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How to Handle vandalism ?

A long term inactive user who has been already warned against vandalism by an administrator such asthis one has gone inactive has become active again and has vandalised the page seeman by making large content removal which has sufficient souce such as this one and this one without mentioning any reason. It is seems he is ideological adherent to NTK party run by seeman and is making this kind of POV pushing which can be inferred from his edit such as this one.In light of this how to approach this incidence? JagatRaxak (talk) 12:18, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi JagatRaxak, good catch there! Normally it should be pretty easy to revert vandalism, although idk if it is available on mobile. At least on desktop, there is an "undo" button you can click when checking the article's history, which will revert the edit in question. This didn't work here though because of conflicting newer edits, so I manually pasted the removed text and added it back in.

A few notes though: Obviously, please first make sure that it is actual vandalism you are seeing. Sometimes, people edit in good faith, but in a way that their edits look like vandalism. Thus, completely undoing edits may sometimes not be optimal. Also, for articles about living persons extra care is needed, because controversial material might have been removed because it is slanderous. But you are right, in this case it was definitely a (politically motivated?) act of vandalism as the claims were sourced, and the sources seem trustworthy.

And lastly, please note that new questions should go to the bottom of the Teahouse page, otherwise they might be overlooked! Best just use the button provided at the top of the page, that handles that automatically ;)

--LordPeterII (talk) 19:38, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

How to make new questions to the bottom? it got automatically into top bcoz I dont know how to put it bottom.JagatRaxak (talk) 06:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

JagatRaxak, click either the big blue 'Ask a question' button or the 'New section' button. They will automatically start at the bottom. Giraffer (munch) 06:25, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Shubham Rathi

Original post in Hindi

बचपन से ही पिताजी ने अनुशासन और देशभक्ति की प्रेरणा दी तथा जिसके फलस्वरूप बचपन से ही देश के लिए कुछ करने का जुनून था और देशभक्ति की भावना थी। स्कूल के समय से ही कुछ देशभक्त व समाजसेवी राजनीतिक नेताओ के चरित्र का प्रभाव पड़ा जिसके फलस्वरूप कक्षा 10 से ही एक छात्र संघठन में जुड़ कर छात्र हित के लिए अपने युवा जोश के साथ कार्य किए। वर्ष 2010 में इंटर करने के पश्चात मुरादाबाद मंडल में सरकारी यूनिवर्सिटी बनवाने की मांग उठाई और वर्ष 2012 में हिन्दू कॉलेज में ग्रेजुएशन में एडमिशन लिया और यही से अपनी छात्र राजनीति की शुरआत करी। लगभग 6 साल एक छात्र संघठन से जुड़ा रहा और बहुत से आंदोलन छात्र हित,राष्ट्र हित व किसानों के लिए किए। मैंने 2015 में अपनी ग्रेजुएशन उत्तीर्ण की तथा 2017 में अपनी पोस्ट ग्रेजुएशन पूरी की और 2018 में लॉ (LLB) में एडमिशन लिया जिसमें कि वर्तमान में अध्ययनरत हूं। वर्ष 2017 में युवा छात्र - छात्राओं की आवाज़ को बुलंद करने के लिए एक छात्र संगठन उत्तर प्रदेश स्टूडेंट्स यूनियन का गठन किया जिसका उद्देश्य छात्रों की समस्याओं को सुलझाना , मुरादाबाद मंडल में सरकारी यूनिवर्सिटी व सरकारी मेडिकल कॉलेज बनवाना और गरीब छात्र - छात्राओं के लिए हॉस्टल बनवाना तथा पूरे उत्तर प्रदेश में युवाओं को आवाज़ को बुलंद करना है। वर्ष 2018 में संगठन का रजिस्ट्रेशन कराया और सर्वसम्मति के साथ संगठन कि बैठक में मुझे उत्तर प्रदेश स्टूडेंट्स यूनियन का प्रदेश अध्यक्ष बनाया गया। हमारा छात्र संगठन उत्तर प्रदेश के विभिन्न जिलों में कार्यरत है तथा युवाओं की आवाज़ को बुलंद कर रहा है। मैंने अब तक अनेकों आंदोलनों में हिस्सा लिया जो कि आतंकवाद के विरूद्ध आंदोलन थे,चाहे वो किसानों के हक की लड़ाई हो या और कोई सामाजिक मुद्दे हों। अनेकों किसान आंदोलनों तथा बहुत से राष्ट्र हित व युवाओं के लिए आंदोलनों को आयोजित किया और आगे भी करता रहूंगा।

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Raghavvishnoi10 (talk • contribs) 06:18, 23 August 2020 (UTC) ‎

Hi there. Your words are Hindi, so my device cannot render it. If you want to talk something about the Hindi Wikipedia, talk it there, not here. By the way for other editors, using Google Translate, this is what it says:

Google translation of original post

From childhood, Dad inspired discipline and patriotism and as a result, from childhood, he had a passion to do something for the country and a sense of patriotism. From the time of school, the character of some patriotic and social political leaders was affected due to which a student from class 10 joined the organization and worked with his youthful zeal for student interest. After intermission in the year 2010, he raised the demand to build a government university in Moradabad division and in 2012 he got admission in Hindu college for graduation and started his student politics from there. For about 6 years, he was associated with a student organization and made many movements for student interest, national interest and farmers. I passed my graduation in 2015 and completed my post graduation in 2017 and took admission in Law (LLB) in 2018 which I am currently studying. In the year 2017, to raise the voice of young students, a student organization, Uttar Pradesh Students Union was formed which aims to solve the problems of the students, to build government universities and government medical colleges in Moradabad division and hostels for poor students. Youths have to be raised in the entire state of Uttar Pradesh. In the year 2018, I got the organization registered and I was made the state president of the Uttar Pradesh Students Union in a meeting of the organization with consensus. Our student organization is working in various districts of Uttar Pradesh and is raising the voice of the youth. I have participated in many movements till now, which were movements against terrorism, whether it is the fight for the rights of farmers or any other social issue. Organized many farmer movements and movements for many national interests and youth and will continue to do so.

What are you trying to say, friend? GeraldWL ✉ 06:24, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Update: I went to the photo's description's website, and the "About" page is literally the whole Hindi text, see http://www.shubhamrathi.in/about. Can you clarify your intention here, Raghavvishnoi10? This is only meant for questions regarding the English Wikipedia, not a marketing place. GeraldWL ✉ 06:30, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

(Biographical content deleted) This is a help forum. What is your question? Nick Moyes (talk) 08:36, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

He's asking us to make an article about Shubam Rathi, I'm an Indian so I understand what he's saying. The whole text is actually Shubam Rathi's biography. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Powering everyone (talk • contribs) 15:12, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

If a blocked account was unblocked, can it's block evasions will also be unblocked?

Hello! I'm asking you for a question. If a blocked account was unblocked, can it's block evasions also be unblocked?OrangeCD-ROM (talk) 06:52, 23 August 2020 (UTC) OrangeCD-ROM (talk) 06:52, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

No, I don't think that is done. Assuming that you're talking about an account that was blocked for some reason and then the person engage in Sock puppetry to try and evade their original block, then the blocked sock puppet accounts are almost always going to be indefinitely blocked. The primary account (i.e. the master account) may be unblocked per WP:UNBLOCK, but the other accounts pretty much never are. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:01, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

User:OrangeCD-ROM - No, as Marchjuly said, but evading the block via sockpuppets also makes it less likely that the master account will be unblocked. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:29, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

• Note. User now blocked. GMG^talk 17:38, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

My user page

Hi, are the userboxes on my user page formatted correctly? I'm having trouble figuring this out. Am I supposed to put the word "Template" in the code? 314WPlay (talk) 09:37, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

314WPlay, all good. GeraldWL ✉ 09:39, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: So the source code is fine? OK thanks. I'm very cautious about editing despite the 'be bold' thing because I've seen loads of edit disputes and arguments, and there are also so many rules, policies, guidelines, and other stuff that I don't make a substantive edit (I wish I could though!). 314WPlay (talk) 09:43, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

314WPlay, you have the potential for being a great editor from your personalities. Welcome! GeraldWL ✉ 09:50, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: Thank you! 314WPlay (talk) 10:04, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

314WPlay WP is like life...if you are friendly, polite and respectful of others, things should work out just fine. If you make a mistake, it can be reversed. Plenty of people have pointed out my mistakes, over the years...and I said thank you, I'm sorry, etc., just like in RL. I learned from it, and often made a wiki friend in the process. The problem, esp. for a new editor (or even an older one) is being stubborn, and unwilling to see the other person's side. Mistakes are expected and forgiven. Being an arsehole, not so much. You seem like the good sort! The talkpage of an article is the best place to work well with others if disagreements arise. So, go forth, make some edits! Gerald Waldo Luis and I believe in you. For example, the two of us, together, received some "corrective advice" recently, followed it, and emerged unscathed. :-) Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 10:14, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Tribe of Tiger Thank you, this is very reassuring. Yes it is like that in a way for those of us who have a life. I'm nervous about making a mistake (more of a personality thing) but I can admit them when they happen and I will go beyond fixing typos - if I don't, there wasn't much point creating an account was there. Can I ask another question here; when do I need to use the Reply to template or link a user's page if I want them to get notified and see it? Other editors haven't always, and yet I still see it. So why does it exist then? 314WPlay (talk) 19:54, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@314WPlay: You've got brownie points here for correctly signing, indenting, and pinging too . —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 22:54, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@314WPlay: Sorry, I don't understand your question per "Reply to template" etc. Perhaps User:AlanM1's compliment helps as a confirmation? Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 23:03, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@314WPlay: I didn't see the question. Use {{Re}} or {{U}} on any discussion page (talk pages or some pages starting with "Wikipedia:" that are used for discussion, like this one) to send notification to someone with a link to that section. You don't need to use it when posting on a user's own talk page because they will receive notification anyway. If someone doesn't respond, they may have notifications turned off, or maybe they haven't seen it, or maybe have nothing to say. People don't use the template if they don't want to bother someone with a trivial response, if they expect the person will see it anyway, they know the person has notifications disabled, or maybe they just forget . —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 00:09, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Tribe of Tiger and AlanM1: Sorry, I didn't phrase it very well. It's a trivial point. Just wanted to know if pinging a user is always necessary in order for them to see your message. I think it's clear now, having read the talk page guidelines and template help as well. What if someone asks a question on an article's talk page - if you reply but don't ping them with reply or u, will they still get an alert about your answer? 314WPlay (talk) 19:38, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

What User:AlanM1 said is true. If you don't ping them they don't get alerted. --David Biddulph (talk) 20:04, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@David Biddulph: OK I'll ping users in my replies to ensure they see it. Thanks to everyone who helped me out here. 314WPlay (talk) 15:49, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Kevin Coates

Good morning

KEVIN COATES: his current Wikipedia entry

Yesterday, Kevin Coates and myself spent all day up-dating his Wikipedia entry, with some difficulty! Eventually - after several false starts - we finally concluded our edit at around 19h00 last night.

However, devastatingly, we've just discovered that our entire new input has been "reverted" by ClueBotNG: how an earth can we get it permanently reinstated?

I'm new at this task and it seems that I should be able to revert to an earlier edit, or re-enter all the new text again, but we're concerned that it will simply be deleted again.

Kevin and I will be delighted for any assistance you might be able to provide.

Sincerely

Richard N Frost (on behalf of Kevin Coates) Richard N Frost (talk) 12:17, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello Richard N Frost and welcome to the Teahouse! Cluebot did indeed revert you, you changed the article from this [1] to this [2] and the bot is supposed to revert stuff like that. You were later reverted again by Justlettersandnumbers who left an explaination here: [3].

My advice to you, if you want to try to have some influence on the contents of that article (not impossible, but WP is a peculiar place), is to take the time to read WP:COI and WP:BLP, and then to start a discussion at Talk:Kevin Coates, suggesting what changes you would like to see, and the WP:RS that supports them. Nothing is permanently reinstated on WP. Change is one of the points of this project. Good luck. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:40, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Nothing is lost. It is all there in View history. And could be copied to your Sandbox to work on before pasting into the article. HOWEVER, given several reverts (deletions) of your attempts, you are strongly advised to start a discussion on the Talk page of the article rather than editing the article directly. And as GGS wrote, read WP:COI, as it clearly applies to you. David notMD (talk) 13:10, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Keep in mind that an article is not a CV regurgitation, and every fact must be referenced. David notMD (talk) 13:12, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Richard N Frost Yes, please see WP:MINREF, for our actual guidelines. Simple stmts that are not likely to be challenged, do not require a ref. If the info added is a quotation, or "contentious" biographical info, it needs a ref, but regular sorts of info do not. Example: "He grew up in a ranch-style house" does not need a ref. We do have to use common sense. Every fact does Not need a ref. I am not sure how contentious it is to make normal stmts about an artist's life and career. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 03:42, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Another way to look at it, Richard N Frost, is to realise that, as an encyclopaedia, Wikipedia is basically not interested in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves: it is only interested in what people wholly unconnected with the subject, and not prompted or fed information by the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If there is such independent published material, then the article should be almost entirely based on it; if there isn't, then the subject does not meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability, and no article on them is possible. --ColinFine (talk) 14:43, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Richard N Frost, well done for coming here for advice; I'd meant to leave you an invitation, but see that in the event I didn't do so – sorry about that! I concur with all the advice that others have given you (my thanks to those who gave it!). For the record, I reverted your additions twice; the edit summary I left the second time was "Again remove swathes of unsourced and WP:PROMOTIONal stuff – WP:neutrality is one of the five pillars of this project; if in doubt, take to talk". Please take the time to follow those blue links and read the pages they lead to, they are both helpful and important. Note to ColinFine and anyone else who cares: I'm pretty certain that Coates is fully notable by our standards, and deserves a considerably better page than we have at the moment. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 17:18, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Tribe of Tiger, however, in a WP:BLP I don't think WP:MINREF has that much weight. It's generally a bad idea to include "is married" and stuff like that without good refs. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:58, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gråbergs Gråa Sång: I suspect I may be a bit bothered on this topic, just now, sorry. I recently had to fend off several notes at Chemancheri Kunhiraman Nair. For one section, I had rewritten the last portion of a properly sourced paragraph, only to see it removed entirely, and the remainder of the info tagged as . I am absolutely puzzled as to why this statement, regarding a person born in 1916, in India, was removed as a "peacock issue".

