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July 18

MS&NF

WP:MEDICAL
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
I Would Like To Know if Ms&NF are related .I have both and loosing my eye sight , I live in the United States.West Warwick Rhode Island. I — Preceding unsigned comment added by EFH58 (talk • contribs) 17:58, 18 July 2013 (UTC) I'm sorry, we cannot answer questions seeking medical advice or diagnosis. You may wish to talk to a medical professional. uhhlive (talk) 20:10, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Hospital

What's the best and better known hospital in Dublin? Where rich people go. Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 19:13, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Hey!! This is not asking for medical Advice... I am asking about a building. Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 20:12, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, my bad, I messed up the template. I totally fixed it! uhhlive (talk) 20:16, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

No problem. I thought I was being banned again :P Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 20:18, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

I understood they have excellent free medical care in Cuba? In any case, we can't give an opinion as to the best hospital in a specific area. μηδείς (talk) 20:41, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Medical care is great here. Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 14:06, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, I'm not too sure how we can answer this. There is List of hospitals in Ireland, which includes a section on Dublin. Possibly the most 'well-known' hospital in Dublin is the Mater Misericordiae University Hospital ('the Mater'), but this is a public hospital (albeit with a private hospital on the same grounds). As to where rich people go for treatment, this will depend on what they are being treated for and where in Dublin they live. If you have a particular rich person in mind we might be able to find a news story about their hospitalisation, but otherwise I don't think we can generalise for all rich Dubliners. - Cucumber Mike (talk) 20:50, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Hi, Cucumber Mike... not looking for a particular person. I am writting a story. I have a rich and famous man who has a house in County Dublin. He has a car accident and I was wondering which's the best hospital? Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 14:05, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

In a car accident, the ambulance or care-flight helicopter is likely to take anyone, regardless of personal wealth, to the nearest suitable hospital. In the past, this has applied even to royalty and presidents. When I was in a car wreck a few years ago, the ambulance didn't even ask me where I wanted to be taken (not that I was in much of a condition to consider such a question!) Only much later, once stabilized and during convalescence would it be considered wise to relocate them to some fancier place...and once the basic trauma care is dealt with, a hospital almost anywhere in the world might be appropriate for someone with a personal jet and the money to pay for in-flight nursing care. SteveBaker (talk) 14:21, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Sweet!! SteveBaker, so he could be taken into any hospital and then re-located... Cool! Thanks! Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 14:39, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

If he's crazy-rich then he could even have a suitable room set up in his own home with a staff of doctors and nurses on hand to look after his every need. SteveBaker (talk) 15:19, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

I don't think he's that crazy lol, SteveBaker... he was having some argument with his ex cuz she thought his new gfriend was not good enough to meet his kids (the ma'am is over-reacting)... and then boom!-car accident- and then... coma :'( He doesn't have time to think about a suitable room. Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 15:24, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Crazy aqui quiere decir 'muy'. μηδείς (talk) 19:14, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Oh, entiendo μηδείς. Gracias por la explicación. Well, he is crazy-rich. Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 19:23, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Concierge medicine. μηδείς (talk) 19:27, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

μηδείς, but he had a car accident, how does his Concierge medicine is going to help him? Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 19:37, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

I was simply naming the concept that SteveBaker was alluding to, not making any plot suggestions. I suggest you read Stranger in a Strange Land. μηδείς (talk) 19:54, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

μηδείς I will look for it and will surely read it. Does it have something to do with my question? Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 20:09, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Not Dublin, no. But possibly everything else. μηδείς (talk) 20:21, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Cool, I will look for it. So, is it about a rich man who falls in love with a younger girl and his ex oppose it?? BTW that's the same name of a U2 song. Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 20:24, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

The plot is too much to summarize, I am sure the article gives an idea. It is about a very rich old man who adopts a human orphan who has been raised by martians and who has to teach him human ways, including complicated love triangles. It's considered a classic and is commonly assigned reading in high schools. (It's on a fully adult level.) μηδείς (talk) 00:31, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Having read our article, it fails to summarize the human aspect of the plot entirely. The story is Romantic in the sense of Victor Hugo. The science fiction aspect is very minor--you could rewrite the novel changing about 10 pages of material and leave the story the same with the martians removed. Perhaps someone else can recommend a better review of the novel than our article. μηδείς (talk) 02:03, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Ok, that makes sense. In the case of your story, as Steve said above, the ambulance will always take a patient to the closest A&E department. This makes sense if you think about it - someone unconscious from a car crash is hardly likely to be making decisions about which hospital they prefer best.

So: in order to best answer your question, I think we need to know where the crash happens. By the way, some terminology for you, since I notice you used the phrase 'County Dublin' above: County Dublin is the name for the traditional county in which the city of Dublin is located, in the province of Leinster on Ireland's east coast. However, the county no longer exists as an administrative unit. In 1994, power was redistributed to three entities, Fingal County Council, Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown County Council and South Dublin County Council (the government of Dublin itself had already been transferred to a body then known as Dublin Corporation and now known as Dublin City Council). County Dublin now exists only in addresses of premises in the three areas outside the Dublin postal districts and as a term used by those living in the city to refer to areas outside of the city but within the former County Dublin area (e.g. Swords, Dublin; Malahide; Rathcoole, Dublin). So, if you set your story in 'County Dublin', those living in Ireland will assume that it is set either outside the city itself, or before 1994. Hope this helps. - Cucumber Mike (talk) 08:01, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Hi, Cucumber... The car crash occurs somewhere between Dublin Airport and Dalkey. And thanks for the information about County Dublin. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 12:48, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Hi again Miss B. That's a fair drive (at least in Irish terms) - about 26km and 30 mins or more depending on traffic. The route would most likely take the driver out of the airport onto the M1 and then through the Port Tunnel (toll €3 after 10am or €10 between 7am and 10am). From there I would cross the River Liffey on the East Link Bridge and take the coast road passing through Ringsend, Sandymount, Booterstown, Blackrock and Dun Laoghaire before reaching Dalkey.

If the accident happens on the Northside (north of the Liffey), I would suggest the Mater (see above) would be the most likely A&E department for the patient to be taken to. A possible bit of added excitement, should your story need it, would be if the accident happened in the Port Tunnel, which would mean that the tunnel would be closed whilst the rescue operation was in progress. Once the car reaches the Southside (south of the Liffey) the most likely might be St. Vincent's University Hospital.

Oh, and you can call me Mike :-) - Cucumber Mike (talk) 15:09, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Wao! Thanks, Mike! I appreciate the time you took to answer my question. I am definitely going to make some changes to the story to add some excitement by placing the accident in the Port Tunnel.

I have another question, what about if the character is a world famous musician, how would be that press thing? How fast it is going to be on the news.... stuffs like that. And, you can call me Laura. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 15:42, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Escape from Harleysville (LOL)

I live in Sacramento, California, and am trying desperately to move. One reason is because of the number of Harleys in the county; I am very sensitive to noise, easily depressed and have issues with anger management. Yet I have been unable to find any literature on what cities have the most and least of them. Is it possible to find out? Or can you answer directly? Theskinnytypist (talk) 22:04, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

You're going to have to be a lot more specific. There must be many tiny places with no motorbikes of any kind. How about the Pitcairn Islands for example. They have a handful of quad-bikes - but aside from that, no motor vehicles of any kind and only one road (which is 4 miles long and easily avoided!). For additional peace and quiet, there are no crying babies because only two of them have been born there in the last 30 years and the youngest is now a teenager.

