Talk:Albinism in popular culture

Specific character entries in the lists

Resolved entries has been archived.--Kslotte (talk) 21:27, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Satan in The Passion of the Christ

Unresolved

 – Sourced, but disputed.

Removed:

• Satan (played by Rosalinda Celentano), in The Passion of the Christ (2004) is portrayed as an androgynous, albino-like figure.

This is not the List of androgynous albino-like figures in popular culture. The only questionable entries at all (e.g. the Matrix: Reloaded twins and the Taarna from Heavy Metal) are sourced with a WP-external theorist labelling them albino-like enough that the average viewer would not understand the difference; for a WP editor to assert this him/herself is original research. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 23:47, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Was restored with a source this time. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 01:15, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Update: Removed, in this form:

• "Satan" (played by Rosalinda Celentano), in The Passion of the Christ (2004) is portrayed here as an androgynous, albino-like figure.

At least one editor challenges this description as accurate at all. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 04:11, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Anime/Manga characters

Resolved

 – We can't add characters just because they have pink or blue ands and pale hair and skin, without reliable sources, per WP:V & WP:NOR.

There also also present too much anime characters with white hairs and blue/red eyes whitout any real evidence of albinism. [The previous unsigned comment was posted by 84.221.156.33 (talk · contribs), 00:02, 15 June 2007 (UTC)]

Such as...? I was pretty sure that these had been eliminated. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 00:36, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

I think that white hair, white skin and blue, pink or red eyes are enough real evidence unless refuted by something else (such as prancing around in the sunlight). So far, each of the questionable anime characters has been removed, most of them were removed due to skin or hair colour, and Folken, who was removed for other reasons, also could have been removed due to skin or hair color. I don't think there's any reason to include anime as a disqualifier. -- Gordon Ecker 02:51, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Disagree. We've got this winnowed down, per WP:NOR, so that no one at all, last I looked, is appearing on the list unless a) a reliable source (including the original publication, the film in its credits, etc.; or a third-party source, such as an interview with author/directory) says they are portrayals of albinism; or b) a reliable source demonstrates that the character is perceived as such a portrayal, regardless of authorial/directorial intent (c.f. the "Matrix Reloaded" twins). As for anime, a really good example would be the work of Camilla D'Errico, as well as many of the specific cases already dealt with on this page (some now archived). D'Errico like many Japanese manga/anime articles uses red and pink eyes with wild abandon as a form of stylization, artistic license and probable symbolism; she also, like many of the others of the genre also uses white or near-white hair in a similar vein. Yet they don't consistently coincide. In her and others' works, there are plenty of cases of white-haired characters with dark eyes, and dark-haired characters with red eyes and so on. Just like there are green-haired characters with purple eyes, and flying tentacle monsters and giant robot and so on. Your "white hair, white skin and blue, pink or red eyes are enough real evidence unless refuted by something else" position is a complete reversal of the burden of proof established as a matter of WP:POLICY at WP:V, WP:NOR and WP:NPOV. All that said, there should not be any implication that a manga/anime character cannot be added if there's reliable evidence supporting inclusion. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 07:12, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

Taarna in Heavy Metal

Unresolved

 – We may need a marginal cases section or something.

Removed:

• Taarna, heroine of the final segment of the animated film Heavy Metal, may not necessarily be intended to portray a person with natural, genetic albinism, though the distinction would be lost on most viewers.

Rationale: Unsourced and speculative; this is better saved for a section (see other discussion on this page) about marginal cases such as the Ueber-Morlock. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 20:08, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Pyramid god-king in 10,000 B.C.

Unresolved

 – God-king is Original research, servants maybe not.

The "Pyramid God" (purportedly either an Atlantean or extraterrestrial... almost certainly, in the context of the film, "really" an Atlantean) is very very pale skinned (we don't get a clear look at him) and seems to employ blind pygmy albinos as a servant class. This probably ought to be mentioned. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 17:17, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

It'd be nice if we had a source discussing it in this article's context... The fact that he's supposed to be something different from regular folk, in a race/humanity sense, seems to put him in the same blob of questionable cases as Ueber-Morlock, etc. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 12:03, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, he may be a separate "race" (or else just a highly advanced culture).. but the blind pygmy albinos are pretty clearly supposed to be humans. I'll look for an source referencing it. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 18:57, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Three links (film reviews) that refer to (alternately) the "god" and his servants as albinos. [1] [2] [3] There are many more (if you google for "10,000 bc albino"), but these seemed to be the most "reputable" sources, rather than forum comments or blog posts. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 19:09, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

I just caught the tail end of it at the theater on my way out from another movie, and the "god"/"Atlantean"/whatever clearly has pigmented eyebrows in his final scene, so he doesn't qualify. I didn't catch the dwarfs (came in too late). Will look for them on DVD, or something, after reading the sources you've dug up. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 06:50, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Did he? Good catch. I don't think he'd be a good bet anyway, as not having a clean view makes his "albinism" speculative at best... especially with the eyebrows as you mention. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 19:05, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Noi the Albino

Unresolved

 – Good entry missing; needs summary written with source(s).

Someone may wish to add to this page something about the 2003 Icelandic film "Noi the Albino" ("Nói albinói"). 71.243.16.13 (talk) 19:01, 16 March 2008 (UTC)Yes877

That's odd... I was pretty sure it was already there. It's not now. Probably another of the perpetual vandals. One of them deleted the entire History section of the article and no one noticed until 15 minutes ago! — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 12:06, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

So-called partial ocular albino in Wayne's World 2

Unresolved

 – Note added to article yet - citation needed.

