Revision as of 05:33, 14 August 2006

Adding signature

Hi Iainsona. To add your signature, simply place four tildes (~) after your sentence. I've added the standard welcome message below which may help you learn other aspects of Wikipedia editing. Welcome! CPAScott 14:21, 9 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Welcome!

Hello, Iainsona, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome!

Wikipedia:WikiProject Newfoundland and Labrador

Welcome aboard, great to see another Wikipedian with interest in the creation and refinement of articles pertaining to Newfoundland and Labrador. I look forward to working with you. If I can be of help to you at any time please don't hesitate to drop me a line. I would very much like to collaborate on articles of mutual interest. HJKeats 16:42, 10 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I look forward to it! :) Iainsona 03:42, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Newfoundland's Time Zone

Hello Mícheál; I hope that you can make it here to my invitation so that I may learn of my errors. For our convenience, I've copied the paragraph as it was left at various times :

The paragraph as I'd left it just before HJKeats deleted it altogether (13:38, 10 August 2006):

Newfoundland has its own time zone (NST being UTC-3:30), one half hour ahead of the three other maritime Canadian provinces (AST being UTC-4) and 1.5 hours ahead of the East Coast of the U.S. (EST being UTC-5); it follows daylight time during the summer on the same schedule as throughout most of Canada (principle but not only exception being Saskatchewan).

The paragraph after the first time I fiddled with it (07:14, 8 August 2006 — 3h after I started editting in Wikipedia) :

Newfoundland has its own time zone, one half hour ahead of the three other maritime Canadian provinces and 1.5 hours ahead of the East Coast of the U.S.; it follows daylight time during the summer on the same schedule as throughout most of Canada.

The paragraph before I touched it originally (until 02:02, 7 August 2006 edit):

Newfoundland has its own time zone, set apart from the North American East Coast by one half hour, instead of the traditional one hour difference.

Your version (06:15, 10 August 2006 ):

Newfoundland has its own time zone, set apart from the nearest part of the North American East Coast (Atlantic Time) by one half hour, instead of the usual one hour time zone difference.

Apart from using 'other maritime' to refer to the fact that, although Newfoundland isn't in the Maritime Provinces of Canada club (due to staying out of confederation for 82 years), it's still maritime and your obvious objection to the word 'ahead', replacing it with the vague 'set apart' as if it were an object of desire, what other problems do you see in my paragraph?

While I wait for your answer, I would elaborate on my objections to your edit:

'Ahead' and 'behind' are used in standard English throughout the world to discuss the number of hours — or part thereof — in difference between one time zone and another. 'Set apart' would be met with looks of confusion and concern. "Indian time (UTC+5:30) is set apart from Pakistani time (UTC+5) by one half hour" wouldn't fly, in my humble opinion. In which direction is it 'set apart'?
The North American East Coast is a lot more than 3 little Canadian provinces. Atlantic Time is as much an oddity as Newfoundland time, being east of Eastern Standard Time. To make the reference most applicable to the greatest number of people, a reference to Eastern Time makes more sense. Could just as easily say that it's a half-hour behind St. Pierre time as that reference would appeal to readers in metropolitan France.
The usage of the word 'usual' when there are so many 30min time zones in the world (NT&SA, Australia:UTC+9:30, India:UTC+5:30, Afghanistan:UTC+4:30, Iran:UTC+3:30 and for smaller jurisdictions such as Norfolk Island, Aus.:UTC+11:30, Cocos Islands:UTC+6:30, and the Marquesas Islands:UTC-9:30). With India and Sri Lanka in the mix with their more than 1 billion people, that makes for a huge chunk of the world's population that lives in a half-hour time zone.

The truly unusual time zones are Nepal and the Chatham Islands which are 45 minute time zones and they're the only two in the world so far as I know (see http://www.worldtimezone.net).

==

Hey Iainsona, thanks for the reply and explanation. I'm really sorry if the note i left seemed like I was just blanketing your statement as completely incorrect. I just meant to say I changed it because it contained an error and I didn't know if I should point out the error there or just change it.

I have no idea why I used 'set apart' when I changed it-I think I just looked at the way it was before and tried to use similar language-I agree with you that using ahead and behind sounds better when you are speaking about time difference, so my apologies on that front.

Indeed the mistake I was referring to was the 'other maritime provinces' statement. Like you said, Newfoundland isn't a member of the grouping 'Maritime Provinces'-and saying that it's a 'maritime' province just because it's on the ocean doesn't fly either, not just because the term means something other than that in general Canadian geographic useage but because if you're using that as the definition than there aren't three 'other' maritime provinces there are at least 4 (Quebec) and actually even 5 if you want to get technical (B.C.).

As for "The North American East Coast is a lot more than 3 little Canadian provinces". I'd just point out that nowhere did I say or intend to say anything like this, I just pointed out that the time of the "CLOSEST" part of the North American East coast, by which I was referring to N.B./P.E.I./Nova Scotia, Labrador, and the part of Quebec which uses Atlantic time.

