Talk:Victoria Junior College

2008

Copy-edit

Hey all. I've been working on copy-editing wikipedia articles these few weeks, and I'll be startig a copy-edit of this one. I'll make improvements as best as I can and add the relevant tags. If you have any questions, just yell here or at my talk page :) And yes, I'm a Victorian. 02S15. Back in the days when the auditorium was not air-con-ed. Actually, it was supposed to happen in our year before the A-levels but it got postponed... But I digress. -Samy85 (talk) 03:40, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

I only managed to do a partial copy-edit... needs a lot more citations and some portions are self-contradictory, like whether VJ students cram Japanese-style. Some portions were also ridiculous, like top students applying to VJ because of the sexy uniforms! (but IF it is true, cite your source). okie that's all! will come back another time to continue! --Samy85 (talk) 04:34, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

I've changed my username from Samy85 to Samuel Tan (talk · contribs). Feel free to say hi at my talk page! -Samuel Tan (talk) 16:05, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

2005-2006

Yes, I'm a current victorian.

It is very hard to talk about the school culture since there are no websites or evidences to support this view, and no study has been done comparing the different school cultures around Singapore.

--supremebull 10:46, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Victorians, please contribute.

Yes I agree with you that the phrases lack a neutral point of view.. what is dynamic , fun and challenging? what facts are there to support this view?

eraser78;talk 12:12, May 04, 2005 (UTC)

"To the wikipedian who nominated this page to be checked for its neutrality,

Please state the reason"

Well, the entire article reads like an advertisement for the college, but these phrases in particular trouble me: "Co-curricular Activities (CCA) in VJC are dynamic, challenging and fun!", "VJC students would not shirk from cheering on for their school during competitions and school events or proclaiming with pride their attachment and love for the college. It is this spirit that constantly drives the college to greater heights and that bonds Victorians past, present and future." Someone edited some of the POV out of the School Spirit section, but it's still problematic. Also, please sign your posts with ~~~~. android↔talk 23:07, Apr 18, 2005 (UTC)

This page still needs some serious cleanup. I know next to nothing about VJC aside from what I can learn from Google, but no one else seems keen to remove the promotional/bubbly language in the article. I'm going to be bold here and attempt it myself. android↔talk 22:01, May 11, 2005 (UTC)

Alright, there's the first pass at a rewrite. I left the Courses section alone, because I can't make sense of the abbreviations and codes. A few minor points:

• Perhaps a word other than faculties ought to be used. In common American English usage, faculty refers to an institution's body of instructors, and faculties is generally used to refer to a person's mental capabilities. I'm not sure what the corresponding word would be here. Perhaps faculties is used in British English in this manner, but I'm not aware of it.
• I removed the sections that consisted solely of external links.
• I un-wikilinked the notable alumna that doesn't have an article, and removed "Joe Augustine," because I can't figure out who that refers to.
• The "Just recently" in the bit about the choir needs to be given a more specific timeframe. I also removed some verbiage later in that paragraph about "clinching gold medals" – perhaps I am missing something here, but wouldn't a first-place finish imply medals were won?
• The "top four junior colleges" bit in the intro and the list of big-name universities that "some alumni" go on to attend (which I removed) need to be sourced.

If someone who actually attends/attended the school would have a go at the Courses section to make it more readable to those unfamiliar with the Singapore education system, that would be great. android↔talk 23:33, May 11, 2005 (UTC)

Thank you for your continued interest in vjc and dedication to making wikipedia better, it is very much appreciated. -Blackrabbit

I am a former student of VJC in Singapore. Joe Augustine is a Deejay in Singapore. The word faculty is not used as an institution's body of instructors in Junior Colleges. It means the subject combinations the students are studying. For example, Science Faculty, Arts Faculty and Commerce Faculty.

--Eraser78 06:21, 16 May 2005 (UTC)

Yes, that is the correct meaning in British English. The American usage - they appear to use it to mean "all the teaching staff added together" - seems quite weird to me. Alarics (talk) 20:52, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

To android, i think the article is not really correct but i think its better to let someone who has more background knowledge on singapore / junior colleges edit the article.

--Eraser78 08:11, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Aquila 2006 champions?

