Talk:English muffin

English Muffins in America

I have to really question this. Cooked in a griddle? As an American I have never encountered this or even heard of it. English Muffins are known as a bread product from Thomas' Bakery (http://thomas.gwbakeries.com/) and are split with a fork at home then prepared in a toaster. I would correct it myself, but I'm not clear if Thomas' uses some kind of skillet-like step during their creation before packaging and placing them on grocery store shelves. In their untoasted form they appear like a wide, barely cooked, biscuit. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.190.51.213 (talk) 09:34, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Name

(The Name)To be politically correct, shouldn't "English" Muffins be called "British" Muffins? Unless of course Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland don't like to eat this particular type of muffin.--Secret Agent Man 13:07, 5 August 2005 (UTC)

English muffins, as described here, do exist in the UK. They can be bought at most supermarkets. I buy them every week. Deb 16:49, 21 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I didn't write that part, but are they called "English muffins" or something else? dml 17:04, 21 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I think we still just call them muffins, but it's true there is some confusion since we started getting the American-style muffin over here. Deb 22:05, 21 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I've deleted that part. Almost every supermarket I know in Britain sells Muffins - both the English bread-type variety and the "American style" cupcake variety. If you asked for an English muffin you would get the bread variety. McDonalds sell an Egg McMuffin which is described as an English Muffin with egg... Tjwood 14:37, 3 May 2004 (UTC)

Sorry to wade into this, but "muffin" in parts of the UK just means bread roll, and there are marked regional variations on what terms mean in the UK -- anyhow people tend to assume you are talking about what they recognise. But I have never seen a packet marked "English muffins" on a shelf in England, now asking some random shelf stacker in a super market if they have "English muffins" does not prove that there is such a thing as "English muffins". You can buy English tea, and have a full English breakfast, but until I see a packet "sourced and made in England" there are no "English muffins".

See the supermarkets? I bought 2 packs from Tescos today :)

• http://www.tesco.com/superstore/product/search.aspx?from=SEARCH&search=muffin# English Butter Muffin
• http://www.rhm.com/rhm/divisions/brands/brands/mpride/

"The Mothers Pride brand is nearly 70 years old. It made its first appearance in the north in 1936 and became a national brand in 1956...As well as the traditional favourites, such as Mothers Pride English muffins, crumpets, fruited teacakes, hot cross and currant buns, there is an assortment of regional specialities, including Mothers Pride Derby scones, Devon scones and Scotch pancakes, and other traditional Scottish fair; potato scones and soda scones."

EDROCKS 05:02, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

And we really should not confuse the name with the product it refers to. This whole article needs citations to be honest, and comparisions between scone, crumpet and the so-called "English muffin". An etymology of the term would be most helpful.

For clarification -- it would make more sense to refer to "muffin (cake)" for baking soda ones -- as they are like cupcakes, and "muffin (bread)" for the yeast based griddle scone or bannock like muffin. Hormel English Muffins

If this is actually a variation of a griddle scone, ironically it isn't English, but more likely Scotish. random googled page about scones

Still that so many native English speakers think English muffins are crumpets, rather than what appear to be scone like bread products, would suggest they are far from available and far from popular in merry old England. --Tonypercy 10:32, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Given that it is possible to purchase English Muffins in all the main supermarkets in the UK (ASDA, Tesco, Sainsbury's, Morrisons) this would suggest that Tonypercy is incorrect in its assumptions. Examples:

• http://images.google.co.uk/images?client=opera&rls=en&q=english%20muffin&sourceid=opera&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi
• Encarta: http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_1861689817/English_muffin.html

And surely you can't say 'so many' without any stats whatsoever backing you up? EDROCKS 05:02, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

'Muffin' vs 'English Muffin'

Usually, in the UK, people talk about just 'muffins'. Out of the 88 concordance matches of the word 'muffin' in the British National Corpus, the word 'English' was used twice, and the word 'American-style' was used once. So it seems that British people infer the particular type of muffin being referred to by the context of the word. (This is what you would expect, linguistically, anyway):

http://www.sketchengine.co.uk/auth/corpora/run.cgi/freqs?q=alc%2C%5B%5D+%22muffins%3F%22;corpname=preloaded%2Fbnc&refs=%3Dbncdoc.id;fcrit=word+0~0%3E0;ml=1 You need to create an account but this is free.

