User talk:T8612

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Hello, T8612, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few links to pages you might find helpful:

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Excellent stuff

Just received what you sent. You're a star. Haploidavey (talk) 23:16, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Brilliant Idea Barnstar
	For support, assistance and input both asked for and unasked. For quietly but consistently improving articles. For making Wikipedia more accurate. For making other editors' work a little easier. Thank you. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:46, 7 July 2018 (UTC)

Anastasius I Dicorus

Hi. I wonder if you can help. I realise that this is out of your specialist timeframe. This article has the sentence: "Four solidi from his reign have been recovered as far from the Byzantine Empire as China." Do you know if this is accurate, and if it is, what might be a RS? (Currently the paragraph has Pyatnitsky, Yuri (2006-01-01). "New Evidence for Byzantine Activity in the Caucasus During the Reign of the Emperor Anastasius I". American Journal of Numismatics (1989–). 18: 113–122. JSTOR 43580526. as a reference.) And do you know if there is an image of a solidus of Anastasius I available? Thanks. Gog the Mild (talk) 21:33, 7 July 2018 (UTC)

Hi. I don't know about this Chinese hoard, but it doesn't sound wrong (I don't have access to this JSTOR article though). Here is a solidus of Anastasius. T8612 (talk) 14:01, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

Many thanks. Gog the Mild (talk) 15:32, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

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Theory that "Numerius" was Etruscan

You've cited this to an inscription from CAH, which unfortunately is not something I can examine despite having been approved for access months ago. But I have to ask, is this what the source says, or are you inferring a possible Etruscan origin from the inscription? Normally I wouldn't nitpick about synthesis with something that sounds fairly obvious. But I can't remember a single source credibly claiming an Etruscan origin for this praenomen. As far as I know, it's only ever described as Oscan, although the fact that it occurs in Latin from the very earliest period suggests that it was at least naturalized, if not native. Latin and Oscan come from a common source, however; Etruscan is unrelated. So while it might be worth noting that it occurs in an early Etruscan inscription (as do many other Latin and Oscan names), I wouldn't suggest that it's of Etruscan origin unless the source clearly states that this is a possibility. P Aculeius (talk) 03:54, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

Drummond says that the inscription is perhaps the earliest known in Etruscan, while the article on the Oscan language says the earliest inscriptions date from the 5th century BC, so I "inferred an Etruscan origin" as you put it (I only put the reference on the first sentence as a result). Drummond cites a source for the inscription, which I haven't checked though.T8612 (talk) 11:26, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for the link. Seeing the inscription in context helps to evaluate its significance for this article. I would say that although the name occurs in a very early Etruscan inscription (it also occurs in one of the earliest Latin inscriptions), there is still no indication that it was an Etruscan name. Nearly all regular Latin praenomina occur in Etruscan inscriptions in Etruscan form, as do a number of Oscan praenomina. What is less certain is whether any Etruscan praenomina were adopted into Latin; a number of scholars have proposed Etruscan origins for certain Latin names, but the proposals are widely inconsistent, and to the best of my knowledge based largely on the occurrence of the names in Etruscan inscriptions, which at best is circular reasoning. In particular, Aulus, Publius, Spurius, and Tiberius are all alleged by different sources to be of Etruscan origin, although described as Latin by others. What we rarely see are known Etruscan names occurring in Roman families: there's a Lar(s) Herminius amongst the 5th century BC consuls, but outside of the Kings, no Arruns, no Laris, Vel, Velthur, etc. except in very rare inscriptions occurring with Roman gentilicia. Which makes it seem very improbable that Numerius was of Etruscan origin, although inscriptions of this type clearly show that it was widespread in the earliest period. P Aculeius (talk) 13:22, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

I see. So Numerius there could be a Latin (who received the vase). The inscription could therefore be the earliest mention of a Latin person (and even Italic?), as the earliest inscription in CIL you mention is dated 670-630 BC, and also features a Numerius (spelt Numasioi, CIL 1², 3, with a picture) and a Manius. Perhaps you could add these to the article? T8612 (talk) 13:55, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

Good idea, I've done that. P Aculeius (talk) 13:12, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

I didn't even know there was an article on the Praeneste fibula.T8612 (talk) 14:17, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

"What is it with Macedonia these days?"

