Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates
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All articles linked in the ITN template must pass our standards of review. They should be up-to-date, demonstrate relevance via good sourcing and have at least an acceptable quality. Nomination steps
The better your article's quality, the better it covers the event and the wider its perceived significance (see WP:ITNSIGNIF for details), the better your chances of getting the blurb posted.
Headers
Voicing an opinion on an itemFormat your comment to contain "support" or "oppose", and include a rationale for your choice. In particular, address the notability of the event, the quality of the article, and whether it has been updated. Please do...
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April 20
April 20, 2021
(Tuesday)
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RD/Blurb : Idriss Déby
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb: President of Chad Idriss Déby dies of injuries at the age of 68. (Post)
News source(s): France 24
Credits:
- Nominated by Hektor (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Uses x (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Hektor (talk) 11:01, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment The death of a national leader is blurb-worthy, but four citations are needed. The details are also very light right now with only the army spokesperson confirming the death, so I suggest waiting for confirmation anyway. Uses x (talk • contribs) 11:06, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Weak support, my weak stands on need to expansion of his assassination when information is available but definitely important. A president on the frontline of battle? Unthinkable in the West. Also, a wikilink to Northern Chad offensive (2021) could be made. CoryGlee (talk) 11:05, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support but Wait, The details about assassination are very low. Several citations are required. Working on it now. Definitely blurb worthy Sitaphul (talk) 11:08, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb pending further update. Looks like confirmed. Africa Report and RIA Novosti report it, too. Brandmeistertalk 11:08, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb Death of a sitting head of state who has held the office for 30 years is a no-brainer for a blurb.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 11:11, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment All the non-French sources couch his death as "[...] states a spokesman for the army". The French source (presumably working closer to the scene) describe his death as "on the way to the front lines". If he were wounded in actual combat, this should definitely be blurbed with a desciption of the circumstances. Article quality is a tad off, but not much so.130.233.213.199 (talk) 11:24, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD only He is unknown in many countries around the world outside Chad despite having head of state for 30 years. But i believe it can be posted as RD instead. 36.77.95.2 (talk) 11:31, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- That he is possibly unknown to some is not relevant at all. Sitting head of state dies in office, certainly a blurb once the quality is sufficient. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 11:33, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
RD/Blurb: Walter Mondale
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb: Former Vice President of the United States Walter Mondale dies at the age of 93. (Post)
News source(s): CBS
Credits:
- Nominated by Purplebackpack89 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
pbp 01:02, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Some orange tags that need addressing. Would support a blurb when fixed. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 01:07, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb the only reason he would be considered for a blurb is having been US Vice President, and the article spends only 2 paragraphs addressing that tenure. I think most people know him better for losing to Reagan. User:力 (power~enwiki, π, ν) 01:15, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Walter Mondale was an important part of American history as Jimmy Carter's Vice President. If Wikipedia puts Alcee Hastings on "Recent Deaths", they should put him on "Recent Deaths" at least. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Djprasadian (talk • contribs) 01:40, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- NB first edit today, 2nd edit overall Bumbubookworm (talk) 02:17, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Hi Bumbubookworm. I think it would be a lot better for community-building to welcome this new user instead of obliquely casting aspersions. --MZMcBride (talk) 05:12, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- NB first edit today, 2nd edit overall Bumbubookworm (talk) 02:17, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Djprasadian, please see the notice at the bottom of the tan box. Thank you. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 05:52, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Severely lacking in citations. Entire sections are unreferenced. Mlb96 (talk) 01:42, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb when ready. Lots of coverage including a lengthy NYT obit demonstrating a lasting impact on U.S. politics from his time as VP and his 1984 campaign. Also, the last former VPOTUS to die was George H. W. Bush (November 30, 2018), and the last non-president VP to die was Spiro Agnew (September 17, 1996), so even if we blurbed every VP it would hardly increase the number of death-blurbs per year. Davey2116 (talk) 01:45, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb article is decent now, clearly a significant person worthy of a blurb. Elli (talk | contribs) 01:47, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Strong oppose blurb per recent problems with blurbs. Former presidents, yes, but vice presidents, unless they established their own legacy, absolutely not. RD would be fine, but as noted there are quality problems, so Oppose RD until those are fixed. --Masem (t) 02:03, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Many paragraphs missing citation. Hanamanteo (talk) 02:07, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Not all the paragraphs you tagged with {{citation needed}} actually were problematic, for example Special:Diff/1018821796. Elli (talk | contribs) 02:12, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Strong oppose blurb as not at the top of his field (politics), and no specific ground-breaking policy reforms disclosed Oppose RD on present quality Bumbubookworm (talk) 02:16, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Strong support blurb -- are we really going to argue that the consort to the Queen of England, who's only contribution to the nation was fathering future royalty, deserved a blurb, but the Vice President of the United States does not? -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 02:17, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- I think you need to read Prince Phillip's article if you believe that's actually true. Uses x (talk • contribs) 08:32, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb, support RD. Mondale simply does not clear the high bar of prominence for a blurb, in my opinion. — Goszei (talk) 02:24, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb. I can see the argument, and he has more merit than a few other major presidential losers (or Quayle, if you want to talk VPs), but ultimately I don't really think he cuts enough of a profile. His term was brief and not terribly action-packed, and while he did elevate the significance of the office, he was hardly Cheney. And I doubt news services are rushing to blast the TVs with 24/7 coverage of his death. Nohomersryan (talk) 03:00, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Never met Mondale, but Dan Quayle is a great guy. Doesn't qualify for RD though, because he's not dead. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 04:35, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Old Man Dies, 40 years after fading away. RD, though, sure. Maybe not today, or tomorrow...but whenever it's ready. InedibleHulk (talk) 04:01, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose A lot of unreferenced paragraphs. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 04:35, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- The opposes related to article quality make no sense to me. Part of the purpose of highlighting these articles on the Main Page is so they get additional views and edits. That's how Wikipedia was and is built. --MZMcBride (talk) 05:16, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- By the letter of the law, though, that template says ITNRD rules. And it says "sufficient quality" is up to a "consensus of commenters". So if you think it's good enough already, saying so is considerable enough. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:28, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- It's also the requirement of any content that is featured (read: bolded) on the main page. Having numerous "citation needed" tags among other warnings is not an example of our best work. --Masem (t) 05:37, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- The purpose of the main page is to showcase Wikipedia's finest work. Putting this article on the main page in its current state would be embarrassing. Mlb96 (talk) 05:39, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- By the letter of the law, though, that template says ITNRD rules. And it says "sufficient quality" is up to a "consensus of commenters". So if you think it's good enough already, saying so is considerable enough. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:28, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- This is in fact precisely what we shouldn't do. The Main Page is the most outside-facing page we have; the elbow grease required to get articles to a presentable level can go on behind the scenes. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 05:49, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb and oppose RD on quality four years acting as a personal assistant in one country on the globe basically achieving nothing. Littered with tags, nowhere near good enough at this stage. Of course, we had Death and funeral of Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh so one supposes we will have Death and funeral of Walter Mondale too, demonstrating the relative significance of their deaths.... The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 09:07, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD Four years acting, not as a personal assistant, but as a strong voice in the one of the most influential nations on the globe. Article is good enough for a RD, maybe not a blurb. The anti-American sentiment is showing on Wikipedia, we should have less of this. Mondale was also a much more influential figure than say a royal consort, basically changing the concept of Vice President in America. Article only needs a few touch ups. reallylazy 08:23, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD only, subject to referencing issues being addressed. Mjroots (talk) 07:35, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb. I also opposed the blurb for prince Philip, on its own merits and because it would set open the floodgates. This one also falls way below the "top of his field" (politics). Important, sure, but not really long term influential or world changing in the field. Fram (talk) 08:01, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD only. Major American political figure, but not one of exceptional international significance. Wizardoftheyear (talk) 08:25, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb VP isn't important enough for a blurb (same as how I believe Prince Phillip wasn't). Oppose RD on quality for now, way too many cn tags need resolving. Joseph2302 (talk) 08:30, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose: Mate, the article is in a really poor state, hardly fitting for the MP. ——Serial 08:32, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose for now. 18 citations needed, and I can't verify anything under 'Apollo 1 accident (1967)', with the existing citations being from a now-dead audio documentary. I shouldn't be the first one to spot this if the article is getting support to post, as I'd expect existing statements to be verified before it gets any kind of support. Uses x (talk • contribs) 08:59, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose RD for now, as per Uses x. And Oppose blurb. Wasn't he married to Betty Ford??[FBDB] Martinevans123 (talk) 09:45, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb I don't think a former vice-president and a presidential candidate who is (in)famous for his utter defeat merits a blurb. There's also not much ado about his death in the media.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 10:08, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD only. Made history when he chose a female vice-presidential candidate, but time fades. -- Alanscottwalker (talk) 10:28, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Not ready for RD - numerous unreferenced paragraphs and even those with references often have just one citation at the end of a long paragraph. Oppose blurb as nowhere near significant enough. Modest Genius talk 10:39, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD, oppose blurb Article quality is good enough for RD, but he really is not getting the level of media coverage necessary for somebody who isn't covered under ITNR to get a blurb. ( Prince Phillip had way more coverage than Mondale is getting, and even he barely got a blurb.)Jackattack1597 (talk) 10:55, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose RD Eight unsourced paragraphs remaining that are tagged.—Bagumba (talk) 11:22, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb, support RD It is being unknown outside the United States, notably in non-English-speaking countries and the Commonwealth. 36.77.95.2 (talk) 11:34, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
April 19
April 19, 2021
(Monday)
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(Posted) Miguel Díaz-Canel
Blurb: Miguel Díaz-Canel (pictured) is elected First Secretary of the Communist Party of Cuba, succeeding Raúl Castro. (Post)
News source(s): RTÉ
Credits:
- Nominated by Uses x (talk · give credit)
- Updated by CoryGlee (talk · give credit)
Article updated
The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.