Wayne's World 2.205.189.194.208 (talk) 21:35, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

This is a valid entry in the "objects of ridicule" section. Needs time code, for a {{cite video}} citation. It's also a great exmaple of ignorant nonsense about albinism (no such thing as "partial albinism" leading to one non-pigmented eye, and even if there were, someone with that condition would not have "20/20 vision in both eyes"). — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 08:37, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Jackie Rogers, Jr. on SCTV

Unresolved

 – No real source provided; case not yet examined for validity.

(He even has his own redirect)
A character played by Martin Short on SCTV.
9:56 video here.

Speaking of Vamp (film) (mentioned in the article)

Unresolved

 – No real source provided; case not yet examined for validity.

Here's Grace Jones playing an albino.

Judge Doom of Who Framed Roger Rabbit

Resolved

 – Apparent original research; no citations after several years.

Someone added Judge Doom. No source. I haven't watched that in so long, I don't remember much about it. So, I don't know if this is a good-idea entry that will be easy to source, or more WP:NOR-violating nonsense. Anyone else want to chime in? — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 10:55, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Well, he is pretty clearly of generally Caucasian appearance in his "human" guise, although with the hat off he has a shock of white/pale-blond hair and his "cartoon eyes" under his fake eyes have red/pink irises. I think he's not intended to be albino, and the red eyes are a side-effect of rage ("seeing red") due to his toon nature. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 22:16, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, that seems just as likely. A "possibility 1.5" is that his Toon appearance is intended to just look like a typical white pet store bunny rabbit, and most of the white ones are albinos, but not necessarily everyone would know that. They'd just think "white rabbit, ergo pink eyes", the way people think "husky dog or Siamese cat, ergo blue eyes" without understanding the genetics behind the breeds. Regardless, there's no source, so I'm tagging this one as orig. research. I wonder if the DVD/Blu-ray version has commentary that could elucidate? If so, {{Cite video}} exists. :-) — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 01:47, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Walter Geist from The Secret of Lost Things

Unresolved

 – Character not yet investigated and added to appropriate section.

The character Walter Geist in Sheridan Hay's novel The Secret of Lost Things (HB ISBN 978-0385518482,, PB ISBN 978-0307277336) is explicitly stated to be albinistic. That is all I know at this point. Someone will need to read the book to be able to place the character in the appropriate list. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 03:12, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Bjørn Beltø by Egeland

Unresolved

 – Needs verification.

Bjørn Beltø is listed as a positive portrayal in the article, but in a student book review is has been described as "strange and neurotic", which could suggest a neutral or ambiguous treatment. Judging from Amazon search results on "albino" in books, the character may make a re-appearance in Egeland's Relic (2010, ISBN 978-0719521638; original Norwegian version probably 2009, ISBN ???, Norwegian title ???). That is all I know at this point. Someone will need to read the books to be able to place the character in the appropriate list. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 08:37, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Ingrid in Northlanders: "Metal" (Vertigo Comics)

I saw a comic with an obviously albinistic woman on the cover. Scribbled the title and publisher down. Found a few deets online. The character is Ingrid, with a companion named Erik, "outcasts in 9th century Norway" She looked very pretty in the cover art of #32, but the interior art made her very homely. She seemed to be a victim of some kind - very distraught throughout the story, which I didn't read, just skimmed for 30 sec., since I had somewhere else to be. Some of the online material suggests she may be the heroine of the story (they "strike a series of blows for individuality against the rigid conformity of the local priesthood", and she's definitely one of the two main characters of this storyline; no idea how she figures in the series as a whole. That said, a synopsis of the first issue in the sub-series has them "launch a crusade of violent retribution" against "corrupt Christian missionaries", so some might view this as an "ambiguous portrayal", depending upon what the actual plot is really like. The Northlanders article suggests that the "Metal" story was 3 issues (nos. 30-32); however, this site (with the cover image I mentioned) shows that the "Metal" story continued through issue #34. All are collected in a graphic novel version with related stories from the Northlanders franchise (specifically, the GN is issues 29-36 and is also named "Metal"). Ingrid also appears on the cover of issues 31 and 34. That's all I know about it at this point. Any comics fans want to investigate? PS: I have not found a source that actually says "she is an albino" or whatever. The synopses are very, very short. Just thought I'd brain dump this here before I forgot about it. I actually had the title and publisher written on a dollar bill for lack of scratch paper, and almost spent it. Heh. Comics are so expensive these days, I'm not willing to shell out for all 5 issues or the GN; I'll leave it to a comics collector to pick this one up. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 04:57, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Revenant victims in "Fablehaven"

Resolved

 – Original research, absent some reliable source; factually incorrect anyway.

Removed this:

• Several characters from Brandon Mull's "Fablehaven" series were temporarily albinistic, losing their pigmentation (along with most of their brain functioning) after encounters with a revenant. Their brain functioning was restored after the death of the revenant, and their albinism was cured soon after by a magical artifact.

There's no such thing as temporary albinism; it's a genetic trait. Being turned magically pale isn't albinism. If a reliable source puts this case in the context of albinism stereotypes or something like that, this might be worth looking into as a borderline entry, in my view. But we've already excluded better candidates like the Ueber-Morlock from the Time Machine remake several years ago, and so on. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 03:28, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

Yin in Darker than Black

Resolved

 – Misrepresentation of source material.

Removed this:

• Yin, the albino girl from the anime Darker than Black.

She's just a clone of a blonde Finnish girl. See her entry in the anime's main article. No source for her being albinistic. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 03:28, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

Bella Swan from the "Twilight" franchise

Resolved

 – Original research, absent some reliable source; and some nonsense too.

