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May 16

hdmi out tvs

do there exist tvs with hdmi out on them ??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.35.15.46 (talk) 02:03, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

Not that I'm aware of (and a blu-ray recorder with HDMI input seems to be equally absent from the store shelves). Maybe they are afraid you will be recording HD TV shows and distributing them on the internet for free. Astronaut (talk) 08:47, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Just curious: what would it be for? I'm not sure what the use would be, since most of the things that a TV displays are the results of other devices being sent in. (cable boxes, DVD players, Blu-Ray, cameras, etc.) Other than the light and sound being sent out for us humans to process, is there any other output originating directly from TVs? Mingmingla (talk) 00:17, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Recording is the obvious purpose, but you might also have another TV hooked in, either in another room or in the same large room (like a sports bar). StuRat (talk) 02:12, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Except that you don't record from the TV. You record from the signal that goes into the TV. The TV doesn't produce any signals of its own, so there is no need for an output, excepting as perhaps a pass-through. Sound outputs on TVs basically do this, they pass the sound signal through the TV so it can be sent to an external amplifier. I'm not sure why you would need to do that with a video signal. If you want to record what the TV is showing, split the signal and send it to a recording device. --Jayron32 02:16, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Let's say you have inputs to the TV from cable, satellite, the internet, broadcast TV and your DVD player. You want to be able to record any of that or play it on a second TV simultaneously. The easiest way would be if you had an HTML output from the TV and input into the recording device/2nd TV. Otherwise a rat's nest of wires and switch boxes would be required. StuRat (talk) 05:59, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

NOFX song "the cause"

I am trying to figure out a lyric in The Cause by NOFX, a song on the album Punk in Drublic. The line begins, "It's a scheme, a dream..." but I'm not sure how it ends. All of the lyrics websites say it's either "barterine" or "baterine", but those are not words. It sounds a little like "product ring" to me, but I'm not really sure. --130.56.71.52 (talk) 02:25, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

Bands and songwriters are not immune to making up words. See Pompatus. --Jayron32 21:20, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

Searching the internet for lyrics websites is what I do when pondering song lyrics. I sometimes check out a few different sites in case they have slightly different words, but in this case they seem to be settled on "It's a scheme, a dream, a barterine" Astronaut (talk) 08:39, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

May 17

No-no-no-no?

Has there ever been an Major League Baseball game in which both pitchers pitched a no-hitter? Or one pitching a no-hitter and another pitching a perfect game? 71.146.10.213 (talk) 05:54, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

A double no-hitter - for 9 innings - occured on May 2, 1917. Fred Toney was pitching for the Cincinnati Reds, and Hippo Vaughn for the Chicago Cubs. The game went into extra innings and Vaughn allowed a run on two hits in the top of the 10th inning. Toney then pitched a hitless bottom of the 10th and is officially credited with a no-hitter. There were a couple of perfect games that were broken up in extra innings (by Harvey Haddix on May 26, 1959 and Pedro Martinez on June 3, 1995), but their opponents only pitched shutout ball through 9 innings, not a no-hitter or a perfect game. --Xuxl (talk) 09:29, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Bob Hendley pitched a 1-hitter for the Cubs against the Dodgers in 1965. The one hit he gave up did not figure in the scoring. Meanwhile, Sandy Koufax pitched a perfect game for the Dodgers.[1] This remains the fewest hits by both teams for a regulation 9-inning game. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 12:03, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. 71.146.10.213 (talk) 03:40, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. 71.146.10.213 (talk) 03:40, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Also, what is the highest number of innings thrown by an MLB starting pitcher in a game? 71.146.10.213 (talk) 03:40, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Baseball Almanac says 26 for the NL, 24 for the AL. The really astounding things about these records is that the NL's Leon Cadore and Joe Oeschger battled each other for 26 innings (nearly three complete games), only to have it end in a tie due to darkness, while the AL's Jack Coombs and Joe Harris pitched into the 24th inning before Coombs emerged victorious, and the loser threw 20 consecutive scoreless innings (the slacker)! Clarityfiend (talk) 04:27, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Another amazing thing about that 26-inning game[2] is that it ran 3 hours and 50 minutes. There are 9-inning games that run about that long now. In those days, games typically started at 3 in the afternoon. So it was approaching 7 in the evening, and they called it on account of darkness. Supposedly both pitchers asked the umpire for one more inning, and he refused - and later supposedly said that he didn't want to see either of them lose it. It was May 1, and if it had been played closer to the solstice, maybe it could have gone 30 or 35. That was a bad game to be having a slump. A couple of guys went 0-for-10 and one went 0-for-11. That'll make a serious dent in a batting average. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 05:26, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Just to take off on a tangent, games almost called on account of darkness reminds me of one of the most amazing home runs in history. Apropos of nothing. Just popped into my head, and thought I'd share. --Jayron32 17:55, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. 71.146.10.213 (talk) 05:22, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. 71.146.10.213 (talk) 05:22, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Is this an original track?

The trailer for 'Cool it' has some pretty nifty music. In particular a track that starts around the 0:52 mark and lasts most of the trailer. Was this written for the film or is it an existing piece of music, and in either case is there anywhere I can find a copy of it? Trailer can be viewed at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtrIJDwlCs8, many thanks in advance. 130.88.172.34 (talk) 10:02, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Hertha BSC Berlin and Fortuna Düsseldorf

Will the 2012–13 Fußball-Bundesliga play with 17 or 19 clubs? --84.61.181.19 (talk) 11:04, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

There will be 18 clubs, but first the German Football Federation (DFB) has to rule on Hertha Berlin's appeal of its tie game with Düsseldorf on may 15th. Either the appeal is dismissed, in which case Düsseldorf is promoted to the Bundesliga, with Berlin relegated, or the appeal is upheld, and then - most likely - the deciding game will be replayed on neutral grounds. After which only one of the two clubs will gain a spot in the Bundesliga next year. The appeal was only filed yesterday and a ruling is expected Friday according to various news sources. --Xuxl (talk) 12:52, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Return to Me by Dean Martin and covered by Bob Dylan

I'm in the process of updating all the files in my audio media collection. Bob Dylan covered a song called "Return to Me" for The Sopranos soundtrack CD Peppers & Eggs. I also have an earleir recording of Dean Martin singing it, labeled with the italian "Ritorna Mi." I'm on a hunt to find out the very original artist to have recorded this song. I want to know if Dean Martin was the first artist to record it or if he was covering it too. I include that kind of information in my media organization.