Nominator's comments: He has been formally elected to the position now. All three articles have citations needed before it can be posted. Uses x (talk • contribs) 15:41, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment ITN/R. Article is short but passible, one CN tag though. The problem with states like Cuba is the lack of transparency around the general secretary election process. --LaserLegs (talk) 16:58, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support: election (or rather, selection) of head-of-state as per WP:ITNR. Osunpokeh (talk) 17:00, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support though I would use "selected" rather than "elected" since it was an election only among the members of the body of the CP of Cuba, not the general public. But still that meets ITNR per the previous ITNC on Castro. --Masem (t) 17:14, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- If the CPC and the CPSU are any indication, these will get far more interesting the farther Cuba gets from the original dynasty --LaserLegs (talk) 17:23, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support change of head of state is ITNR, article is decent enough. Joseph2302 (talk) 17:25, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Looks good to go. Hanamanteo (talk) 18:18, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Very important movement and article is pretty accurate. Alsoriano97 (talk) 19:19, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Article quality is fine. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 19:25, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Weak oppose Due to article quality only, which is so bad grammar. elsewhere it is look so significant to be posted. 36.77.95.2 (talk) 20:26, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Is this supposed to be ironic? The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:30, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Or iconic? – Sca (talk) 20:54, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Regardless of that my opinion, it can be posted because this blurb is ready, thanks. 36.77.95.2 (talk) 21:51, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Or iconic? – Sca (talk) 20:54, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Is this supposed to be ironic? The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:30, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted Stephen 00:17, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) Mars Ingenuity (helicopter)
Blurb: NASA's Ingenuity helicopter (pictured) makes the first ever controlled flight on another planet (Post)
Alternative blurb: The Ingenuity helicopter (pictured) flies on Mars, the first powered flight of a spacecraft on another planet
News source(s): The Independent, BBC
Credits:
- Nominated by Dumelow (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Chinakpradhan (talk · give credit)
Article needs updating
Nominator's comments: We featured this article when it first landed but this seems like a significant step. Article not yet updated - Dumelow (talk) 11:14, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support interesting bit of science news, article is in good shape, lots of great images too. --LaserLegs (talk) 11:20, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support in principle, though the article only has a one-sentence update so far. Could do with fleshing that out a bit, though it's getting heavily edited so hopefully that won't take long. I've added an altblurb (the first controlled flight was in 1985, this is the first powered flight). Modest Genius talk 11:42, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support precisely the kind of thing we should be posting at ITN. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 11:48, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support a fairly major scientific breakthrough. --Aknell4 (talk • contribs) 11:59, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb The original blurb is nice and sweet. The alt blurb, though more accurate (or rather, more detailed), doesn't seem like a headline. This news is quite interesting and the Wikipedia article is extremely good too. --Sitaphul (talk) 12:03, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support as one of the "firsts", it belongs at ITN. Doesn't hurt that it's a positive story too amidst all the misery going on now. --cart-Talk 12:04, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support "Flies on Mars"! Who'd have thought it. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:10, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted. I've added "On Mars." Jehochman Talk 12:26, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Sumitra Bhave
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ref
Credits:
- Nominated by Dharmadhyaksha (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Yojang (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Please note that the article is on the duo Bhave and Sukthankar. Care to be taken to only mention Bhave's name when displayed on main page. §§Dharmadhyaksha§§ {Talk / Edits} 08:39, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment - @Dharmadhyaksha, The article seems well sourced and would surely be eligible for posting if it was on Sumitra Bhave only. I'm not sure of the protocol for duo, and in my knowledge it hasn't been done before. The Rambling Man, do you know what to do in this scenario. In my view, the best course of action is to create two separate pages and then post. -Sitaphul (talk) 10:58, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Just for sake of posting, i don't agree with forking out pages. And are you suggesting we keep repeating same info on two pages because it was to stay on main page for 2 days? There are plenty duos who dont have to die together to be placed on main page. §§Dharmadhyaksha§§ {Talk / Edits} 11:16, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment. This may be an WP:IAR situation if she would not merit a standalone article. 331dot (talk) 11:00, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment, there is flexibility in this. We posted "Roy Horn" in May 2020 and "Siegfried Fischbacher" in January 2021 linking to Siegfried & Roy, for example - Dumelow (talk) 11:18, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Good example of IAR on non-standalone articles (bad examples being usually crime articles). Article seems well sourced, 'ographies in good order, well composed.130.233.213.199 (talk) 11:26, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Eligibility comment Re: members of a group per WP:ITNRD:
Individuals who do not have their own article but who have significant coverage on an article about a group (e.g. one member of a musical group) are eligible for a recent deaths entry on a case-by-case basis.
—Bagumba (talk) 11:49, 19 April 2021 (UTC) - Support - Checking the in the news candidates page is always fun. You get to know more things about Wikipedia and about current affairs around the world. But I digress. Since all of you have clarified that this nomination is possible, you have my support. Sitaphul (talk) 11:58, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. Article looks good and meets the hygiene expectations for homepage / RD. Posting Admin might have to pipe accordingly. Marking ready. Ktin (talk) 17:11, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted Stephen 00:24, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
April 18
April 18, 2021
(Sunday)
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RD: Wayne Peterson
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Washington Post
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Bloom6132 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Only announced and reported today (April 18). —Bloom6132 (talk) 02:46, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
RD: Iain Gallaway
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Radio New Zealand; The Dominion Post
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Bloom6132 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Bloom6132 (talk) 17:30, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Brief, but thorough, and referenced.130.233.213.199 (talk) 11:30, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
European Super League
Blurb: In association football, twelve clubs from England, Italy and Spain announce the formation of a breakaway European Super League. (Post)
Alternative blurb: In association football, Arsenal, Atlético Madrid, Barcelona, Chelsea, Inter Milan, Juventus, Liverpool, Manchester City, Manchester United, Milan, Real Madrid and Tottenham Hotspur announce a breakaway European Super League.
Alternative blurb II: In association football, twelve clubs from England, Italy and Spain announce the formation of a breakaway European Super League amidst large condemnation and disapproval by FIFA, UEFA, ECA and other football associations.
News source(s): Guardian BBC
Credits:
- Nominated by Smurrayinchester (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Nominator's comments: The clubs are threatened with disqualification from their national leagues and from the UEFA Champions League - if that happens, that should definitely be part of the blurb, but so far it's just a threat. Smurrayinchester 07:26, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- I'd say let's wait a bit since this story is developing fast. --Tone 07:33, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
WaitIf this becomes official, then this would be a really obvious thing to post, but I don't think we've crossed that line yet, despite what the announcement said. NorthernFalcon (talk) 08:48, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Changing vote to Support given the reaction this announcement has generated, with responses from high-level governmental officials. NorthernFalcon (talk) 03:05, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose for now. It's a huge European-wide sporting prospect which is upsetting a vast number of people (even causing the UK PM to comment) so it's certainly newsworthy, but at this stage it needs to be paused until it's all in place and actually a reality. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 08:56, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait Obvious ITN post if it happens, but an announcement isn't equivalent to it actually happening. Black Kite (talk) 09:42, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait there will likely be some ramifications of this which will become ITN worthy. Joseph2302 (talk) 09:52, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose because the bold article does not explain why this is significant. This is your pan-continental competition right? It's supposed to "replace" the champions league? Like the EPL isn't going away, this is the thing the top three EPL and whatever other country teams play at the end of the season to decide who is bestest? But it's not the conference cup? What is actually going on here? Y'all Europeans lose your minds over this soccer business and if it's in the news we ought post it (instead of whining about it being parochial or some nonsense) but you can't just assume people are going to understand it. "Obvious" indeed. Is this another XFL (2001)? --LaserLegs (talk) 10:49, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Don't be daft, it's not "pan-continental", the clue is in the name "European". It's not replacing anything, it's another league competition. If you read the article it would help you understand. It's hardly "parochial" as it is about the world's most popular sport across a continent. But hey, don't worry, we're bound to get another riot/shooting nomination in the next few days to get us back on track. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 10:53, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- I did read the article, but it doesn't explain the hysteria. This is a case where the controversy is the story, and the target needs a "Controversy" story otherwise it's just more soccer bother. Yes, very Euro-parochial I agree. Proposals for a European Super League in association football is an orange tagged mess that did a better job explaining the outrage than the current bold linked article. --LaserLegs (talk) 10:56, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Answer this for me: Does Manchester United and Liverpool FC leave the EPL to play in this super league or is it just another end-of-season romp like the champions league? --LaserLegs (talk) 10:57, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Nobody know, which is why it's too soon to post. There will likely be some ramifications from it, and those ramifications may well be ITN worthy at that time. Joseph2302 (talk) 11:00, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Fair enough, just remember you have to make it make sense for Canadians and other countries that don't know or care about soccer. If the teams that routinely dominated the Champions League are breaking away to form their own version of the exact same thing then there has to be a reason and the article needs to explain it. If they're bailing on their national leagues to form a continental league without relegation, well, that's what happens when you let Americans into the cupboard --LaserLegs (talk) 11:06, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- No, we don't have to make it make sense to people who don't care about it, that's not the point of ITN. Your discourse here is all very interesting but as you can see, we don't have the detail and we don't have any consensus to post, so perhaps focus all that nervous energy on improving some articles? The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 11:46, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- It's not the point of ITN, it's the point of Wikipedia and the article isn't "minimally comprehensive" unless it explains the significance. That's just how it is I'm afraid. --LaserLegs (talk) 13:02, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- In case you didn't notice, there's no consensus to post. You're raging against the wrong item. Still, plenty of articles to improve, like XFL (2001), have at them! The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 13:11, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- It'll go up, it probably should go up, once the significance of the new league it's clarified in the target article I'll even withdraw my oppose. --LaserLegs (talk) 13:33, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- In case you didn't notice, there's no consensus to post. You're raging against the wrong item. Still, plenty of articles to improve, like XFL (2001), have at them! The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 13:11, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- It's not the point of ITN, it's the point of Wikipedia and the article isn't "minimally comprehensive" unless it explains the significance. That's just how it is I'm afraid. --LaserLegs (talk) 13:02, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- No, we don't have to make it make sense to people who don't care about it, that's not the point of ITN. Your discourse here is all very interesting but as you can see, we don't have the detail and we don't have any consensus to post, so perhaps focus all that nervous energy on improving some articles? The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 11:46, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Fair enough, just remember you have to make it make sense for Canadians and other countries that don't know or care about soccer. If the teams that routinely dominated the Champions League are breaking away to form their own version of the exact same thing then there has to be a reason and the article needs to explain it. If they're bailing on their national leagues to form a continental league without relegation, well, that's what happens when you let Americans into the cupboard --LaserLegs (talk) 11:06, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Nobody know, which is why it's too soon to post. There will likely be some ramifications from it, and those ramifications may well be ITN worthy at that time. Joseph2302 (talk) 11:00, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Don't be daft, it's not "pan-continental", the clue is in the name "European". It's not replacing anything, it's another league competition. If you read the article it would help you understand. It's hardly "parochial" as it is about the world's most popular sport across a continent. But hey, don't worry, we're bound to get another riot/shooting nomination in the next few days to get us back on track. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 10:53, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose as, err, not actually being a thing. ——Serial 10:56, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. This is A Big Deal for European soccer. Major ramifications especially for the game in England. The story is still developing but the big event is its announcement with 12 clubs. I can't see anything other than its collapse fundamentally changing the item we'd post (apart from increases on the 12 number which is easy to implement). This has happened now and that's noteworthy, it's less good for ITN to retroactively decide there's been sufficient ramifications a few days later. --LukeSurl t c 11:03, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait Timing of the announcement suggests muscle flexing in view of the proposed reformed Champions League, which would have come into effect from 2024. Under the proposals, 36 teams would play in one league in a “Swiss model” - with each team playing 10 games. A knockout stage would then follow. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:10, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose - As far as I can tell, it's currently a proposal. If a league is actually formed, competitive matches take place and/or football authorities such as FIFA and UEFA take action, such as kicking the clubs involved out of their leagues, then we can revisit this. Mjroots (talk) 11:31, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment There's talk of clubs being kicked out of the Premier League today. As I'm not going to be on Wiki for a fair while from ~09:00 UTC, should this happen, then my !vote can be considered a Support. Mjroots (talk) 06:46, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Neutral. This is huge news for the sport, and a massive controversy. But I do wonder if it's actually going to happen, or if it gets negotiated away... As they're talking about starting this August, I can see a case for waiting until the first game happens. On the other hand, the article is a decent introduction to the topic and there's huge reader interest, so posting now would also be acceptable. Hence my !vote. Modest Genius talk 11:50, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- The more I think about this, the more I wonder if it's a threat to force UEFA to renegotiate the new Champions League format. If so, it's possible it never happens, though perhaps the two sides are already irreconcilable. I'm leaning more towards wait to see if it actually happens or was just a very big bluff. Modest Genius talk 14:16, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment - I'm from a country which isn't football crazy. I didn't quite understand what was the reason for the split - it's not mentioned clearly in any of the related articles. But I'm not denying its significance. Such a split definitely would be a turning point in any sport - it would be big news if that happened in my country's favourite sport league. The Wikipedia page would be much better if someone wrote the reason for the split. Thanks. --Sitaphul (talk) 12:10, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment At what point should this story be posted? The first day of play, or the first point in which one of the domestic leagues expels an ESL member, which would be appealed by the most prominent lawyers in the world? The only big new league I can remember in the Wikipedia age is cricket's Indian Premier League, was that posted? In any case, that was a completely different kettle of fish, as all the teams were new. Unknown Temptation (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- A perusal of the article's talk page shows that the Indian Premier League was not posted at ITN. Mjroots (talk) 12:39, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- IPL wasn't a breakaway of existing clubs to form their own league - it was a new competition in a new format of the sport, founded by the existing national authority with new franchises. We had no idea how important it was going to become years later. I can't think of a good parallel to the current situation, where existing clubs are founding their own competition outside the current national and continental structure, but still trying to remain in the other competitions. Modest Genius talk 12:47, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- A perusal of the article's talk page shows that the Indian Premier League was not posted at ITN. Mjroots (talk) 12:39, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. This European Super League is the biggest sports story of the year so far. The formation of any league would not make the requirements to be post in ITN, but with how much there is at stake, the widespread opposition, and the influence of the team and clubs in the league, it should be posted. Not only the clubs would be affected, but players will also, with as of right now being banned from all international competitions. Also, with an actual article for the Super League up, which looks well referenced, the first blurb is ready to be posted. --Awestruck1 13:54, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait as others have suggested. If the league is actually formed, it does appear significant and will impact assc. football in Europe, but this is a planned announcement and could be a negotiation tactic at this stage. --Masem (t) 13:58, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. This certainly seems like a big deal, given all the press coverage it has received. As for waiting to post, I'm not entirely sure what we are actually waiting for. It appears the 12 teams are not merely proposing this league, they have already formed it, though games might not start for a few months. -- Calidum 14:12, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Article is of sufficient quality; legitimate news sources are currently covering this story in sufficient depth. That checks all of the boxes. --Jayron32 14:21, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment The way this goes, we may as well end up with posting "PSG wins the UEFA Champions League after the other three teams are disqualified for joining the Super League". Since the Champions League is ITNR ;) --Tone 14:21, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait. Even though this story is major enough to be picked up by NPR's Morning Edition (when that program typically doesn't feature sports stories in general), there's still all the details to work out. (E.g. there's lots of money, but we don't even know how media rights will shake out.) rawmustard (talk) 14:23, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support if it's actually happening akin to the formation of the Premier League. – John M Wolfson (talk • contribs) 16:51, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment I think the blurb has to include something about the condemnation of the idea by FIFA, UEFA, ECA, the domestic football associations and even politicians because it makes bigger news. I've therefore added another alternative blurb.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 17:58, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support regardless - the story is either a new major sports league or international government condemnation at the attempt, or both. Both would be worthy alone. Kingsif (talk) 18:37, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose there's no guarantee this will actually go ahead.-- P-K3 (talk) 18:49, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait with the governing bodies actively against this, it's hard to really specify what has happened at this stage. GreatCaesarsGhost 19:05, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Any announcement, in any field, broadly construed. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 19:17, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. It's a huge story now, e.g. the top international story here in Denmark. It will probably gradually get less attention with some fluctuations. Don't wait for a threshold event at a time with less interest. It may or may not actually happen but the blurbs correctly say "announce". The 12 announced teams include 6 of the 7 non-American teams on Forbes' list of the most valuable sports teams, 9 of the top-10 at Forbes' list of the most valuable football clubs, and all 12 are in the top-18. They may all be disqualifed from national leagues and other international competitions if they go ahead, and the players may be disqualified from national teams, seriously weakening many countries in their most popular sport where continental and World championships are enormous events. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:44, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support - Do you know how immensely hard it is for European soccer to make news -- let alone front-page news -- here in the States? --WaltCip-(talk) 00:42, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support since it is a major new development within a major world sport, and a very controversial one. Yakikaki (talk) 09:26, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- For a sense of the scale of this in a soccer country, it's Tuesday and The Guardian is still running a live developments and reactions feed [1]. LukeSurl t c 10:05, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) Table Mountain Fire (2021) and Mostert's Mill
Blurb: A fire on Table Mountain, Cape Town, destroys historic monuments including Mostert's Mill (pictured) and the University of Cape Town's main library. (Post)
Alternative blurb: Mostert's Mill (pictured), the only working windmill in South Africa, is gutted by a wildfire that started on Table Mountain.
News source(s): [2], [3]
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Mjroots (talk · give credit)
- Created by Mike Peel (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Nominator's comments: Significant fire and impact on cultural properties Mike Peel (talk) 17:27, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. Count Iblis (talk) 17:33, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment There was a dup nom on the Mosters Mill which I merged into here with the altblurb. --Masem (t) 17:40, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- It was not a dup nom, it was a nom for a separate article, which is now not showing as a nom in the template. Can this be fixed so that both article are showing as noms, and I am credited as a nominator/updater please? Mjroots (talk) 17:43, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- It is effectively the same story, so it made no sense to have two seperate ITNC open for it. We can't have two different nominators but I have added you to updaters. --Masem (t) 17:49, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Also, yes, the mill article is sufficiently good for be featured, so I did adjust all blurbs to reflect that. I haven't reviewed the fire article, but in a case like this where there's more than just one building affected, the fire article is going to be the primary focus, not one structure affected. --Masem (t) 17:53, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've raised the issue re co-nominators at template talk:ITN candidate#Allowing two nominators. Mjroots (talk) 17:58, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Per what Mike Peel said there, I've swapped out the nom (Mike is still credited for creation) --Masem (t) 18:03, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Actually, noms can both be credited separately from this old version of ITNC. I think that is the correct way around this particular situation. Mjroots (talk) 18:19, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've sorted out the credit for Mike Peel from the above link, now if someone would be kind enough to do the same for me, it'd be appreciated. Mjroots (talk) 20:31, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- If you want a job doing properly... Mjroots (talk) 05:33, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've sorted out the credit for Mike Peel from the above link, now if someone would be kind enough to do the same for me, it'd be appreciated. Mjroots (talk) 20:31, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Actually, noms can both be credited separately from this old version of ITNC. I think that is the correct way around this particular situation. Mjroots (talk) 18:19, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Per what Mike Peel said there, I've swapped out the nom (Mike is still credited for creation) --Masem (t) 18:03, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've raised the issue re co-nominators at template talk:ITN candidate#Allowing two nominators. Mjroots (talk) 17:58, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- It was not a dup nom, it was a nom for a separate article, which is now not showing as a nom in the template. Can this be fixed so that both article are showing as noms, and I am credited as a nominator/updater please? Mjroots (talk) 17:43, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb (not altblurb, which says much the same, but less. Maximum bang per buck, please). ——Serial 17:51, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait but generally support. Article text is <3k and the fire is still going so there could be more damage before its contained. What's there is sourced but just needs a bit more expansion as the fire is contained. --Masem (t) 17:56, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
Note that we also have 2021 Cape Town fire - which needs to be merged with Table Mountain Fire (2021). Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 18:00, 18 April 2021 (UTC)- They were merged. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 18:35, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support in principle. Destruction of historical monuments is notable.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 18:09, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support - the fire article has been expanded is now fit to post, mill article updated for tense. Mjroots (talk) 18:15, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb, Oppose alt blurb - Both articles have been merged and there's a lot of content and sources now. The alt blurb focusses to much on the windmill rather than the fire. --Sitaphul (talk) 18:26, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Marking as ready (original blurb has consensus). Image added to WP:CMP. Mjroots (talk) 18:46, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Also support original blurb, per above Kingsif (talk) 18:53, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support good to go. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 19:01, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support This would be like losing Nelson's Column or the Washington Monument.--WaltCip-(talk) 19:05, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support I am very supportive of this. I saw it happen and it was significant. Both in size and culturally here in Cape Town.--Discott (talk) 19:53, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted While I !voted, there's clearly SNOW support for this at this point. --Masem (t) 20:14, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment and @Masem: there appears to be a photo of the gutted mill at the article that may work better in the box. Kingsif (talk) 20:22, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Good call, using Mostert_Mill_burned_down_18_April_2021 would indeed be better. Or another picture in the Table_Mountain_Fire_(2021) category assuming any more pictures are added. --Discott (talk) 20:40, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've seeded the post-fire Mill picture to image protection. It can be updated once its protected. --Masem (t) 20:45, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- And now protected and updated. --Masem (t) 20:57, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- As Mjroots has pointed out, that burned out image may have copyright issues, so until that can be resolved, we're back with the free image until we can have a free post-fire image that we're sure about its free nature. --Masem (t) 21:15, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- It was deleted as a copyvio. Mjroots (talk) 07:34, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- I only noticed that the image had copyright issues after posting my comment. Glad it was taken down until that is resolved. I will try and take a photograph of the mill later today if possible but no guarentees as firefighters are still fighting the fire in the area.--Discott (talk) 08:22, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- It was deleted as a copyvio. Mjroots (talk) 07:34, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- As Mjroots has pointed out, that burned out image may have copyright issues, so until that can be resolved, we're back with the free image until we can have a free post-fire image that we're sure about its free nature. --Masem (t) 21:15, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- And now protected and updated. --Masem (t) 20:57, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've seeded the post-fire Mill picture to image protection. It can be updated once its protected. --Masem (t) 20:45, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Good call, using Mostert_Mill_burned_down_18_April_2021 would indeed be better. Or another picture in the Table_Mountain_Fire_(2021) category assuming any more pictures are added. --Discott (talk) 20:40, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
April 17
April 17, 2021
(Saturday)
Armed conflicts and attacks
Arts and culture
Health and environment
International relations
Law and crime
|
RD: Frank Judd, Baron Judd
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:
- Nominated by KingOfAllThings (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: British Labour Party politician. KingOfAllThings (thou shalt chatter!) 00:25, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Maybe I'm an ignorant American but shouldn't the article just be at "Frank Judd" ? The "Baron Judd" seems not to be part of his common name. --Masem (t) 00:28, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- i believe wp:ncbritpeer covers this. if i understand it correctly, unless he was almost exclusively known by his personal name (e.g., bertrand russell), the current title is fine. however, i don't know if he was almost exclusively known by his personal name. dying (talk) 08:37, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- This is common. See Category:Labour Party (UK) life peers, for example. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 08:46, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose As for the article quality, several tidbits in the lede are not mentioned in the body, and the source supporting these is paywalled for me so I cannot verify.130.233.213.199 (talk) 11:33, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