"His mother died when he was only three years old, and then, at the age of thirteen, he lost his father. He had an early interest in the performances presented by visiting drama troupes, and at the age of fifteen, left his home to begin training at a Kathikali centre, some 25 km away."

The note, left in regards to the remaining text, pertained to the subject's place of birth. The entire original section, prior to the "selective removal" was sourced. I know this because I read the actual source. In reaction to the above, and other notes, I have sourced *Each* stmt, and suspect that the article has now ventured into WP:OVERCITE territory.

In regards to your notes regarding "is married", I must agree that this qualifies as a contentious issue, just don't tell my spouse that I said so! Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 03:20, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Translations

Hello! I want to thank you for the invite! I was a Wikipedia several years ago before the "Drafting process" had been implemented. My interests have grown since as well. I shave studied Portuguese for a year and a half now and enjoy the language so much that I will be pursuing college in Brazil once I get married and receive my citizenship. I went to Wikipedia while writing an article about Wiktionary accuracy for a magazine I work for. I found an article while perusing Portuguese Wikipedia called Ann Syrdal which had no equivalent on English Wikipedia yet. I decided to translate the article for fun and try to publish it to EN before realizing that there was a whole new and unfamiliar system of editing and publishing. It would get published anyway with the help of my translation but I wonder about a couple things:

1. When did the drafting process come into effect? I couldn't find any specific timeline. Although it was a little inconvenient since I had yet to understand it, I feel like it is a particularly good checks-and-balance system.

2. Where do I find lists of drafts? When I searched Ann Syrdal, I could not find my own draft but could only go there when I typed Draft:Ann Syrdal directly.

3. What issues do editors face when translating articles into English? Do different language Wikis have different policies? What should I be weary about when translation articles so as to not produce an unusable version for the main site?

4. The final copy of Ann Syrdal is missing a New York Times source and had some irrelevant information removed but other irrelevant information (such as parent names) kept. I tried to keep it as concise as possible. Was I wrong in keeping The New York Times source in the translation as per WP:OR?

5. I wish to continue doing this because of the amount of fun and good practice it is. Is there a way to see Portuguese Wikipedia articles that do not have English translations yet? Is there a masterlist? MichaelIsAlwaysreal (talk) 18:09, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@MichaelIsAlwaysreal: welcome back. I can't answer all your questions, but for translations into english see WP:TRANSLATE and for translations out of english see WP:TRANSLATEUS. Each Wikipedia has its own rules and guidelines for what is needed for an article. What may be acceptable in the Portuguese Wikipedia may not be acceptable here and vice-versa. RudolfRed (talk) 18:38, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Hello, MichaelIsAlwaysreal and welcome to the Teahouse, and back to Wikipedia.

I will try to answer several of your questions by number below, bypassing the ones where I have too little experience or knowledge.

1. The draft namespace was created following the success of the proposal Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)/Archive 107#Proposed new Draft namespace in late 2013. But the Articles for creation process existed for several years prior to that, using the Wikipedia talk namespace, in a rather awkward way. It was originally devised to permit IP editors to create drafts for articles even though they could no longer (after the Sigenthaler incident) create pages directly in the main article space. It was soon expanded to attempt to help inexperienced editors with creating articles. It has never been, and is not now, required. (Also, the previous use of userspace drafts was not so very different from the use of draft space.) Any autoconfirmed user may if s/he so chooses, create an article directly in the mainspace. However, I do not advise it. Indeed although i have been active here for over 15 years, I always start new articles in draft space (although I do not use AfC reviews) because I cannot create even a minimally acceptable artifice in a single edit, and it is my opinion that few editors can do so.

2. I don't know of any single master list of drafts, and if there were one, it would almost surely be too long to be very useful. Special:Search will find drafts provide that the draft name space is one of those listed in the "search in" pull-down. By default it is not listed. Also, if you start to create a new article, and there is a draft with the exact same name, a notice pops up informing the editor and offering the chance to work on the draft instead. That is, if Draft:Example exists, a notice will be shown if a user tries to create Example.

3. Different language versions of Wikipedia often ahve very different policies and customs, particularly in regard to sourcing and notability. An acceptable article on one Wikipedia may not be acceptable on another. I can't really speak to what other problems are faced by translators.

4. If a sources is relevant to the article I don't see how including it could ever be WP:OR. I am not sure I fully understand this question.

5. I don't know of any such master list, but someone else might.

I hope all that is a bit helpful. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 18:50, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@LordPeterII:, here is an editor who speaks Portuguese, if you are interested. I think you were looking for casual translators? Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 23:17, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Tribe of Tiger: Indeed I was! Thanks for pinging me, and although atm I have no urgent need for a Portuguese translation, you never know what tomorrow might bring!

@MichaelIsAlwaysreal: I'm afraid this is slightly off topic, but if you are eager to work on translations would you consider adding your name at the translators available page? That way, other users (like me, potentially, in the future) could contact you if they need help with some translation (e.g. of a source only available in Portuguese).

Back on topic: About your question 5 - there somewhat is, but not about completely missing, just about incomplete articles: W:Category:Articles_needing_translation_from_Portuguese_Wikipedia There's a whopping 1188 articles (at the time of this writing) that could be expanded from Portuguese there, so that's likely enough for a lifetime ^^ If you are looking for entirely missing articles, I think your best bet would be to do a Wikidata query, but you would need to ask for help with that because I do not know how to formulate such a complex query. Good luck anyway, and I personally appreciate your translation efforts (I try to do the same with German articles from time to time) :) --LordPeterII (talk) 00:09, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

For a previous discussion on Ann Syrdal, see User_talk:MichaelIsAlwaysreal#Ann Syrdal and User talk:Mitch Ames#Ann Syrdal. Mitch Ames (talk) 14:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

DYK

In order to nominate an article for DYK, a. do I have to review another DYK? How do I do that? b. Where do I write the hook – where it says "hook" or where it says "ALT1"? Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 20:58, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Charlie Smith FDTB, provided the article in question complies with all WP:DYKRULES and WP:DYKSG, you can nominate it at WP:DYKNOM. For more info on the DYK process, see WP:DYK and Help:How to write the perfect "Did you know" hook. Also, what article are you thinking of nominating? Giraffer (munch) 21:42, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. I was thinking of nominating Moshe Rosenstain and Yeshivas in World War II.Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 21:45, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Charlie Smith FDTB. I think my reply to you got overwritten in an 'editing conflict', so I'm just popping it back again: You get your first 5 DYK nominations free, with no need to review another one. After the first five, you are expected to do one review for each of your own nominations. This is the QPQ - quid pro quo - you'll have seen mention of. As I recall, your hook goes where it says Hook. But if you have an idea(s) for an alternative hook(s), thet go in ALT1, then ALT2 etc. (I found the instructions for my first DYK to be harder to follow than creating my first article! Good luck. Nick Moyes (talk) 21:35, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you very much. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 22:09, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

I tried nominating an article at Template:Did you know nominations/Yeshivas in World War II but I don't know if it worked. Can you please check? Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 22:48, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Charlie Smith FDTB: You've still got one more key step to take. Having created the individual nomination, that is really only a sub-page, and you now need to stick that page inside the master page of all nominations. It might sound scary, but it's actually quite a simple process of 'transcluding' your nomination, so that it is physically embedded within the master page (not just copy/pasted), which means that any changes to your individual page also appear (live) at Template talk:Did you know. (I know this may seem counter-intuitive to be posting within a talk page, but it's a template's talk page, not a users or an articles - it's ok.)   Like I said, if you follow the official guidelines it's very complicated. I recommend these Instructions for 'Did You Know' that a normal human being can understand. Don't forget you should then also put the DYK nomination into your article's talk page, too. Make sure you watch your individual nomination page as that's where you'll get feedback or concerns raised. You'll probably need to indicate whether you either don't need to do QPQ, or link to the article concerned if you have done one. From memory, isn;t there a field in the template QPQ= but he tip is to look back at earlier nominations and follow how they have been done. You have 7 days from the time of your article's creation to submit your nomination, so you've plenty of time to sort this out. If you need further help from me specifically, please WP:PING me in any reply here (i.e. by including both my username and by signing your post within the same edit. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 08:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nick Moyes:Thank you. I transcluded it under Template talk:Did you know#Articles created/expanded on August 21. Is that all I need to do? Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 17:11, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Charlie Smith FDTB: Well done for doing that! If you look at the other, earlier nominations, you'll see each nominator has added a field 'Reviewed:' and then either indicated that they have made under 5 DYK nominations, or they've linked to the page that they have already reviewed - so you do need to add that, as appropriate. I've also added your DYK nomination to the talk page of Yeshivas in World War II. (Perhaps I could comment that (as an ignoramus on Jewish culture - and, indeed, many other things), I was confused that the lead didn't explain what Yeshivas are, and that it linked to a different word, yeshivos, which took me to Yeshiva. So forgive my ignorance, but I was left quite confused by the possible masculine/feminine or singular/plural ending confusion as you seemed to switch between '..vos' and '...vas' within the same sentence. I also suggest you expand the lead paragraph to explain in a couple of words what a yeshiva is, then where they were moved from (which isn't mentioned), and the fact that those which didn't leave were killed by the Nazis. If you can stand back and read the lead paragraphs with an open mind, it ought to tell a reader the essence of the story. Obviously, it doesn't help that I didn't know what a yeshiva is/are, but despite that I don't feel the lead really gets over to me the broad picture. So I think this is really worth you working on. Hoping this feedback is of use. Nick Moyes (talk) 18:54, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nick Moyes: I added explanation to the opening paragraph and changed all the "yeshivos" to "yeshivas" (they both are plural for the word "yeshiva". "Yeshivos" is the proper Hebrew grammar, while "yeshivas" pluralizes it with English grammar). As for the reviews (I don't need to because it's my first nomination), I don't known how to add that once the page is already published. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 19:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Charlie Smith FDTB: I've fixed it: it goes into the template that you created. It's possible that you may have gone the other way by perhaps adding a bit too much detail now, but not to worry. Nick Moyes (talk) 20:40, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 22:35, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How long does a speedy deletion normally take?

How long does a speedy deletion normally take? So I recently created an article and it was requested for a speedy deletion. I did contest it and I gave a valid reason to contest it. Does anyone know about how long the process takes? Thanks for help in advance. CurrentWeather (talk) 00:09, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi CurrentWeather. It can vary on the type of page that is nominated and the reasons the page was nominated. A page nomimated for copyright reasons or spam reasons might be deleted fairly quickly as soon as some administrator comes across it. If the page you're referring to is Elijah Joyce, then that article has already be deleted per WP:A7 by an adminsitrator named TomStar81. If you look at Template:db-person (which was probably the template that was used), you'll see there's no specific time period that needs to pass before the file can be deleted. So, bascially the process takes as long as it takes for someone other than the aricle's creator who disagrees with the tagging to remove the template or an administrator to review the template. TomStar81 did leave a message on your talk page explaining why he deleted the page; so, perhaps that would be the best place to ask him any further questions if you have any.

