Talk:Pickup truck

Consumption in l/100 km ?

...seems like a relevant ball mark figure.--SvenAERTS (talk) 13:06, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

It's not clear what you are trying to say. Please clarify.  Stepho  talk  02:00, 31 January 2016 (UTC)

Move Minitruck modifications to Pickup truck

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the merge request was: Not moved. This has been open for a year with little input and no consensus for a move. Eagleash (talk) 16:27, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

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Since Minitruck modifications mostly describes modifications for pickup trucks, it would make sense to merge that article to its appropriate section here. Minitruck modifications also has notability problems which justifies this merging, unless there is a better article it can move to. CubeSats4U 07:06, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

At the moment the article doesn't contain anything worth moving. --Cornellier (talk) 11:13, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

• Oppose Rename to Minitruck instead. I'm convinced that there is an article to be had about this particular strand of custom culture, whatever the state of the current article. But it's much more about the customisation than pickups in general. Andy Dingley (talk) 11:19, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Pickup lorry

I know that Brits use the term 'lorry' where the US and Australia (my home) use the term 'truck'. But I've never hear the term 'pickup lorry' used. Since this was recently added to the article, I'd like to hear from some Brits about how common this term is and whether any other term is more common in the UK.  Stepho  talk  09:41, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

Never heard of it (3rd generation lorry driver). "Flatbed lorry" would be the term used, whether it had a flat bed, or a flat bed with drop sides. Pickups are rare anyway because it rains too much. Andy Dingley (talk) 10:35, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

Seemed a little unusual but I wasn't sure. Thanks.  Stepho  talk  10:45, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

Yes, 'Pick-up Truck' is a used term for the car/suv[4x4]-like pick-ups/utes, whilst "Flatbed lorry" would be for the bigger, full sized HGV trucks

For British people or Europeans a pickup does not qualify as a truck or lorry. It is considered as a big car with open loading space instead of a trunk. A truck or lorry has to have at least 7,5 tons gross vehicle weight to be perceived as such in the UK or the EU, and there is no pickup which is that big, except for the F-650 and F-750 perhaps. In fact, everything below 16 tons gross vehicle weight is considered a small truck in UK/EU. A "real truck" has 40 tons or more. -- Alexey Topol (talk) 13:08, 23 October 2021 (UTC)

Cybertruck

Someone's just added a Tesla Cybertruck photo to the gallery ... 'ere we go. My feeling is that the article should include present and past production vehicles only. Otherwise we're going to see rampant creep. Not sure if there's any WP policy on this. --Cornellier (talk) 22:28, 30 November 2019 (UTC)

I agree that it is premature. But I also know that other editors will be adding it as fast as we can delete it. It was hard enough to keep the Trukla out when we had good grounds to stand on. But this one is in a grey area.  Stepho  talk  22:52, 30 November 2019 (UTC)

Exclude until it's actually being delivered to customers and even then it's not clear it should be included. This is an article on the general topic of pickups. Thus a class of vehicles almost as old as the mass produced automobile. As a concept cat with no details and which might vary greatly when/if every produced why would the vehicle have weight for inclusion in this topic? Springee (talk) 23:59, 30 November 2019 (UTC)

Gallery

WP Image Use Policy gives guidelines at WP:GALLERY. Here are a few points:

• Wikipedia is not an image repository.
• A gallery is not a tool to shoehorn images into an article
• Images should be captioned to explain their relevance to the article

Currently the gallery is not conformant to the above, in particular the following:

• let's stick to mainstream production vehicles; no concepts
• the Montana is already at Coupé utility and should be deleted; Holden could be moved there
• The Suzuki Carry already has its own page where it's described as a kei truck
• the two RAMs, the F-350, and the Triton are all the same config

I believe that the onus is on those who wish to include these images to explain why they should be included. Right now it looks to me like a rather indiscriminate collection of photos. --Cornellier (talk) 23:20, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

We've started flip-flopping between old and new version of the gallery, so I'm pointing out WP:BRD advice of leaving it in the original state while we discuss it. After the discussion we can then edit according to the outcome.  Stepho  talk  02:18, 26 December 2019 (UTC)

There are no rules or conventions against images being in multiple articles - so saying an image has been used in another article has no bearing.

The gallery should try to cover different types of pickups, so I'm at a loss for why you would want to remove kei pickup trucks. It's certainly not what an American would think of as a pickup truck but other countries do think that way.