Biscuits

A recent edit has added an (unsourced) suggestion that Muffins ought to be classified as biscuits. That would be very surprising to a speaker of British English because (to us) a biscuit is a cookie and they obviously arent'. The US usage of biscuis appears to be for a kind of bread, and then an English Muffin should be so classified. I wonder if someone could clarify this. Perhaps the original contributor? Francis Davey 17:53, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

Seconded, thanks. I did have a look on Alton Brown's website and a few other links but couldn't find anything Kymara 09:22, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

Americans needs to clarify what they mean by biscuit, and cookie. By biscuit they might be including scones. Their cookies are what native speakers of English deem biscuits on the whole.

Biscuits tend to be lighter and more buttery than English muffins. 75.118.170.35 (talk) 18:12, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Crumpet

This article needs to be merged with Crumpet, the UK term. Jumbo 13:12, 9 Jul 2004 (UTC)

I just expanded the article; I think they are not quite the same and don't need merging. See what you think. Elf | Talk 17:13, 9 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Quite right, they are totally different. I much prefer crumpets but like the occasional muffin. US style muffins are ghastly though, I would be sick if I ate one. Francis Davey 19:50, 22 July 2005 (UTC)

They have to be sourdough muffins, split, not sliced, and broiled under a grill, not toasted in a toaster, and then slathered with butter. Then they're pretty good. And the best hamburgers or cheeseburgers are made with them (by true connoisseurs) instead of hamburger buns.... Hayford Peirce 20:27, 22 July 2005 (UTC)

I'm not agreeing that the article needs to merged with crumpet, but at the very least, this article and crumpet need to explain, with WP:RS's what (if anything but dialect) distinguishes English muffins from crumpets from scones. I went to these articles trying to answer exactly that question, and apparently I'm not the only one. It's what an encyclopedia needs to do. Do these categories overlap, with differences observed by some and not by others? DavidOaks (talk) 15:30, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

A crumpet is something entirely different Sweetie candykim (talk) 20:55, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Roman spear points

Any chance of getting a link to this? I'm curious as to what they are and why they are called this

Spelling

Is it just me or does anyone else object to having American spelling (flavor) about an English food? I wouldn't normally mind, I know the wikipedia guidelines say both are ok, but really ... anyone? Not meaning to offend in the slightest Kymara 11:47, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

I totally agree with you. The Wikipedia Handbook of Style says that articles should use the appropriate regional spelling, so the article on New York should use American spelling, while the article on London should use British English. I think it's obvious that 'English Muffins' should use English spelling. Saluton 20:04, 14th May 2006 (UTC).

The first English muffin was sold in the US. It clearly is a US product. The same way Balti and Chicken Tika Marsala were created by immigrants for the local population in England, and are not Indian food. Therefore the spelling should be in American.

English muffins have existed since before America was founded UKWikiGuy (talk) 15:56, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree. There is no such thing as an English Muffin. There are different varieties, like the plain bread muffin and sweet, confectionery muffins, but there is no historical reason for "English muffin". It is an American expression referring to something few of us in England would recognise as a traditional muffin. Guv2006 (talk) 10:47, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Merge from 'Cheesemuffin'

The page Cheesemuffin suggested does not exist. Nor does any other combination I've tried i.e. Cheese (M/m)uffin. If I get no replies here I'll delete the suggestion in a few days. Kymara 11:29, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

Explanation of Tony Sidaway's removal of paragraph about Alton Brown

I've removed this paragraph:

Because of their cooking style and the composition of their dough, some, most notably Alton Brown, argue that English muffins are in fact biscuits. They do not propose that anything be changed, however.