However, I am very surprised to find no article about the song. Searching for "Return to Me" connects to an article about a movie of the same name. Searching by "Return to Me (song)" turns up nothing. My other main source for finding information on song media, Allmusic, doesn't yield satisfactory results either. A broad Google search was extremely cumbersome.

My first question. Why is there no article about this song? It seems to me to be wiki-worthy, especially in light of many song articles I find that seem to be much more obscure. Was there an article that was deleted for some reason?

My second question. Can anyone locate the information I need on who the original artist was? Or suggest a search method with a finer point than Google? Thanks.

Medleystudios72 (talk) 13:44, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

This site [3] lists the composers as Danny DiMinno and Carmen Lombardo, and claims it was originally written for Martin. Allmusic mentions DiMinno as the composer. The supposed Italian title (Ritorna Mi) does not sound like correct Italian to me (and google has very few results for what should be a standard phrase), so it could be fake Italian, --Xuxl (talk) 13:56, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. I saw the composer info on Allmusic, but Allmusic doesn't necessarily contain original recording artist verification - at least not easily. It just seemed to me to be some Italian Standard that was adapted for Dean. And yes, I also think "Ritorna Mi" (or Ritorna Me, as I also see it) could be a "popularized" version of pseudo-Italian for entertainment purposes. Medleystudios72 (talk) 14:05, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

I think the Italian is "Ritorna a me" and through elision (or synalepha if you will) it's sung as "Ritorn' a me". Deor (talk) 14:40, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

RPG

I'm wondering, can a game like Myst be considered an RPG? since you play the role of a particular character in order to complete the game. My friend argues that the only things that can be called RPGs are games that involve skill points, health bars and fighting, and whilst I accept that this is the standard definition, I countered that the name itself doesn't rule out a wide range of other games in theory, if someone wanted to make that case. I have an actual logical basis from semantics for saying that, but he refuses to accept, or even listen to, that point, simply because it isn't done in standard practice. So, which of us is right here?

Kitutal (talk) 17:45, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

wondering if I'd get a different answer asking under language than entertainment, since it's sort of both... Kitutal (talk) 17:47, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

You can call anything you want by any name, but if you want other people to understand or agree with you, it is best to use words as other people will understand them. Most people would not consider Myst to be an RPG, but rather a graphic adventure game with strong elements of hidden object games. What makes an RPG an RPG is primarly character development, for whatever that means within the gaming system. That is, as you play the game your character develops skills and "levels" and advances throughout the game. Without the possibility of character advancement, a game is just an adventure game. In Myst, you don't have a character that acquires skills and advancements. You simply click and drag on objects on the screen to solve brain teasers, solving said brain-teasers advances the plot of the story. --Jayron32 17:48, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

A "role" means you are playing as a character other than yourself. StuRat (talk) 17:52, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

I see. makes sense. so there's no actual rule that it has to involve fighting and such like? Kitutal (talk) 18:03, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Wrote this response when original question was posted at Humanities desk. Pertinent to your followup question too, I think.

I'd consider Myst to be something more like a puzzle game (despite that article's main focus on e.g. Minesweeper). The distinction between an RPG and anything else doesn't have to do with experience points, leveling up, or the presence/absence of fighting, but rather with the characterization of the game's protagonist (hence "role playing"). In an RPG, the most important factor is that the character grows and changes over the course of gameplay/the story. The player plays the role of the character and in the course of the quest that character changes significantly as a result of the player's actions. In something like Myst, by contrast, the protagonist is extremely hazily-defined, and all of the characterization is centered on the book-writer and his family. All of the problem solving is focused on the goal of solving riddles and bringing the story of the others (not the player) in the game to a close. The protagonist in Myst is there simply so the player can be in the world of the game, not as a real character. ☯.ZenSwashbuckler.☠ 18:05, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Answering the new question regarding fighting: I don't think fighting per se is part of the definition; however it is quite hard to find a single RPG which doesn't include fighting or violence of some sort, if only because fighting provides a convenient way to build skills and gain levels: kill easy baddies, get more skills, get to kill harder baddies, rinse, repeat. However, there are fighting games which are not RPGs, and there are also character driven games that are not RPGs. The deal with there not being an RPG that involves no fighting at all has less to do with fighting being an integral part of an RPG and more to do with fighting being an integral part of gaming, for the most part. You can, I suppose, create an RPG which has all of the elements of an RPG without any physical confrontation, violence, or fighting at all, but who is going to buy it. --Jayron32 18:31, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Seconding Jayron's point. Basically you could have an "RPG" that consisted entirely of making non-violent choices, but in practice it would take an extremely gifted writer to make that game not utterly boring (gifted enough to make a living writing novels and hence mostly not working for game developers, though as games become a more and more accepted form of storytelling art, I'm sure we'll see some games trend this way). Involving fighting in the game is the surest way to keep the player's interest up. Character-driven games that are any good have traditionally always involved fighting. I could see someone making a game in the Leisure Suit Larry mode, but there's only so much variation available (and skill required for gameplay!) in that format and I can't see it making the big bucks that you get from something like the Fable series (chopping heads with a sword > getting shot down at bars). And how many times are you going to play a mystery game once you already know the answer? Including violence and making its application a matter of skill ensures variation each time you play. As far as I know nobody's done this, but I see a "standard" RPG's skills sheet / strength chart as almost the kind of thing where you could make a short video of the numbers rising and put, say, Eye of the Tiger on the soundtrack and use it as a gorgeously nerdy training montage. Basically it's a dry, mathematical way to help you visualize how far your character's come since Level 1, how much he's grown since he got his ass kicked by the gang of trolls and swore revenge, and how close to ready he feels to take on the dreaded Rabbit of Caerbannog. ☯.ZenSwashbuckler.☠ 19:34, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

what about the Sims? Kitutal (talk) 18:57, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

