Talk:Sculptor Capital Management

Controversy and Criticisms

These sections seem to be overreaching. The authors of both articles even use the words "speculate" and "suspicious" in their associations of Och-Ziff. This falls under the Wiki guideline of Wikipedia:Fringe theories. Kind of like charging the knife manufacturer with murder. Plus all the tangent parties that compromise the majority of the content, like Zanu-PF, Robert Mugabe, Walter Hennig and Tokyo Sexwale, have their own Wiki pages that address these issues. Any thoughts? --Monstermike99 (talk) 20:18, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

Monstermike99, that's interesting, but I think an article with a counter point of view is needed here to move further. Have you found any? --Stlamanda (talk) 21:55, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

Stlamanda - I get what you're saying, but that's not the problem. The issue is that they don't belong there at all. They are conspiracy theories and under Wikipedia:Fringe theories policy they shouldn't be there to begin with, regardless of what you find to "balance" it. One source with no witness quotes or supporting documents doesn't make a substantiation. Rjp422 (talk) 23:51, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

I'm siding with Rjp422 more on this one. I read the articles in question again and there seems to be some concrete facts in it (like literally 1 line), so how about we just extract the non theory/speculative nonsense? And Stlamanda, good luck finding counters because I had no such luck. --Monstermike99 (talk) 00:24, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

I did find a counter/update for "Criticisms" that I did add. I think it balances that section.--Stlamanda (talk) 11:21, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

I'm absolutely against keeping them in. To me there's no question it's a violation of the policy given the entire body of the stuff from the articles. Rjp422 (talk) 14:55, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Rjp422 I think a compromise is order or at least a trim down first but you can flag for removal based on the violation if you wish to do so --Monstermike99 (talk) 15:56, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

I'd like to participate in this discussion. What is the exact text that is under discussion here?-- — Keithbob • Talk • 17:24, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

What the sources say

• The source of a controversial $100-million loan that allegedly made it possible for President Robert Mugabe to steal the 2008 Zimbabwean election is a major US institutional investor, the Mail & Guardian can reveal. The payment, which critics say helped Mugabe's Zanu-PF to buy votes and unleash a campaign of brutal repression in an election in which he faced almost certain defeat, was made possible by the New York-based Och-Ziff Capital Management Group....... It is surprising that Och-Ziff was willing to finance the Zimbabwean loan despite the likelihood that Mugabe, whom Western governments opposed implacably, would use it to fuel repression. Och-Ziff declined to comment.--Mail & Guardian 1
• Yet fears have grown in recent weeks that the hedge funds that are blocking the deal – which have been identified as including Vega Asset Management, Och Ziff, York Capital, GreyLock Asset Management and Marathon Asset Management – do not consider the prospect of a disorderly default by Athens as a financial incentive to allow a voluntary writedown deal to proceed.----The Independent
• Och-Ziff, a $28.4 billion (18.4 billion pounds) fund also based in New York, said in an emailed statement: "The Company and its funds do not have a material investment in Greek sovereign debt. The company and its funds have not been involved in any way in negotiations concerning the restructuring of this debt."...................Och Ziff and York are among a group of hedge funds which hold positions in Greek debt that collectively may have built up sufficiently large positions to scupper the bailout deal, several sources close to the debt restructuring told Reuters last week. ---Reuters
• The Company and its funds do not have a material investment in Greek sovereign debt. The Company and its funds have not been involved in any way in negotiations concerning the restructuring of this debt.----OchZiff press release
• Sexwale’s Mvelaphanda Holdings and Hennig’s Palladino Holdings, an obscure entity based in Turks and Caicos, a haven of corporate anonymity, are partners with United States investment fund managers Och Ziff in African Global Capital, a natural resources investment fund focussing on the continent.--Mail & Guardian 2
• -- — Keithbob • Talk • 17:20, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

---

Thanks for breaking this out Keithbob, it will help me show all you guys what I'm talking about. I'm not saying Mail&Guardian and The Independent aren't notable left wing publications, I'm saying even the author hasn't presented any facts to his accusation, see below:

• The first bullet, directly quoted from the article says "controversial $100-million loan that allegedly made it possible", please note "allegedly", also "The payment, which critics say helped", again speculation which as you pointed out below is a violation acccording to WP:CRITICISM.
• Bullets 2,3 and 4, I think were addressed with Stlamanda addition.
• The last bullet you've proved my point that it is far reaching. I would say the Guinea summary should look as follows - Palladino Holdings and Mvelaphanda Holdings, affiliates of OZ Management, are connected to a $25 million loan that Palladino lent to the state of Guinea in order to start up a state mining company. The copy after that clearly is for other entries, it's discussing 3rd parties that have their own pages.

