Talk:Eugène Terre'Blanche

Reliable sources

On June 17, 2001, Terre'Blanche was sentenced to six years in prison, of which he served three years, for assaulting a petrol station worker and the attempted murder of a security guard in 1996.

This is not sourced, nor are the people named, nearly impossible to verify. Was he really sentenced on both counts ? Very badly written. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.143.217.180 (talk) 00:36, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Come back in 1-2 hours. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 00:41, 8 April 2010 (UTC) that took me less than a minute. Next time, please read WP:SOFIXIT. thanks. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 00:45, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Pointing to newspaper articles is really not very professional, I don't think you quote the names either.

Use this instead, names victims:

http://www.justice.gov.za/trc/media/1999/9910/p991018b.htm —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pandries (talk • contribs) 00:53, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

do it yourself Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 01:02, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

So polite. The answer is NO. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.143.217.180 (talk) 21:22, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

Quality of this article

This is the most pathetic article that I have ever read in my life. It is completely biased. It's just... pathetic. No offence, person who wrote those crap. --Scotteh 16:32, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

The above comment breaches civility. If you feel it is biased, then be bold and fix it. Just observe NPOV and other Wikipedia policies in your contributions.

I will also comment that the article is poorly organized and needs to be reworked. --Richard 18:47, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Ancestry

It is not clear which parts refer to Eugène (the one who fell off the horse) and which refer to Estienne, the progenitor. Also, should the horse incident be mentioned? --Lionelbrits 00:57, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Fixed. Zaian 09:33, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Hey all, just added a section on Louis Theroux. If this is erroneous, please edit =]

I was told that TB once said at a meeting that some of his ancestors had died at the Battle of Blood River. Since no whites perished at that battle, this can only mean that at least one of his ancestors was black. Tis a pity such a statement won't ever make it to the Wikipedia page about him. -- leuce (talk) 09:58, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

It could only go in if there is a reliable source that states he said such a thing or which proves he had any non-white ancestry. Jim Michael (talk) 00:45, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

It could also mean that he was lying.--Totorotroll (talk) 09:06, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Should he not be introduced as a white supremacist?

Chronology of Jani Allan affair

I'm just questioning here. The article states that the Jani Allan "affair" came to light in 1992, but it is mentioned in the Broomfield documentary which was released in 1991. Is there is confusion of years here? --Delsen 13:05, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Legally, it is still termed an 'alleged' affair. The reason that 1992 is cited is because that is when many details of the alleged affair came to light, many witnesses testified and gave details in Jani Allan's libel case against the broadcaster of Broomfield's film, Channel 4.

But the links with Allan were already causing trouble within the ANC well before the 92 libel case. For example, an extremist bomber from an offshoot AWB organisation, planted a bomb outside Allan's apartment in 1989. There were also some requests for his resignation between 1988 and 1992, with the alleged affair being cited as one of multiple reasons. Teatreez (talk) 15:49, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Bophuthatswana defeat?

The statement that the AWB was defeated in Bophuthatswana is not correct. This is also not what is written in the cited report of the Tebutt commission: http://www.polity.org.za/polity/govdocs/commissions/1998/tebbutt/tebbutt7.html#8 --41.17.107.132 (talk) 20:30, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

Afrikaans independent community

I seem to remember that the AWB created some sort of white-only community in the mid to late 1980s. Way off? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.226.104.225 (talk) 18:03, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

Conviction

His conviction was rather suspect. In the one case it was a criminal itself that accused him in the other he was actually helping an injured person getting to hospital that then turned against him. --41.18.179.200 (talk) 18:00, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Got a reliable source for that? Zaian (talk) 18:40, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Translation

I think "Weerstandsbeweging" translates to "resistance movement" but a Dutch speaker should check that. It's worth including a translation in the article. 66.127.52.47 (talk) 18:49, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

First of all, it's Afrikaans, not Dutch. Secondly, this article is about TerreBlanche. Explanation of name is given at the article about the AWB Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 20:17, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, the other article confirms the translation. I think it should be added to this article for clarity; doing so also makes the article more self-contained per WP:TPA. 66.127.52.47 (talk) 22:51, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Lead sentence

The lead sentence refers to Terre'Blanche "pushing for an Afrikaner secessionist state within South Africa". This is a very limited summary. In the 1980s and early 1990s he opposed all reforms to apartheid, and threatened to go to war to maintain white rule in South Africa. Anyone want to amend the lead paragraph? Zaian (talk) 07:06, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

Easter Saturday

This man was killed on Easter Saturday. This day is becoming a traditional South African day to murder politicians. The date was either a coincidence or not a coincidence.

