Talk:Roza Shanina

Notability

Is she famous for being hot —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.108.3.220 (talk) 07:48, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

No, she is famous for shooting people. She was hot, though.--172.191.205.200 (talk) 05:46, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Some confusion over the accuracy of the dates that she received the Orders of Glory, June 18th and September 22nd. Excerpts from http://www.airaces.narod.ru/snipers/w1/shanina1.htm say that she received Order of Glory 3rd Class on 1st of May 1944 ("Накануне Первомая 1944 года" = "On the eve of the 1st of May 1944"). The same excerpts from the biography and letters from her friend P. Molchanov on May 28th (which you can find on that same page) also suggest that 3rd Class was received far before June 18th. Additionally, since she was mentioned as having received some Order of Glory in the June 9th issue of the newspaper "Уничтожим врага!" (from first line of http://www.a-z.ru/women_cd2/12/4/i80_207.htm), I think May 1st is probably the right date for it, rather than June 18th.

Additionally, I'm not sure September 22nd is the right date for the Class-2 one, since cross-referencing the biography and her diary excerpts are written as though she received the 2nd Class Order of Glory before some events that took place in late June (during said Belarus/Litva campaign). Maybe the Class-2 Order of Glory is June 18th?

Either way, I could be wrong, but I'm just curious where these dates were obtained from, I'd like to know, too. :) 173.55.242.194 (talk) 12:21, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for pointing out. 18 June actually comes from Ovsyankin ("Документы, выявленные в то время, помогли восстановить некоторые подробности фронтовой жизни юной северянки. "В Советской Армии с 22 июня 1943 года, – гласил один из них. – На фронте с 5 апреля 1944 года. 18 июня и 22 сентября награждена орденом Славы 3-й, а затем 2-й степени"). The reason I'm still in doubt about the 1st May source credibility is that it incorrectly writes Valentina Nikonova instead of Valentina Nikolayeva. The best option is to contact the Archive of Russian Defense Ministry on behalf of this. Twilightchill t 01:12, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

dont talk down to me boy! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.202.41.66 (talk) 20:23, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

Ah. Interesting, thanks for the link, I missed those... strange that they don't match up with the other documents. As for the Nikonova/Nikolaeva discrepancy, it was noted in those excerpts that use of "Nikonova" and "Nikolaeva" just differ across editions of her biography, and it's speculated it could just be that the author chose to slightly change it in one edition. (I'm sure you saw that, not sure how accurate that is.)

"[ Следует отметить, что во всех других изданиях, например бывшего командующего 5-й армией Маршала Н. И. Крылова - "Навстречу победе", письмах самой Р. Шаниной, фамилия Валентины Петровны указывается как "Николаева" ( вместо "Никонова" у Н. А. Журавлёва - автора повести о Розе Шаниной ). Скорее всего, автор слегка изменил фамилию героини. Да и сам факт её трагической гибелью остаётся под вопросом. Так, Роза Шанина в своём дневнике пишет о 2-х пленённых девушках в Мае 1944 года: Ане Нестеровой и Любе Танайловой.

Известно, что Валентина Петровна Николаева является кавалером ордена Славы 3-й степени. Согласно письму Розы Шаниной, к П. Молчанову от 31 Августа 1944 года: "...наконец мы снова в бою. Все ходили на передовую. Счёт увеличивается. У меня самый большой - 42 убитых гитлеровца, у Екимовой - 28, у Николаевой - 24", на счету В. П. Николаевой не менее 24 убитых фашистов и к концу Августа она была жива и продолжала сражаться... ]"

Either way, it does note that Valentina's death's was entirely under question, regardless of whether or not Nikonova/Nikolaeva is indeed just a difference in editions, granted that Shanina wrote about a Nikolaeva later, as the quote states. And, of course, I'm sure the biography is possibly full of poetic licenses, with regards to the chronology of events, so my speculations about May 1st is mostly rooted in the fact that she had already received the award by the time the June 9th "Уничтожим врага!" issue was published. If there's a way to contact something as credible as the Ministry, that'd be fantastic. Either way, great work around here, article is becoming excellent! 173.55.242.194 (talk) 01:32, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Roza Shanina/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 04:37, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