RD: Black Rob
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Complex
Credits:
- Nominated by AllegedlyHuman (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: American rapper, 51. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 23:20, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose for now - There are entire paragraphs without any sources. Sitaphul (talk) 05:23, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose too many citations required. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 07:48, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Charles Geschke
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Adobe press release
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Joofjoof (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Dying (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Co-founder of Adobe Systems Inc. Just announced today. Joofjoof (talk) 07:13, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Wikipedia page looks good and is well-sourced. Sitaphul (talk) 08:10, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RIP, well sourced Vacant0 (talk) 11:28, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support The article is well sourced and has good outlook. Abishe (talk) 11:52, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Looks good to go. Hanamanteo (talk) 13:32, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. Looks good. Marking ready. Ktin (talk) 18:34, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted to RD. SpencerT•C 19:09, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Vivek
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Times of India
Credits:
- Nominated by Ktin (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: News just breaking. RIP Vivek. Article might require one pass at ensuring readiness including some citations for the awards. Referencing completed. Seems to meet hygiene expectations for homepage / RD. Ktin (talk) 02:07, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support - Article seems good with a lot of references. Sitaphul (talk) 04:33, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Good depth of coverage for an actor article; referenced. Could use some minor copy-editing here and there but overall good to go. SpencerT•C 04:34, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support per Spencer's comment Vacant0 (talk) 11:30, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support per above EelamStyleZ (talk) 11:48, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support The subject is highly notable and well sourced. Abishe (talk) 11:52, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted Anarchyte (talk • work) 17:06, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Anarchyte, there are several RDs lower down the page with sufficient support to post (two with “Ready” tags on them). Is there a reason this has been posted, but not the others? Thanks. - 109.249.185.34 (talk) 18:54, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- I have gone through and posted 4 RDs below that were supported /marked ready and that had articles that appeared ready to go. --Masem (t) 19:01, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- That’s great, thank you very much. - 109.249.185.34 (talk) 19:17, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- I have gone through and posted 4 RDs below that were supported /marked ready and that had articles that appeared ready to go. --Masem (t) 19:01, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Anarchyte, there are several RDs lower down the page with sufficient support to post (two with “Ready” tags on them). Is there a reason this has been posted, but not the others? Thanks. - 109.249.185.34 (talk) 18:54, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Kakarla Subba Rao
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Hindu
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Ktin (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Ab207 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Indian radiologist. Padma Shri awardee. A tad on the shorter side. Will work on some edits based on available obits and share an update. Edits done. Article has shaped into a decent C-class biography. Meets hygiene expectations for homepage / RD. Ktin (talk) 00:54, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Everything is referenced and the article is a decent length. Uses x (talk • contribs) 02:07, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Just a citation needed needs to be fixed. Working on that now. Sitaphul (talk) 04:37, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Fixed it, the article seems good to go now. Sitaphul (talk) 04:44, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support All referenced now. Article in good shape. Alexcalamaro (talk) 09:23, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted to RD. SpencerT•C 22:15, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
(Closed) Funeral of Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Blurb: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh's funeral takes place in St George's Chapel at Windsor Castle (Post)
News source(s): CNN, The Guardian
Credits:
- Nominated by Aknell4 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
- Strong oppose Given the issues post-blurb posting of his death, giving coverage of his funeral as a non-royal member is way out of line. --Masem (t) 16:40, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- In what way was Philip a "non royal"? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:45, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- As from previous discussions, he was a consort, not born into blood into the Royal family, and had zero possible chance of assuming any position in the Commonwealth's governance. --Masem (t) 17:05, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Ah yes, a bit like Barbara Bush. Thanks for reminding me. Martinevans123 (talk) 17:08, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Strong oppose we already posted his death, don't need to post his funeral too. Joseph2302 (talk) 16:43, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose and suggest closing. We actually already posted this - the death and funeral article was in the blurb [4], it's just rolled off. P-K3 (talk) 17:03, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose The death was posted as a blurb, that's sufficient. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:11, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
April 16
April 16, 2021
(Friday)
Arts and culture
Business and economy
Health and environment
International relations
Law and crime
Politics and elections
Science and technology
|
(Posted) RD: John Dawes
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC Sport; The Guardian; Associated Press
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Bloom6132 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Bloom6132 (talk) 07:01, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. Seems fine. —Brigade Piron (talk) 13:43, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Marking ready. SpencerT•C 22:18, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted Stephen 02:19, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
RD: Liam Scarlett
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC News
Credits:
- Nominated by Wizardoftheyear (talk · give credit)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Former Choreographer for the Royal Ballet. Just announced today. META: Can someone please help with the formatting issue here? I’ve never done a nomination before, and I’m not sure how to fix this. Wizardoftheyear (talk) 23:47, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment I fixed the formatting for you. The article looks fairly well referenced but the "Works" section will need to be fully sourced so that orange tag can be removed. P-K3 (talk) 00:02, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment. Aside from the citation issue mentioned, I think this will need more prose about his work? —Brigade Piron (talk) 13:44, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose works and awards need referencing. Everything else is satis. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 07:49, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Ranjit Sinha
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NDTV
Credits:
- Nominated by Ktin (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Former chief of India's Central Bureau of Investigation. Article has an yellow box that will need to be fixed before it can be ready for homepage. I will take a pass at the article here in a bit. Ktin (talk) 18:37, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
Conditionalsupport Article could use some copyediting/cleanup and once done, has my support. Examples of issues for fixing include use of italics for quotations instead of quotation marks; talking about his children before his birth in "Early Life"; unclear abbreviations (IAS, IRS) that are not spelled out or linked (or others spelled out after usage); and some grammatical/wording fixes. Appropriate depth of coverage and referenced. SpencerT•C 01:03, 18 April 2021 (UTC)- Rm "conditional"; thanks Ktin for improvements. SpencerT•C 05:26, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted, quality seems sufficient per above iteration. --Masem (t) 03:19, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Roger Soloman
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CBC News; The Guardian (Charlottetown)
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Bloom6132 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Only announced and reported today (April 16). —Bloom6132 (talk) 12:47, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Weak support Wish there was more about his PEI political career, but I realize it might not be too much available in sources. Referenced. SpencerT•C 00:55, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- comment: ross young, the member of the legislative assembly whom soloman served with for three years when they both represented prince edward island's 1st kings district, happened to die about five days earlier, despite an age difference of about 23 years. young's death was posted when his article looked like this. dying (talk) 14:30, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support per Spencer. It's brief but perhaps that's really all there is. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 07:50, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted --Masem (t) 03:19, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
(Closed - Wait) Raúl Castro
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Blurb: Raúl Castro resigns as First Secretary of the Communist Party of Cuba. (Post)
News source(s): NYT, AP, Guardian
Credits:
- Nominated by Davey2116 (talk · give credit)
- Strongest possible support -- the end of an era which stretches back from even before my parents were born. A Castro no longer controls the Government of Cuba. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 21:48, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose – Mr. Castro is 89, so it's not surprising that he would resign as head of the ruling Communist Party. Historical footnote. – Sca (talk) 21:59, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait Changes to the leader of a country is blurb-worthy, but precedent is for the successor to also be or exclusively mentioned in the blurb. The problem I'm seeing is that Miguel Díaz-Canel is only "expected" to take over, and I'd like to wait until that is confirmed. Uses x (talk • contribs) 22:01, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- To add: the citation needed template needs to be resolved on the page First Secretary of the Communist Party of Cuba before I'd be able to support, on top of the above. Uses x (talk • contribs) 22:08, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose In my opinion, it cannot be posted until he is died. His resignation is not enough newsworthy to be posted as ITN. 180.245.109.70 (talk) 22:07, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait According to List of current heads of state and government, this position is the position that holds the power of the executive in Cuba, which makes this ITN/R. However, the blurb should wait until a successor has been picked. NorthernFalcon (talk) 22:08, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Undeniably of historical and current significance. However, Díaz-Canel should be mentioned in the blurb. Wizardoftheyear (talk) 22:18, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait for the replacement to be announced, which should be any day. --LaserLegs (talk) 22:36, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Raúl Castro has too much unreferenced content to post, so while we wait for a replacement to be announced, the supporters can get it post ready. --LaserLegs (talk) 22:46, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait for the resignation and turnover of power to happen. I agree on that this is a case not readily covered by the ITNR but nearly all sources I see reporting on it treat the resignation as if the US Pres. or UK Prime Minister had stepped down, particularly as related to past Communist rule in Cuba. But right now, he still is in this position, he appearently has to name a successor to do this. --Masem (t) 22:45, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yes, what would be significant would be a change in the political system, but I haven't seen anything indicating that's in the offing. As it is, the titular occupant of the top political post is of only passing interest. 'Cuba without a Castro' is still the Cuba we've known for the last 60 years. – Sca (talk) 14:11, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- That feels a little misleading; like stating that the hypothetical replacement of Xi Jinping with an ideologically aligned person wouldn’t be a major story because it’s the same system, or that the hypothetical succession of Kamala Harris to the presidency wouldn’t matter because she’s the same party as Joe Biden. Wizardoftheyear (talk) 17:45, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yes, what would be significant would be a change in the political system, but I haven't seen anything indicating that's in the offing. As it is, the titular occupant of the top political post is of only passing interest. 'Cuba without a Castro' is still the Cuba we've known for the last 60 years. – Sca (talk) 14:11, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Nope. The key difference is that Cuba is a one-party state. Thus, it doesn't materially matter who succeeds Mr. Castro. It will remain a one-party state, and policies (by all appearances) won't change – at least not soon. (Besides, Raúl more or less inherited the top party post from his brother Fidel, founder of Communist Cuba.) – Sca (talk) 22:10, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Hence the China comparison. Wizardoftheyear (talk) 23:25, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Nope. The key difference is that Cuba is a one-party state. Thus, it doesn't materially matter who succeeds Mr. Castro. It will remain a one-party state, and policies (by all appearances) won't change – at least not soon. (Besides, Raúl more or less inherited the top party post from his brother Fidel, founder of Communist Cuba.) – Sca (talk) 22:10, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait, per Masem. We can cover this aspect when his successor is chosen. But support in principle. —Brigade Piron (talk) 13:47, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait until replacement is nominated/inaugurated, and then we can post a standard blurb: "X replaces Raul Castro as First Secretary of the Communist Party of Cuba". Joseph2302 (talk) 09:53, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Vartan Gregorian
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): New York Times Carnegie Corporation of New York
Credits:
- Nominated by Varavour (talk · give credit)
- Created by Yerevantsi (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Looks ready to go. Varavour (talk) 18:42, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Thorough depth of coverage; fully referenced. SpencerT•C 23:17, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Article in good shape. Sad news. Nsk92 (talk) 23:58, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. Article looks good and meets homepage hygiene expectations. Marking ready. Ktin (talk) 00:44, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Fully referenced and comprehensive. Uses x (talk • contribs) 02:05, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Looks good to go. Hanamanteo (talk) 02:33, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted --Masem (t) 18:59, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Helen McCrory
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:
- Nominated by 109.249.185.34 (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Kingsif (talk · give credit)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Needs some updating. 109.249.185.34 (talk) 16:01, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose for now Notable enough, but needs additional citations.
