Talk:Aiden

They are not EMO! Remove it from the genre!

Please consider that allmusic (generally the turn-to page for music on wikipedia) lists emo as one of the band's styles here, and the only editors in objection are anonymous single-purpose editors unhappy with the genre. We've debated in length in the past over the band's genre, and finally just cited a credible source that says "Aiden is this". Until a credible source is cited that says explicitly "Aiden is not emo," the genre will remain on the article. --EndlessVince 17:52, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

HORROR ROCK NOT SCREAMO/EMOCORE

The band themselves call themselves a horror rock band because they are heavily influenced by The Misfits, and their songs that are not Horror oriented are punk anthems. Plus, They do not suck, they know how to play, they are signed to a record label, and those who say they suck are jealous. Once again, THEY ARE HORROR ROCK. Alternative Press also acknowledges them as a Horror Rock band. There is a big reason too why they named themselves after the young boy from THE RING. 198.189.164.206 20:41, 3 May 2006 (UTC)CRC

Thank you for your suggestion! When you feel an article needs improvement, please feel free to make whatever changes you feel are needed. Wikipedia is a wiki, so anyone can edit any article by simply following the Edit this page link at the top. You don't even need to log in! (Although there are some reasons why you might like to...) The Wikipedia community encourages you to be bold. Don't worry too much about making honest mistakes—they're likely to be found and corrected quickly. If you're not sure how editing works, check out how to edit a page, or use the sandbox to try out your editing skills. New contributors are always welcome. Stifle (talk) 13:31, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Is there any reason why someone has a problem with Aiden calling their music Horror Rock? Sounds like someone's just being annoying and not a person knowledgeable of the band cause if they were they'd know that Aiden call their music Horror Rock. So please stop editing it.

A band cannot define their genre, they are biased. The concensus of the majority of people define genre. Gopherbassist 03:27, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

POV and Durogatory

"pop punk attitudes with mall goth aesthetics" is someones POV and very durogatory. What would you think today if The Misfits were to be a new band TODAY? Would you call them MALL GOTH? I think this is wrong and needs serious editing. This band is trying to show a stage presence of Horror Rock. Much like as if TSOL were to walk out on stage in Skeleton Coveralls (WHICH THEY DO!). 198.189.164.206 20:49, 3 May 2006 (UTC)CRC

Mall goth/kindergoth asethetics seems like an acurate descrpition, the members of the band fit the cliche of what is described as "mall goth".

To compare a pop punk band to the Misfits and TSOL is a little silly. The group's music has nothing in common with other Horror Punk bands. - Deathrocker 11:38, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

originallity

Regardless of how similar their sound is to any other band, they are still one of the best live shows I have seen. I rank them right up there with M.S.I., Dope, Korn, and the countless other great shows I have seen. (Those just happen to be the three I think most other people recognize as being good live acts) They have many unique things they do, swinging the mic around is nothing new but you dont see it all to often and the lead singer seems to have mastered it. They are also one of the few bands that I have seen where they weren't afraid to interact with the crowd, the lead singer crawled out onto the crowd and held the mic for crowd members to sing. (I have seen the Deftones do this as well) They had lots of control over the crowd as well, starting a circle pit and having it reverse directions and at one point have the crowd seperate into two halves and charge each other. They finished the show up with having the crowd buddy up with their friends and sing, something the lead singer said was a tradition at their shows. If anyone truely believes that they are copycat band and have no orginality in them, well maybe you should drop by a show and see from the other sides point of view.