I never played the Sims, so correct me if I'm way off base, but that's really more of a God game I think. See also Social simulation game. While you can develop the characters/lives of the people you control, it's in very general terms and there isn't really a single main protagonist who is more important than all others (and who the player "becomes" or pretends to be in order to play the game properly (immersively). An RPG intends the player to identify strongly with the protagonist, to feel what he feels and share in his triumphs - while the Sims intends the player to play around with the lives of a bunch of different people for no pre-defined purpose. ☯.ZenSwashbuckler.☠ 19:45, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

I disagree. Many of the classic early-ish computer RPGs (Wasteland, The Bard's Tale, etc.) involved playing as a party of adventurers, of which there was no clear protagonist. Regards, Orange Suede Sofa (talk) 20:00, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

I think The Sims (while not SimCity or others from the genre) has RPG-elements, but you couldn't primarily describe it as an RPG. After all, characters do have character traits, they do level up and gain skills, which is an RPG element, but as noted, it is primarily a social-simulation mixed with a God-game. --Jayron32 00:23, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

I can't reference this, but I don't think playing a role is enough to make an RPG. Like Jayron said, to be understood in discussions with others, you have to apply the industry understanding of what "RPG" means, even if it is pretty vague and flexible. You can't apply semantic logic, even if it technically makes sense. After all, you are playing a role outside of yourself in any game where the protagonist is named. Super Mario Bros. has you playing as Mario. Sonic has you playing as the titular hedgehog. Neither can be mistaken as RPGs. In the Sims, or simcity, or puzzle games, you aren't playing a role. You are you, explicitly controlling the little people on screen, so there is no role to be played. So while you are right, OP, that the name suggest flexibility, the truth is that for clarity's sake you should think of the term "RPG" as three letters that don't stand for anything anything other than what the standard definition says it is. Mingmingla (talk) 00:10, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Womens' chess

Ive always wondered where the outrage from feminists and others was about this. While I'll concede that it does take a certain degree of physical stamina to endure the mental rigors of top-level chess, it has to be at least 95%, if not more, mental. Chess is, for all intents and purposes, a mental sport. Yet men and women usually play in separate tournaments. Furthermore, the standards to become a Grandmaster are considerably lower for women. Doesn't this smack of sexism? Isn't this basically saying that women-generally speaking-can't play chess as well as men? Joefromrandb (talk) 20:11, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

It's not the same situation as in physical sports, where men and women are prevented from competing. Female players are not forbidden or dissuaded from participating in regular chess competitions. However, there is a much smaller pool of female players, and as a result only a few women have risen to the highest levels. Women's chess gives prominence to female players, which presumably encourages more women to learn the game. As for why so few women learn chess in the first place, one can only speculate. LANTZY^TALK 01:03, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

But what about my point about female Grandmasters having lower standards than their male counterparts? Is making it easier for a woman to become a GM meant to encourage more women to pick up the game? That to me seems like making women eligible for Mensa with a lower IQ score than that required of men, which I think would be insulting to most self-respecting women. Joefromrandb (talk) 01:57, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

I just want to clarify one point. There is a Woman Grandmaster (WGM) title that has lower requirements than the regular Grandmaster (GM) title, but some women obtain the same GM title as men do, meeting the same requirements. See FIDE titles. Bubba73 ^{You talkin' to me?} 02:23, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Yes, but as I understand it, only 3 women (the Polgar sisters, and one other whom I can't remember) hold a full-fledged GM title. Of course I could be wrong. Joefromrandb (talk) 02:27, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Besides two Polgar sisters, there are Hou Yifan, Alexandra Kosteniuk, Xu Yuhua, Antoaneta Stefanova, Zhu Chen, Xie Jun, Maia Chiburdanidze, Nona Gaprindashvili, Koneru Humpy and probably more. Bubba73 ^{You talkin' to me?} 03:20, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Gaprindashvili was the one I couldn't remember. The others must have reached this status somewhat recently. Joefromrandb (talk) 05:33, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Right - it was later. Other women who are full-fledged GMs include Ketevan Arakhamia-Grant, Viktorija Cmilyte, Pia Cramling, Nana Dzagnidze, and Monika Socko and there must be others. Bubba73 ^{You talkin' to me?} 20:13, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

And some more are: Ju Wenjun, Dronavalli Harika, Nadezhda Kosintseva, Tatiana Kosintseva, Marie Sebag, and Kateryna Lahno. Bubba73 ^{You talkin' to me?} 20:20, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

The concept of "grandmaster" doesn't have any absolute meaning. It refers only to the relative skill of a player compared to other players at a particular moment in history. When the average skill level rises or falls, so does the threshold of being a grandmaster. Once you divide the players into different groups according to arbitrary (non-chess-related) differences, you create different sets of statistics and different criteria for grandmastership. In principle, you can divide the players into any number of demographics and determine a grandmaster for each demographic: Jewish grandmasters, Texan grandmasters, lesbian grandmasters, etc. And if you compared these various grandmasters, some would be much stronger players than others, for a variety of historical reasons. The Jewish grandmaster would almost certainly beat the Texan grandmaster. This course of events would not be "insulting" to Texans, and it wouldn't say anything about the inherent ability of Texans to play chess. LANTZY^TALK 02:30, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

I don't know that I agree completely, but that is an interesting point. Joefromrandb (talk) 02:33, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

This isn't so much about arbitrary comparisons. What you say may be true, but if more were required for a Jew to reach full-fleged GM status than a Texan goy, I'd bet there would be outrage. Joefromrandb (talk) 02:36, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Indeed. My point is simply that the designation is arbitrary, because the average skill level of any given population is also arbitrary. There is no way of determining "absolute skill" in chess. If there were, then it might happen that no human being deserves to be called a grandmaster. It's a bit like the Oscars or the Nobel Prize. They give a prize out every year, but the skill level is different every year, so designations like "Nobellist" and "Oscar-winner" have no absolute meaning. LANTZY^TALK 02:55, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