If you google for "US city with most motorbikes", you'll find several discussion of the places to avoid. Here[1] for example is a list of the top 101 cities where people take a motorbike to get to work...that ought to correlate pretty well to the places with the most Harleys. One thing that's clear from that list is that you're going to need to be as far as possible from any military bases...they seem to be hot-beds of motorbike fanatics. But I couldn't find a direct reference for the place with the least motorbikes. While you might find that information out there somehow - I very much doubt that there are good public records to tell you the manufacturer of whatever bikes there are.

Realistically, if you're sensitive to noise, you should be looking for the city with the least noise pollution rather than focussing on just one specific source of noise. This page [2] says that Hartford CT, Cheyenn WY, Cincinnati OH, Modesta CA, Riverside CA, Yonkers NY, Anaheim CA, Lincoln NE DesMoines IA and Madison WI are the ten quietest cities in the USA. Since you are a Californian already - perhaps Modesta is the place for you? Avoid Oakland (Second loudest city in USA) and San Francisco (8th loudest) like the plague since they are both far noisier than Sacremento (32nd loudest).

SteveBaker (talk) 04:08, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

One thing to keep in mind is that motorbikes are largely seasonal in places that have an actual winter (unlike Sacramento). In large parts of Canada, they are in effect illegal to drive in winter months because proper snow tires do not exist for them. There is likely a similar situation in a good part of the northern U.S. --Xuxl (talk) 07:33, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

There are all sorts of retirement communities. Just stay away from Charming, California. μηδείς (talk) 17:03, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Solo Martial Arts (Wing Chun and Krav Maga)

Hello there, I want to learn solo martial art. So far, after bit research, I have come up with this two effective and efficient martial arts - Wing Chun and Krav Maga. Both of them are not taught in our country. But I want to learn them anyway. It's my long term desire. I have found books on Wing Chun and Krav Maga in Amazon.com and Banres and Noble - Wing chun compendium vol. 1 and 2 and Krav Maga by Darren Levine. I want to know whether they are appropriate for solo training . Any suggestion would be appreciated. Thank you--180.234.37.224 (talk) 23:39, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Sadly, it doesn't look like anyone here has an answer for you. I can't answer your question either - but maybe I can help you with other places to look. I don't know whether it helps - but we have articles for both Wing Chun and Krav Maga...each article has over a dozen references to books, articles and web sites on the topic - which should make good reading - and may turn up something you couldn't find on Amazon. But there is nothing so good as talking directly to someone with experience in those sports. So you might also look at the "history" tabs for those two articles and send personal messages on the "Talk:" pages here on Wikipedia to the most prolific editors of those articles (some of them may also allow you to email them using the "Email this user" link to the left of their user page. It's highly likely that people who take the trouble to edit articles on such obscure topics are knowledgeable enthusiasts of those arts. Ideally, you should probably try to track down an online forum where the people who do those things hang out - I'm sure that's the best possible way to get your question answered. SteveBaker (talk) 14:13, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

• • Oh no :(--180.234.71.55 (talk) 16:52, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

I believe that there are many "effective and efficient" martial arts apart from Wing Chun and Krav Maga, including some indigenous to the Indian Subcontinent such as Kalaripayattu. But if you feel those other two suit you, fine. I do not recommend trying to learn them from a book if you have other sources. You can pick up some techniques especially if you have training already, but if you perform them incorrectly-hard to determine on your own-you may injure yourself. N.b Though I cannot prove it I have extensive martial arts experience, including as an instructor. 220 of ^Borg 08:11, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Lack of side dishes in English cooking

Hi. I have been wondering about this for a while now. There seems to be a distinct lack of side orders in English cooking. Take for example simple things like pasta: almost every country has its regional variation of pasta, the Italians have loads, the Chinese have ramen, the Africans have couscous, the Germans have Spätzle etc etc. Then we have the potato: the French have french fries and duchesse potatoes and croquettes, the Germans have Bratkartoffeln etc etc. You get the picture. What I am asking is, are there any proper English side orders? So far I have found roast potatoes and yorkshire puddings, and that seems to be it. I'd be grateful for any help on the matter. --91.49.29.177 (talk) 23:55, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

The idea of having to order extra food served on a side plate is a bit odd and foreign to us Britons. Roast dinners are said to come with "all the trimmings" in one great edifice; that may include one or more varieties of stuffing (with poultry), Yorkshire puddings and several types of cooked vegetables (two or three of carrots, swede, Brussels sprouts, cabbage, broccoli, peas, runner beans and so on). My Cornish grandmother used to serve roasted dumplings. However, the glory of British cooking is the pie, which Americans seem to have consigned to the desert trolley. We appear to have had chips here for about 150 years, and the notion that they originate from France (although maybe true) is likely to cause an argument, if not actual violence. Alansplodge (talk) 00:43, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Note that ramen isn't really Chinese and is incredibly new in any case. Chinese have a variety of noodle dishes with the concept itself long predating pasta, but often the noodles are an integral part of the dish and not a 'side' dish. In fact, looking at the other examples, I'm not even sure what you mean by side dish, as while these examples may sometimes be eaten as a side dish, they are often part and parcel of the dish. Nil Einne (talk) 03:29, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Yeah - I'm not sure that the concept of "side dishes" is a standard part of any cuisine. It's a modern trend to order additional food that's not a part of the basic dish - but that seems to cut across all nationalities. When you buy Fish and Chips (what could be more English?) it has always been the case that you could order a side of mushy peas or pickled onions or pickled eggs. That's been the case since the 1950's to my certain knowledge. I'm not sure that the premise of the question truly makes much sense. SteveBaker (talk) 03:43, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Everyone knows English cuisine is the world's worst. (Neat how I gave a link and snuck in a useless opinion?) μηδείς (talk) 03:29, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Hmmmm - I suspect you've never spent much time in Holland - if it were not for the excellent Chinese restaurants in Amsterdam and the high nutritional value of the trappist monk beer, I think I might have starved to deatn. SteveBaker (talk) 03:43, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

The relevant question then would be, do they have English-food restaurants in Holland? Frankly, there are plenty of places in the US called things like "the tavern" or "the pub" (my favorite place for birthday meals for four decades has been "The Pub") whose best meals are either beefsteak and baked potatoes or fish and chips with green beans or, if fancy, sparrow grass. There's a reason the English are called Beefeaters and that while the English call them frogs, the French respond with the "insult" bistec. μηδείς (talk) 04:30, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

There are plenty of places to buy fish and chips in Amsterdam.[3] I'm fairly certain that there are no Dutch restaurants in London. Alansplodge (talk) 07:22, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

You underestimate the variety of restaurants in London! Google shows a few, though there seems to be a bit of a dessert focus. MChesterMC (talk) 08:09, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Or, indeed, rosbif. The Portuguese nickname for us really does translate as "steak", although I suspect (OR alert) it refers to the appearance of pale, pudgy English flesh after a couple of hours on a sunbed by the pool rather than our taste for slabs of dead cow, with or without a side order. - Karenjc 07:16, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