Similar for the Holden ute - it's a form of pickup that is popular in some countries (eg Australia and South Africa). Why would we want to not show it?

Fixing captions by deleting the image seems a strange solution. Kind of like a doctor who recomends amuptation for curing everything.

I'm not against trimming images that convey essentially the same thing (RAM, F-350, Triton). That part I agree with.

I'm not against concept pickup trucks having an image - but it must demonstrate something that the other images don't.

To reiterate, a set of images that show a good sweep of different types of pickup trucks is a good thing. This includes types of pickup trucks from around the world.  Stepho  talk  02:18, 26 December 2019 (UTC)

For what it's worth, I agree 100% with Cornellier stance on the issue. If we try to make everyone happy, we'll have fifty images in no time. Most automotive articles are over-illustrated for that reason. I disagree we should try to include an example of every local particularism here, especially if that type of thing has it's own article already. --Urbanoc (talk) 13:09, 26 December 2019 (UTC)

Agreed that we don't need fifty+ images. Agreed that we will never make everybody happy. However, I do believe we should have at least the more common types of pickup trucks from around the world. To my mind that includes the US style pickup (eg Ford F-150, RAM or similar), a coupe utility (eg Ford Falcon ute or Holden Commodore ute, very common in Australia, New Zealand and South Africa), Kei trucks (very common in Japan). The US style should have flat bed and well body variations. A 4-door crew cab would also be good (eg Toyota Hilux). The antique Chevy is a nice touch – history is just as important as current vehicles. That's somewhat less than 50 and still covers the majority of types – the whole idea of galley is to be representative with a reasonable number of images.

This article has always suffered from the attitude that if it isn't popular in the US then it doesn't belong here – I am very much against that attitude.  Stepho  talk  07:43, 27 December 2019 (UTC)

I've re-ordered the gallery so it is by date. I think it would be good to skip the duplicated types and replace them with two earlier vehicles - my suggestions:. Eddaido (talk) 11:05, 27 December 2019 (UTC)

• 
  1937 Ford V8 wellside
• 
  1948 International KB3 flatbed
• 
  1951 International L110

WP:GALLERY states "Images should be captioned to explain their relevance to the article". I thinking doing so will help the discussion on which images should be present. Per the above discussion I suggest the article or the gallery contain one, and not more than one of the following:

• a songthaew
• a coupé utility / ute: have the Holden
• a Kei truck: have the Suzuki
• crew cab: have Ford F-Series in article, don't need in gallery.
• flat bed truck: don't have
• long wheelbase vs. short
• RV conversion: have already in article, don't need in gallery
• something to show wheel wells in bed vs. outside bed.
• a cab over
• maybe a monster truck
• police or fire dept. livery (have already)
• a limited number of historical firsts, ideally also illustrating (and not duplicating) one or more of the above points

Suggest excluding concepts and models (e.g. LEGO model). So it could look like this:

• 
  Early compact Datsun Truck
• 
  1960 Chevrolet Stepside. A stepside has the wheel wells outside the bed.]]
• 
  1962 Volkswagen Type 2 2-door utility with single cab over
• 
  1990 Suzuki Carry, a Kei truck
• 
  Songthaew conversion
• 
  The car-based coupé utility 2006 Holden Ute
• 
  A modern flatbed truck
• 
  Monster truck
• 
  Ford Ranger in French National Gendarmerie livery
• 
  Flat sided truck showing wheel well intrusion into bed.

--Cornellier (talk) 15:42, 27 December 2019 (UTC)

Ah, yes, I had forgotten the step-side and cab-over variants. The Dodge A100 and VW Kombi utility are good examples. And of course we have umpteen examples of step-side pickup trucks.

I would use a different image for the flatbed than the "modern" - to an Australian (and probably most non-N.American countries) that looks like a full-size truck (ie like a Mack or Iveco EuroCargo truck). The red KB3 looks ok - although a rear picture would be even better.

Likewise, the International Harvester borders on being a full-size truck. I'm a bit 50/50 on this one because it's also a crew cab - although the French Ford Ranger is also a crew cab.

Monster trucks should not be included because they are custom vehicles.

I would leave out toys - even though I collect model cars myself and regret that my kids no longer play with Lego :(

An image showing dual rear wheels (ie 4 wheels on a single axle) would be good - but not essential. We could also show 6x6 pickups (eg Land Rover made some) but again, I wouldn't treat that as essential.