I also see you're currently working on Draft:Elijah Joyce. The article seems to be about a high school athlete and all of the sources you cited seem to be from the high school newspaper of Dayton Christian where Joyce is a student. I'm not sure how many articles about high school athletes are created, even record-setting athletes, when the primary coverage about them seems to be mainly limited to their high school newspaper per WP:NSPORT and WP:YOUNGATH. You'll probably have a better chance at establishing Joyce's Wikipedia notability if you can show that he has received covered regionally or nationally. You can keep working on the draft if you want, but if it's basically a recreation of the article that was deleted, then it seems unlikely to be accepted by WP:AFC if you submit for review, or likely to be mominated or tagged for deletion again if you WP:MOVE the page to the article namespace yourself. Joyce may have a great career ahead of him in competitive swimming, but it might be WP:TOOSOON to try and create an article about him at this point. Maybe try asking about this at WP:SWIMMING to see if any of the members of that WikiProject have any suggestions on how to further improve your draft. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:44, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@CurrentWeather: For CSD the time frame is usually whenever the spirit moves an admin to go through the log page and start clearing it out or whenever an RC-patrolling admin spots an edit summary with deletion related material and moves to pounce on it. It can take a matter of seconds or it can be a days long affair, it just depends. As far as successfully contesting goes, that depends on the material, the tag, and the admin. In a best case an article stays, but this is usually rare, in most cases an article is axed and in a few cases the admins file for AFD. In all cases though those who would contest are usually asked to be familiar the guidelines and policies which apply to the article's material and as a show of good faith are asked to be familiar with Wikipedia:Arguments to avoid in deletion discussions and User:ReaderofthePack/Common notability arguments as those of us who swing axes grow very frustrated with the having explain for the umpteenth time why such and such an argument doesn't work. TomStar81 (Talk) 01:15, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

TomStar81 you wrote above: In a best case an article stays, but this is usually rare, ...} Not so rare as all that. When I patrol CSD , I find that depending on the sub category, I decline 1/4 to 1/3, sometimes as many as 1/2 of the tags. Look at Special:Contributions/DESiegel and search for "Speedy declined" to get some idea, although this won't show pages later deleted via PROD or AfD (or XfD). I am seeing some 22 declines in my last 500 edits and 24 deletions over the same time period (since 11 Aug). Of course I am probably not representative of all admins on this issue. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 01:33, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

CurrentWeather, I think that the overwhelming majority of Wikipedia administrators would have speedily deleted this article about a run-of-the-mill high school athlete without any hesitation. Please read and study Wikipedia's notability guideline for athletes. It is very rare although not impossible for a high school athlete to qualify for a Wikipedia biography. If he had set a world record instead of a school record, then that would probably qualify him. The example that comes to mind is LeBron James, who went straight from high school to professional basketball. His Wikipedia biography was created in 2003 right around the time he graduated from high school, but before he had played professionally. However, he had already been on the cover of Sports Illustrated by then. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 05:54, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Comment: Irrespective of this particular case, the problem we have created for ourselves is that users whose pages are tagged for WP:CSD are provided with a nice shiny blue button on Template:Db, clearly seeming to allow them to contest deletion, and then a helpful notice on their talk page, too. But if I come along 10 minutes later and delete the page, they've had no chance to interact. Either we should give users a chance to contest, or we should not give it to them in the first place, but simply explain why their content has been summarily executed removed. It's a waste of my time contesting deletion if, once I've finished drafting my comments to contest it, I find the page has already been deleted. At the very least, we should consider changing the user talk page message fromn "This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted." to "Whilst this might give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it is often removed without delay." Nick Moyes (talk) 10:05, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

User:Nick Moyes and anyone else - I suggest that the instructions for administrators who are reviewing speedy deletion nominations include an instruction to look at the talk page to see if there is an appeal. I think that would be a simple and reasonable addition to the procedures. The large majority of speedy deletion nominations are valid, and the majority of appeals contesting speedy deletions are of no real value, but occasionally a speedy deletion nomination is either mistaken (or actually done to make a point) or should go to AFD. I think it is just common sense to include that in the instructions for deleting administrators. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:40, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

In the specific case of Elijah Joyce, the author not only contested the deletion, twice, but removed the speedy deletion tag, although the instructions say clearly not to do that. What we have here appears to be an editor who doesn't understand what is meant by notability. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:40, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

John Dehner

Hi,

Could someone add to the John Dehner page the great part he played in the Andy Griffith Show? He was Colonel Harvey in the episode March 11, 1963 "Aunt Bee's Medicine Man".

Thank you 69.207.147.158 (talk) 02:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but we don't normally add every guest appearance performed unless WP:reliable sources have found it notable and written about it. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 03:30, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

While I agree with you AlanM1, in principle, this is a bit of an interesting case because the infobox photo used claims its's from the Andy Griffith Show; so, it seems there should be at least some mention of this appearance somewhere in the article (obviously supported by a source) beside the infobox image caption. -- Marchjuly (talk) 04:12, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Marchjuly: I don't know. The section is supposedly a "Selected Filmography", but appears to be exhaustive, including uncredited roles, and completely uncited. I know there's a push (or there was) among the film folks to trim down exactly this type of article. OTOH, "one more won't hurt". I guess. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 06:18, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

​I thought the same thing about that section as well. It probably started out as "selected", but got expanded more and more over time. Anyway, I was thinking that a mention would work better in first paragraph of John Dehner#Televison along with the other shows mentioned. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:21, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Citing IMDb

AlanM1 and Marchjuly, If I may branch off a bit from the original question, I found this discussion interesting because I frequently see actors' and actresses' biographies that include (either in the text or in a filmography) numerous guest appearances on TV shows. They seldom have citations, and the few that are cited usually use IMDb or ctva.com, both of which are unreliable sources. I keep thinking the appearances should be reliably cited. Similarly, my watchlist almost daily shows guest appearances added to articles, again with no citation. What (if anything) should I do in those circumstances? Eddie Blick (talk) 01:00, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Teblick: I wish I knew. It's one of those glaring inconsistencies between reality and apparent policy against uncited, unverifiable content, not to mention indiscriminate collection of trivial information (all due respect to the artists, but relative to the overall aim of encyclopedic notability and quality, it seems pretty wrong). I think a concerted effort by a team of editors to go out and clean it up would be necessary, but I imagine there is significant objection to wholesale deletion of uncited content. I'm not sure what should constitute the criteria for selection of works, either. I don't see anything wrong with stopping new additions to the pile if they're not cited and obviously notable, though. No doubt a discussion that should be (and likely has been) held at WT:FILM. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 01:45, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

AlanM1, I appreciate your comments. I am one who likes to have a source for everything I put in an article, so I sometimes feel frustrated seeing masses of information with not apparent support. By the way, in an interesting coincidence, not long after I joined this discussion, I found an edit to Johnny Sheffield in my watchlist. An editor removed a "citation needed" template with the edit summary "Citation request is frivilous. A glance at filmography proves the point." Thus, we have an statement in the text that is supposedly verified by an uncited entry in the article's filmography. Eddie Blick (talk) 01:59, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Hi Teblick. IMDb is generally considered unreliable per WP:UGC, WP:EL/P#IMDb, and WP:RS/IMDB, but in some cases it might be OK if it's discussed and the consensus seems to think it is. Where IMDb is usually helpful is that it provides the names of the TV shows or films (sometimes even the year and episode name) an actor has appeared in which means that it could lead you to other more reliable secondary sources. Even if it leads you tracking down a copy of the show/film and you watch it yourself, you could cite the actual show as a source per WP:SAYWHERE. I did this once for an article in which it was claimed that the subject was connected to the film A.I. Artificial Intelligence. I looked for secondary online sources for verification and when I couldn't find any, I watched the film (again) and looked at the credits. The subject wasn't mentioned by name at all so there was no way to verify the claim and it was removed.

It all might come down to the nature of the actual content and how IDMb is being cited. If the primary claim for Wikipedia notability is that the subject has an IMDb page or their Wikipedia notability is otherwise iffy and no other secondary sources can be found, then IMDb has pretty much zero value in my opinion. If the subject's Wikipedia notability is well-established (perhaps an actor from an era way before IMDb existed) and IMDb is just being used to cite certain entries in a filmography section, then perhaps adding a template like {{Better source needed}} or {{More citations needed section}} is sufficient to let others know of the problem without removing large blocks of content. If you follow the latter approach and someone objects and removes the content anyway, then you will need to be the one to establish a consensus to re-add it because at that point someone is saying that IMDb is clearly insufficient to support the claim. -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:20, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Marchjuly, I admire your dedication to tracking down other sources. I had been going by the IMDb comments on Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources and just replacing IMDb citations with "Citation needed" templates. Now I see that I was in error, so I will let them stand in the future and look for other kinds of improvements instead.Eddie Blick (talk) 02:52, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Not really that dedicated to be honest. That movie just happened to be on cable around the same time I was trying to verify that bit of information; so, I just DVRd it and watched it again. I wouldn't say your approach is wrong; in fact, it's probably more correct than not. If someone re-adds the citations you removed, then use the talk page and explain why you removed them. I know pretty much every bit of information in an article is required to be sourced; however, if the actors appearance in a film or TV show is significant and there's sufficient sourced commentary about the role earlier in the article (or at least a sourced mention), then perhaps another source isn't needed for the table. This would be sort of a tweaked application of WP:CITELEAD. If, on the other hand, the entry is not covered earlier in the article and not sourced anywhere else, like the article about the film itself, then perhaps the WP:CSC should be that it needs a proper source to be kept. -- Marchjuly (talk) 03:03, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you,Marchjuly. I appreciate your clarification and your suggestion for deleting and then, if needed, discussing the citations. I will follow through that way. Eddie Blick (talk) 00:24, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Citing sources - Having a link from a reference link, not just bibliography

Hi,

I have included citations for information contained on a particular page. I thought I followed how to insert sources correctly - and it appears to have done so with the bibliography, as it is listed the same way as everyone else's, and you can click on the titles of the article and be taken to the article direct. My issue is that while the author's last name and reference is coming up in the reference list, it does not link to the article - how do I fix this? The display is also not quite right in the reference list - it has an additional & - and I am following the template and what I see everyone else has done, so stuck as to how to fix it! footnotes 43-45 in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_of_William_Shakespeare

Any assistance would be much appreciated! – Nectarine4505 (talk) 05:30, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Nectarine4505, I have two comments:

• References should follow punctuation marks, not precede them.
• It's not clear why the views of the non-notable Kauffman warrant an entire paragraph. A second paragraph, about a play written by Kauffman, is certainly not warranted. I see that Diannaa has already removed material which seems intended to promote Kauffman. Maproom (talk) 06:35, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

(ec) @Nectarine4505:  Fixed at Special:Diff/974652534. I removed the comma after the years. The page numbers needed the parameter name |pp=, e.g.:

{{sfn|Kauffman|2018,|1-87}} → {{sfn|Kauffman|2018|pp=1-87}}

The Kauffman 2018a ref in the bib had a date of January 2018 instead of 2018a, and did not have the |ref=harv parameter. I don't know if there's a better way of doing multiple sources for the same author and year, but others in the article were done this way (by adding a letter to the year). —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 06:43, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you! Your suggestions are super helpful - I can now see that one of the references in the reference list now comes up with the bibliography information when you hover over it (footnote 44), but not the other couple? Any ideas of what I need to do to fix this?Nectarine4505 (talk) 07:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nectarine4505: If I check it with a non-logged-in Win10 desktop Chrome browser, I get the bib info popup for all four Kaufman refs (and many others I tried) unless the bib entry is also visible on the screen at the time, in which case it highlights that bib entry in light blue (same as it does if you click on the short ref). Is that maybe what's happening? If I use my logged-in Firefox, because I have Navigation Popups enabled, that's the popup I get, unfortunately. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 08:21, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I am not sure? I logged out and had a look - and the actual bibliography seems to be working - yay - but the reference list, only 44 if you hover over it pops up? The other ones nothing is still showing for me...I cannot work it out as far as I can see all the references are listed the same...so not sure what the difference is?Nectarine4505 (talk) 09:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Copy paste content

The article 1957 Ramnad riots has an entire section called 'Events during riots' which doesn't cite any sources however further digging I found this one and the entire sections is a exact copy paste from this source, another problem is that that mentioned source doesn't seem to be reliable either(but not sure about it). Anyway this a blatant copyright violation. What should be done in this case? JagatRaxak (talk) 07:48, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi JagatRaxak. You'll find some information about this in WP:COPYVIO. You can also request assistance at Wikipedia:Copyright problems. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:55, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

The link I provided is wrong messed it up, anyways thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by JagatRaxak (talk • contribs) 07:57, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I asked an administrator named Diannaa to take a look at this and she said that other website is a WP:MIRROR of Wikipedia; basically, this means that the content was on Wikipedia first and the other website just copied it. That sometimes happens and it’s OK for the website to do that as long as they attribute to Wikipedia. So, the Wikipedia isn’t infringing on the copyright of the other website. — Marchjuly (talk) 12:18, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Where can I make a complaint to the admins?

So last night I attempted to get an article published. It was speedy deleted and I understand why. So I moved it to a Draft to continue working and improving it. When I woke up, I saw people had begun the process to delete it. I honestly want to make a complaint to the admins because these 2 guys are working to delete a draft that is less than 12 hours old. The reason for the speedy deletion was because I didn't see enough notability. I had about 1/2 of the needed notability shown. So can someone tell me where I can make a complaint to the admins? Thank you. CurrentWeather (talk) 10:48, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

CurrentWeather If your issue involves user behavior, you can go to WP:ANI. However, as an admin I don't really see anything actionable here. You have already gone to the deletion discussion page and raised your objection, and that will be taken into account. If you were to go to ANI it would likely be closed relatively quickly, as users are allowed to propose deletion in good faith. I might opine that an article about a high school athlete sourced only to the high school paper may not meet the definition of a notable high school athlete(which specifically excludes school papers as sources). 331dot (talk) 10:56, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Are you the person you are writing about, or do you know them? 331dot (talk) 10:58, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I know them and I disclosed that I am close to the topic CurrentWeather (talk) 11:01, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

CurrentWeather while I disagree with the deletion nomination, and have said so in the MfD discussion, the nominator (a very experienced editor) has not violated any policy, guideline, or procedure in making the nomination. I am an admin, and I assure you that any formal complaint would be rapidly dismissed. Any editor who, in good faith thinks that a particular draft harms the project, or qualifies under our deletion policy, may nominate it for deletion at an MfD discussion. All interested editors may give their views. The discussion will last for at least 7 days, and may be continued beyond that. If, and only if, there is a consensus to delete it, it will be deleted. Even after that, it can be undeleted if significant new information comes to light. While drafts are not automatically deleted unless they are untouched for 6 months, they are not immune from deletion by consensus at any point.

If you have sources that indicate better than those already in the draft, I urge you to mention those sources, with links if possible, in the MfD and describe in what way they make Joyce significant. It needs to be something more than setting local HS athletic records, I would think. National or regional coverage would help, or something else out of the ordinary. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 15:04, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Why is this article in the "Wikipedia:" namespace?

I just found this article: [4]

I think it might have been mistakenly placed in the "Wikipedia:" namespace but I am not sure. I am not a regular contributor to the English Wikipedia. --TheRandomIP (talk) 11:00, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

 Resolved GeraldWL ✉ 11:02, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How do i change our company logo that is showing please?