The menu of your "The Pub" doesn't bear much resemblance to British pub food. I wish I hadn't learnt that a salt beef sandwich can be served with fries. That's the kind of "side dish" we can do without. Itsmejudith (talk) 07:20, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

home fries

Yes, the restaurant called "The Pub" really in no way resembles a pub. It has a huge open floor with a view of the grills. I haven't been there recently, but the menu is is basically steak and seafood. μηδείς (talk) 16:56, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

The steaks are probably better - and bigger - than most served in our pubs. Itsmejudith (talk) 20:59, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

We do have what's called "bar food" which is usually steak/burger/hot sandwich--enough to prevent a patron from leaving for a restaurant when he's hungry sitting at the bar. Still no French or ehnic food save maybe nachos. μηδείς (talk) 21:16, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

A sandwich and a plate of chips seems like totally fine pub food to me... Though they should be proper chips, not fries. MChesterMC (talk) 08:09, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Define "proper" chips. The Brits I've known refer to French fries as "chips". (The French, meanwhile, just call them "fries", as "French fries" would be redundant.) ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 13:07, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

See French fries: "North Americans refer to any elongated pieces of fried potatoes as fries, while in the United Kingdom, Australia, Ireland, and New Zealand, long, thinly cut slices of fried potatoes are sometimes called fries to distinguish them from the more thickly cut strips called chips". Gandalf61 (talk) 13:17, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

...and to finish off this oft-repeated set of distinctions so we can get it over with: Americans call thin-sliced fried potatoes "chips" while in the UK, we call them "crisps". How does this pertain to the OP's actual question? SteveBaker (talk) 13:59, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Aren't steak fries the same as British "chips"? They are what to expect in better restaurants (and "The Pub") when you see "fries" on the menu. μηδείς (talk) 17:01, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

They're closer, but not the same. British chips are (basically) square rather than rectangular in cross-section, and (in British pubs/restaurants, at least), steak fries are cooked for rather longer than chips, so they have the definite "crispy outside/fluffy inside" texture of (American) french fries. British chips are far more homogenous in texture. Tevildo (talk) 20:35, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

That sounds like home fries. μηδείς (talk) 01:59, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Without the skins, the description does match up. I've never eaten home fries - the next time I'm in the States, I'll have to try them. Incidentally, the main image for the french fries article does _look_ like British chips (as opposed to what we'd call "french fries"), but without eating them I can't tell. :) Tevildo (talk) 22:58, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

You'll be unlikely to find home fries offered in a restaurant, and if so, likely for breakfast only, and looking more like hash browns. My ex cooked home fries by putting potato slices in a covered pan with water and oil. The water would boil away and then the oil would brown them. It was African-American style. μηδείς (talk) 01:28, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Well we have different kinds of chips in Britain these days and while someone might order them alongside a sandwich in a pub (a bit of salad and some crisps would be a better accompaniment), it was seeing them with a salt beef sandwich that surprised me. Salt beef on rye bread with the trimmings is a self-contained thing. Itsmejudith (talk) 20:55, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

The image labelled "home fries" are what we Brits would call sauté potatoes, whereas what Medeis has described is fondant potatoes. --TammyMoet (talk) 15:18, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

On the original question, I have always assumed the whole concept of a side order that's served on a different plate was invented by restaurants to give them an additional income stream. These days, you'll often get a small amount of meat piled many layers high in the centre of a plate that takes up 75% of the table, and then they charge you extra for anything additional, such as vegetables, salad, pasta ... served separately, even though there's a huge amount of vacant space still on the main plate. Such pretentiousness and venality will not go unpunished. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 23:18, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

July 19

What paths are carneys in Britain?

What paths are carneys in Britain? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Xietianxiedi (talk • contribs) 07:59, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but can you explain what you need to know a little more? Apart from the entries in our Carneys disambiguation page, the only use of the word I'm aware of is for Carnival employees in the U.S.A. (and that's usually carny). Rojomoke (talk) 09:14, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

In his book "The Old Ways" published in 2012, British travel writer Robert Mcfarlane makes a list of ancient paths existing in Britain, including driftways, cartways, carneys,etc. The last term has puzzled me for a long time. I failed to get its explanation in any dictionary or encyclopedia I could find. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Xietianxiedi (talk • contribs) 09:26, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

The term is not in the OED and is not mentioned (looking inside this book on Amazon) in the author's own glossary, so I suspect it's a misprint. It would seem reasonable to write to the author c/o the publisher to point this out and ask for an explantion. Some publishers are quite appreciative of having mistakes pointed out. The only possibility that occurs to me is that it's a contraction of cairn-way, i.e. a way marked by cairns.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 10:43, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Thank you so much. Your explanation and suggestion are quite helpful. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Xietianxiedi (talk • contribs) 11:16, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

It could also be a copyright trap - to ensure that no-one plagiarises that list. Ghmyrtle (talk) 13:18, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

I checked a couple of thesauruses to see whether there is some other term that might have been misspelled or just a typo to get this word - but I can't see any words with this kind of meaning that differ in spelling or are just a couple of letters off of "carney". The trouble is that it seems such a plausible word for a footpath of some kind! Weird. SteveBaker (talk) 13:55, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

The OED does have a noun "carney" but it's an obsolete word for a disease in horses. I wonder if it's a scanno for "camway". I would separate this into two words, but there are many ancient routes called cam roads around the country (cam meaning a ridge, so the equivalent of ridgeway). My guess might be completely wrong, of course. Dbfirs 19:10, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

This call wouldn't be about Camway, would it?  :) -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 11:19, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Quick Reference Guide

I am a supervisor in a call center located in Kentucky and we are looking to create a Wiki page that our employees can refer to as a quick reference guide. I need some help in simply getting it started to where I am able to input the information that we want available as reference. Is this possible? Secondly, can we create a page that nobody other than supervisors and managers can update? Meaning can it be password protected or something along these lines? Thank you greatly in advance for any help or information you have. I can also be contacted by phone if possible (would prefer) [removed]. Again, thanks. [removed] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Richard.smith05 (talk • contribs) 12:08, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia does not do that. You would be better off establishing a social media page, such as on Facebook. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 13:05, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Bugs could not be more incorrect. "Wikipedia" is not what's being discussed here - "MediaWiki" is what you use to set up your own "Wiki" - and it's very well suited to community-created, easily available content. Social media sites (and especially those with a "Facebook" useage model) completely *SUCK* at making community content because each page is "owned" by someone. Collaborative content creation on Facebook and sites like it is almost impossible. SteveBaker (talk) 13:44, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Oh, come on. I could be a lot more incorrect than that. Use your imagination. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 14:10, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

I imagine saying "sorry" is out. DreadRed (talk) 19:54, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia is run on MediaWiki software which is free. You can set up your own wiki. Dismas|^(talk) 13:11, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Very good. But when have you ever heard anyone pronounce it "witi"? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 13:24, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

I'm sorry, what? Dismas|^(talk) 13:37, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

I found the following statement in the article, and then just now some hidden comments after it (unhidden for this purpose):

"Ward Cunningham, the developer of the first wiki software, WikiWikiWeb, originally described it as "the simplest online database that could possibly work". "Wiki" (pronounced [ˈwiti] <!--Hawaiian 'k' before 'i' tends to [t]--><!--This is erroneous. North island Hawaiian or pre-missionary Hawaiian might have either of these pronunciations, but not now. Hawaiian 'k" is phonetic '[k] --> or [ˈviti]) is a Hawaiian word meaning "fast" or "quick".