- Thoughts everyone? --Monstermike99 (talk) 18:44, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

First of all, I loved the section condensing, Keithbob. Your points are well-taken, as are the responses from Monstermike99. I agree on the Guinea cutdown, I say go for it! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stlamanda (talk • contribs) 21:52, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Nice work, Keithbob. I can live with Monstermike99's compromise on Guinea and I think the article is now closer to fact than speculation. Rjp422 (talk) 03:25, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks folks, I'm still getting up to speed on this conversation but, my main concern is that we stick with content that is close to what the sources say and that we don't assume or combine facts per WP:OR. I gather from the discussion above that everyone is now satisfied with the updated content and that it accurately reflects the sources. Cheers!-- — Keithbob • Talk • 18:04, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

Reformatting of the article

I've reorganized the article without making an content changes.

• I've removed many subsection headings per WP:BODY which says: "Very short or very long sections and subsections in an article look cluttered and inhibit the flow of the prose."

Criticism section

• Please note per WP:CRITICISM : sections dedicated to negative material may violate the NPOV policy and may be a troll magnet, which can be harmful if it leads to users with strong opinions dominating the article but may simplify maintenance of the article if unhelpful edits are limited to a single section. In 2006 User:Jimbo Wales weighed in on the question: "In many cases they [criticism sections] are necessary, and in many cases they are not necessary. And I agree with the view expressed by others that often, they are a symptom of bad writing. That is, it isn't that we should not include the criticisms, but that the information should be properly incorporated throughout the article rather than having a troll magnet section of random criticisms." -- — Keithbob • Talk • 16:54, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Edit request to update details

Hello. I am an employee of Sculptor Capital Management. There are some updates I would like to make to the page. Specifically, I would like the Structure section to more accurately reflect the current operational model by replacing the current text in that section with the following: Jimmy Levin is the Chief Investment Officer and the Chief Executive Officer. Mr. Levin joined the firm in 2006 and made gains of $2 billion investing in structured credit products during the financial crisis. The firm is managed by the Partner Management Committee, which consists of eight executives: Mr. Levin; Wayne Cohen, President & Chief Operating Officer; Dava Ritchea, Chief Financial Officer; Brett Klein, Global Head of Corporate Credit; Steve Orbuch, Founder & President, Sculptor Real Estate; Peter Wallach, Chief Risk Officer; Julie Siegel, Chief Administrative Officer & Deputy Chief Legal Officer, and David Levine, Chief Legal Officer. The company manages $11.4 billion in multi-strategy funds, with its Sculptor Master Fund having net annual returns of 11.7% since inception in 1998, and having returned almost 20% in 2020. The company manages $6.4 billion in an opportunistic credit fund, with net annual returns of 10% since inception in 2011. The company manages $15.2 billion in institutional credit strategies – mainly collateralized loan obligations (“CLOs”). The company manages $4.3 billion in real estate funds. In 2020, Sculptor raised its largest real estate fund – a $2.6 billion opportunistic equity fund.

The company has a diverse institutional investor base, including public pensions, sovereign wealth and corporates, family offices, foundations and endowments.

References

Thank you for your consideration and assistance. Michael at Sculptor Capital (talk) 18:19, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

Comment: From my view point most of this content would not be acceptable in a wikipedia article. High promotion tone. Also most of these employees are non-notable. -Imcdc (talk) 03:43, 15 December 2021 (UTC)

@Imcdc:, Thank you for your feedback. I included the list to update the one that is currently on the page. I understand that it may not be encyclopedic, and if that is the case, I suggest the following language for the current Structure section: Jimmy Levin is the Chief Investment Officer and the Chief Executive Officer as of 2020. He joined the firm in 2006. A Partner Management committee, consisting of seven executives and Levin, assist him in managing the firm.

For the rest of the section, I propose revising to read: The company manages $11.4 billion in multi-strategy funds, $6.4 billion in an opportunistic credit fund, $15.2 billion in institutional credit strategies, and $4.3 billion in real estate funds.