Lastly, @Eddaido, please don't change the gallery while it is under discussion. We can change it when the dust has settled.  Stepho  talk  01:46, 28 December 2019 (UTC)

Version 0.2, taking account of the above comments. A rear view of the dually would be better. Also an ID on the chevy. And the well intrusion shot could be better & should have model ID. --Cornellier (talk) 05:16, 28 December 2019 (UTC)

• 
  Early compact Datsun Truck
• 
  1962 Volkswagen Type 2 with single cab over and a dropside bed.
• 
  1990 Suzuki Carry, a Kei truck
• 
  Songthaew conversion
• 
  Dually Chevrolet flatbed truck with dual wheels on the rear axle for improved towing.
• 
  The car-based coupé utility 2006 Holden Ute
• 
  Double cab Ford Ranger in French National Gendarmerie livery
• 
  Flat sided truck showing wheel well intrusion into bed.

We're shaping up pretty good. Rear pics for the duallies and flatbeds would be nice but the front pic you found is acceptabe. Only one more thing - the captions should say "pickup truck" instead of just "truck" because in many parts of the world "truck" means the big ones carrying 5-30 tons of cargo.  Stepho  talk  10:47, 30 December 2019 (UTC)

But suggest leaving Datsun Truck and Kei truck alone per WP:NOPIPE. --Cornellier (talk) 19:23, 30 December 2019 (UTC)

No problem.  Stepho  talk  01:06, 31 December 2019 (UTC)

Crew cabs for the family

JackFromReedsburg, Stepho-wrs, I wanted to respectfully step into these edits [[1]],[[2]]. In context I don't think the Japanese trucks make sense in that paragraph. While it appears the Japanese did have a 4 door pickup in Japan before the 4 door IH in the North American market, the context of that paragraph seems focused on the NA market. The limited distribution of the Japanese trucks at the time would have had no impact on the migration of trucks from purely utility vehicles to a personal/work vehicle. BTW, I'm also not sure I agree with the claim that it was the advent of the 4 door pickup that made trucks a popular personal vehicle. 4 door pickups were almost exclusively 3/4 or 1 ton models until sometime in the 90s (in the NA market). The majority of the personal use pickups have been 1/2 ton models. Perhaps things were different in markets like Australia. Still, that is my OR. Springee (talk) 02:44, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

If the paragraph is concentrated on American pickups it is only because an American wrote it from an America perspective. As it was before I added the Stout a few years ago, it read like Americans were the first to implement crewcabs. This violates WP:GLOBAL. The other points I agree with you.  Stepho  talk  03:05, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Yeah that paragraph is more focused on the NA market. I'll see if I can rewrite it to better express the development of the crew cab trucks, as I know that the IH Travelette was more a utility vehicle, that focused on a 6-passenger cab, whereas the later trucks focused on being a personal vehicle. I don't see an issue with adding the Japanese trucks, and they should be included. JackFromReedsburg (talk | contribs) 03:08, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Thank you.  Stepho  talk  03:12, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Systemic bias?

User:PhoenixBlitzkrieg has slapped a WP:CSB on the article. Is there evidence that the current state of the content is the result of systemic bias? Or is it a reflection of the available references? Or some other problem? Can PhoenixBlitzkrieg answer these questions and suggest ways to improve the article? Your goal is an improved article, not a tagged article. Please see WP:CLEANUPTAG for guidelines. --Cornellier (talk) 23:46, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

I don't see a huge issue with the state of the article right now. Obviously there may be small improvements here and there, but thats not reason enough for a tag. If the user doesn't defend their inclusion for the tag, then it should just be removed. JackFromReedsburg (talk | contribs) 23:59, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

Removed. That tag is PB's only edit to the article and there are no current discussions on the topic. I've removed the tag as unsupported. Springee (talk) 00:15, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

To me, the article seems exclusively talking about the pickup from a US viewpoint, apart from the brief mention of Australia and South Africa in the very first paragraph. The international markets section gives very little information about these cars in other countries, just what models are popular. I know these cars have been popular in other countries both now and historically, but the article barely mentions that. Generally, if I can improve an article, I will, but I know nothing about pickup trucks (which is why I came to this article in the first place). I saw a problem, figured someone better qualified than me could fix it, so tagged it. If I used the wrong tag, sorry. Lithium (talk) 22:54, 24 March 2021 (UTC)