The Nobel prizes and Oscars are awarded based on people's opinions. In chess there are objective ratings as well as direct competitions with other players. Bubba73 ^{You talkin' to me?} 03:23, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Hence my use of the phrase "a bit like". These things are similar in that the designations are relative, based on the competition at a particular moment. The average skill level of chess players varies over time, just as the quality of films differs from one year to the next. In neither case do the honorees achieve an absolute, changeless standard of excellence. LANTZY^TALK 04:00, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

But a GM title is nothing like a Nobel prize or an Oscar award. GM titles are based on objective critera whereas the others are subjective. Bubba73 ^{You talkin' to me?} 04:10, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

May 18

Buzzcocks cover

OK, with my previous question fallen on deaf ears (no offense), I ask another random musical query:

I just heard the Buzzcocks' song "Ever Fallen in Love (With Someone You Shouldn'tve)" on the radio, and although I had never heard the Buzzcocks before I recognized it. I remember it appearing in a movie, but I'm sure the version in the movie was a cover. What movie could it have been, and what band would have covered it? Help me out!!

75.73.226.36 (talk) 02:20, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

According to the article, Ever_Fallen_in_Love_(With_Someone_You_Shouldn't've) has appeared on several soundtracks covered by different bands. If you look at the list, maybe you'll find the one you're thinking of. RudolfRed (talk) 02:38, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

I know the feeling. I used to work in cornfields, and everything I said fell on deaf ears. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 05:20, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

That's why the corn cob married the potato. He was her eyes, and she was his ear. -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 08:43, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

The Fine Young Cannibals did a cover of it that was quite successful commercially. I really liked it... until I heard the foot-stompingly brilliant original. Now I can't bear the cover. --Dweller (talk) 11:32, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

I figured it out: it was Pete Yorn's version in Shrek 2. Thanks! 75.73.226.36 (talk) 11:53, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

As an aside, you should listen to more Buzzcocks. Fantastically great punk band. My favorite song is "What do I get", but their catalogue is filled with gems. Solid band. --Jayron32 15:34, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

As a further aside, everyone should listen to more Buzzcocks. - Jmabel | Talk 07:22, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Well, not everyone. I took Jayron's advice and listened to that clip he recommended. Certainly not my cup of tea, and I won't be giving them any more of my precious auditory attention, but horses for courses, as they say. -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 19:16, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Do you know what's the name of...

this underwear model? [4]. 84.110.45.1 (talk) 11:01, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Well, it's not Vin Diesel. :-) StuRat (talk) 17:48, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Mythbusters - Fizzy Drink Tests Episode

I recently watched a repeat of the Mythbusters episode were they are using fizzy drinks to clean stuff. When the part were they used it on the teeth, me and my friends started arguing about the test (and therefor missed the rest of the show). The argument being that when they put the teeth into the glasses with the fizzy drinks, they are left in for (I think) 24 to 48 hours, and that would be like me sitting here with a mouth full of fizzy drink for over a day.
I have seen other shows were they have done the same or similar tests, including the duration the teeth are left in the fizzy drinks. I am not agruing that fizzy drinks are bad for my teeth but my question was how accurate are these tests ? 80.254.146.140 (talk) 11:18, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

By allowing the teeth to soak longer, it would create a much more visible range of difference between the different drinks, thereby making it easier to determine the most effective. Yes, realistically you wouldn't soak your teeth for 48 hours in in soda, but for the sake of testing their method makes sense. --192.139.119.4 (talk) 12:55, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

It makes sense as an experiment to find if fizzy drinks can make teeth rot, but as an experiment into whether fizzy drinks can make teeth rot in the process of drinking, it seems a naive and useless methodology to me. --Dweller (talk) 13:00, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

So, when people say to "Drinking fizzy drinks is bad for my teeth because..." and mention those experments and their results, are they right or wrong ? 80.254.146.140 (talk) 13:55, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

The idea is that each drink exposes your teeth to the fizzy drink for maybe 5 minutes, and over a lifetime, that quickly adds up to 48 hours (that would be about 500 drinks at 5 minutes each, you could do that in a year easy). StuRat (talk) 17:45, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

I was always under the impression was fizzy drinks left a residue of sugar everywhere in your mouth which speeds up the growth of plague. 130.88.172.34 (talk) 21:19, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

The combination of dissolving the protective coating on the teeth and then feeding sugar to the bacteria in the plaque is far worse than either alone. StuRat (talk) 23:08, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Why on earth can't anybody say Coca Cola? It's obvious that's what the Mythbusters program was about. HiLo48 (talk) 21:57, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Not to me. Pepsi is just as bad and Mountain Dew may be the worst of all. StuRat (talk) 23:06, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Have you seen the Mythbusters episode? It obviously wasn't Mountain Dew. It might have been Pepsi, but my impression was that the presenters were going out of their way to tell us it was Coca Cola without actually saying the name. In their case I can understand it would be for commercial (and possibly legal) reasons. But we are not so constrained. HiLo48 (talk) 23:17, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

I wasn't saying it could have been Mountain Dew in that episode, I'm saying MD may be even worse for your teeth. I think the reason is that you can drink more of it than a cola. (At least with me, too much cola makes me feel ill, so I stop.) StuRat (talk) 23:37, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Please identify

English actor named Charles. Colour movies. Retired. Played upper crust and german officers. Kittybrewster ☎ 16:32, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Charles Dance? --TammyMoet (talk) 17:20, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Older than him. Retired. Kittybrewster ☎ 17:29, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

So, are you gonna share with us, Kitty? -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 21:04, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Spouse misidentified someone looking like Charles Gray. Kittybrewster ☎ 21:18, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

So does he have dark hair and a square face? Robert Vaughn perhaps? --TammyMoet (talk) 10:46, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Resolved? If it is Robert Vaughn, he's still making TV programmes in the UK and not retired. Kitty? --TammyMoet (talk) 17:50, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Kitty marked it Resolved without telling us who it was. That's why I asked (almost 24 hours ago). I'm presuming her reference to Charles Gray was the answer, but it's somewhat vague .... -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 19:13, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Spouse saw him in the street and gave me the info. Probably wrong since Charles Gray is dead. Not Robert Vaughn. Kittybrewster ☎ 19:43, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

