Talk:Steve Irwin

Please note that this Talk page is for discussion of changes to the Steve Irwin article. Off-topic discussions, including tributes are not appropriate for Wikipedia and will be REMOVED. If you are looking for a place to put tributes, try the SMH's or The Australian's tribute page or RIPsteve.com. Thank You For Your Cooperation!

Archives
1 - discussions prior to death confirmation 2 - 09:49 (UTC) to 16:00 (UTC) 4th September 3 - 16:00 (UTC) to 23:59 (UTC) 4th September 4 - 00:00 (UTC) to 07:30 (UTC) 5th September 5 - 04:00 (UTC) to 14:00 (UTC) 5th September 6 - 14:00 (UTC) 5th Sept to 09:30 (UTC) 6th Sept 7 - 09:30 (UTC) 6th Sept to 13:30 (UTC) 8th Sept

Where is the coroner's report? It has been nearly a week...it seems to me like we should have an official cause of death by now...am I mistaken? Grammaticus Repairo 03:20, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Archive 7

Getting way too big, so I copied everything over to an Archive 7. You can further subdivide it from there. --Kitch 13:34, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Linking to Peter Brock

Peter Broke has died to day, and that article links to Steve Irwin. Perhaps this could link there? Two Aussie icons dying in the same week.--Hamedog_Talk|^@ 08:21, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

See the Peter Brock talk page. Consensus there developed into a removal of the reference due to it only being incidental. If there was a cause for the phenomena then it may be relevant. Ansell 08:30, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

• Yes, I have read that, but I watched atlease an hour of the Sky News report tonight and they made several references to the fact it was the second great loss in a week for Australia. Even John Howard said first we lost Steve now Peter. Should be referred to in both.--Hamedog_Talk|^@ 16:12, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

The two are unrelated in everything but their date of death. They're already in Category:2006 deaths. We don't put Hitler as a related item on Ghandi just because both were vegetarians, why would we put these two as related just based on when they died? — ceejayoz ^talk 23:11, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

How about two Aussie Icons to die in the same week?--Hamedog_Talk|^@ 02:06, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

You're missing the point. They are not related in any way except the closeness of their death dates. Related articles are linked to because it is reasonably assumed that a user looking at the current page is likely to be interested in the related article (key word, again, being related). Not many people are going to go to Steve Irwin's page and be expecting a link to a racecar driver's bio. — ceejayoz ^talk 05:03, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

• • • • Also, these news articles may interest you:[1], [2][3]. "Brock's passing has left Australia in shock, especially following the death of Steve Irwin. Two of Australia's most famous citizens, both dying suddenly doing what they loved."--Hamedog_Talk|^@ 02:16, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
      • The core point is not that the deaths were close, rather, that because of this closeness it has had a profound impact on the Australian people. The deaths are already related in peoples minds because of this. I think thats worth a mention.--EDH 08:40, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Peter Brock is related to Steve with his death because He the "second great loss in a week for Australia" But Steve doesn't because he died first 222.154.128.74 01:45, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Irwin quote on what he wanted to be remembered for

A quote by Steve Irwin on what he wanted to be remembered for was removed. I would have thought this summary statement of his whole life's goal would have merited inclusion. If others agree, can they please make the edit instead of me? I'm sure the people on this talk page have much more experience with how best to include it. Perhaps there should be a "Quotes" section? After all, the fact he was so quotable was often commented on in the media also.

Here was the quote:

In episode one of the Crocodile Hunter series ("Steve's Story"), Irwin is quoted as emphatically stating:

“ The one thing I would want to be remembered for is passion and enthusiasm. Conservation is my life, my job, my whole persona. ”

youcantryreachingme 01:38, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

PS - when removed, the edit comment was "remove tribute" - but this is not a tribute (in my opinion) - it's a summary of his life's goals in his own words.

Agreed. Here's a link to that video. Your quote was slightly wrong, but thats ok. Just fix it and add the video link as a citation. By the way, i think the "If we can get people to care about wildlife" quote is probably better.dposse 02:22, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

I can't access the video - do you have the text for the corrected quote? (From memory, "The one thing that I, Steve Irwin, would want to be remembered for is passion, and enthusiasm. Conservation. It's my life, my job, my whole persona." - the quote I used I took from an online source and put the difference down to my poor memory... youcantryreachingme 01:10, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

"after his death"...

"He was described after his death by the CEO of RSPCA Queensland as a "modern-day Noah", and British naturalist David Bellamy lauded his skills as a natural historian and media performer.[16]"

Shouldn't that be down in the Reaction subsection? dposse 19:31, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Larry King transcript.