~Joe

i dont think that Wil sounds anything like Davey Havok, i personally think that davey can sing a lot better. But i dont totally like hate Aiden. I do think that Aiden is trying to be too much like mor popular bands, MCR,AFI, ect... They r a good band though, like their songs are really good lyrically. their image though kinda reminds me of Good Charolett. but yeah they r a good band they just are lacking originallity. i think that if they try less to be like other bands they would be a lot better off.

i think adien has there own style and maybe he has a few role modles like davey and thinks he is cool so you all need to lay off and stop with the 2 year old critisism and just SHUT UP for once and really look at there music maybe you don't like them for there music but you don't know who they are and don't wast you time writing crap that nobody cares about and there not mall goth do see them in big ugly pants the sise of your fat mom so once agien just SHUT UP and stay of this site!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

• kalie frisky*

Facts

The fact is that punk (in any form) has been mainstream since the 80's. It's not a debate. There is no such thing as underground. There is no such thing as originality. Aiden is a band who has played shows, and made albums. Those are the facts, and that's all wikipedia is for. Your judgment is not important. Influencing the reader's opinion is not the point. It is not a review. It's a wikipedia entry. --Zach Hammond 22:52, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

• calm down dear, its only a wiki*

• A pretty poor one, honestly all this article needs to say is that they're a band from yada yada, that plays so and so music, has put out so and so albums, has toured with yada yada. Almost everything else doesn't belong here. that's all I'm saying. But on the other hand, I don't care about this band, so I don't care about the article.--Zach Hammond 21:31, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

MUSTARD

Okay so, I think I cleared up the NPOV issue. As far as the Trivia goes, I'd feel comfortable deleting all of it, and down the road adding the relevant pieces to an article on Die Romantic, or music videos, or something. Discussion? --EndlessVince 21:43, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Debate

Please stop the "Horror Rock" edit war. Okay, so the band may or may not be horror rock. Without actually investigating and offering my thoughts on Aiden's being Horror Rock or not, I'll give my two cents. The Beatles could have said they were gangsta rap, but that wouldn't make them gangsta rap. The band can say whatever it wants, but if the music doesn't fit the wikipedia definition of the genre, then the band shouldn't be stated as such. Or maybe we could be a little more neutral, and say that the band labels themselves as horror Rock, but actually yada yada yada. Whatever. Just quit it.--EndlessVince 04:50, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

I have been the 1 putting that Aiden are Horror Rock. Why? Go on Aiden's official website, Aiden.org. It states that the band call their music Horror Rock. So why is it being deleted when it is a fact? Regardless of whether or not someone thinks it's Horror Rock or not the fact is the band calls their music Horror Rock and that's a fact.

It matters less what Aiden says their music is, and more whether or not the wikipedia definition of Horror Rock applies. If it does, grand. Does it?

Also, Please stop changing it until this is resolved. Thank you. --EndlessVince 16:26, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

Ok so maybe you have a case for the genre thing...but Aiden calling themselves Horror Rock is true so it should not be deleted, regardless or whether you think they're wrong or not.

I think the current revision is a fair compromise, as long as the phrase Horror Rock doesn't link to the the wikipedia article on Horror Rock. It appears the band's definition of the genre strays far enough away, that Aiden's article shouldn't refer to the article on Horror Rock. --EndlessVince 01:47, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

I don't care if they call themselves Bubblegum Black Metal.. doesn't mean they play that style of music or that its even worth a mention. The bands most common shared influenced are that of MCR, A7X and Atreyu, the music they create is similar to those, NOT the description of horror rock.

Just because one of the members bought some Nu-Mi$fits merchandise from Hot Topic doesn't mean the band have anything in common with them musically. Have you heard their music? Seen their videos? Not horror rock at all. - Deathrocker 05:38, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

While I agree that the band's music isn't Horror Rock, it's of encyclopedic value to note that the band calls themselves horror rock, although their interpretation of the genre does not correspond with the most accepted definitions of horror rock. Everything in italics could actually be used in the article verbatim and satisfy all parties in a neutral fashion. --EndlessVince 20:58, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Aiden's music is very unique and although you can say it sounds like A7X...A7X are metal and Aiden is punk without a doubt. Atreyu use a lot of just straight-up screaming in their music whilst Aiden's is more melodic and is mostly singing. Can we at least have that the band call their music horror rock? I mean as far as I'm concerned, Aiden don't sound like Green Day or Blink-182, 2 of the most famous pop-punk bands so why are they allowed to be listed as pop-punk?