Hi How do i change the old company logo showing on wikipedia please Kind regards Jackie Hallewell Jackie Hallewell (talk) 11:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Jackie Hallewell, welcome to the Teahouse. If you want your company's Wikipedia's logo to be updated, you can upload one on Wikimedia Commons under a free license, and someone should probably change it. May I ask what article? GeraldWL ✉ 11:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Courtesy link MMCG. Theroadislong (talk) 11:47, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

The reply from User:Gerald Waldo Luis is only correct if you wish to release the logo for everyone to use under a free licence. It is more likely that you would wish to use the logo under a fair use exemption, in which case you'll find advice at WP:Logos. --David Biddulph (talk) 13:01, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Oh, and continuation to David's, if you're not the one designing, make sure the design team (or person) allows it. GeraldWL ✉ 13:12, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Sorry, Gerald Waldo Luis, but that's probably not right either. Most logos are uploaded with the non-free content criteria, and that does not require permission from anybody. --ColinFine (talk) 14:07, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

CREATING A NEW PAGE/TOPIC

I am trying to create a new page for my client who owns a roofing company in Pennsylvania. I have edited more than 10 pages in an effort to receive the contributor status necessary to create a page. Can you please explain the process to me in a bit more detail? If I want to create a page about this roofing company, what are the appropriate steps to take? How will I be notified when I am able to publish the page? I appreciate any guidance! TEC2012 (talk) 13:11, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

TEC2012 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Since you state that you are editing for a client, you must read the paid editing policy and make the required declaration. (This is a Terms of use requirement and mandatory) You should also read about conflict of interest. Unless you have extensive experience in article creation, you should use Articles for creation to create and submit a draft for review by an independent editor, instead of directly creating it. You should read Your first article and be aware that Wikipedia only summarizes what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen on their own to say about a subject, showing how it meets Wikipedia's special definition of notability Wikipedia has no interest in what the subject wants to say about itself (such as through interviews, press releases, or routine announcements). 331dot (talk) 13:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

About "Wikipedia has no interest in what the subject says about himself," I think you mean "limited space for...". Some autobiographical citations may be used, but Wikipedia only allows it for few cases. GeraldWL ✉ 13:22, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Gerald Waldo Luis This isn't referring to citations, but the OP representing their client and telling the world what they want to say about themselves. That's discouraged. 331dot (talk) 15:10, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi TEC2012, welcome to the Teahouse. I would strongly discourage you to make a page about something/someone you have a close connection with; you'll have a conflict of interest which will decrease the level of encyclopedicness and will seem more promotional. I'd suggest you declare your conflict of interest towards said subject at your userpage; it's useful for other editors to know it. See WP:COI for more info.

You may, meanwhile, make more edits to Wikipedia (valuable edits, ofc) and when the time is right, make an article on something you don't have a conflict of interest with. You may think that you don't have a bias on your client, but it may be seen vividly on the final result; I've never seen any COI-backgrounded edits page creations successful. GeraldWL ✉ 13:19, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Gerald Waldo Luis I obviously cannot speak to what you have seen, but COI editors can and do make edits in the correct manner, either as edit requests or through AFC. 331dot (talk) 13:22, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Apologies for the confusion, I meant page creations. Saw the epidemic just today. I am obviously not saying COIers cannot make good edits, I just haven't saw them. I would love to someday. GeraldWL ✉ 13:26, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

An example of a good COI page (for anyone who wishes to see one) is Handschriftencensus, which Blablubbs and I helped create. The main author was Hrobeth Dunbar, who had a disclosed COI. It started as a draft and passed AfC. Giraffer (munch) 13:48, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis:, perhaps this will be of interest. Yes, Giraffer, is correct, and possibly as a result of this initial good experience, with Giraffer and others, Hroberth Dunbar is now editing Lubeck law, and adding proper sources, etc to update a very old and poorly refed article. He even found an image, to enrich the article. Because they were not the sort of editors who would choose to violate our regulations, I have had good experiences with "academic" -type COI editors, that I met through the Teahouse, who have proved very helpful. See the talkpage of Judith Klinman for examples. Thus far, the academics, in my experience, readily understand and accept our COI regulations, plus they know how to provide well-formatted sources! Another Teahouse meeting occurred with JBonnerAnglican, in reference to a stub that had been started on his father, Gerald Bonner. His notes/sources, as stated on the talkpage, enabled me to expand the article. These "good faith" editors, despite their COI, are a benefit to the project. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 01:50, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks so much for your quick response! I definitely appreciate the concerns with the COI and have read up on that a bit. The purpose of putting the company on Wikipedia isn't for promotional purposes at all. They would just like for their company to have an article in this space. They've been around for nearly ten years, are among the Top 100 Roofing Companies in the US, they've been featured in newscasts in several states on the East Coast and the owner of the company has authored a book on roofing. I know there is a major backlog in getting an article published by someone else and that is why I was hoping to create the article myself. I write content for them only and am not on their staff. Not sure if that helps. What would be your best suggestion for me to try and move this forward? If I don't create the page, who would?

TEC2012 (talk) 13:47, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm sorry, TEC2012, but "they would just like for their company to have an article in this space" is an example of exactly what Wiipedia means by promotion. Wikipedia has essentially no interest in whether somebody wishes there to be an article about them (or, indeed, whether they wish there not to be an article about them). If a consensus of editors agrees that a topic is notable (which requires that there be sufficient independent material about them already reliably published, so an article can be based on that material) then Wikipedia would like to have an article on them, if somebody wants to write it. If there is not sufficient material for them to meet the citeria of notability, then Wikipedia will not accept an article on them. --ColinFine (talk) 14:17, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I have written two books that are available free to anyone about 'Tom Williamson the Golfer' and 'The History of Hollinwell and Notts. Golf Club'. I would like them to be available to Wikipedia readers.

I have written two books that are available free to anyone about 'Tom Williamson the Golfer' and 'The History of Hollinwell and Notts. Golf Club'. I would like them to be available to Wikipedia readers.

How do I create a link to them on the relevant Wikipedia pages?

There is no advertising related to them. I am the archivist at Hollinwell and these are detailed, referenced and informative. Cacosmia (talk) 13:17, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Cacosmia, Wikipedia is not a place for letting people know about your new work. If the book has information that an editor deems needed for a certain article, they will probably cite it at the claim they wrote. GeraldWL ✉ 13:24, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Cacosmia you might be interested in Wikisource.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 15:26, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Related to AFD voting

Where to find the articles for AFD voting ? Iitianeditor (talk) 13:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Iitianeditor. Try looking at WP:AFD#Current and past articles for deletion (AfD) discussions. — Marchjuly (talk) 14:18, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

AFD discusions are NOT votes; you will sometimes see them described as "!votes". The process is described at WP:Articles for deletion. David Biddulph (talk) 14:23, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

David Biddulph Thanks for the help, will check out the provided links.Iitianeditor (talk) 07:59, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Images in infobox showing death / suffering

While reviewing the Killing of George Floyd article I was momentarily struck by the fact we included an image at the top of perhaps the moment he died, was immediately dying, or already dead. While not graphic, it did kind of strike me as odd that maybe this is insensitive and for this article, and others that may be doing something similar, maybe a more neutral image should be selected or omitted entirely. It doesn't bother me personally, and at the same time I do wonder if the image will end up being burned into popular conscience like the Execution of Nguyễn Văn Lém but when looking for other similar events (murder of, execution of, killing of) we either focus on a relatively benign image or do not include one (even if it was broadcast on live TV such as Execution of Saddam Hussein). To be clear, I am not suggesting a scrub of the image - just that perhaps it shouldn't be the top image and we should consider how we present images in the future with some consideration. Anyway, curious as to other peoples thoughts are. Koncorde (talk) 15:06, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Koncorde, see WP:NOTCENSORED. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, an explicit source of information. We don't cover things just because it may cause PTSD. I think it would be doing a disservice if we are not showing the photo. See Wikipedia:Content disclaimer for the disclaimer. GeraldWL ✉ 15:15, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

The image has also been shared globally, so there's no need for a cover-up anyway. GeraldWL ✉ 15:18, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

There is not a question of a cover-up. I explicitly stated "I do wonder if the image will end up being burned into popular conscience". I do question how graphic we are inclined to be. Is there any threshold of sensitivity? Child sex abuse images under the Pedophilia article? Pictures of dead kids in the Columbine High School massacre? Koncorde (talk) 15:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Koncorde The proper place to bring this up would be Talk:Killing of George Floyd- where this has been discussed several times. 331dot (talk) 15:29, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I am specifically not bringing it up there because I am curious as to the wider concept of such images. Koncorde (talk) 15:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

As noted, we don't censor images because of the potential to cause distress or offense. There are ways to suppress the display of images for those that are concerned about such things. What you propose would mean that the image of the Atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki would need to be moved or removed as it depicts hundreds of thousands of people being vaporized or maimed. 331dot (talk) 15:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

There is a difference between "censor" and using a different lead image - bearing in mind we don't seem to follow a standard rule of depicting the most graphic image possible on each article, only on some of them suggesting some editorial censorship is already underway. Should we be actively including such pictures where they can be found? And also there is a clear difference between the dispassionate presentation of the atomic bomb, vs the relative intimacy of Floyds death. Koncorde (talk) 15:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Koncorde: I think it's more about showing an image most widely associated with the topic, which, in this case, is that one. Coverage in sources routinely use that image. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 21:30, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I will abhor changing the lead image, as the lead image is very much the essence of the article's subjects. It makes the readers familiar and ready for what they're going to read below. GeraldWL ✉ 03:23, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

So, in that case why aren't all similar articles illustrated this way? It appears some articles are "censored" by presenting a more palatable picture? Is it the significance of the image? Is the image in and of itself notable, is that the factor? Koncorde (talk) 16:00, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Koncorde, this takes us back to the top. There are no general rules, except some guiding principles that have already been pointed out and norms that can only be understood with experience. Each article depicts images that represent a consensus of the editors who have been editing and discussing the article. If you think an image on any given article should be updated (added, removed, reorganised), the place to bring that up is the talk page of that article, if you can identify a general problem and would like to propose a general solution that ought to be binding to the whole project, the village pump is the place for it. The image guidelines at MOS:IMAGES should have most of the answers you would want before you would proceed with either of those options. (P.S. We work with what we have; the best/most-relevant images may not be freely available for all topics. I would think the biggest reason for inconsistency between articles would simply be the availability.) Best, Usedtobecool ☎️ 09:28, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

I am not trying to change policy, I am just curious about the perspectives that lead to certain images being selected. And that's the interesting bit isn't it. That consensus aspect I mean. How do we get to the point where we do or don't show the most graphic imagery without being accused of censorship? Aside from the legality of showing certain images, what is the threshold? I mean, there are certainly images of decapitation available, but instead we have artistic depictions. Is that not some form of "censorship"? Is the defence of wikipedia as not being censored enough to cover presenting pretty much any photographs in articles. For instance autopsy photographs (per John F. Kennedy autopsy). Is there any argument against including such images in other articles where the "consensus" would be to say that such an image is not relevant? Is a lack of relevance to the persons life, or the events leading to death, a defence against being accused of censorship? Koncorde (talk) 10:02, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

German POWs in America in WWII

There are numerous general accounts of German POWs in America in WWII. I'm trying to find out at which of the roughly 700 camps my father was interned. Sadly, no one in the family remembers where my father told us he was; two relatives think it was in S.C., but my husband and I lean more toward somewhere in the midwest. He talked about harvesting potatoes and beans, and that it was very hot there.

Does anyone know whom I should contact for POW rolls -- if they even exist? 70.35.176.142 (talk) 15:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

This question is probably more appropriate for the Reference Desk; this page is to ask questions about using Wikipedia. 331dot (talk) 15:38, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Copyright

I wanted to report copyright / blatant copy paste issue on the page Devendrakula Velalar which has content copied from thispdf in the url however it is not possible to report on page. What is going on? I read insctruction on wikipedia page about tagging copy right issue but editing not possible in that page it seems. JagatRaxak (talk) 17:01, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, JagatRaxak I will look into the issue. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 17:17, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

If you can't edit the article, you can raise the problem at Talk:Devendrakula Velalar. --David Biddulph (talk) 18:05, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

JagatRaxak I have removed the copied text. I considered re-writing it, but the source from whoich it is copied is missing key info such as the author's name, and seems to come from a thesis database, so it may not be a reliable source. I have used revision deletion to hide all revisions of the page (some 155) that included the copied text. The copied content did not have much context in the article in any case, and seemed to me of quite limited value. But this is not a field I claim to know well.

The page was fully protected earlier this month because of extensive edit warring. Edit requests and reports of problems may be made at Talk:Devendrakula Velalar. The page would, in my view, benefit from much work. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 20:08, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Sigh...while you are at it,DESiegel, the "Inscription" section has been closely/mostly copied from the same pdf in the url, see page ten. The only difference, afaict, is a change in names from Pallas to Devendrakula Velalar. I would be willing to try to rewrite this charming story, if someone can confirm the source, re:ibid. It seems to be from K.R.Hanumanthan, as cited in the article? I However, don't understand why Pallas was changed to Devendrakula Velalar. Sorry for the bother. Pinging JagatRaxak also. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 22:25, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Tribe of Tiger Thanks. From what I read on the talk page of this article, at least one editor thinks that "Devendrakula Velalar" is the proper name for the group others call "Pallas". Personally I don't know enough about the topic to have an opinion. The PDF linked above seems to be a chapter of a thesis, dn does not include any author's name. Perhaps the first part would, but I couldn't find that on the site. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 22:30, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Newcomers Real Estate Help

How does a Veteran Real Estate Agent get listed to help newcomers? Chevy409 (talk) 17:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Chevy409 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. I'm not clear on what your question has to do with editing or using Wikipedia, which is the purpose of this forum. Wikipedia is not a directory of real estate agents. Please clarify. 331dot (talk) 17:30, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia Change Page name (Move)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonographic_Performance_Limited

Hi, entering genuine edits her in respect of above page. Given valid reasons and cited for page name change but getting a little stuck how to request a page move which has ended up in a threat to block.