Removed this:

• Bella Swan, from Twilight, was said to be half or part albino.

This is not supported by her article here or anything else I've found. And there's no such thing as "part albino" or "half albino" anyway; either you have the genetics or you don't. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 03:28, 19 March 2011 (UTC) NB: There are some species that have forms of albinism that humans cannot get, such as the point coloration of Siamese and related cat breeds, and there are human conditions that cause different sorts of albinism (ocular vs. oculo-cutaneous), and different subtypes, as well as conditions that cause lack of pigmentation for non-albinistic genetic reasons, partially or body-wide. None of these things are "half-albinism" or "part-albinism", made-up terms with no definitions. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 03:16, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

Leo/Kimba and related lions in Jungle Emperor/Kimba the White Lion

Osamu Tezuka's classic Jungle Emperor (a.k.a. Kimba the White Lion; first anime broadcast in color, and the inspiration for Disney's The Lion King) features a white lion (thus the title, obviously), which would only occur in nature either because of albinism, in the general lion population, or due to the color inhibitor ("chinchilla") gene of so-called white lions (actually blonde), exclusively in the Timbavati region of South Africa. More complicating yet is the problem, as discussed above, that manga/anime (and Tezuka is the "Father of Manga and Grandfather of Anime") is notorious for very pale characters as symbolic (as already discussed in the article) without them being intended to be interpreted as albinos. I don't know jack about this character or his apparent progeny (I've seen a manga cover featuring what is presumably Kimba and a lion cub, also white). Kimba and cub have blue irises, but Timbavati "white" lions have yellow eyes, like most other cats, and all non-albino lions. The characters also have dark ear- and tail-tips, suggesting genetics in common with Siamese and related cat breeds with point colors (but - the plot thickens - that is actually a form of albinism in felines!); yet this could simply be artistic license, or even a direct homage to Moby Dick, who had some pigmented parts. So, make of that what you will. The article on the manga/anime has no information, sourced or otherwise, on Kimba/Leo's coloration. I'll let someone else look into this one for sources about why the characters are pale. I don't even see anything anywhere that says they are intended to be real-world Timbavati lions. At any rate, the portrayal is a positive one, with aspects of victimhood, if anyone does find anything; Kimbas's father is killed by hunters for his hide, and himself and his mother taken to be zoo animals or something, but he returns to be the lion emperor and is even keen on finding common ground with humans, perhaps even at the cost of his own life. That's about all I know about the plot, too. ;-) — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 03:16, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

The Simpsons again

Riffing on the "albinos invisible in snow" joke from a much earlier episode, a season 23 ep actually shows an albinistic guy and his albinio pet rabbit being invisible against snow except for bloodshot-looking pink eyes. I can't remember what episode it was though. — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒〈°⌊°〉 Contribs. 03:03, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

Ghost from A Song of Ice and Fire

As said in the article: 'Ghost is said to have been the runt of his litter, and thus this novel links albinism with other unrelated conditions'

Where is that said? There doesn't seem to be a citation, and from my own reading of the books, I can't recall anything that could be interpreted as that. Possibly the suggestion that the other pups drove him away (A Game of Thrones, p18) could be construed as his being the runt - though by the usual definition, a runt is smaller and weaker than the others, but Lady, not Ghost, was the smallest of the litter (A Game of Thrones, p152) and I'm not aware of any reference to Ghosts being physically weak, or disadvantaged in any way. And it was never implied that his being rejected by his littermates was for any reason other than his albinism, so what link with unrelated conditions? I've removed it for now, but did the entry ought to be moved to 'positively portrayed'? Unless of course anyone has a citation to support the line in question. CarrieVS (talk) 20:21, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

• Since no-one seems to have any opinion, I've moved it to positive portrayals. CarrieVS (talk) 22:02, 2 November 2012 (UTC)

Volmae, in Farscape S01E06

Episode 6 of season 1 of Farscape, "Thank God It's Friday, Again", features a typical evil albino trope, this time in the character Volmae (played by Angie Milliken). She is pale, white-haired, and red-eyed, collaborating with aliens to enslave her people (who do not share her appearance, but are red-skinned), and to rip off the masters for her own gain. She is made to realize the error of her ways toward the end of the plot. [4]  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽^ʌⱷ҅_ᴥⱷ^ʌ≼  10:13, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

---

Famous people with albinism list

Please add topics about this section of the article as subtopics under this topic.

[This section was refactored in from Talk:Albinism after the merge of the relevant section into the Albinism in popular culture article.]

List needed; King Yellowman; Piano Red

Resolved

 – List created and desired entries added; long since expanded further.

Also, are/were there any famous albinos? If so, could we have a list? User:Palefire

I added a bit about what I know... Yellowman is albino. Tuf-Kat 22:58, Aug 18, 2004 (UTC)

I forgot Piano Red was albino too. Tuf-Kat

List deleted

Resolved

 – List was restored.

Why was the list of famous people with albinism removed? --buck 19:11, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I could find no reason why this section was deleted on 28 Oct 06, so I've restored it. --buck 04:45, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

Anthony Rapp?

Resolved

 – Entry for Rapp was unsourced and false original research; deleted. But existence and name of band is appropriate for ambig. section

Deleted entry in list. No evidence of albinism, including on his own bio, or in the article about him. He is a stawberry-blond with well-pigmented skin. He just happens to be in a band called Albinokid. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 10:11, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Added the band itself to the list under ambiguous/neutral, since they do exist and are a pop culture item. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 12:09, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

"Ice"

Resolved

 – No objections to inclusion after several years; added back in.