←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 14:09, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Setting up a new Wiki is fairly easy. You need "shell access" to the server you're going to run it on. You have to install Apache, MySQL (or one of a couple of clones of that software) and Python (if your server doesn't already have those things...it probably does) - then download and install MediaWiki.

There are ways to set up privilages to keep your Wiki secure. If it's going to be accessible on a public server, you might want to prevent reading or editing by "unregistered" users - and limit the ability to create new accounts to administrators so that new employees would have to apply to get an account set up for them. It's also easy to "protect" individual pages so that only admins can edit them. [4] has instructions for that.

I've done exactly what you're suggesting at three different companies I've worked for - and my g/f's home business. That business is run entirely off of two MediaWiki sites - one public one for our customers and one private one for our internal product development, etc. I could probably merge the two and use the protection features to keep the confidential business information private - but it suits me not to do that.

I have two MediaWiki's set up on my personal website - one "read-only" for public access to information that only admins can edit - and one that's read/write private to my immediate family. I set up another one to allow extended family to post photos of kids and grandkids and show them off to their friends (read-public, write-restricted to logged in users). I set up a MediaWiki for the car club that I used to run (also read-public, write-restricted - but any member can create new accounts - so it's "by invitation only").

MediaWiki is an incredible piece of software with much more flexibility than Wikipedia chooses to use. There are a wealth of cool plugins that extend the functionality beyond that.

SteveBaker (talk) 13:41, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

WikiMarriage

Have ever in life 2 Wikipedians got married?? Miss Bono ^[zootalk]☆ 20:17, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

That's an interesting question. In the US -I think- one still needs a blood test before obtaining a marriage licence. But as far as I know, geeks can share the same source code and yet marry without their derived code(s) suffering any complications or bugs.--Aspro (talk) 21:37, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

There have been many married couples who came to Wikipedia together. The only married couple I can think of who met through Wikipedia are John Vandenberg (talk · contribs) and Siska.Doviana (talk · contribs). At least I think they met through Wikipedia. Someguy1221 (talk) 22:11, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Yes, we met because of Wikimedia. There are a few others, including user:Chase me ladies, I'm the Cavalry. John Vandenberg ^(chat) 22:38, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

He's right. AFAIK, our children have adminship from birth - it's hereditary (what do you mean, "no it isnt"?) Chase me ladies, I'm the Cavalry (Message me) 13:32, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

I propose a new category, Category:Wikipedians who are married to other Wikipedians, as a subset of Category:Wikipedians.

—Wavelength (talk) 23:10, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Wao! That's interesting :O Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 12:41, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

"In the US - ...a blood test before obtaining a marriage licence"

The subject here is a quote from the thread immediately above. As a non-American, I've been puzzled from at least as far back as the 1960s by references in American films and TV shows about these mysterious (to me) blood tests before getting married. What's it all about? Who is testing whom for what? What are the possible consequences? Prohibiting marriage? We don't do it here. Should we? HiLo48 (talk) 23:29, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

See The Straight Dope's answer. Deor (talk) 23:56, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

It depends on state law, it's to determine you do not have syphilis. μηδείς (talk) 00:26, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

I can now understand why the purpose of the tests was never explained. Not a nice topic for nice TV shows to mentions. What happens/happened if one does/did have syphilis? HiLo48 (talk) 00:39, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

If you were lucky the other party stayed around long enough for you to finish your course of antibiotics and take another test. See the rather horrific congenital syphilis. μηδείς (talk) 00:48, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

So those infected were somehow forced to undergo treatment? While it's obviously a very good idea, how was that achieved? Legally? And practically? Locked up in a government clinic until cured? HiLo48 (talk) 01:36, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Again, it's state law. But yes, they typically mandated treatment and provided it if you were indigent, as they did and still do with tuberculosis. See Syphilis#Treatment for how simple or complex the treatment. But they also sent public health agents around to survey you about your prior sex partners and to contact and test them. (They actually made a big deal of that in our high school sex-ed class.) According to our articles, a lot of states still have these laws. Many of them were challenged and overthrown by liberal courts or legislatures in the 80's once states started applying the same rules to the HIV positive. (That is, in some states, if you tested HIV positive, public health agents would try to contact and test your prior partners.) It was seen as a violation of privacy and not effective enough to show a compelling state interest. μηδείς (talk) 01:49, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Incidentally, under English law, a marriage is voidable if "at the time of the marriage the respondent was suffering from venereal disease in a communicable form." (Matrimonial Causes Act 1973 Section 12e). It's never been the practice to routinely test for this, though. Tevildo (talk) 09:56, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

As an aside, there's a long history of forcible quarantine / treatment of certain communicable diseases even in common law / civil-liberties-friendly countries. Quarantine was classically seen as one of the exceptions to a handful of otherwise narrow government powers in the U.S., and I think that tradition extends to most common law countries too. Shadowjams (talk) 04:03, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

July 20

Restauratns having Coke or Pepsi products

I was just wondering: when setting up a restaurant, how does the restaurant owner decide what soft drink product he/she will offer? That is, how do restaurant owners decide if they will offer Coke or Pepsi and what are the factors that affect their decision?

And as a side question, could someone link to an article or website that gives each product's market share worldwide as well as in specific countries? Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 12:10, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

In the UK, if the restaurant is part of a chain, they won't have a choice at individual level as the decision of which soft drinks provider to have has been made at national level. --TammyMoet (talk) 12:35, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

In that case, what are the factor which allow the chain to decide? Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 12:46, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Each company's distributor offers conditions, including supply and delivery schedule, advertising, credit for returing damaged goods, sales incentives and of course the profit margin. If the product is manufactured and marketed by a conglomerate, there may be related products involved in a package of terms. The owner or manager will contract with the company providing the most favorable terms.-- Deborahjay (talk) 14:29, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Plus customer demand. In the UK people tend to ask for a Coke (I've never heard anyone ask for a Pepsi in a restaurant), and it comes in a glass; whether that is what they are actually given is another matter.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 14:35, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Actually legally they are supposed to ask if pepsi is ok - many moons ago the place I used to work at had Pepsi on tap and Coke in bottles. If somebody asked for a coke we were required to ask if pepsi was ok, or they could have a bottle of coke. (99% of people went with the pepsi btw, it was cheaper)--Jac16888 ^Talk 14:39, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

To add to what has been said about the UK, many chains of restaurants are owned by the big brewery companies and they are closely tied in with the Coca Cola company or Pepsi. Even an independent restaurant will probably buy all its drinks from a supplier that will have a connection with one or the other. Itsmejudith (talk)

Most joints in the US will have an exclusive distribution deal with one carrier or another to get a discounted rate, often with the distributor maintaining the fountains or a reach-in fridge or both for the store. Or they can pay more and offer both--but that's rare outside bodegas in NYC. μηδείς (talk) 21:12, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

