Talk:Epic Meal Time

Original research

Can you explain to me why you added the original research tag in this edit? I don't see the issue there.

Also, in this edit, you said ""hip hop slang" is debatable and WP:OR without a source". I've re-added "hip-hop slang" and fixed the ref. It seems that either myself or someone else accidentally added information about the camera used before the ref, which confused things a bit. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 07:03, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

"Hip Hop Slang" was sourced, I removed it by error - the source was indeed there, it was just placed in the wrong spot. Whoops. ;)

With regards to the addition of what merchandise they've started selling - how is that not original research? It's not really even encyclopedic, and considering most websites sell something, not really notable for an encyclopedia either. There are no reliable sources reporting what specific shirts and slogans/logos they're selling - it references the website which is subject to change. While the cookbook and the iphone app are attributable to a WP:RS, the post about the t-shirts is not, therefore it's WP:OR until referenced with a reliable source. It's the same as posting about the contest section on the site (post your own Epic meal and win a shirt) or commenting on what Harley's facial hair is like, and using their website as a reference. Interesting, but ultimately not encyclopedic. --Yankees76 ^Talk 15:19, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

I think that it is important to include information regarding the t-shirts. From what I've gathered, you're not against the entire merchandising section, and clearly their store is an important aspect of merchandising. Considering their store seems to sell only t-shirts, it strikes me as deserving of at least a passing mention. I'm not sure why you think it's original research to say the store sells t-shirts, though, or to mention some of the slogans. The information is definitely verifiable, falling under the acceptable uses of WP:SELFPUB. There is no synthesis here, and no doubts have been raised over whether or not the store is actually selling those t-shirts. I don't view it as being unencyclopedic and, as I explained above, I think it's notable enough for inclusion. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 16:33, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

I disagree, merely being true, or even verifiable (self published or not), does not automatically make something suitable for inclusion in the encyclopedia. I realize that this article will have it's fair share of editors who are fans of Epic Meal Time and will add alot of indiscriminate, but ultimately unencyclopedic information to it. That's fine as it's bound to happen - the Trailer Park Boys article suffered the same fate when that show was popular. This is just one instance where that has happened here - I haven't gone through the article history to see what other nonsense was added.

Ultimately a popular show, whether it's TV or internet based, selling t-shirts is hardly worthy of a mention in an encyclopedia. The Big Bang Theory has shirts for sale on it's website - should we mention that in the article for that show too and link to the CBS website? Perhaps was the wrong tag - the section should probably have an {{Unencyclopedic}} or {{fancruft}} tag instead. --Yankees76 ^Talk 18:14, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

I guess I'm a bit confused as to why you've accepted the iPhone app and the cookbook for inclusion, but not the t-shirts. Have you looked at the ref for the iPhone app/cookbook? It mentions the t-shirts there as well. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 18:34, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Yes, and they also mention EMT toilet paper too. I'm surprised that hasn't made the article.

I think we both can tell quite easily that "No, but seriously" designates that as a joke. I'm not trying to add frivolous or joke information to this article, I'm simply trying to cover important aspects of what they do. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 19:02, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Knowing how some people argue on Wikipedia, one could say that he was just joking about the edible and cheese part of the toilet paper. I think the important aspect of what they do and the reason this article is considered notable is their weekly show. T-shirts, sunglasses, slogans and whatnot is frivolous and ultimately not encyclopedic.

I would propose the section be re-written to be a little more in line with the quality that is expected for Good Articles on this site.

In interviews Mortenstein and Toth have discussed the creation of a cookbook, and an iPhone app to go along with their other merchandising efforts that include branded T-Shirts. --Yankees76 ^Talk 18:45, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Would you be okay with:

Epic Meal Time currently sells a line of branded t-shirts. In interviews, Mortenstein and Toth have also discussed the creation of a cookbook and an iPhone app.

I feel like it flows a little better, and is more clear that the t-shirts are currently being sold, while the app and cookbook are still in the works. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 18:59, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

I'd be fine with that. I think the removal of the slogans helps and will prevent the paragraph from growing everytime the group releases a new shirt (ie: Sauce Boss), and being rewritten every time they sell out etc. --Yankees76 ^Talk 19:10, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Great, I've replaced it. Thanks for working with me on this. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 19:19, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

"Likens" vs. "describes"

I know this is incredibly nitpicky, but wouldn't MadSammyboy's edit changing "Morenstein likens his show as "Jackass in the kitchen"" to "Morenstein describes his show as "Jackass in the kitchen"" be better? "Likens as" sounds odd to me. Usually I only hear "liken to", but "Morenstein likens his show to "Jackass in the kitchen"" sounds bizarre as well. I'm just checking to avoid any edit wars, etc. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 23:00, 28 April 2011 (UTC)

Yes, it's incredibly nitpicky. By definition likens means "to see or represent as the same or similar; compare", that's exactly what the reliable source does[1] It didn't "describe" them as Jackass in the kitchen, it says it is, Morenstein admits, Jackass in the Kitchen, right down to the logo: a skull with a pot on its head, and two kitchen knives forming the crossbones. Therefore - "to see or represent as the same" or "likens" Likens them to or likens them as would probably require weigh in by someone with a bit more formal copyediting training. The article for Maxis uses "likens them as" in the lead.