• Removed "Ice - porn star" from the "commonly mistaken" section. Not sure if it was meant to be added there or to the main list. Sounds bogus anyway, and no sources. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 22:27, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Quick Googling suggests that "Ice" is a non-albinistic African-American uh "actress". — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 23:23, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Hmm...on further research, this entry actually appears to be legit and not a nonsense edit (though a badly formed one, and misfiled in "commonly mistaken".) A different, albinistic, "Ice" (a.k.a. "Icy") has done at least three four "adult" movies: Homegrown Video 663 (2003), Handjobs Across America 12 (2005), and Eye Contact 35 (2006). Warning: If you go looking for source material on this, you will run into naughty pictures. Anyway, I'm not sure this qualifies as "notable" or "famous", but "Ice" appears to be the only albinistic porn "star" in the world. I've never bothered to find out how porn star articles are sourced on WP. I know WP:CENSOR, but still, I'm not sure it would be appropriate to link to smut retailers as sources. Are there notability guidelines for porn stars? I guess if these series of videos have reached numbers like 35 and 663 volumes they might be "notable". <fzzt> This isn't exactly my field... — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 23:48, 1 March 2007 (UTC) Updated: 08:37, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Any one else have an opinion on this? I don't want to leave her out just because she's a porn star rather than, say, a singer, but I don't really know what the "notability" criteria might be for pornographic performers. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 18:33, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Being the only albinistic pornographic actress would seem to be notable, but only if she truly is the only one, right? So if we have a reliable source stating such, she should go on the list, otherwise it's OR to declare her as the only abinistic porn star... unless someone claims to know EVERY person who's ever made pornography. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 22:18, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Agreed, and she's not, at least if one considers home-made stuff (a few minutes on Google turned up an albinistic male doing an erotic webcam show). That said, Ice is still notable enough for this list (though maybe not for her own article - there's a whole guideline about pornstar notability, I think), since she has now four readily-available DVDs, from multiple production companies. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 01:42, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Ice is not currently on the list... and I can't seem to find where/when/why she was removed. Any ideas? --Dante Alighieri | Talk 18:18, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

Some anon deleted half the list some while ago. I've been restoring. I'll put her back on. I guess her videos are essentially sources, so I'm not sure anything further is needed to just mention her here (for her own article, it would be, since notability wouldn't be established otherwise per WP:N, of course). — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 06:51, 9 March 2011 (UTC) Actually, I think she was deleted (possibly by me!) before the famous-people material was merged in here from the main albinism article. Anyway, I put her back in, and used one ref tag to mention all four films. Just mentioning them should be enough. Films, like books and other publications, effectively are their own sources (at least for the basic facts like that they exists, and who they credit). I think that linking to them directly, like the pages about them at the companies that have produced the DVDs, would run afoul of WP:SPAM. I have not, in several years, bothered looking to see if any independent sources mention her (e.g. adult reviews sites, etc.), to establish notability enough for an article. Don't really care to. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 07:36, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

A Porn Star?

There is an African-American, gay porn star named Casper, obviously after the cartoon ghost. http://www.iafd.com/person.rme/perfid=casper_bl/gender=m/casper.htm — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chumley41 (talk • contribs) 01:32, 9 March 2013 (UTC)

Presumably non-notables

Resolved

 – Removed as non-neutral and original research, on a non-notable alleged person.

• Removed "William Howard Adams, American - incredible human being", per WP:N and WP:NPOV. If someone knows who this is and finds him notable, some sources would be good, or go write an article on him? — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 22:18, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

No confirming Google hits so far. There's an author/historian by this name, but isn't albinistic, judging from his photos. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 23:27, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Unsourced entries

[This topic from moved here from Talk:Albinism because the section it referred to was merged into this article.]

It strikes me as important that the existing entries in the "famous" list should get sourced as soon as possible. To the extent I have time to work on the albinism articles in large blocks of time, I want to focus on sourcing the medical facts (esp. since effectively no one else is, aside from User:Allyddin Sane occasionally, and the article will lose it's Wikipedia Release Version "A-Class" status eventually if this isn't rectified.) But some folks less interested in the medical jargon could help out a lot by just doing some basic research on the people in the list to source each with at least one reasonably reliable source (People magazine, probably OK; National Enquirer, not.) Might even be fun! — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 23:48, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

I will see when I can get more active again, but it might take until July for a reasonable calming of my schedule. Is there any deadline for that status or anything similar? Allyddin Sane 00:12, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

Not that I know of for certain; I do see articles get downgraded all the time though. I think it's just when an assessor happens to bother to stop in and reassess, or when someone objects to the assessment. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 00:45, 2 March 2007 (UTC) Note: This comment has more to do with Albinism than Albinism in popular culture, as Albinism has an A-class assessment from the Medical Genetics WikiProject, and Albinism in popular culture has no such assessment to live up to. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 12:11, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

D'arcy Wretzky (Smashing Pumpkins)

Resolved

 – No evidence at all that D'arcy Wretzky is albinistic.

I have a doubt about if D'arcy Wretzky from the Smashing Pumpkins is albino, because I have seen her many times with some characteristics, like the white hair, that makes me wonder about it. Thank you. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 201.134.69.125 (talk) 16:40, 17 April 2007 (UTC).

Bleach. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 19:15, 17 April 2007 (UTC) PS: Dark hair roots, dark eyebrows, dark eyes, no mention of albinism at her article here. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 12:39, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Michael Jackson

Resolved

 – Addressed by main article already.