So, are you saying it isn't resolved after all. And never was? Do you still want us to help you, Kitty? -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 19:52, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

And aren't you going to put us out of our misery? Who is it then!--TammyMoet (talk) 08:26, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

I think it was a non-notable man who resembled charles Gray. Kittybrewster ☎ 12:01, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

So, it's not resolved, then. I've removed the misleading "Resolved" tag pending actual resolution. -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 12:23, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Before WW II. Big bulgy eyes. Kaiser helmet. Kittybrewster ☎ 20:21, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

If he was making films before WWII, as an adult old enough to be a German officer, that would make him at least 100 years old now, probably more like 110-120. Are you quite, quite sure he's still alive? -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 00:06, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Yes. The films portrayed him wearing german officer uniform but were made in colour and are therefore post c.1947. Kittybrewster ☎ 19:59, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

So, what was "Before WW II" meant to tell us? Kitty, I think I'll dub you Madame Crypto-Misleado. You seem to be going out of your way to make sure you don't get the answer to this question, what with a misleading "Resolved" tag when it wasn't resolved, and now a false clue. You must help us to help you, not hinder us. -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 20:38, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Spouse has leaked detail slowly. the real man was spotted having parkinson's in the street and recognised as as actor who has played german/prussian officers. spouse thought it was charles gray and then it became resolved. then spouse changed their mind so it became unresolved. Kittybrewster ☎ 21:51, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

May 19

Is there a name for this heavy metal musical technique?

Resolved

 – – Kerαunoςcopia^◁_galaxies 17:45, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Only recently finding out there are names to techniques like Alberti bass and Mannheim rocket, I was wondering if there was a name for the simple and often used technique of filling in the gaps of a melody or ornamentation (played on a guitar, for example) with either bass notes—the root, I guess—or some other pattern. I've looked at Heavy metal music#Relationship with classical music (and other sections) and Baroque music#Styles and forms and the closest things I can find are Basso continuo#Basso continuo, but that's not it, and maybe Pedal point, though maybe this is a variation.

Some examples (time aligned) from Youtube (please note your computer's volume, the metal songs may be loud): Metallica's "Master of Puppets" (cover), Bach Fugue, and Children of Bodom, end of Towards Dead End

Thanks!!– Kerαunoςcopia^◁_galaxies 01:07, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

The technique of making a monophonic instrument play two or more voices by using rapid alternations of pitches separated by relatively large intervals, is called pseudopolyphony or implied polyphony, and the result is called a compound melodic line. So I'd say that the term you are looking for is a compound melodic line, where the lower voice is a pedal point. (And yes, I know an electric guitar is a polyphonic instrument, but in the Master of puppets link, it was mostly played monophonically in the phrases in question). --NorwegianBlue ^talk 21:56, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Pedal point it is! Thanks so much! – Kerαunoςcopia^◁_galaxies 17:45, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Old Cartoon about elfs/dwarfs who work in a forest making milk/drink?

I remember an old cartoon about some kind of elves or dwarves who work in a forest making some kind of drink. And then maybe the elves drink this milk or something that turns them into dark evil elves, but the good white milk changes them back. I think the evil elves were blue or something. Any of this ring a bell?

Also what is this name of this old black and white cartoon, theres a big mean guy with a beard, and he slaps around this cat or kid at the docks? --Gary123 (talk) 02:13, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

The first one sounds like a mangled version of The Sunshine Makers, in which cheerful workers bottle and deliver sunshine in what look like milk bottles, and battle others who like being sad. Clarityfiend (talk) 03:03, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Soccer teams of Europe

Which team in France gets support from the ethnic minorities meaning Arabs and Africans? Which team in Belgium gets support from the ethnic minorities meaning Africans? Which team in England gets support from the ethnic minorities meaning South Asians, Arabs, Africans, Iranians and Turks? Which team in Spain gets support from ethnic minorities meaning Africans? which team in Portugal gets support from ethnic minorities meaning Africans and which team gets support from ethnic minorities meaning Arabs and Africans? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.92.151.226 (talk) 04:38, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

All of them. --Jayron32 18:37, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

LOL. Great response Jayron. This is a really weird question. It involves so many questionable assumptions it's impossible to answer in any direct and helpful way. HiLo48 (talk) 21:58, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Name for the array of monitors and controls used by sound technician?

Is there a name for the array of monitors and controls used by a sound technician during a live performance? On Commons, someone created a category Commons:Category:Monitor world (sound reinforcement). I'm extremely suspicious of that name, and seriously doubt it has any currency, but I don't have a better term to suggest.- Jmabel | Talk 07:25, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Mixing console (aka audio mixer, sound board, etc.)? Clarityfiend (talk) 08:05, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

That's what I'd have called it when I was playing music circa the 1970s, but the person who created this category seems to have that sort of thing as subcategories: Commons:Category:Monitor mixers‎, Commons:Category:Multicore cables (sound reinforcement), Commons:Category:Stage monitor racks‎, Commons:Category:Stage monitors. - Jmabel | Talk 17:26, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Real Madrid

If Iker Casillas , the team captain , isn't on-pitch (substituted,sent off,etc.) who will wear the captian armband? Marcelo Sergio Ramos or Higuain or other? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wzmileksir (talk • contribs) 11:28, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Jazz and singles

hello,

is this correct to call a separately released Jazz tune "single", or is this term only for non-compositions? Regards.--GoP_T^C_{N 21:15, 19 May 2012 (UTC)}

To inverstigate your question, I googled it, but was rather surpried that the first several hits were to dating sites. So I needed to break out of my filter bubble, and DuckDuckWent it instead. (I've no idea why google believes I would be insterested in this sourt of stuff. Honest! And it's difficult to se where the ads stop and the results begin). The DuckDuckGo result was a lot less noisy, and explained the hits on dating sites: there is a British dating site for people who share an interest in jazz called www.jazzsingles.co.uk. And there was a link to a (nonresponsive) American site as well. Most of the remaining hits that I checked were hits on relevant sites, where "jazz singles" mostly referred to jazz compositions released in single format, whether they were cover versions or original performances. If you want to refer to a jazz composition without reference to performer, you could use "jazz song", or "jazz composition" (as you did). --NorwegianBlue ^talk 22:49, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

