as "According to XYZ Record Company, she attended Columbia University ..."

The "Fame" school isn't called "Professional Performance Arts School", by the way, although it is indeed a professional performing arts school.

--Uncle Ed

• Ugh. Real musicians don't have to pad their resumès. -- goatasaur
  • I wonder if I should call up the principal of the school and ask who was valedictorian in 1996? --Uncle Ed
    • Somehow I doubt she attended Columbia U. at the age of sixteen. It takes a lot of work to prematurely graduate grades, especially two years' worth. I smell crap. -- goatasaur

Who says she skipped two years? Many people who don't skip grades start college a few months before they turn eighteen, so if she started a few months before turning seventeen (her birthday is in January) she would only have skipped one year.

Yeah, the bio I found (instead of the CNN puff piece) makes it sound more like she signed with Columbia Records than attended Columbia University -- not that I'm saying she didn't, of course. I know people at LaGuardia High School -- if that's the "Fame" school her publicity keeps harping on -- and I guess I'll have to ask them if Alicia Keys ever attended or spoke there. --Uncle Ed

See my note below. --Uncle Ed

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alicia keys also sites a teacher at the Professional Performance Arts School in Manhattan who, while she was majoring in Choir, gave her valuable instruction on her voice. "This teacher spent so much time with me, she became the closest thing to vocal training I received," alicia keys recalls.

I found hundreds of articles all misspelling "cites" as "sites", as above. So I am, if not suspicious, at least incredulous. --Ed

I agree. That would be a well-known fact if it were true, I think (would have been drilled into every American's skull during the advertising blitzkrieg about her actually writing songs and playing on her own albums, as if that wasn't standard for the last thirty years or so). Her biography (at aliciakeys.net) says (or implies) that it is so, but I still have grave doubts. It also says she is influenced by Wu-Tang Clan, which is utterly incomprehensible to me (and one of my best friend's friend loves Keys, so I've heard her whole album). May as well say she's influenced by Pat Boone or Ali Farka Toure, so I certainly won't accept that as a source. Tuf-Kat 04:34 Apr 3, 2003 (UTC)

Geez, are we bitter much? This article seems unreasonably harsh. -- Zoe

Yeah, I'm having second thoughts now. I finally found a website that got the high school's name right:

"By age nine, Alicia could paly sonatas by Mozart and Chopin. At 12, she got into New York City's High School for the performing Arts (which Fame made famous) she graduated as valedictorian in 1996. "

...although the spelling and capitalization is a little off. Maybe I'm placing too much emphasis on credentials, anyway. --Ed

Sounds better, but I think the :highly derivative" in the article still should go. -- Zoe

I just made a few changes -- does it seem better? (highly derivative is still there, though I could accept the removal of highly without much problem). It's hard to write about something so inherently POV as musical influences in a NPOV way, but there is a large faction of critics and listeners who think Keys and other label-hyped "original" artists don't do anything D'Angelo didn't do ten times better five years before. Feel free to revise as needed. Tuf-Kat

I can accept Zoe's compromise. Tuf-Kat

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Okay, I did my research. Alicia Keys attended PPAS, which is another high school in Manhattan -- not the "Fame school" mentioned in several on-line bio pieces. --Uncle Ed 18:21 Apr 8, 2003 (UTC)

Alicia Augello Cook

We should add her other name, Alicia Augello Cook.--Sonjaaa 03:35, Sep 17, 2004 (UTC)]]]]]]]]

Sorry if I ask... I'm an Italian Alicia's fan. Does anybody know WHY she choose KEYS as artistic name? Please answer.... SMKL

Alicia has taken the last name: "Keys", because she thought it would be cool since she was able to play the piano. And still has since she was just a little girl! Wonderful, beautiful, sexy soul star that will always be top-charted! -Rodney

I read somewhere that had another middle name, "Joseph". Weird, I know. Can anyone else verify this info? TamYum 03:51, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Joseph? I see a J have ben added in the article. So, the info has been verified?

She attended P.S. 116 in Manhattan (K-6) and DID NOT grow up "in poverty."

Copyright violation

The current state of this article looks like a copyright violation from http://www.proactiv.com/celeb/alicia.php, doesn't it? It reads like something a professional publicist has written, not a WP editor. Wasted Time R 21:23, 3 August 2005 (UTC)

I've reverted the main text back to the last version before the copyvio was added. The subsequent sections (discography, awards, etc.) were unaffected. Wasted Time R 21:38, 3 August 2005 (UTC)

I think she is both but she is puerto rican.

UMMMM, QzDaddy, if her mother is white and her father is Jamaican, that doesn't make her African American because her black heritage isn't from America. And the term Mulatto is still in use because if someone, like me, is half black and half white, what are we if we aren't Mulatto? Plus census still refers to us as Mulattoes.