Any experienced editors out there that can help out? My goal is to share factual knowledge and expand access to correct information on this page.

My suggested name change is to "PPL - Music Copyright Collection Society" which will identify it for everyone who knows this company. "PPL is the logo of the Company and the name that everyone in the UK who knows it, calls it by - this includes the Company itself, it's 110,000 members (who all state they are members of the "PPL" and all the license fee payers!)

Any help appreciated. Thanks DJ888kmg (talk) 17:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

It would be wise for you to read what you were told on your user talk page. You were given a link to WP:Requested moves. --David Biddulph (talk) 18:10, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@David Biddulph: Thanks for the advice. Have set up Move request and discussion taking place on Phonographic Performance Limited. DJ888kmg (talk) 08:19, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

How can I upload a photo in an article?

How can I upload a photo in an article? Nasimrezaei1 (talk) 17:57, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

This brochure gives a good overview of the process. I'd caution you, though, that the subject of the draft you're working on does not seem to qualify for a Wikipedia article. See WP:NMUSIC. So I would not invest a lot of time in the draft; you are likely to be disappointed when it is not published. Calliopejen1 (talk) 18:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

That includes not uploading a photo until a draft is accepted as an article. David notMD (talk) 19:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@David notMD: I'm not sure I understand your comment. Images are allowed in drafts as long as they are free images (and presumably the only images that would be permitted in this user's draft biography would be free images). Calliopejen1 (talk) 20:11, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How best to check if a newly created article is 'substantially identical' to a deleted one?

I'm specifically thinking in terms of CSD WP:G4. For instance 'John Taurus' has had a delete result at AfD twice this year, but today I stumbled across Draft:John Tauras. Kj cheetham (talk) 19:03, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

P.S. I know only admins can see deleted versions, so really I'm asking which is the appropriate forum to ask them in. -Kj cheetham (talk) 19:06, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I can tell you that the draft is exactly the same, just with the filmography table added in. bibliomaniac15 19:22, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. -Kj cheetham (talk) 19:24, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How do I improve my article on Mike Siegel?

Hi all! I'm new to editing Wikipedia. I wrote a new article on Draft:Mike Siegel (politician). It has been rejected on grounds of "lack of notability." Now, Siegel is a well-known politician in his state, and has received a lot of coverage in many news outlets, so there's no shortage of material about him and I think he qualifies as notable. I'd like to get to improve my article so it can be published as soon as possible. Could I ask anyone who is interested to read it and advise me on how to improve it? Gnaanamurthy (talk) 19:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Gnaanamurthy Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Please read the the notability guidelines for politicians. Merely being a candidate for office does not merit someone an article, which means that he would have to meet the more general notability guidelines for people. 331dot (talk) 20:01, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

331dot Understood. I have added more national sources that demonstrate the national significance of his career and campaign. Gnaanamurthy (talk) 01:53, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

331dot For the moment I've decided to keep the article in my workspace, and we'll see what happens after the election. However, there is a reference to Mike Siegel on the page of the Congressional District where he's running: Texas's 10th congressional district. Would the editors object if I provided some information about Siegel in the relevant sections of that article? Gnaanamurthy (talk) 17:01, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Gnaanamurthy If he wins his election, he would then merit an article(even before he is sworn into office). In the article you reference, I see little more than his name mentioned, so I don't really see much of an opportunity to add to it there IMO. 331dot (talk) 17:05, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Texas Elections and Politicians: Errors

2002 Texas Elections for US Senator: Democrat candidate for U.S. Senator was Kirk Watson. The photo in right-sidebar is not Kirk Watson.

Rick Perry: Rick Perry was never Governor of Texas, but is listed as Governor for several years. Wayne Roberson, Austin, Texas (talk) 20:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Wayne Roberson, Austin, Texas Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. The proper place to note errors us on the article talk page of the relevant article. I'm not sure how you can claim Rick Perry was never Governor of Texas, he won three elections as Governor. 331dot (talk) 20:24, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

You say that "Rick Perry was never Governor of Texas"; the article Governorship of Rick Perry seems to disagree with you, so you would need very strong evidence to convince us. Similarly 2002 United States Senate election in Texas disagrees with you on the identity of the Democrat candidate. If you have published reliable sources to support your contentions, the talk pages of the articles concerned would be the place to discuss your thoughts. David Biddulph (talk) 20:34, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How long until a new draft is approved.

Hi there I wanted to ask how long it takes for a new draft article to be approved and listed?

Also, is there a way to add a subject photo to the article for the artist who I’m writing about?

Thanks you. IrishContributor2020 (talk) 20:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@IrishContributor2020: Your article had not been submitted for review, so I submitted it. I also reviewed it and declined it. Please read the message at Draft:Karl Dawson to understand why it was declined. If Dawson doesn't qualify for an article (and I'm not sure he does), then it does not make sense to invest time in adding images to the draft. For now, please see if you can collect more significant coverage of Dawson and add it to your draft. Once it's been accepted, I'd ask here about how to add a photo to the article. Calliopejen1 (talk) 20:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Change the URL or make a new page? New guy needs help :)

I want to put up a page on Wikipedia at this URL https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neighborly, but it's already taken with another company that's out of business.

The Neighborly I want to make an entry for is a totally different company at the same URL as the previous company (neighborly.com).

1) Should the new company be on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neighborly?

2) If so, what should the current https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neighborly be changed to?

3) If not, what should the new company's URL be?

Thank you for your help! Govatos (talk) 20:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Govatos, and welcome to the Teahouse. There are standard ways of handling multiple articles with whose subjects have the same name; but my advice to you is not to worry about it, but use the articles for creation process to create a draft. When you submit your draft for review, a reviewer who accepts it will move it to main article space, and sort out any name clashes. You do realise that creating a new article is one of the hardest tasks for inexperienced editors? (I know you've been here 12 years, but you describe yourself as a new guy). Have you read your first article? --ColinFine (talk) 21:12, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

show a 12 hour clock

Bold textshow a 12 hour clock

l 2600:1700:ECD0:A7A0:607F:A00E:76FD:76B4 (talk) 21:07, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I checked preferences and I don't see this as an option. Perhaps someone can suggest a gadget that does it. In either case you would need to create an account to change the time format display. RudolfRed (talk) 21:20, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Conflict of Interest for new wiki user not showing correctly

Hello. I am writing a draft for my company since we do not have a wikipedia page yet. I was writing the disclosure part (conflict of interest) according to the template provided and for some reason, after submitting, I see "Connected contributor paid should only be used on talk pages." According to a deck for creating an account and stating our conflict of interest, the screenshot for after submitting the disclosure was not the same as what shows for my screen and I am unable to submit my wikipedia draft for approval.

Any suggestions or guidance to fix this problem? Much appreciated and thank you! Meguatastro (talk) 21:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Meguatastro: Please use {{Paid}} for your user page. {{Connected contributor (paid)}} should go on the talk page of the draft you create. Calliopejen1 (talk) 21:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Meguatastro and welcome to the Teahouse. Thank you for declaring your conflict of interest. {{connected contributor}} is for use on the talk page of an article where a person with a COI has edited. {{UserboxCOI}} is for use on your user page. place it as follows:

{{UserboxCOI|1=Wikipedia article name}}

If there is more than one article for which you have a COI, add 2= and 3= and so on, for up to nine article names. However, if you are writing about your employer, use {{Paid}} as Calliopejen1 said above. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 21:40, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Meguatastro. In the interest of possibly saving you a considerable amount of disappointment and frustration, I would like to make some (possibly unwelcome) point.

• First, creating a new article is one of the most difficult tasks for a new editor, and I always advise against trying it before spending a few weeks or months improving existing articles and learning how Wikipedia works first.
• The task is even more difficult for an editor with a conflict of interest, because (since Wikipedia is basically not interested in anything that the subject says about itself, or the subject's associates or employees say about it) it will be necessary for you to forget everything you know about the company, and confine yourself to summarising what people unconnected with the company have published about it.
• Nobody in the universe "has a Wikipedia page". Wikipedia has articles about notable companies and other notable subjects. If your company does not meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability, then all time and effort you put into trying to create an article will go to waste.
• Further, nobody owns a Wikipedia article. If you succeed in getting an article about your company written and accepted, it will thereafter not be your article, and you will not control its contents. You will be welcome to suggest changes on the article's talk page, but that will be the limit of your involvement.

If you still want to go ahead, I suggest looking at User:ian.thomson/Howto for a summary of how to proceed, and your first article for more detail, --ColinFine (talk) 22:44, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Question about edit requests by an editor with a COI related to the article

I have a COI because I an connected to the subject of an article (She is a politician and I am a supporter or her candidacy and do some volunteer work for the campaign). So, following the instructions I have received, I request edits on the talk page of the article. I have done so. I have posted my question there, but have not received a response from the editor who has read the request. I am waiting for additional responses. I would like to know whether it is appropriate to make edits to my requested edits, or are they set in stone until the review is completed?

I am new to Wikipedia editing and am not familiar with protocol. I'm hoping to learn more about it here. I'm a little gun-shy after making one edit, which was not promotional in any way, and being immediately block for "promotional/COI" editing. I know now that it was COI editing, but I didn't know at the time, and the edit was absolutely neutral. I have made no edits to the page since. Anyway, I was happy to find the Tea House, where I can get some information in a friendly environment. – BiostatSci (talk) 23:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

BiostatSci Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. To increase the odds your request will be seen by another editor, I have marked it as a formal edit request. Another editor should see it soon and comment. In the meantime, please review and comply with the paid editing policy(which includes unpaid-in-money volunteer work). 331dot (talk) 00:24, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply! It helped. I have read WP:PAID and believe that it does not apply to me. Let me explain more about my COI. I am a supporter of the candidate and have indeed taken on some tasks as a volunteer for the campaign, but editing the Wikipedia article is not one of them. That idea was my idea. I got it when I looked at the article and saw how incomplete it was. It was based solely on information that was nearly 2 years old and contained nothing about her work as a legislator. I saw a request by Wikipedia for someone to help make it more complete by adding content. I and a friend decided to work on it. I did some research, sent it to the friend and she made the first attempt to edit. When she showed me what she put up, without giving me a chance to review it before publishing, I was disappointed. It was not appropriate for a Wikipedia article. So, I started editing myself. My friend has never volunteered for the candidate, as far as I know, but has done some writing for the county Democratic party. I believe that she has given up on making or suggesting further edits. Neither of us were "asked" to update the page by either the candidate or the county Democratic party. The idea to do it was entirely mine. I have not and will not receive payment of any kind for this effort from anyone or any organization. I have no affiliation with the county party, except that I am registered to vote in the county as a Democrat. So, I believe WP:PAID does not apply in my case. If I'm wrong, I will make the disclosure (but I prefer not to if not required). It' the word "paid" that gives me pause. Is there a way to disclose without giving the impression that I was paid to do this? That would give the wrong impression. I don't mind saying that I am a volunteer, even though I was not "asked" to do this. I great appreciate you advice! BiostatSci (talk) 05:25, 25 August 2020 (UTC)BiostatSci

BiostatSci If you have not been asked or directed to edit Wikipedia, you may not need to say that you are "paid", but you still have a conflict of interest that, while not required by the Terms of Use, you should disclose. 331dot (talk) 13:11, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

I have already disclosed that I have a conflict of interest with regard to this page. I did it within a day of the first request by the editor. It's at the top of the talk page of the article (Melanie Stansbury). It does not say that I am a volunteer, however. I don't see a way to edit it to disclose, more specifically, that I volunteer for her campaign. If you can edit it, and have the time to, I would welcome it. I am not editing the article directly, so I can't disclose it with each edit. I can also disclose on my talk page, if that helps, but I don't see that that template allows for specifics about the nature of my connection with Ms. Stansbury. I want to be in compliance! I just don't want to do it in a way that looks like I am being paid. That would misrepresent my connection with Ms. Stansbury. I would not want a viewer to see the disclosure and think that I have been paid, or am claiming to have been paid, when I wasn't. So, I would appreciate your advice on how to make any additional disclosure that might be necessary. I have edited my request for revision on the article talk page to make clear what my connection is, and I have added a tag on my talk page, with an explanation of the specifics on the history page. If I need to do anything else please advise. Thank you again. 2601:8C0:180:7490:D97:F32B:BB6C:4B97 (talk) 14:40, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Question about the subject of a prospective article

Hello Teashouse hosts. I am considering an ambitious article, specifically a list. I am inspired by the fact that I've not written a list article and also by a recent new article: Francis Drake's Circumnavigation. The article would be a list of SFD's landfalls, and each item would include pertinent information. I anticipate breaking the circumnavigation into sections of geographical regions, too.