You wrote at Talk:Cleopatra#Ptolemy "Macedonian" not "Macedonian Greek": "Jesus, what is it with Macedonia these days?" The answer is that, back in summer of this year, Greece and the Republic of Macedonia finally reached an agreement to resolve the Macedonia naming dispute that has been going on for the past twenty-seven years. In this agreement, the Republic of Macedonia said it would agree to change its name to the "Republic of North Macedonia" and, in turn, Greece agreed to withdraw its vetoes against Macedonia joining the European Union and NATO. Here is an article from The Washington Post reporting on this: [1]. On September 30 of this year, however, the Republic of Macedonia held a referendum to officially change its name to "Republic of North Macedonia." The referendum failed. Russia is alleged to have interfered in it. These allegations remain unconfirmed, but it is certain that Russia desperately does not want Macedonia to join any western government organizations because Russia still considers the Balkans part of its sphere of influence. Interfering in the referendum would also be entirely consistent with Russia's pattern of behavior. Here is an article talking about the failed referendum from TIME: [2]. In any case, it seems that the proposed name change has stoked up an insane fervor among both Greek and Macedonian nationalists alike and has led many of them to come here on Wikipedia to change articles to match their own nationalistic perspectives. --Katolophyromai (talk) 17:05, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, I know about the naming dispute, but it's a bit unreal to see people on both sides vandalising articles on 2300+ years old topics. T8612 (talk) 18:10, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Well, on the bright side, at least it shows that ancient history still really matters, at least to some people, if not necessarily for the right reasons. The great irony is that most polis-dwelling Greeks before the time of Alexander considered the Macedonians archaic and backwards and some even doubted whether they were truly Greek at all, but Greeks today have almost universally come to embrace the ancient Macedonians as not only "Greeks," but as emblems of their own heritage, a fact which, to me at least, seems to show that even the most seemingly insurmountable national differences can be overcome. It is a shame that this history is driving people apart, rather than bringing them together as it should. --Katolophyromai (talk) 18:53, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Alea

You may add that it was an error in Stephanus if you wish, but things we are told existed tend to be notable even if they never did or their existence is disputed. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 00:09, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

This is not my wish, it's what the major academic source on the subject says. We do not have to repeat mistakes of ancient sources. At least mention Hansen & Nielsen' statement on both articles. Carlossuarez46 T8612 (talk) 00:21, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

Hansen and Nielsen don't even note it's a mistake on Sephanus' part. It can also have been excluded because it didn't exist in the archaic or classical period - the timeframe addressed by their studies; rather than the Hellenistic, Roman, and Byzantine times that would have been with in Stephanus' ambit. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 00:28, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

I checked and Stephanus cites Theopompus for this Alea in Thessaly (see screenshot). When checking Theopompus, there is only a mention of Alea in Arcadia (see screenshot, from Gordon S. Shrimpton, 1991), so it is indeed a mistake from Stephanus. Theopompus also lived in the 4th century BC, so Hansen & Nielsen would have mentioned this city if it existed. @Carlossuarez46: T8612 (talk) 01:38, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

Not sure if that's original research, but put it in the article. We have articles on mistakes of ancient authors (e.g., Anticyra (Locris)) Carlossuarez46 (talk) 18:21, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

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Rise of Rome

Hello, T8612. I am a relatively new user, and I am looking to make a contribution within the scope of WikiProject History. I wanted to start with a medium-quality and medium-importance article so I wouldn't screw up anything big. One of the glaring problems with the article (besides the "non-encyclopedic writing style" that was cited when I started to work on the article) was that one of the books in the references section, Empires of Trust, was not listed in the bibliography section. If you want to help me improve the article moving forward, maybe discussion should be continued on the talk page Tplaza64 (talk) 22:54, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

This article would be quite tough to write as you need to read a vast amount of sources on the subject. If you have just started and still hesitant, perhaps you could start with an easier article on the period? Examples of articles that need improvement are Cimbrian War, Sertorian War, Liberators' civil war, etc. Otherwise, please state your plans in the :talk of Rise of Rome before starting. @Tplaza64: T8612 (talk) 17:14, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

I think that that would most likely be a good idea. I have gone ahead and retracted the project template from the page and will leave it alone until I am a more skilled editor. Tplaza64 (talk) 20:49, 24 November 2018 (UTC)

A page you started (Aulus Manlius Torquatus Atticus) has been reviewed!

Thanks for creating Aulus Manlius Torquatus Atticus.

I have just reviewed the page, as a part of our page curation process and note that:

Excellent article - very high-quality construction and referencing; interesting too! Well done.