The term "single" gets abused a bit, but it referes to a specific type of recording, one that has a single song on each side of a vinyl record disk. This usage became quite anachronistic as that type of media has died out, but it never meant just a "song", although in modern usage, the term has become confused with "song". So yes, there were Jazz singles, insofar as you could purchase a single-format recording which had jazz music on it. In the 1990s, when compact discs became the standard format for music, there started to be released "CD singles" and "CD Maxi singles" which were actually of a length that used to be called "EPs" or "Extended Play" records on vinyl. An EP had 2-3 songs (say, 10 minutes) on each side of the disc. A "record album" or "LP" or "Long Play" had 5-6 songs (say, 20-25 minutes) on each side. Now that most music is bought digitally, these terms have little meaning. Every song can be purchased as a stand-alone piece of music, so the idea of "singles" "EPs" and "LPs" are historical things. Singles used to come in several formats, most home consumers bought what were called "45s", which were played at 45 RPM, and usually came in a small 7-inch format. Record stations and DJs used what were called "12 inch singles" which were larger and also played at 45 RPM. Prior to the 1950s, the most popular single format was the 10-inch, 78 RPM disc, referenced in the Aerosmith song "Big Ten Inch Record", a format that even by the 1970s was outdated such that Aerosmith could make an oldy-sounding song about it. --Jayron32 23:11, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

"Big Ten Inch Record" was an oldie by the time Aerosmith recorded it. Bull Moose Jackson had originally recorded it in 1952. --Metropolitan90 (talk) 04:17, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks Jayron (always a help!) I will change it to "single". Regards.--GoP_T^CN 09:51, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

All the original recordings were "singles". The earliest ones didn't even have a "B" side. You could buy physical "albums" to store these singles in (the modern equivalent is the CD albums you can find most anywhere). Longer recordings, such as symphonies and operas, required multiple "singles" in these "album" folders. So the term "album" in reference to an LP was a natural term to use. I don't know for sure, but I suspect 45s came along around the time portable record players came along, in the 1950s. 45s were obviously much lighter to carry in the types of "album" books designed to carry collections of 45s. 45s and 78s co-existed at least through the 1950s, and until the mid-1960s or so a typical stereo had a second needle for use with 78s, which had a different groove structure. Of course, you had to allow for the big hole in the middle of 45s, and there were several approaches for it. Those portable players often had a little disk in the middle that you lift and set in place so the 45 would be stable. Finally, artists stopped releasing stuff on both 45 and 78, and just focused on 45. Just as LPs for awhile were on both vinyl and CD, and generally now only CD. Similar evolution currently in process with film, videotape, DVD, and BluRay. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 17:23, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Adaptor intended to be placed in the big hole of a 45 rpm record to play on a conventional spindle. This is distinct from the simpler stubby cylinder adaptors that were intended to be attached to the spindle or turntable itself.

Oh, dear, I get to be the old guy.

Even by the 1930s (and I believe in the 1920s), "albums" in more or less the modern sense were pretty common, though of course they consisted of a literal album containing multiple 78 RPM records. You could get multi-disc versions of any of Beethoven's symphonies, for example, but (for example) the Almanac Singers' recording of songs of the Spanish Civil War came out as an album of 78s, which I had as a child. No, it was not new at the time I had it.

45s and 33s both date from the late 1940s. There was also a 16-2/3 speed, which ended up used mostly for spoken-word records for the blind.

The last stand of 78 RPM records was children's records, which continued to be released on 78 into the early 1960s. - Jmabel | Talk 03:12, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

The inserts, as shown here, were one of at least 3 systems. Another was the little pop-up thing I talked about, for players that could only handle one record at a time. The third was an adapter for the record-changer, the tall spindle with a little "trip" mechanism to make the next one in a stack of records drop into the play position, which was common on non-portable players. You would slide that cyclindrical adapter over the spindle and it would work the same way. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 08:46, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Identify UK TV advert

I was reminded the other day of an advert from the late 70's (or thereabouts) - rather sexist by today's standards, but still amusing. It went something like:

MAN: What are we having for dinner tonight?
For i = 1 to {reasonably large number}

MAN: Is it {synonym of delicious}?

WIFE: Yes!

SHOT OF PRODUCT

Next
MAN: What is it?
WIFE: Suet pudding.
FX: Off-screen domestic violence
V/O: Give them what they really want - {name of product}
MAN: SUET PUDDING!!!

A search on "suet pudding advert", not unexpectedly, gives us adverts for suet pudding, which isn't the case here. Can anyone remember what the advert was actually for? Tevildo (talk) 21:15, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Think you need to edit because I don't remember the mathematical explanation being in there... but I'll leave it to you Tevildo cos I could be wrong! --TammyMoet (talk) 08:24, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Was it Caramac or Angel Delight? --TammyMoet (talk) 11:48, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Not Caramac, it was definitely a "meal" rather than a "snack" item. It might have been Angel Delight, although I had the impression it was a savoury rather than a sweet product - I'll see if I can find some Angel Delight adverts of the era. Incidentally, that photo in the Angel Delight article is positively obscene... Tevildo (talk) 12:18, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Think I meant Caramelle rather than Caramac. Another thought: was it Fray Bentos pies? --TammyMoet (talk) 09:55, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Mmmm... Tinned meat pies! Proper British fast food... except you had to cook the bloody things for half an hour, and even then the pastry had an unpleasant slimey consistency. I don't remember the ad I'm afraid, despite a depressingly comprehensive memory of 1960s marketing campaigns. Who else remembers the cartoon crow that used to advertise Farrows' tinned peas? BTW I rather think Angel Delight was a product of the 1970s, displacing "Instant Whip" and all those blancmanges that we used to eat. Alansplodge (talk) 00:07, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

I stand corrected: Angel Delight says it was launched in 1967. Alansplodge (talk) 00:11, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

lyrics question

In "Wonderful World" by Sam Cooke, is it "I dont claim to be an A student", or "ace student"? 87.194.239.235 (talk) 22:29, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