I've had articles rejected in the past and do not want to put the work into this one with that as a possibility. You can see a record of what I've written [HERE]. I look forward to hearing from you. Hu Nhu (talk) 00:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hu Nhu: I think that would be a useful companion to the article (i.e., link to it somewhere appropriate in the article). I can see having tables with dates and locations, along with co-ordinates, notes, and refs. Maps with location pushpins would be good, too (see {{Location map}} and other templates in this category). Maybe something like List of Spanish missions in California. Some of the locations are pretty vague like a bay in Northern California – I don't know if there's better info in the sources, but most of them appear to be books which may or may not be online. You may need to do some library legwork and/or seek out someone with books at WP:RD. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 02:40, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hu Nhu: That sounds like a cool article. I agree with JohnM. Calliopejen1 (talk) 06:30, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Black Lives Matter

You need to change the copy...........NON VIOLENT? I love your site but this is WRONG!!! 2601:101:8200:DE7E:71A9:AEA0:5D25:3A74 (talk) 00:58, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

If yiu disagree with the content of an article you should post on the talk page of that article, but be prepared to cite reliable sources. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 01:09, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

What article are you referring to? Anyone knows the courtesy link? GeraldWL ✉ 03:25, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Presumably Black Lives Matter.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:50, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Questions about editing from a new editor for Wikipedia

I'm curious about many things, but my topmost curiosity is the overview process for Wikipedia. After spending a good deal of time editing an article and ensuring that it was cross linked with other pages, the article still includes statements that the article is an orphan with no other articles linking to it (I've definitely crosslinked other articles with it), that it needs more specific categories (I've added specific categories), and that it requires copy editing (I've copyedited extensively). If someone would kindly explain the review process, I would greatly appreciate your time.

Warmly,

Maria Ó Cluanáin Maria Ó Cluanáin (talk) 04:22, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Maria Ó Cluanáin: Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. The tags at the top of Ciokaraine M'Barungu were added manually by editors. They can be manually removed once the issues they mention have been cleared up. I have checked them and they are no longer needed, so I've removed the tags. Thank you for your edits!ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:33, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

PS while looking at the article text, I noticed some of it may be a bit of a close paraphrase of the Google Arts and Culture source; I tagged it as such so that other editors can have a look.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:49, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

How to approve my article Draft:Poojabishnoi

 Naresh Prajapat 04:38, 25 August 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nareshprajapatmogra (talk • contribs)

Perhaps you mean to ask: "What can I do to Draft:Pooja Bishnoi in order that it will be approved?" If so, then the answer is "Make radical changes, supporting every assertion within your revised version with a reference to a reliable, independent, published source." Please read Help:Your first article. -- Hoary (talk) 06:57, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

You need to be realistic with your expectations. Not many 9-year olds are notable by Wikipedia's definition. See the guidance on notability for athletics and for cricket. --David Biddulph (talk) 10:24, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

The article actually doesn’t have enough notability of the person or even the layout. It looks like the whole article was written in the lead.Nihaal The Wikipedian (talk) 14:37, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

My editing got removed

Hello, unfortunately all of my editing of the page below got removed for some unknown reason to me. The page as it is does not speak about this person accurately and I wanted to do him Justice! It only spreads some negative information that happened under questionable circumstances for 2 years of his 63 year long career and now we are supposed to highlight and focus on those 2 years. On the top of that, I have received a message from “unknown user” telling me that this page is about Remi Korchemny and not a scrap book about whom he coached. First of all I do not appreciate that sort of communication - at all and secondly I was just stating the facts and putting relevant information about the legendary coach instead of some nonsense shameful information text about some “doping scandal”. Also, of course Wikipedia is not a scrapbook to me - that is absolutely out of question!

I am asking you to restore my work as I was stating only information Remi Korchemny personally told me. Yes, him and me are fiends and I don’t see any conflict of interest when I am listing his accomplishments. And no, I am absolutely not promoting him and also not receiving any money from him for this!

Again, I am kindly asking you to restore my work so that I can complete all of his successes so that people can see for themselves.

Thank you.

P.S. Did you even read the list of references I included? I don’t think you did because if you only did, you would understand what I am talking about.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remi_Korchemny Radspeed (talk) 05:22, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

The place to discuss changes to an article is on its talk page, in this case Talk:Remi Korchemny. David Biddulph (talk) 05:32, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Radspeed, an editor represents neither all editors nor the Wikimedia Foundation. Consider a better approach next time. I'll see what's going on right there. GeraldWL ✉ 06:01, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

You say "him and me are friends and I don’t see any conflict of interest when I am listing his accomplishments". Whether or not you see a conflict of interest, you have one. -- Hoary (talk) 07:00, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hoary, proved by their removal of the "BALCO" (Controversy) section. GeraldWL ✉ 07:02, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

None of the myriad of achievements and lesser trivia were supported by any inline references to enable verification of them. On that basis alone, it seemed to me to have been appropriate for those COI edits to be removed. We never take word of mouth content about any individual; their past conviction for drug cheating is irrelevant to that concern. Including a selection of a few good, independent references which mentions his coaching successes might be appropriate, but not vast list of random achievements with no inline sources to support them. Nick Moyes (talk) 07:59, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Note: Also followed up and then responded to on my talk page (here). Nick Moyes (talk) 10:28, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Follow-up to Draft:SysCAD

Hi, I'm seeking some assistance with Draft:SysCAD - could someone please review and let me know what additional information would need to be seen to satisfy product notability? DanMunchie (talk) 08:11, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello DanMunchie, and welcome to the Teahouse! Notability means that the subject should be covered by multiple reliable, independent sources with in-depth coverage of the topic. This doesn't seem to be the case for your draft. A quick Google doesn't provide many secondary sources. The submission was declined twice because it wasn't notable enough, and unfortunately it doesn't look like it will pass again. You can't increase notability yourself, so it might be time to stop working on the draft. For more info on notability, see WP:GNG and WP:N Giraffer (munch) 08:23, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Giraffer, thanks for the reply. I am confused because many of the other entries in Category:Chemical engineering software would have the same issue. As it is field with heavy IP protection, very few public articles are written describing the base software used in chemical engineering projects. Similar to how no-one would write an article on Excel when doing an accounting project. Reference (3) especially is as in-depth as you could get from a third-party. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DanMunchie (talk • contribs) 11:14, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

There are >six million articles in English Wikipedia, many of which are poorly referenced or deletion-worthy. See Wikipedia:Other stuff exists. David notMD (talk) 15:21, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello

Hello, I'm currently making a wikipedia page for a notable figure. How do I keep it clean and professional and also follow wikipedia's guidelines?

The Work-In-Progress page: Draft:Datan Hopson KingOwnageXV (talk) 10:21, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

KingOwnageXV Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Please note that IMDB and social media accounts are not considered independent reliable sources. IMDB is user-editable, while social media accounts are not independent. Wikipedia is primarily interested in what independent reliable sources with significant coverage state. You would need to show with such sources that this person meets the special Wikipedia definition of a notable creative professional. You may want to read Your First Article for more information. 331dot (talk) 10:26, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

And you should not have copy/pasted text from another copyrighted website, as you did for the two lead sentences. We do not allow that. See WP:COPYVIO Nick Moyes (talk) 10:34, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Original research

1957 Ramnad riots has a section named 'Events during riots' but there was no single citation for the content. I digged through the internet to find sources that I can add but whatever I found seems either to be copied from wikipedia article or the source is unreliable blogspot. So I conclude that this might be a possible original research given the absence of citation. Kindly advise whether the content should be removed? JagatRaxak (talk) 10:54, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, JagatRaxak. Another editor, (Gerald Waldo Luis) appears to have now added a notice to say that that section is uncited - though they forgot to come back an explain their rationale to you. My feeling is that we shouldn't rush to delete uncited content if it is not contested, and is likely to be correct. It might have come from a book or 1957 printed newspaper- it sounds like you aren't sure either. Unless you seriously doubt its veracity, I'd be inclined to leave the content there - possibly adding a note on the talk page to prompt anyone that sources might be helpful. (You could even trace back in the article's history to see who made the original edit and contact them if they're still active here). Just deleting stuff that is likely to be true, but not cited, isn't always the best thing for an article - it's often a case of using one's judgement, and explaining your actions so others can judge your reasoning, too. Hoping this helps, Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 14:06, 25 August 2020 (UTC) 

Apologies for not putting a disclaimer here. I wash on a rush to preparing for a family TV time. Again, apologies, will try slowing down next time. GeraldWL ✉ 15:06, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

And to clarify, I am just putting a disclaimer that there's no citations; I'm not requesting deletion. Editors who is willing to grab sources are welcomed. GeraldWL ✉ 15:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protection request suitable for vandalism.

Hello,

We are experiencing frequent vandalism to our page. We are subject to edit war. They undid our correction of their changes, moments after each revision. This person has caused disruption to other people’s pages too, including editing content without knowledge of topic, changing external links outside of WP, removing pages. I wish to lock my page with editing rights for myself and colleague. Is semi-protection suitable? How can I apply for this? Vivll (talk) 11:13, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Vivll I assume this refers to Ipsotek. No, you cannot lock a page so that only you or those you designate can edit it. All pages may be edited by all good faith users. If there is a problem with vandalism, you may request general page protection at WP:RFPP. However, I don't see the edits to that article as vandalism- a deliberate effort to deface an article. Editors have been removing efforts to add promotional language to that article. Wikipedia is actually not interested in what a company wants to say about itself; Wikipedia primarily summarizes what independent reliable sources say about an article subject. If there is information that is incorrect, we want to know what it is on the article talk page(as a formal edit request if needed, but promotional language will not be accepted.

If you work for Ipsotek, you must make the required paid editing declaration. This is a Terms of Use requirement and mandatory. 331dot (talk) 11:18, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

You and Vis470 have both been editing only this article, and the content has been reverted as blatantly promotional by two experienced editors. You were also advised to declare your paid relationship on your User page before proceeding. Going forward, do that, and do not edit the article directly. Instead, propose changes on the Talk page of the article. Any other path of action will lead to both of you being blocked. David notMD (talk) 15:27, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Vivll: I'm afraid much of what you've said and are experiencing is because of a mistaken impression: Ipsotek is not your page. It is an article in this encyclopedia, just as it would be if it were in Encyclopædia Britannica or some independent (non-PR) book or magazine article. It's (supposed) to be written by independent volunteer Wikipedia editors, based on what independent reliable sources have written about the company. You're not entitled to directly control what is in the page, nor who edits it. You're free to mentional factual problems and discuss changes to the article at Talk:Ipsotek, where a good-faith effort will be made by editors to make sure the article complies with Wikipedia's policies, is fairly balanced with a neutral point-of-view, and accurately reflects those reliable sources. This is all described at the various blue-links given above. I hope this helps. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 01:18, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Review Draft Article

Hi Robert McClenon! Thank you for reviewing the Draft:JioTV and highlighting the concern. I would like to explain this "This draft does not show how this division of Jio Platforms is sufficiently notable to need a separate article. " Jio Platforms has many divisions and JioTV is one of those. It's a LIVE TV application that is completely different from its other applications such as JioMeet (its a video calling app) or JioSaavn (it's an online music app only). Also, I have added more independent sources that are covering JioTV. Please have a look.

Since Robert has reviewed my article that's why I tagged him here. In general, I would appreciate help from any Wikipedia editors to improve this Draft:JioTV Ritzz07 (talk) 11:27, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Do you have a question for us? Giraffer (munch) 11:53, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Giraffer This draft Draft:JioTV has been declined because of notability concerns. So I am seeking help regarding the same. --Ritzz07 (talk) 13:21, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

User:Ritzz07 - What do you want help or advice about? I wrote that the division, JioTV, does not appear to be notable independent of its parent, Jio Platforms. You can expand the draft and resubmit it with an explanation as to how the division is independently notable. Or you can make an edit request to expand the article on the parent company. Robert McClenon (talk) 15:06, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Robert McClenon I need advice where exactly I need to share an explanation of changes I make. Here in this thread or will I get an option to write an explanation at the time of resubmission request. Also, could you please highlight which section ( or content) you feel does not appear to be independent. Any content that doesn't have a sufficient reference link. It will help me rework on this article. Thank You Ritzz07 (talk) 07:18, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Footballers

Who is better Ronaldo Or Messi Ibelaka Anulika (talk) 12:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Ibelaka Anulika Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. This is a place to ask questions about using Wikipedia. Do you have a question about using Wikipedia? 331dot (talk) 12:13, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Copyright of a painting I own

Hi, I would like to write a page about Zambian artists between 1970-90. I want to include a few pictures of paintings and sculptures I own as samples of Zambian artists. All but one of the artists are now deceased, and the one still alive has given me their consent. Could someone please let me know if I can put these pictures on a Wikipedia page. I took the photos of the paintings and sculptures I bought many years ago. Any help will be very appreciated Lusaka80s (talk) 12:39, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Most likely not, unless they are under a siutable license. Note that normally copyright does not end immedately with the death of the artist, but rather some amount of years after that event (70 years is common, but there are shorter and longer periods). As such, its going to be difficult. (Disclaimer:I am not a lawyer and therefore cannot give you legal advice. If you need legal advice, please contact a lawyer of your trust) Victor Schmidt (talk) 13:16, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Move request Phonographic Performance Limited - Request for input on discussion

Hi, started a move request at talk:Phonographic_Performance_Limited - all Editor input welcome. DJ888kmg (talk) 13:18, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

relationship sections of one article when there is a main article of the same name and topic

I'm new.

I noticed the article on Pernambuco was marked to require improvement especially in the History Section. I began making edits without realizing the significance of the line/link indicating that there was a History of Pernambuco article. Question: To what extent should the history section in the general article on Pernambuco be related to the "main" article about the history of Pernambuco?