[4] This was the Larry King interview that he did with Steve after his "Baby and the Croc" incident. It has some very nice quotes and infomation in it. Can we try to work it into the article? dposse 20:01, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Anyone? dposse 02:35, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

There's already a reference to the transcript of the original 2004 show, Steve Irwin#_note-larry_king_transcript. — LazyEditor (talk|contribs) 18:25, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Unless you really want to talk about the irony for some reason, do you really feel it's in good taste to put that quote there? Sure, he said it, but there are many other quotes about his conservation policy that might get the point across better. As it is, no one will think about the the quote, they'll just be thinking, "Oh that's weird." I'm not advocating censoring it, just I think it would be better (if people think it's appropriate) to put it in the discussion of his death, and put some other conservation quote in. What do others think?

I'm sure it's unintentional, but as it is it reads as a kind of bad joke... Komdori 18:36, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Yep, the bit about getting animals into people's hearts is in poor taste, given the circumstances. Friday (talk) 18:56, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

First of all, if you are talking about this edit, please start a new section in this talkpage, as it has nothing to do with dposse's question. About the contents of the edit itself, it has absolutely nothing to do with Irwin's death. It's his opinion about the 'animals on show' issue, and I honestly think it's good material for the Environmentalism section (and not for the Death section). That quote explains a lot about his motivations for filming shows about animals, and it supports the preceding sentence (about sharing his enthusiasm for animals). — LazyEditor (talk|contribs) 19:18, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Fair enough, but having a quote from Irwin about "letting animals into your heart" is just too much, I think. I'm not saying it was intentional or anything, but I don't think it should be in there. Friday (talk) 19:22, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

I don't really care that you removed that sentence without waiting for more opinions, but are you sure you're not just influenced by the edit summary? I've re-read that paragraph a few times and still don't associate it with his death, because of all the context around it. — LazyEditor (talk|contribs) 19:47, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

I put it in this section since that's from where the quote came--feel free to break it out if you think it's more clear. There are a lot of good quotes there that could replace it without it losing much (or anything). Komdori 19:48, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

If there are other more suitable quotes, I think that would be preferable. I agree with LazyEditor that I didn't instantly associate it with his death -- but if one does, that's some bad taste right there. If there are equally memorable quotes that get the point across, I'd say, "better safe than sorry" that somebody would be unnecessarily hurt by the imagined-or-implied irony. --Jaysweet 20:14, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Media Image

Not to step on the toes of you pro Wikis but in the section entitled "Media Image" in regards to the sentence that says "His unabashed enthusiasm for dangerous animals and childlike energy sometimes made him appear simple, which drew some criticism at home." Is this statement a fact or an opinion? And if we keep it in the article I believe it would be more accurate to say that he appeared "simple minded" rather than "simple", since these are two entirely different things. 4giron 17:26, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

It was bothering me so I just went ahead and added "minded" after simple. I am sure a thesaurus has many other variations of this state of being such as dimwitted or perhaps even simpleton, but simply simple just doesn't cut it for Wikipedia 4giron 19:13, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Onion Radio News

Technically, the Onion did a parody in their Onion Podcast. It's titled "Australia's 'The Stingray Hunter' Says 'It Should Have Been Me'".I don't know if anyoue feels it's worth mentioning in the actual article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kc12286 (talk • contribs) .

No, but you can add it to the uncyclopedia article on Steve Irwin. Andjam 01:36, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Greer etc

I understand that the section should be concise, but recent condensations should show both sides of the argument (sympathetic and not sympathetic with Greer)ñ also, please read the referenced article if you´re going to condense, because the edits I´m fixing misquote and ignore the gist, meaning that the editor didn´t bother to go to the source. Pablosecca 03:56, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

I did make edits to show both sides. Instead of reverting, help by being more concise. Your edits fork the article into another topic altogether.--I already forgot 06:36, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

They dont "fork the article into another topic", they add depth to an interesting and relevant point. Are you an aussie? Aussies understand the presence of "cultural cringe" and are more often than not skeptical of types like Irwin. So it´s important to note these things from both sides. Hamilton makes several important points, which I include. PLEASE, if you´re going to condense the quotes, do us a favor and do it intelligently. For instance, you moved the quotation mark on Hamilton´s quote to include something he didn´t say. READ THE REFERENCED ARTICLE to make sure your quotes are correct, otherwise you´re just messing up the work of others.Pablosecca 17:01, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Ok, you win. It’s clear that you do not intend for anyone to change your original edit and will make any excuse to revert the change. The fact that you state "Aussies understand the presence of 'cultural cringe' and are more often than not skeptical of types like Irwin" indicates you may be editing with your pov. Wikipedia is an international collaboration and I only wish to improve the content of the article from that standpoint. The excessive use of quotes in the section (and other parts of the article) reads like a news article and not and encyclopedic entry, however, I do not wish to prove a point or niggle over the section so I will bow out of the edit dispute. --I already forgot 02:22, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

• After all the debate about Greer, someone suggested that she had previously made comments on the same subject while he was still alive. Is this true? Did he respond? If so, then it's possibly a noteworthy inclusion. If not, then it's just the ravings of someone seeking more publicity. Wahkeenah 03:58, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

´Wildlife expert´?

