Talk:2021 Formula One World Championship

Semi-protected edit request on 2 December 2021

The results for Red Bull for Azerbaijan are reversed: Perez won and Verstappen retired. This is for the World Constructors' Championship standings section. 62.45.36.173 (talk) 12:00, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: The table isn't one row per driver. The best result goes on top regardless of who scores the result. If Perez beats Verstappen, Perez's result goes on top (like in Azerbaijan). When Verstappen beats Perez, Verstappen's result goes on top.

We have the same case for every other constructor, and this fact is made very clear below the table. SSSB (talk) 12:08, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

@SSSB: this comes up so often I wonder if it's worth reverting to the pre-2014 method of the constructors' tables. I assume there was a discussion about it at the time? Spa-Franks (talk) 23:58, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Discussions are linked in the Q&A box at the top of this talk page. I agree with the comments made there that the current method makes the most sense (if you understand that constructors' results are not the same as drivers' results), but I'd be open to an RfC to see what alternatives people have to offer. 5225_C (talk • contributions) 04:54, 5 December 2021 (UTC)

Strongly disagree for the reasons mentioned every time this is discussed. I would actually suggest changing the pre-2014 tables to the current standard, not the other way around. SSSB (talk) 09:27, 5 December 2021 (UTC)

Pole Trophy

This appears to no longer be a thing, please see the discussion here. Sparkle1 (talk) 00:30, 7 December 2021 (UTC)

Free practice driver rule (again)

I edited off the mention of rule change where FP1 drivers for inexperienced drivers were mandatory. It was supposed to be introduced for this year, but in the end 2021 sporting regulations don't include it (rule 26.1 b). However, 2022 sporting regulations have such a rule mentioned (numbers of rules were changed, now rule 3.12.2).

Also we have seen that seven teams never fielded an extra driver for FP1, only Williams, Alfa Romeo and Alpine did that. Guanyu Zhou did only one FP1 so Alpine doesn't escape with that. Callum Ilott did two FP1 sessions for Alfa Romeo while Williams fielded Roy Nissany in three and Jack Aitken in one sessions. Also, according to the spirit of the rule, AlphaTauri and Haas fielded rookie driver(s) so they are deemed to use such driver in Bahrain and Emilia Romagna GPs.

I pointed this in April (see in archive 2) but it didn't get any reaction. Would it be suitable to mention that the rule was postponed until 2022? BleuDXXXIV (talk) 12:01, 10 December 2021 (UTC)

What we need is a source which says that the rule was delayed from 2021 to 2022. SSSB (talk) 12:15, 10 December 2021 (UTC)

@SSSB: Would any of these potential sources help? 1: Formula 1 is set to introduce a regulation from 2022 that mandates teams to run young drivers in certain free practice sessions. - 2: From 2022, all 10 teams will be forced to run a rookie driver in two different Friday practice sessions during the year. - 3: Formula 1 teams will all have to run a rookie during a given number of grand prix practice sessions from the 2022 season in an effort to create more opportunities for young drivers. At present, teams have the option to replace one of their race drivers with an alternative driver during Friday practice – but only Williams, Alfa Romeo and Alpine have taken up that opportunity during the current season. - 4: All 10 Formula 1 teams will be forced to run a rookie driver on two Friday practice occasions in 2022 following a change in the sporting regulations.

Sadly, none of them mention that there was a delay that caused it. The closest I could find for that was this article: 5: Earlier this month, F1, the FIA and all 10 teams unanimously agreed to delay the introduction of the 2021 regulations by a year to 2022. The WMSC has now rubber stamped the move, allowing the relevant regulations to be adjusted. (...) Teams will also be able to hold a one-day test within 48 hours of the final race of the season to run young drivers. Up to two cars may be used for this test but it remains optional. Hopefully, something from this will be useful. --Super Goku V (talk) 23:44, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

DNS or WD??