I tried asking this at the Albinism page but someone said they wouldn't answer it and I should ask it here: Does Michael Jackson have the Albino disease or something? Why is he white? Thanks 14:55, 23 September 2007 (UTC)~~

You can't "contract" albinism, as the article clearly explains; if you weren't born albinistic you never will be. Jackson's lightening skin tone is was due to bleaching treatments and makeup, as is well documented at his article. Please read the articles before asking questions about them. :-) — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 16:28, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the help19:54, 23 September 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.210.248.112 (talk)

I have vitiligo. I asked my dermatologist if it is possible for a persion with vitiligo to turn albino. He said yes. Some of his patients had "turned white." I don't know if this is regarded by the medical profession as true albinism. Eligius (talk) 03:31, 30 January 2012 (UTC)

Pedro Julio-Hughes

This entry was removed as unsourced:

• Pedro Julio-Hughes, Puerto Rican artist and falconer

No information available so far.

Helder Gomez

This entry was removed as unsourced:

• Helder Gomes, civil rights advocate

No information available so far.

Tony Evans

This entry was removed as unsourced:

• Tony Evans, American newspaper columnist

No information available so far.

Rebeca Soto-Healy

This entry was removed as unsourced:

• Rebeca Soto Healy, socialite heiress of the Mexican newspaper El Imparcial

No information available so far.

Li Yipeng

Resolved

 – Sourceable, but questionably notable.

This entry was removed as unsourced:

• Li Yipeng, Lee Hsien Loong's son

No information available so far.

Restored with source. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 06:53, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Later removed as a redlink. May not be notable (just being the son of someone famous doesn't confer notability). — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ  Contribs. 12:16, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

Undid some but not all removals from famous people section

All of the following were removed on the basis that they are redlinks. I don't entirely agree with that - redlinks encourage article creation, and many pages have redlinks on them without people feeling the need to delete them - but I don't want to fight about it. I'll preserve the list here, with sources, and it should be checked periodically to see if any of them have turned into bluelinks. I think that several of them eventually will, including Fox, Nahadr, Krondon, Sánchez, and Radhakrishnan in particular, since cursory Google searches on them turn up all kinds of stuff.

• Tony Evans, American newspaper columnist
• Brooke Fox, American singer-songwriter
• Krondon, rapper and hip-hop musician and producer
• Li Yipeng, Lee Hsien Loong's son
• Mem Nahadr (a.k.a. "M"), American performance artist, composer and jazz vocalist
• TK Radhakrishnan, Carnatic flutist
• Nestor Sánchez, Cuban singer
• Ali Şengöz, Turkish radio DJ

Evans, Li and Şengöz seem less likely to generate articles. Turkish WP has no article on Şengöz, and (almost surprisingly) the Spanish WP has no article on Sánchez despite Google evidence indicating that he's pretty popular in Cuba and Puerto Rico. Nahadr had an article already, but it was a copyvio (copy-paste of a bio from another website) and got speedied. Brooke Fox is particularly likely to generate an article, as she is increasingly well-known and has performed on various major shows (Conan O'Brien, etc.). Redford White does have an article at one of the Philippine Wikipedias, so I've restored him to the list as notable and redlinked. Since being delted from this list, Malford Milligan has had an article written about him, so I've restored him to the list. Great example of why not to delete redlinks just because they are redlinks. I've also restored Bowman and Hurley, since the former was a major-character actor in a notable film with an article, and Hurley has acted in and produced films that have articles, so neither will stay redlinked forever. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 20:45, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

Update: Krondon's not a redlink any longer; adding him back into article. — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ  Contribs. 08:09, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

Update: Bowman and Nahadr have articles now. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 08:37, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

References

Woman in music video by Biff Naked

Resolved

 – Not albinistic, and non-notable even if she were.

The woman 18 seconds in, in Bif Naked's ["Lucky" music video, and also about 2 minutes into it.

Why would we care about some woman appearing randomly in a music video? Utterly non-notable. And it's not an albinistic woman, just some goth chick with black contacts and bleached hair. Please actually read Albinism. :-/ — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 10:55, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Two more models

Resolved

 – Just an FYI; to-do list updated.

Diandra Forrest and Stephen Thompson (model) badly need an article each. She's being called "the first albino supermodel" (in more than one source) and had a TV feature about her, and he's gotten a lot of coverage already, as well a prominent cover and a major ad campaign. Google turns up all kinds of stuff on both. She is already much better known and with more and broader exposure than Connie Chiu (who may well be retired at this point - haven't see anything new from her in years). Forrest is with a major modeling agency, appears in numerous major-publication photo-editorials and ad campaigns, and has been profiled in magazines and TV shows, as well been in a Kanye West music video. Thompson is not yet as well-known as the other male albinistic model, Shaun Ross, and I can't yet find what his agency is (used to be UglyNY, but they're defunct) nor where he is from (US? Scotland? I dunno). — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 06:31, 9 March 2011 (UTC) Update: Digging around, I've found pics of Thompson, watermarked "INMAGINE" that date to Nov. 2008 or earlier. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 06:48, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

Update: I believe that the albinistic male model-actor in Katy Perry's new music video "E.T." is Thompson. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 06:09, 1 April 2011 (UTC)

Danish Ahmed

He is probably notable, but I know this guy personally, so adding him would be a WP:COI problem for me, and maybe even selecting sources would be, so I'll leave it to someone else. Here's the entry as it once was, and subsequently removed for now:

• Danish Ahmed, a Pakistani-Canadian writer and speaker (author of A Dictionary of Distinctions, ISBN 978-0-973-13600-5)

— SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 05:03, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

---

Double standards

Resolved

 – No consensus for proposal in over a year.