Yes he is a television personality but is he properly called a wildlife expert? Maybe we should be more specific. He managed a zoo, which requires a certain expertise -- the question is qhat kind of expert. Should we keep it or change it? Thanks Pablosecca 04:06, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

I looked at three news articles from the References and none of them refers to Irwin as "wildlife expert". In the Larry King interview, he refers to himself as "wildlife warrior" (accordingly, this article calls him that). He also said "My dad was a wild life expert" (no "like myself" or "as well"). I guess we should just change "wildlife expert" to "conservationist" (or maybe "wildlife conservationist"). — LazyEditor (talk|contribs) 04:37, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Irwin was raised in a reptile park, quite literally, which he and his father expanded over the course of thirty odd years to the Australian Zoo that it is today. He lived and breathed animals and conservation. Steve Irwin was the owner/director of the zoo and had more than forty years of experience handling wild animals. While he may not have had a degree from a university like more traditional scientists and "experts", he was still an expert in every sense of the word. Jeremy Bright 04:39, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

I've always seen "Naturalist" when reading things about him. Sabar 08:28, 9 September 2006 (UTC) If Irwin had finished a degree in zoology, I would still hate him but I would have to admit he does have a formal education. Irwin never even went to college {unless Wikipedia left something out} much less obtained expertise as a scientist. Irwin was one of the world's most talented stuntmen but did not have any compassion for animals. I regret Wikipedia didn't do enough to expose him for being an opportunist whoose only concern for animals was useing them as props. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Edward Saint-Ivan (talk • contribs) .

These are all great points of view. If you know of considered research from reliable sources that supports them, they'd be most welcome in the article (per wikipedia's policy on maintaining a neutral point of view). Otherwise we should all just take our grousing to another forum. --SiobhanHansa 00:30, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

I though grousing was the whole point of Talk (wink). Anyway, Thompson Gale's Biography Resource lists Irwin as "wildlife enthusiast, zookeeper, television show host", and I've put a citation in the article. Pablosecca 07:33, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

"Keep that camera rolling"

Even regarding his own death, Irwin displayed a sense of humour. He once insisted, "My number one rule is to keep that camera rolling. Even if it's shaky or slightly out of focus, I don't give a rip. Even if a big old alligator is chewing me up I want to go down and go, 'Crikey!' just before I die. That would be the ultimate for me." [23]

Unless someone can find a source for this quote that is more reliable than an online music tabloid quoting from the Daily Star, one of Britain's notoriously unreliable tabloids, this needs to go.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Unreadablecharacters (talk • contribs) 19:26, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, sounds dodgy. Especially as he was known as the Croc Hunter, not the Alligator hunter.--Hamedog_Talk|^@ 11:11, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

This quote (or at least something like it), along with the one I have mentioned below in this talk page (being remembered for passion and enthusiasm ... conservation is life, job, whole persona) - I believe comes directly from episodes of the Crocodile Hunter series. youcantryreachingme 00:58, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

can you possibly find the episode name/number? SOADLuver 03:55, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, I was reading through the links of "Where to pay tribute(or something like that) at the top of the page, and came across this at http://www.ripsteve.com/cause-of-death.html : "Steve is quoted as saying "if I die, I at least want it filmed on camera" in an interview which took place in 2003." This isn't definitive proof of such a thing being said, but I doubt that they would make it up.Casual Karma 05:18, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

"An Aussie Hero"

This phrase only googled for this article, wikipedia mirrors and a couple of irrelevant news links. I don't know why it was inserted in the reference, as far as I can tell the Channel 7 show was "Steve Irwin: A Tribute". Psychobabble 12:27, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Precedent deaths caused by stingrays

I live in Italy and I would report to you that on 6/25/2006 a 14/15 y. old italian boy, Michele Arnulfo, was dead after about 30 min. of hospitalization for internal haemorrhage for a vein's perforation caused in the sea by a wound in the abdomen probably made by a stingray (in italian: pastinaca). The autopsy found a wound deep 15 cm and a 6 mm hole in the artery and the iliac vein.

The accident happened in Italy, locality of Costa Smeralda, city of Porto Cervo - Cala di Volpe, about 150 meters offshore of the beach of Liscia Ruja (or Liscia Ruia).