It seems to be just a namedrop for a guy with a cookery show. This is his personal opinion, which is sort of interesting, but in my opinion not really suitable for the encyclopedia article. --Tony Sidaway 12:21, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

This bit does not seem quite right

In northern England "Muffin" is a common term for a circular sandwich bread roll, often wrongly refered to as a barm, cob, barmcake, bap or teacake.

I've never seen a breadroll referred to as a muffin - it's either breadroll or if you go into the north it's a barm. --Charlesknight 18:08, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. Bread rolls / barms / cobs / baps / barmcakes today mean a bread roll, so a circular sandwich bread roll is not incorrectly referred to as a barm, cob, barmcake or bap. Teacake is something else again. Muffin is certainly not the correct term for these others, yet the text suggests it is the only correct term. This confusion also seems to have been continued on the Muffin page. EDROCKS 05:02, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

I can't remember where, but somepeople do call a barm/bread roll/cob/ bap a muffin. It is in the North, I think around Manchester. But they tend to be larger. But a shop near me in Leeds used to sell oven-bottom muffins which were packaged http://www.ovenbottommuffins.co.uk/ and were basically just large barm cakes Sweetie candykim (talk) 12:49, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

You should go to Manchester or parts of Lancashire. I was in Ancoats, Manchester, yesterday, and there is a sandwich shop there with the word "muffins" used on its outdoor advertising. One of many, I imagine. It would be wrong to state that the entire North of England uses the word (I would never call a bread roll a muffin, for example, and to my ears it sounds twee), but Mancunians do use it as a synonym for a bread roll, bun etc. Guv2006 (talk) 13:11, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

English/US muffins

I have removed the following,

Despite the name, English muffins are not as popular in the United Kingdom as they are in North America, and the word Muffin in Britain most commonly refers to the same thing as in the U.S.

since it is absolute nonsense. At the very least, the unqualified usage of the word "muffin" from one UK English speaker to another would refer most of the time to an English muffin. Naturally, I have no statistical source to back this up, but as Wittgenstein remarked, "explanations must end somewhere". Soobrickay 02:49, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

This may depend on your age. I know hardly any, actually I know NO people who eat English muffins on a regular basis, the muffins I often come into contact with are those of the American variety, which people refer to simply as muffins. The article now says they are 'widely eaten in Britain' but it is not. In fact I would say Americans eat English muffins more than British people. McDonalds breakfasts often contain English muffins called McMuffins. NJ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.11.198.174 (talk) 18:39, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

I am British and I eat these regularly, but I agree, there are probably more Americans that eat these because of the McMuffin. However the McMuffin is more of a harder bap than a muffin Sweetie candykim (talk) 12:47, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

The comments on this discussion are hilarious. Who'd have thought a muffin could be such a political bone of contention. Anyway having enjoyed the banter I might as well comment. I am English, a Londoner with Irish routes and fifty-ish. Most Saturdays we have fresh bacon (which my family call 'rashers') and muffins bought from a local supermarket called Sainsbury's. To my fellow compatriots you're just not looking because all the supermarkets sell 'English' muffins in packs of 4,6 or 8. There must be enough people around eating them for them to be so easily available. These are indeed similar to the McMuffin bun which in England is surprise, surprise baked in England anyway. Do I use the term English Muffin? - yes I do because otherwise the shop assistant is likely to show me a spounge like small cake that originated in the United States and which is now very popular particularly in cafe style shops like Costa and Cafe Republic and indeed in every supermarket across the country.dorkinglad (talk)

...and I'm tagging it with {globalize/USA} too | US bias and fixing it

I have removed the following from the article as it doesn't specify in which countries it is true:

"English muffins are usually available in regular flavor (usually unsweetened white flour), sourdough, whole wheat, and raisin, and occasionally in gourmet flavors such as blueberry, orange spice, and so on. Most English muffins are 3–4 inches (8–10 cm) across and less than 1 inch (2.5 cm) high, although gourmet varieties are somewhat larger."