I actually agree with your point about making it refer to Eastern time as opposed to Atlantic so that it applies to the greatest number of people-that completely makes sense, and you could probably even just say "the bulk of the east of North America" to refer to the portion of the continent which is on Eastern time. I disagree with your statement, however, that "Atlantic Time is as much an oddity as Newfoundland time, being east of Eastern Standard Time." I don't think the original person who wrote that was saying that Newfoundland time was an oddity simply because it was east of Eastern Standard Time, I think the purpose was to point out that it is the only place on the continent where the time zone shifts by a 1/2 an hour instead of a full hour from the one next to it. I think it should say perhaps that it is 'unusual in North America' perhaps? This would solve the conflict with, as you pointed out, there are other examples of 1/2 hour changes in time zones, throughout the world and even examples of 45 minute changes. Like I said, I don't think the original writer was intending to say that Newfoundland's time zone was unique in the entire world, just that it was relatively unusual especially in the North American context?

Let me know what you think-good work all around though-and always good to talk to a fellow Newfoundlander, cheers mate. Mícheál 05:33, 14 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Daylight savings

Hi, an interesting fact from John Anderson article is the fact that Newfoundland was the first jurisdiction in North America to adopt Daylight savings time. With some work we could collaborate on an article along the lines of the Act passed in 1917 establishing the fact and have it entered in DYK. HJKeats 13:20, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

1. ... and, as you suggested at the Talk:Newfoundland, pairing that with a paragraph or two on North America's asinine attempt at double daylight savings time and making Newfoundland the guinea pig ...

2. I'm thinking too that other jurisdictions (France (including St. Pierre et Miquelon), Spain, Belgium, and the Netherlands) being 1h or more ahead (in the case of Galicia in western Spain especially) of their solar times might fit into the double daylight savings time as well; their standard times are equivalent to our daylight time (sun directly overhead at about 1pm) and their summer daylight time is equivalent to our failed attempt at double daylight savings time (sun directly overhead at about 2pm).

3. What's DYK? Iainsona 13:37, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

DYK is an acronym for Did You Know of the main section on the Wikipedia home page. New articles only qualify and it usually denotes an interesting fact that draws attention to it. It has to 5 days or less to qualify and an article of fairly good quality. It will spend a few hours on the main page and it usually attracts a bit of attention when other users will pitch in and lend a hand to embellishing the article. I have started the article, you may add to it as you wish. HJKeats 13:52, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

URGH ... I was just thinking about getting up and leaving the computer! :) Well, I suppose there are worse things that I could be 'wasting' my time on! :) <Humming a few bars from the hymn 'Yield not to Temptation'> :) Iainsona 13:57, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Excellent input, appreciate your help with this article. HJKeats 14:43, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That's all I can do for today. I've been fading fast for quite a while. I'll be talking about pink elephants in itsy-witsy, teeny-weeny yellow polka dot bikinis stepping on Flying Purple People Eaters if I don't take some respite. See you soon. Iainsona 16:00, 12 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Daylight Savings Act of 1917

Hi, I believe the article is good to go. It would be great if we had a picture of John Anderson, I'm afraid it may be impossible to get it in before we nominate it for DYK. There is a picture of him at CNS and I have spoken with the curator there and she has no problem with using any of the photographs at CNS for Wikipedia articles, just that I won't be able to make it there for a few days. The correct bill name is Daylight Saving Act (8 Geo. V,c. 9), no s. Shall I leave it to you to nominate it for DYK? HJKeats 21:42, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Should we move the article to Daylight Saving Act of 1917 first? The QEII library isn't open on Sundays but I should be able to pop by there tomorrow. You wouldn't by any chance have taken the name of the lady with whom you spoke? Or would I just say "A friend of mine had been talking with someone here and ..." Iainsona 21:47, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Also, I have no idea how to nominate an article for DYK 'though I 'spose it won't be too difficult to figure out ... :) Iainsona 21:48, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Nominated for DYK. I'm leaving the 'puter now and on my way to my parents. Edit with you tomorrow. Iainsona 22:08, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I had spoken with both Joan Ritcey and Bert Riggs. Joan is the curator and she had suggested that I bring a digital camera as what most students do during research. You may mention my name, Hayward Keats and I spoke with her about two weeks ago, maybe three. I had suggested that any digital data I use would be credited to CNS and its source. They have a number of photographs already scanned in, but for those they don't she suggested the digital camera as an option. HJKeats 22:20, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Noted. I'll bring my digital camera. I'm headed on the door now ... finally! Iainsona 22:24, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

DYK

On 13 August, 2006, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Daylight Saving Act of 1917, which you created. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the "Did you know?" talk page.

Great article. Thanks for the nomination. Great start here and I look forward to more DYKs. Cheers -- Samir धर्म 23:45, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I have to admit that I never thought 6 days ago when I joined Wikipedia that I would have been collaborating on a article that earned a place on the main page, let alone so soon. Very cool ... and many thanks to Hayward for affording me the opportunity to do so. Iainsona 03:55, 14 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]