Jim Michael, is it disputed that 3 April 2010 was Easter Saturday? Does it have to be relevant for me to post that? Should I go and remove the statement that Chris Hani was killed on Easter Saturday in his bio? Chris_Hani#Assassination

I thought my posts would be improved, but it simply got reverted. This seems like relevant observation. Squiose (talk) 20:31, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

Unless a reliable source says it isn't a coincidence, we must assume that it is. In any event, this is a global encyclopedia, albeit one written in the English language, and the concept of "Easter" may not be culturally relevant to some of our readers, so it's better, I feel, just to leave it as the date, which is neutral in that regard. Rodhullandemu 20:35, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

So you say that the Chris Hani article is wrong as well? I believe culturally relevant to the readers should take a back-seat to relevance to the case, as Easter is celebrated, and is indeed a national holiday in the country where the murder occurred. We could always link Easter Saturday for the culturally irrelevant folks, couldn't we? Squiose (talk) 21:16, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

I don't believe it should mention Easter unless a reliable source has commented on the relevance of this. Meanwhile, trying to draw events together to explain what appear to be coincidences is not permitted here unless someone else has commented on it. "No original research" is not a negotiable policy. Rodhullandemu 21:22, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

This is too early, and at this point speculation. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 21:29, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

To say it that Easter Sat is a traditional day to murder politicians is unsubstantiated; two cases that had nothing to do with religion do make a trend. I don't see any reason to mention Easter Sat on this article or Hani's, as there is no evidence, nor I believe any suggestion, that either murder was connected to Easter Sat or Christianity. Several murders happen every day in South Africa; the vast majority of murderers do not plan to kill in line with the Christian calendar. In the case of a non-Christian killing a Christian in a religious attack in which the killer planned it for Easter weekend for extra publicity, it would be relevant, but it seems almost certain that religion was not an issue in this murder. Jim Michael (talk) 23:49, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

BTW, if you want to get the terminology right, Easter Saturday is actually the Saturday after Easter. The Saturday between Good Friday and Easter Sunday is Holy Saturday. Zaian (talk) 06:06, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Link to South African farm attacks

Somebody is trying to link his death to the article on farm-attacks. I think that's a bit of a stretch... yes, he was killed on his farm, but no, linking to the article on the general issue is a coatrack and undue. Every report we have says it was a wage-dispute. Give me some evidence that this was a racially motivated hate-crime-style attack (or whatever you want to call it). Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 06:17, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

The Guardian categorises it as a farm attack: [1]. So does the BBC[2]. So does opposition leader Mangosuthu Buthelezi[3]. 19:00, 6 April 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jngt (talk • contribs)

It is relevant to link to the farm attack article. That article doesn't claim that all farm attacks are racially motivated hate crimes. Zaian (talk) 19:24, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

OK. Conceded. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 19:30, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Death notice

Is it really useful to give seven different sources for the death? It is not a contested fact, I suggest to take six of them out. --Pgallert (talk) 10:13, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Not all of the info stated is in each one of the refs. Jim Michael (talk) 00:14, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Politician or political activist?

Both terms are used in this article to describe him. Did he receive a regular salary for his political position? If so, he was a politician; if not, he was an activist. Jim Michael (talk) 00:19, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

well, he was a member of the Herstigte Nasionale Party, ran for office, but never made it. I'm not sure but I think that counts as politician, albeit only for a short while. No? Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 00:37, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Do good sources call him a politician, activist or what? --hippo43 (talk) 09:36, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Birth year: 1941 or 1944?

AWB-leader - Eugène Ney Terre'Blanche. --Sukarnobhumibol (talk) 07:11, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

The AWB sometimes creates modern myths and such. All sources say he was 69... do the math :) Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 07:17, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

I can calculate... :) --Sukarnobhumibol (talk) 03:31, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

WHEN DID HIS WIFE DIE? THE RUMOR SAYS SHE COMMITED SUICIDE, IS THAT TRUE??? CONFIRM PLEASE

a) we're not deaf, don't yell b) don't write into others' comments c) we'll find out, chill. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 01:26, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

???? --Sukarnobhumibol (talk) 05:25, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

wasn't you, was it? Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 06:52, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

I thought, you said that. --Sukarnobhumibol (talk) 08:36, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

Terre'Blanche's widow Martie is alive. I'm not aware of him ever having been married to anyone else. Jim Michael (talk) 02:05, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

Restore?

The following was removed on the basis that it was a copyvio and uncited:

Terre'Blanche and the AWB were seldom out of the media during the 1980s and first half of the 1990s. Terre'blanche's powerful oratory and apocalyptic images of race war often featured, with the image of heavily armed AWB members parading in uniform, sometimes hooded. However, this image of the rise of the far right was not the only image projected by the media, which increasingly ridiculed Terre'Blanche and his supporters.

I suspect it was actually a sentence from Wikipedia which was subsequently used in the media, not a sentence from the media which was copied by Wikipedia. I think this should be restored in full. Zaian (talk) 06:20, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

Spelling error

hello, in the section 'Death', 2 paragraphs from the last, it says:

ANC leaders later announced a temporary ban on the sining of the song[52].

I propose:

singing rather than sining. 81.96.176.14 (talk) 17:39, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

 Done Jim Michael (talk) 00:45, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

Incompleteness and serious omission

In the third paragraph an important alleged motivation for the murder was omitted:

Alleged motivations for the murder have included a pay dispute, sexual assault[2], and racist motives, triggered by the song "kill the boer" recently promoted by Julius Malema[33]of the ANCyouth organisation.

Please revise!!

I don't think the lead is the place to air the latest allegations. Speculation about pay disputes, assaults, Malema, etc. are covered in detail later in the article. I've removed them from the lead. Zaian (talk) 08:26, 13 April 2010 (UTC)