Njál 19:42, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm hovering over how to fix the article. If the descriptions in it are accurate, an 'English muffin' is something like a cross between a muffin and a crumpet. We can't have a article on American 'English muffins' and another article on English 'muffins' — they are closely related. I think I shall create sections. Could someone please check that the section I am going to label 'American' really is? Njál 20:33, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

(Removed the {globalize/USA} tag now as I've fixed/clarified most of my objections — the request for checking above is still valid.) Njál 21:39, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Article name

I'd rather like to make 'Muffin' a disambig page and link to something like Muffin (cake) and Muffin (bread) — but I'm fairly sure I'd be outvoted on that (bitter experience, bigger populations...). However, on the principle that an article about a (originally) British thing should have a British, or at least a neutral (i.e. not propagating a specific region's term — Wikipedia is here to report, not influence) name: are there objections to or suggestions for renaming this article?

To do

• cut down the number of links to 'brands' — I will do this randomly if not done by someone familiar with them (done)
• cut down the number of pictures of someone's cookery batch (done)
• add a picture of a muffin bought or made in England (done)
• check a recipe for US-style English muffins/make sure the pictures are representative. For example, what do the versions McDonalds sell look like?

Njál 21:39, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Breakfast muffin

Just to check — do we commonly call them 'breakfast muffins'? If we do, I'll add the info back in at the top (and add a disambig page). Njál 21:01, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

We rarely if ever eat "english muffins" in the UK.

From the photo it looks like what I would call a bap thats been toasted. 80.2.202.130 21:34, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

That is not a bap/barm/muffin(another name for the softer bread). (English) muffins are harder than barm cakes and they have flatter sides. They also have a rougher texture on the outside and people do eat them regularly Sweetie candykim (talk) 12:44, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

>>To be honest I've seen a lot of english people here talking about the fact that noone eats the bloody things. You and a few others are basically trying to tell us, english people, that they are eaten widely. Never have I seen those type of muffins in anyones fridge, and to tell you the truth I always wondered why McMuffins in McDonalds were called Muffins, as I didn't even know another type other than the cake-type sweet muffins existed. If I actually cared I would remove the statement referring to it being "widely eaten in Britain" due to the fact it is blatantly not true. Anyway, I don't know any of the codes to leave my IP but whatever. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.182.29.133 (talk) 02:01, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Never heard of this before

"Muffins in Britain Muffins are made with a soft, kneaded dough of flour, milk, yeast, sugar, and salt. This proves (rises), is rolled out and formed into shape, and left to rise again. The muffins are then cooked on a lightly-greased hot surface such as a griddle or frying pan. Crumpet rings are not involved in the current form. Muffins are commonly eaten at teatime."

I've never eaten anything like that, and I'm English. I've certainly never cooked anything "on a griddle or frying pan". And in all the years my old mother prepared me a traditional tea, I never had a "muffin". (I also noticed in other articles about english things, the american writer sometimes writes their "disneyfied" belief in what something is like, rather than what its actually like). 80.2.202.130 21:38, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

"Muffins in Britain... are then cooked on a lightly-greased hot surface such as a griddle or frying pan."

Really? That's news to me, and I'm British. Americans just make this stuff up as they go along. Absolute nonsense. As the above user has commented, the idea some people (such as the source of the above quote) have of England/Britain bears little relation to reality, and would be better suited in the pages of fairy stories. The idea that we eat muffins for tea after faffing about with them in a frying pan is mind boggling, and even insulting. Go and do some research, for goodness sake, and stop posting fantasy as fact. Guv2006 (talk) 13:17, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

Well, I'm British and I've certainly had (English) muffins. They aren't so common now - but traditional teas are rarer, but they were certainly very much more common earlier last century. I have frequently cooked things on griddles for tea but mostly drop scones (aka Scots pancakes). What has happened is that in England in particular, crumpets have taken over the role of muffins in almost their entirety. English people usually buy pre-made crumpets rather than cooking their own as well. Francis Davey 14:55, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

