Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sam Giles

Sam Giles

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Sam Giles (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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Delete Although the individual has published a few good academic papers, by comparison with other high profile academics in the field of palaeontology listed on Wikipedia (for example, Jenny Clack, Mark Norell or Michael Benton), her contribution is very minor and does not pass the WP:SCI. I feel that maybe in the future this individual should be considered for a wiki page, but at present I cannot see any reason for it being retained. The research section also boasts of more of self promotion and several of the sources are directly linked to academic studies, rather than actual newsworthy science. None of the sources show indicate that this person is clearly notable. My suggestion is for the page to be considered for deletion. I am new to editing Wiki, but am a semi-retired paleontologist and have noticed a bunch of wikipedia paleontologist pages that I feel do not warrant their own page, by comparison with such individuals mentioned above and therefore intend to do a bit of a clean up and contribute where I can. User:Xioa72 (talk) 12:29, 21 December 2018 (CET)

• Keep I would firstly note that WP:SCI is not Wikipedia policy, but a failed proposal, so it can't be used to assess articles. The relevant guideline is WP:NACADEMIC, which has 9 points, the first of which is "The person's research has had a significant impact in their scholarly discipline, broadly construed, as demonstrated by independent reliable sources." Those sources do not need to be scholarly, but WP:INDEPENDENT and WP:RELIABLE. There are a lot of non-independent sources included in this article (her own papers, and sources from or by universities she is or has been affiliated with). However, there are several which are both independent and reliable, eg [1], [2], and (not in the article) [3], [4], [5], and which do indicate (to a non-paleontologist) that her research has had a significant impact on the field. The subject of this article may not be as notable as the others you referred to, but, if she meets the Wikipedia criteria for notability, that is not a reason for this article to be deleted. (I would have to say that these sources are not "the most typical way of satisfying Criterion 1", and other editors may not agree that she meets any criterion of WP:NACADEMIC, or even WP:GNG.) RebeccaGreen (talk) 13:12, 21 December 2018 (UTC)
• Thanks for your reply, that's much appreciated. Yes, you make some good points. However, I was unaware of the pages you mention - I'm new to Wikipedia editing (sorry), but looking at those pages, and specifically what is required for individuals of notability, this reiterates my previous statement that this individuals contribution to her field does not meet the Wikipedia criteria for notability sensu WP:NACADEMIC and WP:GNG. Compare with those mentioned previously, or other palaeontologists who have made major, significant contributions in this field such as Darren Naish, David B. Norman, or even Robert T. Bakker. I don't see any evidence that this individual is deserved of their own Wikipedia page. There are 100's of palaeontologists who have contributed equal to or much more to the science, who don't have their own page (yet). User:Xioa72 (talk) 18:52, 21 December 2018 (CET)

• That's a reason for them to have articles, not, necessarily, for this person not to have one. There is a specific point about that somewhere, with a shortcut which I don't remember right now (I am fairly new to editing too). Maybe I'm thinking of Other Stuff Exists WP:OSE (or doesn't exist). And that's one reason for AfDs - other editors assess the subject's notability against relevant criteria, and a closing editor or admin assesses the arguments to keep, delete, merge, redirect, etc, and makes a decision (hopefully on consensus). Some areas have very specific agreed criteria, others don't, so the general criteria apply (and sometimes people who don't meet specific criteria do meet general ones). If you are aware of palaeontologists who have contributed a lot who don't yet have articles, if I were you, I would try to put my energy into writing articles about them, rather than arguing for deletion of existing articles. I'm not trying to say don't put articles up for deletion, some definitely don't belong in an encyclopaedia, but that in itself doesn't help expand Wikipedia's coverage of significant people / discoveries / developments in theory, etc. I hope I'm making myself clear! And hopefully other editors will weigh in too. RebeccaGreen (talk) 19:19, 21 December 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Academics and educators-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 18:37, 21 December 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 18:37, 21 December 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Science-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 18:37, 21 December 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 18:38, 21 December 2018 (UTC)

• Weak Delete - I can see 5 or so mentions in mid-quality RS, but it doesn't quite hit the mark. NickCT (talk) 19:15, 21 December 2018 (UTC)
• comment Xioa72 Welcome to Wikipedia. Whether or not other more 'deserving' people don't have articles or vice versa has zero relevance to the discussion of whether this person is notable enough. If you know of people who are notable and don't have pages, by all means create those pages! valereee (talk) 19:18, 21 December 2018 (UTC)
• comment From the UofM article: here: :"For several decades, scientists have placed polypterids down near the base of the family tree of ray-finned fish, a large group believed to have originated around 385 million years ago.

But a new study that used CT scans to probe three-dimensionally preserved fossil fish skulls shakes up the fish family tree by concluding that the emergence of polypterids occurred much later than researchers had thought. The findings also suggest that the origin of all modern ray-finned fish may have occurred tens of millions of years later than is generally believed.

The international research team was led by Sam Giles of the University of Oxford and includes University of Michigan paleontologist Matt Friedman. A paper summarizing the findings was published Aug. 30 in Nature."

I think that might show notability right there? valereee (talk) 19:28, 21 December 2018 (UTC)

• Delete - I don't see any reason for this page to be retained. One Nature paper should not warrant the erection of a Wikipedia page. Weak. Dino710 (talk) 11.18, 22 December 2018 (GMT)

• Comment Huh. Very interesting. First this article is AfD'd by a brand new account. Then the delete is supported by an apparent SPA created to defend the AfD for Dean Lomax, a paleontologist whose article was ultimately deleted. valereee (talk) 11:51, 22 December 2018 (UTC)

Oh, not created to just defend the AfD -- apparently created to create the Dean Lomax article in the first place. Edit history was lost when article was deleted, I guess? And a couple weeks ago, deleted a photo of Dean Lomax that had been used in that article. More and more interesting. valereee (talk) 12:10, 22 December 2018 (UTC)