Should Mazepin's withdrawl in Abu Dhabi be recorded as "Did Not Start" (DNS) or withdrawn (WD)? Kimi Raikkonen, at Zandvoort, had a +ve Covid test, but withdrew before quali, so this should go down as "withdrawn", as it is. However, any withdrawls after quali could/should go down as a DNS - this would be consistent with e.g. the 2015 Australian Grand Prix, where Valtteri Bottas was recorded as a DNS after being withdrawn with a back injury. Mbdxecw2 (talk) 12:08, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

I would be very interested in the rules surrounding this. Using previous edits as precedent isn't good enough. Is there not an official document we can refer to? Declanhx (talk) 16:10, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

This is the official document: [1]. The title is literally "... Car 9 [Mazepin] - Withdrawal from the event. SSSB (talk) 16:14, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

The document suggests that this is because Haas withdrew him. Of Williams never officially withdrew Bottas (i.e. a de facto withdrawal only) then that is an official DNS. It is not the rules or the race officials who determine if it a withdrawal or DNS, it depends on the process the team deploy. It's effectively the team who make that decision. SSSB (talk) 16:17, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

Right but what is the general rule? User:SSSB Does F1/ The FIA have a set of rules with the definitions in writing? I'm here because I have a £350 bet on the line so i really am eager to know. Declanhx (talk) 18:55, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

Please note that Wikipedia's talk pages are not the place to ask for evidence to settle a bet. I only checked so that the relevant articles would be correct. My interpretation of the sporting regs, namely article 36.4 suggests that Mazepin is official considered to be withdrawn. That is the only place in regulations that mention withdrawing (i.e. withdraw isn't defined in the regs). SSSB (talk) 19:25, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

I understand, I'm not here to ask for evidence, I was giving my reasoning as to why i'm eager to know this information beyond the wikipedia article. It was my thought process that the FIA would have a definition section for the given sections of the table key. I appreciate the FIA link for the withdrawal. Declanhx (talk) 19:58, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

Result and Mercedes protest

The article currently says: "Ultimately, Verstappen became the 2021 World Champion after overtaking Hamilton the final lap of the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix." Right now, it looks that way, but is "ultimately" really a good choice of words here? Mercedes have protested the result, arguing that the final lap should be annulled, as it did not follow the rules - and many commentators seem to agree.[2] To quote The Guardian's Daniel Harris, "Righto my friends, that is (not remotely) that. At some point, we’ll find out the results of Mercedes’ appeal. [...] Whatever you make of the final shake-up – and let me say again, I’m dubious at best – we can still marvel at the drive".[3] Renerpho (talk) 16:51, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

They will judge it tonight. It won't be days until we know.Tvx1 17:26, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

That would be nice. In any case, the issue has been addressed, and the wording is no longer problematic. Thanks! Renerpho (talk) 18:40, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

One protest dismissed already.Tvx1 19:07, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

Second one dismissed as well, but Mercedes lodged an intent to appeal the dismissal.Tvx1 20:13, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 12 December 2021

Max Verstappen of Red Bull Racing privisionally won the championship for the first time in his career though this is under appeal by Mercedes. Lewis Hamilton of Mercedes finished runner up; Mercedes won the constructor championship for the eighth time in a row.

>>>

Max verstappen won the world driver championship for the first time in his career. Lewis Hamilton of Mercedes finished as runner up. Mercedes won the eighth consecutive World Constructor Championship. Marskore (talk) 20:07, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

 Not done, an intention to appeal has been lodged.Tvx1 20:14, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 12 December 2021 (2)

Max Verstappen of Red Bull Racing won the championship for the first time in his career. Lewis Hamilton of Mercedes finished runner up; Mercedes won the constructor championship for the eighth time in a row.[1][2]

Remove references, they are about the 2020 season, not 2021 season. Marskore (talk) 20:17, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

 Done. Replaced the ref. ◢  Ganbaruby!  (talk) 23:35, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

Mercedes protests

The controversial end of the final race, and the two Mercedes protests, made the news yesterday. I'd previously been unaware of the event. So I came here hoping to learn what the protests were about. But I find that covered in just two sentences, with nothing about the substance of the protests – despite it being the most notable event of the race, maybe of the whole championship. Maproom (talk) 08:42, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

@Maproom: it is covered extensively (possibly excessivly) at 2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix. SSSB (talk) 10:22, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

So it is. I know so little about the subject that I can't judge whether it should be discussed more deeply in this article as well. I don't even know how the two articles' subjects differ (and I don't want to know, please don't tell me). Maproom (talk) 14:48, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

I definetly think it should, but to a lower level of detail. SSSB (talk) 14:53, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 December 2021

In the first paragraph below the picture, the first sentence has a grammatical error. It says, “... an end the...” and it should say, “and end to the...” 24.184.190.225 (talk) 05:01, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

 Done, thank you. 5225_C (talk • contributions) 05:33, 21 December 2021 (UTC)