I too, as a Brit, have never seen an English muffin before. If you say 'muffin' to an English person they will think of a normal 'muffin' not what Americans call an 'English muffin'. I believe we used to eat English muffins here but they are not common at all anymore. 80.42.203.35 21:11, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Depends on your age and background. Also, you may be a little unobservant. I was in Sainsbury's at the weekend and found on the bread shelf some bread products described as "muffins" which were without doubt English Muffins, so your usage is certainly not universal. Francis Davey 11:21, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Francis, you presumably have a special Sainsbury's, perhaps a one-off just for you? Even the Sainsbury's website has no mention of these "English muffins" you appeared to find so easily. In fact, they have blueberry, toffee, double chocolate chip, etc, etc - yes, the American varieties we are all familiar with - but not a word about the common or garden "English" variety that we, apparently, heat up in a frying pan (q.v) then eat for tea: http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/Sainsburys_-_Muffins_in_Sainsburys.html Plus, apart from when denoting lamb and beef, etc, we are not in the habit of telling customers about the nationality of our foods. If there is an item in the UK calling itself an "English muffin", you can bet it has been created by marketing people. Guv2006 (talk) 13:36, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

Using the same website I've found 31 separate instances of Muffins of those Sainsbury's: http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/Shopping/FindProducts.aspx?Query=muffin&SortBy=3 and it most certainly does list "English Muffins" or clearly I'm imagining this: http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/sainsburys-price-comparison/Patisserie/Kingsmill_Love_to_Toast_Muffins_4.html

http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/sainsburys-price-comparison/Patisserie/Sainsburys_All_Butter_Muffins_4.html http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/sainsburys-price-comparison/Patisserie/Sainsburys_Basics_Breakfast_Muffins_6.html http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/sainsburys-price-comparison/Patisserie/Sainsburys_Wholemeal_Muffins_4.html The list goes on with multiple other types and brands, clearly as Francis says you are unobservant. The food is very rarely referred to in Britain as an "English muffin" this is North American terminology, but according to Sainsbury's it is referred to as either a Muffin, Breakfast Muffin, or [type] muffin etc. The only time it was referred to as an English Muffin was when it was gluten free, I've no idea why they chose to do this since their other products which are the same time but including gluten lack the "English" designation. I am also a Brit and have eaten muffins as a child for breakfast, and also more recently, indeed last month in fact. The initial confusion likely stems from the fact that the quoted article says a muffin is griddled/fried and yes it is, if you're making them yourself. If you've bought it in a shop you're more likely to toast it. http://www.cookingbread.com/classes/class_english_muffins.html Aria_elwen 12:40, 25 June 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.23.48.113 (talk)

" I am also a Brit and have eaten muffins as a child for breakfast, and also more recently, indeed last month in fact." Are you sure? What a strange sentence. First you recall that you ate them as a child "for breakfast", then you claim it was "more recently", and finally it's "last month in fact". Your evidence wouldn't stand up in court, Aria! I propose that the witness is unreliable. Guv2006 (talk) 08:40, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

Yes I am British and I eat these regularly for breakfast Sweetie candykim (talk) 12:38, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

(Afternoon) tea

From the "Muffins in Britain" section:

Contrary to popular belief, muffins are not eaten during afternoon tea, as in post-empire Britain "afternoon tea" or simply "tea" commonly refers to dinner or evening meal.

Eh? I'm British, and live in the West Midlands, where "tea" is commonly used to mean a hot evening meal at about 6pm. But I would never, ever call that meal "afternoon tea", and can't recall anyone I know doing so either. "Afternoon tea" I would use, in a deliberately slightly affected manner, to describe the old-fashioned "cucumber sandwiches" affair at 4pm or so. The terms aren't interchangeable. I've rejigged the sentence to something a bit more accurate - though I freely confess that trying to explain how dinner can be called tea and lunch can be called dinner isn't that easy! Loganberry (Talk) 16:35, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

The section is absolute rubbish, and possibly NNPOV (class warring.)Afternoon tea is very much alive and well in Britain. Rhinoracer (talk) 20:58, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

I wouldn't say afternoon tea was "alive and well" merely because it's partaken of by some elderly/twee people in Middle England. It's an anachronism. Guv2006 (talk) 09:26, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