According to the current version of the article:

"These lists do not include fantastic characters whose appearances are similar to albinos, but for reasons other than actual albinism (aliens, the undead, magical beings, the genetically altered, etc.) Exceptions are characters who are broadly perceived as members of the "evil albino" category due to the distinction being lost on audiences, where this confusion can be reliably sourced."

Why shouldn't neutrally and positively portrayed non-albinistic characters such as Daniel Hall have the same criteria for inclusion as negatively portrayed non-albinistic characters such as Killface? -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 07:43, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Are there any objections to expanding this rule to cover all characters commonly perceived as albinistic? -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 01:15, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

Yes. There have been numerous objections to this, all throughout not only this page's existence but every version of it heretofore; this talk page largely consists of nothing but such objections. Doing so is [[WP:NOR|blatant original research]; this is Albinism in popular culture, not Non-albinos broadly interpreted (according to someone's unsourced personal opinion) as members of the "evil albino" category in popular culture. We've even removed some characters that can be marginally sourced as perhaps falling into this category, on the basis of undue weight and questionable source reliability. There is no double standard here. There is no Killface in the list, and if someone added that pale extraterrestrial to the list, I or someone else would immediately remove that entry as original research. There is no dispute here. Another way of looking at it: See WP:WIAFL/WP:WIAFA and consider the criteria there. This should be a Featured List (or Featured Article, if its non-listy material grows significantly) at some point, but it will never be one, or even a Good Article, if it contains questionable entries. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 21:04, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

In the first post, I wasn't suggesting the addition af Daniel Hall or Killface, I was suggesting that their inclusion or exclusion should be based on the same set of rules. By "expanding this rule" I meant replacing "Exceptions are characters who are broadly perceived as members of the "evil albino" category due to the distinction being lost on audiences, where this confusion can be reliably sourced." with "Exceptions are characters who are broadly perceived as albinistic due to the distinction being lost on audiences, where this confusion can be reliably sourced.". Most of the objections seem to be based on inadequate sourcing, original research or failure to meet the current criteria, you seem to be the only one who objects to fixing the double standard in the evil albino merge artifact by expanding the criteria, and that objection seems to be based on a misinterpretation of my suggestion. Anyway, the double standard could also be fixed by removing the "Exceptions are characters who are broadly perceived as members of the "evil albino" category due to the distinction being lost on audiences, where this confusion can be reliably sourced." line. I prefer the former option, but would also okay with the latter option. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 22:59, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

So ... are there any objections to fixing the double standard could also be fixed by removing the "Exceptions are characters who are broadly perceived as members of the "evil albino" category due to the distinction being lost on audiences, where this confusion can be reliably sourced." line and cutting out all the villainous and / or negatively portrayed non-albinistic characters who were included due to that line? -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 02:09, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

Needs further discussion, I think. No one has supported the idea. I see where you are coming from, but a) we have an arguably reliable source that not-quite-true-albinos or maybe-albinos are in fact an aspect of the "evil albino" phenomenon, meanwhile b) we have no such source suggesting that, say, white-haired anime characters are part of any counter-meme, rather than just being coincidentally white-haired because anime artists like to make characters look unusual. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 20:17, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

Restructuring proposal

Resolved

 – Clearer section names will solve the problem.

I've got a better restructuring proposal. IMO the fiction section should be divided into the following subsections:

• Heroes and positive portrayals
• Neutral and ambiguous portrayals
• Subjects of ridicule, and "freaks"
• Villains
• Characters commonly perceived as albinistic
• Animals
• Other references to albinism (any verified intentional reference to albinism in fiction which doesn't fit into any of the above categories)

The "Characters commonly perceived as albinistic" section would be used for characters such as The Twins from The Matrix Reloaded, IMO we should probably require a citation for each enty in that section because these entries are likely to be challenged. The "Animals" section would cover characters such as Moby-Dick. The "other references to albinism" section would cover intentional references to albinism which do not involve actual albinism, such as Graham Coates being compared to an albino ferret, or Augusta Seger, a non-albinistic supervillain who picked up "Albino" as a nickname. As for "fantastic characters" (aliens, mutants, monsters, the genetically engineered, the magically transformed, characters in an anime or manga where everyone has unusual hair and eye colours etc.), IMO we should be extremely skeptical about claims that they are albinistic, but should treat them the same as any other characters if they are confirmed to be albinistic, confirmed to be commonly perceived as albinistic or fit into the "other references to albinism" category. This article is titled "albinism in popular culture", not "the evil albino stereotype in popular culture". -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 04:05, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Since no one has commented on my most recent proposal, I've decided to make the change and let the issue be resolved through the BRD cycle. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 05:17, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

Partially reverted, per WP:BRD, on the following grounds, among others:

1. The split caused an excessive amount of sectioning and subsectioning.
2. The list has long been stable with a simple structure of negative, neutral and positive, a structure by design, and essentially necessitated by the nature of the article (largely about albino bias but addressing exceptions, as well as celebs).
3. When stripped of original research, practically nothing was left of the new sections (e.g. there was only one remaining "Characters commonly perceived as albinistic" entry that can actually be sourced as so perceived; "negative portrayals" was empty for animals; only 6 or so animal entries remained total; etc.).
4. The Matrix twins have also been reliably sourced as quite central to the renewed debate about the "evil albino" stereotype, so I've moved it back up top where it belongs.
5. The division also marginalized the Autumn/Winter case, one of the most important bullet items in the entire article (fixed).
6. There isn't any particular reason to divide "100% human" from other entries; this list isn't about character classification by biology. Everyone in the Matrix is a construct, and virtually everyone in Jonah Hex is a mutant of one kind or another, as just two examples, with a third being the very frequent tying of albinism to magical powers in fantasty fiction (presumably an unexplained biological detail). So dwelling on details and trying to classify by them is pointless.
7. Diving the list by these criteria was not actually performed consistently (cf. anthropomorphic badger entry I had to relocate).
8. To the extent that separating out animals has merit, it can be done at the end of the established neg./neut./pos. sections (as I have done, as a compromise).
9. The split has encouraged and directly resulted in a big stream of bogus entries, all of them blatant original research, by suggesting in the intro that supernatural and alien and just white-haired and whatever entries are okay as long as they are in the new sections.

While some attempt at compromise has been made (as noted, I'm conceding that someone might find animal vs. human entries being separate somehow useful; also kept "other references" section and moved item into it), mostly the article's been restored to the structure it was, plus some further improvements (e.g. the problem that "villain" and "hero" are too limiting, as brought up in another thread, has been dealt with).

— SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 22:32, 16 December 2009 (UTC)

Wouldn't listing a character in one of the "portrayals" sections without some source verifying that it's an actual intentional portrayal of albinism and not merely some coincidence perceived as a portrayal be original research and non-neutral? I've added the accuracy tag due to the misleading headings. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 01:46, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

The sole unusual cases, the Matrix twins and Autumn Brothers, are well-documented on both sides of the disputes surrounding them. Tagging the entire "Fiction" section with a blanket dispute tag is rather too WP:POINTy. Get to the details you disagree with, please. I've added another source in the Autumn/Winter case (which needed an update anyway). Wikipedia is not making the claim that the Matrix twins or the Autumn brothers were negative portrayals of people with albinism; we're citing those who are. Ergo not a WP:NOR issue nor a WP:NPOV problem. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 05:46, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

The details I disagree with are the inaccurate section titles. By including the twins in the "negative portrayals" when that categorization is disputed, the article is taking a side in that dispute. Perhaps an "alleged portrayals" section could be added. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 22:21, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

The section titles aren't inaccurate - no one has questioned that the portrayals are negative (hostile, antagonistic). That there is a dispute as to whether the portrayal in one case is truly of albinos in the strictest sense has been sourced both pro and con, and the published view that such marginally albinistic portrayals qualify as albino bias has also been sourced, in the lead; meanwhile no counter viewpoint has been found published yet. WP's job on the matter is done, at least for now. If someone puts out a screed against the "Vailian" viewpoint on the matter we can cite that, too. If this still isn't satisfactory to you, file a WP:RFC on the matter, since the two of us arguing about it circularly won't help resolve the question. Better to arrive at a broader consensus.  SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ  Contribs. 20:24, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

This article is titled "albinism in popular culture", this means that the "fiction" section is implicitly about albinism in fiction, and that the "negative portrayals" section is about negative portrayals of albinism in fiction. I'm not questioning the characters' inclusion in the article, the interpretation of the Twins as an example of the "evil albino" stereotype is definitely an example of albinism in popular culture, however the characters themselves are not necessarily a portrayal of albinism in fiction, it could just be an unfortunate coincidence, so I believe it would be misleading and violate WP:NPOV to stick it in a section specifically for actual confirmed portrayals of albinism in fiction. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 22:38, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Again, I don't see any point in us two continuing to go over this by ourselves. If you (along among everyone else apparently) are not satisfied that the fact that "the audience wouldn't know the difference" portrayals can sometimes constitute cases of "evil albino stereotype", despite the fact that we have sourced this viewpoint, and would be perfectly willing to source an opposing viewpoint if one could be found, then that is a matter for wider consensus discussion, and it really doesn't have anything at all to do with section titles. It's a matter of whether the Matrix twins belong there. I will stand very, very firmly by them belonging there since we have sources that show definitively that they are in fact part of the albino bias debate in the public consciousness, in a big way. There is nothing anywhere in this article to indicate that a) The article's lead and initial discussion is about the albinio bias/evil albino issue broadly, but b) the lists that follow cannot contain entries where we have reliable sources that the figures are perceived as fitting into that stereotype. The difference between the Maxtrix twins and the long list of deleted stuff above is that the WP:OR junk was removed because of lack of sources, either showing authorial intent or showing public perception. I can't think of any other way to explain this. Either we'll agree, or the larger community should decide the matter, but it's Christmas Eve and I don't want to keep arguing about it. :-)  SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ  Contribs. 00:42, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

Another way of putting it: If the Matrix twins "belong in the article" (you don't disagree that they do), they can't be "outside the scope of that specific section" unless they aren't portrayed negatively, since that's the only thing asserted by that section asserted more specifically than the article as a whole[*] (and if that were the case, they'd have to be in some other section, such as the neutral/ambiguous one). By way of analogy, if I am admitted into membership in a private club, and everyone in that club is divided into the "Members Six Feet Tall and Up" chapter and the "Members Under Six Feet Tall" chapter, and I am 5'9", there is no basis upon which to deny my membership in the shorter chapter other than by challenging either my measurements or the validity of my club membership card. If the twins belong in the article (that is the case), and everyone in the article is in one section or another (and that is the case), and they are villain/antagonist characters (that is the case too), then by definition they have to be in that category (which, naturally, is also the case). [* Not counting the famous people/animals and folklore/urban myth sections, which were added on later and aren't relevant to this discussion].  SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ  Contribs. 05:16, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