P2dwight (talk) 13:31, 25 August 2020 (UTC) P2dwight (talk) 13:31, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi, P2dwight, welcome to the Teahouse. If a section has a main article on it, then the section there is just a brief summary of that article. GeraldWL ✉ 13:41, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@P2dwight: The maintenance templates at Pernambuco#History talk about specific issues (sections out of order, missing 165 years, etc.). To me, it seems that the History of Pernambuco article is not much longer than this section, which probably should not be. It seems that the main page section should be trimmed. I'd discuss what to do about it with other involved editors at Talk:Pernambuco. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 01:45, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Requesting assistance with updates to law firm page

Greetings! I'm a marketing professional with Thompson Coburn law firm. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thompson_Coburn I posted a request for two small updates on our page's Talk page, but haven't received a reply yet. Could someone please take a look and let me know the best next steps? Many thanks! Spencecomms (talk) 13:49, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Spencecomms I have marked your article talk page post as a formal edit request; if you do that it is more likely to be seen by other editors. You may see this page on edit requests for more information. 331dot (talk) 13:52, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

331dot Thank you very much!Spencecomms (talk) 14:11, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Article Hijacked - Please help

Hi fellow editors,

I used to update election data in Indian political articles years back as an IP editor. I just found the article K. Annamalai hijacked. Upon searching i found a policy for article hijacking at WP:AHIJACK.

Comparison

This is how the article used to be before on July 2019 - [5]. It was for a K. Annamalai who is a Member of a legislative assembly and the article passes WP:NPOL.

It was changed hijacked in this edit on 12 April 2020 for another K. Annamalai - [6] . The present K. Annamalai is a random police officer who was famous in his area and joined a political party recently and his is not at all notable.

Several different User accounts edited it continuously to bring it to the present state, mostly promotional and i believe they are controlled by the same person. I believe the edits are from his fans.

Problem

The main problem i found is that other election article's which links to this article's for the Member of the legislative assembly now points to a random police officer.

The article is locked now and can somebody help rectify the problem or what is the protocol here, since a lot of articles linking to this article are getting affected. 2409:4072:510:2EF6:8069:EFE4:EF63:6CB4 (talk) 14:52, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

The first attempt at usurping the article was in this edit in February which was subsequently reverted, but others have come along more recently to do the same. David Biddulph (talk) 15:26, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

I've reverted the article to its pre-hijack state. It's now a one-sentence stub, but with incoming wikilinks. Maproom (talk) 18:35, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Geograph / Commons

Hi, I'm sure someone has given me advice on this before but I've forgotten how to do it properly. I want to use this image, which is on geograph.co.uk and has a CC2.0 sharealike licence - what's the best way to get it onto commons? (The upload wizard doesn't give the option to select 2.0, only 2.5, 3.0 etc.). Thanks in advance GirthSummit _(blether) 15:44, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

The stuff in the green box at the top of this Commons page has advice about transferring Geograph images to Commons. Deor (talk) 17:37, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Girth Summit: Sorry, forgot to ping. Deor (talk) 17:38, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Deor, hi - I think it was probably you who gave me advice on this last time I tried to do it. I'm afraid I'm still perplexed - Magnus' tool doesn't seem to be doing anything (I click run and nothing happens), and the 'basic upload' option doesn't give me a CC2.0 option - what to do? GirthSummit _(blether) 19:52, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Deor I think I cracked it, I did it manually, following the format of another file. Hope I haven't screwed it up :) Thanks GirthSummit _(blether) 10:10, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

@Girth Summit: Well done! For some reason, geograph2commons fails in that way on about 5% of pictures from Geograph. I've never managed to work out why. I've made one small change the the file, to change its name from c:File:Geograph-5942774-by-Jennifer-Petrie.jpg to c:File:Memoral to the Dunbar Soldiers taken prisoner at the Battle of Dunbar in 1650 (Geograph 5942774 by Jennifer Petrie).jpg. I did this because the original name didn't describe what's in the picture. It looks like the instructions on Geograph for transferring pictures don't work if you have the ImprovedUploadForm gadget enabled, as new Commons users do (but I didn't until recently). I'll see if I can find a way to fix this. --bjh21 (talk) 11:41, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Bjh21, thanks - I see you changed the file name at Battle of Dunbar (1650) too - very thorough, much appreciated! Did I get the coordinates right do you think? I did all that manually, copying the formatting from another image, hope it's how it's meant to be. Cheers GirthSummit _(blether) 11:45, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Draft guidance

Hi. I've made several revisions to Draft:David J. Zimmerman based on your feedback, and would appreciate your comments. Thanks. VictorMooney (talk) 15:58, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@VictorMooney: It looks like you've made a lot of good revisions. If no one here ends up reviewing, I'd just press the submit button so that it goes in the queue for review as part of the Articles for Creation process. Calliopejen1 (talk) 19:04, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Calliopejen1: Thank you. I don't mind letting it sit here for a bit. I hope to get it as clean as possible before submitting for review.VictorMooney (talk) 19:24, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@VictorMooney: I took a look at the article and reviewed the sources. I did a little maintenance cleanup. It would be nice if there was more biographical coverage, but the media coverage of his work seems to meet notability requirements. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 21:19, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@TimTempleton: Thank you. The biographical coverage I've found seems to be largely from - assorted blog posts, his own web site and commercial galleries. I'm not sure if those references would make the draft better, or rather, water it down. I've tried keeping the references I used to better recognized sources. What would you suggest? VictorMooney (talk) 21:40, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

I think it's good to go. Incidentally, I don't think you need a reliable, independent source for a claim that somebody was born in place X or got a first degree at college Y: unless the claim is outlandish -- born on South Georgia Island, first degree from the Royal University of Bhutan -- or disputed, you can take the biographee's word for it. (A doctorate is a different matter.) -- Hoary (talk) 22:23, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hoary: Thank you.VictorMooney (talk) 22:47, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Did Charles Porion die in 1868 or in 1908?

Sorry if I'm in the wrong place by the way, haven't exactly been here long.

There is conflicting information about this, even between language editions on Wikipedia. French and Spanish versions claim the latter date, whereas English claims the former. There is a source on the corresponding English article, but I don't have the language know-how and source evaluation skills to check whatever sources the Spanish and French have for the date and which one is the most authoritative. --85.76.101.85 (talk) 18:40, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Museo del Prado (should be authoritative) says "after 1868".[7] The French article doesn't seem to have any references for his death date. These two books also say after 1868.[8][9] Calliopejen1 (talk) 18:59, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, that cleared up the matter significantly. I edited the article accordingly. --85.76.101.85 (talk) 19:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Evidence for post 1868: He was still painting in 1876, he received the Legion of Honour in 1884. Christies, which appears to be the source of the current date, seems to be misled. The 1868 date seems linked only to his time at the Salon. I am not sure they are an authoritative source for this information. An equivalent French auction house says 1908[10]. This book attributes it to 1908, and is referring to art created between 1873 and '79[11]. Anyway, would likely need someone with access to one of those books. Koncorde (talk) 19:26, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

The Musee d'Orsay book is citing an [[École du Louvre] thesis written in 2003 which apparently concluded he died in 1908.[12] If Musee d'Orsay think that's correct, I think we should go with that. It postdates a lot of other references; perhaps new research has been done. I'll edit the article with a note about this. Calliopejen1 (talk) 20:39, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Calliopejen1 and Koncorde: A New York Times article dated 1906 about one of his paintings says he was already dead then. The Legion of Honour was awarded in 1884. So, the citable range seems to be 1884–1906, assuming the LoH was not awarded posthumously. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 08:44, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks Alan, a third date to look at! Koncorde (talk) 10:53, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

References

Google search returning talk page only

When I am searching on google "Shourya Deep" why is only "talk: Shourya Deep" is popping. Prakash mesra (talk) 20:31, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Prakash mesra: You edited a user page User:Shourya Deep which isn't indexed. The page has just been flagged for speedy deletion - its subject doesn't seem to be notable enough. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 20:51, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Shourya Deep is now a Wikipedia article, but there is a lag before it appears via a Google search. David notMD (talk) 00:15, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Seeing a deadlink- do I remove it?

Hi. When seeing a deadlink- (URL deleted/not working) and it ks not backed up at Wayback-Machine. Do I remove it altogether?Thhings6sz (talk) 21:53, 25 August 2020 (UTC) Thhings6sz (talk) 21:53, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Thhings6sz: Depends on where the link is. If it is in the external links section, then remove it. If it is a link for a reference/citation, then leave it there and mark it with {{dead link}}. See WP:LINKROT for more info. RudolfRed (talk) 22:08, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks. For example, this https://en.m.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=BioSLAX&diff=prev&oldid=974933528 did I do it properly?Thhings6sz (talk) 22:26, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Thhings6sz: You did it correctly, but the dead link was for Scribd, a commercial site, and clicking still took readers to Scribed.com. I deleted it and replaced it with the citation needed template. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 23:09, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks. Great lesson.Thhings6sz (talk) 23:56, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Use of Thesis in References

Hi, can we use a thesis as a reference for Wikipedia articles? I am currently drafting a Wikipedia article on a journalist and writer, and his work was covered and written about extensively in an Adelaide University's published thesis. Khwabeeda (talk) 22:20, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Please see WP:SCHOLARSHIP. -- Hoary (talk) 22:26, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks Khwabeeda (talk) 23:01, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Question on citing

So I just added the 10 articles of impeachment for the Impeachment inquiry against Mike DeWine. Since it is a list and a large section (All coming from the same source), how do I cite it? Thanks for help in advance. Elijahandskip (talk) 22:29, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

I commented on the article talk page. If there had not been an ongoing discussion, I would have immediately nominated the article for deletion and added one sentence and a redirect to the Mike Dewine article. The impeachment is pure political grandstanding and is not going to be anything but a waste of time. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 22:52, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

I mean it is still a moment in history that will be remembered about him. It isn't often that state governors have impeachment articles drawn up against them. Even though it won't be voted on, the history part is why I am keeping it an article for now. I agree it is COVID stupidity, however, it is still a moment in history. Same as how NFL players from 30 years ago have a 2-3 sentence article about them. They are a moment in history playing on a NLF team. Not going to argue with your opinion, but I would still like to know what is the best way to cite something that large. Elijahandskip (talk) 23:01, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

How to link to specific revisions using wikilinks?

This is a really basic question, but I'm wondering if I can reference specific revisions in wikilinks, specifically so I can link other revisions in edit summaries. For example, in this revision I tried to use wikitext for an external link to the relevant previous revision, but it doesn't get "linked" in the Wikitext, so I think I need to use a wikilink. But I'm not sure if it's possible to do that. Thank you! Suriname0 (talk) 22:36, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Suriname0. Yes. You can use the template {{oldid}}. If it is the difference from the previous version you want, there is template {{diff}}. --ColinFine (talk) 23:05, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Review

So I have re-submitted my draft, does it usually take this long for the draft to get reviewed since the first time I submitted my draft it only took a day for it to get reviewed. Thank you. EuniceR29 (talk) 01:13, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Courtesy Draft:Universiti Teknologi MARA Sarawak. Ther review process is not a queue. Reviewers look at the list and select what they want to review next. Can be days, but can be as long as months. You can continue to work on the draft while you wait. David notMD (talk) 01:42, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

I see. Thank you for the reply.  EuniceR29 (talk) 02:40, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

@EuniceR29: Many of the references are just bare URLs, which you should improve while you wait. See WP:ERB for the correct way to cite references. Note also that refs go after punctuation, not before it, unless it's necessary to distinguish that the ref applies just to the last word and not the whole sentence or clause. Please also see MOS:CURLY. I've corrected these issues in the draft at Special:Diff/974982328. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 02:16, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello and thank you for correcting the draft. So now I just need to edit the references?  EuniceR29 (talk) 02:40, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Advice from Teahouse hosts does not necessarily mean that a reviewer will approve the draft. The groups of volunteers (hosts and reviewers) are not connected. David notMD (talk) 12:22, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

How do you become a wiki controller

 Fat boi 2.9 (talk) 04:37, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Fat boi 2.9. You added this question and then you seem to have tried to remove it but created some formatting problems instead; so, I re-added your question. I'm not sure what you mean by wiki controller. Do you mean Wikipedia administrator? If that's the case, you can find out some more about the requirements for becoming an administrator in Wikipedia:Administrators and Wikipedia:Guide to requests for adminship. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:02, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Question about Sample Page and adding photos

Hi... I'm new here.. nice to be here. Might I ask when we are editing in Sample Page & we publish, does this then is public,.. or does it first have to be reviewed. Also I can't see where to add photos, probably on a different edit engine. ? Protea1111 (talk) 04:48, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Protea1111. By Sample Page, you seem to be referring to User:Protea1111/Sample page, and that's what Wikipedia refers to as a userspace draft for a potential Wikipedia:Article. All Wikipedia pages are public in the sense that any one can see them, but WP:ARTICLE and WP:DRAFTS are quite different. You might want to take a look at Wikipedia:The answer to life, the universe, and everything for some general information about the kinds of articles Wikipedia tends to accept. Help:Your first article and Help:Referencing for beginners are two other pages many new editors trying to create an article for the first time seem to find hjelpfu. You might also want to take a look at this how-to page created by a Wikipedia administrator named Ian.thomson since it contains lots of helpful suggestions as well. I also recommend that you take the Wikipedia:Adventure because you'll learn about Wikipedia editing while actually making edits to existing articles.

Drafts can be submitted to Wikipedia:Articles for creation for review, but I wouldn't suggest doing so now because your draft is almost certain to be declined. Submitting a draft for review is not required, but newish editors are encouraged to do so because it will give them a chance to receive feedback from other more experienced editors. Writing a proper Wikipedia article is pretty hard because there's lots of policies and guidelines that need to be met. Many first time editors immediately try to create article, only to see their work fairly quickly deleted for not be suitable for the article mainspace. This can be a bit discouraging when it happens which is why working on a draft and submitting it for review is suggested for editor who have yet to create many articles.