I propose that this whole section be deleted. No editor has submitted any real evidence as to the time of day, or accompaniment that is more likely for muffins now and any real evidence that this has changed at all. The whole section now digresses into a discussion of meal time terminology which has nothing to do with muffins. No English person could fail to understand what afternoon tea meant (regardless of regional or class distinctions as to the meaning of "tea" on its own). However, there is really nothing useful to be said about it. Muffins are eaten at afternoon tea and breakfast. Has this changed? Is it a class thing? We simply don't have any useful information and I strongly suggest this part of the article be removed, rather than attempting to rejig. If no-one objects, I will do so. Francis Davey (talk) 20:44, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

The names given to the time of day vary so dramatically across the UK that it is inaccurate to say such a thing as "tea time". I'm from Worcestershire, just south of West Midlands, so for us tea time would also be around 6pm and the thought of having muffins at that time is sheer madness! Beeurd (talk) 20:34, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Muffins rule

I just spent half an hour explaining what muffins were to someone, this page helped a lot :) Also, sainsburys do a 'cheese and pepper' muffin, hard to get them as they sell out quickly in the morning, but they're really nice. cncplyr (talk) 12:18, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Removal of Name Section

I removed the following section, titled "Name," from the article:

The word "muffin" appeared in England around the 11th century, derived from the Old French moufflet, which meant "soft" in reference to bread. Instructions for cooking a similar form of bread have existed since at least 1747, although credit for the phrase "English muffin" is often given to Samuel Bath Thomas, an English baker who emigrated to New York City and began producing his “muffins” around 1880. The Merriam-Webster dictionary, however, names the origin as 1902.

First off, none of this appears to be sourced and many of the "facts" appear to conflict with what sources I have found.

• Merriam-Webster actually puts the year of origin for "English muffin" as 1884, which seems to support the Samuel Bath Thomas origin.
• However, M-W also puts the year of origin for "muffin" as 1703, matching what is written in the more comprehensive article on muffins (which cites the online etymology dictionary listing of 1703).
• In fact, that article also has a section on English muffins and this article is fairly redundant and it might even be appropriate to merge this article into that one.
• The 11th century origin seems to be completely made up and doesn't match anything I can find (and appears to conflict with the other sources' 1703 claim).
• The muffin article also cites the word to be of either French or German origin, and M-W lists only the German origin.
• In the sources of the Thomas article, it is mentioned that Thomas was never an English baker; that is, he was never a baker in England. Rather, he emigrated to America at a young age, where he eventually became a baker. Saying that he was an English baker is misleading.
• Additionally, nowhere is Thomas credited with the term "English muffin." Instead, Thomas is only credited as having created the forerunner to the "English muffin." The muffin itself had already been extant for nearly 200 years.
• Where are these so-called instructions from 1747?

As I have listed, nearly ever word in the section is either questionable or outright wrong. As such, I have decided to remove the entire section. I would also like to reiterate my suggestion that the entire article be merged into the muffin article. Jaardon (talk) 22:02, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

"Rarely eaten"?

I am not going to revert this yet because I haven't found a useful citation, but I strongly disagree that they are rarely eaten in the UK. They are stocked in all supermarkets and in many small "corner shops", at least here in Derbyshire. They wouldn't stock them if there wasn't a market for them. If people aren't eating them, what are they doing with them? Rachel Pearce (talk) 17:29, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

I agree, there's always plenty in my ASDA and Tesco - and they sell. Ronhjones (talk) 00:52, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Very well said! Andrewa (talk) 19:01, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

Yes I am British and I eat these regularly. They are just breakfast food like toast, Scotch pancakes, crumpets, potato cakes and cereal Sweetie candykim (talk) 12:40, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

Apart from being appalled by your breakfast habits, Sweetie candykim, you appear to be going against the grain of the argument that these things are eaten at "high tea". Guv2006 (talk) 08:44, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

What is wrong with my breakfast habits??? I mainly eat cereal or toast, or occasionally muffins, Scotch pancakes or crumpets. I don't even like potato cakes and have a fry up at the weekend. Pretty standard. What do you eat? Just fruit??? Sweetie candykim (talk) 00:26, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