Voice

please can someone add her vocal range and profile

sort

the records etc are sorted from old to new. The tours in reverse order. shoudn't this be the same? Aleichem 13:55, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

all fixed :) Sarz 03:30, 14 October 2005 (UTC)

your right on point...Jamaicans call themselves Jamaicans. Key is a Jam'Merican. Jamaicans would just call her Mix, or redbone.

I was reading young voices, and it clearly states in an interview with her that she is not actually Jamaican. Her mother is white Irish - Italian, and her father is black African - American. So can we please change the incorrect facts. Lauren.I.Machel 17:25, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Keys also became the first female R&B artist to have three consecutive number one debuts on the Billboard 200 album chart in as many releases.

This was edited, Janet Jackson was the first female R&B artist to have 3 #1 debuts on the Billboard 200 (janet., The Velvet Rope, and All For You). She's is also the only female artist to score 5 back to back #1 hits albums on the chart.OperativePhrase 02:18, 14 November 2005 (UTC) 'However it is correct Key is the first R&B female singer to her first 3 albums hit #1 as "Janet" is NOT Janet jackson's first lp but her third following "Janet Jackson" and "Dream Street" which did not hit top of the charts.'

No. janet. is NOT Janet Jackson's third album as a solo artist. That would be Control. She released two unsuccessful albums (Janet Jackson and Dream Street) before hooking up with producers Jimmy Jam & Terry Lewis and coming out with Control in 1986. See: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000002GFE/002-2717084-9816042?v=glance&n=5174

-- Jalabi99 04:54, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

Piano history

Did Keys start learning piano at five or seven? The article currently says five, but many websites say seven, and she says "six or seven" in an interview with ASCAP.

She started playing the piano at seven. Remember that people put whatever they feel like in these articles but they are false sometimes. It's good you asked though! Roku 13:25, 9 May 2006 (UTC)Roku

Part of it is probably vandalism, but there have been so many contradictory things put out about Keys by her people and by her herself. Who knows to believe. I quit. (kidding) Hesperides 20:09, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Rewrite

A lot of this article seems to be copied and pasted from [1], the bottom of which reads "Copyright © 2003 Guthy-Renker®, All rights reserved". Extraordinary Machine 14:23, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

At first glance, they appear to be different enough so as to not be a copyvio. Are there any specific paragraphs you are concerned about? Hall Monitor 19:05, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

Here's one example: "After relentless touring, Alicia followed up her successful debut with, The Diary of Alicia Keys released in December 2003. The album was hailed by critics and sold over 618,000 copies its first week of release in the United States." Extraordinary Machine 16:26, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

Unrelated, I know, but I'm not familiar with WP editing yet. I just happened to be here and noticed that the article claims Keys is a soon-to-be actress (implying she has never acted before), but further down in the page states that she has acted on The Cosby Show in 1985. Thus I removed the phrase "is a soon-to-be actress" from the section on what she is up to now.

I'm going to go on a limb and guess that since the guest episode, she hasn't aced until recently, she doesn't consider herself a proven actress. In the cobsy episode, she had no speaking lines and basically had to be a cute girl. So, is she a veteran for it?

Birth Date

Alicia Keys's birthday year is actually 1980. Record companies tend to thwart the minds of the consumer to make them think artists are younger than they really are. They use that to try and boost record sales and make the artist more appealing to a certain age group.

I don't believe that. Any proof? Drdr1989 18:38, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

Public records list: AUGELLO COOK, ALICIA J Jan 25, 1980 New York, NY Rosedale, NY Uniondale, NY Jamaica, NY Questors 03:06, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

Which "public" record?? Drdr1989 08:23, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

There are a number of public record databases on the Internet, some are fee- or subscription based. This one just gives an age, not a birthdate: US Search. Others give actual birthdates. As far as what the public records actually are, Ancestry says: "The US Public Records Index is a compilation of various public records spanning all 50 states in the United States from 1984 to the present. These records are all accessible to the general public by contacting the appropriate government or municipal agency. Ancestry.com has simply made the process of finding certain public records easier by making them available in an online searchable database." Questors 18:20, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

So, in other words, you retrieved this information from the subscription based Ancestry.com? Drdr1989 03:38, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

BTW, I'm on the fence with this one, still leaning slightly towards 1981. Drdr1989 07:21, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

I think it's very suspect that legal documents says she was born in 1980 when her "official" year of birth is 1981.--Fallout boy 01:56, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

I was looking on IMDb today, and they changed her birthdate to 1980.--Fallout boy 23:15, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

Now, this has gotten more confusing... Drdr1989 23:30, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Why don't ask Alicia herself, What is your DOB? This is not a joke. Let her tell whatever she prefers to. And lets accept it. To whom does it matter if its 1980 or 1981. Some journalist needs to ask this question. or might be some family friend might answer.Vivek 19:59, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