I'll be reviewing this article shortly. From a scan it sounds like a very interesting person. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 04:37, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Here are the issues I found:

• "Roza with her fellow girl" fellow girls?
• "Roza sometimes returned from her fellow countrymen of Ustya Raion" not sure what is meant here.
• Soviet institutes of secondary education sounds like it should be all capitalized, but I could be wrong.
• All the paragraphs starting with dates feels repetitive; mix it up a bit.
• there are times where use a comma after a year and times you don't (i.e. june 22, 1944 and june 24, 1944,); make it consistent.
• "In May, 1944" when it's just the day and month a comma isn't needed.
• "Shanina was awarded the Order of Glory 3rd class for actions in the battle for the village Kozyi Gory" for her actions...village of Kozyi
• "during that time, from April 6 to April 11," during that time not needed.
• "To preserve military secrecy in her diary Shanina termed the killed and wounded "blacks" and "reds", respectively" cite preferred for this
• "Shanina was among the first woman snipers" first female snipers sounds better to me here.
• "she regretted for having done so little." for not needed
• "She is the only person, killed in these places, whose body was not transferred in 1953 to the mass grave of Soviet soldiers" neither comma needed.
• "Sergey was also killed, leaving Marat as the only surviving brother." I'd clarify that you post onyl surviving brother from the war; at least I assume that's what you meant. That paragraph should be cited as well.
• I would request a copyedit; ask either at WP:GOCE or WP:MILHIST (the latter might be better since goce is a couple weeks backlogged right now) as the prose is quite rough in some spots. It's not so bad that I would fail this, but it's enough to keep me from passing it.

I'll put the article on hold for a week. By then the issues should be fixed and a copyedit requested. I'll pass the article when all that is fixed. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 05:40, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

All issues are fixed now and the request has been made (Wikipedia:WikiProject_Military_history/Logistics/Copy-editing/Requests). Brandmeister t 14:09, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Ok. I just noticed that that page looks unused, so the WP:GOCE request might be the better route after all (only a couple edits after 2009 on that one) Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 16:29, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Submitted there. Brandmeister t 19:38, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Copyedit completed. Brandmeister t 12:11, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

• All references should list the original (non-translated) titles/publishers/author(s) unless they are common in English. Then |trans_title= where needed. I did some but got tired mid-way :) —  HELLKNOWZ  ▎TALK 15:47, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

  That's a good point. That still needs to be wrapped up, though once that is I can pass the article no problem. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 17:26, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

  I went and fixed those last couple, so this article now passes GA status. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 23:57, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

Horny

While the nickname is amusing it seems a little out of character, perhaps a bit demeaning given the subject's life. In any case it might be more proprer -and informative- if the original Russian word in cyrillic and transliterated to Roman/English were used also. I have looked around for more info myself, but I clearly don't have the resources the original author had/has. Bunnyman78 (talk) 00:17, 21 April 2011 (UTC)

The source doesn't provide the original Russian version, the nickname was probably given by English-speaking Allies. Brandmeister t 23:40, 21 April 2011 (UTC)

What is the original Russian version? I tried looking for it, but as far as I see the websites don't have it. —  HELLKNOWZ  ▎TALK 06:40, 22 April 2011 (UTC)

Higher-res version of main image

Hello, I have found a higher res version of the main image available here if somebody can upload and replace it. I haven't done anything with images on Wikipedia yet so I don't want to accidentally break a good article (or remove any important data on the previous image.) Thanks. Dataxpress (talk) 05:03, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Done, thanks. Brandmeister t 18:51, 24 November 2011 (UTC)