- Oppose, not good enough. There is no wait, only do. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 17:52, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment I've added six refs, I'm still checking through them to see if there are roles/awards not mentioned, and will look for those. No other article issues that would prevent posting. Kingsif (talk) 18:57, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Should be all sourced. Kingsif (talk) 22:03, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Looks well referenced now. P-K3 (talk) 22:37, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Appropriate depth of coverage. SpencerT•C 04:34, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Looks good to go. Hanamanteo (talk) 17:06, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted --Masem (t) 19:00, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Andrew Peacock
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ABC News, The Sydney Morning Herald, The Guardian
Credits:
- Nominated by JMonkey2006 (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Ballitomanga (talk · give credit), Steepleman (talk · give credit), Rubberbandme2015 (talk · give credit), Lugnuts (talk · give credit) and Artegia (talk · give credit)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Former national leader of the Liberal Party of Australia (LP), Former Ambassador of Australia to America JMonkey2006 (talk) 12:08, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support. Article's in a good state, for the most part. Some stuff is unsourced but I don't think it's enough to prevent posting. Anarchyte (talk • work) 12:15, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose There are whole paragraphs unsourced, let alone single sentences. Black Kite (talk) 13:15, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Same reason as Black Kite (talk · contribs). Will change when the article is fully sourced.
- Oppose for now needs more citations! Vacant0 (talk) 13:55, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support only one [citation needed] which really could/should be gotten rid of or sourced immediately. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 17:53, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Apart from the cn tags, the source for the entire first paragraph in "Early political career" is a 404 for me. Black Kite (talk) 18:40, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Tag, singular. And plenty of copies of that source at Archive.org. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:56, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support as soon as the above sourcing issues are resolved Thescrubbythug (talk) 18:06, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- It seems to me that the above issues are now resolved. I've helped fill in wherever citation was needed. Thescrubbythug (talk) 10:07, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted --Masem (t) 18:57, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
April 15
April 15, 2021
(Thursday)
Armed conflicts and attacks
Disasters and accidents
Health and environment
International relations
Law and crime
|
(Closed) Indianapolis FedEx shooting
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Blurb: A mass shooting at an Indianapolis FedEx leaves nine dead and six injured. (Post)
News source(s): (CNN), (AP News), (NY Times), BBC, Guardian
Credits:
- Nominated by Elijahandskip (talk · give credit)
- Created by Love of Corey (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Nsk92 (talk · give credit) and Kellis7 (talk · give credit)
- Wait We currently don't have a motive and it's been 12 hours since the shooting took place. Kellis7 (User talk:Kellis7 14:31, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
Wait– Per previous. RS reports indicate suicidal shooter acted alone, and his motive was unknown. Although toll considerable, wider significance appeared absent as of 14:30 UTC. – Sca (talk) 14:44, 16 April 2021 (UTC)- Wait unless it's terrorism (racial, political, religious I don't care) we ought not post. Domestic and workplace disputes frequently turn deadly in the United States. --LaserLegs (talk) 14:52, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait per reasoning of LaserLegs. --Masem (t) 14:56, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose another day in the United States. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 15:31, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Bro. 15 casualties at a single shooting isn't "another day in the US". At max, 10 casualties in a single location would be typical, but more than that is big news. This is top news in 90% of major news sources. Elijahandskip (talk) 15:47, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- "Bro", nearly 13,000 people have been killed in gun violence this year in the US (and it's only mid-April). This is nearly the 150th mass shooting of 2021. It's just not news. It's like reporting that bombs have gone off in a war. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 15:50, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Where are you getting these numbers from? You're either making it up or wildly misciting somebody's statistics. Levivich harass/hound 00:31, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Gun Violence Archive has 12,422. Stephen 00:47, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- If that's the source, that would be misciting statistics. GVA is reporting 12k deaths, not homicides. Similarly they report ~147 "mass shootings" this year but 11 "mass murders". And their definitions don't match other sources' definitions anyway. This hasn't happened 13k or 150 times before or anything even close to that. This is not a routine event, and I wish people would stop misciting statistics in their arguments. "Lies, damn lies, and statistics," I guess. Levivich harass/hound 01:16, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Gun Violence Archive has 12,422. Stephen 00:47, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Where are you getting these numbers from? You're either making it up or wildly misciting somebody's statistics. Levivich harass/hound 00:31, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Where are you getting the number 15 from? All recent sources (including the article) list the death count as 9. Gex4pls (talk) (lack of contributions) 16:01, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Gex4pls, "casualties" include non-fatal injuries. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:12, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Muboshgu Oh, I assumed they meant deaths alone, thanks for the clarification. Gex4pls (talk) (lack of contributions) 16:14, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Gex4pls, "casualties" include non-fatal injuries. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:12, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- "Bro", nearly 13,000 people have been killed in gun violence this year in the US (and it's only mid-April). This is nearly the 150th mass shooting of 2021. It's just not news. It's like reporting that bombs have gone off in a war. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 15:50, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Bro. 15 casualties at a single shooting isn't "another day in the US". At max, 10 casualties in a single location would be typical, but more than that is big news. This is top news in 90% of major news sources. Elijahandskip (talk) 15:47, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Sadly this is run of the mill. This isn't another day in the US, it's just another month. There have been 31 other deaths in unrelated mass shootings in the US this month alone, and that number is only set to grow. Gex4pls (talk) (lack of contributions) 16:06, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose per TRM et al.. – John M Wolfson (talk • contribs) 16:16, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait Although this is being widely reported, and the number of casualties is above the routine, we don't yet know if this is just another workplace dispute or something more significant. P-K3 (talk) 16:22, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
Wait unless this is something extremely out of the ordinaryOppose run-of-the mill event. Black Kite (talk) 16:54, 16 April 2021 (UTC)- Oppose Nine deaths isn't enough for a blurb, and I've said before it's not reasonable to post every event on this list, the same way it's unreasonable to post every high-casualty event in regions of wars, protests, etc. The article would also need to be more comprehensive. Uses x (talk • contribs) 17:33, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose dog bites man, unfortunately. ——Serial 18:33, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Another run-of-the-mill shooting in the United States that makes me feel that we're getting spammed. Putting RD nominations aside, 'shooting in the United States' is the most frequent type of nomination, even more frequent than elections. I simply can't see any extraordinariness.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 19:32, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support - First mass shooting at a FedEx in 30-some odd years.--WaltCip-(talk) 20:17, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- ... on a Thursday ... The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:20, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- You have a link to a mass shooting at a FedEx on a different day in the last 30 years? --LaserLegs (talk) 22:37, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- ... on a Thursday ... The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:20, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose – All indications are that the shooter, a 19-year-old former FedEx employee, acted on his own, so broader significance seems unlikely. Under the circumstances and in context, nine fatalities (including the gunman) doesn't seem like ITN material. – Sca (talk) 22:15, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose shootings in the US are so common, and nothing to suggest this is anything ITN worthy. Joseph2302 (talk) 00:45, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- comment: the onion has republished its 'No Way To Prevent This,' Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens article, suggesting that this may not be a run-of-the-mill event. dying (talk) 01:21, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
(Closed) United States racial unrest
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Ongoing item nomination (Post)
Credits:
- Nominated by AllegedlyHuman (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Lmomjian (talk · give credit), Tvc 15 (talk · give credit) and Love of Corey (talk · give credit)
Article updated
- Oppose all just run of the mill stuff at the moment. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 21:26, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose (pending significant developments) in accordance with previous reasons in Daunte Wright protests below. Osunpokeh (talk) 21:38, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- @Osunpokeh Anything specific? I can't see anything that applies to this nomination considering this is a list of all protests (which undeniably are notable and have a high impact), rather than a single element of that list. Uses x (talk • contribs) 21:57, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support It's ongoing, it's certainly in the news, the overall impact (both domestic and international) is high, and the article is high quality. The comment about the protests being routine (which I agree with) doesn't apply to a collection, so there's no issue with that in this nomination. Uses x (talk • contribs) 21:44, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support per Uses X mostly. I'm unconvinced by the not a (insert country name) ticker - civil unrest is well established as notable enough for Ongoing. We should apply the same standards that we ought apply to others: pull it down when the story is stale or the article is trash. --LaserLegs (talk) 21:52, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support it's significant, the nature of these protests is not run-of-the-mill at all, and the article is in great shape. Events are likely to continue in this direction as today we see the release of a video of a 13 year old Hispanic male shot while his hands were up. – Muboshgu (talk) 21:56, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support none of this is run-of-the-mill, despite the misinformed protestations to the contrary. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 22:11, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wrong. That's why we have an article detailing literally dozens of protests after the literally hundreds of people who have been killed by the US police in the last few months. It's almost as common as mass shootings. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 09:05, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support There is no valid argument against this year-long event being significant. Rather the argument is that several hundred mass protests occurring in a short span are distinct unrelated events, such that a) they must qualify individually and b) the vast number of protests make the them commonplace. Cynical as hell, but typical anti-American bashing from the usual suspects. GreatCaesarsGhost 22:18, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- I guess we just run a "racial unrest" ticker and a "mass shootings" ticker then, as both are commonplace and completely unremarkable these days. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 15:31, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose The problem is, given the nature of this article is being constructed, there's no proverbial end to this, and it would remain in ongoing indefinitely (In contrast, we know there will be a point we can eventually remove COVID once it no longer is seen as a worldwide threat). If we post this, we might as well post something along the lines of "gun violence in the United States" - a major news topic but one that has no clear "end". --Masem (t) 22:22, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Guaido still thinks he's president of Venezuela, students in Hong Kong are still antagonizing the CPC, in fact there are still weekend protests in Belarus all those articles were in ongoing and are no longer. Prying stuff out of OG is a gigantic hassle around here but that isn't a reason not to put things into OG. Brexit popped in and out as it flared up. The Myanmar protests are in the box right now and that mess is a monument to WP:SYNTH. I empathize, but relax, we'll be fine. --LaserLegs (talk) 22:41, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose per Masem and The Rambling Man. I do not believe that several riots that may coincide temporally and causally is something of such importance as to be "ongoing". Police brutality + protests is usual in the US. Catalonia has experienced something similar (bridging the gap) in recent years in the context of the territorial crisis with Spain, with riots for days and I would not even think of nominating it. Although honestly I am not going oppose if a consensus is reached to support it. Alsoriano97 (talk) 22:32, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Its a notable series of ongoing protests, and I would support Catalonia protests being ITN, tooJackattack1597 (talk) 00:20, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Since at least 2011, there have been reliable protests/unrest/riots in American cities every Summer. Whether you're sympathetic to the professed motivations, yet another year is hardly unique, unusual or comment worthy outside of larger effects. Putting them in Ongoing is like putting Crime in the US in Ongoing; it's part and parcel of living there.130.233.213.199 (talk) 06:02, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Adding, individual events are much better suited for blurbs, and I would (and have) support(ed) them previously. The linked article is narrative spinning from disparate events that are sometimes not even thematically related.130.233.213.199 (talk) 06:04, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support per Uses x and Muboshgu, and per RS (e.g. those cited in the article), which write that the protests 2020-present are quite different from previous 21st-century protests. (How long did it take before Occupy Wall Street was added to ongoing?) Levivich harass/hound 06:07, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose mostly because the article is blown up with every incident of larger scale that occurred in the country over the past year (What does the 2021 storming of the United States Capitol have to do with race without clear explanation in the text?). I also notice events that were posted either with a blurb or to ongoing on their own so the target article is definitely not something to support on the main page. In my opinion, 2020–2021 Minneapolis–Saint Paul racial justice protests could be a better fit in place of Daunte Wright protests and the proposed one just waters down notability (Yet, the article on Daunte Wright protests is not updated with yesterday's events, implying descending significance as time goes by.).