"an A student". RudolfRed (talk) 22:41, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Definitely "A student". Great song by the way.--GoP_T^C_{N 09:51, 20 May 2012 (UTC)}

Thanks. 87.194.239.235 (talk) 20:55, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

May 20

Seeking a "brothers" band

Hi. I was listening to a rerun of American Top 40 today; I don't know what year it was from, but doubtless from the 1970s. Among the songs on the roster was one by a band called the "[Something] Brothers", which consisted, Kasem (the DJ) said, of two brothers (with the surname [Something]). One of their earlier songs (not the one he played) had been covered more than a hundred times over the years, and had made them loads of money. The song he played though, was their own (not a cover). I'm seeking their last name; alas, all I remember of it is that it ended in a vowel sound (probably a non-silent e; the name Anende sounds about right (but isn't right)). Any ideas? (I know this isn't much to go on.)—msh210℠ 20:00, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Allman Brothers ? StuRat (talk) 20:06, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

The Everly Brothers? The Doobie Brothers? The Isley Brothers (lots of 'brothers' bands in the 70s...) --Onorem♠Dil 20:12, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Nope, but thanks for trying. It was none of those. I should mention also that the show I heard today aired on KZQZ-AM (in case that helps anyone figure out what year it was from) and that I think Kasem said the earlier song (the one covered so many times) had been from 1950s (but I'm not sure).—msh210℠ 20:15, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

I thought I had it with Isley...Shout was much covered and came out in 59. I'll keep looking. --Onorem♠Dil 20:28, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Whoever they are, they're not listed as "[Something] Brothers" at Category:Sibling musical duos.—msh210℠ 20:31, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Lots of "Brothers" weren't, e.g. The Righteous Brothers and The Walker Brothers. Clarityfiend (talk) 21:17, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

But he said these were brothers, which those two (I think) were not.—msh210℠ 21:21, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Oh, I've remembered something else. Whatever song Kasem played (i.e., not the heavily covered one from the '50s) had a long title, long enough to make me wonder if it had parentheses in it.—msh210℠ 20:44, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Alessi Brothers? Oh Lori was quite big here in the UK in about 1977 or 1978. Britmax (talk) 21:53, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. The name sounds right, but the dates don't (they were too late), and they don't seem to have such a heavily covered song.—msh210℠ 21:55, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

The Bellamy Brothers were real-life siblings; they released "If I Said You Had a Beautiful Body Would You Hold It Against Me", which is long title. But their dates don't seem to match your parameters. -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 03:15, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

From what I can tell through various searches, there are two AT40 programs featuring Casey Kasem that are being broadcast - reruns of shows from the 70s and reruns of shows from the 80s. This website list the songs played on each. For this past weekend, the only "brothers" act appears on the 70s playlist, the Addrisi Brothers, who our article tells us wrote "Never My Love", which has been covered dozens of times and "was the second most-played song on radio and television of the 20th century." --LarryMac | Talk 13:08, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Although the song title in that link (now corrected, incidentally) is just "Slow Dancin'", according to allmusic.com the full title is "Slow Dancin' Don't Turn Me On", which is not particularly long, but to my ears sounds like it could be partially parenthetical. Their other minor hit of the early 70's was "We've Got to Get it on Again". You can find performances of both songs on YouTube. --LarryMac | Talk 21:00, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Thank you very much!! Yes, "Never My Love" was the song Kasem mentioned (he said it'd been covered more than a hundred times, I believe), and "Slow Dancin' Don't Turn Me On" was indeed the song I heard (great song, incidentally, and one I'd never AFAIK heard before).—msh210℠ 03:55, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Incidentally, the still shown at the 50-second mark in this YouTube video includes the title "SLOW DANCIN' (DON'T TURN ME ON)" (sic, with parentheses).—msh210℠ 04:06, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

I've moved them out of Category:Musical duos and into the sub-cat Category:Sibling musical duos. -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 19:36, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Georges Méliès and the Star Films catalogue

Many of the films created by the legendary French filmmaker Georges Méliès have a number in something called a Star Films catalogue. I know that Star Films was Melies' film studio, and that Playing Cards, which is listed as number 1 in the catalogue - See here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IKvSErVidQ - was apparently Melies' first film. This leads me to believe that the order of the Star Films catalogue denotes the release order of Melies' films, however I do not know this for sure. One point that confuses me is that some films have multiple numbers in the Star Films Catalogue. For example The Haunted Castle is number 78-80. If the number denotes the order of release, then it wouldn't make any sense for The Haunted Castle to be the 78th, 79th, and 80th film to be released. Its only one film!

Can anyone confirm what the order of films in the Star Films catalogue means?--Jpcase (talk) 20:43, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

May 21

Christopher nolan

Was Mr. Christopher Nolan an assistant to any cine personality for cinematic techniques like direction/editing/cinematography etc.? Has he done a course for any of the above mentioned studies? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.224.149.10 (talk) 04:36, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Is our Christopher Nolan article about the man you mean ? (It's a common name, so I want to be sure.) StuRat (talk) 04:45, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Yes, the director of Dark Knight

He worked as cinematographer and editor on his first two films, Following and the short film Doodlebug[5] but he doesn't seem to have formally studied filmmaking. His partly self-taught and partly learned through the film society at University College London. Most likely, he worked on other people's amateur films during his childhood and student days, but he's not listed as doing paid work for anybody else on any commercial films. --Colapeninsula (talk) 13:16, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Pause button, play button