Standing to the newspaper article, near to the accident his words were: "Iniziate a risalire a bordo - ho visto una cosa, la voglio prendere" (in english: "begin to come back on board ship - I saw a thing, I want to take it"). Then "Mi sono fatto male: andiamo via, andiamo via..." (in english: I got hurt: let's go away, let's go away..."). Short after he loose consciousness and never get back. He dead at 4:45 pm.

In the days after the accident the scuba divers of the italian gendarmerie (Carabinieri of the Nucleo Subacquei of Cagliari) in that piece of sea caught a stingray of 55 cm with a tail of 6 cm and saw numerous stingrays, while a bather reported to 112 (emergency telephone number) to have seen a(n animal like a) stingray 7 times bigger than that.

You can read something more here (in italian language. You can use babelfish.altavista.com to translate it):

http://www.girlpower.it/mondo/news/cronaca/notizia.php?nid=28788

http://www.hotdogline.com/news.php?idnew=5432

http://www.tgcom.mediaset.it/cronaca/articoli/articolo316106.shtml

http://it.news.yahoo.com/28062006/203/studente-morto-catturata-pastinaca-50-centimetri-printable.html

http://www.repubblica.it/2006/06/sezioni/cronaca/giallo-costa-smeralda/razza-o-punteruolo/razza-o-punteruolo.html

http://www.d1television.it/page.php?cPath=0&id_page=4&module=News&action=view&id=407

Furthermore, on 9/03/2006, about 24 hours before the death of Steve Irwin, a 35 y. old italian scuba diver, Augusto Murri, reemerged - alive but with lancinating pain - from the sea Near to Villasimius in Italy with a bleeding deep hole between the appendix and the liver, without knowing what caused it. The suspects went on a stingray.

Source (in italian)

Sorry for reformatting your comment, but horizontal scrolling utterly sucks. Professor Ninja 11:23, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Was the boy pierced through the heart by the stingray and survived? If not, i see no relevance to this article. dposse 17:46, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

No, but since the article states that "As of 1996, only seventeen worldwide fatalities had been recorded due to stingrays, [35] and the attack on Irwin is believed to be the only fatality from a stingray ever captured on film.[41]" I think that the exceptionality of these events make them relevant and interesting even if there's not total certainty that they are caused by stingrays.

Do you think that for those 17 cases there was total certainty about it?

What of the filming?

With all the speculation, hear-say, and conspiracy theories about, wouldn't the origional film be a good source to lay the foundation as to exactly how he was stung? I know for some sensitive people they're rather not see it, but a reference to a copy would be welcome to those like I looking for the events as they unfolded. This would allow those that wanted, an opportunity to know or decide for themself. If it's already mentioned in the article, is it available? Has a statement stating if it will be released been provided already? Thanks. Supaplex 05:47, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

The film is (or was) in the possession of the Queensland Police. It's likely to be destroyed at the wishes of the family. -- Longhair 05:50, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Why? Steve Irwin would have wanted footage of his death at the hands of an animal to be kept, and said he would have wanted to keep the camera rolling. It would be a great shame, for starters Mr Irwin's wishes not being met, and for an uncorrectable mistake to be made. Canberra User 06:19, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

There's no point asking anyone here why. You're better off asking those with the power to make the relevant decisions about their reasons. -- Longhair 06:22, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

This really is not on topic, and like memorial, et al, should be removed by an Admin or someone else higher up the wikipedia food chain. I would never want my comments to be removed by another editor, so I'm not going to take it upon myself to do so (unless it were inarguable vandalism or something like that).

One thing's for sure, imo, images from the video should never be displayed in a wikipedia article.

PainMan 09:52, 10 September 2006 (UTC) Could a link not be added though. Even indirectly?

Added commentary on "Baby Bob" controversy...

from statements made by Steve and Terri from the tv program "Crocodile Hunter Confessions" about the incident with their son and the crocodile.

also, rewrote intro to make it more encyclopedic.

PainMan 09:47, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Thats hardly encyclopedic, by changing the name into "Stephen Robert Steve Irwin" and removing a valid source for no reason. Why don't you go to the Tony Blair article and change the name into "Anthony Charles Lynton Tony Blair"? And why did you shorten the whole controversy part into one incident? I have reverted your edits on both the intro and the controversy. Tips - next time you make a change in a heated article like this, discuss, because most probably your edit will be worse than what hundreds of others agreed on, anyway, and even if you think you have some good ideas, discussing is always better than making big changes yourself. Aran|heru|nar 12:27, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Block

I really do think that this wiki article should be blocked altogether and Admin only allowed to edit this page. Because people are Signing in and Vandalising--82.47.145.146 13:09, 10 September 2006 (UTC)