There is nothing unique about this band or their music at all, they are very much part of the 10 a penny nu-emo trend, with From First To Last, My Chemical Romance, etc. Read the article on punk rock, this band is very, very far from that style of music. They are also very far from the likes of the Misfits, Calabrese and Balzac, they are most certainly not a part of the horror punk or horror rock movement. It just seems like an attempt by the band and fans to suddenly try and distance themselves from this "21st century emo" tag, as it is on its way out.

It says alot that the band's common influences are Atreyu, A7X, and MCR. - Deathrocker 09:24, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

To clear things up on my position, I don't care about this band at all. In fact, all the dispute surrounded by this band has made me hate them. I don't have any interest in ever listening to them. I got involved with the article, however, because I care about Pacific Northwest bands in general. The first thing I did to this page was to categorize it as a Washington musical group, but now I'm just trying to make it into an acceptable wikipedia article. As it stands, it is not. --EndlessVince 01:04, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

Honestly, I don't think Aiden sound like MCR or FFTL, or Taking Back Sunday or any of the other so-called 'emo' bands. Aiden are heavier, they portray a strong horror image and their music is just quite different from them basically. Anyways, I guess I'll settle for what's on the page now but they are definitely a punk band...maybe you misinterpreted what I said as meaning that they were a 70's-style punk rock band which they obviously aren't, I mean that they are definitely somewhere under the huge genre of punk, whereas A7X are heavy metal...for a punk band, Aiden are quite heavy and if you do say their influences are A7X, MCR and Atreyu, well it's obvious that they are not easy to classify. So, that is why it should be noted that they call their music horror rock instead of misleading people with Post-Hardcore, Pop-Punk or even emo, I believe someone put which is quite lame since no one seems to know what emo is anymore and just lump Aiden together with the other so-called 'emo' bands.

I think I've shown above, logically how the band do not play horror rock or have any connections to that scene at all, they are very much part of the nu-emo/pop Warped Tour movement. Regardless of the fact that Wikipedia is not an experiment in democracy the only other person who has heard their music that seems to think they fall under this classification, seems to have a lack of knowledge on genre terminology as it is, exemplified by comments such as "Aiden are punk rock". - Deathrocker 17:26, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

You can say in the article that the band's classification of horror rock is disputed. It is. But you've got to be neutral about it. What is your objection to the way that piece of the article was worded before you changed it back? As it is worded now it is POV. If that would be a more appropriate thing to get a consensus of, we can do that in a new survey.

I hope you wasn't referring to me, Deathrocker, as I did not say Aiden were punk rock...they definitely fall under the genre of punk rock though and no on can dispute that. Whether they're pop-punk, post-hardcore, they're some sort of punk band. Also, Anti-Flag and and NOFX are on the Warped Tour and you're saying that they're 'nu-emo/pop'? They are punk rock.

Anti-Flag are a hardcore band, and NOFX are skate punk... neither of which are punk rock. Also please try to sign posts with four tides, it makes it easier for people to follow who said what.

Take a look at the horror rock article, bands in that genre of music take musical influences from doo-wop and 50s/60s rock n' roll. Aiden however, take musical influence from current metalcore and post-hardcore bands, they clearly don't play the horror rock form of music. To have their genre as "horror rock" because the band have suddenly decided they want to distance themselves from bands that they play the same kind of music as ("21st century emo"), would be unencyclopediac addition and factually incorrect. It would be the equivelent of somebody trying to get the Marilyn Manson article changed to "gothic rock" regardless of the fact that his music doesn't have the characterists of that classification. - Deathrocker 19:16, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