Does anyone know where the designs for the pause button (two vertical bars), play button (right-pointing triangle), fast-forward button (two right-pointing triangle), stop button (square), etc., came from? They're now pretty much found everywhere from smartphones to MP3 players to DVD players to flash videos but where did they originate? I'm guessing they were first developed for cassette players, so maybe around the 1970s, but it would be interested to find a first recorded use or designer even. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.206.101.76 (talk) 11:33, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Checking out google images, they don't appear to have been used on 8-tracks, which were an early portable audio tape system. They would have been useless on a record player. So that leaves cassette audio and possibly reel-to-reel to check out. Here's the thing, though: When you're dealing with physical buttons, the words are sufficient. I can't recall ever seeing a reel-to-reel with those symbols, and I don't think they were used in early cassettes, either. The reason for adopting non-language symbols like that would likely be for international markets and for "virtual" buttons like on computers. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 12:25, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Not at all. The words may be sufficient for you, but it doesn't necessarily follow that they are for everyone. If a play button on a CD player is labelled ►, for example, that is a lot clearer than one marked PLAY. It's shorter, neater and completely intuitive, so please stop making meaningless generalizations. --Viennese Waltz 12:50, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Yes, you're right. I intended to say they were sufficient at the time. Obviously not now. Totally guessing here, but if there were cassette recorders being sold in non-English countries, they might well have had to print words in that language... until someone came up with the famous language-independent symbols. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:16, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

The booklet for my first video cassette recorder, from about 1981, already has the well-known symbols - as well as the corresponding English words. Looking now for my early-1970s audio cassette recorder. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:46, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Booklet for my first audio cassette recorder, from about 1970, has the arrows and the words, but does not have a pause feature at all - just a stop/eject. Likewise with one from 1971 or 1972, which shows the standard symbols and words, including a little black square for "stop", but again no pause button. It was either playing/recording - or it was stopped. No in-between. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 00:01, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

That brings up a further point. "►" may be fine for left to right scripts, as it is general considered forward movement, but what about in countries reading right-to-left: do they reverse the triangle? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.206.101.76 (talk) 13:06, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Those arrows describe the physical direction the tape is moving, so switching them could be even more confusing. I may be wrong, but I think CD's spin counterclockwise, which would be left-to-right at the front of the player. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:49, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Of course, the play symbol still appears on digital music players, which have no moving media the arrow is supposed to indicate the direction of. --Jayron32 00:08, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Sure. It's just that everyone now is used to the standard symbols, independent of the physical media. Old habits. Like the sound you hear when you pick up a land-line phone, a "dial tone", never mind that no one "dials" anymore. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 08:32, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Some theories - Jarry1250 ^{[Deliberation needed]} 13:03, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

(after edit conflict) This Grundig reel-to-reel recorder from 1963 already had the arrows for forward/backward (a rather intuitive choice) and the red circle for record (a pretty arbitrary symbol). The Grundig C100 from 1965 had the double arrows for fast forward/rewind, but text labels for all other buttons. At the time, it seems like Philips and Grundig were the only ones offering cassette players, and the Philips models of the time had text labels until 1966 or 1967 (when they adopted the symbols we know today), so it looks like those symbols were designed by someone working for Grundig. According to this forum discussion, these symbols were defined as an international standard by the IEC in 1973 (IEC417 -Graphical symbols for use on equipment), but I don't know if the earliest version of the IEC definition already included the pause symbol....from going through the images at the cassette recorder museum, it looks like the pause symbol did not become an established standard until well into the 1970s (of course, early tape recorders mostly didn't have a pause function, so there was no need for a standardized symbol early on). -- Ferkelparade π 13:08, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Interesting question. I always assumed the symbols were chosen because they were clear about tape movement and direction. The red for record being a color of warning--careful, you don't want to accidentally record over something you want to keep! I'm pretty sure I've seen red arrows in addition to red circles. The double lines for pause I always guessed had to do with how tape heads look, [6] (but this is just a guess). Finally, for what it's worth, here is a photo of a 1974 Polish reel-to-reel machine showing those symbols (you have to zoom in to see clearly). It's a non-English example anyway: File:Unitra ZK-147.jpg. Also, I would think the symbols are more likely to originate with reel-to-reel machines than cassette players. It's more important to know which way the tape is moving with open reels than with cassettes. The fast forward and rewind functions are particularly linked to the way the spinning reels look when working with those machines. And the visual idea "I want all the tape to be on that reel", press button with arrows pointing toward that reel. The reels in cassettes are more hidden from view, and unlike open reels you don't unwind the tape completely from one of the reels. Pfly (talk) 00:44, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

About the pause button. I thought the main point of it was to be able to engage the recording head without starting the tape moving—pressing both pause and record. That way you can immediately start recording without the record head having to physically move up to the tape, which would involve a small amount of time and needless head movement. The pause button seems much less useful on cassette players. At least, back in the 1980s when I was recording in a studio on reel-to-reel machines "pause-record" was the way we were taught. I wonder if early reel-to-reel machines did not let you engage the record head without moving the tape, or if perhaps they had some other way to do it—perhaps you could engage the heads with a lever or something? Pfly (talk) 01:06, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

May 22

Black and white movie - cold graves

Hello. This is a real shot in the dark, but I'm looking for a black and white movie (probably late fifties, American) that I saw on TCM years ago. The only thing I remember about this film is one scene, where a female is explaining to the protagonist that on hot nights, she likes to go to the cemetery because the graves are nice and cold to the touch. I would be so happy if anyone can figure this out. 74.69.117.101 (talk) 04:17, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

It's In the Heat of the Night (the movie, not the later TV series). Here's the script: [7]. Do a find (Control F) on "coolest" to see the relevant part. May we mark this Q resolved ? StuRat (talk) 04:30, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Only trouble is, it's a color film. However, here's the clip.[8] The comment in question comes about 2 minutes in. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 08:24, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Maybe the OP saw it on a B/W TV? I think did on my (only) viewing years ago, but my memory's blurred because I'd previously read the book. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 84.21.143.150 (talk) 12:00, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Minesweeper record

I just did a record on beginner minesweeper and I noticed there is no such here http://www.minesweeper.info/wiki/World_Record_History. So I wanted to ask you if I could send you a screenshot of it. The record is 0 seconds on beginner!I justed clicked at random and everything was solved. (The mines were placed in a way that one lucky click could solve everything at once). And it was on linux. So ,if I send the screenshot to you, will you put it on the record list? Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.177.134.174 (talk) 13:15, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Sorry, this is the help page for Wikipedia, the online encyclopedia. We don't have any connection to the minesweeper game, and we don't display video games records. You will have to find some other way to contact them. --Colapeninsula (talk) 13:19, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

black/white - ferroseed

how does ferroseed evolve? I'd look this up elsewhere but my parents don't let me on to most sites