By potato cake I meant this

(Irwins potato cake, potato scone or tattie scone), not a scallop. Sweetie candykim (talk) 00:31, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

Muffins in the UK

Why does this state that we Britons prefer to eat crumpets or scones for afternoon tea?! Exactly which century are we supposed to be living in?! KillerKat (talk) 00:21, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

God knows. It's like a Disney cartoon in this article. The England found on Wikipedia might have been vaguely accurate around 1950, but not since. Guv2006 (talk) 13:41, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

I'd guess the 18th. Some Americans ae still fighting the American Revolution, I'm afraid. But it's a relatively harmless hobby. Andrewa (talk) 19:05, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

Cornmeal

At the risk of causing more confusion... aren't muffins usually dusted with flour? Maybe cornflour (though I don't think so), but even that isn't the same thing as cornmeal. Knole Jonathan (talk) 15:18, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

Is it really English?

I'm English, and it makes my toes curl every time an American mentions an "English muffin" on TV, in a film, etc. Basically, I have no idea what they're talking about. Hardly anyone in England eats muffins, and those that do and who live in Manchester/Lancashire will be referring to a bread roll or a bun. Everything in America has to have some kind of puerile European name attached to it - why? If it's not a "danish", it's a "french fry", and if it's neither of those it's an "english muffin". For goodness sake! Guv2006 (talk) 13:05, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

Are we really having a discussion about the humble (English) muffin?

The comments on this discussion are hilarious. Who'd have thought a muffin could be such a political bone of contention. Anyway having enjoyed the banter I might as well comment. I am English, a Londoner with Irish roots and fifty-ish. Most Saturdays we have fresh bacon (which my family call 'rashers') and muffins bought from a local supermarket called Sainsbury's. To my fellow compatriots you're just not looking because all the supermarkets sell 'English' muffins in packs of 4,6 or 8. There must be enough people around eating them for them to be so easily available. These are indeed similar to the McMuffin bun which in England is surprise, surprise baked in England anyway. Do I use the term English Muffin? - yes I do because otherwise the shop assistant is likely to show me a spounge like small cake that originated in the United States and which is now very popular particularly in cafe style shops like Costa and Cafe Republic and indeed in every supermarket across the country

dorkinglad (talk)

It's one of my favourites! English Muffins are about as English as those briny sausages in jars that we call "American Hotdogs" are American. Ditto, our ersatz "American diners" which are nothing like American diners. The "English Muffins" you refer to are misleading. You wouldn't have found them in your superstore 10 or 20 years ago, because they didn't exist. They are an import (albeit one now made in the UK), like various other foods we get from America. Americans invented the "English Muffin" as a marketing tool to sell more bread/wheat foods, and the word "English" has connotations American shoppers of a certain age and sensibility like. Think of the ploughman's lunch - an invention of the Milk Marketing Board in the early 1960s to sell more cheese, this is the American equivalent. Guv2006 (talk) 09:41, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

Product of American marketing agencies

Just as ploughman's lunches have nothing to do with ploughmen (being an invention of the Milk Marketing Board in the 1960s), so too should "English Muffins" be seen as having little or no connection with England. Guv2006 (talk) 08:25, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

United Kingdom

"They are still a household favourite... [and] are also available in traditional British tea rooms, served with breakfast or high tea." This section is complete and utter nonsense and should be removed. I have lived all over the UK, and nowhere have I know muffins to be a "household favourite", whatever that means. And what on earth is "high tea" in this day and age? This wasn't Edwardian Britain the last time I checked. This section is fanciful and has no basis in reality. In fact, the entire article is built on very shaky foundations (see numerous comments above stating that there is no such thing as an English Muffin). Guv2006 (talk) 10:40, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Almost all of this article is unsourced. Goal muffin? Not a thing comes up in Google for this. Frankly, this entire article needs to be rewritten. 87.113.39.175 (talk) 06:12, 15 June 2010 (UTC)