The current second sentence of the Structure section, beginning "On February 5, 2018," would be more appropriate in the history section. I Propose moving it to its chronological place there.

Thank you for your assistance and input. Michael at Sculptor Capital (talk) 13:30, 6 January 2022 (UTC)

 Partly done I added the information about company funds, and further trimmed the list of company executives throughout the article. I removed some of the leadership succession info in favor of leaving that information in the structure section. Spencer^T•C 06:38, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

References

Spencer, thank you for your assistance with these edits. Daniel Och is no longer the CEO of the company. In 2021 Jimmy Levin was appointed CEO. Similarly, Richard Ketchum is no longer Chairman of the Board. This is substantiated by both the firm's website and this Institutional Investor article. Can you please modify the first sentence of the Structure section to reflect Jimmy Levin's position as CEO? Also, the list of key people in the Infobox should be updated to be:

• Jimmy Levin, Chief Investment Officer & Chief Executive Officer
• Wayne Cohen, President & Chief Operating Officer
• Dava Ritchea, Chief Financial Officer
• Steve Orbuch, Founder & President Sculptor Real Estate

using https://www.bloomberg.com/profile/company/OZM:US to substantiate.

The language in the History section should also be modified to reflect the changes in the company. My suggested replacement for the first two paragraphs is:

The firm was founded as Och-Ziff in 1994 by Daniel Och with financial support from the Ziff family, founders of Ziff Davis Media. The company completed an initial public offering in 2007. The firm was one of the few hedge funds and private equity companies that completed IPOs before the market downturn of 2007. Also in 2007, it became a founding member of the Hedge Fund Standards Board which sets a voluntary code of standards of best practice endorsed by its members.

The History section should also mention the rebranding of the firm, something like: On September 12, 2019, the company changed its name to Sculptor Capital Management.

I'd also ask that the content of the current Criticism section be merged into the History section in compliance with WP:CRIT. There is updated information about the settlements of the cases against the former leadership, and I will work to draft that as a separate request. I appreciate your assistance in updating the information in the article and ensuring its accuracy. Thank you.Michael at Sculptor Capital (talk) 15:27, 15 February 2022 (UTC)

References

Hi Michael, I can update the article if you help me with the following:

1. Can you please provide a reference with the Bloomberg profile formatted using the {{cite web}} template (including publisher, title, access date, etc.)? Of note, I think instead of having too many people in the infobox, it would be best to leave it at just the CEO and president.

2. Do you have references from reliable, third-party sources (i.e. not the company website) to the founding date and other information related to the company's founding?

3. Similarly, do you have another reference for the IPO in 2007 (and being "one of the few hedge funds and private equity companies that completed IPOs")

4. I do not see the cited info for the sentence "Also in 2007, it became a founding member of the Hedge Fund Standards Board which sets a voluntary code of standards of best practice endorsed by its members" in the reference that is provided; could you provide a different reference? I have added {{citation needed}} tags to each of these statements in the article.

5. The name change sentence is  Done

6. Merging the criticism content into the history is  Done.

As I may be delayed in replying to other requests, feel free to both tag me and add a new {{request edit}} template to a new section for future article proposed changes in order so that others may also be alerted to review proposed changes. I also recommend using either {{cite news}} or {{cite web}} templates to help you format references correctly, which makes it easier for reviewers to implement requested edits. Best, Spencer^T•C 17:20, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Spencer, thank you for the edits you have already implemented. My responses below correlate to your numbered requests above.

1. Regarding the infobox, to my understanding, a company infobox can include up to four executives. I’d appreciate including the four I listed above. As this is a company profile on the Bloomberg site, there is no author or date. I used the template parameters as best I could: "Sculptor Capital Management Profile". Bloomberg.
   
2. This source can be used to substantiate the information in both this and the next item: Zuill, Lilla (November 14, 2007). "Update 2- Och-Ziff IPO raises $1.15 billion". Reuters. Similarly, the sources used on Daniel Och's page can be used to support the company's founding in 1994.
3. The IPO and other related information is supported by the source above. If possible, I'd appreciate removing the $32 amount.
4. The role of Och-Ziff Capital in founding the Hedge Fund Standards Board is supported by: "SBAI History".

Again, thank you for your assistance and patience. I will "be in touch" when I open my next edit request. 69.164.90.182 (talk) 21:01, 17 February 2022 (UTC)