BTW - Am I going to have to defend every edit I make to this article to you on the talk page? If so, let me know, and I'll start a thread for each one to get your approval first so I don't waste more time making the edits in the first place. This is becoming tedious, and considering the triviality of the content that is being discussed and challenged on here (and some of the major and well sourced information that was missing from the article previously while such non-notable topics were being discussed), I suspect that both of our time could probably be spent on more important issues than T-shirt sales and one word edits. --Yankees76 ^Talk 12:52, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

In order to avoid a further 10 or 15 post discussion, I've changed the copy to reflect the the exact text from the Montreal Gazette.--Yankees76 ^Talk 13:06, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

The new wording seems fine to me. I'm not sure if the question here is whether or not you'll have to defend your edits to me, or if others will have to defend theirs to you. I don't understand why you reverted the edit by MadSammyboy when, in my opinion, it made the article flow better. I know this was a nitpicky point to bring up, and I apologize if you feel it's a waste of your time. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 13:39, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

I think the explanation above as to the definition of the word "likens" explains the rationale behind the revert quite well. Not every non-vandalism edit is an improvement. --Yankees76 ^Talk 14:13, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Wow- I didn't mean to stir anything up here. I was just reading the article and thought the wording 'likens as' was a little awkward. The essential definition of 'liken' is 'compare', and the preposition 'to' works better with 'compare' than does 'as' (which carries a meaning similar to 'like'- 'likens like' is awkward). However, it doesn't hurt my feelings if that doesn't work for everyone, and the way the article reads now seems pretty good. Sorry for the trouble! - MadSammyboy

Notability

I know he's gotten a bit of attention lately but come on...I knew the guy when he was "just a substitute high school teacher"...it wasn't that long ago, and he'll probably go back to doing something like that when this fizzles out. Jmajeremy (talk) 21:59, 14 May 2011 (UTC)

This article meets the notability requirements. Epic Meal Time has been covered in many reliable sources, including being featured on Leno. It has also won a Shorty Award, a well-known award. (See WP:WEB.) Also, notability is not temporary. Regardless of who he was or may be in the future, the subject is notable enough. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 03:50, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

Jmajeremy - this isn't an article about just one individual. This is an article about a Internet Phenomenon that meets Wikipedia's notability guidelines under WP:WEB. Even if it "fizzles out" as was noted, notability is not temporary. --Yankees76 ^Talk 16:15, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

"Muscles Glasses" vs. "MusclesGlasses"

I believe I've reverted the change from "Muscles Glasses" to "MusclesGlasses" three times now. I looked through every single one of the existing references, and all of the ones that mention him refer to him as "Muscles Glasses", including the space: [2], [3], [4], [5]. I tried to look for a source that used "MusclesGlasses", but found little. I couldn't find a mention of him on the official site, and other sources using that appear to be mostly unreliable. If there's a good reason to change from "Muscles Glasses" to "MusclesGlasses" (i.e. one supported by reliable sources), do let me know. Otherwise, it should stay as it is. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 21:21, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

Hey, I didn't realize it was a point of contention here. "MusclesGlasses" is used in the youtube video description for the episode "Sugar Shack." I haven't seen it written anywhere else by the EMT crew. 216.165.20.98 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 11:19, 23 May 2011 (UTC).

But by all means, if you have a good source that differs, keep it reverted. The Epic Meal Time youtube description I mentioned is ungrammatical itself: "We head to MusclesGlasses birthplace... and eat." However, the video does also state: "Somewhere deep in Quebec... lies the birthplaces of MusclesGlasses." Normally I don't think it'd matter all that much, but fans seem to get the name wrong far more often than they get it right, with most of the youtube comments I've seen using some variant of "muscle glasses" instead of the plural. He is a main character, so it'd be helpful for the wiki page to get it straight. Maybe a footnote? 216.165.20.98 (talk) 13:28, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Well, the four sources I mentioned above all refer to him as "Muscles Glasses" with the space. I agree that the EMT crew referring to him as "MusclesGlasses" in that YouTube description could be a source to support it as one word, but I'm finding no reliable mention other than that. Furthermore, two of the sources that refer to him as "Muscles Glasses" with the space are interviews with the EMT guys. I feel like they would be especially careful to get the name right in an interview, since the guys would be right there with them. Also, Muscles Glasses' own YouTube channel uses the space: [6]. I'll add some inline citations from the existing sources to support "Muscles Glasses" with a space, unless some other, better sources turn up. – GorillaWarfare ^{talk • contribs} 14:28, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Alright, sounds good. I didn't even know he had his own channel - I just remembered the one video and assumed that the spelling in the article was the result of all the different misspellings being so prevalent. I could have avoided causing extra work by not being such a lazy wiki user, but alas, my editing is pretty much limited to drive-by grammar/spelling fixes and removal of blatantly NPOV material that irks me. "Muscles Glasses" definitely sounds like the right way to go. 216.165.20.98 (talk) 22:29, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

His Facebook account[7] does not use the space, but his Twitter account does [[8]]. I think at this point, just go with how it is printed in reliable sources. --Yankees76 ^Talk 14:06, 24 May 2011 (UTC)