But the twins aren't listed in a section on albino bias, the evil albino stereotype or alleged portrayals of albinism, they're listed in a section about negative portrayals of albinism in fiction. The Twins are clearly negatively portrayed characters, and it is clear that they have been interpreted as examples of albino bias and the evil albino stereotype, however it is not clear that they constitute a portrayal of albinism. I think the simplest solution would be to rename the "fiction" section to with "albinism and fiction" and rename the "negative portrayals", "neutral and ambiguous portrayals" and "positive portrayals" to "negatively potrayed characters", "neutrally and ambigously portrayed characters" and "positively portrayed characters", which would expand the scope of the sections from properly sourced confirmed portrayals of albinism to properly sourced examples of characters related in some way to albinism and fiction. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 02:20, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

Sold! Honestly, I don't see the difference very clearly, but I don't see anything objectionable about the section titles at all, and if it makes everyone happy, then great. :-) I've also argued for longer but clearer disambiguations in an RFC recently on another topic, so I'd feel hypocritical arguing for shorter section titles if someone is making a heartfelt case that they are more vague (even if I'm not seeing the vagueness very clearly). — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ  Contribs. 08:01, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

Simple Man

Resolved

 – Author added to article.

I was wondering if you know who the author of the book Simple Man that is referred to in the Wikipedia is? I wanted to try and find the book it sounds interesting. Violet yoshi (talk) 03:39, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Ruadhan J. McElroy, added to article. You can use Google to find simple bits of information like this. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 20:59, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

Ween's "Albino Sunburned Girl"

Unresolved

 – Not in article yet; such things may need own section.

This song (also covered by the Jimmy Wilson Group) is all over YouTube and I guess is a big number for Ween, who I've honestly not listened to at all since around 1994. Anyway, it's a cultural reference, like the Nirvana song we're already listing. I don't know jack about this song or the band, so someone else with a clue about them should probably add this to the right place in the article. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 08:52, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

I just saw an album by another band kinda like this (I forget the details, but can find it again). Along with Albino Kid and these other things, this strongly suggests a "References in pop culture" section, as I've seen in various other articles. — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 08:37, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

El Blanco albino graboid

I notice that the article lists the film as "incorrectly" describing the graboid as sterile as a result of albinism... I think we can all agree that it's difficult to be "incorrect" about the cause/effect relationship of genetic or other disorders/anomalies in a fictional species with no known biological kinship to any known animal. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 18:14, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

Needs rephrasing. The issue is that, like many other cited examples, the creators of the character link albinism with other genetic problems, when there is no such link (generally; there are in fact some odd-ball genetic conditions that result in both albinism and some other problems - the main Albinism article lists a number of them the infobox by their OMIM codes - but in these cases it is correlation, not causation, in that both albinism and whatever else are both associated with the condition in question, but the albinism is not causing the other problem(s). — SMcCandlish Talk⇒ ʕ(^Õل^ō)ˀ Contribs. 06:37, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

Fair enough. It's been QUITE some time since I've seen the Tremors films... I assume the film explicitly makes the albinism causative of the sterility? If so, maybe a note that in all known albinistic creatures, no form of albinism results in sterility while some in some rare cases both albinism and sterility might result from a larger "parent" disorder? --Dante Alighieri | Talk 17:47, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

Use of the word "albinistic".

On this and other related articles, the word albinistic appears to have be old standard for referring to animals and humans with albinism. I object to this, as the word is at best non-standard outside of it's use in Wikipedia articles, and carries connotations of an epithet. I would personally like to we of replaced with more standard vocabulary. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.192.151.28 (talk) 12:43, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Use of the word "albinistic".

On this and other related articles, the word albinistic appears to have become standard for referring to animals and humans with albinism. I object to this, as the word is at best non-standard outside of it's use in Wikipedia articles, and carries connotations of an epithet. I would personally like to we of replaced with more standard vocabulary. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.192.151.28 (talk) 12:44, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

"normal-looking"

"normal-looking" Really? Are we going to call some skin colours normal? So what is normal, what shade of pink, black, brown, yellow or red do we consider normal? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Spazturtle (talk • contribs) 15:51, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

I think normal means anything on the, well, normal scale of human skin colours, as opposed to a skin colour caused by a medical condition. You have a point, though. If you think it's poorly expressed, you could try and improve it. Be bold. CarrieVS (talk) 12:10, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

If anyone wants to see the context, it's in this section. CarrieVS (talk) 12:15, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

The Heat

The character 'Craig' in the 2013 movie 'The Heat' is subject to mockery throughout the film because he is portrayed as an albino. Please can someone with the know how add it to the list? Many thanks.Spikymoss (talk) 09:10, 6 September 2013 (UTC)

Albino Farm (2009)

Probably the most obvious thing in years to cover here [5]. I will actually watch it in its entirety before adding a summary of it, since the entire thing may be a tongue-in-cheek commentary on the evil albino stereotype, rather than a wallowing in it. But if anyone else has seen it, feel free to beat me to it.  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽^ʌⱷ҅_ᴥⱷ^ʌ≼  12:51, 26 December 2015 (UTC)

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Dany, & the Targs. ASOIAF

So we have the dire wolf Ghost mentioned, but how about Daenerys Targaryen and the entire Targaryen family. Who would marry brother to sister to keep the 'dragon blood' pure. Dany should come under the section of positively portrayed characters, with a mention of the rest of her family. Maybe it should also be mentioned that they are not portrayed with Albinism in the HBO TV show.