--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 08:30, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- This is sorta what I was getting it in my oppose, while it is clear the concept of long-term racial instability is there, this feels like an OR-created topic that doesn't reflect how the news frames this. Connections are being made between the George Floyd protests and these events, sure, but they aren't seemingly calling it connected event. --Masem (t) 14:02, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment/Musing -- Having thought on this some more, I think we should probably wait until after the verdict for Derek Chauvin. These protests may rapidly die, or they may become as big as the protests in 2020. We don't know yet. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 08:41, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Then that won't be an "ongoing" news story, it will be a story directly related to the most recent police killings so will be a blurb. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 09:10, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose My first thought was a blanket oppose, since the other nom is still open and this feels like a classic way to skirt around opposition there, but I read through all the comments, particularly TRM and LL, and I still feel that the Minnesota riots article would be a more appropriate target (and that the new? article probably shouldn't exist at all) but have been convinced a blurb would be more appropriate given the often disparate nature of the protests/riots/whatever. Kingsif (talk) 10:36, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose – Too broad a topic, impossible to manage in a way that treats incidents equitably, inevitably producing a mishmash. – Sca (talk) 12:54, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose - Racism in the United States has been going on for a long time and this topic isn't current (this is my understanding, since I'm not from the US). If it's about a specific protest or unrest like the George Floyd protest, I'm okay with it. But not this. --Sitaphul (talk) 14:00, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Before anyone says I'm anti-American, I've supported the Daunte Wright protest nomination Sitaphul (talk) 14:12, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment A better case may be made for ongoing of the Daunte Wright protests. Albertaont (talk) 18:44, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support per Uses x and Muboshgu. It's certainly getting a lot of coverage. Collectively they're notable enough and show no signs of fading, so it's suited for ongoing. Davey2116 (talk) 21:49, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Anyone who claims that this is "run-of-the-mill" either categorically dislikes when United States affairs get put on the front page or doesn't know anything about the United States (or in TRM's case, both). The changes that have been sweeping the nation since last June are unprecedented. Monuments getting taken down, actors retiring their roles, the Redskins finally changing their name, etc. Mlb96 (talk) 05:31, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Furthermore, this article covers every protest since last June. Look at this list of race riots in the U.S. Prior to June 2020, there hadn't been a race-related protest in four years. And with the exception of 2014-2015, there was an average of one race-related protest per year. Since June 2020, we've had multiple race-related protests per month. To claim that these kinds of protests are common is absurd. If they seem common now, it's because the racial unrest is LITERALLY on-going. This frankly should have been put into on-going months ago, but better late than never. Mlb96 (talk) 05:45, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- You mean there wasn't any protest in 2019 like this one? Hawkeye7 (discuss) 06:56, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Hah, by all means try to insult me Mlb96 but you just make yourself look silly really. Racial unrest has been ongoing for years and it's not newsworthy, it's just "a way of life" in the US, just like mass shootings. Nothing changes, nothing of true encyclopedic value comes from these protests or shootings. Once the balance tips and someone actually does something to prevent more than 1,000 people being murdered by the US police per year or reduce hundreds of mass shootings to nearly zero, then we can get genuinely interested in a news story. Until then, it's business as usual. I feel very sorry for the thousands of people killed every year in each of these circumstances in the US, but that doesn't mean we need to overwhelm this global encyclopedia with protest/mass shooting tickers. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 08:14, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- TRM, I'm trying assume good faith, but I feel that your anti-American bias is shining through, and it's annoying. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 09:46, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- No, I'm just saying it as it is. The rest of the world is dog tired of being inundated with "riot" and "mass shooting" stories from the US, in particular when literally nothing ever is done about it. I discovered 'No Way To Prevent This,' Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens today, sums it up perfectly. This isn't about anti-American anything. If someone kept suggesting we post minor casualty events from a war zone then I'd continually oppose those as well. This is no different. But I appreciate your attempts to AGF. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 10:59, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- I'm in full agreement with TRM here and I'm American - this is unfortunately the situation in America for more than a decade or two. What's happened in the last year and calling it a special period is inappropriate WP:SYNTH. Further, this type of story belies the purpose of ongoing, where we know that there will be a reasonable endpoint that we expect to pull the event; there is no sign that this unrest will end in the US; if it ends (likely due to legislation that is passed) the means by which it ends would be a story. --Masem (t) 14:14, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- No, I'm just saying it as it is. The rest of the world is dog tired of being inundated with "riot" and "mass shooting" stories from the US, in particular when literally nothing ever is done about it. I discovered 'No Way To Prevent This,' Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens today, sums it up perfectly. This isn't about anti-American anything. If someone kept suggesting we post minor casualty events from a war zone then I'd continually oppose those as well. This is no different. But I appreciate your attempts to AGF. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 10:59, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- TRM, I'm trying assume good faith, but I feel that your anti-American bias is shining through, and it's annoying. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 09:46, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Hah, by all means try to insult me Mlb96 but you just make yourself look silly really. Racial unrest has been ongoing for years and it's not newsworthy, it's just "a way of life" in the US, just like mass shootings. Nothing changes, nothing of true encyclopedic value comes from these protests or shootings. Once the balance tips and someone actually does something to prevent more than 1,000 people being murdered by the US police per year or reduce hundreds of mass shootings to nearly zero, then we can get genuinely interested in a news story. Until then, it's business as usual. I feel very sorry for the thousands of people killed every year in each of these circumstances in the US, but that doesn't mean we need to overwhelm this global encyclopedia with protest/mass shooting tickers. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 08:14, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- You mean there wasn't any protest in 2019 like this one? Hawkeye7 (discuss) 06:56, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Furthermore, this article covers every protest since last June. Look at this list of race riots in the U.S. Prior to June 2020, there hadn't been a race-related protest in four years. And with the exception of 2014-2015, there was an average of one race-related protest per year. Since June 2020, we've had multiple race-related protests per month. To claim that these kinds of protests are common is absurd. If they seem common now, it's because the racial unrest is LITERALLY on-going. This frankly should have been put into on-going months ago, but better late than never. Mlb96 (talk) 05:45, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- It's just a low-level collection of angry people who are continually angry about things that don't change. This isn't news. That's the point. There is nothing to be gained for our readers on seeing low-level protest after low-level protest after low-level protest added to that article of low-level protests. The world is bored of this, nothing changes, nothing gets to a point of real noteworthiness. It may come to a shock to those people in the US who think this is of anything more than a passing interest, but these shootings and riots just roll off the news with regularity. There's no interest. This is a global encyclopedia, focusing ITN on mass shootings and protest after protest is not its mission. And since when was 2021 storming of the United States Capitol about racial unrest? Jesus. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 14:53, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Referring to millions of American protesters as "just a low-level collection of angry people who are continually angry about things that don't change" is your anti-Americanism showing again. You really need to curtail this here. If "this isn't news" then why is it all over the news? Also, you do not speak for "the world". "The world" does not have a single opinion on anything. Your comments here are 100% just your opinion and no one else's. Levivich harass/hound 15:14, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oh give it rest. Half the items in that article featured dozens, not millions, of people protesting and many of those had nothing to do with "racial unrest". Once you have a suitable argument other than the half-baked "anti-Americanism" bollocks, I'll listen. I'm actually anti-police-murder and anti-mass-shooting, I have no opinion on the United States, having been there several times it offers literally nothing. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 15:58, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Referring to millions of American protesters as "just a low-level collection of angry people who are continually angry about things that don't change" is your anti-Americanism showing again. You really need to curtail this here. If "this isn't news" then why is it all over the news? Also, you do not speak for "the world". "The world" does not have a single opinion on anything. Your comments here are 100% just your opinion and no one else's. Levivich harass/hound 15:14, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support, per Mlb96. Nothing "run of the mill" about the racial protests that have been taking place over the last year since the George Floyd death in the U.S. They absolutely are qualitatively different from the protests that have occurred before, and they have already resulted in significant changes in attitudes towards race and policing, comparable to the impact of the Me Too movement. Saying that the rest of the world is dog tired of being inundated with these stories is a perfectly good reason to put them into a single 'ongoing' item. Then each time an individual story of this kind gets nominated for a blurb, there will be an immediate counter-argument: we already have an ongoing item for this topic and let's keep it there. Nsk92 (talk) 14:05, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose way too broad and disparate. A lot of that article is just disparate protests in response to isolated events that might've had something to do with racism. TBH, it might actually be original research to group these all together as part of some cohesive movement, in the way that article is doing (distinct from some kind of list article), unless there's some RS doing the same (not immediately obvious). But, and WP:CRYSTAL notwithstanding, possibly in the future there may be a suitable nomination relating to the Chauvin trial. But not sure this is it. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 15:14, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose as too broad, in line with what several others have pointed out above. Yakikaki (talk) 19:04, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- This strikes me as rather amorphous. I'm not completely ready to dismiss it because it is generating significant and ongoing coverage, though. pbp 22:56, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose - This is a cultural paradigm shift, and so in effect is actually too newsy for ITN. At the rate things are going, this would probably never come down off ongoing if posted.--WaltCip-(talk) 14:27, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
(Closed) Kerch Strait closure
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Blurb: Russia announces its decision to close the Kerch Strait in the Black Sea to "warships and other state vessels" until October. (Post)
News source(s): NY Post, Plymouth Herald, Ukrinform
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Brandmeister (talk · give credit)
Article updated
- Oppose Announcement. Might be relevant when it actually happens. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 21:12, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose Just an announcement, and not in the news much. The update would also need to be longer, giving the impacts of it, etc, as right now there's only the background. Uses x (talk • contribs) 21:20, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose It's not significant - if we were to nominate every military activity then the list would be huge Sitaphul (talk) 14:05, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment I think Russia announcing it's doing a thing is the same as Russia doing that thing. I rather doubt anyone is going to test them. --LaserLegs (talk) 22:52, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment This is related to the back-and-forth between Russia-Ukraine-US, and is a minor development about equal to the US sailing destroyers through the Dardanelles, or Zelensky's visit to troops. The article is actually pretty nice. I'd rather post good articles with a topical update than the usual "event" article, but some more information in the blurb is needed to give readers context. And we should wait at least until next week when this is no longer merely an annoucement.130.233.213.199 (talk) 06:14, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
April 14
April 14, 2021
(Wednesday)
Armed conflicts and attacks
Arts and culture
Disasters and accidents
Health and environment
International relations
Law and crime
|
(Posted) RD: Michel Louvain
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CTV News / Canadian Press; Montreal Gazette
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Bloom6132 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Bloom6132 (talk) 01:15, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Article is well-sourced Vacant0 (talk) 13:59, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Good article, and everything is sourced. Uses x (talk • contribs) 02:32, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted --Masem (t) 18:57, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Ahmed Usman
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Premium Times
Credits:
- Nominated by Spencer (talk · give credit)
- Updated by Aymatth2 (talk · give credit) and Spencer (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Former Military Governor of Ondo and Oyo States in Nigeria. Article is referenced and has appropriate depth of coverage. SpencerT•C 15:38, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Article is in good shape. Alsoriano97 (talk) 08:23, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Weak support article is generally fine, though it's currently using worldstatesmen as a source, which should be replaced as it's on the depreciated sources list (as it's a self-published peerage website). The dates in lead are a bit unusual, maybe put them into text. Joseph2302 (talk) 08:43, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Joseph2302 Already posted, but thanks for the feedback--updated refs and shifted the dates into the text. SpencerT•C 15:02, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Looks good to go. Hanamanteo (talk) 09:42, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted Anarchyte (talk • work) 11:00, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted to RD) RD/Blurb: Bernie Madoff
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb: American financier Bernie Madoff (pictured), who operated the largest Ponzi scheme in history, dies at the age of 82. (Post)
News source(s): Guardian, AP, BBC
Credits:
- Nominated by Jgeorge20 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