The gas station chain Speedway makes a selling point of the fact that they offer both Coke and Pepsi fountain beverages. It took me a while to realize that was what they meant by the slogan "unRIVALed refreshment" (emphasis theirs). Howicus (talk) 00:00, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Itsmejudith's comparison to brewery-owned places is very apt in this case. Yum! Brands, owners of Taco Bell, KFC, and Pizza Hut, is a former division of PepsiCo. Yum's article claims "Yum! Brands has a lifetime contract with PepsiCo", although it doesn't cite a source. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 00:30, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

The above answers mostly focus on multi-unit chains stores (which makes sense, as those are the biggest movers). For family restaurant owners, there are a number of options. You can, of course, offer both Coke and Pepsi. This is seen sometimes in smaller servers like fry stands and hot dog carts, etc. The reason why they do it is two-fold: one, they can be different from the McD's and KFCs that only offer one chain and two, they almost certainly buy their product using a completely different setup and often a completely different distribution channel. Buying Coke or Pepsi from a foodservice distributor is surprisingly expensive; way more expensive than buying from the market and perhaps twice the price of those big box bulk stores. The reason why is that Coke and Pepsi very much want to be exclusive to your store, so they charge a high initial price to the distributor and then allow the restauranteur to debit them back a rather generous amount provided they stay exclusive. The hot dog cart guy may not meet the minimums to qualify for the plan, so they're much further ahead to just buy their soda pop from the same place everyone else does (i.e. the local grocery store). Most family restaurants would qualify and thereby reap the benefits: it's not worth paying 50% more for your beverages unless you have a very compelling draw to do so. Provided they meet the quite modest minimums, they'll also get all kinds of swag (neon signs, light-up thermometers, giveaways) - just so that Coke will rest easy in knowing that no Pepsi items are lurking in your tavern. The same kind of set up also occurs with other foodstuff (like french fries), but it's not nearly so cut-throat a business. Matt Deres (talk) 02:49, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Then why not just buy supermarket own brand cola, I find most of them taste pretty much the same. 213.104.128.16 (talk) 12:56, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

Shabraque image

Is this a "shabrack" or does it have another name in English?

I've been tinkering with our Shabrack article, which was the slimmest of stubs consisting of a one-line dictionary definition (it's a fancy saddle-cloth) and this image. I've only ever heard of a shabraque (the more common spelling) as a military accoutrement, and the only sources I could find relate to military use. I know next to nothing about horses except which end the hay goes in, and am wondering if the illustrated item is really a shabrack or shabraque in English and whether it actually belongs in the article. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Alansplodge (talk) 19:26, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

"I know two things about the horse, and one of them is rather coarse." (Belloc). Sincerest apologies for this most inappropriate of posts to the Jowett of the reference desk. Tevildo (talk) 22:29, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Fact-checking, based on the fear that the quote was actually from Nash, has revealed to this cat that the originator was in fact one Naomi Royde-Smith, on whom we don't have an article. /me curls up and dies. Tevildo (talk) 22:38, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

More Pooter than Jowett I'm afraid. It did sound like Belloc - I started the Cautionary Tales for Children article. Alansplodge (talk) 00:41, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

WPEQ here. Truth is, most of us in the real world would call that a saddle blanket or saddle cloth. However, military folks still use them (such as the Royal Canadian Mounted Police equestrian units) and the photo above IS of the style and shape associated with the shabrack, which is the common North American spelling (even in Canada) See: [5], [6]. I made a couple edits to the article to do a minor cleanup, always room for improvement and thanks! Montanabw^(talk) 18:53, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Many thanks. Alansplodge (talk) 18:58, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Resolved

July 21

American cuisine around the world

In the United States, restaurants serving the cuisine of another country are quite common. There are many Chinese, French, Mexican, Italian, etc., restaurants in just about every city. (There is even a quite fine English restaurant in Washington, D.C.) ... How prevalent are American restaurants in other countries? (I am not referring to fast food places or chains, but real sit-down restaurants.) For example, is there a restaurant in Paris where one can get steak, baked potato and corn-on-the-cob? Or someplace in Tokyo that serves New England clam chowder? If such places exist, do local people patronize them just as Americans go to international-themed restaurants in the U.S.?    → Michael J Ⓣ Ⓒ Ⓜ 03:59, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

See What Is The Best American Restaurant In London? and American restaurants in Paris. Alansplodge (talk) 15:50, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Planet Hollywood exists in many cities around the world, although there seem to be more closed locations than open ones.-gadfium 21:48, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

First of all, American cuisine is quite a broad concept. Like with Chinese, Indian, etc. food, the type of cuisine stereotyped as American abroad represents a minority of the diversity in different types of American cuisine. Secondly, generally restaurants profiled as 'American' abroad tend to be part of franchises, such as T.G.I. Friday's or Ruby Tuesday. I think you will find rather few small, family-owned restaurants profiled as American outside of the US. --Soman (talk) 00:03, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Having worked at TGI Fridays, one could call their food American, but it is not typically American, rather intentionally distinctive, like standard fries coming with curry powder, salt and pepper, or onion rings made with red (purple) onions. Typical American food is going to be German, Irish, or English cuisine or Soul Food (those four being the most common ethnicities in America) with regional specialities: Lobster roll, Boston and Manhattan clam chowder, pierogies from the Ruthenian diaspora, Jewish Deli sandwiches, scrapple, pancakes, grits, Maple syrup, funnel cake, Southern food, including fried chicken and watermelon, Cajun cuisine including jambalaya and dirty rice, corn on the cob, jersey tomato, Tex Mex, barbecue, and various things with salmon and avocado from out west, although I have never been to California. Hot dogs, Hamburger, Ice Cream and cotton candy all got their impetus from world and county fairs. Much of this you can get at a diner, deli, or specialty store, but little of it save maybe the soups from an upper ranger American restaurant, where you'll get filet mignon, various grilled fishes, chicken marsala, crab cakes and veal. μηδείς (talk) 00:33, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

There are some American-style diners in Europe, where they go overboard on the kitschy 1950s decor. You will also find Tex-Mex restaurants, which are usually a lot more American than Mexican. Other non-chain American restaurants would be burger joints or places serving American-style brunch. --Xuxl (talk) 08:40, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

There was an independent soul-food place in Brighton, on the south coast of England. It was featured on Ramsay's Kitchen Nightmares but sadly it didn't survive. Ramsay advised the owner to cook everything from scratch and not cut corners by cooking items in advance and freezing them. He has no background in small mid-market restaurants anyway. [7] Itsmejudith (talk) 09:35, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

In the trendier metropolises in Asia, Tex-Mex restaurants and American steak houses or burger restaurants (proper sit down places, very expensive by local standards) are common. One random example is Blue Frog, a chain that serves American cuisine in various countries in Asia. The Boxing Cat Brewery is also a memorable example from Shanghai.

Some American cuisine chains which you might think are a little down market in the West enjoy a much higher market position elsewhere. Sizzler is a big thing in Asia - you will find its "semi-formal" restaurants at prominent and prestigious locations from Tokyo to Jakarta. Despite its financial woes elsewhere, its Asian market presence has been stable and growing. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 17:59, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

There's the Buffalo Grill chain in France. Itsmejudith (talk) 18:22, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

You might also want to consider pizza to be largely American cuisine. Yes, it started out in Italy (although tomatoes came from the Americas), but pizza was changed dramatically in the US, by allowing customers to choose individual toppings, adding home delivery, a variety of crusts, etc. So, American pizza is as different from it's origins in Europe as the hot dog is from it's origins in Germany.