Skate Punk...well, anyone who's Skate Punk can also be classified as Punk Rock and NOFX are a punk rock/skate punk band. Anti-Flag, hardcore? Possibly...but also punk rock as some of their stuff does not sound like other hardcore music I've heard. Aiden are not emo...c'mon, they are slightly emotional hardcore punk, to use its full name (so as to distance itself from so-called 'nu-emo' like Taking Back Sunday or whatever). Aiden's music is really hard to classify but that doesn't automatically make it nu-emo...the Warped Tour has punk rock bands on...Hardcore falls under the genre of Punk Rock, Pop-Punk falls under the genre of Punk Rock, Emo falls under the genre of Punk Rock, Horror Rock/Punk falls under the genre of Punk Rock. Aiden are not emo cause they're on there...you can call 'em Horror Rock, Emocore, Pop-Punk, Post-Hardcore because they take bits and bobs from each of those styles but c'mon...nu-emo? Give me a break, Aiden are nothing like them...going back to that thing about being influenced by A7X...A7X are metal so that pretty much proves that Aiden shouldn't be just lumped together with the other '21st century emo' bands...

pop-punk

can someone explain to me why this band was genrefied as "pop-punk"?

Yeah, how did pop-punk come up? That's just weird... -Shinobi101

they're definetely not pop punk i'd put them in more of the emorock or gothrock category they are not at all pop and not at all punk

i'd say they're emo. they have all of the characteristics of it...

Citations

I've added citations to back up claims made on the article. I've also deleted claims for which I couldn't find any references (and I don't foresee a citation). For example, there was a claim that they were signed to Victory Records because of their association with Silverstein. I found nothing anywhere to back this up, although I did find this: 2004 was a very busy and exciting year for Aiden. They managed to play over a hundred shows, put out their debut full length, make two music videos, and catch the attention of Victory Records. The article's claim that "Die Romantic" promotes bulimia and suicide found very few results on google, and most of those were on message boards. Also, the claim about Francis's broken finger can only be found on blogs. While it may be true, a reference is required. If you find one, replace the removed claim.--EndlessVince 04:50, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Mallgoth

The article on Mallgoth has been deleted. It now redirects to Mansonite. There's no reference anywhere for Aiden being mansonites. A google search for mallcore Aiden finds no references of any value. Most of what google finds reads something like "fuck their hot topic mallcore goth bullshit," which has no place. Moreover, the wikipedia article on mallcore does not cite its references and is poorly written. For now, I'm deleting the mallcore/mallgoth claim. Before changing it back, please discuss it here. --EndlessVince 19:32, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Mallgoth/mallcore "culture" and Mansonite culture are somewhat related; if it was meant as just Mansonite instead of mallcore/mallgoth then it would have said that, but that isn't what the detractors of the band have stated. As a fan of course you'd like to cover up one of the main criticisms of the band, but please understand this isn't a fan profile, its an encyclopedia and in the context of the criticism section (as well as NPOV) it is in the correct place.

First, I need to restate that I've never listened to the band, nor will I ever be a fan. But this article isn't going anywhere and it's needed some work since I stumbled on to it while cleaning up Washington music articles. I understand what mallgoth/mallcore/mansonite "culture" is. I'm not covering up the main criticism of the band. The criticism in the article is only NPOV and appropriate if it's cited, which I tried to do but couldn't find any places to cite that support your claim of detractors' criticism. The articles on all three said criticisms are very poor articles to mention in the article anyway. Please cite a credible source that says Aiden is mallcore, and I'll let the issue rest. I'm also posting this on Deathrocker's talk page to request a reply (as he, in my experience, tends to be somewhat noncommunicative).--EndlessVince 20:14, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Biggest Songs

A list of top songs is very welcome, if it's cited and verifiable by referencing lists such as a Billboard Top 100 list. Also, "Fan Favorite" mentions can get dangerous, as eventually all their songs might be listed as favorites. It's best to stick to the facts by citing a source. --EndlessVince 04:50, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Picture

In order to improve this article, we definitely need a picture. Can anyone find a decent picture of Aiden? DeeJayJayJay 20:52, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Drew likes balls?

whoever wrote "DREW LIKES BALLS", please dont do it anymore. thats what your userpage is for. --Buf Sabres Fan 02:16, 22 November 2006 (UTC)