As for adding images to article, it can be a bit tricky at first, particularly when it comes to copyrights, etc., but it's not too hard to get the hang of. However, I would suggest that you first create a viable article and then worry about uploading images. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:27, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Help with a problematic string of persistent mass removal unsupported by Wikipedia standards done by a threatening editor who refuses to discuss and claims they are absolutely correct?

Serial Number 54129 (who I do not want to ping or have anybody here ping based on threatening comments made towards me, including a request to block me after mistakenly reporting this situation to Arbcom) has repeatedly removed mass amounts of content on List of My Hero Academia characters claiming the info to be unverifiable and original research, despite the content explicitly being stated by the material, and that statement being backed up by multiple other editors on the article talk page, which SN has not commented on since the beginning of the month. I recently made a DRN thread that was recently closed due to me and SN going into an uncivil back-and-forth exchange that again resulted in SN refusing to discuss after claiming that they were absolutely right and that I had no idea what I was talking about. However, I based on patterns shown by SN, I know that they will be back to removing the same content without discussion and ignoring the article talk page in a few weeks, and I want to know if there is anything to prevent that. I’m worried that they will end up casting more aspersions on me about “bulshitting admins” or “crufting”, and I’m scared that I’ll be wrongfully blocked or have the page wrongfully fully protected based on an overzealous and threatening editor removing content in a way that does is not supported by Wikipedia standards. Do I just revert their edits every time they do the same mass removal in a few weeks? I know ANI and DRN are not the right places to report this, as ANI directed me to the article talk page (where Serial Number refused to discuss) and DRN directed me to ANI (when I had already tried ANI and it boomeranged). I’m sorry if this isn’t the right place either, but I don’t want to have to every few weeks deal with constantly reverting mass removal unsupported by Wikipedia standards from somebody who would rather threaten me and claim they are right than discuss on the article talk page, I’m scared, and I have no idea how to handle this situation. Unnamed anon (talk) 06:05, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Pinging GorrillaWarfare and DESiegel since both are admins who have previously been involved in trying to sort this out.

@Unnamed anon: You don't need to be scared, but you might want to take a step back for a bit and let things cool down. My suggestion to you would be to continue discussing things on the article talk and continue working for a consensus in favor of the edit you want to make. No matter how right you know you are, reverting each other like this is going to be seen as edit warring and the two of you are likely going to end up being blocked. You might also want to consider self-reverting your last edit and propose that the change be made on the article's talk page. If you're able to estblish a consensus for the addtion, it will be added regardless of whether the other editor likes it, and they will be expected to honor the consensus or establish a new one in its place. If they choose to not discuss things or take a WP:BATTLEGROUND approach, then it will only reflect poorly on them. You're both close to WP:3RR right now and continuing on in this manner will almost certainly lead to both of you being blocked.

Finally, I think your understanding of WP:BRD is a little off. The BOLD edit was when you added the content the first time, not when the other editor reverted you. At that point, it probably would've been better to bring things to the article talk page. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:50, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

The main issue is that multiple other editors have agreed that the mass removal was inappropriate, and even afterwards, the other editor still removed the content, claiming that the material wasn’t verifiable when the anime and manga are both considered verifiable sources, and proceeding to tell me that I have no idea what I was talking about on the now-closed DRN thread. Their refusal to discuss on the article talk page keeps leading to them still reverting weeks later and giving me a threatening remark. It’s not just the edit warring or the refusal to discuss I’m afraid of, it’s also the threatening attitude. And how many editors does it take for a consensus, because I’ve been backed up by at least two other editors. Unnamed anon (talk) 07:10, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

A "threatening attitude" can indicate a behavioral problem and that would be better off discussed at WP:ANI. If it really bothers you and you're feeling WP:HARASSed, then that would be the best place to assistance. Before you go to ANI, however, you should look at WP:AOHA and WP:BOOMERANG because your behavior will be examined as well and you will be expected to provide specific examples of the other editor's behavior. There are very few Wikipedia saints amd pretty much everyone who edits alot gets frustrated at some point in time; so, if someone points out thngs that you could've done better, acknowledge their concerns and explain that you will try to do so. Heated discussions can be unpleasent for sure, but it's repeated behavior that is considered more problematic and likely to draw a stronger response.

There's no set number or editors required to establish a consensus, but generally the more the merrier. However, a local consensus cannot supercede a community-wide policy or guideline; so, a thousand editors saying it's OK on an article talk page to add a BLP violation to an article is not going to make it OK to add a BLP violation to the article. At the same time, a single editor claiming that certain content is a BLP violation when a thousand editors are saying it isn't is also just as unlikely to carry the day. If the other editor chooses not to participate in article talk page discussion, then you cannot make them do so; the other editor, however, cannot stop you and others from discussing things and reaching a consensus. Maybe trying to get others familiar with the subject matter involved in the discussion would be a good thing. Scroll up to the top of the article's talk page and see what WikiProject's it's scope falls under and then add {{Please see}} templates to the projects' talk pages. Since you dispute seems to involve and interpretation of WP:OR, it might also be a good idea to add a "Please see" template to WP:ORN as well. You might want to even consider a WP:RFC if you feel wider community input is necessary to resolve this. If other people are getting involved and they support the changes you want to make, then the other editor will have to reconsider their position or risk being sanctioned by the community. At the same time, if it turns out the consensus favors the other editor's position, then you will then have to accept that and move on. -- Marchjuly (talk) 08:04, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Transclude 2 or more tables from 1 article to another.

How would one transclude two or more "Series overview" tables from one article to another? I've used the onlyinclude /onlyinclude coding for both. But when I transclude the first table, the table appears with extra table coding below it. The second table simply won't appear (it still references the first table). How to I single each table out so that each can be viewed as planned? Do I have to name the "include" coding for each somehow? Are there samples I could be directed to? CYAce01 (talk) 06:24, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

@CYAce01: Yup, if I understand correctly. See WP:SELTRANS. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 07:14, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

 MaySundAnd (talk) 07:53, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

@AlanM1:That was exactly what I was looking for. Worked great. Thank you! CYAce01 (talk) 09:41, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

misrepresentation and biased and defaming editors especially to particular group of people doing racism

hey anyone who is reading this message i want to draw your attention on the two newly joined editors on wikipedia doing their propganda and defamotry work on the single article pageRajput ,the both editors named User:Heba Aisha and User:LukeEmily are from same team doing vandalism and spreading misinformation about a single article of an community group Rajput . both editors has done heavily edits on same page you can checklast 250 edit history last 250 edit history what they both have done till now from past month,they are adding the new references from propandas writers or paid writers just to malign the image of community . they are representing the references in such a way to spread the misinformation on page . both editors are far from neutrility and dedicating the entire time to just this single pageRajput . check the talk pages of both editors for more info ,you will see their propganda work and their contribution on this single page ,they also revert the other editors edits and they added a alot of references which can't be trusted from view of neurtility or good source ,they are also adding refernces in such a way that it looks genuine from first perspective but when you dig in deeper you will understand their racism toward a group of people . anyone who is reading this please must check the page history and both editors works and their join dates on wiki and what they are doing since day 1 to till now especially on a single page . wikipedia is a open source platform for betterment of society and providing free information to worldwide users ,few elements like these guys are maligning the image of the wikipedia platform. Loneltrussia (talk) 07:56, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

• on Rajput talk page discussion is going on you can put ur views there.Also for my contributions see my profile.Thank u very much.Heba Aisha (talk) 07:59, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

This is being discussed at WP:AN/EW; duplicating discussions is not helpful. You are welcome to add to the discussion there. -- Hoary (talk) 08:23, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

PDF: delete and as valid reference

 MaySundAnd (talk) 07:57, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

How can I delete this PDF-file, and does a PDF-file without a link count as a valid ref.?

Want to delete this one: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:CV_template.pdf?markasread=25687252&markasreadwiki=commonswiki

- May — Preceding unsigned comment added by MaySundAnd (talk • contribs) 08:00, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Commons:File:CV_template.pdf is hosted at Wikimedia Commons. As you view it there, you should see the option "Nominate for deletion" (or, if you are viewing it in Norwegian, something similar in Norwegian). Nominate it for deletion there, of course with a valid deletion rationale. It's a Wikimedia Commons matter, not a Wikipedia matter. If you want to delete it and also want to use it as a reference, then one of us doesn't understand something important. -- Hoary (talk) 08:15, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Potential vandalism/wrong citation

Hi everyone I recently came across a page which https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayurveda which misquotes a source to provide a potentially vandal/non-neutral view of the practice in general. Refer to line 2 of article of citation 3 which mentions that the practice is "quackery". Since there is protection applied to the article, I was wondering if any experienced editors could review this issue.

Thanks! 117.97.242.222 (talk) 08:26, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Please make a specific request/recommendation, and post it in Talk:Ayurveda. -- Hoary (talk) 08:32, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Stated in the source "acquaint doctors regarding specific provisions and orders barring quackery by unqualified people." medicine is mentioned "4 lakh belong to practitioners of Indian Medicine (Ayurvedic, Sidha, Tibb and Unani)." The claim is correct. GeraldWL ✉ 08:35, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

When do copyvios require revision deletion, and how do you go about requesting them?

I recently encountered this edit, which appeared to be a copyvio - [13]. I reverted it and notified the editor, but since this is my first time dealing with copyvios, I don't know if there was anything else I needed to do. WP:CV101 says that "If appropriate request revision deletion of the reverted edits" but I wasn't sure what the criteria for rev deletion are or where to place the request template? Additionally, should I have placed Template:Cclean on the article's talk page? Thanks, Darth Coracle (talk) 09:09, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

@Darth Coracle: basically, to request the removal, you want to add {{copyvio-revdel}} to the page. I strongely recommend that you use User:Enterprisey/cv-revdel for this, as this allows you to select the revisions from the history page, which makes things easier than manually searching for the version ids. Victor Schmidt (talk) 09:16, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Ah thanks; good to know. Darth Coracle (talk) 09:20, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

How to submit an article in Spanish wikipedia once I have it ready.

Hi Everyone! I have recently been declined an article in the English wikipedia as it was in Spanish, they referred me to the Spanish wikipedia site, where I included the article I'd like to submit for review, but I can't seem to find the option of submit. Please advise how to proceed.

Please see below: "Your submission at Articles for creation: sandbox (August 25)[editar código] AFC-Logo Decline.svgYour recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by NotTheFakeJTP was: The submission appears to be written in Spanish. This is the English Language Wikipedia; we can only accept articles written in the English Language. Please provide a high-quality English Language translation of your submission. Otherwise, you may write it in the Spanish Wikipedia. Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved. If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to User:EstudioMatildeMarin/sandbox and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window. If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to User:EstudioMatildeMarin/sandbox, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "{{Db-g7}}" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit. If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted. If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors. JTP (talk • contribs) 21:38, 25 August 2020 (UTC)" EstudioMatildeMarin (talk) 09:45, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

EstudioMatildeMarin, sorry to have to do this to you again, but Spanish and English Wikipedias are two entirely different and independent projects. How things work there, only those who edit there could tell you. It is possible but unlikely that someone who edits both the Spanish Wikipedia and this one will see this post before it is archived. You could look for a help desk at the Spanish Wikipedia itself, es:Wikipedia:Café/Archivo/Ayuda/Actual looks like one to me but I can't read Spanish very well. Usedtobecool ☎️ 10:24, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Browser for mobile

Dear fellow Wikipedians, What are the browsers that are supported for editing in mobile ? For laptop / desktop, Chrome is supported, but not for mobiie. Please help..... Cheers.... Anupam Dutta (talk) 09:47, 26 August 2020 (UTC) Anupam Dutta (talk) 09:47, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Anupamdutta73, I am not entirely sure what you mean. I use Wikipedia on Chrome in my android mobile phone all the time, though I don't make many mobile edits. Could you be more specific as to the nature of the problem you are having? Best, Usedtobecool ☎️ 10:29, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Anupamdutta73, I don't know if this will help, but I use the "official" Wikipedia app for Android. This allows you to edit an article in much the same way as you can when accessing Wikipedia via a browser. There is no equivalent of the "Edit source" tab at the top of the page, but each section within the article has a pencil icon next to which serves the same purpose. I don't think I would be comfortable doing any serious editing on a mobile screen with a small touch keypad, but it can be done. Mike Marchmont (talk) 12:13, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Usedtobecool and Mike Marchmont During the lockdown period, I didn't have access to my laptop.. I had to do it all on my mobile... Now every time I edit, I am reminded that I am not using a recognised browser.. so now,. looking for that elusive offical browser... By the way, my laptop is yet to have Bengali font.... So hope, you have got a hang of my problem (though not serious , but want peace of mind).... Cheers...... Anupam Dutta (talk) 12:59, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Help for blocking

Hey I'm a newcomer to wiki, How to block some Vandal user from editing that article ?? Anyone help please. Abhiraam.chyren (talk) 06:33, 26 August 2020 (UTC)Abhiraam.chyren

Moved from WT:Twinkle. SD0001 (talk) 10:04, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Abhiraam.chyren, is this about Sushant Singh Rajput? WP:AIV is the place to report vandals. However, there may be other steps you need to consider before reporting someone. So, it would help to know more about the particular editor or article you want to address. Regards! Usedtobecool ☎️ 10:38, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

leave me alone

how do I get you off of my computer. When I open it, it has a picture from you. It is irritating. Get off of my computer!!!!!!! 2601:280:4780:240:1D4F:1157:152B:CEC6 (talk) 13:11, 26 August 2020 (UTC)