- Support. Count Iblis (talk) 13:59, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose ??????????????? Fakescientist8000 (talk) 14:03, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Both of you are going to have to provide a rationale...-- P-K3 (talk) 14:11, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- @Pawnkingthree: To be fair the comments were posted before I added the template - it previously just read "Bernie Madoff" with no context. Black Kite (talk) 14:14, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Ah, ok.-- P-K3 (talk) 14:15, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yeah, my bad. I was just bewildered that it didn't have a template. Fakescientist8000 (talk) 15:33, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Ah, ok.-- P-K3 (talk) 14:15, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- @Pawnkingthree: To be fair the comments were posted before I added the template - it previously just read "Bernie Madoff" with no context. Black Kite (talk) 14:14, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Both of you are going to have to provide a rationale...-- P-K3 (talk) 14:11, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support I'm not seeing any lapses in sourcing. Lede's a bit awkward and overheavy on details of the trial but not a severe enough issue to block RD posting. (and confirm with BK that the first two !votes from Count Iblis + Fakescientist8000 had been made before a template was added) --Masem (t) 14:17, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Adding my Oppose blurb - convicted fraud dies in prison does not represent a transformative person at the top of their field. --Masem (t) 15:04, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb given the magnitude of his fraud, and have proposed as much. I understand we don't want to push too much stuff off the ITN box; while I don't necessarily agree, at least that's better than promoting otherwise non-notable stories because "nothing's happening". – John M Wolfson (talk • contribs) 14:18, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support A well cited article, it at least deserves a RD Vacant0 (talk) 14:26, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb There is one cn tag, to a list of assets that seem logical, three dead links, and a clarify tag that I don't understand, but otherwise in great shape. Prominence warrants blurb. Kingsif (talk) 14:29, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb. Significant criminal, yes, but not of lasting global importance. Sandstein 14:30, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support: Major news sites like CNBC and the New York Times have it as a top story and the article is well cited, if not a blurb it at least deserves an RD mention. PolarManne (talk) 14:31, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD only. Article looks good. Infamous in the US, but doesn't meet the very high bar for international notoriety for blurbs for deaths from old age. It's a side article in UK and French news. --LukeSurl t c 14:32, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD only article is good shape for RD. For someone involved in such a high profile scandal, surprised his name isn't more commonplace, but outside of the US he isn't well known at all. So doesn't meet the very high threshold for a deceased person to get a blurb. (And before anyone screams bias, I also opposed Prince Phillip last week for same reason). Joseph2302 (talk) 14:41, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posting RD, there will be no consensus for a blurb, I believe. --Tone 14:52, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support RD only doesn't meet significant criteria for a blurb.-- P-K3 (talk) 14:55, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb, international ramifications etc. ——Serial 14:57, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support blurb Now that the template has been added. Very significant person indeed, chief mastermind behind a massive fraud scheme. Fakescientist8000 (talk) 15:35, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb and weak oppose RD Just another nomination in the avalanche of nominations to blurb around here lately. Big criminal, but not a transformative figure in his field, neither in his country nor globally, as stated above. Also there's two cn tags in the article. Alsoriano97 (talk) 15:53, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Blurb this guy is the Nelson Mandela of financial criminals. Household name: check. Feature films/documentaries: check. Blurb it up. --LaserLegs (talk) 16:02, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Well was, anyway. And also "the Prince Philip of Ponzi fraudsters"? Martinevans123 (talk) 16:06, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb per Masem. A lot of media coverage but RD is appropriate. SpencerT•C 16:22, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb per Masem. Blurbs are the exception, not just for anybody that people have heard of. — Amakuru (talk) 16:32, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb - what information does the blurb provide readers that an RD listing doesn't provide? "Madoff died" is what the RD listing says: beyond that, a blurb would say nothing useful. If Madoff is a global transformative figure, etc., then everyone knows who he is and we don't have to describe him in a blurb. So a blurb won't give any add'l useful info, which means the only reason to blurb rather than RD is to say his death is more important than other RDs. We shouldn't be doing that, as it's not our place to decide. Levivich harass/hound 17:02, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb. Old man dies in prison. No rationale for a blurb other than him being reasonably well-known. Nohomersryan (talk) 17:30, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb - Notoriety does not equate to global transformative importance.--WaltCip-(talk) 18:46, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Weak Support blurb I don't think that crime ought to be a significant enough field for ITN death blurbs, and I don't like the idea of giving further fame to a criminal, but there's no question that Bernie Madoff was a "transformative world leader in his field" given that he ran the largest ponzi scheme of all time, so by the current wording of "Blurbs for recent deaths" he probably should be a blurb. NorthernFalcon (talk) 19:26, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose blurb exactly as WaltCip puts it. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:08, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
(Closed) Daunte Wright protests
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Ongoing item nomination (Post)
Credits:
- Nominated by 2600:1700:5890:69F0:1D21:C59E:DB08:A777 (talk · give credit)
- Wait but leaning oppose. Nowhere near the scale of the George Floyd protests at this point. --Masem (t) 05:04, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose
Article quality is not suitable for Front Page, currently at AFD.130.233.213.199 (talk) 05:17, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- The article is improved and the AFD has closed. On a second review the article could go up. The point made by TRM below is a very good one, though. Protests and riots in the Upper Midwest (and in many of the places listed in the Events elsewhere section) have become commonplace over the last few years.130.233.213.199 (talk) 04:57, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yet another Ongoing nomination has been made for this event (above) which links to a much weaker and frankly poorly composed article. In the interest of getting something up on this topic, I'd suggest to make a blurb nomination along the lines of Protests and unrest stemming from the death of Daunte Wright enter their Nth day. The article here is good enough, and that blurb formulation we have used many times previously.130.233.213.199 (talk) 10:58, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- The article is improved and the AFD has closed. On a second review the article could go up. The point made by TRM below is a very good one, though. Protests and riots in the Upper Midwest (and in many of the places listed in the Events elsewhere section) have become commonplace over the last few years.130.233.213.199 (talk) 04:57, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose On article quality. Anything red-tagged is not getting on the main page, however ITN the actual event. Kingsif (talk) 05:22, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support I think we could even move it into ongoing as part of 'American protests' or 'United States protests', similar to the Mynamar protests ongoing ITN. Even though the Black Lives Matter movement has experienced a period of inactivity, it seems to be re-emerging and we could potentially list it in the ongoing should these protests continue to regain momentum. JMonkey2006 (talk) 05:56, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait until AFD ends. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 06:20, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment 2020–2021 Minneapolis–Saint Paul racial justice protests is a different potential target, that I'm neutral towards. Kingsif (talk) 06:34, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Wait, also a Comment: this is a bit POINTy: considering the rather tame Northern Ireland Riots got in, this one should, by that same standard. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 07:52, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support This receives front-page coverage on the BBC and many media in Europe and it appears that the protesters haven't calmed down even though the incident was followed by police resignations. I strongly suspect that some users are deliberately undermining the significance of these protests because they no longer take place during Trump's presidency. And we don't have a rule that an ITN nomination should be frozen while an AfD on an underlying article is open.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 07:59, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment this has an AFD running for it, so shouldn't run unless that's resolved as keep. Joseph2302 (talk) 08:02, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose for now. If something major happens I'd reconsider, but 53 arrests isn't front-page news to me. According to the article, these protests are only part of the more general 2020–2021 Minneapolis–Saint Paul racial justice protests which I'd personally support for ongoing due to the wider scope. Uses x (talk • contribs) 08:13, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose per Uses X. Domestic protests without the national (and international) impact of George Floyd protests. I would say that Northern Ireland riots are much important than this ones and everyone agreed in not to post it in ongoing. Alsoriano97 (talk) 08:20, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- But it was blurbed, which this one is not being considered for (I think). -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 08:31, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose because it's nowhere near important enough. The article is up for deletion. Jim Michael (talk) 08:25, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose. It's pretty clear that this isn't like the George Floyd matter. 331dot (talk) 08:31, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Re-opened The AfD has been speedily closed with a result 'Keep' so the discussion here can continue.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 16:07, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- For the record, the AfD was closed as "no consensus".—Bagumba (talk) 16:29, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yes indeed but 'no consensus' to delete has the same effect as 'Keep', which is more spot on in relation to this nomination.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 16:59, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've never seen a speedy close with no consensus before- seems like that is being used solely so people can re-open this nomination. Joseph2302 (talk) 19:09, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- The nominator themself withdrew the nomination, but a speedy keep was technically not possible because one editor chose "Delete" before the article was expanded to a reasonable length (see WP:WITHDRAWN). Other than that, it was between a keep and a merge, and a merge isn't reasonable considering the size of both articles. There's no conspiracy. Uses x (talk • contribs) 19:53, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've never seen a speedy close with no consensus before- seems like that is being used solely so people can re-open this nomination. Joseph2302 (talk) 19:09, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yes indeed but 'no consensus' to delete has the same effect as 'Keep', which is more spot on in relation to this nomination.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 16:59, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- For the record, the AfD was closed as "no consensus".—Bagumba (talk) 16:29, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support It would be inconsistent of me to have supported posting the Northern Ireland protest but oppose this one. Mlb96 (talk) 18:14, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- It should be considered that often when there is a "white cop shoots black person" incident which happen with rather troubling frequency, there are protests, some more significant and/or violent than others; the Floyd protests clearly surpassed a level of being "routine". These protests may be just tipping past "routine" with the events of last night but they still aren't at the same sense of scale as the Floyd ones. In contrast, the protests in N. Ireland aren't anywhere close to routine occurances, and the events that led to those unusual (beyond the ususual tension between N. Ireland and the rest of the British Isles). As such, it didn't have a baseline to compare to so was posted for that reason. Its why we do consider events relative to their scope and scale for similar events within the same region for posting, and how that would filter up to the international scale. --Masem (t) 18:20, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose along the lines of Masem's explanation above. Like mass shootings, these protests are now commonplace, and realistically it needs to not be "routine" for it to be something we should consider at ITN. Those arguing about the N'Iron posting need to realise that riots there (in this day and age) just don't (didn't) happen. Trying to equate these regular riots with a rarity is not a reasonable comparison. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:07, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Ok, so if riots in Northern Ireland started up again, would you be OK with not blurbing them/putting them in ongoing? -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 00:02, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Are you trying to assert that riots happening for the second time in decades equates to the run-of-the-mill riots we see in the US every time a cop kills someone? The US police kill more than 1,000 people a year, it's routine. The ensuing riots are, thus, routine. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 06:52, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- They are not routine. Most deaths by police do not result in rioting, or even protest. And these are not run-of-the-mill. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 08:19, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Sure, well perhaps the 1,000+ people killed by US police every year would beg to differ if they could. And a quick look at 2020–2021 United States racial unrest shows that yes, indeed, riots are very much commonplace these days, whether you think so or not. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 16:09, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Police killing people in the US is obviously not something worthy of ITN. These protests however, are new and not routine. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 22:13, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- As the "ongoing nom" demonstrates, these protests have been going on regularly for months and months. It's routine. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 15:29, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Already having an effect on the world outside Minneapolis, and article is well updated. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 21:05, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Effects? Which ones? Where? Alsoriano97 (talk) 21:31, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- City under a state of emergency, professional sports teams cancelling games, protests around the country. These things rarely accelerate as quickly as this one has. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 21:48, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Effects? Which ones? Where? Alsoriano97 (talk) 21:31, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose – Per Jim Michael, TRM – The shooter and the police chief have resigned, and the shooter has been charged, hopefully defusing this incredibly bizarre event.