As for "To whom does it matter if it[']s 1980 or 1981", we have a policy here for factual accuracy. It would be interesting to see their response (although I doubt Alicia Keys answers inquiries personally). If someone actually does email her, make sure to mention we found her on the US Public Records Index which says 1980.--Fallout boy 04:07, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Apparently, Alicia Keys has also decided 1980 is correct. She told People magazine she's currently 26.[2]

Some of you obviously know nothing about Alicia Keys

I added IMDB and BBC as references to 1980, as both have a reputation for getting things right. But it's true that many places say 1981. --h2g2bob (talk) 18:40, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Controversy

First off, on the Performance Arts high School: here is a link http://www.greatschools.net/modperl/browse_school/ny/1916/

Second, Alicia Keys is an contralto. This is evident by her deep speaking voice.

Thirdly, Alicia Keys signed a demo deal with Jermaine Dupri and his So So Def label, then distributed to Columbia. However the deal didn't work out, but not before Clive Davis took notice and quickly signed her to Arista Records. Clive has a reputation for allowing artists to mature and is not strictly looking for dollar signs. BMG (Arista's parent had a rule that executives had to retire at 60). As part of Clive's severance package, he got $800 million and his own indpendent label (J), which is distributed by BMG. He was allowed to take some of the Arista roster with him including Deborah Cox and Alica Keys. This was the reason for some of the brief fallout between Davis and Whitney Houston, herself a former protegé)

Fourthly, its a misnomer she went to Columbia. She took classes, but under the school's gifted high school program (I took college classes myself while in high school). So she's an alumni, but not as its being reported.

Fifthly, she mentions the choir director spending a lot of time with her so it was like personal instruction. But her "major" was always piano performance, never voice. It just happened that because she was in choir and had this teacher's assistance that her voice would be "discovered". She mentioned this many times in early BET appearances.

Sixthly, it is 1981 (she was 21 when Fallin came out and she was 2001's) Which was 4 years ago. Right now alicia is 25 years old about to be 26 on january 25

Hope that helps.Antares33712 06:00, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

Check your math. If she was 21 in 2001, she was born in 1980.--Fallout boy 06:53, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

She wasn't 21, she was 20 when Fallin' came out so her birth year is 1981. -- Sarz 12:19, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

I'm a little curious how it's a known fact that she was 20 when "Fallin'" came out. Did she explicity state she was 20?--Fallout boy 06:48, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

 I don't recall her EVER specificly saying what age she was when "Fallin" was released in 2001, however, if she was 21, her birth-year would be 1980. Does that help any? Roku 13:51, 9 May 2006 (UTC)Roku

What does her "deep speaking voice' have to do with her singing voice, Mariah Carey has a deep speaking voice but a high singing voice, Christina Aguilera has a deep singing voice and a high speakng voice, that is not proof that she is a contralto like Toni Braxton. 67.175.23.73 11:03, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

Columbia University

I'm removing the Columbia University alumni category because Keys never received a degree from said institution. Hesperides 00:02, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm putting it back because the definition of alumni includes all who matriculate, even if they leave without a degree. As far as I know, she did enroll as a candidate for a bachelor's degree.

As far as you know, which is what? Don't take her statements in interviews and her press releases at face value. Reading this discussion page and doing a little research shows a consistent streak of dishonesty and exaggeration on her part, particularly in areas concerning musical talent and her schooling. Hesperides 20:04, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

First Song Written

Because there couldn't be any more ambiguity surrounding Keys and the hype/fabrications she and her PR and label people have desseminated, the article currently states she wrote her first song "Butterflyz" at the age of 14; a google search comes up with a plethora of websites that say the same. However, below are two contradicting quotes from Keys, which in turn contradict what's currently written in the article and on those sites:

"I wrote my first song when I was 11. And it was actually inspired by the movie Philadelphia. It was about a year after my grandfather had passed away and I was very close to him..." [3]

In response to the question "What was the first song you ever wrote?":

"I was 14 and had just seen the movie Philadelphia. It was such a sad movie, and it was about a year after my grandfather passed and I wasn't really able to grieve. So I saw that movie, came home to my little player piano, sat down and took that whole night writing. The song was called "I'm All Alone." Through it, I was able to finally grieve for my grandfather." [4]

For what it's worth, Philadelphia came out in 1993, which would have made Keys 13 at the time, so the ASCAP statement must be false. So which was the first song she wrote and when did she write it? I'll bow out and let someone else make the edit due to my bias. Hesperides 20:36, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Where's the duet with Cham

Um someone's not updating this page, I just saw her in the video with Cham, yet it's not on here...