And other foods Americans think of as foreign are at least partially American. "Chinese food" in the US, for example, has changed a lot in relation with what is served in China. For example, the fortune cookie was invented in the US. I wonder if US Chinese food chains, like Panda Express, will be successful in China. StuRat (talk) 19:03, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Second that about pizza, actually. Papa Johns, for example, is emphatically American in its overseas marketing. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 21:50, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Somehow I odn't think US Chinese food would suit the Chinese palate. It would cater only to a fairly narrow market segment made up of expats who prefer their Americanised Chinese food to Chinese Chinese food. However, the American fast food concept has been successfully married in China with actual Chinese food - East Dawning, a KFC subsidiary, has created a brand of fast food-ised Chinese food which is doing very well (and has spawned home-grown imitators in China). --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 21:46, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

In Japan, they have KFC as Christmas dinner. Massive bloody let-down for me, when I was married to a Japanese woman, because we had this fast-food crap which she considered to be exotic and keeping in with the spirit of this 'foreign festival', whereas to me, it was just a load of shite which may or may not have been home to a whole bunch of parasitic insects - shite that we can buy any day, every day, in England. We only had that once. The following year, I introduced her to proper Christams food (except that I had to improvise with the sage for the sage and onion bit). They also consider MacDonalds to be quite exotic, even though many of us educated ones in the west tend to think of MacDonalds as being the lowest of the low. KägeTorä - (影虎) (TALK) 23:08, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

To reply to Michael's last question, some people like to patronize American food while refusing to let it pass their lips. Neat trick, that. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 11:08, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

On Serving People !

I have always had this doubt - Why is that people become social entrepreneurs and why do donors support them? What is the whole point ?

NOTE this is being asked at Wikipedia:Reference desk/Humanities. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 05:50, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Hotpixel fixing

So I was asked to fix hotpixels in this image of mine, but I don't even know what they look like or how to fix them. 1. Can someone point out a couple examples, and 2. How do I fix them? Thanks in advance, Ks0stm ^{(T•C•G•E)} 07:24, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

A hot pixel is an isolated fault in a digital camera or LCD screen that exhibits a fixed bright or dark spot that does not belong in the image. Deciding which speck of light in your picture is a hot pixel or is actually in the scene needs interpreting and it would help you spot them if you have a picture of plain black from the same camera. I downloaded your picture and opened it in MS PAINT which is an image editor in every Windows PC. I found a first likely hot spot at (527,369) and brushed it over with the colour of surrounding pixels. This you can do. DreadRed (talk) 09:24, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Looking at this particular photo (at full resolution), the hot pixels have been marked by the camera as definite white "X"'s, which can easily be distinguished from genuine spots of light. Not all cameras will be so helpful, of course. Tevildo (talk) 09:35, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

See the attached for detail near the horizon at the far left of the image, showing both a hot pixel and a real light source. Tevildo (talk) 09:53, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

A truly helpful camera, or a program that one can write, would brush out the hot pixels automatically instead of just detecting them. DreadRed (talk) 10:04, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

I use a free open souce image manipulation program called GIMP. [8] There are other free plugins such as [9] & [10]. Once down-loaded, you can do most most of your photo editing with it.--Aspro (talk) 17:05, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Awesome, very helpful information. Thanks y'all! Ks0stm ^{(T•C•G•E)} 09:56, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

crane lifting safety

I don't need help with crane lifting safety -- I know enough about it -- I just need help finding where (if anywhere) Wikipedia discusses crane lifting safety! There's nothing on it at Crane (machine), and I can't find a separate article on it, either. (The question comes up because I'm trying to fix the faulty disambiguation reference at tagline to guy-wire; I'd like to have it point at the section on tag lines in the article on lifting safety, if there were one. Perhaps I'll have to write it.) —Steve Summit (talk) 11:38, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

It does look as though the article needs to be written. Safety engineering covers the general topic, but only from a theoretical/legal standpoint. Safe working load and lifting equipment are currently just stub articles. We have an article on LOLER, but that's (a) jurisdiction-specific, and (b) more about law than engineering. Tevildo (talk) 12:44, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

July 22

Omaha Beach 6 June 1944

High US casualties are attributed to the sinking in rough seas of most of the amphibious swimming tanks intended to support infantry. But the Omaha beach had been effectively barricaded with anti-tank obstacles of which the invasion planners were aware. What were the tanks intended to achieve, had they arrived as planned? DreadRed (talk) 02:46, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

The tank traps do not appear (as far as I can see) to have had a large part in the tanks problems. Our DD Tank page says of the landings on Omaha specifically:"DD Tanks were designed to operate in waves up to 1 foot (0.3 m) high; however, on D-Day the waves were up to 6 ft (1.8 m) high." and "the tanks of 741st Tank Battalion were launched too far out, about 3 mi (4.8 km) offshore". (which seems to be contradicted by statements below that the plan was to launch 6,000 yards [5,500 m/3.4 mi] out.) On Omaha some of the the tanks were apparently carried all the way to the beach. See here at the part marked Page 39, " In the 116th RCT zone, the officers in charge of the tank-loaded LCT's had decided not to risk the conditions of sea, and the 32 DD's of the 743d Tank Battalion were carried in to the beach."

• Omaha Beach: "the 741st Tank Battalion put 29 DDs into the sea, but 27 of these sank, the remaining two made the long swim to the beach."
• Gold Beach: "Eight tanks were lost on the way in"
• Juno Beach: "twenty-one out of twenty-nine tanks reached the beach"
• Utah Beach: "Twenty-seven out of twenty eight reached the beach"

All of these losses seem to have been to the tanks failing to float as designed, not due to anti tank obstacles. I am not very up on the history of the tanks on D-Day and stand to be corrected! I am only going off what WP and it's sources state.

• As for what the tanks were "intended to achieve", " launched from 6,000 yards out, swim ashore, and take up firing positions at the water's edge to cover the first phase of the assault. Their fire was to be placed on the main enemy fortifications, particularly those west of Exit D-l which could bring flanking fire on Dog Beach. Moving up through the obstacles as the tide rose, the tanks would support the main assault and then clear the beach through Exit D-3'" sourced from here in Omaha Beachhead , Assault Plan, Plan of Assault Landings, p30 (last paragraph ) --220 of ^Borg 06:07, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

The phrase "Moving up through the obstacles as the tide rose.." conjures an image of 30 tonne Sherman tanks with their canvas buoyancy skirts still intact swimming over obstacles like these. The source appears to be a US Army historian writing after one of their costliest actions (3000 prepared troops killed in minutes by fewer than half as many defenders, mostly German teenagers) needed to be explained. The invasion planners had recent experience of probing German coast defence in the Dieppe Raid where all 29 tanks that landed were blocked and abandoned; their crews all killed or captured. So after their swimming stunt (that failed), what were the DD Shermans ever going to achieve at Omaha? DreadRed (talk) 10:15, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

To me, "Moving up through the obstacles as the tide rose.." just means that the tanks would move slowly up the beach, destroying obstacles in their path as they went. Anti-tank obstacles are not supposed to be impenetrable; they are just intended to slow tanks down so that their mobility is impeded and they become easier targets for anti-tank weapons and other tanks. Gandalf61 (talk) 11:32, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Note that on that very picture, taken 6 June, there is a Sherman on the landward side of the defences, and it certainly wasn't lifted over by a crane. So passing the obstacles was certainly possible! As G61 notes above, the tank traps are also not an impenetrable barrier; they're meant to slow down and congest vehicles to make them easy targets. The planners would have been aware of this, and chose to land the tanks anyway; a tank on the beach, even if effectively pinned down, was probably felt better than no support at all.