This is fairly interesting, the year hasn't passed and "In 2006, Aquila was the overall champion house."? StrawHatLuffy 16:37, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

I think it's worded this way because it would be stupid to put it in the present tense (as many articles do), only having to switch it to past tense once the year is over, creating unnecessary work. As an aside, it should be flashed wildly somewhere that Aquila is pronounced ah-KWEE-la, and not as many victorians pronounce it: ah-KEE-la. —Dudboi 00:18, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

VJC 6-year programme

http://www.asiaone.com/News/Education/Story/A1Story20090327-131603.html

Referring to the above article, I am wondering why the principal of VJC has so much say in this matter. Principals come and go every few years. But the alumni will always be alumni. What is the VAC/VEC stand on this matter? Shouldn't the VAC/VEC have jurisdiction over the 2 schools? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.156.9.238 (talk) 20:23, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

SPAM

An editor with a clear Conflict of Interest is turning this article into a spam-vehicle. It would be nice when that editor come up with reliable (no social media), independent (not the schoolwebsite or related websites), prior published sources (preferrably but necessarily in English). The Banner talk 16:34, 5 December 2017 (UTC)

Clarification

That editor is trying very hard now to figure out what sort of sources constitute reliable and independent sources now, so do help her along and together we can all improve the article bit by bit! :) The old version of the article has a lot of information, but a lot of it lacks sources / sounds promotional (I swear it's not intentional). I will be relooking the currently omitted statements and searching for sources for those statements that didn't sound promotional. I've just done so for some bits, mostly in the "History" segment e.g. about Theatre Studies, French LEP, choir's win at Cardigan Eisteddfod etc. However, I'm unable to find neutral sources for some things e.g. East Zone S&T Centre. Would appreciate help in looking for sources! Skyelyrics (talk) 03:20, 25 December 2017 (UTC)

Details of Edits, 25/12

Merry Christmas y'all. Added back the achievements of VJ choir, this time with backing from the website of the competitions' organiser (Interkultur). As the world ranking is likely to change over time, rendering the information inaccurate, I referenced a cached version of the world rankings instead of the live version. Also, the url of the pdf downloadable results were used, so here are the websites from which they were retrieved:

• http://www.interkultur.com/events/world-choir-games/bremen-2004/
• http://www.interkultur.com/events/world-choir-games/xiamen-2006/#c1256
• http://www.interkultur.com/results/

Fixed some broken links and added back the trivia about David Beckham. Does anyone know if it's possible to search Straits Times archives without a subscription? I remember being able to do it with a school subscription. It would make the job much easier if its articles could be searched (for example, there's bound to be some mention of the principal succession in 2006 when Mr Chan took over, but right now, all I have is the press release).

Will be adding back the sports CCA info/achievements next, because the CCA list is too skewed to performing arts right now. Sources for those (redsports & straits times?) shouldn't be too hard to find, I hope. I copied-and-pasted quite heavily from the old versions of this article so please feel free to edit the flow of the text if it's weird now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skyelyrics (talk • contribs) 06:03, 25 December 2017 (UTC)

@Skyelyrics: For Straits Times and other newspaper archives before 1989, you can go to NewspaperSG to access them, and for those after 1989, you can access them at the Multimedia Stations at public libraries. R22-3877 (talk) 09:58, 25 December 2017 (UTC)

@R22-3877: Sorry I wasn't clear, I meant to ask if it's possible to access the archives on the straits times website itself :) I've already used the NLB newspaper archives as sources but some of those articles require viewing at Multimedia Stations, so I wasn't sure whether they could be cited at all. Personally I've decided they're okay though, by comparing it to using a published book as a source - some readers may not have access to the book, but it shouldn't be a reason to disallow it as a source? Skyelyrics (talk) 07:07, 27 December 2017 (UTC)

To the Anonymous Editor

Appreciate the anonymous Wiki user for your attempts to make the page neutral, but could you please list your edits on the Talk page as well, not just edit summaries? Especially when they are debatable edits - for example, instead of quietly removing all the CCAs save for the "Sports" and "Choir" sections, why not list your concerns here? What is wrong with the individual sections, how can they be improved?

I find some of your edits to be contentious, maybe another reader can offer his/her opinion.

You cited the reason for removal as "Removing unsourced and self published sources and promotional content on CCAs."

• Firstly, some of the sources you removed were not self-published. Victoria Chorale earning gold medals at the World Choir Games - that was referenced to Interkultur's published list of award recipients. Dance's achievements at the World Dance Olympiad was also referenced to the International Dance Organisation
• Secondly, if you find the sources to be a problem, you can just add the "citation needed" template message, or ask for better sources here. Why remove the content entirely?
• Thirdly, I agree some of the content sounds promotional. (To clarify, I was not the original author for most of it, I merely copied & pasted from old versions of the article.) Anyway, if the content sounds promotional, why not rewrite it so that it sounds more neutral? Or ask someone to rewrite it?

Also, some of your edits rendered the content inaccurate or confusing.

• VJC is not the only Singapore JC to offer Theatre Studies. ACJC & TPJC offer TSD as well. Your edit removed the qualifier "until 2005". Speaking of ACJC, you might want to look at their Wiki page, which is also full of promotional content.
• Removing of titles in the principals section - okay sure, but the section ended up with so many mentions of "Chan" with nothing to clarify whether it's Mr Chan or Mrs Chan.

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