Merging

I don't think the Alicia Keys' awards and nominations page should be merged with this one. It is far too long. -- Cielomobile ^minor7♭5 01:00, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

I agree; I cant see that a discussion has taken place here, so I am going to de-merge the article; its far too long to put into the main article and all other artists have a seperate article for awards and nominations - there is no reason to be different with this article. Rimmers 16:38, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Middle name?

The article only says that her middle initial as "J.". Does she only have an initial or does the "J." stand for something? Wikipedia is the only source that shows she even has a middle name. Everywhere else I've looked only shows her full birth name as "Alicia Augello Cook". Where is the source of this middle initial? Rhythmnation2004 15:51, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

i believe it has been stated in article that her middle name is Joseph... after her grandfather. i'll locate the article shortly. Heartburn2005 09:01, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

nationality?

How come Ive read in multiple places that her mother is Puerto Rican too, and even in an interview I read with her talking about her name she said she pronounces Alicia as Uh-Leesh-Uh but its actually after her maternal grandmother and supposed to be pronounced Uh-lees-see-yuh. So why doesnt it list she is Puerto Rican too? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.128.141.162 (talk) 00:01, 3 February 2007 (UTC).

Why so many= Answer?

It is official now that alicia keys dad is an african - american, and her mother is irish - italian. I don't know where people are gettin jamaican and puerto rican from. She said herself shes african, irish and italian.

New Pic

Honestly this article needs a new picture. The current one is gritty and unrecognizable. Wuthai 22:56, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

She is not a classical pianist.

Someone keeps identifying her genre as classical in the info box. Until she comes out with a classical album, she ain't classical, folks. Someone about a year ago did the same regarding jazz. She isn't jazz either.

I've also snipped out the sentence about her writing her first song at age 14. See the above section "First Song Written" for reasons why. If it's in doubt, it gets taken out. Hesperides 20:13, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Coloratura Soprano?

I think not. She really isn't that dramatic either. I would give her either a plain alto or maybe mezzo-soprano.

Fair use rationale for Image:AliciaKeys-SongsInAMinor-music-album.jpg

Image:AliciaKeys-SongsInAMinor-music-album.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 18:54, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

"As I Am" release date has not been specified

Alicia nor her label have specified that October 23rd is the release date for As I Am. There is no source that even mentions the 23rd; only October in general. Heartburn2005 09:00, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Who messed up the Albums section?!

The table is gone. also the certification was wrong. if u check riaa.com, u'll see that Songs in A minor (12mil) and The diary of alicia keys (9.1mil) have all sold more than what people keep putting on there. Also Gangsta lovin with Eve should be added to the #1's section

Keys' comments on Wikipedia

For curiosity, and perhaps adds for the article, the Finnish tabloid Iltasanomat has interviewed Alicia Keys, and she commented on Wikipedia [5]: "Dear people, don't trust Wikipedia. Anyone can add anything to Wikipedia, even if the information isn't correct" "

Then she comments this article: "They say John Legend and Justin Timberlake would be on my up-coming album, eventhough it is not correct. Wikipedia is the most unreliable source in the world.". --Pudeo⺮ 19:44, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

She said that John Legend and Timbaland (not Justin Timberlake, which Pudeo mistyped here - JT isn't even mentioned in the As I Am (2007) -part) are not featured on her upcoming album. --Ras 23:54, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

This is amusing considering a lot of the inaccuracies on her wikipedia page originate from her publicity crew/record label. And as reading this page's history seems to show, people are trying to wade through the contradictory information she's put out about herself to get to some kind of objectivity. BlueGreen 05:27, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

Also, it's stupid and silly of her to call wiki "the most unreliable source in the world" when she told MTV last year she wanted to work with Legend on her next album (link 17 on the wiki page) and on doing a google search, her own fansites were reporting (from press releases?) all through this year that Legend was collaborating with her.

On reading this talk page, sounds like SHE'S the most unreliable source in the world. She has to have some major psychological issues.

BlueGreen 05:48, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

What she said is an unforgivable exaggeration. She should have said, "Wikipedia is ONE of the most unreliable sources in the world." I guess, like so many others, she should be secretly editing the entry about her. So, now mistrustring Wikipedia is a mental illness? Don't cross the Wikicult, Alicia! Nicmart 11:49, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Philanthropist?

Every time a celebrity helps with some non-profit organizations she ranks as a philanthropist? Is there a celebrity alive who hasn't polished his image by doing such good deeds? I imagine Michael Vick has had his share of involvement with such organizations. Is someone going to add "philanthropist" to his Wikipedia entry? Nicmart 03:29, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Some wankster probably would, sad to say--MistaTee 04:07, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

The same wankster who added it to "Alicia Keys"? Nicmart 11:50, 12 September 2007 (UTC)