As for what the Shermans were "ever going to achieve", the answer is exactly as described - close support artillery for getting troops past fixed defences, firing from positions near the edge of the beach. They certainly failed to get there, but that doesn't mean their intended role would also have failed. Andrew Gray (talk) 18:15, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

• Those are not antitank traps but mined coastal defences against boat landing at hight tide. Hence, the D day landings were timed for low tide, so that the vessels taking in the spear force did not come to grief on them. Antitank defences are different from these. Read the history books. The OP may be getting confused with land tanks and LST's. Two different beasts.--Aspro (talk) 21:30, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Edit/Edit Source buttons

Can someone please explain to me how to use the Edit/Edit source features? When did this start? Herzlicheboy (talk) 05:53, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Edit invokes the visual editor. WP:VE. Edit source invokes the normal editing method with Wikitext. The visual editor was in beta for awhile and was recently rolled out for all users. RudolfRed (talk) 05:58, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

What are the reviews and comments on the new feature so far? Does anyone have any links? Thanks for your help, btw. Herzlicheboy (talk) 06:05, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

I provided a link in my reply. From there you can see the feedback that's been provided. RudolfRed (talk) 06:08, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

See here: Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback too. A lot of editors seem to be rather unhappy with Visual Editor. --220 of ^Borg 06:11, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Any way to opt out of it? I already know Wikimarkup from other wikis. Also, funny how the rationale stated at WP:VE is that wikimarkup is somehow "unacceptable in 2013" (I'm paraphrasing). That is just more evidence of the "dumbing down" of society. Herzlicheboy (talk) 06:20, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

In your preferences, under gadgets you can turn off the visual editor. Or just always use "edit source" if that's the interface you prefer. RudolfRed (talk) 06:38, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Pregnancy and flights

Can a pregnant woman get on a plane and travel? (my story stuffs) Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:13, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

From the Mayo Clinic: "Generally, commercial air travel during pregnancy is considered safe for women who have healthy pregnancies." They go on to mention that one should check with their doctor anyway. Mingmingla (talk) 16:50, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Hi, Mingmingla, thanks for your answer. Have another question: you are safe even if you are a 8 month pregnant woman (Again: I am not pregnan, for those who think that :)) Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 17:40, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Most airlines allow pregnant women to travel through their eighth month. Traveling during the ninth month is usually allowed if there is permission from your health care provider. - American Pregnancy Association DreadRed (talk) 18:51, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

And if they travel during the 9th month, they really should reserve an extra seat, just in case. :-) StuRat (talk) 19:07, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

lol! Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 19:09, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Thank you very much DreadRed Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 19:03, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

This is a request for medical advice, question should be directed to a your doctor, not the Wikipedia reference desk. There are a whole lot of complexity in this issue, many different factors to consider for each individual. --Soman (talk) 19:11, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

I think I pointed out somewhere up there that is a hypothetical question about a story I am writting ↑And even if I were pregnant and wanted to travel I couldn't... Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 19:22, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

The problem is that we can't circumvent medical/legal aid questions by posing them as hypothetical, there are real risks involved in people making medical decisions based on what is said in an anonymous forum like this. --Soman (talk) 23:42, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Assume good faith. It's not our job to sleuth out people's hidden motives. -Elmer Clark (talk) 06:37, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Had she said, can this girl I know who's 8 weeks pregnant fly safely? you'd have your request fro advice--but I am glad someone is watching. μηδείς (talk) 00:49, 23 July 2013 (UTC))

I didn't read this as a request for medical advice. I saw it as a question about airline rules. And anyway, pregnancy isn't a medical condition. HiLo48 (talk) 23:59, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Exactly, that's why one doesn't see a doctor when pregnant. μηδείς (talk) 00:49, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

It depends on the breadth of the term "condition". Pregnancy was once referred to as "her delicate condition". ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 10:08, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

It most certainly is a medical condition. What I think HiLo means is that it is not an illness, and he'd be right there. It may be accompanied by certain illnesses, but pregnancy itself is not an illness. But to repeat my opening sentence, it most certainly is a medical condition. (Spoken by someone who spent a number of years writing fund rules and policies, and definitions, for a major Australian private health insurance company.) -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 10:56, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

From my Google search for born in on airplane aeroplane in flight, I found Mom Cleared to Fly Gives Birth on Airplane! | The Stir.

—Wavelength (talk) 00:57, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

So, obviously, the answer to the OP's initial question is "Yes". In fact, the anecdote you linked to could be a good plot line for the OP's story. Throw in some creepy critters on the plane, and some random wacked-out passengers and crew, and you've got a good plot line for an "Airplane" type movie. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 09:47, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

... and don't call me Shirley. Gandalf61 (talk) 10:09, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

The possibility of a passenger going into labour in-flight cannot be ruled out and is therefore an event Flight attendants must be prepared to handle. A good attendant notices a female passenger in advanced pregnancy and inobtrusively enquires whether she is comfortable, e.g. would like an extra pillow, speaks english, and knows how long the flight will last. The pilot has the immediate authority to rule whether the passenger may fly and will consider a notice from an attendant that a passenger is likely to cause inconvenience. We can speculate on the legal consequences neither of a late-pregnant woman being refused flight, nor of compensation an unsuspecting passenger might claim for life's drama unfolding on the window seat next to him. DreadRed (talk) 09:56, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Thank you guys! and girls, if there is some girl involved... :) Anyways! Thank you all... this stuff of the ref desk is fun... I have a lot of ideas... it is helping me with my writer's block period :o Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 12:28, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Hang on, though. In late pregnancy airlines may refuse to carry you (I'm seeing "past 36 weeks" on some websites) and you may be refused travel insurance. Itsmejudith (talk) 13:17, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

That's mean with poor pregnant girls. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 18:22, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

July 23

where legs are amputated

I'm watching the very interesting vlog of "AmputeeOT" (an occupational therapist who recently lost a foot), and it occurs to me: one hears of amputation below or above the knee — how come I've never heard of amputation at the knee, i.e. keeping the whole femur but no bone below? —Tamfang (talk) 06:43, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

It's possible. The Gritti-Stokes amputation is an amputation done through the knee. It's mentioned at Amputation#Leg_amputations but there's no detail. I found a little via google. RudolfRed (talk) 07:05, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Coffee pod things

This is a very long shot, but I've been given a box of Dolce Gusto coffe pod type things, and I wonder if I can use them in a Nespresso home machine? --TammyMoet (talk) 12:39, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Our Dolce Gusto article states (unsourced) that "The Nestlé capsule systems are currently not compatible with each other, and each system requires different types of coffee capsules. Since the design is proprietary, these capsules are only available from the manufacturer." - Cucumber Mike (talk) 12:55, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