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Britishfinance (talk) 10:23, 13 January 2019 (UTC)

Re: LR Taylor

Hi, you made a number of changes to the List of Roman consuls, based on a paper written by this author. Could you provide more bibliographical information about this paper, such as the periodical the article appeared in, & the volume & date of its publication? -- llywrch (talk) 03:53, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

@Llywrch:Hi, I don't really know how to edit the biblio template used on this page, so I didn't add the full refs. Here they are:

• Lily Ross Taylor and T. Robert S. Broughton, "The Order of the Two Consuls' Names in the Yearly Lists", Memoirs of the American Academy in Rome, 19 (1949), pp. 3-14.
• ——, "New Indications of Augustan Editing in the Capitoline Fasti", Classical Philology, Vol. 46, No. 2 (Apr., 1951), pp. 73–80.
• —— and T. Robert S. Broughton, "The Order of the Consuls' Names in Official Republican Lists", Historia: Zeitschrift für Alte Geschichte, vol. 17, part 2 (Apr., 1968), pp. 166-172. T8612 (talk) 11:01, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

RE: Annales

I just wanted to say thank you for the very thorough review of Annales. I appreciate that you really dug down in your critique, which I truly believe has made the article better.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 14:44, 11 February 2019 (UTC)

Thanks! Perhaps you could look for promoting it to FA. T8612 (talk) 15:03, 11 February 2019 (UTC)== Congratulations from the Military History Project ==

		Military history reviewers' award
		On behalf of the Military History Project, I am proud to present the The Milhist reviewing award (1 stripe) for January to March 2019 reviews. Peacemaker67 (talk) via MilHistBot (talk) 00:31, 3 April 2019 (UTC) Keep track of upcoming reviews. Just copy and paste {{WPMILHIST Review alerts}} to your user space

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Re: G.-M. Cupertino

He used at least one other name to create hoax articles: Dgarq. (And I suspect there is at least one more alias he used.) I identified about 17 articles that he created that are likely hoaxes, such as Marcus Pupienus Maximus. I have not have a chance to do a proper double-checking then nominating them for deletion before now. If anyone is interested in doing the tedious part of the work, I can share my list. -- llywrch (talk) 05:31, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

Yes, please share your list. T8612 (talk) 11:12, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

Well, I checked the current status of the names on my list & discovered I had addressed most of them. Only 8 remain, which are:

• Marcus Pupienus Maximus, father of the Emperor Pupienus. (I haven't been able to find any verification of his existence beyond the Historia Augusta)
• Appius Claudius Pulcher (triumvir monetalis)
• Lucius Clodius Tineius Pupienus Bassus
• Dexter (Consul 263) -- the details on this person are dubious
• Eparchius Philagrius, bishop of Cyrpus
• Quintus Flavius Egnatius Placidus Severus
• Philagrius (prefect of Egypt) -- the details beyond his tenure in Egypt are dubious
• Rufius Viventius Gallus

Good luck with them. I honestly hope all of them prove to be real people. -- llywrch (talk) 20:43, 7 April 2019 (UTC)

@Llywrch: Thanks. Appius Claudius Pulcher (triumvir monetalis) is a real person, although I would delete the article as he was not notable enough.

The real question here is whether Christian Settipani's book is a reliable source. Andrew Dalby seemed to doubt it. I haven't been able to read it, so I cannot say. T8612 (talk) 20:54, 7 April 2019 (UTC)

My views on Settipani are somewhat conflicted. At first, due to G.-M. Cupertino's misuse of his primary monograph, I shared Dalby's opinion about Settipani: his work was a collection of fabrications & sloppy research & entirely unreliable. However, as I continued my research I found him referred to in the academic secondary with a certain degree of respect -- albeit I have yet to encounter one academic who agrees with his conclusions. (He tends to accept possible genealogical connections than most experts.) I also found an errata he wrote on the Web, & in that work he came across as sober & intelligent. So Settipani may express a notable alternative POV, if not actually be reliable. (But I'd perform much more research before I'd actually accept him as reliable as, say, Ronald Syme.)

My own opinion is that wherever he is cited with a page number -- which occurs maybe half a dozen times -- what we have is Settipani's own opinion & may be reliable. But when he is cited simply by his book, no page(s) provided -- which is the case in the vast majority of cases -- it is very likely one of G.-M. Cupertino's fabrications/hoaxes. Nevertheless, that person may actually have existed, & Cupertino simply invented some, most or all of the details about the personage, so it's still worth the time to check the material rather than delete the article. -- llywrch (talk) 05:12, 8 April 2019 (UTC)

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Re: Picture request

Hi, atm I can't do anything because I'm studying for exams at school and I'm not that active on Wiki... you can try asking on Project:Rome on the italian Wiki, it's the first place I thought of, haven't been active in quite a while, sorry for that :^( --Claudio Dario Il Bar 16:27, 5 June 2019 (UTC)