Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2012 May 7

7 May 2012

Autonomous_Sensory_Meridian_Response

Undelete:This article should be undeleted, as there are numerous sources for this phenomena, and it was apparently judged as a medical topic when initially deleted, which it is not. It will not appear in a medical paper, for the same reason a genre of music won't. See this talk page for a heavily linked discussion on the topic. The current page for ASMR describes the phenomena as a blatant hoax. This needs to be edited regardless of the outcome. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.254.76.153 (talk) 13:10, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

• Endorse deletion review is not to be used just because you dislike the outcome: it is to be used if the debate was conducted or closed incorrectly or if significant new information has come to light that would justify reopening the discussion. There is no way that debate could have been closed as anything other than Delete: the arguments for deletion had solid grounding in policies and guidelines which were not addressed by those arguing to keep the article, and the arguments for retention were all extremely weak. The links on Sandstein's talk page point to reddit, blogs, Google search results, self-published websites, an internet radio station, an article from an "alternative newsweekly" and an opinion piece from the Huffington Post. None of this gets remotely close to establishing notability. The assertion that this is not a medical topic is, frankly, ridiculous, and is only relevant because WP:MEDRS applies. Hut 8.5 14:23, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

The assertion that this is not a medical topic is not "ridiculous" at all. Not one piece of evidence has shown that this is a medical topic, no treatments are suggested in any of the citations presented, no symptoms are described, no medical journals cited. This topic does not need to meet the standards of WP:MEDRS and any debate which relies on those standards is flawed. Therefore, the debate was conducted incorrectly. Allegations were made regarding the use of sock-puppets were made by those supporting deletion, which is of course, a delusion on their part. If users cannot explain with cogent argument why a community is not notable, they should not delete the article. 62.254.76.153 (talk) 16:17, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

By "the debate was conducted incorrectly" I mean "there were procedural errors in the discussion" - things like not tagging the article with the appropriate template, or closing the discussion prematurely. You haven't alleged any such errors here. The fact that the article didn't claim to diagnose or treat disease doesn't mean it's not a medical topic. ASMR is supposedly a physical sensation in parts of the human body caused by particular external stimuli, that makes it a medical topic. Even if it was not a medical topic we still need significant coverage in third-party reliable sources and nothing you've pointed to qualifies. Many participants in the debate were meatpuppets, that makes matters worse. Hut 8.5 15:13, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Using derogatory terminology to identify participants who disagree with you is not conducive to civil discussion. I am not a "meat-puppet", I am a contributor and would like to be treated as such. Your own enlistment of those who support deletion is no different.

I note you said "ASMR is supposedly a physical sensation in parts of the human body caused by particular external stimuli, that makes it a medical topic." Can you show where you got that definition from? It is a very loose definition; it would include television, music, art and speech. Presumably you just created the definition to further your argument, which is not conducive to reaching a conclusion on this topic. If Wikipedia's guidelines suggest these topics are medical, please correct me. You yourself cite premature closure as an example of procedural error - it's apparent that the citations and arguments above were not made in the original argument thus it's closure was premature. 62.254.76.153 (talk) 16:17, 7 May 2012 (UTC)