We truly have an article on everything! Thanks Mike. --TammyMoet (talk) 15:23, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

I suspect that they use the business model where they sell the coffee maker dirt cheap, perhaps even free, counting on selling you the pods at a steep markup, since there's no competition for their proprietary pods. (Of course, you can always throw the whole thing in the trash and get a cheaper system, once you realize the situation.) StuRat (talk) 18:33, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

(this is a response to Cucumber Mike's post) Hmm, the second part of that sentence is wrong. Capsules are not only available from other manufacturers, but (at least in Europe) legitimately so, according to the recent decision of the English High Court in Nestec v Dualit. See e.g. this report. --19:04, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

I had a suspicion that it might be incorrect (or at least only partially correct), which is why I qualified my answer by saying it was unsourced. In fact, the whole article is unsourced, except from the manufacturer's website. Still, I have removed the sentence in question from the article, and left a link to the above post. - Cucumber Mike (talk) 19:24, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Hours and hours??

How many hours lasts a flight from San Francisco, CA to Dublin, Ireland? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 12:57, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

http://www.travelmath.com/flying-time/from/San+Francisco,+CA/to/Dublin,+Ireland says 10 hours, 41 minutes, assuming 500 mph with 30 minutes for take-off and landing. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:18, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Any stopover? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 13:20, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

The flight range is common but it appears there is no direct flight. Entering Dublin at http://timetables.oag.com/sfo2/ gives various options with total travel time of 13-14 hours, for example starting to London in 10 hours. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:49, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

I guess that in the case you traveling in a private jet, you don't have to make any stopover, right? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 13:52, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Yes. I don't know how common the distance is for private jets but some can do it. It's 8,200 km and a Gulfstream G550 has plenty of range with 12,500 km. If you lack the range then you may be able to at least get a shorter stopover. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:11, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

((edit conflict)). In that case, yes, you wouldn't have to stop. StewieCartman (talk) 14:12, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

What about this plane MD-83 (as private)? is it fast? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 14:21, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

The short answer is: no, not really. It's in the article you reference under "Variants"

Thanks Bielle! :) can you suggest a faster plane? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 15:11, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Gulfstream G650 appears to be the fastest civilian aircraft in operation today. It has the required range. At fast cruise speed of 595 mph it has range 11112 km. We only need 8200km so it could probably get closer to the max speed of 610 mph. At 600 mph with 30 minutes for take-off and landing it would take 9 hours according to http://www.travelmath.com/flying-time/from/San+Francisco,+CA/to/Dublin,+Ireland. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:23, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Wao! Thank you very much, PrimeHunter and all of you guys!! You are amazing. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:27, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

On regular commercial airlines there is currently no direct option between SFO and DUB. You will have to change somewhere: Atlanta, Chicago, London, etc. Depending on the routing and layover time, the trip can take 15-20 hours. Faster, viable options are a direct flight on a private jet or private charter; so an Airbus A380 cruises at 945 km/h so the same site mentioned above indicates a time of 9 h 11 m. Even faster, but a lot less viable for 'ordinary' people is a faster airplane; so Concorde (if it was still flying and was permitted to fly overland at cruising speed) would take under 4 hours, flying at mach 2. There are also various supersonic commercial/private aircraft projects under development with similar speeds to Concorde, and various military research projects for hypersonic aircraft (> mach 5). Astronaut (talk) 16:40, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

'Ordinary' people are 'civilians'? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:47, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Yes. If you were rich enough to get a supersonic aircraft project off the ground, a civilian could fly on such an aircraft. But when it come to even faster, you would need to be a military test-pilot. Astronaut (talk) 16:51, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

The supersonic Concordes were unable to get licenses to fly over the mainland, a large factor in their going out of business. Cross-Atlantic flights usually have a "standard" flight time which is greatly affected by head or tailwinds. μηδείς (talk) 17:05, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

I just want my character flights fast enough to see her bfriend who had a car accident, the man who is going with her (a friend of her boyfriend) is rich enough to have a private plane. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 17:07, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Clearing things up... my questions here are not for real situations. I am not rich nor do I have a rich boyfriend, nor I am going to make a trip to ireland. I am writting a story and I am asking for advice. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 20:36, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

If this is about your pregnant passenger, things can get topsy-turvy. She might go into labour during the flight, before she or anyone else knows she is pregnant (that really happens!). Then because of time zoning, the birth day recorded on the ground could be on the day before she boarded the plane. And if it's twin babies and just one is born by midnight February 28th, his womb mate might get three birthday cakes before the other's first birthday. And if there's a miscarriage with any acusation that it was induced deliberately, Dublin is about the last place in Europe you would want to land. DreadRed (talk) 20:59, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Unidentified flying objects

I took the following pictures of some aircraft, mostly military, but they need identifying. Does anyone know what they are? Aircraft 2 and 3 are the same as is 6 and 7. Aircraft 1, aircraft 2, aircraft 3, aircraft 4, aircraft 5, aircraft 6 and aircraft 7. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 23:10, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Where did you take these photos? Besides Canada. Howicus (talk) 23:16, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Also, 1 might be a McDonnell F-101 Voodoo. Howicus (talk) 23:18, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

(ec) By the number on the tail of #1, it appears to be a McDonnell CF-101 Voodoo, actually a CF-101B according to this book, which gives its history (at the Alberta Aviation Museum in 1998). Clarityfiend (talk) 23:20, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

2/3 is a Avro Canada CF-100 Canuck -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 23:21, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

4 and 5 are both Canadair CT-133 Silver Stars. Howicus (talk) 23:24, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

6 / 7 is an HS.125-600, owned by one George Trussell of Edmonton (link). Tevildo (talk) 23:39, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

So, then, these photos were probably all taken at the Alberta Aviation Museum. Howicus (talk) 23:42, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Doesn't that mean Mr. Trussell was the photographer, not the owner? -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 23:44, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

You're right, sorry. Tevildo (talk) 23:47, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. That was very fast. Yes I took all of them at the Alberta Aviation Museum last week. My apologies to all as I didn't look properly at http://www.albertaaviationmuseum.com/Current_Collection and probably could of identified them there. I have two more that were in the restoration area, aircraft 8 and aircraft 9, that don't seem to be in the listing. I was able to id the third restoration by finding a PDF of the 2009 version of http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=ERCO_Ercoupe&oldid=284037358. Thanks again. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 00:31, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

Aircraft 9 is almost certainly the B-25J mentioned at the Alberta Aviation Museum page. Howicus (talk) 00:38, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

and the last one is a Stinson Reliant, also mentioned on the Museum's page. Howicus (talk) 00:39, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. I'm just wondering but isn't number 8 a Cessna 172? It's ident (FPGO) is different to the Reliant (FOAY). There is a 172 listed her (#60) as an pending acquisition. I just checked the Canadian Civil Aircraft Register Database (use the four letters under mark) and both idents get hits. FOAY is listed as owned by the museum and FPGO was last owned by someone in Alberta. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 02:01, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

I have no idea about green roads or green paths in the UK. I know there are green ways in the US, but they should be different from green roads in the UK.