- PS: This user grew up in Minneapolis, and can hardly believe the stuff going on there – but I left a long time ago. – Sca (talk) 22:16, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Comment maybe the thing to do is to put Black Lives Matter into ongoing since both the road side summary execution of unarmed black men by sworn police and mass demonstrations afterwards both seem to be .... ongoing. We've let poorer quality articles fester in the box for ages and the pattern of "but the sub-articles" was well established as a justification for keeping the Hong Kong Bother in the box for a while. Consider it anyway, especially with the Chauvin acquittal looming there is certain to be more unrest. --LaserLegs (talk) 15:46, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- I thought you were going pointy there at the beginning (I know ho much you love ongoing), but you convinced me. These are absolutely ongoing in the literal sense, and only routine for the last year. 2020–2021 United States racial unrest would seem appropriate. GreatCaesarsGhost 18:09, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- +1. Not that crazy of an idea to have US racial unrest in ongoing. Levivich harass/hound 18:15, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose that for ongoing, basically it would then be argued to stay in perpetuity. Might as well have a US ticker. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 21:16, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- I thought you were going pointy there at the beginning (I know ho much you love ongoing), but you convinced me. These are absolutely ongoing in the literal sense, and only routine for the last year. 2020–2021 United States racial unrest would seem appropriate. GreatCaesarsGhost 18:09, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Do you really think that these protests, more intense and severe that we've had since May, are going to occur in perpetuity? Serious question. -- Rockstone[Send me a message!] 22:22, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yes. US cops murder at least 1,000 people a year. That hasn't and won't change. People now get annoyed by it rather than just accept it as part of the US lifestyle. Protests, as evidenced by the "ongoing nomination" article, are now commonplace. They will happen for the foreseeable future while nothing changes. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 14:09, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- LaserLegs, GreatCaesarsGhost, Levivich, and The Rambling Man: I've nominated the article here. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 21:21, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Seems a significant topic to me - max it should be there for 2 or 3 days Sitaphul (talk) 14:10, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- LaserLegs, GreatCaesarsGhost, Levivich, and The Rambling Man: I've nominated the article here. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 21:21, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- In the context of U.S. mass shootings, this singular one seems less than significant, though it has a bizarre aspect. – Sca (talk) 14:51, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- That's true, but that's not a qualification for not posting. Correct me if I'm wrong Sitaphul (talk) 18:24, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- In the context of U.S. mass shootings, this singular one seems less than significant, though it has a bizarre aspect. – Sca (talk) 14:51, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support The article is very detailed and these protests have certainly gotten a lot of coverage. I'd support either this or 2020–2021 United States racial unrest as nominated above. Davey2116 (talk) 21:47, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support per above, but I think a broader racial unrest ongoing would be better, per the arguments in that thread, and tonight is the first Adam Toledo protest... these protests are only growing with no sign of dissipating. Levivich harass/hound 03:38, 17 April 2021 (UTC)
April 13
April 13, 2021
(Tuesday)
Armed conflicts and attacks
Business and economy
Disasters and accidents
Health and environment
Law and crime
|
(Posted) RD: Conn Findlay
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Associated Press; The Washington Post
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Bloom6132 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Only announced and reported today (April 13). —Bloom6132 (talk) 20:28, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Tidy article, well referenced suitable for RD JW 1961 Talk 22:51, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Fully cited and comprehensive enough for RD. Uses x (talk • contribs) 23:06, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted. Black Kite (talk) 23:22, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Bobby Leonard
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Indianapolis Star; Associated Press
Credits:
- Updated and nominated by Bloom6132 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Bloom6132 (talk) 23:55, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Sufficient coverage and sourcing.—Bagumba (talk) 02:16, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support definitely good enough for RD. Joseph2302 (talk) 08:12, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Fully referenced, and the citations check out. Uses x (talk • contribs) 08:55, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Per consensus above. Fakescientist8000 (talk) 10:37, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted My initial vote aside, consensus is clear.—Bagumba (talk) 10:53, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
(Posted) RD: Peter Warner
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Sydney Morning Herald
Credits:
- Nominated by Spencer (talk · give credit)
- Updated by MerlinVtwelve (talk · give credit), Spencer (talk · give credit) and Vacant0 (talk · give credit)
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Australian captain. Article covers key aspects of the subject's life in appropriate detail; referenced. SpencerT•C 15:46, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Suggest Well-referenced, although we should clean up the article. It's not ready for RD *truly* until then. Fakescientist8000 (talk) 16:03, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support well cited Vacant0 (talk) 17:24, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support Looks good to go. Hanamanteo (talk) 01:48, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
- Posted—Bagumba (talk) 02:22, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
(Closed) Japan's cabinet approved dumping of radioactive water
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Blurb: The Cabinet of Japan approved the Fukushima nuclear Plant to dump treated radioactive water to the Pacific Ocean over a course of 30 years. (Post)
News source(s): "Fukushima: Japan approves releasing wastewater into ocean". BBC. 2021-04-13.
Credits:
- Created by lovewhatyoudo (talk · give credit)
- Updated by lovewhatyoudo (talk · give credit)
Article updated
- Nominator comments: This is the first time since 2011 the Japanese government makes it clear to the world on how Japan would deal with the radioactive water. Reading the comments on the ITN nomination of #(Closed) Fukushima disaster cleanup (which was a different article), my responses are as follows.
- (1) Part of the "consensus" on rejecting #(Closed) Fukushima disaster cleanup was based on the poor focus and the poor quality of that article, not on the importance of the news per se. This is a different, new article, entirely focus on the water.
- (2) Some users voted "opposed" by claiming this is "old news". In fact, news on this before 13 April 2021 was just speculation by tabloids. The cabinet approval was handed down on 13 April 2021.
- (3) While some users rightly pointed out "the cabinet approved the dumping to happen two years later, not to happen now", being the "first ever cabinet decision on the matter" grants this news importance.
- -- love.wh 15:13, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose - See consensus below. WP:SNOW for the below, and this isn't much different. Fakescientist8000 (talk) 14:56, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Part of the "consensus" was based on the poor quality of a separate article, not on the importance of the news per se. -- love.wh 15:18, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Almost everyone there opposed on notability too. Joseph2302 (talk) 15:22, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose and speedy close. We just had a discussion on this that closed as a clear consensus not to post. The fact that a new separate article has been created doesn't change the consensus. Joseph2302 (talk) 15:03, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Especially as this article just seems like a WP:CONTENTFORK so you can say there's a new article, and therefore start a new nomination. Joseph2302 (talk) 15:14, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- The original article is large enough (> 70,000 bytes) this would need to be split from it anyway. Uses x (talk • contribs) 15:17, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- The new article was entirely focus on water, different from the all-encompassing Fukushima disaster cleanup. How can this be WP:CONTENTFORK? Rather, this is a necessary main article. -- love.wh 15:27, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- The original article is large enough (> 70,000 bytes) this would need to be split from it anyway. Uses x (talk • contribs) 15:17, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Especially as this article just seems like a WP:CONTENTFORK so you can say there's a new article, and therefore start a new nomination. Joseph2302 (talk) 15:14, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Support - Significant global news, must read. STSC (talk) 15:06, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose New article is a hopeless mess of WP:SYN about various dumping events. I'm not even sure why this is a distinct article from the Fukushima clean-up article. It takes a scatter-shot approach to reporting on the events, and there's little in the way of narrative flow that makes the article very hard to follow, and not up to the standards I would expect for the main page. --Jayron32 15:27, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
(Closed) Fukushima disaster cleanup
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Blurb: Japanese Prime Minister Suga Yoshihide announces that more than 1 million tonnes of radioactive water will be dumped into the Pacific Ocean (Post)
Alternative blurb: The Japanese Government announces that treated radioactive water from the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Plant will be dumped into the ocean
Alternative blurb II: Japan announces that radioactive water from the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear disaster will be dumped into the ocean
News source(s): NHK News, KBS News, CGTN, Reuters, Global Times, The Guardian, Al Jazeera, ABC News, The Jakarta Post, The New York Times
Credits:
- Nominated by JMonkey2006 (talk · give credit)
Article needs updating
- Oppose "Announcements".130.233.213.199 (talk) 08:21, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose The target article has multiple (flagged) problems, and it hasn't been updated to mention the announcement and the implications of it. I don't see any point in evaluating the notability of the announcement until that's done. Uses x (talk • contribs) 08:53, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose this was announced days ago. Is this a "confirmation" of the "announcement"? When they do dump billions of tons of vicious nuclear waste into the sea, that may become a news story (with related protests etc no doubt). The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 09:10, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose on quality that article is nowhere near the standard of article we should be putting on front page- it was marked as outdated in 2017, and nothing has changed since then. Also, not sure this would be notable enough for ITN anyway, but that's irrelevant until the article is massively improved. Joseph2302 (talk) 09:17, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose they're not dumping raw water, it's going to be diluted with seawater and released with minimal radioactivity. Calm down. --LaserLegs (talk) 10:41, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose. Radioactive waste sounds scary, but this isn't barrels of glowing ooze like you see in the Simpsons. In reality it's sea- and rain-water that has gained a tiny amount of tritium (which also occurs naturally, albeit at lower levels). From the Guardian article linked above, expert consensus is "the treated water poses no scientifically detectable risk". It's a public relations problem, not a health risk or environmental disaster. Modest Genius talk 10:48, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Per [5], the International Atomic Energy Agency says "There is no scandal here" and an independent scientist says it "does not pose a health risk at all". Even the local fishermen don't object to the release itself, just the poor communication with the public that the water is safe. Modest Genius talk 10:56, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oppose - This is not quite as bad as allowing an entire population to become irradiated and having them believe nothing is wrong. WaltCip-(talk) 11:28, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
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